[00:00.000 --> 00:01.480]  For Standard Time, good morning, HOPE.
[00:04.020 --> 00:07.800]  One more thanks to Robert Steele, and we will move on to our next talk.
[00:08.220 --> 00:09.000]  This should be good.
[00:09.100 --> 00:12.520]  It's called Using a Space Camp Model for Next Generation Security Training.
[00:13.000 --> 00:17.720]  And I would like to present our speakers, Mark Tobias, Tommie Blackwell, and Matt Fiddler.
[00:19.040 --> 00:20.080]  A pleasure to be here.
[00:20.540 --> 00:22.600]  I'll give you a brief introduction to our team.
[00:23.780 --> 00:25.140]  My name is Mark Tobias.
[00:25.260 --> 00:33.220]  I'm a lawyer and physical security specialist, and I lead a team that work for all the major lock companies in the world.
[00:33.500 --> 00:38.880]  We figure out how to compromise high security locks and we figure out how to fix them.
[00:39.500 --> 00:41.400]  So guys like us can't get into them.
[00:41.980 --> 00:49.300]  Tommie Blackwell is a PhD, Education Administration, and she's part of our team.
[00:49.660 --> 00:54.600]  She ran Space Camp at Huntsville, Alabama for 12 years.
[00:54.760 --> 00:56.520]  How many of you guys are familiar with Space Camp?
[00:56.520 --> 00:58.020]  Okay, great.
[00:58.520 --> 01:03.040]  Well, they have now run 600,000 kids through Space Camp.
[01:03.660 --> 01:05.760]  A very, very popular program.
[01:05.900 --> 01:07.940]  Tommie ran it for 12 years.
[01:08.560 --> 01:12.400]  We have a team that's put together that we'll talk about.
[01:12.640 --> 01:14.920]  And then David Fidler is a high school student.
[01:15.180 --> 01:16.660]  His dad and I work together.
[01:17.380 --> 01:21.400]  His dad is a covert entry specialist, makes tools for government.
[01:21.400 --> 01:31.260]  And we thought David would be actually more relevant than Matt, who was supposed to be on this panel, because we're targeting high school and college kids and we want your input.
[01:31.500 --> 01:36.800]  So we're going to go through a slide presentation and then we would like questions.
[01:36.800 --> 01:46.560]  We actually did this eight years ago at HOPE in July of 2004, but now we have something to talk about.
[01:46.780 --> 01:51.500]  So we're looking at a security camp based on the Space Camp model.
[01:52.340 --> 02:01.700]  In HOPE 2004, I talked about a concept at that point, and the title of the talk was Harry Potter meets Reality.
[02:03.220 --> 02:17.860]  What we had proposed was the real Hogwarts for security training and to get kids into a security curriculum so that they would get involved in security and pursue it as a career.
[02:18.860 --> 02:22.340]  And at that time, we talked about a failure of imagination.
[02:22.880 --> 02:29.700]  And that's what our team deals with every day in physical security designs in locks and safes.
[02:30.060 --> 02:33.240]  And there's a real problem on the part of a lot of manufacturers.
[02:33.500 --> 02:37.700]  They understand how to make things work, but they don't understand how to break them.
[02:38.200 --> 02:42.540]  And what we teach engineers worldwide is how to break things.
[02:43.340 --> 02:45.800]  Sort of like destructive ten-year-olds.
[02:46.660 --> 02:55.260]  And so... but we're talking about... there's a lot of security camps out there and boot camps, but we're talking about a very immersive, high-tech environment.
[02:56.020 --> 03:03.740]  Just like the Space Camp model, and Tommie can talk about that a little bit, the security threat has escalated since 2004, obviously.
[03:04.800 --> 03:08.740]  As things have become more computerized, the threats have escalated.
[03:09.800 --> 03:13.200]  The Pentagon now has a Cyber Command Center.
[03:13.700 --> 03:14.760]  Big problem.
[03:14.960 --> 03:20.980]  But the vision was a Hogwarts Academy that does the real things.
[03:22.360 --> 03:33.720]  We want to teach... and the original idea that laid dormant for a while was that we could bring high school and college kids into a very, very high-tech environment.
[03:33.720 --> 03:38.740]  And start teaching them the basics, and really get them turned on to security.
[03:39.760 --> 03:45.900]  And do... teach them the basics of the real tools in cyber, in physical, and in forensics.
[03:46.980 --> 03:54.780]  And at the end of the day, provide a strategic labor pool of very security-savvy employees.
[03:55.700 --> 03:58.980]  And so that was the original idea.
[03:59.440 --> 04:00.700]  The media covered it.
[04:00.940 --> 04:02.880]  We had some subsequent meetings.
[04:03.180 --> 04:08.000]  Right after that, the 9-11 Commission came out with a scathing analysis of the government.
[04:08.280 --> 04:15.140]  And the reason, at least in part, that 9-11 happened is because it was a total failure of imagination on the part of the government.
[04:15.940 --> 04:18.860]  So, and that was the coverage in USA Today.
[04:22.220 --> 04:28.380]  Basically, the intelligence community, they actually knew 9-11 was coming, but they couldn't believe it.
[04:29.000 --> 04:42.660]  What we do is we think out of the box and analyze threats and figure out, in our world of physical security, how to figure out what the threat is, how to exploit it, and then how to fix it.
[04:42.660 --> 04:54.120]  And so what we're really looking for is really bright, motivated, bored kids that think they might want to go into security.
[04:55.420 --> 04:56.480]  Next slide.
[04:57.520 --> 05:04.980]  So, 2010, we started really looking at the Security Camp concept in earnest.
[05:04.980 --> 05:18.300]  We had meetings with industry and government leaders, two years of analysis of the problem, and really what was going on in America and around the world as far as security camps to make sure it wasn't already being done.
[05:18.740 --> 05:21.100]  We met with several different universities.
[05:21.600 --> 05:30.260]  We met at two different national laboratories, and we met with law enforcement and forensic investigators all over the country.
[05:30.260 --> 05:41.460]  What we came up with is a definition of a security intelligence lab and what we call the SI7 Academy.
[05:43.520 --> 05:56.820]  So, the problem today is that the government feels that we are short by 10,000 to 30,000 security specialists to protect this country.
[05:56.820 --> 05:58.000]  That's a lot.
[05:58.240 --> 06:00.100]  The real question is, where do you get them?
[06:00.560 --> 06:05.820]  Because you can't instantly create a security specialist for either cyber or physical security.
[06:06.100 --> 06:17.900]  I started picking locks when I was 15, and it took me a long time to acquire the expertise and skills to lead the team that I do today.
[06:18.720 --> 06:21.480]  It's not instant, but you have to start somewhere.
[06:22.140 --> 06:31.460]  So, the threat to the United States, as you all are aware, Facebook, for example, 600,000 times a day they're attacked.
[06:32.020 --> 06:36.260]  The Pentagon is repeatedly attacked every day.
[06:38.240 --> 06:39.840]  Everybody's attacked, as you know.
[06:39.840 --> 06:51.280]  The costs of an attack, the median is $3.8 million to infrastructure, to banks, to insurance companies, to critical infrastructure.
[06:52.740 --> 06:59.260]  The last five years, there's been 2,800-plus infrastructure attacks that have been documented.
[06:59.260 --> 07:17.140]  The Chinese have a government program, government policy, to attack our infrastructure, and some of my associates are working investigations involving, for example, the Chinese hacking into law firms that handle intellectual property applications for patents,
[07:17.300 --> 07:23.320]  because it's a lot easier to steal the intellectual property than develop it yourself, and it puts you five years ahead.
[07:23.320 --> 07:41.520]  So, every major company in the United States has got a problem, and what I can really tell you is, security, if you get into it, and obviously that's the goal, is a fascinating endeavor once you understand what's going on.
[07:41.840 --> 07:44.680]  So, obviously, it's a digital world.
[07:45.140 --> 07:46.360]  Everything is digital.
[07:46.560 --> 07:49.940]  Everything is microprocessor-controlled, microprocessor-embedded.
[07:50.040 --> 07:51.260]  So, what's at risk?
[07:51.720 --> 07:52.240]  Everything.
[07:53.320 --> 08:08.200]  So, the other problem is, the FBI, which is the primary investigative jurisdiction under Justice, they, the Inspector General found that they really, really lacked resources in their field offices, because they're inundated.
[08:08.380 --> 08:13.220]  Now, obviously, the Secret Service is also involved, but they're inundated.
[08:13.620 --> 08:20.720]  And, first of all, a lot of attacks aren't even discovered, and there's not enough investigative talent to deal with it.
[08:21.880 --> 08:25.480]  So, there's a lot of government action in this area.
[08:25.820 --> 08:33.120]  The National Security Agency is involved in funding different schools in different education curriculum.
[08:33.520 --> 08:37.000]  The Department of Homeland Security, obviously, is also involved.
[08:37.000 --> 08:42.220]  But, the efforts are essentially uncoordinated.
[08:42.700 --> 08:45.600]  It isn't that they're good efforts, but they're uncoordinated.
[08:46.320 --> 08:58.520]  And although there's a number of schools of excellence around the country, and these are increasing, there's not enough of them, and there's not enough kids coming out of the schools to serve industry and government.
[08:59.360 --> 09:11.020]  So, the current academic solutions, let me let Tommie address that, and talk about that just a little bit, and then where that, where we go from there.
[09:11.260 --> 09:21.340]  Well, many universities are offering degrees in cyber security, as you know, but these courses are diluted by other academic courses.
[09:21.780 --> 09:25.860]  And also, not many kids are entering this field.
[09:26.080 --> 09:28.500]  So, there's really not a special information in the field.
[09:28.500 --> 09:33.640]  It's not an emphasis on physical security, and it's certainly not integrated with cyber security issues.
[09:33.860 --> 09:48.040]  So, actually, what part of what we want to do is to inspire young kids and give them a background, so that they can be motivated to enter these majors in universities.
[09:48.340 --> 10:01.490]  And hopefully, we can get some scholarships for these kids, because right now, the nation is not investing the time and money and attention to this field in order to get kids involved.
[10:02.300 --> 10:06.420]  And right now, what we have is a combination of camps going on.
[10:06.820 --> 10:08.860]  You're familiar, I'm sure, with the U.S.
[10:08.900 --> 10:09.620]  Cyber Challenge.
[10:09.840 --> 10:12.480]  It's made up of three different challenges.
[10:12.480 --> 10:14.720]  All are web-based.
[10:14.860 --> 10:19.780]  There's the Forensics Challenge, the Net Wars, and the Cyber Patriots Defense Challenge.
[10:19.780 --> 10:26.760]  And then what's happening is the government is selecting the best of the best from those challenges.
[10:27.260 --> 10:29.240]  Cyber Siege is a high school program.
[10:29.240 --> 10:30.180]  It's everywhere.
[10:30.200 --> 10:31.700]  It's all over the world.
[10:31.700 --> 10:34.620]  But it is, again, just a web-based program.
[10:34.620 --> 10:37.520]  It's not complete training in any way.
[10:37.660 --> 10:41.600]  So, we feel that we need more than games, and we need more than workshops.
[10:41.600 --> 10:45.520]  A lot of conferences have workshops, like DEFCON, for example.
[10:46.180 --> 10:47.360]  But they're brief.
[10:47.520 --> 10:49.320]  They're usually a few hours or one day.
[10:49.520 --> 10:51.980]  We need more than university classroom courses.
[10:51.980 --> 10:56.300]  We need more than adult certification programs by professional organizations.
[10:56.500 --> 11:00.920]  What we need is an immersive security training academy.
[11:02.020 --> 11:06.360]  So, that's what we're putting together, a very different kind of academy.
[11:06.720 --> 11:08.820]  We want a different kind of trainees.
[11:08.880 --> 11:11.320]  We want the Davids of the world.
[11:11.320 --> 11:13.580]  We want the bright, motivated young people.
[11:13.580 --> 11:19.420]  And we want to use Space Camp, the high-tech model, for this academy.
[11:19.700 --> 11:33.240]  So, what we want to do and what we are planning to do is to build the Quantico of cyber and physical security with real threats, real scenarios, high-tech tools, and simulated environments.
[11:33.500 --> 11:40.900]  So, Tommie, talk about Space Camp because that's where your real professional experience is with lots and lots and lots of kids.
[11:41.460 --> 11:41.920]  Yes.
[11:42.220 --> 11:48.520]  Well, how many of you... I can't see you out there very well, but I know a group of you in the front are familiar with Space Camp.
[11:48.660 --> 11:51.060]  How many have actually attended Space Camp?
[11:52.500 --> 11:54.300]  Oh, I see some hands out there.
[11:54.740 --> 12:04.760]  Well, those of you that have attended and maybe those that you know about Space Camp know that it's from a week to back-to-back programs would be two weeks.
[12:04.760 --> 12:10.860]  And the programs are graduated from the little guys all the way up to 99-year-olds.
[12:11.040 --> 12:12.480]  We have corporate camps.
[12:12.620 --> 12:14.980]  We have teacher camps.
[12:15.100 --> 12:16.620]  We have international camps.
[12:16.740 --> 12:19.100]  And space camps are located all over the world.
[12:19.100 --> 12:20.680]  I don't know if you know that or not.
[12:20.680 --> 12:23.520]  But the mother facility is in Huntsville, Alabama.
[12:23.860 --> 12:32.100]  There are two more facilities in the United States and then one in Canada, Belgium, Japan, and Turkey, Space Camp Turkey.
[12:32.100 --> 12:38.880]  So, these camps succeed because they don't just give you theory.
[12:39.460 --> 12:50.520]  You don't just get to interact with the stars of space exploration, the engineers, the rocket scientists, the astronauts, and so forth.
[12:50.520 --> 12:54.280]  But you are actually in the simulated environment.
[12:54.280 --> 12:58.120]  You are placed inside and immersed in the mission.
[12:58.120 --> 13:01.240]  So, you train in astronaut simulators.
[13:01.460 --> 13:05.580]  You perform the mission just as an astronaut would.
[13:05.980 --> 13:07.580]  It is time elapsed.
[13:07.900 --> 13:14.440]  You feel you are really in the same environment that an astronaut would be in.
[13:14.440 --> 13:36.060]  As a matter of fact, one of the wonderful things I got to do at space camp was when Ron Howard was producing Apollo 13, we got to train Tom Hanks and Ron Howard and Kevin Bacon and the crew for a week because it is the nearest thing that you can get to the real training of an astronaut.
[13:36.460 --> 13:43.060]  But the point is, there is no such thing that exists in the physical and cyber security world.
[13:43.060 --> 13:50.920]  So, we want to take this model, this space camp model, and apply it to the security training.
[13:51.580 --> 13:56.840]  So, from concept to plan, here is what we have been doing the last two years and why we are here today.
[13:57.200 --> 14:01.040]  We assess the need and what is missing for students.
[14:02.240 --> 14:09.480]  We assess what is lacking in present training and how to get young people into a security curriculum.
[14:09.480 --> 14:13.920]  And how to prepare students for careers in security.
[14:14.260 --> 14:16.980]  How to augment what is already in place.
[14:17.520 --> 14:24.660]  Then we had to select a venue which was no small task, establish a legal infrastructure, and obtain funding.
[14:24.660 --> 14:39.200]  So, in June of 2012, after meeting with the national laboratories, several major universities, and commercial facilities, we selected a venue.
[14:40.820 --> 14:49.560]  And we wanted the venue to be one of the national centers of excellence that was established by the National Security Agency.
[14:49.560 --> 14:52.580]  So, we chose from many universities.
[14:53.120 --> 14:55.340]  We were at Oak Ridge National Lab.
[14:55.340 --> 15:00.720]  We were at the University of Washington, which has an extremely good cyber security program.
[15:01.700 --> 15:07.460]  We held a cyber security summit with the city of Huntsville, Alabama.
[15:08.180 --> 15:10.400]  We've been to DEFCON at meetings.
[15:10.620 --> 15:19.700]  We did a Yale Security Summit last September with 60 kids from MIT, Yale, Harvard, and the University of New Haven.
[15:20.520 --> 15:24.260]  We've been to the University of Cambridge in England, University of Rhode Island.
[15:24.900 --> 15:29.360]  We were out in Honolulu meeting with their educational people and police.
[15:29.360 --> 15:34.720]  We were at the HTCIA, the High Tech Investigation Association in Atlanta.
[15:35.000 --> 15:39.540]  And finally, at Dakota State University in Madison, South Dakota.
[15:40.260 --> 15:48.800]  So, we finally chose, not because I live in South Dakota, although, actually, everybody asks me what my address is.
[15:48.820 --> 15:53.500]  It's actually seat 3B on Delta, because I travel so much.
[15:53.500 --> 16:00.880]  Dakota State University was founded in 1881 as a teacher's college.
[16:01.720 --> 16:12.520]  About 30 years ago, the governor of our state, after discovering the Internet, decided that South Dakota should be the most wired state in the world.
[16:13.100 --> 16:18.600]  And so, we actually trained about 200 inmates in our state penitentiary.
[16:18.600 --> 16:27.080]  And they went and wired every single classroom, public and private, in South Dakota with Cat 5, so that we had distance learning and we had Internet.
[16:27.240 --> 16:29.680]  When the Internet caught up with what we did.
[16:30.480 --> 16:33.620]  So, Dakota State is a very small school.
[16:34.500 --> 16:36.540]  It's got about 3,000 students.
[16:36.860 --> 16:39.160]  But they're one of the National Centers of Excellence.
[16:39.160 --> 16:40.600]  It's a safe environment.
[16:41.060 --> 16:49.900]  And they have a really unique program that can stand up to any of the major universities in the country.
[16:50.860 --> 16:53.980]  Why don't you talk a little bit about DSU, and then we'll tell you what we're doing.
[16:54.220 --> 16:59.320]  Well, there's so many qualifications, believe it or not, even though it's a very small university.
[16:59.540 --> 17:07.020]  Of course, you know that it was named by NSA as the National Center of...actually, it's the National Center of Academic Excellence in Cybersecurity.
[17:07.020 --> 17:12.200]  And they offer many kinds of degrees there that you might be surprised about.
[17:12.480 --> 17:15.120]  The BS in computer and network security.
[17:15.200 --> 17:22.780]  Actually, if you get a teaching degree from there, you still have to have a major or minor in technology, which is a good thing.
[17:23.000 --> 17:25.900]  They offer the Masters of Science of Information Assurance.
[17:26.760 --> 17:28.020]  They've written books.
[17:28.020 --> 17:30.040]  They have wonderful faculty members.
[17:30.040 --> 17:38.880]  They have created a conference called DakotaCon that we attended last year that was attended by, I don't know, maybe...
[17:38.880 --> 17:41.200]  Several hundred students from around the area.
[17:41.500 --> 17:45.680]  Not like this, but pretty good for that area, but it's growing.
[17:46.600 --> 17:58.020]  The real relevant issue is they've got the best instructors, and they've got physical facilities, and we're looking at building a very sophisticated physical facility that we'll talk about.
[17:58.020 --> 18:06.300]  And then recently, they've been named one of the four universities in the United States that would offer the cyber ops operations.
[18:06.560 --> 18:18.620]  So they're located with the Naval Postgraduate School in California, Northwestern University, in Massachusetts, the University of Tulsa, and Oklahoma.
[18:18.620 --> 18:20.280]  So it's quite prestigious.
[18:20.840 --> 18:29.380]  Ninety-six percent of their graduates go on to get jobs, and that should be appealing to any student in college right now.
[18:29.680 --> 18:36.940]  They give degrees up to the PhD level, and they have an absolutely superb, outstanding faculty.
[18:37.200 --> 18:44.120]  As a matter of fact, one of their physics professors is world-renowned and is working with us on this project.
[18:44.120 --> 18:45.320]  She was a TED fellow.
[18:45.540 --> 18:47.420]  I don't know if you know what TED is or not.
[18:48.320 --> 18:54.370]  So the plan is to create a Quantico space camp for cyber and physical security.
[18:54.860 --> 19:01.620]  And what you need to understand is all of the boot camps, all of the security camps, nobody's doing physical security.
[19:02.400 --> 19:07.700]  And physical security is built into cyber security at every level.
[19:07.700 --> 19:17.280]  And especially in my world of locks and safes, electronics are integrating into all of the locking systems for all the server rooms, for all the buildings.
[19:17.540 --> 19:22.080]  Pretty soon all the buildings are going to be remotely programmable with their door locks.
[19:22.080 --> 19:25.520]  And so everything is coming together.
[19:26.120 --> 19:29.160]  We can bring the best of both worlds together.
[19:29.160 --> 19:45.600]  We have commitments from major significant instructors, from companies that are global in nature, to bring the real immersive environment to teach students about the basics of security and get them into a curriculum.
[19:46.780 --> 19:59.840]  So the Security Intelligence Lab to deliver a continuum of timely, world-class, immersive education, training, and research in physical and cyber security.
[20:00.020 --> 20:03.020]  And why is really simple to fill the needs today?
[20:04.500 --> 20:07.200]  So we'll do three things actually.
[20:07.200 --> 20:11.420]  We're creating the umbrella called Security Intelligence Lab.
[20:11.420 --> 20:14.780]  And under that umbrella, we'll do three different things.
[20:15.020 --> 20:30.400]  The first, of course, in the dark blue, has to do more with research and information sharing, conferences, talks, workshops, evaluating the field, making recommendations to industry.
[20:30.680 --> 20:42.160]  Actually helping industry by allowing our students to go into industry, take a look at security systems, both cyber and physical security, break them, and perhaps fix them.
[20:42.440 --> 20:45.620]  And the second piece will be the SI7 Academy.
[20:45.980 --> 20:54.940]  And under the academy structure, we'll offer different kinds of academies, from the corporate security professionals all the way down to citizens' protection session.
[20:55.160 --> 20:58.500]  The first that we'll develop will be for high school and college students.
[20:58.700 --> 21:07.720]  And then, of course, we hope to have extensions internationally, satellite campuses, and do product development and publications.
[21:08.060 --> 21:24.160]  And the real trick is our students, once they go through our basic lab, will be able to collaborate on security problems with their colleagues worldwide during the school year to solve problems for clients and corporate sponsors.
[21:24.520 --> 21:32.380]  And one of the things we want to be able to do is to actually help communities become cyber secure.
[21:33.160 --> 21:37.620]  So, of course, we want to start with Madison, South Dakota, which is a small community.
[21:37.620 --> 21:41.040]  And if we can succeed there, then we can scale up.
[21:41.940 --> 21:44.380]  Okay, so who's involved in this project?
[21:44.660 --> 21:53.220]  We've been meeting with the most distinguished experts in cyber and physical security and forensics, that is, forensic investigations.
[21:53.220 --> 22:02.260]  And these are the folks in physical security, in physics, in cyber, that are going to be involved.
[22:02.460 --> 22:05.680]  There would be the best of the best that you would be exposed to.
[22:06.900 --> 22:07.460]  Okay.
[22:07.720 --> 22:16.620]  So, again, we're talking about an immersive training academy, advanced tools, the best tools, and high-tech techniques and a vigorous curriculum.
[22:16.620 --> 22:20.940]  And it would be delivered in a challenging, high-tech environment.
[22:20.940 --> 22:37.500]  And the environment that we're looking at designing is like Space Camp with scenario-driven coursework, with gaming, with competition, with lectures, and collaboration with students and sponsors.
[22:37.900 --> 22:45.700]  Basically, we want to teach everybody the basics and then how to think very alternatively about solving problems.
[22:45.700 --> 22:49.980]  And, Tommie, talk really briefly about what would be some of the areas in the camp.
[22:50.120 --> 22:50.360]  Okay.
[22:50.380 --> 22:53.600]  This is an example of the kind of thing that we'll have.
[22:53.760 --> 22:57.440]  We're calling it a technology vision village.
[22:58.000 --> 23:05.940]  It'll have things from the tavern to the skiff landing from Cyber Tool Street, where you can purchase your tools.
[23:06.120 --> 23:08.340]  We'll have robotics or gaming.
[23:09.680 --> 23:13.880]  We'll create some 3-D environments like magic inside the keyboard.
[23:15.160 --> 23:17.720]  We'll have...we're calling this a Tobias Alley.
[23:17.780 --> 23:20.360]  Do you know what the Huggins Alley is in FBI training?
[23:20.360 --> 23:23.860]  Is anybody familiar with Quantico at the FBI Academy?
[23:24.520 --> 23:31.020]  It's a real-life city that they've built to train agents in different real-life scenarios.
[23:31.500 --> 23:33.720]  Walking down the street, is it a bank robber?
[23:33.740 --> 23:34.380]  Is it a victim?
[23:34.560 --> 23:35.320]  Is it a hostage?
[23:35.680 --> 23:36.420]  Do you shoot?
[23:36.540 --> 23:37.260]  Do you not shoot?
[23:37.380 --> 23:37.860]  What do you do?
[23:37.860 --> 23:40.940]  We're going to do the same thing in physical and cyber security.
[23:43.820 --> 23:50.940]  So, basically, we're going to combine all of these different disciplines, cyber, identity theft, locks and safes.
[23:52.240 --> 23:56.160]  So, what we're talking about is very technology-wise young people.
[23:56.160 --> 24:02.480]  And the criteria to get in will essentially be imagination, intelligence and determination and talent.
[24:04.120 --> 24:11.020]  And to develop usable security skills and ultimately become a high-sought-after security professional.
[24:11.220 --> 24:12.520]  Here's the bottom line.
[24:12.740 --> 24:16.280]  Security means employment and employment means job security.
[24:16.840 --> 24:19.980]  And in this economy, everybody's going to be looking for that.
[24:19.980 --> 24:22.140]  Facts about the academy.
[24:22.860 --> 24:29.580]  We'll use the next generation technology held in an extraordinarily futuristic immersive environment.
[24:29.860 --> 24:32.660]  And the location is a safe location.
[24:33.760 --> 24:39.100]  And this is what we're looking at building as far as the environment.
[24:39.600 --> 24:52.700]  And believe it or not, because we're an agricultural state, what we're looking at is a really, really high-tech geodetic dome in the middle of a cornfield, which is next to the campus.
[24:53.200 --> 24:54.140]  Everybody laughs.
[24:54.780 --> 24:57.880]  The thing about South Dakota is there's no bureaucracy.
[24:58.580 --> 25:00.040]  And it's safe.
[25:00.160 --> 25:00.880]  There's recreation.
[25:01.180 --> 25:04.260]  But the best thing is we've got classrooms.
[25:04.380 --> 25:16.120]  We're looking at building this facility in a dome shape that would be very, very futuristic, that would hold all the labs, the classrooms, all the environment for learning these critical tools.
[25:16.960 --> 25:18.500]  So what do we need from you?
[25:18.600 --> 25:19.420]  Why are we here today?
[25:19.480 --> 25:23.100]  We'd like your input just like eight years ago when we started this.
[25:23.380 --> 25:25.600]  Input and feedback, creative support.
[25:26.140 --> 25:31.380]  If you take our email address, if you have any input, we'd really, really appreciate it.
[25:32.320 --> 25:33.680]  We want your ideas.
[25:33.680 --> 25:40.380]  And David, as a high school kid, would you come to this academy and why?
[25:41.140 --> 25:43.000]  I would 100% go to this academy.
[25:43.460 --> 26:01.760]  I feel it's a need for people to start, because we're being brought up in the digital age, and for kids my age and younger and even a little bit older, I think it's a necessary need for people to be introduced to this new form of security, this new form of intelligence that's kind of lacking in a modern-day society.
[26:01.760 --> 26:09.860]  I know a lot of people who just randomly get spyware and malware on their computers from doing random crap.
[26:10.420 --> 26:25.300]  And I think it takes a lot of understanding, but yet more of being introduced into the idea that, oh, there's so much more than just clicking on a link or opening a door with a key.
[26:25.300 --> 26:33.480]  I think people have to know the vulnerabilities in things to know how to fix them and to have a more open view and stuff.
[26:33.680 --> 26:52.280]  So we would solicit, if you turn off the lights, we would really solicit, because this is why we came into New York this time, we would solicit questions, ideas, suggestions, criticism from you guys, because you're who we would be doing this for.
[26:52.480 --> 27:00.500]  The university, the state of South Dakota, everybody is really, really intrigued about this and want to make it work.
[27:00.500 --> 27:07.120]  And so now we're talking to funding sources, both government and private, and to corporate sponsors.
[27:07.500 --> 27:11.140]  And everybody's involved in this program now.
[27:11.240 --> 27:12.800]  It took a long time to get here.
[27:14.280 --> 27:23.680]  The reason we went to Yale last September was to determine whether the location really matters.
[27:23.680 --> 27:32.160]  And what we came away with 60 kids in a three-day intensive weekend was it doesn't matter if you have the content.
[27:32.840 --> 27:41.280]  And frankly, it's a lot easier to go to a small city, by the way, with a great lake, two miles from the campus.
[27:41.840 --> 27:46.300]  But the real trick is to learn really intriguing stuff.
[27:46.740 --> 27:48.660]  So I think there's microphones.
[27:48.660 --> 27:54.280]  We'd really like to hear from you guys as far as questions, input, suggestions.
[27:59.310 --> 27:59.890]  Yes, sir.
[28:00.610 --> 28:01.010]  Hi.
[28:01.490 --> 28:03.410]  Actually, I'm kind of an interesting case.
[28:03.950 --> 28:08.370]  This next upcoming year will be both my senior year in high school and my sophomore year at college.
[28:08.530 --> 28:09.110]  Oh, that's cool.
[28:10.330 --> 28:11.970]  First off, I think this is a brilliant idea.
[28:12.290 --> 28:13.770]  I actually live in Rapid City.
[28:13.970 --> 28:14.470]  Oh, really?
[28:14.810 --> 28:15.470]  So this is kind of interesting.
[28:15.550 --> 28:17.590]  I'd love to work on you extensively with this.
[28:17.750 --> 28:18.850]  I might give you my contact information.
[28:18.890 --> 28:20.690]  I've got my cards up here when we're done.
[28:20.690 --> 28:21.910]  If you guys, please.
[28:22.210 --> 28:25.690]  And my website is security.org.
[28:25.830 --> 28:26.930]  Really easy to remember.
[28:28.870 --> 28:30.810]  Everybody asks, how did you get that?
[28:31.490 --> 28:32.930]  It's called 1995.
[28:34.930 --> 28:46.490]  I was sitting in England with some colleagues at a government covert entry gathering, and I said, you know, it's about time to get a website.
[28:46.490 --> 28:50.210]  Believe it or not, three weeks before, security.com had been taken.
[28:51.110 --> 28:54.830]  And so we grabbed security.org, and the rest is history.
[28:54.830 --> 28:58.190]  Maybe some of you know me from the lockpicking world.
[28:59.270 --> 29:01.510]  But we're really intrigued about this.
[29:01.570 --> 29:04.690]  This took a long time to get to where we're at.
[29:04.690 --> 29:11.010]  And the national labs are essentially on board telling us, you know, we'll help you.
[29:11.430 --> 29:13.470]  And so we want input.
[29:14.530 --> 29:15.170]  All right.
[29:15.270 --> 29:29.270]  So anyways, my question behind this was, are you looking more at a program to actually cultivate interest where there is none, or more to actually take the pre-existing interest, those who, you know, as you've stated before, are already bright, interested,
[29:29.430 --> 29:34.010]  motivated kids, and actually harness them and focus their energy?
[29:34.010 --> 29:37.930]  Or are you looking to actually cultivate where I would see apathy in a lot of schools?
[29:37.930 --> 29:40.070]  Are you looking to cultivate that into interest?
[29:40.270 --> 29:40.670]  Both.
[29:41.510 --> 29:42.870]  Both are goals.
[29:44.030 --> 29:46.190]  Because, look, America's at risk.
[29:46.610 --> 29:54.870]  As you guys all know, where are we going to get the experts to protect the infrastructure, government, and commerce?
[29:55.210 --> 29:56.090]  Where do you get them?
[29:56.770 --> 29:58.430]  You have to get them through schools.
[29:58.990 --> 30:01.730]  And we've got to get kids into these curriculums.
[30:01.910 --> 30:03.210]  Security is fascinating.
[30:03.210 --> 30:06.090]  Now, I solve puzzles for a living.
[30:06.490 --> 30:09.070]  My background is law enforcement and a lawyer.
[30:09.390 --> 30:13.590]  But I do physical security and fraud investigations around the world.
[30:14.130 --> 30:16.690]  But most of my work is physical security.
[30:16.950 --> 30:21.930]  We take things that cannot be broken, and we break them.
[30:21.930 --> 30:25.190]  And sometimes we break them in 10, 20, 30 seconds.
[30:26.370 --> 30:33.270]  That these companies that we work for spent millions and millions of dollars to develop, and they don't get it.
[30:33.410 --> 30:36.550]  They're starting to get it because they're so embarrassed sometimes.
[30:36.850 --> 30:41.510]  But the bottom line is to make things more secure, and both of your points are valid.
[30:41.850 --> 30:45.130]  We need to intrigue kids, and we need to get them into a curriculum.
[30:45.130 --> 30:47.110]  Can I answer that just a little bit, too?
[30:48.430 --> 30:55.630]  I think apathy can be helped by education, just education.
[30:56.010 --> 30:58.130]  But interest really can't.
[30:59.070 --> 31:07.710]  So the students that have absolutely no interest in this field, I think our program probably is not going to turn them on.
[31:08.590 --> 31:22.130]  But apathy, yes, we can educate them to what the problem is and how the situation about our infrastructure, critical infrastructure for the United States, and what is in the news every day, practically anyway.
[31:22.490 --> 31:39.530]  But as far as training kids to go into companies and work with corporations or get more education and more training at the university or higher level, we really need the technology-wise student that has an interest in this.
[31:39.590 --> 31:40.830]  Yeah, so the question is...
[31:40.830 --> 31:41.170]  And some training.
[31:41.310 --> 31:41.950]  How do you do it?
[31:43.050 --> 31:49.850]  And because of Tommie's experience with Space Camp, the way to do it, we think, is a really immersive environment.
[31:49.850 --> 31:54.110]  So you're living security 24 hours a day and really solving problems.
[31:54.210 --> 31:55.010]  Because that's the trick.
[31:55.230 --> 31:56.890]  And building your world and then...
[31:56.890 --> 31:58.310]  And then trying to wreck it.
[31:58.870 --> 31:58.970]  And then trying to wreck it.
[31:58.970 --> 32:02.230]  And then wrecking it, which is what we do at Space Camp.
[32:02.230 --> 32:06.850]  We throw anomalies at you and make your mission go wrong and you get stranded in space.
[32:06.990 --> 32:08.490]  And you have to figure out how to get back.
[32:08.730 --> 32:10.650]  And the trouble is some of the kids don't want to come back.
[32:11.350 --> 32:12.090]  That's right.
[32:12.750 --> 32:14.070]  Did that answer your question?
[32:14.290 --> 32:14.790]  That it does.
[32:14.850 --> 32:27.130]  One more thing about that is it's going to be very useful to us to know the winners of these big contests, these Internet web-based contests like CyberSiege, for example.
[32:27.130 --> 32:39.730]  It's going to be useful to us to get the kids that have gone to DEFCON, the kids that have won their awards at DEFCON, or the kids that have gone to boot camps.
[32:39.750 --> 32:46.430]  For example, DSU has a boot camp especially for high school students, or DakotaCon.
[32:46.590 --> 32:50.210]  And those are the kids that I think would be interested in coming to this academy.
[32:50.210 --> 32:53.670]  But we're going to screen them extensively.
[32:54.150 --> 32:56.310]  We'll do psychological evaluations.
[32:56.930 --> 32:58.630]  We'll do other kinds of screening.
[32:58.850 --> 33:00.770]  Not just anybody is going to get to come.
[33:00.890 --> 33:03.210]  Because that's going to be a question from one of you.
[33:03.670 --> 33:11.430]  How do you decide who is going to do white hat hacking and be ethical in doing this?
[33:11.810 --> 33:12.690]  Next question.
[33:14.870 --> 33:17.330]  So you kind of led into my question unintentionally.
[33:17.350 --> 33:18.550]  I'm going to start with a confession.
[33:18.550 --> 33:20.710]  I picked my first lock at space camp.
[33:21.070 --> 33:22.570]  Good for you.
[33:23.290 --> 33:24.810]  So you were a success.
[33:28.090 --> 33:28.830]  That's good.
[33:29.430 --> 33:37.390]  Well, and it leads into what I guess we now call the white hat, black hat, gray hat, lots of hats discussion of...
[33:37.970 --> 33:41.510]  I was one of those youngsters that did things like that.
[33:41.510 --> 33:56.910]  And I was very, very lucky that my parents and my father, who's actually here with me, even though he's out of the field now, they redirected me from these pursuits that were less than good at that age to using them for good things.
[33:56.910 --> 34:00.210]  To using them, or at least in ways that didn't get me in trouble.
[34:00.550 --> 34:02.690]  Now this was also 15, 20 years ago.
[34:02.870 --> 34:23.930]  And nowadays we see, with all of the words you used to describe the risks to this country of cyber attacks, I mean, how do we encourage these kids in a way that kind of balances, I don't want to say balances, but encourages them despite all of these things they hear.
[34:23.930 --> 34:36.250]  And works to protect them from that environment where what you guys are looking for is to accentuate those skills that they probably develop independently and can get them into trouble nowadays.
[34:36.530 --> 34:42.250]  And how do you accentuate those and protect them as you guys try and grow those skills into something that is to be used for good?
[34:42.590 --> 34:43.030]  Well...
[34:43.030 --> 34:44.190]  Let me just say one thing.
[34:44.410 --> 34:53.910]  I was out in Honolulu last April meeting with a retired Honolulu PD detective who has led the development of the K-12 program.
[34:53.910 --> 34:58.550]  in Honolulu for the Hawaiian school system on exactly what you're talking about.
[34:58.890 --> 34:59.070]  It's called Safe Online.
[34:59.070 --> 35:10.670]  It's called Safe Online to teach these kids to be safe on the Internet and the legal issues because you can really get into trouble easily and not think you're breaking federal laws.
[35:11.170 --> 35:16.390]  And let me just say, if we had had computers when I was in high school, I'd still be in prison.
[35:18.170 --> 35:27.570]  And it's really true because I started picking locks when I was 15 and figuring out how to make penny phone calls and teaching cops how to use pennies in the nickel slot on the payphone.
[35:28.110 --> 35:30.730]  And, you know, and graduated from there.
[35:30.870 --> 35:32.930]  And I really am lucky I didn't get into trouble.
[35:33.090 --> 35:35.350]  But, you know, I ended up going into law enforcement.
[35:35.710 --> 35:39.030]  But it's a really, really good question and a big problem.
[35:39.030 --> 35:39.450]  It is.
[35:39.570 --> 35:49.010]  And actually, what we're finding is that, you know, most black hat hackers are bottom dwellers.
[35:49.190 --> 35:52.230]  You know, there is no future in that.
[35:52.470 --> 35:58.310]  There's really no future in stay in a dark closet somewhere and doing this just because you can.
[35:58.310 --> 36:01.310]  So, what we're offering is something...
[36:02.290 --> 36:02.710]  An outlet.
[36:03.210 --> 36:03.590]  Right.
[36:04.310 --> 36:04.810]  An outlet.
[36:05.530 --> 36:06.250]  Go ahead.
[36:06.470 --> 36:13.890]  Well, actually, as I've been brought up into this world of physical security and cyber security.
[36:14.070 --> 36:16.350]  And I've gotten myself into some pretty sticky situations.
[36:16.550 --> 36:18.510]  I actually put my school into lockdown a couple of times.
[36:20.130 --> 36:20.650]  Yeah.
[36:20.950 --> 36:22.890]  Directory with all the printers and propaganda.
[36:24.790 --> 36:27.030]  Anyways, I think it comes with knowledge.
[36:27.030 --> 36:30.870]  And I think me being redirected by my dad.
[36:30.970 --> 36:33.210]  My dad's a hardware security expert.
[36:33.370 --> 36:37.810]  And he actually did telecommunications in the Marine Corps.
[36:38.690 --> 36:42.950]  And it had my dad directing me from, okay, you did this.
[36:43.050 --> 36:43.530]  This is good.
[36:43.770 --> 36:46.550]  Let's see how we can fix it so this doesn't happen again.
[36:46.770 --> 36:48.350]  And somebody else doesn't do this.
[36:48.490 --> 36:51.930]  And that really, really sparked my interest in this whole security world.
[36:52.490 --> 36:52.870]  And...
[36:52.870 --> 36:54.190]  So, just to clarify...
[36:54.190 --> 36:54.890]  I'm sorry, I'm going to let him go.
[36:54.890 --> 36:57.270]  But just to clarify, I guess my concern isn't so much...
[36:57.270 --> 36:58.310]  Your dad...
[36:58.310 --> 36:59.830]  I mean, I think we all have these people in our lives.
[37:00.350 --> 37:00.710]  It's...
[37:00.710 --> 37:01.070]  What would...
[37:01.070 --> 37:02.250]  So, you put your school into lockdown.
[37:02.430 --> 37:04.070]  What was the administrator's reaction?
[37:04.110 --> 37:05.110]  And how do you...
[37:05.110 --> 37:18.310]  How do we, as a group of people that are trying to make this model work, educate the people who encounter these kids and how to redirect them to you guys as opposed to yelling at them?
[37:18.310 --> 37:19.530]  Well, just like...
[37:19.530 --> 37:19.650]  Or arresting them.
[37:19.690 --> 37:20.390]  Just like a kid...
[37:20.390 --> 37:21.230]  Or arresting them, yeah.
[37:21.490 --> 37:27.090]  Just like a little kid who spills water on his brother and his parents yell at him, he's striving for the attention.
[37:27.330 --> 37:34.350]  It's the same way that I believe that me and a lot of other kids who started becoming black hats, if you want to call it that.
[37:34.510 --> 37:35.670]  They strive for the attention.
[37:35.810 --> 37:38.130]  Oh, the principal said I did something bad.
[37:38.250 --> 37:39.230]  They don't know what I'm doing.
[37:39.510 --> 37:40.450]  I can do it again.
[37:40.450 --> 37:44.530]  It has to turn from that into, okay, you did this.
[37:44.630 --> 37:45.290]  This is bad.
[37:45.550 --> 37:46.690]  I don't want this to happen again.
[37:46.750 --> 37:47.930]  You're smart enough to do it.
[37:48.530 --> 37:50.850]  Can you help me make it so somebody else can't do it?
[37:50.950 --> 37:53.250]  And the incentive for doing it the right way.
[37:53.410 --> 37:55.230]  There has to be a carrot out there.
[37:55.310 --> 38:10.150]  I was astonished to learn a couple of weeks ago that some of the consultants in this field who come in and teach about cybersecurity, and they are the best of the best, charge $5,000 a day.
[38:11.390 --> 38:14.130]  Well, that's a big incentive to do it the right way.
[38:15.150 --> 38:20.630]  It's a big incentive to know that you have a job when you get out that's legitimate, that you will always have a job.
[38:20.750 --> 38:26.590]  It's not a big incentive to know that you could possibly go to prison because you're doing this just because you can.
[38:27.290 --> 38:28.030]  Next question.
[38:28.310 --> 38:31.750]  All right, so I am from Towson University.
[38:31.990 --> 38:36.590]  Well, I'm an alumnus now, but at the time I was going through their cybersecurity program.
[38:36.590 --> 38:54.190]  And so one of the things that we would find, particularly within our security team, and we would go out and do these competitions, DC3, CCDC, you name it, was at the beginning of the year we send out our email and stuff and we'll have, you know, a packed auditorium of people who are interested.
[38:54.190 --> 38:59.050]  Maybe because they saw hackers when they were growing up or, you know, swordfish and stuff like that.
[38:59.050 --> 39:02.690]  And it's a lot of Hollywood-esque stuff, not really the, you know, hands on the keyboard stuff.
[39:03.210 --> 39:14.350]  What we found is that after three weeks there's a high drop-off rate of, okay, once they actually know what the field involves and the work that you have to put into it, you know, they kind of tend to lose interest.
[39:15.530 --> 39:18.630]  That was the case and the problem we had for several years.
[39:18.670 --> 39:26.070]  What we've kind of done to alleviate that is we make it a bit more immersive, kind of like what you're trying to do here.
[39:26.070 --> 39:33.550]  So I don't know if you've implemented something similar where what we do is we'll have the general talks on, you know, what are the future possibilities you can do.
[39:33.650 --> 39:37.550]  You can go into different security roles, whether it's private sector, public sector.
[39:37.790 --> 39:47.170]  What we have them do is we do sessions where they're small group sessions so it's more time between whoever is, I guess, tutoring-ish to the people.
[39:47.310 --> 39:50.410]  But what we do is we do a comprehensive exam, you know.
[39:50.410 --> 39:53.710]  It's nothing like too long, you know.
[39:53.810 --> 39:57.690]  It only takes about a half hour of where your strengths are, where your weaknesses lie.
[39:57.790 --> 40:02.710]  Not just on a technical standpoint, but on a conceptual level and on an abstract thought level.
[40:03.530 --> 40:07.810]  To see if you can kind of get you in the mindset of solving, you know, problems.
[40:09.370 --> 40:23.670]  Because what we found is that by engaging them in shorter groups and by giving them kind of an evaluation first, we can better direct how we put them in our program and who we can, you know, buddy them up with and partner them.
[40:23.770 --> 40:26.170]  So I was wondering maybe if you guys have thought of implementing that.
[40:26.270 --> 40:26.910]  Yeah, we have.
[40:27.070 --> 40:31.010]  Let's take the physical security side because that's my real expertise.
[40:32.010 --> 40:37.270]  One of the areas that I call would be the Apollo 13 room, okay.
[40:37.830 --> 40:53.030]  If we give you, let's say we give you a buffet of ten different physical security problems to solve involving real products, real locks, real doors, real server rooms, whatever.
[40:53.330 --> 40:56.910]  And we tell you these are the tools that we're going to give you.
[40:57.050 --> 40:58.690]  You figure out what to do with them.
[40:58.690 --> 41:02.850]  You figure out the solution to get through the door, okay.
[41:03.210 --> 41:09.090]  And then we want an analysis of how this lock is designed or this mechanism, this system.
[41:09.710 --> 41:10.770]  What's wrong with it?
[41:10.870 --> 41:11.850]  How do you defeat it?
[41:11.950 --> 41:12.770]  How do you fix it?
[41:13.330 --> 41:18.130]  And let's say we have ten kids in a squad to do that for a day, two days, whatever.
[41:18.370 --> 41:19.130]  And then they report.
[41:19.290 --> 41:21.530]  And everybody's got these similar problems to solve.
[41:21.550 --> 41:23.430]  And they choose what problems they solve.
[41:23.550 --> 41:25.210]  Let's say they're magnetics based.
[41:25.370 --> 41:26.870]  Let's say they're physics based.
[41:26.870 --> 41:29.390]  Newton's third law of motion based, whatever.
[41:29.690 --> 41:32.350]  So we're constantly challenging you.
[41:32.490 --> 41:34.870]  And that's one of the models that we're looking at.
[41:34.870 --> 41:38.930]  So you really, really get into this to come up with a solution.
[41:39.190 --> 41:49.590]  What I really believe from dealing with a lot of kids, if you take really bright kids and you put them together and you give them a problem, they'll solve it.
[41:50.110 --> 41:52.090]  If there's a solution, they'll solve it.
[41:52.210 --> 41:54.330]  And they'll spend 24 hours to do it.
[41:55.070 --> 41:57.450]  You know, forget the venue.
[41:58.110 --> 42:01.990]  You know, everybody said, because we had an offer from the state of Florida.
[42:02.230 --> 42:08.030]  Why don't you come to Orlando, you know, where Disney World is and Universal Studios?
[42:08.030 --> 42:08.630]  Who cares?
[42:08.630 --> 42:08.710]  Who cares?
[42:09.350 --> 42:13.410]  The kids aren't going to these kind of venues for a vacation.
[42:14.110 --> 42:17.670]  They're going to really, really be intrigued and have their minds challenged.
[42:17.890 --> 42:19.690]  And that's what we think this is all about.
[42:21.030 --> 42:21.490]  Yep.
[42:22.490 --> 42:23.670]  Any more questions?
[42:24.070 --> 42:24.670]  Please.
[42:25.410 --> 42:25.850]  Yep.
[42:26.930 --> 42:28.170]  I grew up poor.
[42:28.390 --> 42:33.830]  And I started hacking in the beginning mostly because I couldn't afford long distance phone calls.
[42:34.030 --> 42:34.910]  Yeah, so did I.
[42:35.190 --> 42:35.610]  Yeah.
[42:36.650 --> 42:45.990]  But the reason that I'm pointing that out is all of the intensive things I've managed to go to throughout my life were all scholarship based or free.
[42:45.990 --> 42:51.990]  I couldn't afford space camp even though my uncle worked for NASA and I really at one point wanted to be an astronaut.
[42:53.890 --> 42:56.930]  So I do think the intensive programs are very valuable.
[42:57.270 --> 43:03.690]  But I just want to encourage you as someone who's also, I set up a program now for robotics and programming education for kids.
[43:04.630 --> 43:09.030]  Just to try to reach out to the poor kids and the ones who can't afford it.
[43:09.030 --> 43:16.370]  And even maybe have a grassroots program at, like you said, at the high school level involving teachers.
[43:16.370 --> 43:19.290]  And then maybe make your thing like the national championships.
[43:19.850 --> 43:26.810]  So that way more of a grassroots, more of a poor basis can get involved.
[43:27.050 --> 43:33.590]  Because, you know, essentially if you're talking about space and maybe things have changed, I don't know.
[43:33.670 --> 43:35.950]  I hadn't looked into it since I was a kid and wanted to do it.
[43:35.950 --> 43:37.910]  But there was nothing in between.
[43:37.910 --> 43:41.410]  There was space camp or there was looking at posters.
[43:41.890 --> 43:55.870]  And so, you know, as someone who did grow up poor, I would just encourage you, like, you know, all of the things that I did that could have got me in trouble perhaps like you, I did because pretty much I couldn't afford it.
[43:56.130 --> 43:58.110]  You know, my dad was blue collar.
[43:58.230 --> 43:59.670]  My mom took care of the family.
[43:59.670 --> 44:09.490]  And so I just encourage you that when you're looking at your program, a lot of us who may have, who may be black hats, you know, or a lot of it are doing it.
[44:09.590 --> 44:11.630]  Not necessarily just because we can't afford it.
[44:11.650 --> 44:12.590]  I'm also ex-military.
[44:13.190 --> 44:15.970]  You know, and the military is usually a way to get out of there.
[44:16.250 --> 44:19.830]  You know, and so you have a lot of kids who are probably doing things.
[44:20.890 --> 44:22.170]  Sometimes they're feeding their families.
[44:22.690 --> 44:27.870]  You know, so I just want you to keep in mind that all, you know, people who are black hats sometimes do it for a reason.
[44:27.870 --> 44:42.510]  Well, not only are we covering that, the model is to have some scholarships, not only for kids that can't afford to come, but for some disabled vets who are perfect for security.
[44:43.090 --> 44:44.490]  Absolutely perfect.
[44:44.910 --> 44:51.050]  And because, frankly, arms and legs don't matter when you're doing security work.
[44:51.150 --> 44:52.070]  It's what's in your head.
[44:53.050 --> 45:00.350]  And, you know, we're looking at, you know, obviously wealthy parents are going to afford this, but they can subsidize the kids that can't afford it.
[45:00.470 --> 45:01.590]  It's already in the mix.
[45:01.850 --> 45:03.790]  We've already extensively talked about this.
[45:03.890 --> 45:12.870]  And as far as space camp is concerned, that was always top of mind with us because we wanted every kid to be able to come.
[45:12.870 --> 45:19.790]  And what we ended up doing, we had a big scholarship program that was corporately funded, but it was not free.
[45:20.110 --> 45:21.510]  You couldn't come free.
[45:21.730 --> 45:24.070]  You had to have an investment in it.
[45:24.090 --> 45:34.710]  If you had to wash cars for the summer and pay for a fourth of your tuition, because if you have an investment in something, it means more to you.
[45:34.810 --> 45:36.350]  But we did have a big scholarship.
[45:36.350 --> 45:41.170]  Yeah, as a matter of fact, I think Chelsea Clinton was on scholarship because her dad couldn't afford to send her.
[45:42.710 --> 45:43.490]  Next question.
[45:43.710 --> 45:48.550]  By the way, my original handle on the Internet in 1995 was multi-freak.
[45:49.590 --> 45:51.250]  So if that tells you anything.
[45:51.510 --> 45:51.690]  Cool.
[45:51.770 --> 45:52.570]  So I'm officially sold.
[45:52.670 --> 45:54.450]  I love the idea, the whole immersive thing.
[45:54.670 --> 45:55.310]  It's fantastic.
[45:55.870 --> 45:56.610]  You know, this is great.
[45:56.870 --> 45:58.590]  So now you have a call for ideas.
[45:58.830 --> 46:00.890]  Can we maybe focus that call a little bit perhaps?
[46:00.890 --> 46:07.090]  You know, as an entrepreneur, bootstrapping my second business, what's going to take to get us out of this analysis paralysis?
[46:07.330 --> 46:08.210]  Eight years in development?
[46:08.390 --> 46:10.410]  Like, why isn't construction starting now?
[46:10.570 --> 46:11.510]  Like, what are some of the holdups?
[46:11.610 --> 46:12.590]  Can you maybe focus that a little bit?
[46:12.590 --> 46:17.470]  Yeah, it's really simple because there's been a critical lack of funding, lack of interest.
[46:17.970 --> 46:26.350]  When I talked to my buddy who was head of security at one of the national labs, he had proposed this in 2006 with DOE and DHS.
[46:26.350 --> 46:31.990]  And as he said, they both said it was a stupid idea, which as he looked at me and said, that means it's a good idea.
[46:32.390 --> 46:33.450]  That was before its time.
[46:33.570 --> 46:34.730]  That was before its time.
[46:34.930 --> 46:38.970]  So we really started putting this together and having meetings in 2010.
[46:39.370 --> 46:44.610]  And now we have an agreement with a major computer university and we're moving ahead.
[46:45.250 --> 46:47.250]  If you've got haters, you know you've got something good there.
[46:47.410 --> 46:48.770]  No, no, absolutely.
[46:49.430 --> 46:49.790]  For sure.
[46:50.210 --> 46:52.510]  So we've got great plans for like the dome, the very physical aspect.
[46:52.510 --> 46:53.190]  We're working on it.
[46:53.250 --> 46:54.250]  We're working on funding now.
[46:54.570 --> 46:54.930]  Funding.
[46:55.410 --> 46:56.450]  We're at the funding stage.
[46:56.470 --> 46:56.670]  No, no.
[46:56.690 --> 46:57.290]  You have to have funding.
[46:57.510 --> 47:04.410]  So now we've had major meetings and now we're meeting with corporate sponsors and some government folks.
[47:04.430 --> 47:05.890]  And so now we're going to put it together.
[47:06.070 --> 47:08.650]  Well, actually, we just chose the venue last month.
[47:08.790 --> 47:08.970]  Yeah.
[47:09.150 --> 47:10.230]  We had to have a venue.
[47:10.250 --> 47:19.850]  As a matter of fact, we have the governor's office all the way to the president of the university, the board of regents for the university.
[47:20.010 --> 47:20.690]  Everybody's involved.
[47:21.050 --> 47:21.770]  Everybody's involved.
[47:21.770 --> 47:24.770]  We could not do anything until we had a venue.
[47:25.450 --> 47:27.270]  Next question, because we're going to run out of time here.
[47:27.730 --> 47:28.090]  Thank you.
[47:31.210 --> 47:31.630]  Hi.
[47:31.970 --> 47:36.070]  I've done security-related training of various kinds for about five years.
[47:36.070 --> 47:49.990]  And I'm curious as to whether you are looking at, as part of this project, finding out a way to export some of this really rarefied knowledge that you're trying to cultivate in a select group out to everyone else.
[47:49.990 --> 48:07.090]  Because it seems to me that, in my experiences and then in the news, very often the problem is not that we don't have, you know, a really elite core of security professionals, but rather that everyone increasingly is in a position to influence our overall security infrastructure.
[48:07.090 --> 48:16.790]  And there can be a weak link somewhere, like some employee who happens to take a laptop home that happens to be unencrypted, that ruins everything, even in an environment where there are really good security practices.
[48:17.030 --> 48:17.830]  Distance learning.
[48:19.330 --> 48:22.210]  It's already built into the program at DSU.
[48:22.210 --> 48:25.830]  And we would obviously make it available.
[48:27.070 --> 48:29.250]  Probably last question, because we're going to run out of time here.
[48:29.910 --> 48:30.870]  Any more questions?
[48:32.110 --> 48:33.570]  Actually, I'm going to self-identify.
[48:33.670 --> 48:37.050]  I'm a graduate student in the cybersecurity program at NYU Poly.
[48:37.350 --> 48:42.810]  And I actually just recently attended the USCC camp that was held the last week of June at Virginia Tech.
[48:42.810 --> 48:51.890]  My comment actually is more towards, you know, the demographics of the room here as well as at USCC camp, I was the only woman in attendance.
[48:52.830 --> 49:00.750]  The thing that I find interesting is that we're doing this based on high school and college.
[49:01.150 --> 49:07.210]  What I'm finding is that young girls self-select long before they get to high school.
[49:07.210 --> 49:18.770]  And so what's the incubator process to actually start at the educational elementary level to actually start thinking that this is really cool?
[49:18.970 --> 49:20.130]  And I'll just give you an example.
[49:20.390 --> 49:22.450]  One of my work colleagues has a five-year-old daughter.
[49:22.650 --> 49:25.230]  Just enrolled her in robotics camp for the summer.
[49:25.390 --> 49:27.310]  She showed up for robotics camp.
[49:27.430 --> 49:29.210]  She was the only young lady that was there.
[49:29.210 --> 49:39.450]  So, I mean, we're talking about making this a progress, but we're kind of not doing anything to seduce 50% of the population.
[49:39.650 --> 49:41.310]  That is a great point.
[49:41.310 --> 49:41.550]  That's a great point.
[49:41.710 --> 49:42.130]  It really is.
[49:42.130 --> 49:43.530]  Send us an email so we can talk.
[49:43.730 --> 49:46.350]  And I'll make one follow-up with that.
[49:46.550 --> 49:51.550]  We found in science that young girls self-selected by the fifth grade.
[49:52.150 --> 49:56.330]  And if they got turned off in the fourth and fifth grade, you didn't get them back.
[49:56.750 --> 49:58.590]  Any last comments?
[49:59.170 --> 50:00.490]  Before they throw us out here.
[50:00.710 --> 50:00.850]  Yes, sir.
[50:01.670 --> 50:07.090]  To exact that point, the fact that we are not starting early enough.
[50:07.350 --> 50:08.030]  You're right.
[50:08.310 --> 50:08.710]  Yeah, no, no.
[50:08.890 --> 50:09.710]  Absolutely agree.
[50:09.870 --> 50:12.530]  You're talking about from high school and up.
[50:12.650 --> 50:12.830]  Right.
[50:13.030 --> 50:13.150]  Right.
[50:15.610 --> 50:19.330]  Are you planning on doing mini camps before they're out there?
[50:19.430 --> 50:22.270]  Maybe, but the problem is you need a skill set.
[50:22.350 --> 50:25.130]  You need a basic skill set before you can even move forward.
[50:25.330 --> 50:27.090]  That's where the education comes in?
[50:27.590 --> 50:27.810]  Yeah.
[50:27.810 --> 50:37.990]  Well, if you treat this as a catalyst and you bring it into the future, I think more younger kids will then teach the even younger kids.
[50:38.190 --> 50:40.670]  And then it will start that way and become actual movement.
[50:40.870 --> 50:43.410]  And I hope this is what this is going to start producing.
[50:43.690 --> 50:43.890]  Yeah.
[50:44.130 --> 50:45.770]  But it starts small.
[50:45.930 --> 50:48.090]  We'd really like to thank you guys for your input.
[50:48.090 --> 50:51.470]  And like I said, MWtobias at security.org.
[50:52.350 --> 50:56.890]  Please get a hold of us because we're really, really looking for your input at this level.
[50:57.170 --> 50:58.310]  Thank you very much.
[50:58.310 --> 50:59.170]  It's been a pleasure.
[50:59.250 --> 50:59.450]  Thank you very much.
[50:59.450 --> 50:59.590]  Thank you very much.