[00:00.000 --> 00:01.360]  This is the second one.
[00:01.660 --> 00:02.120]  This is the second one.
[00:11.660 --> 00:12.400]  Come on.
[00:12.660 --> 00:13.240]  Yeah, please.
[00:14.080 --> 00:15.360]  We're making time on the car.
[00:15.640 --> 00:16.420]  We'll call back.
[00:19.460 --> 00:21.000]  We'll call back and say we have a card.
[00:23.780 --> 00:25.380]  A little click on the card.
[00:25.540 --> 00:26.960]  Just be back and go to the car.
[01:51.060 --> 01:51.860]  Talk, talk.
[01:54.700 --> 01:56.720]  Talking to the other telephone, yes.
[02:10.370 --> 02:12.510]  Yes, we begin.
[02:12.730 --> 02:12.870]  Okay.
[02:13.430 --> 02:15.250]  I'm going to introduce you and then we start.
[02:15.510 --> 02:15.950]  No problem.
[02:16.850 --> 02:17.930]  We'll grab up a mic here.
[02:19.070 --> 02:19.450]  Hello.
[02:20.490 --> 02:20.710]  Hello.
[02:21.070 --> 02:21.150]  Yeah.
[02:25.470 --> 02:26.030]  Don't worry.
[02:26.210 --> 02:27.890]  I'll introduce you and then you can go.
[02:28.150 --> 02:28.170]  Hello.
[02:35.370 --> 02:40.530]  Okay, we're starting again, so we're waiting for a few more people to come in from outside and then we're going to start.
[02:40.530 --> 02:44.010]  So let's give it 30 seconds for people to come in.
[03:57.120 --> 04:03.560]  As you know and as you have all read on the program, we would have liked to begin here.
[04:03.560 --> 04:11.640]  We're going to start with an address by Emmanuel Goldstein, the editor of 2600 Magazine and the organizer of the Beyond HOPE Conference in New York.
[04:12.900 --> 04:22.500]  Due to fiendish technical difficulties and because we could not get the audio link over our deluxe picture tell box working as of yet, we're still working on it.
[04:23.260 --> 04:30.360]  This address is going to be rather short because the audio is absolutely of less than optimal quality.
[04:30.740 --> 04:33.240]  So the address is going to be very short.
[04:33.440 --> 04:35.120]  It's going to be very hard to understand.
[04:35.120 --> 04:43.700]  We promise you a longer and more hi-fi address later during this conference.
[04:43.700 --> 04:51.160]  And of course, all the shared sessions between HIP and Beyond HOPE will have perfect audio quality, we hope, we think.
[04:51.160 --> 04:57.240]  But for now this address is going to be very short, and I pass the mic to Emmanuel Goldstein.
[05:06.960 --> 05:13.300]  Hello, my name is Emmanuel Goldstein.
[05:13.300 --> 05:13.840]  I will soon.
[05:14.420 --> 05:17.420]  Let's sing in the name of the name of the Lord.
[05:18.540 --> 05:19.440]  It's the King of the King of the Lord.
[05:21.520 --> 05:23.960]  Let's get off the table.
[05:23.960 --> 05:27.760]  Well, that must be there and here.
[05:32.160 --> 05:40.720]  But if you don't have to come from here and I can be there and you can come from here as well, you can come here as well.
[05:43.880 --> 05:53.100]  What I want you to be, is you all, and I have to talk to you about it, but I don't know if I know it's a fire.
[05:53.100 --> 06:02.600]  But, I also hope that you are too strong, with you, and I'm telling you so sad.
[06:05.800 --> 06:08.260]  Can anybody have a good number of things?
[06:14.340 --> 06:17.420]  But, we have a new society.
[06:33.340 --> 06:38.580]  And we feel that after that, right?
[06:39.440 --> 06:40.380]  Take a break.
[06:41.280 --> 06:43.400]  And that we will be here.
[06:50.640 --> 06:53.280]  You are my mother, we have to be here.
[06:54.380 --> 06:55.440]  So, what's up?
[07:01.370 --> 07:05.670]  We take care of the fact that we have to be here.
[07:23.450 --> 07:24.830]  Oh, cool.
[07:25.870 --> 07:26.470]  Excellent.
[07:28.210 --> 07:29.050]  Yeah, excellent.
[07:46.170 --> 07:49.410]  We can't read what's on the screen, but we'll read it later.
[08:00.040 --> 08:01.680]  All right, are you still there?
[08:04.000 --> 08:04.840]  Hello?
[08:06.620 --> 08:07.040]  Hello?
[08:08.960 --> 08:09.380]  Hello?
[08:33.840 --> 08:34.880]  Nice game.
[09:00.160 --> 09:01.560]  Okay.
[09:09.270 --> 09:12.770]  Are you done?
[09:13.110 --> 09:14.510]  Yes.
[09:19.290 --> 09:19.970]  Okay.
[09:19.970 --> 09:20.650]  Cool.
[09:21.050 --> 09:21.510]  Cool.
[09:22.930 --> 09:24.450]  Okay, we'll talk to you later.
[09:24.570 --> 09:24.910]  Good luck.
[09:26.610 --> 09:27.170]  Good luck.
[09:32.080 --> 09:33.260]  Okay, cool.
[09:33.560 --> 09:34.240]  Cool.
[09:34.840 --> 09:37.620]  HIP starts with being hacked by everyone.
[09:38.280 --> 09:39.660]  I really like this.
[09:43.140 --> 09:54.150]  Okay, we're going to switch to another video source here.
[09:59.930 --> 10:03.250]  We'd like to welcome you all to this, the exact middle of nowhere.
[10:03.550 --> 10:09.970]  Again, a place far away from society, or at least a few kilometers away from the nearest city.
[10:12.530 --> 10:24.430]  The PTT has complimented us on picking a spot far enough away from wires and infrastructure that they had to set up a microwave beam in order to get us connected to the network.
[10:24.430 --> 10:27.150]  So, we were complimented on that.
[10:29.570 --> 10:30.870]  It's been a while ago.
[10:31.030 --> 10:36.170]  It's been four years since HEU hacking at the end of the universe in 1993.
[10:37.050 --> 10:43.470]  And HEU was held in what seems now like a completely different era, a completely different century.
[10:43.470 --> 10:47.710]  There was no public access Internet in many countries and many places.
[10:48.370 --> 10:51.050]  Even in Holland, very few people had Internet access.
[10:52.450 --> 11:02.450]  HEU had what was then state-of-the-art go-for-server in use to inform the public around the Internet what HEU was and how they could get there.
[11:02.450 --> 11:06.130]  And we still had to do lots of other advertising.
[11:06.550 --> 11:07.750]  We had to make posters.
[11:07.970 --> 11:15.970]  We had to fold lots of folders in order to get HEU known to the community of hackers around Europe and around the world.
[11:17.350 --> 11:19.070]  Now, that wasn't necessary anymore.
[11:19.190 --> 11:20.890]  We've only advertised on the World Wide Web.
[11:21.010 --> 11:25.170]  The World Wide Web in 1993 didn't even really exist yet.
[11:25.530 --> 11:28.590]  It was there, but it wasn't really in use.
[11:30.110 --> 11:36.090]  HEU had two times 19.2 Internet connection and it was enough.
[11:36.270 --> 11:38.210]  People could actually tell that out to the world.
[11:38.390 --> 11:39.150]  They could IRC.
[11:39.150 --> 11:44.990]  They could do anything they wanted to over two 19.2 perigate connections.
[11:48.230 --> 11:53.990]  A lot of us have to really live in the world in making the Internet accessible and developing it.
[11:54.570 --> 11:56.250]  We've set up Internet access.
[11:56.990 --> 11:58.790]  We've helped set up Internet access.
[11:59.010 --> 11:59.670]  We've set up email.
[12:00.830 --> 12:02.970]  We've built public spaces on the net.
[12:04.830 --> 12:14.010]  And we've raised public awareness on issues like privacy, encryption, and lots of social issues regarding the net.
[12:17.600 --> 12:23.340]  But there's also a lot of problems that face us, that face the Internet community and, in fact, the entire world.
[12:24.060 --> 12:30.460]  Our Internet environment is being polluted, which may or may not be a result of the very other fields of the Internet.
[12:32.060 --> 12:39.700]  There's an urge by governments all over the world to take control of all of these new technologies and to regain their control over the media.
[12:40.260 --> 12:41.420]  And there's censorship.
[12:41.680 --> 12:47.560]  Many countries, governments are trying to control what people can and cannot say, also on the Internet.
[12:48.320 --> 12:51.560]  So we are still facing more of problems in the world.
[12:51.840 --> 12:58.380]  Even though Internet access is now there for most of us West Europeans and for most of us north of the equator.
[12:58.700 --> 13:00.920]  There's still a lot of problems facing us.
[13:03.760 --> 13:04.360]  Okay.
[13:04.660 --> 13:06.440]  And then, now we are back today.
[13:07.100 --> 13:08.640]  And we have more people.
[13:09.080 --> 13:10.620]  We have more facilities.
[13:11.300 --> 13:12.380]  We have more logistics.
[13:13.280 --> 13:16.360]  It's all much more complicated than four years ago.
[13:16.740 --> 13:23.580]  We have had a six-metric microwave and we will be doing our reconnection.
[13:25.760 --> 13:29.980]  And we only hope it's enough.
[13:30.200 --> 13:34.120]  Because we are all afraid to serve our family, we can't imagine.
[13:42.050 --> 13:43.650]  What is the purpose of HIP?
[13:44.890 --> 13:55.490]  For us, the purpose of HIP is to let all of you network yourself in a technical sense, but also in a social sense.
[13:56.630 --> 14:13.490]  HIP is our place where we can meet each other, where we can talk about issues that we are concerned about, and where we can talk about issues we'd like to know, we'd like to let the world know what we are concerned about.
[14:15.410 --> 14:24.830]  This is our place where we can find where we stand, where we can tell us This is the first one of the musical programs.
[14:27.000 --> 14:29.650]  And, um, ladies and gentlemen...
[15:38.460 --> 15:41.480]  Oh, yeah, ooh,
[15:54.920 --> 15:55.940]  yeah, yeah.
[16:19.280 --> 16:20.830]  Oh, yeah.
[24:44.600 --> 24:46.000]  Hi, everybody.
[25:04.960 --> 25:06.120]  Two minutes.
[25:06.880 --> 25:07.880]  Two minutes.
[25:08.300 --> 25:08.600]  Two minutes.
[26:41.300 --> 26:42.220]  Okay, thanks.
[26:42.720 --> 26:43.480]  I don't
[26:59.440 --> 27:01.300]  think it's working.
[27:10.120 --> 27:11.160]  Can you hear me now?
[27:12.120 --> 27:12.520]  Alright.
[27:13.740 --> 27:15.220]  Welcome to Beyond...
[27:16.700 --> 27:17.500]  Okay.
[27:25.760 --> 27:26.960]  Welcome to Beyond HOPE.
[27:28.280 --> 27:29.820]  You're supposed to applaud now.
[27:37.530 --> 27:41.090]  I want to give a special thank you to Garth Brooks for that wonderful concert last night.
[27:41.310 --> 27:42.150]  I think that's all.
[27:43.550 --> 27:44.790]  Garth, he's out there somewhere.
[27:44.910 --> 27:45.950]  I don't know exactly where he is.
[27:45.990 --> 27:48.750]  Last I heard, he was out in the network room trying to get his PC to work.
[27:50.730 --> 27:53.670]  We're here tonight to answer questions from the press.
[27:53.930 --> 28:00.030]  The conference officially starts tomorrow, but we're here tonight to sort of play around with our gizmos and get things working.
[28:00.030 --> 28:01.990]  A note from the network room.
[28:03.110 --> 28:03.730]  Let's see.
[28:03.870 --> 28:06.050]  Connectivity will be available in a few hours.
[28:06.230 --> 28:08.310]  Probably overnight will be actually connected to the net.
[28:08.830 --> 28:13.830]  And the main hope.net machine that you're all going to try to hack is going to be available tomorrow.
[28:13.830 --> 28:16.210]  So, please be patient with that.
[28:16.390 --> 28:21.850]  If you're a volunteer and you want your volunteer badge, please do not ask Pam anymore because she will kill you if you ask one more time.
[28:22.390 --> 28:26.050]  They will be available again tomorrow when the conference officially starts.
[28:27.630 --> 28:30.850]  We have a big lineup of speakers and panels.
[28:31.150 --> 28:33.450]  We have a schedule we just got back from Kinko's.
[28:33.630 --> 28:40.410]  So, that will be available in the back, in the merchandising room, whenever it is that you want to look at it and see what's coming up.
[28:40.490 --> 28:46.730]  I can tell you briefly, tonight we'll be sort of playing around with this thing with the World Wide Web.
[28:46.730 --> 28:54.830]  If there's anything you want to mess around with and show us, we have a PC there that we can sort of play around with and do things like that.
[28:54.830 --> 29:02.370]  We're going to take questions about 2600 coming up at around 9 o'clock and we'll be playing some videos from 10 o'clock onwards.
[29:02.870 --> 29:07.950]  Tomorrow, though, when we start the official conference, Brock Meeks of MSNBC will be giving the keynote address.
[29:07.950 --> 29:08.690]  That's at noon.
[29:09.090 --> 29:19.630]  And we'll have all kinds of other panels throughout the day, including some secret stuff that you might not be aware exists on privacy, information on people.
[29:19.630 --> 29:24.130]  That will be done by a real live private eye, right here, live on stage.
[29:24.830 --> 29:28.470]  We'll also have Bruce Schneier talking about encryption.
[29:28.830 --> 29:30.150]  The folks from the L0ptt.
[29:30.830 --> 29:36.890]  A live broadcast of Off The Hook at 6.30, being beamed out to all of the Tri-State area.
[29:37.370 --> 29:45.710]  And we'll have some folks from Steel This Radio, which is the Lower East Side's first low-power radio station that has declined to get permission from the FCC.
[29:51.590 --> 29:56.130]  We'll have a lecture from Ira Winkler, where hackers and criminals collide, all kinds of legal information there.
[29:57.010 --> 30:01.170]  GSM phones with fiber optic, Tom from England, and a couple of other expert types.
[30:01.690 --> 30:03.970]  I'm happy to announce that Bernie S.
[30:04.190 --> 30:04.770]  will be here.
[30:10.700 --> 30:15.960]  He will be on a couple of panels, including one on dangerous legislation that may just throw you in prison for a couple of years.
[30:15.960 --> 30:22.120]  As well as a prisoner panel with fiber optic to discuss just what happens to hackers when they go to jail.
[30:22.420 --> 30:23.780]  And how we can prevent such things.
[30:24.500 --> 30:27.460]  We'll also be tying into the conference in Holland.
[30:27.640 --> 30:30.160]  How many of you know there's a conference going on in Holland right now, too?
[30:32.600 --> 30:36.400]  This is probably the biggest hacker event ever in history.
[30:36.860 --> 30:42.500]  Because, A, we have a huge conference here, but, B, there's another huge conference someplace else, and we're tying them together.
[30:43.000 --> 30:46.440]  We connected to PictureTel last night to give their opening address.
[30:46.980 --> 30:51.040]  However, the sound didn't work very well, so they could see my face, but they couldn't hear what I was saying.
[30:51.860 --> 30:53.740]  But it's progress of sorts.
[30:54.100 --> 30:57.180]  We will have a very good network this time.
[30:57.180 --> 31:00.320]  If you recall, how many of you were at HOPE One in 1994?
[31:03.060 --> 31:08.320]  Well, as you know, we only had a 28-8 connection, and most of the time that was being ping-flooded by somebody in the Midwest.
[31:09.780 --> 31:15.180]  So, we have a 10 megabit connection this time, and we expect that to stay up a little bit longer.
[31:16.660 --> 31:18.640]  So, that'll be, again, happening overnight.
[31:18.760 --> 31:20.100]  We'll be getting that hooked up to the network.
[31:20.200 --> 31:27.600]  So, this could be a very historical conference in that it could be the first conference ever in the United States to actually have a working network that stays up.
[31:30.020 --> 31:31.680]  We're all hackers, so go figure.
[31:31.940 --> 31:34.960]  Okay, we have a bunch of people here today that come from all over the place.
[31:35.080 --> 31:36.700]  We have Veggie from CDC.
[31:42.260 --> 31:46.420]  We have Phiber OptiK, who is making his first appearance at a hacker convention ever.
[31:51.640 --> 31:54.040]  From England, the notorious CyberJunkie.
[31:57.560 --> 31:59.280]  Also from England, Zap.
[32:02.600 --> 32:05.560]  And former editor of TAP Magazine, Cheshire Catalyst.
[32:09.800 --> 32:17.300]  So, I'll give them each a moment or two to say whatever they want to say to you people, and then we can take some questions and get started.
[32:18.980 --> 32:19.420]  Veggie?
[32:20.240 --> 32:20.640]  What?
[32:20.800 --> 32:21.660]  You have anything to say, Veggie?
[32:22.340 --> 32:22.780]  Nothing.
[32:22.980 --> 32:23.180]  Okay.
[32:24.540 --> 32:25.260]  No comment.
[32:25.820 --> 32:27.600]  You didn't bring Mr. T for some reason.
[32:27.980 --> 32:28.920]  No, I didn't bring Mr. T.
[32:29.840 --> 32:30.580]  Phiber Optik.
[32:31.400 --> 32:32.260]  Oh, geez.
[32:33.340 --> 32:34.460]  Speak into the microphone.
[32:43.520 --> 32:44.560]  Thank you for coming.
[32:45.060 --> 32:46.460]  I have nothing to say.
[32:53.360 --> 32:54.280]  CyberJunkie.
[32:55.540 --> 32:57.880]  No, I've got nothing to say either, really.
[32:59.540 --> 33:01.600]  Well, send it into the microphone.
[33:03.600 --> 33:05.900]  I said very quietly, I ain't got anything to say either.
[33:06.340 --> 33:07.700]  See, he's got a real accent.
[33:09.260 --> 33:09.700]  Zap.
[33:10.340 --> 33:11.740]  Yeah, speak to my liar.
[33:16.540 --> 33:22.480]  Well, I'm the Cheshire Catalyst, and I used to be the press liaison for Tap, as well as the editor, publisher.
[33:22.480 --> 33:26.380]  The guy that pasted it up, got it to the mailbox, a few other things.
[33:27.500 --> 33:30.300]  So, I've gotten used to handling some of the questions from the press.
[33:30.440 --> 33:39.520]  And the one thing I just like to get across is, all hacking is, it's just hacking away at the computer keyboard until it does what you want it to do.
[33:44.120 --> 33:49.940]  After that, it's trying to keep that program running, getting it fixed.
[33:50.980 --> 34:02.240]  The true hacker syndrome is when you see a piece of software that doesn't work the way you think it should, and you try and tell the guy who's supposed to maintain it, what it should be doing.
[34:02.740 --> 34:04.640]  And usually, how to fix it.
[34:05.440 --> 34:07.940]  It's called bug reps, bug reports.
[34:08.780 --> 34:20.200]  And I wind up on the world wide web, sending in these bug reps to people, some of whom have no clue what I'm talking about, because they use some piece of software to write their web page, and they weren't really sure how to use that.
[34:20.640 --> 34:27.820]  So, it's an interesting phenomenon to see all these newbies, using all these sophisticated software tools, not really knowing what they're doing, and putting up some interesting things.
[34:28.760 --> 34:29.940]  But, they're hacking.
[34:31.140 --> 34:33.860]  They're just hacking away at it until it does what they want it to do.
[34:33.860 --> 34:41.320]  So, now, part of the share the knowledge syndrome that I have as a hacker is to help get the word out to some of these people writing web pages.
[34:41.860 --> 34:43.040]  You've got graphics.
[34:43.300 --> 34:44.320]  They're good graphics.
[34:44.500 --> 34:47.360]  But don't forget the guys that can't see the graphics.
[34:47.580 --> 34:50.300]  The people using links, the non-graphic web browser.
[34:56.040 --> 34:57.840]  My thing is information.
[34:58.160 --> 35:06.860]  If you go to my homepage, http colon slash slash digital dot net slash tilde Cheshire.
[35:08.760 --> 35:09.280]  Plug.
[35:09.280 --> 35:09.680]  Yeah, plug.
[35:09.760 --> 35:10.620]  Can we go to that page?
[35:10.760 --> 35:13.560]  You'll find that it's mostly text.
[35:13.900 --> 35:15.360]  There's very few graphics.
[35:16.140 --> 35:17.500]  Can we go to that page, please?
[35:17.760 --> 35:18.960]  Well, probably not immediately.
[35:19.300 --> 35:20.220]  Let me type it to you again.
[35:20.260 --> 35:20.740]  We're typing it.
[35:20.740 --> 35:35.620]  Okay, http colon slash slash digital, D-I-G-I-T-A-L dot N-E-T slash the tilde character, which is up next to the number one, but you have to hit the shift key to get there.
[35:37.460 --> 35:38.820]  Well, there's a lot of newbies.
[35:39.020 --> 35:40.580]  I do have to explain that to you.
[35:40.640 --> 35:42.540]  I expect these folks here won't be that newbie.
[35:42.540 --> 35:45.380]  But after the tilde, it's Cheshire.
[35:45.520 --> 35:51.440]  C-H-E-S-H-I-R-E slash will be a little faster.
[35:51.660 --> 35:55.280]  And it'll hit enter, and it should get you there.
[35:56.720 --> 36:00.420]  Now, one of the graphics I do have on my page, I'm fairly proud of.
[36:01.480 --> 36:04.420]  Actually, if you want to put... Oh, okay, it's coming up now.
[36:07.740 --> 36:08.140]  Okay,
[36:13.940 --> 36:15.280]  what characters have been forgotten?
[36:15.780 --> 36:16.180]  Oh!
[36:16.620 --> 36:19.000]  Now, did I tell you to put WWW up there?
[36:20.960 --> 36:25.060]  I did not tell you to put WWW, because that's not how you reach it.
[36:25.060 --> 36:28.100]  How did you get the error message on the side of a milk carton?
[36:28.920 --> 36:32.780]  Well, this is the error message from Florida Online, digital.net.
[36:33.060 --> 36:33.960]  Yeah, this is the graphic.
[36:35.680 --> 36:36.160]  Okay.
[36:39.100 --> 36:41.780]  And also notice the little TM trademark symbol?
[36:42.200 --> 36:44.320]  That is character number 153.
[36:45.720 --> 36:48.060]  So you can make that a single character.
[36:49.180 --> 36:56.360]  If you go back up to the line, and after the slash, the last slash there, if you put pound sign, politics.
[37:03.210 --> 37:04.710]  My political agenda.
[37:05.090 --> 37:07.190]  And the logo for Sam's army.
[37:07.550 --> 37:10.930]  Which is the national supporters club for the U.S. national soccer team.
[37:16.810 --> 37:18.510]  Yes, I am a one-worlder.
[37:18.630 --> 37:20.250]  I believe one world, one game.
[37:20.690 --> 37:22.570]  And the rest of the world likes soccer people.
[37:28.590 --> 37:30.650]  That's one of the few graphics I have on this page.
[37:30.850 --> 37:32.130]  Most everything else is information.
[37:32.710 --> 37:40.410]  I've got the cover from an issue of Wired Magazine, because the cover article is a phenomenal article on the global fiber optic link.
[37:40.590 --> 37:42.910]  A flag, the fiber link around the globe.
[37:43.990 --> 37:49.550]  And since Wired Magazine still has that article available online, I link to it so you can grab it.
[37:49.810 --> 37:54.310]  I also give instructions on how to download it so you don't have to waste all your online time reading it online.
[37:55.250 --> 37:59.330]  I expect some newbies to be coming into the page, and I try and educate them.
[38:02.070 --> 38:02.670]  Let's see.
[38:02.850 --> 38:05.610]  The other graphic I have on there, of course, is the HOPE logo.
[38:06.350 --> 38:08.670]  Which was up on the site about a week ago.
[38:08.970 --> 38:13.890]  And we finally got that dealt with on how to put the logo up so people could capture it easily.
[38:16.710 --> 38:19.730]  I'm into information as a sport.
[38:21.130 --> 38:22.810]  Share the knowledge is where I come from.
[38:23.150 --> 38:25.410]  It's gotten me into more trouble than anything else.
[38:27.770 --> 38:32.890]  And, you know, I love it when people send me emails saying they like all my different sites.
[38:33.010 --> 38:36.690]  They bookmark me because they know that they can get to, rather than bookmarking everything I've got.
[38:37.950 --> 38:43.050]  If you have questions, I've got links to my email, cheshire at 2600.com.
[38:43.410 --> 38:46.190]  May take a week to get back to you, but I'll send you something back.
[38:46.970 --> 38:48.270]  And because I want to help.
[38:48.410 --> 38:49.990]  I want to help get the information out.
[38:51.690 --> 38:52.210]  Thank you.
[38:58.600 --> 39:04.360]  I'd like to invite our fellow panelists here, if they have any webpages that represent them, to let us know.
[39:04.460 --> 39:05.580]  And we'll connect to them right here.
[39:05.800 --> 39:07.100]  I'd like to make a suggestion, too.
[39:07.440 --> 39:11.520]  When the audience says by applause that they like a page, bookmark it.
[39:11.580 --> 39:14.500]  And at the end, put the list of bookmarks up on the HOPE.net.
[39:15.180 --> 39:15.640]  Sounds good.
[39:15.980 --> 39:17.420]  Or rank it by applause level.
[39:17.900 --> 39:18.320]  Right.
[39:19.140 --> 39:26.340]  Before we began here, we decided to visit the webpage of our sister conference, Hacking in Progress, the HIP conference.
[39:26.620 --> 39:29.300]  And as it turned out, it wasn't secure.
[39:32.440 --> 39:34.080]  Thanks to CyberJunkie here.
[39:34.320 --> 39:36.740]  Maybe he could explain what it was that was done.
[39:36.960 --> 39:38.560]  Or not done.
[39:39.500 --> 39:42.220]  If we could connect to this URL.
[39:42.480 --> 39:43.840]  Again, no www here.
[39:44.060 --> 39:47.850]  It's guide.campsite.hip97.nl.
[39:48.580 --> 39:52.740]  I'm not sure if they fixed it or modified it or whatnot.
[39:52.960 --> 39:56.480]  But they have a little diary going there of what's happening.
[39:56.800 --> 39:57.320]  HIP97.
[39:57.740 --> 39:58.730]  HIP97.nl.
[40:00.030 --> 40:00.850]  Not HIPnet.
[40:00.970 --> 40:01.310]  HIP97.
[40:09.730 --> 40:11.270]  We are waiting for something in particular.
[40:11.510 --> 40:11.530]  Okay.
[40:13.910 --> 40:14.790]  Oh, that's bad.
[40:17.790 --> 40:21.670]  Hopefully by tomorrow we'll have the terminal up here so we can actually type as we speak.
[40:22.230 --> 40:22.970]  That would be neat.
[40:23.390 --> 40:24.650]  Okay, connecting over to Holland now.
[40:33.520 --> 40:35.040]  Okay, this is the online diary.
[40:35.220 --> 40:37.000]  They're keeping a diary from their campsite.
[40:41.090 --> 40:42.150]  Okay, can we scroll down?
[40:45.800 --> 40:46.440]  Keep scrolling.
[40:51.340 --> 40:54.820]  Okay, this is the HIP Friday morning section.
[40:57.200 --> 40:58.280]  I like the font.
[40:59.900 --> 41:01.820]  Click on it where it says hacked page there.
[41:21.400 --> 41:24.640]  They've contacted Interpol and we should be prosecuted shortly.
[41:27.380 --> 41:29.980]  Sorry, but did you want to say anything about this particular system?
[41:31.200 --> 41:37.480]  Not really other than that I was pretty surprised to find a web page that had been set up by hackers that was vulnerable to the IMAP exploit.
[41:39.300 --> 41:45.000]  But we should point out that if you are setting up a system inside, you can expect to be hacked, if not by the Dutch, then by us.
[41:45.960 --> 41:49.800]  Because that's what we're here for, to figure out vulnerabilities and mess around with things.
[41:49.940 --> 41:54.800]  But if you do hack someone else's machine, please don't do anything bad, like wipe out things.
[41:54.800 --> 41:56.600]  But do let the person know that you've been there.
[41:58.100 --> 41:59.680]  All right, we'll take any questions.
[41:59.680 --> 42:02.920]  If anybody has any URLs they want to go to and show us what they're up to.
[42:03.740 --> 42:06.460]  I know there was a story in the Associated Press about the conference.
[42:06.500 --> 42:10.460]  If you want to maybe look around on the web or something, maybe we can find that.
[42:11.480 --> 42:12.980]  It might be on CNN or something.
[42:13.740 --> 42:16.180]  But if there's anybody that has any questions, please feel free to ask them.
[42:19.100 --> 42:20.440]  We are a quiet bunch, huh?
[42:20.540 --> 42:22.060]  Nobody here wants to talk, nobody there wants to talk.
[42:29.140 --> 42:30.160]  They don't want to say anything.
[42:37.070 --> 42:38.530]  What's happening over there so far?
[42:38.970 --> 42:43.790]  Well, you know they're outside in tents and things like that.
[42:43.890 --> 42:48.990]  So they're basically trying to keep dry and figure out how to get electricity from tent to tent.
[42:49.170 --> 42:50.310]  What kind of outlet do they have?
[42:50.310 --> 43:03.130]  They also, well you see the thing is, HIP is run by XS4All, which emanated from the Dutch magazine Hacktic, which used to be a hacker magazine before they stopped publishing a couple of years ago.
[43:03.990 --> 43:08.150]  XS4All happens to be the largest provider in the country because they got such an early start.
[43:09.170 --> 43:12.750]  And they have all kinds of connections as far as getting connectivity.
[43:12.990 --> 43:17.090]  So they have a 10 megabit connection as well to the Internet out there on the campsite.
[43:17.250 --> 43:19.170]  They have microwave links back to Amsterdam.
[43:19.170 --> 43:22.230]  So we both have very good connectivity this time.
[43:22.450 --> 43:29.550]  And once we get the picture tell working, you'll be able to communicate with them live here on stage.
[43:29.870 --> 43:38.630]  And we're planning several panels, including the L0pht panel and Bruce Schneier's cryptography panel, where they will be listening, they will be asking questions as well as if they were here.
[43:41.150 --> 43:42.730]  Are there any members of the press here?
[43:42.810 --> 43:44.250]  This is a press conference after all.
[43:45.790 --> 43:47.170]  We did let them in, didn't we?
[43:49.130 --> 43:50.270]  I saw a few press text.
[43:50.410 --> 43:51.390]  I was talking to a few people earlier.
[43:51.730 --> 43:51.870]  Okay.
[43:53.270 --> 43:56.590]  I mean, the press is always asking us questions about hacking.
[43:56.770 --> 44:01.310]  You know, about what is, you know, how do we justify our existence and things like that.
[44:01.310 --> 44:02.770]  So that's what we're here to do.
[44:10.590 --> 44:11.070]  Sorry?
[44:11.430 --> 44:12.770]  How many people are we expecting?
[44:12.770 --> 44:14.210]  How many people are we expecting?
[44:14.410 --> 44:18.590]  Well, we've got quite a bunch already.
[44:19.530 --> 44:22.050]  We're expecting a couple of thousand at least.
[44:23.670 --> 44:25.810]  Because, have you seen what's going on out there?
[44:25.990 --> 44:26.890]  Are there signs up?
[44:27.570 --> 44:29.690]  There are all these stickers over the NYNEX phones?
[44:29.870 --> 44:32.130]  I mean, someone's been busy.
[44:33.930 --> 44:37.650]  And, of course, there's been publicity through the magazine, through the radio show, off the hook.
[44:38.650 --> 44:44.490]  So we expect a lot of people who are non-hackers as well to come to this thing, which I think is a good way of being introduced to the network.
[44:44.790 --> 44:47.810]  If you see somebody out there who has no idea what they're doing, show them.
[44:47.810 --> 44:51.530]  Show them how things work, how the web works.
[44:51.670 --> 44:53.090]  That's kind of what this panel is for.
[44:53.250 --> 44:57.670]  So we can show people, get their first taste of the net through hackers' eyes.
[44:58.070 --> 44:59.690]  I think that's the healthiest way to do it.
[45:08.310 --> 45:12.490]  Do we know if we're being monitored by any federal, state, or local officials?
[45:12.650 --> 45:14.070]  I think it's the same assumption.
[45:14.310 --> 45:15.070]  I think, yeah.
[45:15.630 --> 45:19.070]  We're always being monitored one way or another.
[45:20.010 --> 45:23.150]  I mean, for one thing, we do a radio show on a 50,000-watt radio station.
[45:23.150 --> 45:29.790]  But, you know, the funny thing is that the Secret Service actually contacted our radio station to demand cassette copies of the show.
[45:30.230 --> 45:33.090]  And we said to them, why don't you just listen and tape it yourself?
[45:33.310 --> 45:34.810]  You know, it's a radio station.
[45:35.510 --> 45:38.550]  And they didn't call back, so I think they might have figured out how to do that.
[45:40.010 --> 45:40.530]  Oh, yeah.
[45:40.530 --> 45:43.290]  So they do have a keen interest in our activities.
[45:44.610 --> 45:46.210]  But, yeah, we know they're out there.
[45:46.570 --> 45:48.410]  But, you know, you can't let that bother you.
[45:48.470 --> 45:50.110]  You can't let that stop what you're doing.
[45:50.110 --> 45:52.690]  And we try to laugh it off.
[45:52.870 --> 45:56.390]  But there are those people that get prosecuted by them, and we can't forget about those.
[45:56.570 --> 46:06.170]  Oh, I forgot to mention, for the first time ever on Sunday, we'll be having a panel featuring the story of Kevin Mitnick from Kevin Mitnick's perspective.
[46:06.350 --> 46:10.910]  His lawyer will be on the panel answering questions about just what has been going on with this case.
[46:10.910 --> 46:13.730]  Kevin's been in jail for two and a half years now without trial.
[46:14.110 --> 46:16.350]  And I think it's time for a lot of questions to be answered.
[46:20.230 --> 46:21.750]  John Markoff might even be here, too.
[46:21.930 --> 46:23.750]  So we might have some questions to ask of him.
[46:23.990 --> 46:28.990]  To get back to the question of whether you're being monitored, I don't think it's necessarily, you know...
[46:29.650 --> 46:33.950]  I mean, whether there are people here, I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing.
[46:33.950 --> 46:37.330]  Because I think that if people in law enforcement communities...
[46:41.150 --> 46:46.750]  Another point, too, is that I would rather have them watching me when I was publishing TAP.
[46:47.470 --> 46:49.370]  Because I knew they'd be watching me.
[46:49.530 --> 46:52.690]  I was squeaky clean and kept myself squeaky clean because I knew they were watching me.
[46:52.850 --> 46:58.290]  And I'd rather have them watching me than somebody who was reading articles who was really doing things out there.
[46:59.110 --> 47:00.090]  That's not even my point.
[47:00.090 --> 47:04.470]  The point is that I'd rather have them see hackers and know that hackers are people.
[47:04.610 --> 47:11.910]  Instead of getting ideas of hackers from watching war games and reading news stories that say hackers are moving satellites.
[47:12.210 --> 47:12.330]  Right.
[47:12.510 --> 47:16.290]  And I'd rather have them knowing what I'm doing than sitting back in their offices wondering what I'm doing.
[47:17.270 --> 47:19.710]  Their paranoia is more what I'm worried about than anything else.
[47:19.950 --> 47:22.990]  That's one of the reasons why we have 2600 meetings in open areas.
[47:23.170 --> 47:24.650]  Because we're trying not to hide.
[47:24.750 --> 47:27.770]  But the funny thing is, they try to hide at the meetings.
[47:27.770 --> 47:33.030]  They're walking around with sunglasses hiding behind poles peering at us and taking pictures.
[47:33.790 --> 47:36.850]  And, you know, if they would just come up to us and talk to us, we'll talk back.
[47:36.850 --> 47:38.630]  And they might learn a thing or two.
[47:39.270 --> 47:40.370]  So it's kind of funny.
[47:40.430 --> 47:43.310]  They won't get out of that particular way of life of spying on us.
[47:44.370 --> 47:45.190]  It's what they do.
[47:45.230 --> 47:45.830]  What can I say?
[47:47.210 --> 47:47.970]  Any other questions?
[47:50.630 --> 47:52.570]  Questions about the panel, about New York City.
[47:54.330 --> 47:55.970]  How many people are from out of town?
[48:00.790 --> 48:03.610]  We were supposed to have the mayor here to welcome us, but...
[48:04.590 --> 48:06.630]  I think Garth kept them up late last night.
[48:06.850 --> 48:09.870]  And we'll just have to accept our welcoming.
[48:10.270 --> 48:11.850]  This is a great part of town.
[48:12.050 --> 48:13.250]  There's all kinds of things to do here.
[48:13.330 --> 48:16.130]  There's the Angelica Theater a block away with all kinds of alternative films.
[48:16.590 --> 48:22.130]  There's Little Italy, Chinatown, Avenue A, Broadway, The Village, all that kind of stuff.
[48:22.130 --> 48:24.390]  So you won't be bored, that's for sure.
[48:24.990 --> 48:29.070]  That's if you happen to step outside of this place, where you also won't be bored.
[48:29.210 --> 48:35.530]  There's all kinds of things going on with computers and with speakers and with neat things on the merchandising tables as well.
[48:37.350 --> 48:40.670]  So what we're going to do is move on to the web sessions.
[48:41.450 --> 48:42.930]  And anybody is welcome to do this.
[48:43.030 --> 48:44.070]  Basically, it's very informal.
[48:44.210 --> 48:49.670]  If anybody wants to just type in some URLs and show people some crazy things that are going on.
[48:49.850 --> 48:51.430]  Try to avoid pornography, though.
[48:52.410 --> 48:54.550]  There might be children and senators around.
[48:55.350 --> 48:56.590]  We don't want to annoy them.
[48:57.750 --> 49:00.230]  And by the way, tomorrow is Senator Exxon's birthday.
[49:00.350 --> 49:01.010]  I don't know if you know that.
[49:01.630 --> 49:03.430]  So we have to plan something real special.
[49:07.660 --> 49:08.020]  Okay.
[49:08.140 --> 49:10.620]  Well, thanks for coming, members of the press.
[49:10.820 --> 49:13.520]  And any other questions, feel free to ask us.
[49:13.660 --> 49:15.920]  We'll be playing around with the...
[49:18.500 --> 49:19.220]  I was...
[49:19.720 --> 49:22.540]  There was a request for people from the press to please stand up.
[49:22.540 --> 49:23.060]  Garth Brooks.
[49:23.740 --> 49:24.400]  Garth Brooks.
[49:26.980 --> 49:30.220]  You know, he didn't wear it on stage, actually.
[49:30.360 --> 49:31.080]  Did he wear it on stage?
[49:37.130 --> 49:38.450]  I'll tell you, he's quite a guy.
[49:38.610 --> 49:39.290]  He really is.
[49:40.450 --> 49:42.010]  Did anybody go to the concert last night?
[49:43.290 --> 49:43.950]  One person.
[49:44.270 --> 49:44.450]  All right.
[49:44.530 --> 49:45.850]  Well, we were all pretty busy, I know.
[49:47.050 --> 49:47.470]  All right.
[49:47.530 --> 49:48.830]  Well, we're glad things are working out for Garth.
[49:49.670 --> 49:50.030]  Okay.
[49:50.030 --> 49:50.910]  So we're here.
[49:51.110 --> 49:52.910]  If you have any questions, come up and ask us.
[49:52.910 --> 49:55.510]  We'll be playing around with the video projector.
[49:56.090 --> 49:58.490]  At 10 o'clock, we'll be showing all kinds of weird hacker videos.
[49:58.970 --> 50:02.110]  If you have anything that you'd like us to show...
[50:02.690 --> 50:05.630]  Oh, we're currently broadcasting the conference via real audio.
[50:05.830 --> 50:08.730]  So hello, all those people out there that didn't come here.
[50:09.770 --> 50:10.150]  Losers.
[50:10.490 --> 50:11.630]  Boy, are you missing a party.
[50:12.190 --> 50:15.410]  You still have two days to come make it and get down here and visit with us.
[50:15.470 --> 50:22.230]  If you have to leave the conference, though, or if you'd just rather be home with your computer, we'll be broadcasting the whole thing live so you can listen to it there.
[50:23.670 --> 50:28.370]  We'll also be making announcements on some things that are going on, parties, events that you can go to.
[50:28.910 --> 50:29.990]  So stay tuned.
[50:30.150 --> 50:32.950]  And if anybody hacks the network, we'll be announcing that here as well.
[50:32.950 --> 50:35.850]  So wander all throughout the rooms.
[50:36.190 --> 50:37.050]  You know, look around.
[50:37.230 --> 50:38.210]  Ask lots of questions.
[50:39.090 --> 50:44.710]  Keep in mind, too, this conference is not just for coming in here and listening to people talk from the podium.
[50:44.970 --> 50:51.130]  This is a conference for getting together with other people, schmoozing, and sharing information among yourselves.
[50:51.410 --> 50:53.910]  You'll find it's the best part of the conference when you start to talk with people.
[50:56.310 --> 50:56.790]  Okay.
[50:57.250 --> 50:59.710]  Thanks for coming, and we'll be here.