[00:00.000 --> 00:04.920]  I think it's Re-wired: Hacking the Auditory Experience with Amelia Marzec.
[00:24.760 --> 00:25.400]  Hello.
[00:25.840 --> 00:26.800]  Alright, you can hear me.
[00:28.320 --> 00:32.750]  So, I'm Amelia Marzec and my project is called Re-wired.
[00:33.620 --> 00:39.470]  It's a helmet that takes in sound from the environment and translates it into vibrations.
[00:40.180 --> 00:45.540]  And they're conducted through the skull and interpreted as sound by the inner ear.
[00:46.800 --> 00:51.580]  It's based on my own experience with losing hearing in one ear due to a tumor.
[00:52.520 --> 00:57.940]  And wanting to begin an experiment in the realm of DIY medical technology.
[00:58.800 --> 01:03.360]  And I wanted to consider less invasive methods for augmenting hearing.
[01:13.650 --> 01:22.210]  So, I became aware that experiencing sound through bone conduction was possible at the time that I had surgery.
[01:22.210 --> 01:30.810]  And one of the possible ways to fix monophonic hearing is to drill a screw into your skull.
[01:31.170 --> 01:38.790]  And attach a receiver to it so that sound waves are converted into vibrations in the skull.
[01:39.490 --> 01:41.750]  And here's a diagram of your ear.
[01:42.470 --> 01:46.650]  So, the sound bypasses the outer ear and the middle ear.
[01:46.830 --> 01:50.070]  And it goes right in here where it says cochlea.
[01:50.250 --> 01:54.190]  And it stimulates the nerves there.
[01:54.470 --> 02:03.270]  So, this is actually why your voice sounds different to you than when you hear yourself on a recording.
[02:03.270 --> 02:07.520]  And that's because your skull is actually vibrating.
[02:07.830 --> 02:10.310]  So, it does sound slightly different to you.
[02:14.670 --> 02:16.370]  So, I didn't like the sound...
[02:16.370 --> 02:22.150]  I didn't like the idea of, you know, of getting the implant.
[02:22.150 --> 02:27.050]  Because you end up with an open wound behind your ear that already doesn't work.
[02:27.770 --> 02:29.630]  And some people really like that.
[02:29.790 --> 02:35.470]  But I guess I sort of wanted to adjust to having one ear and see what that experience was like.
[02:35.830 --> 02:40.990]  And so, I guess there were a couple things that happened.
[02:41.250 --> 02:47.410]  One was that my eyes started compensating for the lack of surround sounds.
[02:47.410 --> 02:57.490]  So, you have... you aren't able to really pinpoint things in space because you need two ears to do that.
[02:57.610 --> 02:59.070]  They sort of like triangulate.
[03:02.510 --> 03:08.770]  And so, when I walk into a room, it's like my eyes just like take it in in like a millisecond.
[03:08.790 --> 03:13.010]  And sort of remember where all the items in the room are.
[03:13.010 --> 03:19.230]  And so, then when I hear a sound, it's sort of... my brain sort of maps it to whatever I saw.
[03:19.490 --> 03:24.070]  And this is... this works like most of the time, you know.
[03:24.150 --> 03:25.110]  And sometimes it doesn't.
[03:25.230 --> 03:31.750]  Like I had a friend who was... you know, I saw him upstairs, you know.
[03:31.910 --> 03:36.290]  And then a little while later, I heard his voice and I thought he was still upstairs.
[03:36.290 --> 03:37.170]  So, I looked up.
[03:37.330 --> 03:39.850]  But he was actually like, you know, coming at me.
[03:39.850 --> 03:43.810]  And that's because I had remembered where I last saw him in space.
[03:48.050 --> 03:59.490]  So, another thing was that, you know, with the sound, I was experiencing it through the hearing that I already had.
[03:59.490 --> 04:02.690]  And also vibration in the environment.
[04:02.690 --> 04:04.630]  So, I started paying attention to that more.
[04:04.750 --> 04:08.390]  And it wasn't like I, you know, I could do that before.
[04:08.390 --> 04:10.450]  I just wasn't paying attention to it.
[04:10.590 --> 04:18.050]  So, one day I was like playing the piano and I became aware that the whole instrument felt completely alive in my hands.
[04:18.090 --> 04:22.050]  You know, it was like all the notes were sort of like traveling up my arm, you know.
[04:22.050 --> 04:26.390]  And it was just a really rich experience of sound.
[04:27.310 --> 04:38.110]  So, then I decided to start messing around with that technology and to adapt, to adapt it into a helmet.
[04:38.430 --> 04:41.230]  You know, to sort of share that perception with people.
[04:41.230 --> 04:49.630]  And also, like, as a tool to just test it, you know, on myself and see, you know, if that was useful.
[04:50.070 --> 04:50.250]  So,
[04:55.280 --> 04:56.220]  let's see.
[04:58.720 --> 05:08.200]  All right, so it's a helmet that leaves the wearer free to roam their environment and experience a physical sensitivity to sound.
[05:08.200 --> 05:16.080]  And it has really small microphones, it has signal amplifiers in it, vibration components.
[05:16.940 --> 05:24.340]  And in my next version, I was thinking of putting in like an effects circuit, like a, you know, pedal just to see how that changed it.
[05:24.460 --> 05:30.960]  You know, like, you know, like if there's a delay, like would that change your perception at all?
[05:32.940 --> 05:37.220]  And it adjusts to any head, you know, because it's like an adjustable helmet.
[05:37.220 --> 05:43.920]  And I'm going to put on dials so that you're also able to sort of control what you're hearing.
[05:47.220 --> 05:49.620]  So, these are some of the pictures from the process.
[05:50.680 --> 06:02.180]  This is like, yeah, I made this sketch like right after I lost my hearing because I became aware of like, you know, picking up radio waves in the air or something.
[06:02.340 --> 06:05.460]  And then I got sort of interested in all of this.
[06:05.460 --> 06:07.820]  But I had an idea for making a helmet.
[06:08.060 --> 06:17.980]  And I sort of put it aside for like three years until recently when I just got out a bunch of audio equipment I had in my house.
[06:17.980 --> 06:29.180]  And I tested it with like a pair of, like vibration headphones, earbuds.
[06:29.820 --> 06:31.860]  And they make these and they sell them to people.
[06:32.000 --> 06:36.000]  They tell them they could like, listen to music underwater.
[06:36.000 --> 06:39.280]  And I'm still, I don't know if you guys do this.
[06:39.420 --> 06:42.460]  I've never needed to listen to music underwater.
[06:45.300 --> 06:48.600]  But in any case, you know, so it worked.
[06:48.620 --> 06:58.440]  And then I just started buying smaller hardware, like see what I could find to, so I didn't have to like be tethered to the wall and walk around with like wires hanging off.
[07:00.680 --> 07:02.580]  And so I put it into a hat.
[07:03.000 --> 07:04.840]  That was sort of my first impression.
[07:05.200 --> 07:09.960]  And, you know, that didn't really work because the hat was, it was too soft, you know.
[07:10.120 --> 07:13.040]  And I went on a walk in my neighborhood like this.
[07:13.800 --> 07:17.680]  The guys in my neighborhood are used to seeing me doing weird stuff now.
[07:17.680 --> 07:23.120]  Like, I walk into RadioShack in a panic all the time and they're like, what's going on?
[07:24.360 --> 07:31.480]  But, you know, so this was a, it was actually a bunch of stuff that I got in RadioShack and, you know, stuck together.
[07:31.700 --> 07:40.960]  So I was, so this is also interesting because people could just, you know, walk into like a store in their town and like make this stuff.
[07:41.100 --> 07:43.580]  You don't have to go through surgeons.
[07:43.580 --> 07:45.140]  You don't have to go through doctors.
[07:45.140 --> 07:47.080]  You don't have to go through your medical insurance.
[07:48.760 --> 07:59.380]  You know, so if there's a way to make this easier and smaller, you know, then for things that aren't invasive, obviously, it could possibly help other people.
[08:01.760 --> 08:04.880]  So then I got the helmet to have more structure.
[08:04.880 --> 08:06.980]  And this is what my house looked like.
[08:07.660 --> 08:09.620]  This is what my house usually looks like.
[08:09.620 --> 08:26.800]  And, you know, so then I was just putting it together, like taking apart an amplifier and, you know, just really gluing everything together and testing it on my head in the middle of the night.
[08:29.060 --> 08:31.060]  And, you know, and then it was done.
[08:31.360 --> 08:44.200]  So I was going to show it at the Sound Research Summit at EyeBeam and I bought 142 earplugs because I really thought people would want to wear it, you know, and I didn't use that many.
[08:44.200 --> 08:48.760]  But I have a video from that.
[08:49.860 --> 08:50.960]  Let's see.
[08:53.740 --> 09:02.140]  Because I wanted to have some folks wear it and then, like, give me feedback on what it felt like.
[09:02.820 --> 09:04.760]  So we can watch that.
[09:14.090 --> 09:16.090]  And the beginning is just me talking.
[09:16.310 --> 09:17.230]  I've seen enough of that.
[09:20.790 --> 09:21.230]  Wait.
[09:21.970 --> 09:23.910]  So I can see, like, the word right?
[09:25.730 --> 09:26.510]  Oh, you know what?
[09:26.590 --> 09:27.290]  We need sound.
[09:36.390 --> 09:37.390]  Oh, thanks.
[09:43.430 --> 09:44.790]  And now we need video.
[10:05.500 --> 10:15.360]  I interviewed some people wearing my helmet to get a sense of how it was being perceived and how it fit into the overall ecology of the event.
[10:15.360 --> 10:16.900]  It's sort of like walking through a train.
[10:17.040 --> 10:19.860]  I can hear my footsteps, too, like when I put my heel down.
[10:20.420 --> 10:26.760]  It's kind of like everything's going through a radio and the voices are distorted before you have a little bit of static.
[10:28.880 --> 10:31.720]  But your sensation of hearing your own voice is the same.
[10:32.660 --> 10:34.520]  Like you said, you're hearing it through your skull.
[10:35.120 --> 10:39.300]  The vibration element was not translating, having a really complex bit of sound.
[10:40.000 --> 10:43.480]  The sounds that make less static are better.
[10:44.080 --> 10:44.420]  Yeah.
[10:45.160 --> 10:45.800]  Fighters out.
[10:46.240 --> 10:50.760]  So there are definitely points where suddenly something would come into focus, like a particular sound.
[10:51.860 --> 10:57.440]  You know, whether I would, like, twerk my head a particular way and then suddenly I could hear some little detail.
[10:58.080 --> 11:01.040]  You know, whether it was from my installation or whether it was there.
[11:01.360 --> 11:06.040]  But yeah, so I was trying to find, like, if there's these magical spots where I could, like, twerk my head and suddenly...
[11:07.620 --> 11:12.840]  I realized that what was affecting him was my prototype had only one microphone on it.
[11:13.100 --> 11:17.020]  So people were experiencing monophonic sound for the first time.
[11:17.100 --> 11:19.140]  Yeah, let's hear about the directionality of the ears.
[11:20.920 --> 11:28.900]  Sound kind of became, I guess, because my ears were plugged, its tonality seemed to change.
[11:28.900 --> 11:31.680]  I don't know if it was because I was getting less sound.
[11:32.140 --> 11:36.280]  But in a sense, it became... what's the right word?
[11:36.500 --> 11:39.340]  Almost, like, refracted or something.
[11:39.500 --> 11:41.880]  Like, the way light is refracted, its bent.
[11:42.740 --> 11:44.700]  I sort of got a different sensation.
[11:44.980 --> 11:48.900]  And I also heard my voice, which I think...
[11:50.540 --> 11:53.300]  I heard, like, higher tones in my voice.
[11:53.300 --> 11:56.360]  So if that's possible, I also have a wild imagination.
[11:57.440 --> 11:58.320]  And it's good.
[12:11.130 --> 12:14.330]  A lot of the things that I hear right now were gone.
[12:14.530 --> 12:15.610]  And I was just...
[12:16.130 --> 12:20.010]  But I had a cute sense of some things that I wasn't hearing so well.
[12:20.670 --> 12:26.430]  But it seemed like any kind of reverb or echo or resonance that I hear in the room right now disappears.
[12:27.710 --> 12:31.290]  When I played it, I could only hear myself.
[12:31.470 --> 12:33.270]  I couldn't really hear anything else when I was playing.
[12:33.550 --> 12:35.090]  Any space, I could hear Alan.
[12:35.430 --> 12:40.190]  And I could hear the vibration of this wire over here, which is crazy.
[12:40.530 --> 12:46.450]  I feel that with the first prototype, I basically recreated the experience of having only one ear.
[12:46.670 --> 12:53.870]  And that building it with man-made hardware, it naturally subtracted from the details that a person normally hears.
[12:53.870 --> 12:59.610]  I mean, playing with the sense that you have, but not changing something about that sense.
[13:00.270 --> 13:04.050]  It's like a very kind of subtle, disorienting...
[13:04.830 --> 13:05.830]  Can I help it?
[13:11.460 --> 13:12.340]  All right.
[13:12.840 --> 13:19.700]  So I'm going to be running a demo of this for a week in October.
[13:19.700 --> 13:21.100]  So I don't have it with me today.
[13:21.220 --> 13:21.920]  I'm getting it ready.
[13:21.920 --> 13:29.380]  And I'm going to be doing it outside of the New York Eye and Ear Infirmary on 14th Street.
[13:30.360 --> 13:32.720]  It's part of the Art in Odd Places Festival.
[13:35.160 --> 13:39.340]  And I'm, like, kind of scared because I had all these doctors there, you know.
[13:39.440 --> 13:45.640]  So I, like, kind of want to run into one of them with it and try and, like, sell it back to them or whatever.
[13:45.640 --> 13:48.960]  But we'll see what happens.
[13:50.080 --> 13:52.240]  So that's all I have for right now.
[13:52.520 --> 13:54.220]  I don't know if you guys had questions.
[13:54.240 --> 13:58.420]  I was interested in, like, if, you know, how you guys feel about that.
[13:58.420 --> 14:04.940]  Or if you know anyone who's had, you know, like a similar experience.
[14:06.220 --> 14:08.480]  This room isn't really set up for this.
[14:08.480 --> 14:12.020]  So they said you could, like, walk up here if you want.
[14:12.560 --> 14:12.880]  Right?
[14:14.940 --> 14:19.940]  So does it translate the vibration to your ears to those little buds you're talking about?
[14:20.080 --> 14:21.940]  Or is this a light connecting to your head?
[14:24.120 --> 14:24.740]  Go on.
[14:24.860 --> 14:26.960]  So you want to know if it's going...
[14:26.960 --> 14:28.240]  It's going through these earbuds.
[14:29.080 --> 14:32.020]  So I just sort of planted them on my forehead.
[14:32.220 --> 14:34.860]  And it vibrates enough.
[14:34.860 --> 14:39.000]  It's actually a really strong one that I was sort of hacking.
[14:39.020 --> 14:41.200]  It has its own amplifier on it.
[14:41.500 --> 14:44.460]  So it's stronger than actually a normal earbud.
[14:47.300 --> 14:52.080]  If there's damage to the fibers inside of the inner ear, would this still work?
[14:52.180 --> 14:55.900]  Or is this reliant on the fibers in order to transmit?
[14:57.160 --> 14:58.880]  Yeah, that has to work.
[15:00.600 --> 15:06.460]  So you need to have the inner ear and you need to have the auditory nerve from your ear to your brain.
[15:06.720 --> 15:07.940]  At least one of them.
[15:08.140 --> 15:11.540]  It'll work if there's one in place, you know, so...
[15:15.900 --> 15:18.380]  Have you considered non-auditory input?
[15:18.740 --> 15:25.340]  Like ranging from an ultrasound or different types of senses that could be mapped into an auditory signal?
[15:28.520 --> 15:31.180]  That might make this a totally different project.
[15:31.180 --> 15:32.020]  I don't know.
[15:32.380 --> 15:38.500]  There was a biorhythm exhibition last summer where they had these like, you know, like a sonic bed.
[15:38.680 --> 15:44.080]  You could get in the bed and it would, you know, sort of envelope you in sound or whatever.
[15:44.400 --> 15:49.440]  So, but yeah, I'll see what I come across.
[15:49.440 --> 15:53.880]  Do you have any ideas for like, what you'd want to experience?
[15:55.000 --> 15:57.380]  Well, I think, well, my wife actually is blind.
[15:57.400 --> 16:01.500]  And so we're always very interested in ways to get haptic feedback for certain things.
[16:01.680 --> 16:05.680]  And so a range finder mechanism might be of interest.
[16:05.840 --> 16:09.340]  So you could sense a room and amplifying your hearing.
[16:09.860 --> 16:18.840]  Again, so she relies very heavily on her hearing in a different way to you do, but she still has to do all these tricks about navigating a space and the relationship between what sight she does have on her hearing and so on.
[16:24.510 --> 16:24.990]  Sorry.
[16:25.750 --> 16:31.710]  There's a few projects that use sensation like vibration or electrodes and things like that to remap sensors.
[16:31.710 --> 16:49.610]  But my question was, a lot of these projects and your work, I guess, as well, is based on losing some kind of sense or to in some way having something missing from what we consider as the normal human experience.
[16:50.150 --> 16:58.470]  Is there something from your project that you think could apply to make hearing better than the normal human experience?
[16:58.470 --> 17:04.570]  Like, are there things that you can do to improve your other ear as opposed to merely regain what you had lost?
[17:07.850 --> 17:14.170]  I don't think that technology is really ready for that, you know, because it's all man-made.
[17:14.330 --> 17:18.430]  And the thing about sound is it's so beautiful.
[17:18.430 --> 17:30.190]  And when you're, you know, wearing something that's artificial, even like these totally crazy, you know, hearing aids that people have made, and it's still, it's like, it is like listening through a radio.
[17:30.450 --> 17:32.970]  You know, there's sort of interference sometimes and all these things.
[17:34.110 --> 17:35.150]  It would be great.
[17:36.090 --> 17:39.950]  I was thinking of, you know, adding on to your sense.
[17:40.070 --> 17:51.490]  I mean, this is definitely, you know, more of an art project, but what if I put like 10 microphones around my head, you know, and then I could have just 360 sound all the time or something, I don't know.
[17:52.330 --> 17:55.290]  But, um, there's someone in the back.
[17:58.110 --> 18:05.890]  In, uh, when, when you have this on, do you have to spend extra time thinking about what you're getting in order to interpret it?
[18:05.970 --> 18:10.810]  Or because it's sort of plugging into the internals of your hearing anyway, is it still very intuitive?
[18:11.250 --> 18:15.390]  That you, you hear it as hearing instead of hearing it as something new and different?
[18:16.810 --> 18:19.190]  Um, yeah, you get used to it.
[18:19.430 --> 18:22.410]  Um, so, so, you know, it is, it is like hearing.
[18:26.090 --> 18:26.710]  I don't know.
[18:26.810 --> 18:27.050]  Okay.
[18:27.570 --> 18:34.230]  Um, it sounded like one of the things that was sort of the most, like, that the frustration you had was, was localization.
[18:34.510 --> 18:37.250]  Cause you had like, just, there's the one ear that you could hear out of.
[18:37.250 --> 18:44.570]  Is, is there anything, like, have you, have you, have you tried anything with, with the, the inputs for the sound that are in the helmet?
[18:45.090 --> 18:57.010]  Possibly even sending something to the, to the, the, the fully functioning ear as well to, to actually recreate that perception of, of, like, the location of sound sources?
[18:57.870 --> 19:03.370]  Like maybe, maybe relative strengths coming in, or I, I don't, I don't really know exactly how you do it, but.
[19:03.370 --> 19:06.590]  Yeah, no, that, that's totally, totally true.
[19:06.730 --> 19:09.250]  Cause it sounds slightly different.
[19:09.250 --> 19:14.390]  You kind of realize that it's on, you know, whatever side of your head the microphone's on.
[19:14.930 --> 19:21.170]  Um, so you can sort of train yourself to, uh, to find direction that way, you know.
[19:24.160 --> 19:30.640]  Hey, so I know the, uh, usual upper limit on the highest frequency people can hear is actually due to the structure of the outer ear.
[19:30.640 --> 19:34.380]  And through bone conduction hearing, you can hear up to many tens of kilohertz at least.
[19:34.800 --> 19:36.820]  Have you thought of doing anything in ultrasound with this?
[19:37.060 --> 19:38.040]  For hearing ultrasound?
[19:40.030 --> 19:41.530]  Like whales or something?
[19:45.720 --> 19:47.660]  That's a good, a good question.
[19:47.860 --> 19:55.140]  Maybe we could translate that into something and, you know, have people hearing that underwater.
[19:57.340 --> 19:58.080]  That's great.
[20:01.540 --> 20:02.880]  Hey, this is a great talk.
[20:03.160 --> 20:08.000]  Um, do you have a sense of what this will be in three years, five years time?
[20:08.220 --> 20:12.700]  Do you see this more as art, medical technology, a product?
[20:13.080 --> 20:16.280]  I just like to hear kind of what, what's your vision for a few years out?
[20:17.340 --> 20:19.200]  Um, that's a really good question.
[20:19.200 --> 20:21.360]  Cause I just started this, this year.
[20:21.360 --> 20:28.800]  Um, you know, so I, I am interested in, uh, if it's possible to make it smaller, you know.
[20:29.580 --> 20:31.920]  Um, and, you know, I'm sure it is.
[20:32.080 --> 20:33.800]  So that's something I have to look into.
[20:34.340 --> 20:41.100]  Um, but I think it would just be cool to have, you know, some sort of kit or some sort of instructions.
[20:41.400 --> 20:48.680]  Because, um, it, it's just a nice feeling to, that people could just make it, you know, and have it if they need it.
[20:48.680 --> 20:50.960]  And there's actually, um, a lab.
[20:51.160 --> 20:57.620]  It's a little devices lab at MIT where they're, um, they're doing this and they're, like, totally serious.
[20:57.640 --> 21:01.920]  Like, they'll, uh, go to Africa and, and people want a pharmacy.
[21:01.920 --> 21:04.500]  So they'll be like, oh, how do we make a pregnancy test?
[21:04.640 --> 21:06.560]  Let's take it apart and see how it's made.
[21:06.700 --> 21:11.900]  And, you know, see if there's materials in, in the environment here that we could use for, for that kind of stuff.
[21:12.160 --> 21:14.980]  So, um, so yeah.
[21:15.080 --> 21:17.920]  And that's, that's a worst case scenario kind of thing.
[21:17.920 --> 21:20.240]  I like worst case scenarios a lot.
[21:22.640 --> 21:23.080]  So...
[21:25.260 --> 21:30.360]  There's a, a guy in the UK you might be interested in talking to, a guy called Dr. Kevin Warwick.
[21:30.460 --> 21:31.480]  You may have heard of him.
[21:31.600 --> 21:33.060]  He's kind of a robotics guy.
[21:33.160 --> 21:34.380]  He's not a medical doctor or anything.
[21:34.980 --> 21:37.380]  Um, but, uh, I went to a lecturer.
[21:37.560 --> 21:39.740]  He's, uh, I don't know, maybe 12 months ago.
[21:39.880 --> 21:44.640]  And he's doing similar things, particularly with, um, ultrasonics that some, someone mentioned earlier.
[21:44.640 --> 21:50.960]  Um, in terms of kind of just sort of augmenting extra senses.
[21:51.540 --> 21:56.380]  Um, so some of this work he's doing is sort of, um, uh, implants related.
[21:56.600 --> 22:01.280]  But a lot of it's sort of external, you know, conducting vibrations, uh, similar to this.
[22:01.280 --> 22:03.180]  So it might be worth looking that guy up.
[22:03.980 --> 22:04.400]  Okay.
[22:04.400 --> 22:05.280]  What's his name again?
[22:05.580 --> 22:06.780]  Uh, Dr. Kevin Warwick.
[22:07.500 --> 22:07.940]  Okay.
[22:08.300 --> 22:09.000]  I'll go right there.
[22:09.060 --> 22:09.340]  Yes.
[22:09.480 --> 22:09.880]  Excellent.
[22:11.300 --> 22:11.720]  Yeah.
[22:12.180 --> 22:12.240]  Yeah.
[22:13.020 --> 22:13.220]  Yeah.
[22:14.860 --> 22:15.000]  Hello.
[22:15.380 --> 22:16.680]  I think you have a totally cool idea.
[22:17.140 --> 22:21.380]  And, uh, is it necessary for your entire head to be encapsulated?
[22:21.380 --> 22:25.900]  Could you have, like, a super cool futuristic headband sort of thing that just goes all the way around?
[22:26.100 --> 22:27.580]  Or does it have to be in a helmet?
[22:28.900 --> 22:31.360]  Um, yeah, it doesn't have to be in a helmet.
[22:31.740 --> 22:44.260]  Um, you know, that was just sort of, you know, a test to, uh, to just get the thing working and be able to have this wireless thing that I could go outside and wear and, you know, just see how it felt.
[22:46.900 --> 22:50.520]  Um, so, yeah, I mean, would you wear a futuristic headband?
[22:50.700 --> 22:50.860]  Yeah.
[22:51.040 --> 22:52.260]  That's a good wearable question.
[22:52.580 --> 22:55.460]  I got, like, an augmented reality sort of vibe from this.
[22:56.520 --> 23:00.540]  I mean, you know, augmented reality people are putting, you know, LED screens in glasses.
[23:00.620 --> 23:02.760]  Well, why not augment your hearing, too?
[23:02.880 --> 23:04.120]  I think that would be a totally cool idea.
[23:04.120 --> 23:06.300]  And I would buy it if it's a really cool headband.
[23:08.580 --> 23:08.940]  Nice.
[23:09.880 --> 23:10.240]  Great.
[23:12.000 --> 23:14.340]  I'm wondering how often do you wear this?
[23:14.680 --> 23:23.120]  And outside of, like, the, the proof of concept, like, how has this changed, like, your everyday interactions with people and, like, the social side of things?
[23:24.380 --> 23:27.380]  Um, yeah, I don't wear this normally.
[23:27.640 --> 23:32.380]  It's, uh, you know, it's definitely a test project.
[23:32.500 --> 23:41.880]  And, uh, so I sort of wear it when, uh, you know, it's, it, it feels like, uh, performance or, you know, if I'm doing a demonstration or something like that.
[23:42.180 --> 23:46.140]  Um, yeah, it has a really performative aspect to it.
[23:46.320 --> 23:54.780]  Because, um, I, I really don't need to be wearing a big helmet in my daily life.
[23:54.920 --> 23:57.220]  But, I mean, maybe I should go to work like that.
[23:58.020 --> 23:58.540]  You know?
[23:59.380 --> 24:01.740]  Actually, when I, when I had surgery, I was thinking about this.
[24:01.740 --> 24:04.680]  I, um, I wasn't supposed to get hit on the head.
[24:05.120 --> 24:07.380]  Because they had, like, cut a hole in my skull.
[24:07.560 --> 24:10.300]  And it had to, it takes, like, six weeks to heal up.
[24:10.460 --> 24:15.160]  So, I was thinking this is, like, a really good post-surgery sort of project.
[24:15.180 --> 24:17.980]  Where it's, like, you know, you've just come out.
[24:18.140 --> 24:20.760]  And you're, like, f*ck, I, I can't hear in one ear.
[24:20.900 --> 24:23.200]  And I'm not supposed to get hit on the head.
[24:23.920 --> 24:24.460]  You know?
[24:25.160 --> 24:27.160]  I, I don't know if anyone would go for that.
[24:27.160 --> 24:28.720]  But, it was a thought.
[24:31.760 --> 24:34.460]  Um, I'm the kind of person that errs on the side of caution.
[24:34.620 --> 24:40.820]  And I've heard many horror stories about people losing hearing to, you know, listening to too many loud rock concerts and the like.
[24:40.920 --> 24:45.100]  And my spouse actually had cholesteatoma and is missing most of his hearing in one ear.
[24:45.720 --> 24:48.500]  And I'd be concerned about using something like that.
[24:48.620 --> 24:52.420]  Because what are the implications for his working eardrum?
[24:52.560 --> 24:56.800]  Would it cause any sort of damage to have amplified sound vibrating through his entire skull?
[24:59.340 --> 25:01.640]  Um, I don't know.
[25:01.680 --> 25:05.160]  Because it, you know, it goes right to the, to the inner ear.
[25:05.480 --> 25:10.040]  So, um, yeah, I'm sure it vibrates the bones in the process.
[25:10.380 --> 25:11.720]  Yeah, there's a lot of bones in there.
[25:11.960 --> 25:13.800]  So, um...
[25:26.160 --> 25:30.800]  Well, you know, it would be interesting, actually, to see, like, you know, the stuff that's on the market.
[25:31.020 --> 25:33.920]  Like, the ones where they, like, totally implant it into your head.
[25:33.920 --> 25:38.200]  Um, you know, if there's any sort of long-term damage with those, you know?
[25:38.340 --> 25:40.280]  Because this isn't anything different.
[25:40.560 --> 25:44.800]  And so they're already selling that, you know, as a sort of medical solution.
[25:45.260 --> 25:45.620]  So...
[25:46.160 --> 25:47.160]  That's a good question.
[25:48.560 --> 25:51.320]  Um, you mentioned that it has a microphone.
[25:51.620 --> 25:52.940]  At least one, if not two.
[25:53.580 --> 25:58.820]  Um, microphones are, um, very affected by sort of what's around them or how they're placed.
[25:58.820 --> 26:03.080]  So I wondered if you experimented at all by putting, say, like, a parabolic mic and if you could...
[26:03.080 --> 26:04.000]  If you could...
[26:06.080 --> 26:08.560]  You could carry it with you or you could point it in different directions.
[26:08.880 --> 26:13.240]  Or you could even, uh, since it can be wireless, you can leave the mic somewhere else.
[26:13.660 --> 26:15.980]  You know, like, drop it near a stage or something.
[26:16.540 --> 26:23.040]  Uh, or you were talking about things to hear, you could put a heartbeat sensor on your mate and hear their heartbeat, perhaps, or something.
[26:26.160 --> 26:27.320]  You should call me up.
[26:27.440 --> 26:28.340]  We could work on this.
[26:38.830 --> 26:43.630]  I had, uh, I had one idea, uh, from the two things that were talked about here.
[26:44.150 --> 27:04.130]  Um, if you can hear higher frequencies through, like, bone conduction, um, maybe you can, like, make an ultrasound thing that would maybe help that guy's wife see by, like, a bat through ultrasound conducting.
[27:04.130 --> 27:06.850]  So there's a project for somebody to think about.
[27:08.130 --> 27:08.890]  Excellent.
[27:09.190 --> 27:09.350]  Yeah.
[27:11.430 --> 27:11.910]  Yeah.
[27:11.910 --> 27:16.770]  Yeah, they're gonna have this whole thing in Central Park where people are hanging out with bats.
[27:17.550 --> 27:20.410]  And, uh, in a, in next week, actually.
[27:20.730 --> 27:21.970]  Maybe you should check that out.
[27:23.890 --> 27:24.370]  Because...
[27:24.370 --> 27:26.390]  I have to look this up.
[27:26.510 --> 27:28.870]  This ultrasonic thing keeps coming up, you know?
[27:31.010 --> 27:33.050]  I think it's on Wednesday or something.
[27:33.050 --> 27:36.470]  It's some sort of bat walk or whatever in Central Park.
[27:42.420 --> 27:49.880]  Um, as long as, as I say, as, uh, uh, it's been some years ago I studied for a bit, uh, about sequel acoustics.
[27:50.120 --> 27:59.580]  Um, usually the, the, the stereo that the brain receives, how do you localize, uh, where the sounds come is, uh, learned by the, by the brain.
[27:59.580 --> 28:05.300]  So you, as, as you have learned that you get the sounds, uh, from the last place you have seen something.
[28:06.220 --> 28:10.560]  Little, little kids, uh, still don't, don't know, uh, where, where the sounds comes.
[28:11.060 --> 28:32.080]  So maybe, uh, if you only had, uh, if you only got, uh, sound through, through the school, yes, um, uh, through one ear and you leave the, your, your fine ear, uh, uncovered, maybe if you did it for a while, you began to, to get some kind of a stereo image on your brain and began to learn how to,
[28:32.080 --> 28:39.400]  how to get a bit of this, regain a bit of your location abilities, based on, based on that.
[28:40.680 --> 28:41.800]  Based on seeing?
[28:43.460 --> 29:01.120]  Not on seeing, but, uh, still having your, your, uh, your healthy ear uncovered and, and getting the, the, the other, uh, like placing a mic on the other side and getting info from, from the, from the other side on, on the, on your skull, on your bones.
[29:01.380 --> 29:01.820]  Yes.
[29:02.560 --> 29:03.440]  Yeah, absolutely.
[29:03.760 --> 29:08.900]  Cause it, it will sound like slightly different, you know, coming from a device.
[29:09.360 --> 29:12.340]  Maybe it's a process of learning and having it for a while.
[29:13.100 --> 29:15.400]  Maybe it's a process of learning, having it for a while.
[29:15.480 --> 29:26.020]  Maybe you have it like for one week or two, your, your brain begins to, to, to do something and relate the two different kinds of sound and you can relate better than with sight like you do now.
[29:27.580 --> 29:28.300]  Yeah, absolutely.
[29:30.360 --> 29:32.140]  Yeah, I mean, I think that's a really good idea.
[29:32.280 --> 29:38.120]  I think one thought about that would be to try and, instead of have the transducer up here, try to localize it a little bit closer to the...
[29:39.960 --> 29:41.080]  I guess to the bad ear.
[29:41.280 --> 29:47.040]  So I guess the good ear is still hearing sound from the outside and having a transducer over here.
[29:47.040 --> 29:51.120]  Just because I know that those cues are usually timing and level based.
[29:52.240 --> 30:03.280]  So, if you really want to try and tackle that, try and localize with this, you try and, I guess, first get the transducer to be roughly equally as loud as the good ear.
[30:03.640 --> 30:12.760]  And then the time differences should just work because if the transducer is over here, it's as if it's where your ear is.
[30:12.760 --> 30:18.440]  So, I think if you wanted to try and pursue that, you'd try and scoot the transducer over to where your other ear was.
[30:19.840 --> 30:21.100]  You're absolutely right.
[30:21.740 --> 30:22.700]  Let's get this guy.
[30:25.830 --> 30:30.250]  Have you thought about modifying it for, like, entertainment purposes or for those sorts of markets?
[30:31.470 --> 30:36.670]  Just for, like, normal people to, like, have more different types of auditory experiences?
[30:39.510 --> 30:45.010]  Well, I was thinking about that when, you know, I was building an effects pedal.
[30:45.170 --> 30:53.430]  It's not in there yet, but, you know, like, it's a nice experiment to see, you know, if you have a delay, you know, how that changes your perception.
[30:53.430 --> 30:58.050]  You know, if you added a larger delay, I'm sure it would really change it.
[30:58.310 --> 31:05.790]  So, I mean, that's a matter of just taking, you know, someone with normal hearing and messing it up.
[31:07.670 --> 31:12.790]  So, it's not... it could be fun, you know?
[31:13.770 --> 31:15.710]  Yeah, for educational purposes, too.
[31:15.890 --> 31:17.630]  Yeah, that's true, for education.
[31:22.330 --> 31:23.050]  All right.
[31:23.430 --> 31:23.870]  Nice.
[31:29.930 --> 31:36.690]  I understand that this is primarily a device for you to gain back some of your ability.
[31:36.910 --> 31:40.630]  And like was said earlier, I completely understand that.
[31:40.750 --> 31:41.410]  I've been in that position.
[31:41.550 --> 31:42.850]  I've had five surgeries on my ear.
[31:43.030 --> 31:44.410]  I've had part of my skull removed.
[31:44.510 --> 31:45.570]  I have a hole in my eardrum.
[31:45.570 --> 31:48.210]  I have difficulty hearing a lot of frequencies.
[31:49.770 --> 31:54.930]  And if half the people in this room are talking right now, I'll be going insane, because I wouldn't be able to handle it.
[31:56.430 --> 32:07.130]  I think this kind of device is wonderful for dealing with that, but could also be used for expanding beyond what our current senses can currently handle.
[32:07.490 --> 32:10.950]  Like, one idea I just had was a pH sensor, for example.
[32:10.950 --> 32:16.910]  You could hear the acidity of the air around you.
[32:17.130 --> 32:19.070]  You could hear the moisture level in the air.
[32:19.990 --> 32:29.370]  And I think that'd be a great way of expanding upon our basic senses and allowing us to experience the world and learn from the world in new ways.
[32:49.520 --> 32:51.700]  Great talk, and I think you had some great ideas.
[32:52.060 --> 33:02.660]  I was wondering if you had ever heard of, in Rochester, at Rochester Institute of Technology, they also have the National Technical Institute for the Deaf, and I think they would love to hear your idea.
[33:03.940 --> 33:04.700]  All right.
[33:05.800 --> 33:07.200]  I guess I'll look them up.
[33:09.320 --> 33:10.220]  Sweet, thanks.
[33:11.740 --> 33:12.480]  All right.
[33:13.900 --> 33:14.960]  Okay, is that it?
[33:16.340 --> 33:17.280]  I guess so.
[33:17.440 --> 33:18.420]  Thanks for coming, guys.
[33:18.420 --> 33:18.500]  Thank you very much.
[33:18.520 --> 33:18.900]  Thanks, Maria.
[33:18.900 --> 33:18.920]  Thank you.