[00:00.000 --> 00:04.440]  A blog entitled Seat 31B, and so he's going to be talking to us about how to hack travel.
[00:04.760 --> 00:05.620]  TProphet.
[00:11.930 --> 00:14.530]  Wow, I thought I might have three people in the audience.
[00:14.750 --> 00:17.990]  You guys do know I'm up against some, like, fuzzing talk, right?
[00:20.230 --> 00:22.770]  Anyway, thanks so much for coming.
[00:23.270 --> 00:31.110]  I'd like to talk today a little bit about something that's, you know, very different than what I've covered in previous HOPE conferences.
[00:31.670 --> 00:39.590]  As you may know, I cover telecommunications and surveillance a lot, and, you know, basically, the guy who was on at 2 p.m.
[00:39.650 --> 00:41.650]  yesterday is a pretty tough act for me to follow.
[00:41.930 --> 00:45.570]  He knows way more than I do, and we all do as well now.
[00:49.030 --> 01:00.670]  So, in the column, The Telecom Informer, I've actually, like, been covering, if you're a 2600 reader, you've probably noticed over the last five years or so that I've been covering a lot of stuff, you know, outside of the United States.
[01:01.250 --> 01:03.410]  Because I've been living abroad.
[01:05.890 --> 01:13.450]  So, my life's goal was to visit all seven continents, and I traveled a lot anyway in, you know, seeking the furtherance of that goal.
[01:13.690 --> 01:30.770]  But I also lived and worked in Beijing from 2010 to 2013, and so that got me the opportunity to not only see, like, a lot of really cool stuff around Asia and also around the world, but I also, because I wanted to get out of Beijing very often, the air is really bad there,
[01:31.290 --> 01:36.170]  had to learn a lot about how to, you know, do that on a salary that was a Chinese salary.
[01:36.310 --> 01:38.670]  I didn't make, like, a big Western salary.
[01:38.670 --> 01:40.970]  I was making, you know, some pretty small money in China.
[01:41.570 --> 01:45.650]  And so I had to do all of the travel that I wanted to do, pretty much on a budget.
[01:47.030 --> 01:51.290]  After I left Beijing, I went for an MBA of all of the crazy things.
[01:51.510 --> 01:56.090]  And so I lived and studied in the Netherlands last year and also spent four months in Costa Rica.
[01:56.650 --> 02:01.210]  So I got to travel around quite a bit in Europe and in Central America.
[02:03.150 --> 02:14.790]  And one thing that, you know, really, I'd like to speak to anybody here who's, you know, 18 years old and has never, like, left the country, really, my first big international trip was a mistake fair.
[02:14.930 --> 02:17.230]  I went to Japan when I was a freshman in college.
[02:17.830 --> 02:23.530]  You know, I told my roommates that I was going to Japan for the weekend, and they all thought I was kidding, and actually, I did go to Japan.
[02:23.910 --> 02:25.510]  And it was $200.
[02:26.070 --> 02:27.350]  It was $299 Canadian.
[02:27.350 --> 02:31.250]  That's back when $1 U.S. bought you, you know, $1.50 Canadian.
[02:31.610 --> 02:34.750]  And that was actually a really eye-opening experience.
[02:34.990 --> 02:40.690]  I mean, you know, the fact that you can actually travel for little or nothing if you just think like a hacker.
[02:41.850 --> 02:46.150]  So this is a map of where I've gone so far in 2014.
[02:47.090 --> 02:51.790]  I am not really happy about my carbon footprint, but I did...
[02:51.790 --> 02:54.890]  I have managed to see quite a bit so far.
[02:54.890 --> 02:57.630]  This is my first round-the-world trip this year.
[02:57.730 --> 03:01.770]  I have another one scheduled in a couple of months that cost me very little.
[03:02.010 --> 03:04.550]  It was $219 roughly all in.
[03:06.050 --> 03:08.090]  So, some interesting places I've been.
[03:08.390 --> 03:15.310]  You know, I don't really hopefully need to establish a lot of credibility around this, but in case you don't know me, I've been everywhere from Toadsec, Arkansas.
[03:15.310 --> 03:16.310]  That's a real place.
[03:17.510 --> 03:18.470]  To Antarctica.
[03:19.370 --> 03:27.850]  And, of course, I've spent a lot of time, although not nearly as much time as Edward Snowden, in the Srimitevo airport transit zone.
[03:29.390 --> 03:31.650]  So, you know, pictures are worth a thousand words.
[03:31.810 --> 03:33.310]  It's really fun to hang out with penguins.
[03:35.330 --> 03:39.750]  And here's me with a North Korean admiral, of all things, in Pyongyang.
[03:42.010 --> 03:51.810]  And this is the police officer who arrested me in Armenia, but actually, like, you know, it all worked out in the end because I'm here and not in an Armenian prison.
[03:52.210 --> 03:56.870]  So, what is travel hacking?
[03:57.570 --> 04:01.950]  So, travel hacking is really... I view it pretty broadly.
[04:02.530 --> 04:05.850]  If you're doing something that most people don't do when they travel...
[04:05.850 --> 04:07.290]  Well, you might if I adjust this microphone.
[04:08.010 --> 04:09.730]  Let's see, that may work a little better.
[04:10.850 --> 04:20.470]  There's a few different things you can do around travel hacking that a lot of people are doing, but I don't want you to think that this is the only thing that you can do with travel hacking.
[04:21.010 --> 04:30.710]  There's actually a lot of stuff that's undiscovered, and actually, if you put your mind to it, and you start really learning about how this stuff works, you're going to find stuff that I'm not talking about here.
[04:30.710 --> 04:38.450]  In fact, I found stuff I'm not talking about here because this is going to be on the Internet, and, well, anyway, you know what happens after that.
[04:38.750 --> 04:40.230]  So, mistake fares.
[04:40.470 --> 04:41.610]  What's a mistake fare?
[04:41.850 --> 04:49.270]  It's when an airline publishes fares, humans do that, and humans, unfortunately, tend to be error-prone.
[04:49.430 --> 05:02.050]  So, sometimes, somebody will make a mistake, and $599, which would have still been a cheap fare to Tokyo, becomes $299 Canadian, which is like $200 U.S. when I did it.
[05:03.610 --> 05:06.210]  Mistake fares happen more often than you might think.
[05:06.350 --> 05:07.730]  They usually don't last very long.
[05:07.830 --> 05:08.830]  They get caught very quickly.
[05:09.270 --> 05:18.050]  So, if you find a mistake fare, if you find a fare that you think is probably a mistake, and you think you might want to take that trip, buy it right now.
[05:18.370 --> 05:19.630]  That fare will not last.
[05:20.590 --> 05:21.570]  Some routing tricks.
[05:21.870 --> 05:37.530]  So, there's some... I'll get into this more and show you guys some pictures of things you can do, but there's actually some things you can do that are creative with routing, where, for example, if you stop in a city for less than 24 hours, that's not considered a stopover.
[05:37.870 --> 05:42.050]  So, if you're flying Cathay Pacific, you can have a whole day in Hong Kong if you plan your flights right.
[05:42.350 --> 05:49.890]  That's a routing trick, and it actually would cost you a lot of money for a stopover if you had a 24-hour or greater stopover.
[05:50.110 --> 05:52.390]  So, you know, that's just one example of routing tricks.
[05:52.510 --> 05:53.570]  There are others that you can do.
[05:54.210 --> 05:55.790]  Frequent flyer program loopholes.
[05:56.050 --> 06:02.630]  So, there are a lot of ways to get miles that aren't necessarily what the airlines actually had in mind.
[06:03.010 --> 06:13.210]  And if you follow the rules and you don't commit any fraud, you actually can rack up a huge number of miles, which many people think are useless, but actually they're pretty useful.
[06:13.810 --> 06:16.930]  By the way, for those of you guys in the back, there's a ton of...
[06:16.930 --> 06:20.430]  Well, there's a few seats in the front, so, you know, feel free to move up if you'd like.
[06:22.870 --> 06:23.790]  Credit card bonuses.
[06:24.090 --> 06:29.450]  So, if you sign up for a credit card, yeah, that's probably around the right number of people for the seats we've got.
[06:31.190 --> 06:32.450]  So, credit card bonuses.
[06:33.330 --> 06:36.850]  If you sign up for a new credit card, a lot of the time you can get some bonus miles.
[06:37.310 --> 06:42.170]  Banks are trying to hit numbers, which is something I learned a lot about in business school.
[06:42.170 --> 06:55.230]  And so, if you look toward the end of business quarters, there are sometimes some fairly crazy deals that you can get, you know, for frequent flyer bonus miles, but you have a very limited time to sign up for them.
[06:55.510 --> 06:58.270]  And, you know, there's really, like I said, a lot more.
[06:58.750 --> 07:00.990]  Think like a hacker when you're approaching travel.
[07:00.990 --> 07:03.270]  I know that's like a dangerous thing to say, right?
[07:03.490 --> 07:08.090]  Because, you know, given the security climate around travel, thinking like a hacker can sometimes get you in trouble.
[07:08.290 --> 07:14.950]  But when it comes to getting a good deal, you're not gonna get in any trouble, and you might actually be able to visit somewhere really cool.
[07:16.330 --> 07:19.710]  So, what do I think makes a really awesome travel hack?
[07:20.190 --> 07:24.430]  Something that allows you to travel for little or nothing, I think, is a really awesome hack.
[07:25.690 --> 07:34.570]  Now, one thing you'll find if you go searching around for travel hacks on your favorite search engine is a lot of hacks that I don't think are really hacks.
[07:34.730 --> 07:35.670]  They're fake hacks.
[07:35.790 --> 07:37.690]  Even airlines publish them and call them hacks.
[07:37.930 --> 07:39.890]  You know, they have guerrilla marketing teams.
[07:40.290 --> 07:44.610]  So, something that makes you pay more isn't a hack, actually.
[07:45.010 --> 07:48.870]  So, you know, you get an upgraded room or whatever if you pay a higher price.
[07:49.030 --> 07:54.410]  Or you may get an upgraded room because may is like the king of weasel words when it comes to travel.
[07:54.430 --> 07:56.310]  to the travel industry.
[07:57.630 --> 07:58.890]  Those things aren't hacks.
[07:59.830 --> 08:02.270]  Little or nothing, you know, that's my baseline.
[08:02.510 --> 08:03.350]  Yours may be different.
[08:03.570 --> 08:08.410]  I know a lot of people think I'm crazy to fly around in economy class the way that I do.
[08:08.690 --> 08:11.810]  And they would never consider anything other than a live-flat seat.
[08:12.310 --> 08:12.750]  Octal.
[08:15.190 --> 08:18.850]  But, you know, for most of us, travel in the back of the plane is okay.
[08:19.050 --> 08:21.050]  And if you're doing it for free, that's even better.
[08:22.850 --> 08:30.610]  So, another awesome thing that makes an awesome travel hack is a travel hack that you can't actually get in trouble for or be taken away from you.
[08:30.810 --> 08:32.330]  And so, what do I mean by that?
[08:32.710 --> 08:37.430]  It's legal under the contract and it's legal under the rules, so it can't actually be rescinded later.
[08:37.430 --> 08:47.130]  So, one thing that airlines love to do is if there's a mistake, they try any possible way to weasel out of actually having to honor the deal.
[08:47.510 --> 08:55.290]  And this is, you know, something that if you wanted to get out of a contract with an airline, you wouldn't be able to do.
[08:55.530 --> 09:01.550]  So, don't feel bad if you find anything that's completely legal under the contract that you can hold an airline to.
[09:01.550 --> 09:04.030]  So, what's legal under a contract, generally speaking?
[09:05.150 --> 09:11.250]  Sometimes, there's... every airline publishes this thing called a contract of carriage and it's pages and pages and pages.
[09:11.550 --> 09:16.090]  And most of it, you know, references other parts of the same contract and it's really confusing.
[09:16.850 --> 09:19.610]  And things tend to be pretty broadly worded in it.
[09:19.810 --> 09:25.350]  So, essentially a contract of carriage says, we can do whatever the hell we want, anytime we want.
[09:25.350 --> 09:32.390]  And so, you can't really rely on their contract of carriage to be... to account for much in most cases.
[09:32.770 --> 09:36.850]  But there is something that's really important in the contract of carriage that actually does matter.
[09:37.010 --> 09:43.110]  And that's, you're going to pay us money and we're going to give you transportation to, you know, the place that you paid us money to take you to.
[09:43.470 --> 09:46.810]  That's essentially what the contract, you know, what they have to give you in the contract.
[09:47.090 --> 09:52.830]  They may actually take you on different flights or send you on a different airline or like send you on a different day even.
[09:53.790 --> 09:57.550]  But they do have to give you transportation in exchange for the money that you gave them.
[09:58.130 --> 10:04.750]  So, as long as the fare is at least a dollar, then, you know, basically you entered a contract.
[10:05.030 --> 10:06.410]  That contract of carriage applies.
[10:06.670 --> 10:11.190]  So, if they try to say it was a misprint or something, well, it's plausible that fares are a dollar.
[10:11.370 --> 10:15.270]  Like, they actually are in Europe on a fairly regular basis, plus a whole bunch of fees.
[10:15.530 --> 10:17.950]  But, you know, airlines here have a whole bunch of fees, too.
[10:18.190 --> 10:19.810]  So, maybe they're running a promotion.
[10:19.810 --> 10:25.110]  You don't have any... like, it's not credible to say that it was a misprint anymore if the fare was a dollar or more.
[10:25.310 --> 10:27.230]  So, you can actually hold them to it.
[10:27.390 --> 10:28.370]  What are the exceptions?
[10:29.570 --> 10:35.170]  Well, if it's a frequent flyer program hack, there was one with United where people were buying tickets that...
[10:35.170 --> 10:40.750]  You know, business class tickets to Europe for far more miles than they were supposed to be.
[10:41.010 --> 10:45.670]  Well, miles are a different ballgame because those are entirely administered by the airline.
[10:45.830 --> 10:47.330]  They can essentially do whatever they want.
[10:47.330 --> 10:54.070]  So, if there's a misprint in a frequent flyer program, probably the airline is fully within its rights not to honor it.
[10:54.190 --> 10:56.170]  And generally, they won't if they find out.
[10:56.610 --> 10:58.310]  So, keep it below the radar.
[10:58.530 --> 11:01.790]  Don't go bragging on the Internet if you find some crazy frequent flyer hack.
[11:01.970 --> 11:04.030]  And there are crazy frequent flyer hacks out there.
[11:04.790 --> 11:11.710]  I'm using one to Turkey, which probably I shouldn't talk about in more detail.
[11:13.310 --> 11:14.350]  Don't want to take it away.
[11:15.290 --> 11:23.110]  You know, it's not illegal to do these things because, you know, if they publish something and it's a misprint and you buy it, that's... you haven't committed any crime.
[11:23.110 --> 11:26.870]  But they might take away your ticket and just refund your miles and they can totally do that.
[11:27.030 --> 11:30.730]  But when you paid cash money for a ticket, there's no getting out of it.
[11:30.730 --> 11:41.430]  Like, if you want to get out of that $150 change fee, or now a $250 change fee, or with Delta, like, fully non-refundable, like, not even with a change fee, you can't get out of it.
[11:41.530 --> 11:44.270]  So, don't let them get out of the mistake that they made.
[11:46.090 --> 11:48.630]  So, another criteria for awesome travel hacks.
[11:48.790 --> 11:50.110]  Something that isn't well-known.
[11:50.890 --> 11:53.590]  So, there's a lot of stuff that's really well-known.
[11:53.590 --> 12:01.070]  If you search travel hacking, which many of you may be doing right now on your laptops, you're going to find a whole bunch of really well-known stuff.
[12:01.450 --> 12:08.770]  And, you know, if it's something you developed that isn't well-known, that's an awesome travel hack, because it means it won't get shut down anytime soon, probably.
[12:09.810 --> 12:17.310]  And the last one, and I think this is actually, you know, the most important one, it takes you, you know, you're going somewhere for free, right?
[12:17.510 --> 12:20.090]  You're going somewhere for free in a way that you can't be shut down.
[12:20.090 --> 12:23.370]  And it's a place that you actually want to go where it's safe.
[12:23.810 --> 12:33.050]  So, if you find an awesome travel hack that will take you to San Pedro Sula, Honduras, you might not want to go there, because they have the highest murder rate in the world.
[12:33.210 --> 12:34.830]  Like, it's not a safe place at all.
[12:35.550 --> 12:39.950]  You know, if you're going to Kinshasa in Congo, probably the same.
[12:41.210 --> 12:52.070]  And, you know, if you find a great spring fair to the Caribbean, well, there are always great spring fairs to the Caribbean, because, you know, they have hurricanes there and nobody wants to be there then.
[12:52.450 --> 12:58.250]  So, don't be dodging bullets or hurricanes when you make a travel hack.
[12:58.730 --> 13:01.810]  That actually might not have been such a good deal.
[13:03.050 --> 13:05.350]  So, let's talk a little bit about mistake fairs.
[13:05.390 --> 13:10.890]  I already talked, you know, to this some, but occasionally a mistake fair will happen.
[13:11.090 --> 13:14.330]  In the past year, this has happened with Delta United.
[13:14.330 --> 13:26.430]  If you bought United tickets through this crazy Norwegian, like, regional carrier website, you could get them for incredibly cheap, because they actually forgot to put the fuel surcharge on when they sold tickets that way.
[13:27.210 --> 13:28.410]  And Alitalia.
[13:28.770 --> 13:29.970]  Whoa, what happened?
[13:31.090 --> 13:31.690]  Sorry.
[13:34.570 --> 13:42.130]  So, the Alitalia Fair was one that I took advantage of for the round-the-world trip.
[13:42.370 --> 13:50.250]  So, I'm going from Los Angeles to Boston to Rome to Budapest to Amsterdam for 23 hours to Beijing.
[13:51.250 --> 13:57.470]  My cost out-of-pocket was $450.30 for all this, but I earned miles on that, and miles have value.
[13:57.830 --> 14:03.150]  So, you know, if you subtract the value of the miles, what it works out to is around $219.
[14:03.510 --> 14:10.490]  And then I had to get from Beijing back to LA, but I had 30,000 Alaska airline miles to do that, and I got those for free.
[14:11.630 --> 14:16.110]  So, basically, $219 is taking me around the world, and you could do this too.
[14:16.110 --> 14:24.250]  Actually, I met somebody yesterday who's leaving from New York on a similar itinerary, going through Milan and ending up in Tokyo.
[14:25.290 --> 14:30.570]  You know, he's an avid travel blog reader, and just happened to pick up the deal when it was available.
[14:30.810 --> 14:44.630]  This is called a fuel dump, and so sometimes an airline will publish, if there's a very complex itinerary, and I'll talk about this more if I have time, but with certain kinds of very complex itineraries, the fuel surcharges can drop off a ticket.
[14:45.010 --> 14:52.990]  So, in order to dodge taxes, airlines will publish a fare that's like a $10 fare with a $500 fuel surcharge.
[14:53.290 --> 14:59.090]  So, if you can make that fuel surcharge go away, then, you know, that's kind of a good thing.
[15:00.210 --> 15:07.710]  So, like I said, it's generally not all that risky on a mistake fare if the paid fare is at least a dollar.
[15:08.550 --> 15:13.350]  You know, they won't let you out of the contract if you want to get out, so don't let them.
[15:14.130 --> 15:16.750]  And super risky with frequent flyer programs, as I said.
[15:17.010 --> 15:21.370]  So, let's talk about mistake fares through fuel dumps.
[15:24.310 --> 15:27.570]  So, there's a couple of techniques to make a fuel surcharge go away.
[15:27.830 --> 15:31.730]  And I'm going to talk only about old ones, because you guys need to find your own new ones.
[15:31.730 --> 15:36.190]  The most popular are what's called a first strike or a third strike.
[15:36.330 --> 15:36.990]  Now, what is that?
[15:37.350 --> 15:44.670]  You book your itinerary, and then you add a completely unrelated flight at the end that's really cheap.
[15:44.910 --> 15:49.330]  So, the pineapple poke technique would add a flight at the end.
[15:49.450 --> 15:56.030]  So, say that you're going from, I don't know, like Los Angeles to Costa Rica and back.
[15:56.030 --> 15:59.590]  So, you're flying to San Jose, Costa Rica and going back to Los Angeles.
[16:00.010 --> 16:07.030]  And you're doing this on, say, Avianca, which is, you know, totally plausible to do.
[16:07.170 --> 16:08.170]  So, this is Star Alliance.
[16:08.670 --> 16:11.130]  And then you add an inter-island flight in Hawaii.
[16:11.390 --> 16:12.630]  This is your pineapple poke.
[16:14.290 --> 16:20.790]  That's like maybe 15 miles from, you know, say, Honolulu to somewhere close to Honolulu.
[16:20.790 --> 16:23.850]  You know, like you pick the cheapest inter-island flight that you can on United.
[16:24.130 --> 16:25.610]  Also, a Star Alliance carrier.
[16:26.230 --> 16:27.330]  That breaks the fare.
[16:27.730 --> 16:30.230]  It runs the thing through a Star Alliance pricing engine.
[16:30.670 --> 16:35.190]  Which, for whatever reason, isn't able to actually calculate out the fuel surcharges.
[16:35.350 --> 16:38.950]  So, the thing gets dropped and the fare gets divvied up between Avianca and United.
[16:40.450 --> 16:44.010]  And, you know, without the fuel surcharge part, and you can just go buy that.
[16:44.330 --> 16:44.550]  Right?
[16:44.730 --> 16:45.790]  So, this doesn't work anymore.
[16:46.030 --> 16:47.230]  Like, they fixed the pineapple poke.
[16:47.630 --> 16:50.550]  A lot of people were poking a lot of pineapples for a long time.
[16:50.550 --> 16:53.350]  And cost a lot of money.
[16:53.610 --> 16:57.250]  So, generally, it only works on international flights.
[16:57.390 --> 16:58.850]  You can't do this on domestic flights.
[16:58.850 --> 17:01.490]  You have to cross a continent, typically.
[17:02.050 --> 17:06.410]  And you don't have to do your, you know, your short haul third strike.
[17:07.270 --> 17:10.750]  In even the same continent as you're flying into or out of.
[17:10.870 --> 17:13.690]  Like, you could add a, you know, like a cheap flight inside of Europe, for example.
[17:13.770 --> 17:14.650]  If you wanted to do that.
[17:15.130 --> 17:16.090]  And it could work.
[17:16.090 --> 17:21.750]  You know, the goal is you want to try to force the fare through a different engine to be priced.
[17:22.390 --> 17:24.630]  Where fuel surcharges all drop off.
[17:24.830 --> 17:28.270]  So, what's a good, you know, candidate for fuel dumps?
[17:28.750 --> 17:31.250]  You want to find a fare that's a really cheap fare.
[17:32.050 --> 17:33.950]  And most of the fare is a fuel surcharge.
[17:34.190 --> 17:37.770]  Because if you're dumping the fuel surcharge, it doesn't do you any good if it's not very big.
[17:37.770 --> 17:38.030]  Right?
[17:38.670 --> 17:45.390]  So, interestingly enough, U.S. Airways just had a problem, I think it was three weeks ago.
[17:45.890 --> 17:51.530]  Where they used to price their flights mostly as a fuel surcharge and, you know, very small fare.
[17:51.830 --> 17:58.550]  And because they joined the One World Alliance, there ended up being a whole bunch of opportunities to do this kind of thing.
[17:59.330 --> 18:03.030]  So, they have, for the interim, like started actually paying taxes.
[18:03.790 --> 18:10.470]  They were losing so much money through fuel dumps that they ended up repricing their fares as most of the money is in the fare.
[18:10.630 --> 18:11.970]  And they don't have fuel surcharges anymore.
[18:12.270 --> 18:16.050]  So, you know, it's a known problem to airlines.
[18:16.270 --> 18:17.270]  Like, they know this can happen.
[18:17.290 --> 18:23.230]  But as long as they don't lose a lot of money, basically, it's not a really huge deal to them.
[18:24.810 --> 18:26.290]  So, that's a third strike.
[18:26.430 --> 18:31.130]  A first strike, you add a one-way in front of where you're going.
[18:31.130 --> 18:33.670]  And by the way, with a third strike, that's the best way to do it.
[18:33.690 --> 18:35.470]  Because you don't actually have to take that flight.
[18:35.850 --> 18:37.150]  You know, you take the flight you want to take.
[18:37.310 --> 18:40.490]  And then there's this inter-island flight in Hawaii that you never show up for.
[18:40.650 --> 18:42.250]  And, you know, that is what it is.
[18:42.510 --> 18:44.010]  But what makes a good third strike?
[18:44.010 --> 18:45.050]  It's a really cheap fare.
[18:45.310 --> 18:47.030]  And it actually drops the fuel surcharge.
[18:47.650 --> 18:48.890]  A first strike is similar.
[18:49.310 --> 18:56.590]  So, for example, suppose that you want to fly from Seattle to, again, Costa Rica.
[18:57.050 --> 19:01.910]  But you can add on a first hop from Vancouver, BC.
[19:02.490 --> 19:03.610]  Well, the problem with that...
[19:03.610 --> 19:05.530]  So, you're crossing a country boundary.
[19:05.730 --> 19:09.890]  Like, you used to be able to do a lot of, you know, sketchy stuff by starting from Canada.
[19:10.990 --> 19:12.830]  So, if you lived near Canada, it was great.
[19:14.710 --> 19:18.070]  But the problem with this is you actually have to take that first flight.
[19:18.070 --> 19:22.150]  So, you know, if you're in Seattle, you'd have to drive up to Vancouver and take your first flight from there.
[19:22.670 --> 19:26.970]  So, it's not as easy to do as a third strike because you actually do have to show up for it.
[19:27.770 --> 19:39.250]  Keep in mind, with plane tickets, if you miss any flights anywhere along the way on your itinerary, and you don't get the problem solved in the airport right then, then they will just cancel the whole rest of your itinerary.
[19:39.470 --> 19:43.050]  So, that's not a problem if it's the very last leg and it's a flight you didn't want anyway.
[19:43.490 --> 19:45.770]  But it's a pretty big problem if it's your first leg.
[19:45.810 --> 19:47.090]  So, you've got to show up for that one.
[19:47.090 --> 19:49.370]  But this technique gets used a lot less.
[19:50.190 --> 19:57.690]  So, for people who live near airports in another country, because remember you have to cross from one country into the other for a strike to work.
[19:58.990 --> 20:00.910]  This only works on international flights.
[20:01.870 --> 20:04.250]  It could be potentially a good option for you.
[20:04.790 --> 20:08.130]  It's a whole other workshop to talk about how to really exploit this stuff.
[20:08.350 --> 20:16.130]  Like, there's, you know, there are actually travel bloggers who, you know, do seminars for hundreds of dollars, you know, and give a talk for half the day on this.
[20:16.130 --> 20:17.730]  So, I can't go into a lot of detail.
[20:18.090 --> 20:22.210]  But if you start doing some searching online, you can learn a lot more about this stuff.
[20:22.410 --> 20:27.190]  And there's actually a lot of people who do this as a hobby, like finding places that you can do fuel dumps from.
[20:27.450 --> 20:33.970]  There's even a whole, like, you know, kind of way of speaking in code that people do around this to keep it out of the search engines.
[20:33.970 --> 20:39.950]  So, you know, I'll let you guys do your own research from here, but it's kind of cool.
[20:40.230 --> 20:42.050]  And you can actually do some pretty incredible stuff.
[20:43.070 --> 20:49.110]  So, that is a map of my $219 around the world trip, which involves a fuel dump.
[20:50.170 --> 20:53.430]  I'm doing all that, like, and it really is like paying $219.
[20:54.430 --> 20:56.090]  So, you know, you could do this too.
[20:57.090 --> 20:58.590]  So, miles and points.
[20:59.310 --> 21:01.030]  What can I say about miles and points?
[21:01.210 --> 21:06.130]  They're simultaneously the easiest and the most frustrating way to actually get anywhere for free.
[21:06.390 --> 21:07.690]  Because it's never really free.
[21:07.790 --> 21:10.330]  You're always paying taxes plus whatever fees they can lard up.
[21:10.790 --> 21:13.650]  The other thing with miles and points is you don't want to hoard these things.
[21:13.830 --> 21:18.270]  Because it's like holding, you know, Venezuelan boulevards or Zimbabwe dollars or something.
[21:18.610 --> 21:21.950]  The value is, you know, drops precipitously from year to year.
[21:22.470 --> 21:29.410]  United just gutted their program and they actually doubled the number of miles it takes to get anywhere for a lot of ticket types.
[21:29.910 --> 21:31.790]  So, don't hang on to your miles.
[21:31.970 --> 21:33.230]  If you have miles, spend them.
[21:33.510 --> 21:34.570]  Definitely spend them.
[21:35.230 --> 21:37.010]  And it's not just frequent flyer programs.
[21:37.430 --> 21:42.830]  So, some of the ones that haven't been gutted as badly are banks will have their own programs.
[21:43.050 --> 21:45.430]  So, for example, U.S. Bank has something called Flex Points.
[21:46.070 --> 21:48.450]  The Bank of America has their own program.
[21:48.950 --> 21:50.990]  You know, Chase has...
[21:51.570 --> 21:53.410]  Citi has thank you points.
[21:53.650 --> 21:55.310]  So, these are risky.
[21:55.630 --> 22:01.830]  If you do too much sketchy stuff with your credit card, the bank can just take your points and there's nothing you can do.
[22:02.270 --> 22:05.510]  Because the whole thing is, you know, the whole contract is governed by arbitration.
[22:05.510 --> 22:07.730]  You can't file a complaint with the DOT or anything.
[22:07.910 --> 22:09.290]  You have no leverage at all.
[22:09.470 --> 22:11.550]  So, again, don't hoard bank points either.
[22:12.070 --> 22:16.630]  But, you know, these are actually something you can look to if frequent flyer miles aren't working for you.
[22:17.190 --> 22:23.690]  Hotel programs, like these are interesting because, you know, for example, Starwood Points, you can transfer to a lot of different airlines.
[22:24.990 --> 22:30.790]  And it's probably worth pointing out that with an American Express points, you can also transfer those to a lot of different airlines.
[22:30.990 --> 22:36.230]  So, these may be a more stable currency that depreciates less to hold points in.
[22:36.230 --> 22:42.770]  And then when you want to redeem an award, you can do a mileage transfer into the frequent flyer program of your choice.
[22:43.230 --> 22:47.770]  At the time, so you're not holding a currency that depreciates as much.
[22:50.270 --> 22:53.690]  Marriott, Starwood, Hilton all have their own points programs.
[22:53.950 --> 22:56.910]  These get gutted much more often than the bank points do.
[22:57.170 --> 22:59.970]  So, I would say more stable, but I wouldn't say stable.
[22:59.970 --> 23:04.150]  Like, points in general are something to get rid of, not something to hang on to.
[23:05.010 --> 23:08.870]  Spend them as soon as you've got them for a trip that you actually want to take.
[23:10.010 --> 23:11.130]  So, some hacks.
[23:11.410 --> 23:13.270]  What can you do that's a miles and points hack?
[23:14.030 --> 23:17.630]  If you go read most travel bloggers, they want to sell you a lot of credit cards.
[23:17.730 --> 23:24.790]  But there's actually some truth to what they're saying because actually credit card sign-up bonuses are the best way to get a lot of miles very quickly.
[23:24.790 --> 23:28.950]  But there's a difference between a good deal and a bad deal, and that's the thing that you really need to know.
[23:29.270 --> 23:37.510]  So, with credit card sign-up bonuses, typically the ones you'll find on travel blogs with their affiliate link are not going to be the best deal that you can get.
[23:37.730 --> 23:45.950]  So, you should do some searching if you're interested in a particular product and see if there's a better bonus that's available that doesn't have an affiliate link and doesn't pay some bloggers or something.
[23:47.250 --> 23:53.170]  Sometimes the affiliate link is the same number of miles that you'll get, but you pay an annual fee and you can find one...
[23:53.170 --> 23:57.950]  You can find a link that isn't an affiliate link and they waive the annual fee for the first year.
[23:58.690 --> 24:06.250]  And keep in mind, like what I said before, there's a bunch of MBAs crunching the numbers and trying to hit quarterly targets inside the banks.
[24:06.490 --> 24:11.510]  So, at the beginning of a quarter is generally the worst time to try to sign up for a credit card.
[24:11.810 --> 24:14.570]  So, right now is not a good time to be signing up for credit cards.
[24:14.690 --> 24:17.890]  There really aren't any great offers that are available now.
[24:17.890 --> 24:27.550]  But when we start getting close to the end of the quarter, and especially when you start getting close to the end of bank fiscal years, which can either end at the end of the year or like in the middle of the year.
[24:27.730 --> 24:30.270]  You know, June 30th is the end of a fiscal year for a lot of companies.
[24:31.270 --> 24:35.910]  You'll see these last-ditch efforts where you can find some crazy, crazy promotions.
[24:36.870 --> 24:39.950]  You know, and it's just all because somebody needs to hit their numbers somewhere.
[24:39.950 --> 24:41.490]  So, take advantage.
[24:41.910 --> 24:48.530]  You know, the banks aren't dumb, but they do give away a lot sometimes, and sometimes more than they should to hit a quarterly target.
[24:48.750 --> 24:57.970]  You know, the incentives of the people managing these programs are not always aligned necessarily with what's the most fiscally prudent thing to do, and that's great for people like us.
[24:59.110 --> 25:00.510]  So, manufactured spending.
[25:00.730 --> 25:01.390]  What's that?
[25:01.810 --> 25:09.030]  So, there's this giant field of manufactured spending that I'm not going to get into in a huge way.
[25:09.030 --> 25:13.090]  You guys can do your own research on this and come up with your own techniques, but...
[25:13.610 --> 25:16.690]  So, you get points for spending money on your card, right?
[25:17.270 --> 25:20.150]  Well, what if you were spending money without really spending it?
[25:20.810 --> 25:31.210]  What if you're, like, thinking like a money launderer and a terrorist, and thinking of the techniques that these guys use, you know, to move money around, like...
[25:31.210 --> 25:36.890]  And maybe you just leverage some of those same techniques, and you rack up a whole ton of miles.
[25:37.650 --> 25:42.670]  There's a risk to doing this, and the risk to doing it is that it makes you look like a terrorist and a money launderer.
[25:42.830 --> 25:49.410]  Like, you know, there's, like, one guy who's been, like, every major bank in the country has shut down his accounts.
[25:49.550 --> 25:50.330]  They won't tell him why.
[25:50.550 --> 25:52.790]  Like, you know, but he's got a lot of miles.
[25:53.030 --> 26:03.270]  So, you know, you've got to kind of make a decision as to what is the right level of, you know, activity.
[26:04.010 --> 26:07.610]  You know, for me, personally, I don't have the time.
[26:07.830 --> 26:13.150]  Like, I'm, you know, like, in addition to being, like, a blogger and columnist for 2600, like, I'm running a startup.
[26:13.410 --> 26:17.750]  Like, so I don't have a lot of time to do this manufactured spending stuff.
[26:17.770 --> 26:18.930]  It is very time consuming.
[26:19.850 --> 26:29.570]  You know, it's everything from, like, buying stuff at government auction and reselling it to, you know, like, buying certain financial products and getting cash out of them when you shouldn't be able to.
[26:29.770 --> 26:33.530]  I mean, it's like, and it involves a lot of driving a lot of the time and, like, a lot of time.
[26:33.950 --> 26:36.730]  So, you know, there are people that make a full-time career of this.
[26:36.810 --> 26:37.610]  I don't have time.
[26:37.610 --> 26:40.530]  So, when I do manufactured spending, and by the way, it's legal.
[26:40.790 --> 26:43.750]  Like, it looks like you're laundering money, but you aren't actually.
[26:43.970 --> 26:46.250]  So, if the cops show up, you can just tell them what you're doing.
[26:46.410 --> 26:47.150]  It's not a big deal.
[26:47.350 --> 26:48.750]  Like, you know, you're just getting miles.
[26:48.890 --> 26:49.950]  It's not illegal to get miles.
[26:51.130 --> 26:52.690]  They kind of wasted their time with you.
[26:52.850 --> 26:56.090]  You know, they'll probably not be happy, but it's, you didn't do anything illegal.
[26:57.550 --> 27:07.510]  So, you know, like, but you typically, if you sign up for a credit card, you've got to spend 2,000 or 3,000 or, you know, 5 or $10,000 on the card within the first two or three months.
[27:07.510 --> 27:09.010]  In order to get the bonus.
[27:10.570 --> 27:16.070]  You know, I just did a Southwest Airlines card, and I had to spend $2,000, you know, in the first three months.
[27:16.250 --> 27:19.810]  And then that gets me my 50,000 points, which is an offer that's no longer available.
[27:19.970 --> 27:20.710]  That was a good one.
[27:20.850 --> 27:23.310]  The current offer of 25,000 points isn't a good one.
[27:23.590 --> 27:26.310]  So, you know, again, you've got to hit things at the right time.
[27:28.010 --> 27:33.870]  So, you know, I will hit, I'll use manufactured spending to hit my, like, minimum, you know, spend.
[27:34.010 --> 27:36.290]  But you can actually rack up millions of miles.
[27:36.290 --> 27:42.290]  And there's guys that, like, are pushing, you know, a million-plus dollars through, like, you know, seven bank accounts in order to do this.
[27:43.430 --> 27:44.670]  So, extreme couponing.
[27:45.590 --> 27:47.030]  This is super famous.
[27:47.250 --> 27:51.570]  There's a guy named David Phillips, you know, who in 1999...
[27:51.570 --> 27:55.550]  This is an old story, because, you know, I don't want to give away, like, anything current about extreme couponing.
[27:55.690 --> 28:01.110]  But there are definitely extreme couponing deals that you can do right now and get a crazy number of points.
[28:02.070 --> 28:04.090]  You know, do your own research.
[28:04.410 --> 28:05.390]  That's part of being a hacker.
[28:05.730 --> 28:09.230]  But, you know, David Phillips did this Healthy Choice promo.
[28:09.430 --> 28:19.870]  So, Healthy Choice, for those of you that are not American, is a very unhealthy brand of frozen food and packaged food products with lots of preservatives that you can buy here in the States.
[28:20.470 --> 28:22.010]  There are some pretty bad meals.
[28:22.030 --> 28:23.050]  They're not healthy at all.
[28:23.850 --> 28:26.510]  Maybe they pass for healthy in the States.
[28:28.350 --> 28:39.370]  But this guy, you know, found out that if you send in box tops from Healthy Choice products, you could get, you know, some number of miles for each one of the box tops.
[28:39.550 --> 28:47.910]  And so he did a test, and he figured out that if he bought the 25-cent containers of really bad pudding, that that actually was a qualifying purchase.
[28:48.030 --> 28:49.470]  They didn't actually exclude that.
[28:49.470 --> 28:59.270]  So the guy, like, it was 1999, he went around to, like, every major supermarket in the area and bought them out of Healthy Choice Pudding, spending, like, around $4,000 on this.
[28:59.450 --> 29:02.870]  He told them, you know, as cover that he was stocking up for Y2K.
[29:06.070 --> 29:11.650]  And, you know, he mailed in all the box tops, and he netted a million, like, more than a million advantage miles.
[29:11.770 --> 29:15.730]  You know, and the thing is, this gets back to, like, did he follow the letter of the contract?
[29:15.730 --> 29:17.070]  Well, in fact, he totally did.
[29:17.410 --> 29:18.950]  You know, he bought a Healthy Choice product.
[29:19.470 --> 29:21.090]  It was a Healthy Choice product.
[29:21.950 --> 29:24.430]  You know, it had a UPC symbol on it.
[29:24.770 --> 29:36.570]  You know, the fact that it was 25 cents, and that wasn't exactly what they planned, and he got, you know, a hundred thousand-some dollars worth of travel for this, if he spent it right, you know, that's actually, you know, their problem and not his.
[29:36.710 --> 29:38.110]  He was just being a savvy consumer.
[29:38.110 --> 29:40.690]  So, there's mileage runs.
[29:40.930 --> 29:42.030]  So, what's a mileage run?
[29:42.190 --> 29:49.190]  It's where you can fly extra in order to get more miles, and I'll talk more about that later with a couple of slides to show you.
[29:49.470 --> 29:52.430]  And then, there are some promotions around buying miles.
[29:52.630 --> 29:58.050]  Like, a lot of airlines, U.S. Airways and Avianca are, like, two airlines that are very famous for doing this.
[29:58.250 --> 30:00.070]  They'll do, like, double miles promos.
[30:00.070 --> 30:01.930]  You can spend money and get miles.
[30:02.810 --> 30:03.530]  Super risky.
[30:03.530 --> 30:06.450]  Remember what I said about inflation with this stuff?
[30:06.450 --> 30:10.810]  Like, you know, do you wanna buy double Zimbabwe dollars?
[30:11.750 --> 30:13.390]  Maybe, if you're gonna spend them right now.
[30:13.830 --> 30:15.890]  But, if you're gonna hold on to them, maybe not.
[30:16.090 --> 30:17.890]  Like, that wouldn't be a very smart decision.
[30:19.110 --> 30:26.710]  So, credit cards are a deal with the devil, and I wanna really underscore this because a lot of people get into a ton of trouble when it comes to credit cards.
[30:26.950 --> 30:32.290]  So, you know, like, I spent a year in business school learning how to screw people in various ways.
[30:32.550 --> 30:37.370]  And, you know, credit cards are one of the best ways in America to separate you from your money.
[30:37.610 --> 30:38.850]  Banks are really good at this.
[30:39.370 --> 30:46.790]  So, and they're way smarter than even, you know, like, all of them combined are smarter probably than all of us combined because they're way richer, right?
[30:47.570 --> 30:51.430]  So, typical minimum spend requirements in a limited period of time.
[30:51.430 --> 30:54.390]  So, like, you don't get your bonus if you don't meet the minimum spend.
[30:54.490 --> 30:55.430]  That's one way they screw you.
[30:55.550 --> 30:56.550]  You pay the annual fee.
[30:57.010 --> 30:58.690]  You fail to meet the minimum spend.
[30:58.810 --> 30:59.890]  They don't have to give you anything.
[30:59.890 --> 31:02.890]  So, be sure you always meet that minimum spend.
[31:03.230 --> 31:06.070]  You don't need to meet more than the minimum, but be sure you meet the minimum.
[31:08.070 --> 31:12.890]  So, consider how to meet the minimum spend in some unconventional ways because, you know, people...
[31:12.890 --> 31:17.950]  some people will just, like, go crazy on Amazon and buy a bunch of crap they don't need, you know, in order to hit a minimum spend.
[31:18.090 --> 31:28.610]  And that's great for Amazon but maybe not so great for you and your relationship when whoever you're with is really complaining that you have too much crap that you bought from Amazon cluttering up the house.
[31:29.250 --> 31:31.610]  So, and your bank account's empty, right?
[31:31.810 --> 31:38.730]  So, consider, you know, how much this can cost you because if you don't manage this well, you know, you pay interest charges.
[31:39.510 --> 31:43.790]  You, you know, you pay and you forget to, like, cancel cards before the annual fees come due.
[31:45.030 --> 31:47.310]  You end up buying stuff that you don't need.
[31:47.450 --> 31:50.790]  This can end up costing you way more than the value of the miles or the points that you got.
[31:50.950 --> 31:52.450]  And actually, that's what banks are counting on.
[31:52.710 --> 31:57.010]  So, you know, don't be a statistic, like, really stay on top of this stuff.
[31:57.170 --> 32:00.350]  If you're not good at staying on top of this kind of stuff, it's not a game for you.
[32:01.310 --> 32:06.010]  And I'm a big fan, you know, I just want to underscore, like, I'm a really big fan of free miles.
[32:06.530 --> 32:18.190]  So, if you go out reading travel blogs, there's, like, a lot of them pointing to, like, you know, 100,000 point offers for, like, $500 annual fee platinum cards that you can't get out of the annual fee for.
[32:18.670 --> 32:19.930]  Is that really a good deal?
[32:20.070 --> 32:21.130]  Well, maybe it is.
[32:21.310 --> 32:27.130]  But at some point, you've got, like, four platinum cards in your wallet that you're paying $500 annual fees on.
[32:27.250 --> 32:33.670]  And you've got to figure out, like, and then you get used to the perks that go with that, you know, the concierge service and the free lounge access and whatever else.
[32:35.050 --> 32:36.790]  So, banks also count on this.
[32:36.950 --> 32:42.230]  Like, you're going to enjoy having that product and, you know, you're not going to cancel it when it comes around.
[32:42.410 --> 32:44.270]  Like, you're just going to pay the $500 annual fee.
[32:44.450 --> 32:48.310]  And then, by the way, like, they don't actually give you a bonus the second year, right?
[32:48.310 --> 32:50.070]  That's the first time you get the card.
[32:50.230 --> 32:51.070]  That's when you get the bonus.
[32:51.770 --> 32:55.170]  So, you know, they're only making money in subsequent years after that.
[32:55.330 --> 32:59.650]  Enough people keep this that it makes it worth it for them to do these outsized promos.
[33:00.030 --> 33:03.810]  So, you know, stick to your guns.
[33:03.990 --> 33:05.170]  Make sure that you keep them free.
[33:05.250 --> 33:07.830]  Otherwise, you're not really getting all that great a deal.
[33:07.970 --> 33:08.750]  Or maybe you are.
[33:08.890 --> 33:11.670]  I mean, you know, it's a highly individual thing whether you like the lounge.
[33:12.390 --> 33:19.030]  Personally, you know, the third world transit lounge, you know, with the whaling babies, I have earplugs.
[33:20.330 --> 33:23.950]  So, what makes a mistake fare even better?
[33:24.870 --> 33:26.330]  Combine it with a mistake routing.
[33:28.210 --> 33:31.110]  Mistake fares still earn miles most of the time.
[33:31.430 --> 33:35.070]  And it's getting harder to do, like, mileage runs profitably, right?
[33:35.230 --> 33:36.110]  But it's still possible.
[33:36.430 --> 33:41.830]  There's a really great website called theflightdeal.com, and they have a Twitter account as well, the flightdeal.
[33:42.830 --> 33:50.730]  And flyertalk.com, you know, there are a lot of private forums that are not Flyertalk, but I'm not going to point you guys to them because they're private.
[33:51.630 --> 33:56.970]  Flyertalk is a way that you can meet people that may introduce you to more private forums where, like, things are more freely shared.
[33:57.310 --> 34:00.270]  But you can learn a lot on Flyertalk if you're new to this stuff.
[34:00.750 --> 34:04.430]  Just keep in mind that that's not the only place where people into travel hacking talk.
[34:06.850 --> 34:09.210]  So, what are mileage run pitfalls?
[34:09.210 --> 34:11.070]  So, you know, what's a mileage run?
[34:11.270 --> 34:14.130]  It's when you're, like, trying to fly extra miles to get more points.
[34:14.310 --> 34:15.710]  That's basically all it is.
[34:16.930 --> 34:18.350]  So, how can you do that?
[34:18.350 --> 34:19.470]  There's a number of ways.
[34:19.970 --> 34:22.910]  Typically, what it involves is booking out-of-the-way connections.
[34:23.870 --> 34:30.870]  So, what you end up doing is, you know, you're ending up flying more miles, and your butt's in that seat, but you get more miles in your account.
[34:30.930 --> 34:33.570]  And you're not necessarily paying any more money.
[34:34.870 --> 34:37.690]  So, I'll show you an example of how this can work in a moment.
[34:39.130 --> 34:42.710]  So, there's, you know, airlines are really well aware that people are doing this.
[34:43.010 --> 34:44.730]  And they've put up with it for a while.
[34:44.910 --> 34:47.670]  But again, too many people have started flying too many miles.
[34:48.430 --> 34:49.110]  Oh, I've got ten minutes.
[34:49.130 --> 34:50.270]  Okay, I'll speed up.
[34:51.870 --> 34:54.910]  So, they're getting, you know, too many people have started doing this.
[34:55.090 --> 34:58.170]  So, airlines are starting to change how their frequent flyer programs work.
[34:58.630 --> 35:03.830]  Next year, Delta and United are going to give you points based on the money you spend versus the number of miles you fly.
[35:04.050 --> 35:06.470]  So, there will be no reason to do this with those airlines anymore.
[35:07.710 --> 35:09.770]  American and Alaska, you still can for now.
[35:10.070 --> 35:11.930]  So, you know, it hasn't gone entirely away.
[35:12.030 --> 35:12.950]  It's just on the way out.
[35:14.390 --> 35:19.050]  And one thing that, you know, that I really want to underscore is the last bullet point on this slide.
[35:20.070 --> 35:27.810]  I read recently about a guy who flew to Australia and turned around and came back just for the miles because he found a really cheap fare.
[35:28.650 --> 35:29.890]  And, you know, people have to go to work.
[35:30.050 --> 35:33.150]  So, you know, they try to do this thing on the weekend, you know, with mileage runs.
[35:33.310 --> 35:35.990]  And they obsess over the number of cents per mile.
[35:36.390 --> 35:41.250]  And I'm looking at this and I'm saying, wow, you went to Australia and you didn't see a single kangaroo?
[35:41.690 --> 35:43.290]  Like, you never left the airport?
[35:44.270 --> 35:45.590]  That's just, like, that's nuts.
[35:45.790 --> 35:47.330]  You know, remember why we do this.
[35:47.570 --> 35:50.050]  You know, why are you traveling?
[35:50.250 --> 35:51.450]  It's to see awesome stuff.
[35:51.610 --> 35:52.650]  It's to do awesome things.
[35:52.830 --> 35:54.410]  And so, like, you were already somewhere awesome.
[35:54.410 --> 35:56.870]  Like, and you did that just for the miles.
[35:57.010 --> 35:58.070]  That's a little bit crazy to me.
[35:58.230 --> 35:59.570]  Like, maybe it's not to him.
[35:59.770 --> 36:01.830]  You know, again, it's a highly individual thing.
[36:01.990 --> 36:03.970]  Sometimes just getting miles is people's hobby.
[36:04.150 --> 36:10.610]  But I can think of a lot more fun things to do with my free time than just getting miles.
[36:12.350 --> 36:13.830]  So, have a look at this map.
[36:14.030 --> 36:16.030]  So, I flew to Quito for $400.
[36:17.610 --> 36:19.090]  And that was a mistake fare.
[36:19.230 --> 36:20.110]  I didn't leave from LA.
[36:20.250 --> 36:20.910]  I left from Phoenix.
[36:20.910 --> 36:22.210]  And so, this wasn't possible.
[36:23.970 --> 36:29.090]  But if you fly straight there, it's around 4,000 miles-ish.
[36:29.750 --> 36:32.090]  And if you happen to, like, if it...
[36:32.090 --> 36:36.730]  So, if the fare allows you to route on both Delta and Aeromexico, then it gets really interesting.
[36:36.730 --> 36:38.810]  Because you have all the Delta hubs available to you.
[36:38.870 --> 36:40.050]  And that could be a valid routing.
[36:40.210 --> 36:44.050]  You just pay the extra segment tax for every additional city you go through.
[36:44.250 --> 36:45.510]  Which I think in the U.S.
[36:45.630 --> 36:47.070]  right now is $7.50.
[36:48.210 --> 36:54.130]  So, if you routed from LA to Salt Lake City, to Seattle, to Minneapolis, to Atlanta, to Mexico City, to Quito...
[36:56.810 --> 36:59.330]  Then you could almost double the number of miles that you got.
[36:59.710 --> 37:03.870]  But you're also gonna well more than double the amount of time it takes you to get there.
[37:04.150 --> 37:06.830]  So, and you're gonna... you'll be super exhausted when you do.
[37:07.110 --> 37:10.350]  So, yes, you can get creative with routings.
[37:10.410 --> 37:12.350]  You totally can get more miles by doing that.
[37:12.350 --> 37:13.530]  Remember while you travel.
[37:14.110 --> 37:19.410]  And, you know, it's just really up to you as to what your tolerance is for this kind of crazy stuff.
[37:20.670 --> 37:22.290]  So, free one-way ticket.
[37:22.430 --> 37:23.350]  I like free, don't you?
[37:24.470 --> 37:30.230]  So, some airlines, if you're booking an international ticket, you have the option to do a stopover.
[37:30.530 --> 37:32.890]  So, that's how I got to HOPE, actually.
[37:32.890 --> 37:34.510]  I was leaving from China.
[37:35.610 --> 37:39.350]  I left from China, flew through Hong Kong, went to LA.
[37:39.810 --> 37:42.010]  I had a stopover there for a couple of months.
[37:43.330 --> 37:50.650]  And then, you know, I just continued my itinerary through Vancouver to New York.
[37:50.790 --> 37:51.610]  Why through Vancouver?
[37:51.810 --> 37:52.850]  Because that's what was available.
[37:53.230 --> 37:56.510]  So, you can actually... you know, airlines are starting to crack down.
[37:56.630 --> 37:58.290]  You can't do this anymore with American Airlines.
[37:58.510 --> 38:00.190]  But with a lot of airlines, it's still possible.
[38:00.190 --> 38:03.450]  So, never forget, like, is there a trip you're going to be taking?
[38:04.690 --> 38:06.810]  You know, can you add on an additional segment?
[38:07.090 --> 38:10.830]  Yeah, there's a trip I'm taking after my round-the-world trip, right?
[38:11.330 --> 38:13.090]  I'm going to be going home for Christmas.
[38:13.310 --> 38:17.330]  So, I just... you know, I just added that on as part of my itinerary.
[38:17.590 --> 38:19.190]  Save me 150 bucks, roughly.
[38:19.390 --> 38:20.770]  I mean, you know, money's money, right?
[38:20.890 --> 38:21.370]  I like free.
[38:22.050 --> 38:25.270]  So, without the free one-way, that's the itinerary I just talked about.
[38:25.390 --> 38:26.350]  Here's what it looks like.
[38:26.350 --> 38:30.250]  And with the free one-way, that's basically what I did.
[38:30.730 --> 38:32.730]  So, I can speak to you here now.
[38:34.710 --> 38:35.850]  So, hidden cities.
[38:36.250 --> 38:41.170]  Hidden cities get a lot of ink or virtual ink on the Internet.
[38:41.170 --> 38:45.030]  And I don't think enough is said about how risky these things are, right?
[38:45.230 --> 38:50.610]  I actually wrote on Seat 31B a very detailed column on what exactly can go wrong.
[38:50.770 --> 38:52.570]  But what's a hidden city itinerary?
[38:52.570 --> 38:57.330]  You're going somewhere and you fly through a city that you actually want to go to.
[38:57.550 --> 39:01.470]  Like, so, say you're going to Guam and it goes through Tokyo.
[39:01.630 --> 39:02.910]  Well, you don't really want to go to Guam.
[39:02.970 --> 39:05.890]  Like, unless you want to go to the Air Force Base there or something.
[39:06.590 --> 39:09.550]  So, you just get off in Tokyo and like skip that other segment.
[39:09.750 --> 39:17.650]  A lot of people were doing this because, you know, until two weeks ago, if you had Avianca life miles, Guam was considered the continental U.S.
[39:17.650 --> 39:18.650]  They'd miscoded it.
[39:18.990 --> 39:27.070]  So, for 12,500 miles, you could book through, like, Taipei or through Tokyo to Guam and like, you know, just get off the plane there.
[39:28.010 --> 39:33.770]  So, basically, it's not without risk because if there's irregular operations, they're just going to reroute you.
[39:33.930 --> 39:42.970]  So, if you were going to go to Guam, like, via Tokyo, and that flight for whatever reason something went wrong with, they might send you through Hawaii instead.
[39:42.970 --> 39:45.890]  And then you'd be stuck in the terrible place of Hawaii.
[39:46.190 --> 39:51.890]  So, you know, keep in mind, you know, sometimes Hidden Cities, like, one changing to another, like, isn't necessarily a bad thing.
[39:51.890 --> 39:56.770]  But don't make any non-refundable reservations based on the Hidden Cities itinerary plan.
[39:56.910 --> 40:05.050]  And don't get too bent out of shape if it doesn't work and you end up on a direct routing to the final destination you booked, which is entirely possible and can happen.
[40:07.050 --> 40:11.470]  So, I'd like to, you know, kind of wrap this up because we're close to...
[40:11.470 --> 40:13.030]  Am I going to have time for questions?
[40:13.290 --> 40:13.690]  Yeah.
[40:14.650 --> 40:15.330]  Oh, okay.
[40:15.450 --> 40:17.010]  So, with questions, I have time for questions.
[40:17.210 --> 40:17.310]  Great.
[40:17.790 --> 40:21.090]  So, I'd like to wrap things up with kind of a call to action, right?
[40:21.290 --> 40:24.590]  And that call to action is, you know, I've been to all seven continents.
[40:25.050 --> 40:28.410]  I'm a way better person now that I've seen how other people live.
[40:29.330 --> 40:31.290]  I've experienced different cultures.
[40:31.470 --> 40:35.350]  I've seen a lot of parts of the world that are not the U.S.
[40:35.630 --> 40:40.330]  So, I don't want to, like, you know, toot the horn of GTFO too much.
[40:40.330 --> 40:44.370]  There are some other hackers that run a podcast called GTFO.
[40:44.790 --> 40:48.250]  And they talk a lot about how hackers can make a difference overseas.
[40:48.550 --> 41:01.350]  But really, it's very natural for people, even hackers who are, like, really open to experiencing other things and learning new ideas, to kind of get into a rut and a bubble.
[41:01.370 --> 41:05.150]  And when you get out of it, your life can become so much more amazing.
[41:05.150 --> 41:10.230]  So, cost really isn't a barrier anymore for most people from developed countries to travel.
[41:10.410 --> 41:13.310]  It's gotten really cheap, especially if you're doing travel hacking.
[41:13.490 --> 41:14.170]  It's almost free.
[41:14.430 --> 41:22.250]  So, and we have a really unique perspective, everyone in this room, on how we can impact the world and how we can make it a better place.
[41:22.390 --> 41:25.170]  And you really can't do that unless you're out in it.
[41:25.230 --> 41:26.310]  So, see the world.
[41:26.470 --> 41:28.270]  See firsthand how you can make a difference.
[41:28.270 --> 41:36.270]  Learn what problems that you can solve that people are having, that are problems you would never see in the United States or in Western countries.
[41:36.910 --> 41:43.190]  You know, it was so eye-opening to me to be living in China, where, you know, people live in such a different way.
[41:43.390 --> 41:47.630]  And the way that they interact and use technology is so incredibly different as a result of that.
[41:47.850 --> 41:50.490]  So, it's super eye-opening to get out.
[41:50.650 --> 41:52.290]  So, I really encourage that you do.
[41:53.030 --> 41:58.990]  And finally, just a little plug for my blog, Seat 31B, which this isn't my full-time thing.
[41:59.170 --> 42:01.210]  It's just kind of like something I do on the side.
[42:02.890 --> 42:08.330]  Most of the travel blogs that you're going to be reading online are just trying to sell you a credit card through their affiliate link.
[42:08.510 --> 42:11.830]  You guys are all smart enough to tell whether a link is affiliate or not.
[42:13.350 --> 42:14.890]  Don't sign up for that credit card.
[42:16.110 --> 42:18.570]  I'm trying to tell everybody the real story.
[42:18.730 --> 42:22.810]  And the real story is that, you know, you're not going to be flying luxury and first class for nothing.
[42:23.050 --> 42:24.750]  Like, travel bloggers can do that.
[42:24.910 --> 42:26.830]  They all have relationships with the airlines.
[42:27.250 --> 42:31.370]  Yeah, the chances of you doing that are roughly the chance of a snowball in hell.
[42:31.650 --> 42:33.190]  So, it can happen.
[42:33.950 --> 42:35.390]  Maybe you get lucky sometimes.
[42:35.830 --> 42:37.230]  But, you know, don't bank on that.
[42:37.370 --> 42:38.550]  But you can travel for free.
[42:38.690 --> 42:40.310]  If you aren't...
[42:40.310 --> 42:50.690]  If you're totally okay with, like, being in the middle seat, in the back, in economy class, like, you know, with the aroma of chemical toilet, like, wafting every time the door opens.
[42:50.690 --> 42:53.750]  Because that seat was free and it's not the good one, right?
[42:54.330 --> 42:58.510]  But, if you're okay with the not good seat, you can travel really cheap or free.
[42:58.850 --> 43:00.730]  And that's what I do on Seat 31B.
[43:01.170 --> 43:03.810]  So, with that, I will open up to questions.
[43:04.290 --> 43:05.510]  And thank you very much.
[43:18.800 --> 43:19.740]  AB, thank you.
[43:19.980 --> 43:24.980]  Just a reminder, if you do have questions, come up to the microphone because then we'll capture your questions on the microphone and the DVD.
[43:27.840 --> 43:35.560]  For those of you running out, if you need to catch another talk, but you do have questions, you can also email me at tprophet at seat31b.com.
[43:36.900 --> 43:37.840]  Hey, thanks for your talk.
[43:37.840 --> 43:41.340]  I just wanted to just contribute one little tip that's been really useful for me as well.
[43:42.060 --> 43:52.980]  Sometimes I'm buying tickets on, like, Travelocity or Orbitz, and I find that they always give the best discount deals if you don't have any cookies in your browser identifying you as a previous site visitor.
[43:53.200 --> 43:58.600]  If you go to Travelocity, you come back an hour later, the price goes up, delete all your cookies, it goes right back down.
[43:58.760 --> 44:00.120]  So, just something for people to remember.
[44:01.020 --> 44:02.560]  That's actually a really good point.
[44:03.100 --> 44:08.140]  Airlines and travel agencies, and especially hotels, do play games with pricing.
[44:08.780 --> 44:11.180]  So, and it's actually not just cookies.
[44:11.780 --> 44:18.040]  The IP, the geo location of your IP address is a very real thing, and pricing is based on that a lot of the time.
[44:18.380 --> 44:23.380]  So, one travel hacking tip you guys can do is, you know, try IPs from different places.
[44:25.400 --> 44:29.240]  Question, maybe you can speak on the validity of this pseudo travel hack.
[44:29.460 --> 44:35.520]  So, I've heard that, you know, if you know somebody that works for the airlines, the one in your family, they can travel for very cheap or very free.
[44:35.520 --> 44:42.440]  Would it, you know, would it make sense to either socially engineer, bribe, or just befriend people that are stewards or stewardesses?
[44:44.560 --> 44:47.900]  People who work for airlines are often really interesting people.
[44:49.160 --> 44:52.080]  So, I mean, there's nothing wrong with making friends, right?
[44:52.400 --> 44:52.740]  Right.
[44:52.740 --> 45:00.340]  But, one of the things that new friends ask airline personnel most often is whether they can get a free ticket.
[45:00.340 --> 45:04.000]  And you wouldn't be a very good friend if you were, like, asking for that kind of stuff.
[45:04.300 --> 45:08.640]  Just like your friends aren't very good friends if they're asking you to fix their computer.
[45:10.240 --> 45:10.640]  So...
[45:10.640 --> 45:11.680]  Give and take.
[45:11.840 --> 45:12.480]  Give and take.
[45:12.860 --> 45:14.440]  I'll fix your computer for a second.
[45:14.440 --> 45:16.500]  You know, the reality is, yes, you can fix their computer.
[45:16.640 --> 45:17.580]  You totally can do that.
[45:17.700 --> 45:20.260]  You can probably fix anything with their computer, but do you want to?
[45:21.620 --> 45:22.180]  Thank you.
[45:23.960 --> 45:27.120]  Yeah, that was kind of going to be my comment about the social engineering aspect of this.
[45:27.240 --> 45:29.400]  You mentioned mistake fares.
[45:29.680 --> 45:30.900]  Don't call the airline.
[45:31.900 --> 45:32.300]  Don't.
[45:32.680 --> 45:33.080]  Please.
[45:33.760 --> 45:37.680]  What ends up happening is the person at the computer sees it pop up.
[45:37.800 --> 45:42.060]  They not only know that that's wrong, but they're going to escalate it.
[45:43.000 --> 45:45.740]  There's that human element that's going to screw things up, but I was surprised you...
[45:45.740 --> 45:45.940]  Maybe.
[45:46.320 --> 45:46.720]  Maybe.
[45:46.720 --> 45:52.560]  See, the thing with call centers is that they're mostly run by human robots in India now.
[45:53.320 --> 45:53.480]  Yeah.
[45:53.940 --> 45:58.800]  So, you know, who have to stick to a script and aren't allowed to actually make any decisions and have no power for anything.
[45:59.000 --> 46:06.880]  So, if you're talking to, like, anybody... that's totally true if you're talking to somebody who's a thinking, you know, person who has some, like, power desk laid.
[46:07.420 --> 46:09.880]  But, you know, if you're calling United, don't worry.
[46:10.080 --> 46:14.200]  If you're doing something simple or you're calling United because they're United, it's fine.
[46:14.200 --> 46:23.040]  But if you're asking them to do anything sort of complicated, that's going to get kicked back to the U.S., that's going to get kicked back to what's called a pricing desk, and they're going to trigger that.
[46:23.220 --> 46:32.740]  I was surprised you didn't mention that my actual question was some of the tools you use for this, like Matrix, or, you know, a lot of us don't have access to command line tools like an actual registered travel agent.
[46:32.800 --> 46:34.180]  I just wondered if you could talk about that for a second.
[46:34.400 --> 46:34.660]  Sure.
[46:34.780 --> 46:37.660]  There are lots of tools you can use to do travel hacking stuff.
[46:37.660 --> 46:39.280]  Like, this isn't a functional talk.
[46:39.420 --> 46:40.480]  This is an overview talk.
[46:41.600 --> 46:46.440]  You know, maybe next year, if this is well-received, I can do, like, a talk with some more techniques.
[46:47.060 --> 46:50.800]  But, yeah, there are lots of... there's a whole long list of tools that I use to find good deals.
[46:50.960 --> 46:55.500]  But you don't actually need that list to start learning on your own how travel hacking works.
[46:56.700 --> 46:59.360]  You have to tell us about the Armenian prison story.
[46:59.560 --> 47:00.500]  I'd like to hear more about that.
[47:00.500 --> 47:12.480]  And my other question is, are there any, like, ad hoc courier services where somebody needs something delivered somewhere, and you're a trusted person, and you can just take a plane and deliver a package for them for free?
[47:12.580 --> 47:12.620]  Sure.
[47:12.640 --> 47:13.980]  Well, let me start with your question.
[47:14.120 --> 47:16.580]  The Armenian thing, actually, it was just a traffic violation.
[47:16.580 --> 47:20.680]  The license plate fell off my, like, sketchy rental car, and that's a really big deal there.
[47:20.700 --> 47:24.420]  So, like, the traffic police stop you and arrest you if that happens and take you to the police station.
[47:24.440 --> 47:25.880]  But, you know, like, it all ended well.
[47:25.900 --> 47:28.360]  Like, you saw my picture with the police detective.
[47:29.420 --> 47:31.760]  So, like, the courier thing.
[47:33.640 --> 47:36.720]  Don't take anything that isn't yours through an airport ever.
[47:37.240 --> 47:46.280]  Because if that package isn't documents and it's actually heroin, and you're going to Singapore, which, you know, these things happen.
[47:46.600 --> 47:50.200]  Like, the penalty for smuggling heroin into Singapore is death.
[47:50.360 --> 47:51.320]  They just kill you.
[47:51.460 --> 47:52.400]  They don't care.
[47:52.620 --> 47:53.940]  They don't give a shit who you are.
[47:54.040 --> 47:55.140]  They will cut off your head.
[47:55.740 --> 47:58.660]  Don't ever take anything that isn't yours through an airport.
[47:59.280 --> 48:05.820]  And if you're stupid enough to even think about smuggling to make some money or pay your travel expenses, then you're too stupid to be here.
[48:11.870 --> 48:16.210]  What's happened to the resale for unused tickets?
[48:17.290 --> 48:23.350]  Resale for unused tickets in the United States and in most developed Western countries essentially doesn't exist.
[48:23.750 --> 48:25.530]  Tickets are tied to a specific name.
[48:26.010 --> 48:28.610]  So the thing is, like, on paper you can do this, right?
[48:28.930 --> 48:33.030]  There's a name change fee, which is more than the price of the ticket.
[48:33.270 --> 48:40.510]  So, you know, essentially, like, if you're, you know, if you want to not take a flight, you're just going to lose all your money is basically how it works these days.
[48:44.150 --> 48:44.510]  Hi.
[48:44.510 --> 48:45.210]  Thanks for the talk.
[48:45.290 --> 48:46.310]  It's been really informative for me.
[48:46.350 --> 48:47.410]  I do sort of the same thing.
[48:47.410 --> 48:56.770]  And I'm wondering if it's possible to do things like game, not C-classes like first-year business, but, like, ticket classes like Y-class or C-class, and if there's some advantage to doing that.
[48:57.890 --> 49:07.330]  There can be, but, you know, when... remember at the very beginning when I said, a travel hack where you have to pay more isn't really a travel hack.
[49:08.670 --> 49:14.710]  Generally speaking, like, any of these kinds of, you know, games to get into upgradeable fare buckets, which is the question you're really asking.
[49:14.710 --> 49:28.430]  So his question is, can I... can this cheap economy class ticket that I bought, is there a way to, like, switch it into a higher fare class so that it's then upgradeable if I'm an elite status member, which is... I think that's what you're asking, right?
[49:29.130 --> 49:29.630]  Sort of.
[49:29.790 --> 49:31.390]  They're worth more miles in some cases.
[49:31.410 --> 49:33.150]  Yeah, sometimes worth more miles, that kind of thing.
[49:33.670 --> 49:36.190]  You know, the short answer is not really.
[49:36.630 --> 49:42.690]  There are, like, some one-offs, but, you know, it all depends on whether you get rerouted and whether somebody makes a mistake.
[49:43.030 --> 49:43.330]  Okay.
[49:43.470 --> 49:43.690]  Thanks.
[49:45.730 --> 49:48.950]  I just want to add something about the courier flight.
[49:49.110 --> 49:50.750]  I've flown courier in the past.
[49:50.990 --> 49:55.570]  Apparently, most airlines do have a relationship with courier.
[49:55.710 --> 50:05.330]  There are many items that can be flown by in person, because if it goes through cargo, it can take much longer.
[50:05.470 --> 50:06.430]  You need it much faster.
[50:06.630 --> 50:06.910]  Sure.
[50:07.050 --> 50:08.530]  There are legitimate courier services.
[50:08.770 --> 50:08.890]  Yeah.
[50:09.010 --> 50:10.630]  There are also a lot of really sketchy ones.
[50:10.630 --> 50:12.570]  So if you don't know the difference, don't do it.
[50:12.750 --> 50:13.410]  Did you have a question?
[50:14.350 --> 50:15.770]  I just want to add that.
[50:16.090 --> 50:17.050]  I mean, for example...
[50:17.050 --> 50:17.090]  Great.
[50:17.270 --> 50:17.510]  Yeah.
[50:18.170 --> 50:19.710]  I mean, that's the difference.
[50:19.910 --> 50:22.870]  There are the official couriers and they all work with off.
[50:23.670 --> 50:24.070]  All right.
[50:24.130 --> 50:24.710]  Next question, please.
[50:25.850 --> 50:26.130]  Hi.
[50:26.130 --> 50:34.690]  I know this is mostly about air travel, but do you know anything about hitching rides on cargo ships or riding as a passenger in a cargo ship?
[50:34.930 --> 50:36.310]  Yeah, you can do that and pay money.
[50:36.570 --> 50:37.350]  Talk to Emmanuel.
[50:37.350 --> 50:42.610]  He did it and did a round-the-world trip, which he actually wrote an amazing blog on.
[50:43.350 --> 50:44.810]  And he did it all by surface.
[50:45.150 --> 50:46.310]  There were no flights involved.
[50:46.450 --> 50:51.170]  So, like, he left from New York, went all the way around the world, and traveled only by train and ship.
[50:55.060 --> 50:58.340]  Substantial variations in ticket price because of time of day.
[50:58.560 --> 50:59.860]  Is that a myth or a reality?
[51:00.200 --> 51:00.560]  Yeah.
[51:01.460 --> 51:04.600]  There's variations on prices based on demand.
[51:04.820 --> 51:14.820]  And so, you know, there's less demand on, for example, a Tuesday afternoon than for a Friday evening, for example, like for flights.
[51:14.980 --> 51:23.340]  And so, what you're going to find is that there's going to be, like, more cheap tickets sold at inconvenient times, which are Tuesday, Wednesday, and Saturday, typically.
[51:23.560 --> 51:25.640]  You're talking about the, sorry, you're talking about the time of flight, right?
[51:25.820 --> 51:26.820]  I meant the time of purchase.
[51:27.080 --> 51:27.880]  Oh, the time of purchase?
[51:28.080 --> 51:28.340]  No.
[51:28.580 --> 51:33.440]  There's, like, airlines adjust for us all the time, sometimes, you know, many times, like, even in 15 minutes.
[51:35.980 --> 51:37.280]  Are there any other questions?
[51:37.440 --> 51:38.320]  I think we're running...
[51:38.320 --> 51:39.380]  I have one question.
[51:39.640 --> 51:39.720]  Yeah.
[51:39.720 --> 51:41.720]  This is less technical, more sort of anecdotal.
[51:41.820 --> 51:46.660]  Do you find that when you get on a mistake fare flight, it is frequently packed with the same people?
[51:47.500 --> 51:47.940]  Like...
[51:47.940 --> 51:48.760]  When I get onto a...
[51:48.760 --> 51:51.900]  Like, you end up sort of co-traveling with a lot of other travel hackers?
[51:52.900 --> 51:57.020]  Oh, so, yeah, on a mistake fare flight, that's a really good question, right?
[51:57.240 --> 52:04.700]  So, you know, this $219 around the world thing got very highly publicized, and it lasted an unusually long time.
[52:04.880 --> 52:06.700]  Like, usually these things get killed immediately.
[52:07.960 --> 52:13.660]  In Italy, there is coffee to drink in a sidewalk cafe, and maybe a nice dessert to enjoy.
[52:13.660 --> 52:25.220]  And so, you know, almost 48 hours later, after, like, it was on every travel blog in the universe, and Alitalia was losing, like, you know, I'm sure that it's well into the... over a million dollars at this point.
[52:25.860 --> 52:27.440]  Finally, they did something to fix it.
[52:27.780 --> 52:34.460]  So, there's gonna be a lot of, you know, people on these particular flights, especially the Boston to Rome flight.
[52:34.780 --> 52:39.540]  But, you know, whether you bump into other travel hackers, you know, there's... it's not actually...
[52:39.540 --> 52:42.940]  There aren't a lot of people doing this, which is why we can actually get away with it, right?
[52:43.120 --> 52:48.920]  If there were a lot of people doing it, then the revenue calculation would tip in favor of fixing the problem instead of...
[52:48.920 --> 52:50.980]  You know, airlines know this stuff's going on, right?
[52:51.240 --> 52:52.560]  They totally know it does.
[52:52.860 --> 52:56.140]  They just look the other way because fixing it would cost more than they're losing.
[52:56.800 --> 53:03.820]  If a lot of people are doing it, then they're just gonna fix stuff, which means we as hackers find new ways to get really good deals.
[53:03.820 --> 53:09.080]  Because there's... that's the great thing with, you know, with these complicated legacy systems that airlines run on.
[53:09.400 --> 53:15.400]  There's just so many ways to break them and so many ways to save money that if smart people are looking at this instead of...
[53:15.400 --> 53:21.880]  You know, like the guys that are doing travel hacking generally are just like, you know, they're not like super technically smart.
[53:23.080 --> 53:24.640]  They don't know how to write scripts.
[53:24.760 --> 53:26.560]  They don't know how to spider sites.
[53:26.720 --> 53:29.380]  They don't know how to do any of the kind of stuff that we know how to do.
[53:29.380 --> 53:36.180]  And most stuff comes out of just like, you know, amateurs like doing this in their spare time who aren't particularly technically sophisticated.
[53:36.880 --> 53:44.820]  So, you know, if people in this room start really getting into it, maybe it'll cause enough damage, but maybe not.
[53:45.560 --> 53:46.000]  Thanks.
[53:48.100 --> 53:49.260]  I think that's it.
[53:49.460 --> 53:50.940]  So, again, thanks.
[53:51.060 --> 53:52.560]  I'm surprised we had so much interest.
[54:08.710 --> 54:10.830]  Sorry, TProphet, I have one more thing to say to you.
[54:11.230 --> 54:12.290]  This is some comments you made.
[54:12.650 --> 54:15.750]  I don't mean to do this in public, but I feel like it needs to be done for public service.
[54:16.370 --> 54:21.290]  When you're talking about people who work on phones for things, please don't call them human robots.
[54:21.650 --> 54:22.170]  Please don't.
[54:22.250 --> 54:22.810]  They are people.
[54:22.990 --> 54:23.550]  They have jobs.
[54:23.910 --> 54:27.470]  We also should all as hackers not be saying things on the order of... thank you.
[54:27.970 --> 54:32.290]  We should not be saying things on the order of people who are mindless, like when they're doing jobs like that.
[54:32.390 --> 54:34.350]  They're just having to work a script or they lose their job.
[54:34.550 --> 54:35.670]  It's not that they're mindless, right?
[54:35.970 --> 54:36.710]  That's totally what I mean.
[54:36.850 --> 54:37.030]  Okay.
[54:37.410 --> 54:38.170]  Yeah, exactly.
[54:38.310 --> 54:41.110]  The point was that they have a script and not that they're mindless.
[54:41.110 --> 54:42.630]  So, just wanted to point that out.
[54:43.370 --> 54:46.410]  We should be careful because sometimes we are not as smart as everybody else is.
[54:46.750 --> 54:47.270]  Thank you.
[54:47.630 --> 54:48.430]  Thank you all for coming.
[54:49.390 --> 54:50.830]  And A.V., you can bring it back up.