I just run out of milk
There's no paper in the loo
Oh, millibomb
And now it's started raining
Like the thunder do
Oh, millibomb
And I begin to wonder
How bad can it get?
A burger comes in through my door
Makes my TV sex
So I light up the cigarette
Listen to some sounds
Set my house on fire
Burned it to the ground
Couldn't get much worse
But if they could, they would
Oh, millibomb
For the best, expect the worst
I hope this understood
Oh, millibomb
Now I've got a console
My brother's on the run
I might have a change in luck
Before my day is done
Couldn't get much worse
But if they could, they would
Oh, millibomb
For the best, expect the worst
I hope the sun is good
I hope the sun is good
But millibomb
돈 drinking
I hope the sun is good
And I do
What I wish
They could see
They could see
They could see
They could see
They could see
Too many times
They are not working
I Ad thi
I bet
Old
Well, things almost couldn't get worse around here.
All the technical problems we had just within the space of 30 seconds.
It's incredible. If you leave something in a certain position, something is bound to go wrong.
Well, the music's from Don Letts and Big Audio Dynamite. The song is much worse.
And look for him and his new band, Screaming Target.
And he'll be out next, well, in a couple of months, actually.
And this is Emanuel Goldstein. The program is The Fifth Corner here on WBAI Radio, where it's about 11.46.
That's right. The news ended early tonight and caught us all off guard.
But no matter, we have plenty to talk about tonight.
Talking about technical glitches and things getting all fouled up,
well, that naturally leads us to telephones and to high technology in general,
because that's what seems to be happening.
And we're going to be talking tonight mostly about independent payphone companies.
Those strange companies you see with those nasty-looking telephones on the street
that sometimes take all your money, just like some of the nasty people on the street.
Well, if you look at the New York Times a couple of days ago,
you would have seen an article all about some of the nasty things that those phones do.
And I'll read a little bit from that, and then we'll talk directly about that.
Saying that charging for directory assistance hurts consumers,
New York City's Commissioner of Consumer Affairs has petitioned the state agency that regulates telephone service
to forbid independent pay telephones from leaving such charges.
The commissioner, Mark Green, also has asked the Public Service Commission
to block a request by New York Telephone to begin charging 50 cents
for calls made from payphones to directory assistance.
We talked about this a few weeks ago, at quite some length, actually.
Mr. Green said,
The various companies that link independently-owned pay telephones to directory assistance charge
from 40 cents to 75 cents for the service, which is now free from New York Telephone payphones.
Those companies are charged 48 cents per call by New York Telephone,
and according to the petition, that's more than twice the 20 cents Mr. Green estimates each call cost
actually put through.
In an interview, the commissioner said he did not think any company should charge
or be charged for directory assistance.
Ideally, phone companies can cover any cost of directory assistance
either by spreading it over their long-distance rates,
or, if necessary, spreading it among all those who benefit from directory assistance
by being listed in phone books.
I think that's fairer, and it avoids the problem of independent companies
being discriminatorily burdened by New York Telephone.
But a spokesman for New York Telephone, Stephen Marcus,
said it made more sense to charge companies as they use the service.
There's a cost for providing directory assistance, he said,
and the alternative to charging the private companies is to charge our customers.
And as for Mr. Green's allegations of discrimination, Mr. Marcus said,
there's nothing to prevent these companies from hiring operators
and providing their own directory assistance.
There are few alternatives to directory assistance for New Yorkers
who must use paid telephones, says Mr. Green.
There are many poor people for whom directory assistance calls
are not a luxury but a necessity.
They often don't have residential phone service,
and they call from the street.
This argument perhaps doesn't work in Omaha,
but in New York City's environment,
vandalism has made free phone directories unavailable at payphones.
When's the last time you saw one?
Since consumers... I said that, by the way.
Since consumers lack the choice of looking up the number for free,
and since getting the number usually leads to a paying call,
New York Telephone and the independents
should not charge for directory assistance.
Well, we have Mark Green on the telephone with us.
Commissioner Green, are you there?
I'm here. Gosh, I couldn't have said it better myself.
Well, actually, you did say most of that already.
I know. Thank you.
But I'd like to go a little bit more into detail on these things.
For one thing,
you're pretty much scratching the surface
of some of the awful things that those alternate payphones do.
I'm not sure if you're aware of some of the horrible things,
such as charging $9.95 to access another long-distance company,
or asking for that amount.
But we are aware that what's especially terrible about that
is the typical customer won't know that
until they get their bill later.
It's obviously uncommon to expect that to happen.
Wall Street Journal recently did a survey
of the long-distance costs of these independent companies,
and they're phenomenal.
Yes, that's true.
A lot of people don't realize that
because the payphones take their AT&T card cheerily,
but they'll process it using another long-distance company.
Now, some of the things you said about directory assistance
are quite intriguing,
and they bring back memories of the days
when there was no charge for directory assistance.
In your opinion, what's changed?
Why are all the companies now charging such a huge amount?
Well, trying to sneak in a rate increase through the back door.
They're allowed to try.
We're allowed to complain.
The Public Service Commission has to rule.
It's my judgment that phone companies have to make a profit.
Their regulated utilities are allowed a rate of return.
But we're not dealing with Cadillacs or Acuras.
We're dealing with a public utility
because it's a public necessity for most people.
And it's my judgment that, you know,
the phone companies can make a return
when you make a paying call.
And the whole idea of 411
and what used to be called information,
they fancied it up,
now it's called directory assistance,
is that is a prerequisite
to making a paying call.
You know, when you go to buy a car,
the auto dealership doesn't charge you
the cost of the door you walk through
in order to get into the showroom
to see the car
and to make your $10,000 purchase.
Similarly, an information call
is like the door you walk through
shouldn't be charged for it,
which is a precondition to making the call.
That's when they should make the money.
You shouldn't be charged twice.
I agree.
When did you first become aware
of this injustice
as far as what the independent phone companies
are doing
and now what New York Telephone
wants to jump on the bandwagon with?
A few weeks ago, our staff,
we have Department of Consumer Affairs
at 80 Lafayette has 340 staff.
We've been strengthening our staff
by adding some policy and advocate people,
especially a man named Glenn Van Nostitz,
who's the assistant commissioner
for that position.
He, for 10 years,
worked with probably
about the best consumer advocate
in Albany
in the Assembly of State Senate,
Franz Leichter.
And Glenn spotted this,
and we sent some people out
to research it
to estimate the number
of independent pay phones
on our streets.
It's about 15,000,
a fourth of all the pay phones.
And then to see where they are,
see how many charged
and what they charged.
Our best economic study
yielded the following.
It costs New York Telephone
about 20 cents a call
to provide the directory assistance number.
Okay, now that's something
I'm curious about.
Now, do they charge themselves
every time they call directory assistance?
What is that money used for?
Well, it's the cost
of doing business to them.
I mean, they factor that
into their rates.
They factor salary,
plant, equipment, overhead,
their health plan
for their workers,
everything into their rates.
It's just built in.
We estimated that cost
by adding up the cost
of the employee,
a CWA union worker,
plus benefits,
plus the plant equipment
to keep them operating.
It's about $40,000 per person
in all.
Then looked at the estimated
200,000 directory assistance
contacts a year
that each operator makes,
which yielded 20 cents a call.
And so even on that basis,
they're passing on
not 20 cents,
but more than double,
48 cents to the independent company.
And if the independent company
feels it has to charge
50 cents or more,
well, New York Telephone
is charging nothing.
It makes it harder
for the independents to survive.
Uh-huh.
So the fault here
isn't all on the
independents' shoulders,
then it's New York Telephone
as well.
It's fixed fault and credit.
I credit independent phone companies
for existing.
It's better than
the pre-divestiture days
when there was only
Ma Bell.
I like competition.
For example,
in an area in West Harlem,
we found 27 payphones
on the streets,
all are independents.
Uh-huh.
So the good news is
a lot of these
smaller independent companies
are going and making money
from where New York Telephone
has refused to go,
often poorer areas,
areas of consumers of color.
That's good.
What's bad, though,
is to charge 50 to 75 cents,
which a lot of people
without means,
a lot of elderly,
can't easily afford.
And a lot of disabled
and elderly
not only can't easily
physically use a phone book
in the alternative
so they don't have to pay money
for 411,
but we all live in New York.
We know there aren't
payphone books.
I'm sorry.
There aren't phone books
on the street of payphones
because of vandalism.
So we're sort of forced,
if you don't have
a residential phone accessible,
to use this overpriced service.
Commissioner Green,
let me just break in here
a moment.
This is kind of ironic,
I suppose,
but I haven't heard
a phone line
with as much noise
as this one
since I was in Eastern Europe.
And I'm wondering
if perhaps I should
just call you back
and get a better line
so that our listeners
can actually hear
what you're saying.
Oh, if you'd like to do that,
that's fine.
I'm sure it's inadvertent.
There's no reason
for our listeners
to have to put up
with that kind of noise,
so I'm going to
go to this announcement
and hopefully
when we come back
you'll hear Commissioner Green
in a nice,
sparkly, clean line.
Okay, to be continued.
Hi, this is Rosemary Reed
and I'm inviting you
to come join us
in celebrating
our 30th anniversary
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Join us aboard
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at Pier 84
at 44th Street
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returning at 1 a.m.
Tickets for this benefit
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The proceeds from this event
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Facilities Upgrade Campaign.
That's Friday, June 15th
at the WBAI
Moonlight River Cruise
celebrating 30 years
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For more information
call 212-279-0707
and oh yes,
you can help to defray
the cost of this event
by becoming
a cruise underwriter
and attend a private
pre-cruise reception.
Call me, Rosemary Reed,
for more information.
Okay, we're back
and judging from
the silence,
I think we have
a good phone line
this time.
Commissioner Green,
are you there?
I'm here.
Okay, we were talking
about the difficulties
of alternative
payphone companies
or alternative
long-distance companies
to exist
and it is a credit
that they are
able to survive.
Is that the reason
though why
there seem to be
so many unfair
practices that they
engage in
such as huge
surcharges,
blocking access
to other
long-distance companies?
I don't have
access to their books.
Only the Public
Service Commission
does.
It's my view
that they're
hurting themselves,
they're hurting
especially poor,
elderly,
frail,
disabled customers
by charging
for information
calls.
Why do people
call information
but to get
a phone number
in order to
make a paying
call?
It's not like
they're going
to a luncheonette
and ordering
a Coke for free
and then walking
out before ordering
the main course
and paying anything.
Again,
it's the
precondition
to the later
sale.
And in most
cases,
the phone call
immediately follows
the call to
information.
I think so.
You know,
we did get
a call
from New York
Telephone
after we
released our
study this
past Tuesday.
They weren't
happy with it.
They said,
oh,
it doesn't
cost them
20 cents
a call
to process
directory
assistance.
And they
would send
us their
cost data.
We welcomed
it and we're
waiting to see
their information.
And I can
understand their
concern.
They're
providing this
service and
they want to
charge for it.
Again,
though,
I think the
cutting off
their nose
despite their
face,
they said,
well,
gee,
a lot of
businesses
use directory
assistance to
get information
about other
businesses to
build up their
mailing lists.
Question,
what rational
business person
would stand
all day by a
payphone?
in order to
get directory
assistance when
they could
obviously get
access to a
phone book,
sit down,
a cup of
coffee,
a nice club
soda,
and then do
it leisurely
and themselves
rather than
electronically.
That didn't,
I found that
not persuasive,
but they'll be
calling back with
more.
Well,
it was only a
few years ago
that you didn't
have to go to a
payphone to make
a free directory
assistance call.
You could do it
from anywhere,
from your office,
from your home.
Why is it now
that it
suddenly costs
money?
I am guessing
that 9x is
having a lot of
difficulty getting
rate increases up
front as a
consequence to
trying to, in
effect, get a
rate increase by
small charges that
won't develop the
kind of huge
public opposition
that has enabled,
for example,
Attorney General
Bob Abrams,
the head of the
Consumer Protection
Board, Richie
Castle from
successfully blocking
what was, in the
immediate past, a
nearly $1 billion
rate increase for
9x.
So they're trying to
chip away at that,
and I think this is
the exact, I think
it's a bad business
judgment.
I think it hurts all
consumers, especially
those most vulnerable,
as I indicated.
But I must tell you,
New York Telephone is
not just a bad guy in
every way,
nothing whatsoever.
We're all frustrated
at how frequently
payphones on the
street are broken.
It's not the fault
only of the phone
company.
A lot of drug
dealers use pay
phones, and they
overuse them.
Then there are a lot
of phone pirates who
just gouge them for the
change in them.
They're professionals.
They're not just people
who are desperate or
destitute for a night.
And the phone company is
desperately trying to
find a technology that
can withstand the
weather and assault of
the urban environment.
Why is it more of a
problem now than it
was, say, five years
ago, though?
Well, if part of
their problem are
drug dealers using and
abusing the phones,
there are more of them
than five years ago,
I would guess.
I'm not at the police
department, but I read
what everyone reads.
And while I read that
middle income and use
by students of drugs is
stable or declining, that
the use by hardcore
addicts of crack and
cocaine is skyrocketing.
And a lot of these
people don't have
residential phones, which
can be traced and
tapped by the police, and
they use street phones.
And we see the results.
Second, New York
Telephone reported to me
that phone pirates are
increasing in number.
Perhaps it's also
related to drugs.
They're desperate for
the money, and the
phones are one public
place which contains
money.
Hard to get to, but
these people are
desperate.
Uh-huh.
You see, I agree that
there is a problem there,
but generally you can
tell when somebody has
destroyed a pay phone to
get the money out of it.
In most cases where I
find a non-working pay
phone, it seems to be a
phone that just doesn't
give you a dial tone for
some reason, and it
doesn't seem to be
anything wrong with the
exterior of the phone.
And that leads me to
believe that it's just not
being maintained.
And I was also, I was
told by a couple of
different repairmen that
fixing pay phones,
especially after the
strike, is not a
priority, not a high
priority.
Well, New York
Telephone has also said
that they fell behind
during the strike.
Obviously, it was a
strike that communication
workers felt fervently
they had to engage in to
protect their health
benefits won over decades
of unionization.
They won the strike at
great cost to themselves.
Among the results is a
backup and repair and
installation.
That excuse has to fade
over time, obviously.
Soon, if not weeks,
months, but soon, they
have to have been caught
up.
I accept your point.
The problem may not be
really vandalization on
the street, but
mismanagement at the
company.
That is, the dial tone
doesn't come on.
You can't blame a vandal
for that.
Right.
And I have to wonder,
too, that strike went
on for such a long
time, and during that
time, 9X was not
paying the striking
workers.
Where did all that
money go?
Is it possible they
made a profit over the
strike?
That is possible.
Again, I don't have
access to their books,
and you should call
Jan Pierce, Vice
President of Region 1
CWA.
I'm sure he knows all
about that.
I'm sorry, I'm
questioning you as if
you work for the
phone company.
I must not do that.
Obviously, it was more
hurtful to working
union members who
lived on their
salary, as opposed
to the phone company
who, in the short
term, may have
profited.
We're talking to
New York City
Commissioner of
Consumer Affairs,
Mark Green, and I'd
like to ask you, are
you aware, during the
latest rate increase
hearings, one of the
things that New York
Telephone is asking
for, in addition to
charging 50 cents for
directory assistance from
payphones, they also
want to charge 50 cents
for every call to the
operator, that does not
result in a call being
placed.
In other words, if you
call the operator and
just say something, you
know, ask a question of
some sort, and you don't
place a call, they're
going to charge you 50
cents.
Were you aware of that?
Question like, what's the
time, what's the weather,
what's your home phone
number?
Anything.
I mean, I call the
operator a lot for various
things to find out maybe
the location of a particular
exchange or when discount
rates start.
And from my understanding of
reading the little hello
book that I got, that's
going to cost 50 cents every
time I don't make a call.
I don't know how they're
going to go around billing
that, but that strikes me
as something that hasn't
been paid too much
attention to.
I haven't seen anything
about that.
I haven't seen it either
publicized, discussed, or
complained about to the
public service commission.
I can understand the phone
company imposing a charge
if people frequently call it
for information that the
phone company is not
primarily responsible for,
the time, for example.
People in our society
should be able to figure
out the time without
calling a private company.
Right.
However, for you to call
and get information about
the cost of service, of
installation, there's a lot
of information they should
provide about their service
even if you don't follow
through and make a phone
call.
Again, the analogy is,
you know, you go into a
restaurant, you ask to look
at the menu, you look at it,
you decide, too expensive
for me, they shouldn't
charge you for the glance
at the menu, even though
it took some staff time.
Mm-hmm.
Good analogy.
I like that one.
Not bad for midnight, right?
No, not bad at all.
Another thing that has
always been a sticking
point with me is the fact
that the phone company
charges for touch tones.
And that's something that
I'm not sure if you're
aware of this, the fact
that there really isn't a
service associated with
that.
What do you mean by that?
You mean you get no
additional service other
than the fact that instead
of rotary, it's touch
tones?
Well, you provide the
phone, you provide the
tones.
The only thing that you
paying the fee accomplishes
is them not telling the
computer to ignore your
tones.
In other words, every
single piece of switching
equipment in the phone
company, the modern
equipment, is equipped to
handle touch tones.
In any event, right?
In any event.
The only systems that
couldn't do that were the
really, really primitive
systems of the early
60s.
I must tell you an
anecdote that's not
necessarily related to
phone charges, but it's
related to touch tone and
rotary.
My six-year-old son
visited my new office at
the Department of
Consumer Affairs.
It's my new office, but
it's 25 years old.
Very old, decrepit
building.
And all our phones are
rotary.
rotary.
And he looked at these
phones and he said,
Daddy, what's that
machine?
He'd never seen a
rotary phone.
We have touch tone
phones.
Do you think he would
know how to dial one?
He had no idea.
I had to explain it.
You got your finger, you
put your finger in it, you
go in a circle.
Uh-huh.
Yeah.
You know, I heard
somebody commenting on
something like that once
before where someone didn't
know how to use a rotary
phone.
And they were just
wondering if there was an
emergency, what would they
do?
You know, how would they
use the phone?
Open up the window and
scream.
Probably.
Uh-huh.
Now, let me say that
there's a New York City
office called Entertel,
headed by a new
commissioner, Bill
Squadron.
And they are full-time
advocates for the city's
consumers in matters of
energy and telephone,
hence Entertel.
and Commissioner
Squadron is brand new to
the job, and they will be
frequently intervening along
with Attorney General Bob
Abrams, Consumer Protection
Board State Chief Richie
Kessel at the Public
Service Commission.
More frequently and more
expertly than our Department
of Consumer Affairs, this came
to our attention, and since it
was pending at the Public
Service Commission, we wanted
to speak and did speak out
on it.
Uh-huh.
What can people do who are
interested in getting more
information or contributing
information of their own to
this particular case?
Well, two things.
Either they can write us at the
Department of Consumer Affairs.
The staff person who's working
on it with me is a man named
Michael Alcamo, A-L-C-A-M-O.
We're at 80 Lafayette Street, or I
don't know the phone number or
address of Entertel, but it's
Commissioner Bill Squadron.
How do you spell that?
S-Q-U-A-D-R-O-N.
I meant Entertel.
Oh!
I'm sorry.
S-Q-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U.UU-U-U-U-U-U-U-I-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U U-U-U-U-U-U-E-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U-U
I'll write the Entertel, and they'll be continuing on this proceeding.
Okay, sounds good.
Now, you also had a proposal that they take the charges for directory assistance
and spread them over the long-distance rates, I believe?
Well, I'll tell you, when consumers call information,
overwhelming percentage at the time, they then get a number
and pay a quarter for the call.
The phone company makes money from the sequence of 3 million directory assistance calls
being made a year, followed by a paying call.
They make money.
So when the phone company says, gee, how can we pay this cost,
the answer is, be patient.
Five seconds later, you'll get a quarter,
which already is more than you said the cost of the directory assistance service is.
So the answer is, I don't think they have to charge anything.
Should they make an argument they should charge something?
At worst, spread the cost over all of us who benefit from information assistance
since we are in the phone book.
Someone may call to get my phone number, they get the phone number, and I'm benefited.
Well, you know, it's interesting.
The only people that get charged are the people who aren't in the phone book.
You get charged for being unlisted, which is something I've never been able to understand.
Oh, I see.
You have to pay money in order not to be in it.
Exactly.
That's interesting.
One of those other things that they do.
What about long-distance information?
Do you think we can apply the same rules there?
Because that used to be free, too.
And now it costs 60 cents to call long-distance information.
And for me, anyway, it keeps me from making phone calls
because I don't want to spend 60 cents just to find out a number
or 60 cents to find out that there isn't a number.
Interesting, because long-distance rates generally have fallen substantially in real terms
since 1984, since AT&T was broken up.
We obviously have MCI Sprint competing with AT&T.
And I can see it's ironic to make a 60-cent charge for long-distance information
and then a long-distance call that's not much more expensive than that.
No, in fact, long-distance calls can be cheaper than local calls in many cases.
Also, it's unfair because while locally it is conceivable you can get a pay phone
in the alternative to this directory assistance call,
especially if you're a residential consumer.
Obviously, I'm sitting in my home here on the east side of Manhattan,
and I have a Manhattan phone book here.
Conceivably, I could have a Queens, Brooklyn, Bronx, et cetera phone book.
It's hard to believe that I'd have a Los Angeles phone book, a Chicago phone book.
And so it strikes me as unfair to charge when the consumer has no real alternative.
And obviously, you're going to be making that long-distance call.
The only exception, though, is New York Telephone may not make the profit.
AT&T long-distance lines may make it.
Sprint may make it.
And so there may be some kind of division of the cost in that particular instance.
Plus also, well, you know, again, that could work out if they divided it evenly
and based it upon the number of customers or something like that,
the amount that they charge these companies.
But it's interesting when you say it's not likely you would have a Los Angeles phone book.
And even if you wanted one, they'd charge you a pretty penny for getting one
because they're only free in the local area.
They're not free in other states, for instance.
So that's something else that a lot of people aren't aware of.
Well, listen, if people want to either find out more or contribute more,
I do encourage them either to write to the Department of Consumer Affairs
or Entertel and Commissioner Squadron
because this is a long-distance hall, as it were.
Uh-huh.
And I'm glad to have contributed whatever I could.
Okay. Well, thanks very much for joining us tonight.
And keep up the fight.
Hopefully we'll see some more articles in the paper about this.
It would be nice to get back to the days where you can pick up your phone
and be assured of what you're going to get on the other end
and not get a surprise once a month.
That's the goal.
Okay. Thanks so much.
Thank you for having me.
All right. Good night.
Good night.
And we'll be taking your phone calls at 212-279-3400 any second now.
So run to your phones, make your calls, and tell us what you think about free information.
Should directory assistance be free?
Should other kinds of phone calls be free?
You know, what's fair?
What is not fair?
Give us a call, 212-279-3400.
She's bugging me again
Run to use the phone
Find and rent a hip man
From the Twilight Zone
It was good in the beginning
But why has become a drag?
Found me a solution
In adventure night
Five seas has downplay men
It's just a call away
Cheaper than some real fees
And they do the job to pay
So if you've got a problem
Pick up the telephone
For the Benson Glory Cowboys
From the Twilight Zone
At the Cardinal Club
There's no extra fault to tease
We're the gang that couldn't shoot straight
But we aim to please
Be at best and drifters
Shellshock from the head
At the Cardinal
Dark savage pays the bill
Yeah, soldiers are fortunate
But we're not meant to drive
But mister, I must tell you
Neither are I kind
So if you've got a problem
Pick up the telephone
For the Benson Glory Cowboys
From the Twilight Zone
At the Cardinal Club
There's no extra fault to tease
We're the gang that couldn't shoot straight
But we aim to please
Did a job in Georgia
Money in advance
For the Benson Glory Cowboys
Fingers rule the post
With chillin' nausea rocks
I've seen some civil war now
For the cash we took their life
Back here on the homestand
Rich on people's wives
Ladies, bounty hunter
Comical ineptitude
Modern cowboy cowdress
Guns and gloves
So if you've got a problem
Pick up the telephone
For the Benson Glory Cowboys
From the Twilight Zone
At the Cardinal Club
There's no extra fault to tease
With a gang that couldn't shoot straight
Pokey
James, please
May I help you?
May I help you?
Yes, this is the operator?
Yes
Jimmy Lafayette 06
Person to person with Mr. Carson King
That's King with a K
Oh, I got it
Have a good evening
Thank you
Welcome
Wrong number
Carson King, please
Don't get him flowing
Is this Mr. King?
Is this Mr. Carson King?
What's this?
You dirty little shithead
I paid you five C's
Of my heart and cash
Now look what you did
Who is this?
I paid you to bump off my wife
And then
I gotta check the file
Check the file
Yes, target address
4275 South Brooklyn Avenue
Apartment 42C
Okay, okay
I got it
Alright, let's see
What's that?
Uh, let's see
Target was a tragic Caucasian woman
Early 30s
Named Martha Lee
Yeah, but you got the wrong girl
Wait a minute, wait a minute
Wait a minute
The payment was made
Easy pay credit plan
It's a monthly installment
Yeah, yeah, yeah
You never find all that
Look
Look you, brother
We have a completion
Report on the file
Target within
715
EM
4275
South Brooklyn
Market 42C
Not P, you fool
It was C
C
42C
So now they screw you around
With this guy
Next door
Then the monkeys come down
And they shove his wife
Out the window
How is that supposed to make me feel?
Look at that
It's just 42B on the report
It's not our fault
It's not your fault
We're all you ain't paying, huh?
So go ahead and sue me
So you're not gonna pay, huh?
I'm not paying
Okay, uh
Say 42C
22C, yeah, that's it
You got it
Yeah, well
We'll be calling
Hey, wait a minute
Operator
Hey, come on now
Operator
Oh, it never failed
To crack me up
That's Rent a Hitman
I'm sorry
Dial a Hitman
From Big Audio Dynamite
Off their second album
And, uh
One of life's little ironies here
Uh
I'm about to show you
As we prepare
To take some calls here
Um
We're talking about
Directory assistance
Costing money
Oh
Hello
Telephone, Ms. Donaldson
May I help you?
Yes, hi
I need overseas information, please
Hold on
One moment for an operator
Who can assist you
Thank you
AT&T, how can I help you?
Hi, I need overseas information, please
From Manila
In the Philippines
Hold on, please
Thank you
Hello, operator
Yes
Can you tell me
How much will this cost
To get information?
It doesn't cost anything
For information
It costs you for the number
Also, information is free overseas
As far as I know
Well, you're the operator
So you would know
Hello
Yeah, but just
Everything in here
Goes on a tape
And when it read off
Uh-huh
I don't know
But I'm
I'm sure you don't
You don't pay
But to the best of your knowledge
There's no charge for this
Okay, that's good enough for me
Are you connecting me
To information over there?
Now, you asked me
For two different things
You asked me for
Rape and information
Right
Uh, information
Uh, the rates come up
In front of me
Now, what rate do you want?
Do you want the
5 to 2 a.m. rate?
Well, no, I just wanted
To get information over there
Oh, hold on then
Directory assistance
Thanks
How do you spell
The name of that city?
Uh, Manila
M-A-N-I-L-A
M-A-N
I-L-A
Just a moment
Thank you
I thought you wanted
The rates too
Just a moment
Computer has to make everything
I'm sorry?
Computer has to make everything
Yeah, well, the computers
Are running the world
I know
I'm messing up
You know I'm
Because one thing
They only put out
What you put in
And that's true
Yeah, that's true
They're only as good
As the people
That program them
Right
Unfortunately, we never
See those people
Well, you know
Anytime something happens
They say computer
Uh-huh
As soon as you get
As a wife
They say, oh, computer
It's a scapegoat
You're not supposed to know
That they program it
It's only putting out
What they're put into
Uh-huh
Garbage in, garbage out
Okay, let me put this in
And see what's going to
Come out now
Just a moment
All right
I'm going to give you an IOC
Because everything I put
In the computer
Is rejecting it
Oh, dear
Hold on
Okay
IOC
That's either the
International Olympic Committee
Or the, uh
International Operators
Or something like that
We are the
International Operators
Ah, okay
Not the International
We, uh, we connect you
To some of the
International
We're in New York
Okay
So you got to connect me
To what, Pittsburgh?
Yeah
Oh, you know all about it
Yeah, I've done this before
Oh
Okay
AT&T, I'm a C
That's operator calling
From 212-279-348
Thanks
Hello
Yes, hi
I need information
In Manila
The Philippines
Please
Your international call
Cannot be completed
It is
Assistant
Hello
Yes, directory assistance
This is United States
Pittsburgh
I have a customer
On the line
Needing your assistance
Can you please help him
Go ahead, sir
Yes, go ahead, please
Uh, yes
Hi
I need the telephone
Number in Manila
For the Hilton Hotel
The main Hilton Hotel
There
Sir, that is under
Manila Pavilion
Okay
Manila Hilton
Is now under
Manila Pavilion, sir
Okay, fine
Number is 573711
Okay
Does that include all the
Country codes and city codes
I'll take care of that, sir
Okay
I just want to
Thank you very much, operator
I appreciate it
You're welcome
Uh-huh, bye-bye
Bye
Hello, sir
Yes
Yes, can you hear me?
I can, yeah
I'm going to give you the code
So you can dial it yourself
But I'll connect you
If you don't mind
Well, I'm not making the call
Right now
I just wanted
Oh, you're not
Okay
I just wanted to get the number
It's, uh
Okay, sir
You dial 011
Right
63
Uh-huh
And 2
And then the number she gave me
Number, right
573711
Okay, thanks very much for your help
No problem
Bye-bye
Bye-bye
Now, how many operators were there?
Uh, did everybody keep count?
I kept count
First, there was a New York telephone operator
She connected us to AT&T
We had that nice long chat about computers with her
She connected me over to Pittsburgh
The IOC, International Olympic Operator
And then he connected me to the operator in the Philippines
Four operators there
Four operators
And it didn't cost anything
And all the phone companies are still in one piece
You know, I don't think I really robbed the bank too much
By getting this information
And I may very well call that hotel someday
I mean, I did write down the number
So I have it here
It's a bit of information
And in fact, the whole city of New York now has that information
So I've actually provided a service of sorts
So, um
That tells you a thing or two
That tells you
Kind of the hypocrisy of it all
Because, uh
Sometimes they charge you outrageous amounts of money
And sometimes they charge you nothing
Fifty cents
To call information in New York City
To get a local number that will cost you a quarter to call
Nothing
To call international information
To get a number that will cost you a fortune to call
It's interesting, isn't it?
Well, our number is 279-3400
And, uh
It's time now to take your calls
Good morning
Hello
Go ahead
Uh, well
My beef is with these, uh
International
Not international
But local
Telephone
Uh
Offering local service
That doesn't work at all
What do you mean, Jim?
You mean those alternate pay phones?
Yeah, you know
Like at somebody's grocery store
They've got a, um
A phone, uh
Outside
And it's no longer
New York telephone
It's, uh
You know
Some little tiny outfit
In God knows where
And, uh
For instance
I put in, uh
Foolishly
Two dollars
Into one today
To make a long distance phone call
That I really had to make
Two dollars
I don't think I've ever known anybody
To put in so much money
In one of those things
A completely foolish thing to do
And, and totally unfaith
Uh
I don't know why
But, uh
Naturally it ate it
And, uh
Do you gamble, sir?
I, I try not to
But I really had to make this phone call
And there's no other way to do it
I see
It ends up with, uh
My calling them up
And saying
How do I get my money back?
Well, who did you call up?
I called, uh
The operator
And it was
And there was no, uh
Identification of what the phone was
On the phone
Okay
That I assume has to be done usually
That's illegal for them not to
Yeah
They have to tell you where to call
If the phone is broken
Right
So I, I called zero
And they connected me
To the AT&T operator
Who of course told me
It was not her problem
Right
Uh, and then
Somebody else got on
And told me to talk to the person
Uh, who owns the phone
Supposedly
Who's the grocery guy
Uh huh
Now the grocery guy
Started looking very violently at me
And very angry
But finally he gave me
The name of a company
In Brooklyn
Uh huh
Uh, who I called
Uh, and, uh
They claim that
Nobody's there
So
They claim nobody's there
You mean you got a machine?
Two dollars essentially
I see
Uh, so I
And why it is
That we have to have
These little independent
Uh, things
I'm perfectly happy
To have, uh
Nine X
Regulated by the government
Well, you know
I'd like to see competition
But I'd like to see
Fair competition
I don't want to see
People getting ripped off
But I also don't want to see
One monopoly
That pretty much
You know, dictates the rules
And what they say goes
And there's no way around them
That's kind of scary
And you know
Most countries
Are run by the government
I'm sorry?
How about having the government
Watch them more seriously
And do a better job regulating
Well, I think we should be
Watching them
You know
And we should be speaking
To, uh
To commissioners
Like Commissioner Green
About this
Uh, because, uh
It's
It's gotta be government
Regulated to a degree
But it also has to be
Regulated by
The citizens
Of the city
Of the state
Of the country
You know
I don't like the idea
Of one phone company
Because one phone company
Is very easy
To suddenly control
Or suddenly turn off
If, uh
If some national emergency
Quote-unquote
Happens
And they need to control
All the phone traffic
This way
There's all kinds
Of alternatives
There's all kinds
Of alternatives
And you can
Make your phone call
If you're smart
If you know how to do it
Well, an alternative
Is not an alternative
If, uh
It's a total rip-off
Of course not
That these independent companies
Are often just
A total rip-off
And it's not even
You know, it's
I don't know how
They get into this business
But it really seems like
You know, Joe's phones
Well, maybe
Maybe the only way
They can survive
I don't know if this is true
I'd like to know if it is
The only way they can survive
Is to rip people off
Mm-hmm
Maybe it's so hard
To be a phone company
That this
You know, if you do it fairly
You can't make any money
And this is the only way
That's why you only get
The sleazeball people in there
And I'm not saying
All the people running
Those phones
Are sleazeballs
I'd like to know
Is there anyone out there
That's had a positive experience
With those phones
Besides me
Because I've found
Some of those pay phones
That allow you to call
Information all over
The country for free
I'm sure it's not
Supposed to do that
But they do
Other ones have
Working phone, basically
Is what I would be happy with
Sorry, a working phone?
Working phone would be nice, yes
Well, can you honestly say, though
That 9x phones are
I mean, they're better, yeah
But are they as good
As they were in the past?
Same reason I now go with
AT&T
After trying, you know
One of the other ones
I'd rather pay for
A unionized company
Where the workers
Maybe they're not treated great
But they're treated, you know
Better than they are
With Sprint or whatever
Uh-huh
What have you heard
About Sprint?
Just that they tend
To do things like
Screw up on people's bills
And just be
Extremely unreliable
But anything with regards
To how they treat
Their workers?
Yeah, I know that AT&T
Or at least I've been told
That AT&T is the only
Unionized one
And Sprint and MCI are not
Interesting
I'd like to get more
Information on that
All right, well I just
Wanted to add my beef
To the air there
Thanks for calling
Okay, thank you
Our number is
279-3400
Good morning
Hi, how are you?
Good, how are you?
Response to your first caller
I just, by the way
Was going to mention
Something about those
Private phones also
Uh-huh
There is a way of
Getting around
Paying a lot of money
For that kind of call
If you know how to do it
What's your way?
Well, you know
You can call the
AT&T or 9X
And get their
Credit card for free
And, you know
When you go to
These private phones
You dial 00
To get the AT&T operator
And you tell them
That you want to
Place a credit card call
Even if it's a local number
You could still do that
Well, that's not
Always true
If you dial 00
On some of those phones
You won't get AT&T
You'll get something else
If you get anything at all
I mean, different phones
Do different things
That will work on some phones
But it won't work at all
You are supposed to get
The AT&T operator
Even on a 9X phone
If you dial 00
On a 9X phone
That has pre-selected
Another long distance company
You might get Sprint
You might get MCI
Yeah
You have to use
The carrier access code
If you want AT&T
And that's
10288
108TT
MCI is 10222
Sprint is 10333
And there's a whole bunch of others
Well, if you could find
The phone that even has
The instructions on it
I mean, you have to
Read the fine print
On how to do
All of these things
I would be happy
If they just didn't
Block access to things
Like 950 numbers
Which don't cost anything
To call
They ask for $9.95
To call those things
And that's not fair
They're obviously
Trying to prevent you
From using another company
And I don't mind
Other phones
Other companies
If they do it fairly
If everybody plays
By the same rules
I would recommend
Everybody to at least
Get the AT&T calling card
For free
And the local 9X card
For free
Well, every phone company
As far as I know
Offers cards for free
And they come in handy
Depending on where you are
At the moment
For instance
If you're at a place
That doesn't allow
Operator access
If you're, say, at work
You want to make a phone call
To somewhere
Long distance
You want to pay for it yourself
But you can't access
The operator
To give her
The calling card number
And the switchboard
Won't allow you
To place a zero plus call
How do you get around that?
Well, as an answer
You use the Sprint card
Which comes off
An 800 number
And you dial the 800 number
Give them all the information
And they place the call
For you that way
So there's always an instance
Where you'll need
One of these companies
And since it's free
Why don't you get
Everything you can
Get MCI
Get AllNet
RCI
TDX
All those companies
I wanted you to do
Before you finish your program
That was very interesting
You getting the information
For the long distance there
And it was fun, too
You know, there's something
Happening in Liberia now
There's supposedly
A civil war going on
To try and get
The Hilton Hotel there
Well, I don't want to bother them
They're probably busy
Go ahead
See what happens
How they handle
A situation like that
Oh, I don't know
Be brave
That's not at this moment
Sometimes during the show
Well, we'll see
We'll see what happens
I want to see how
Something like that
Works in real life
Okay, thanks for calling
How the reporters get through
When they have to
Start doing news
It's bad, do it
Now, that's a good point
That's a very good point
Reporters do need to get through
And reporters should know
How to use the phones
And when the Panama situation broke
We made phone calls
From here at BAI
And it's a good thing
That we knew how to do it
That we knew how to
Well, you know
I'll show people
That need to get through
In emergency situations
I'll do that any time
Thank you
All right
Bye
Same thing for
San Francisco earthquake
Nobody could get through then
And if you knew how to do it
If you knew how to
Use the alternatives
You could get through
That's why alternatives
Are important
For emergency situations
And also
Just to get through
Everyday life sometimes
You need alternatives
You can't always have
Just one way
Of doing things
It goes for just about
Anything in life
Including phone calls
279-3400
Good morning
Good morning
Very interesting program
One thing I'd like to say
About these private pay phones
I have an answering machine
That I can access
From a touchtone phone
But lots of these phones
Once you dial your seven numbers
Or whatever
And you get through
The phones don't work anymore
They turn off the touchtone pad
Yeah
That's a common problem
Also
If you were using
If say you were calling
Another long distance company
And they make you
Enter your authorization code
And then dial the number
It doesn't work
When you reach them either
Because they turn off
The touchtone pad
After a certain number of digits
And that's very unfair
Also some of these phones
Only send out the touchtone
For a very brief time
Like maybe a quarter of a second
And you can't hold down the key
Some machines are sensitive
And you have to hold down
Or not sensitive
And you have to hold down the key
For a long period of time
But some of these
Quote unquote
Modern phones
Don't allow you to do that
And the real ironic thing is
You've already paid
For your phone call
You're connected
But it's completely useless
You can't do anything
What I would suggest
Is a cheap device
Called a touchtone pad
That you would hold up
To the mouthpiece
And that way
You'd be able to send
Your tones over the mouthpiece
Because that's all it is
You're just sending tones
Over the phone wires
So it doesn't matter
Where you send it from
If you could speak the tones
It would work
But nobody can do that
Of course
Yeah well you know
That's fine and dandy
Except if I wanted to
Carry something with me
Then I would have gotten
A cheaper answering machine
That has one of those
Remote things
That you have to carry
All the time
Right
One of those
But everybody can
Get into those ones
They can whistle
And access those
Those particular
Answering machines
Yeah I'd like to tell you
A quick story
Of what happened
To me and Marbell
Okay
I got
I had moved
And I wanted
My number on listed
It's the years
I had gotten
My bill at my P.O. box
And I have like
A weird last name
That's made up
Of two words
And so about
Two weeks after I move
I get my bill
At my new residence
Which was an error
And my name
Was severely misspelled
And then a week later
I get a sales letter
From a metropolitan
Life insurance company
So I was wondering
How did they get
My new number
I called the guy
Whose name was
On the sales letter
I called him
In the middle of the night
I mean you know
I harassed him
Sort of
Trying to get this info
They wouldn't tell me
The phone company
Told me
I must be crazy
Because
You know
They wouldn't do it
If it's unlisted
Then it's unlisted
For two months
They told me
I was crazy
Finally I had a hearing
In front of the PSC
And what came out
Was that the guy
That printed
The non-published numbers
Or transferred them
To microfilm
Or something
Sold the copy
To Metropolitan Life
Wow
Isn't that nice?
That's pretty incredible
Did that make the papers?
That's a scandal
No, no, no
I mean I was young
And foolish
And I should have sued them
But I was just happy
To know that
I'm not crazy
Well it's always good
To know that
But still
You could have
You could have
Cleaned up with that
I think
Because that's
A big invasion of privacy
I assume that guy
Got fired
I have no idea
Supposedly a letter
Went out to some
Commission or somebody
Who oversees
The insurance business
I never followed it up
I was just
How long ago was this?
This was
Oh god
This was like 1976
Uh huh
Wasn't that long ago then
Well that's
That's an interesting story
And if anybody else
Has something similar
Going on now
Pursue it
If you think
What told you
That the phone company
Knew about this?
Oh nothing told me
It's just that
You know
They said possibly
One of my friends
Has a friend who works there
Who gave my name
Etc
My logic said to me
Well then they would
Spell my name properly
You know if you get
A sales letter
It should have
Your name properly
Uh huh
My name was misspelled
The same way
That the phone company
Misspelled it
Well that tells you
Right there
And that's why
When I deliberately
Misspell my name sometimes
For instance
You go to Radio Shack
For some reason
Radio Shack interrogates you
Whenever you buy something
They demand to know
What your name is
Where you live
So every time I go in
And it's the same one
The same guy
Asking me all the time
I always give a different name
And a different address
Well sometimes I give
The same address
Because that way
I get to see
Who they give my mailing list to
Or my name to
And I do that to everybody
And I find out
Who talks to who
And uh
You know
It doesn't
It doesn't cost me any time
And it's uh
Sort of a way of
Of having fun
With these uh
With these people
Uh
There's a lot of
Exchanging of information
Going on
And the phone company
I know is about to
Start selling
Its mailing list
They probably sent you
A little form
With your last phone bill
That gave you the option
Of not being a part of that
Uh
But it's uh
It's something that we're
Going to see a lot more
Of in the future
Of course
The more mail
The more junk mail I get
The more I just don't
Read it at all
It's a big waste
Yeah
So I don't know
Where it's going to
Wind up
Anyway
Thanks very much
For calling sir
And uh
Good luck in the future
Thank you
Bye bye
279-3400
Good morning
Hi
Um
I tuned in
You know
Not too long ago
But I
I gathered from
What was said
That you uh
Talked about
Long distance rates
Uh
We didn't talk too much
About long distance rates
Uh
We talked mostly
About local
Well
That
That seems pretty
Uh
Central
Given what
Sprint and
AT&T have been
Advertising
I mean
I assume you've
Gotten to the bottom
Of it
I switched from AT&T
To uh
To Sprint
After doing some
You know
Some research
It seemed that
Although I had
Reach out to America
With AT&T
It seemed that
Sprint
Had uh
Hours that were
Extended well beyond
Uh
AT&T's
And that the rates
Themselves
Uh
Were fractionally
Lower
Uh
And given that
The hours were
Uh
Extended
It seemed uh
That Sprint
Had a better situation
Uh huh
Well it's important
To know two things
One
For different people
Different companies
Work better
And I've heard
Complaints about
All the companies
From people
Throughout the years
And two
Is the fact that
Just because you
Choose a particular
Company
Doesn't mean you
Can't use another
Company
So if you
Choose Sprint
That doesn't mean
You're abandoning
The AT&T forever
If you need to
Use them for
Something
You can always
Just dial their
Carrier access code
And you're
Connected to them
So it's uh
It's it's not
That final a thing
And you can always
Switch back at some
Point
Usually they
They pay the fee
For that uh
If they have a
Certain promotion
That time of year
Right well that's
Their offer now
That you know
If you've switched
Over from
AT&T to Sprint
They'll pay for
You switching back
Uh but I don't
See at this point
I mean I
I make about
60 dollars average
Uh a month
On AT&T
So now
Now I've switched
And I've thought
You know maybe
I'd say
15 percent
Uh huh
And have you
Well I don't know
I just got my
First bill
And uh
Pretty hard to
Figure it out
Uh huh
Really because uh
You know you'd
Have to
You'd have to call
Up AT&T
And go over it
With them
And see uh
If the rates
Are really uh
Lower
Unless it's a
Dramatic difference
You know I don't
I don't really see
The point of
Wasting hours
Trying to figure out
Which plan works best
Unless you're spending
A lot of money
Like thousands of dollars
A month
Right
Then it would make sense
To uh
To um
Use the company
That saved the most money
And in fact
A lot of companies
A lot of corporations
Do that
When you make a call
A computer calculates
Which company
Has the cheapest rate
To that place
At that time
And it places it
Over that line
Unfortunately though
Sometimes that results
In uh
In poor lines
And people don't
Know a way
To get around it
Uh so it's important
To be able to have
Control over the system
As well as
As having the alternatives
In other words
You should be able to
Uh make a call
Using any company
That you want
At any time
And that's uh
That's something that
A lot of people
Just aren't taught
In fact none of us
Are taught that we have
To go out and learn
It ourselves
And ask a lot of questions
Uh so hopefully
That will improve
Over the years
Right well I'm
I don't know how
The service also
The quality of service
Differs from
Sprint to AT&T
Which I mean
AT&T does
Give excellent service
I think
For the most part
They you know
It's it's okay
Yeah it's not bad
But uh
They make mistakes too
And they can uh
They can rip you off
If you don't watch out
I'm sure
Did you see the article
Uh uh
It was in
In like a business journal
Like Cranes
Or or The Economist
Or something like that
I don't know
Where uh
Billions of dollars
A year
Were being charged
Overcharged
Uh for uh
Transatlantic calls
By uh
The major carrier
I don't know
If it was AT&T
Or ITT maybe
They were being charged
Under what circumstances
Well just
They just found
Generally that there
Was about 3 billion
In overcharges
Uh on
Transatlantic calls
Just generally
Well that's uh
That's a fairly large amount
I
I thought so too
Uh huh
That's why it seems
So ironic that uh
We down at the bottom
Of the totem pole here
Have to deal with uh
With paying 50 cents
For something that is now free
You know it's um
It seems like we're being
Punished a bit too much
Right
For something we didn't do
Um that's uh
A bit of an injustice
Anyway thanks so much
For calling sir
And I hope your
Your choice is a good one
Thanks a lot
Okay
279-3400
Good morning
Hello
Yeah go ahead
Yeah fascinating show here
Thanks
Yeah I also resist uh
Radio Shack
Giving them my
My name address
And I think it's
It's a bunch of cock and bull
Well you know
I don't want to pick on them
Too much because
They seem to be the worst
Offender in my opinion
But uh there are
Other places that interrogate you
And ask you all kinds
Of personal questions
Whenever you
Dare to buy something
From them
It makes you wonder
What they really want
Spend a quarter
And they'll ask you for
You know your name and address
Uh huh
I have never found
One of those uh
Joe phone company
Phones that have worked
And when I did
It has been so
Outrageously priced
That I just hang up
And walk out
And you just get disgusted
We want a dollar
You know for
To call across town
Or what not
Right right
Last chance from the city
It's like you know
Two dollars
See all those phones
Are able to be programmed
Right there
In fact they can be
Programmed over the phone
As well
Uh whereas regular
New York telephone
Pay phones
They're they're not
Programmed within the phone
It must be a set
It's a set rate
Or what not
It's something that is
Set at the site
And it's either set
With the consent
Of the person
Who owns the phone
Or the uh the person
That leases the phone out
Yeah
Those rates could be changed
They make them look
Like AT&T phones
Oh yeah
That's that's something else
You have to wonder
Why do they make them
Look so much like phones
That they aren't
Right like like
Knock offs
Right off the bat
Well I think uh
I think the coin return
Mechanism is on the other side
Uh huh
Of the fake ones
Uh well you can tell
Because the receiver's plastic
And you know a lot of it
Is plastic
But you know the visual effect
Is you're using you know
A New York telephone
So you just you just pay it
You know you don't you don't
You don't question it
Most people don't question it
Uh huh
I've also had another question
I want to ask you
Yeah
Is it legal for a company
To tap their phone
On their private property
If they have a public phone
In their in their premises
Can they just tap it
Well you know a lot of
Companies do that
A lot of companies uh
In fact AT&T is one of them
When you call them
They'll say
This call may be monitored
Uh for uh
For service
Yeah
Considerations or whatever
Uh but they have to tell
The employees they're doing that
I don't understand
Because there's a phone
There's a company in the city
That I call a lot
I use their phone
To call on their premises
It's a public phone
And I know it's tapped
Because I once saw
A phone worker
Working on the phone
I asked him
I said hey
Are these phones tapped
Because all I hear
Is click click click click
Yeah they're tapped
You know
What can you do about it
Well why would
Why would those particular
Phones be tapped
Is this a crazy company
Of some sort
It's a company that
You know has a lot of money
And they you know
It's an auction house
Uh huh
And I don't want to say
The name or what not
Well you see
You wouldn't be able
To tell a phone
Is tapped by clicks
Because we've reached
The stage where we can
Tap phones without
Making clicks
Yeah you're right
You've got to be right
But I asked this phone guy
He was working on a phone
He said yes they are tapped
You know
And ever since then
I just you know
I refuse to use a phone
And I'm wondering
Is it legal for them
To tap private phone calls
On a public phone
I don't know
That's a very good question
That is a very good question
I know they're doing
Everything now
Because of the war
On drugs
You know they have to
Invade people's privacy
All over the place
You know for your own protection
Uh that's that's a good question
I don't think it is
And I think that
I don't think it's
That we could stop it
But
You have to have a court
Order to tap
Somebody's phone
And I believe that person
Always has to find out
In the end
That his phone was tapped
Whether or not
He's charged with anything
Uh in the case
Of a public phone
Who do you tell
Do you tell everybody
That ever used it
Yeah no I think people
Just ought to be aware
That when they're in
A company's
Uh you know
When they're in
A company building
A building that's
Owned by a company
Watch it
I mean no
You know
If you're talking
Something illegal
You know you're probably
Going to know
The difference anyway
But you know
People that just
Make phone calls
In general
Shouldn't have to be
You know monitored
I don't think
It's ridiculous
Well people are being
Monitored a lot more
Than they think they are
In fact uh
The phone itself
Doesn't have to be
Monitored
The phone company
Could be monitoring
Their calls
While they're in progress
Was it on your show
That I heard
That they can actually
Hear what you're saying
Even though the phone
Isn't picked up
Well there are some
Phones that can do that
Uh alternative pay phones
Yes is a good point
In fact uh
Uh the magazine I work for
Had a had a letter
From somebody that uh
That said they
They saw this
Because what they did
Was they called up
One of these alternate
Pay phones
And they saw the number
On the phone
They went home
And they called that number
And it picked up
With a little computer
And they were able
To figure out
How to get into the computer
To make the phone
Do certain things
And they hit a button
And all of a sudden
They could hear
All the noise
Around the phone
They could hear
Cars starting up
They could hear
People walking around
It was sort of like
A room monitor feature
On a pay phone
So obviously
If any
If anybody
If any hacker
Could do it
They obviously
Are able to do it
Well it's there
For somebody to do it
Yeah it's a feature
So you have to wonder
What is the feature
Being used for
Yeah yeah
I mean
So yeah that
That telephone
Could be listening to you
Even with the phone
Right
Not off the hook
Hung up or what not
It's uh
Yeah it's scary
Yeah yeah
And who knows
It could be cameras
In the things too
You know
This is a surveillance age
Yeah
Great show
Great show
Alright thanks for calling
Thank you
Speaking of uh
Of 2600
We have our meeting tomorrow
If anyone is interested
In uh
Hanging out with a bunch
Of computer hackers
Uh we have meetings
Every first Friday
Of the month
At the Citicorp Center
In fact
Speaking of the
Citicorp Center
Uh talking about
Uh crazy corporations
That tap phones
I'm not saying necessarily
That they do that
Uh but somebody there
Suspected that they
Were doing this
And the result was
A big sign
On all of the pay phones
In the Citicorp Center
That said
Tapped
In other words
You walk up to this phone
And the first thing you see
Is a big word saying
Tapped
Makes you
Makes you think a little bit
Before you uh
You start making
Your phone calls
And that was
Based on somebody
Hearing some weird noise
When they
Picked up the phone
So they thought
Hey this means
The phone is being tapped
Maybe they were right
Maybe they were wrong
Who knows
Maybe they were right
Maybe they were wrong
Oh that's my voice
Good morning
Good morning
I have an experience
With a telephone company
That was very strange
I called
I couldn't find
A telephone number
Of a television station
And I looked
All through the book
And finally
I had to get information
And she told me
To look under W
Now it seems
Out there listed
Under wireless
But the general public
Doesn't know that
And I didn't know it either
So when she told me
I said
Do I have to pay
For this
She says
Yes
I says
Why
She says
Because she gave
You information
Well I said
I'm not giving you
Any money for this call
I want to speak
To your supervisor
And had a big argument
And she let me speak
To the supervisor
So the supervisor
Gives me an explanation
Why I have to pay
For the call
I said
I want to tell you something
I'd like to know
Why you bring all those
Ten pound books around
Twice a year
That we're paying for
If we have to pay for
All that lousy information
That we could get
What do we need
The telephone books
That you bring to the house
I have several copies
Of different photos
And they're no good
So we had a big fight
And she said
I wouldn't hang up
And finally
She says
Okay I won't charge you
Oh boy
Well that's
That's quite a story
Now did they
Did they not give
No I refused to pay for it
Well did they
Did they not give you
The number
You bring those books
A couple of times a year
The way it comes
Uh huh
And you can't
You don't know how to use them
Because they don't give you
Any instructions
How would a person know
That a television station
Or a radio station
Is on the W
Uh huh
Well now did they give you
The number at least
No she told me
If I look on the W
Alphabetically
I could find
You mean
You mean you called
But how would a person
Know to look on the W
Well you
You called
It wouldn't occur to me
In a million years
You called information
I don't tell you
I don't look for anything
You
You
You
You
And they bring me
Twice a year
And we paid for them
Okay
The yellow book
And the other book
And I think
The hold on thing
Is a real
Bracket
Let me just ask
One question
And I gotta go
To another call
Uh
You
You asked for a number
From information
And they didn't give you
The number
They just told you
Where to look
In the phone book
You told me
Where to look
That's incredible
On the right
Letter of the album
And they charge you
For that
That's uh
And I said
Do I have to
Pay for it
Can you do that
She says yes
I said why
She says because
That's what
You have to do
I said well
I'm not going
To pay you
Well I want to
Speak to her
Okay well
I think that's
Where we came in
Thanks very much
For calling though
And uh
And good luck
In the future
With these kind of
Things
That's what we need
To do
We need to stay
Informed
We need to stay
Outraged
Good morning
Oh hi
Good morning
Um
Enjoying the show
A lot
Uh
I've got a question
Yes
Uh
Last year
New York Telephone
Uh sent me a promotion
In the mail
Stating that
For two months
I would receive
Call waiting
For free
I could try it out
For two months
And at the end
Of the two months
I could decide
Whether or not
I wanted to
Continue the service
And they
Included a card
To fill out
And send back
To them
By a certain date
Uh stating
Yes I'd like to
Continue
And I'd be charged
Whatever the monthly
Charge was
Or if I didn't
Want the service
So at the end
Of the two months
I decided that
I didn't
Particularly want
The service
I filled the card
Out
Sent it to them
And probably
A week or so
Later I got
A telephone call
From New York
Telephone
Asking me
If I did
Want the service
And I told them
Over the phone
No I didn't
And I had sent
Them their card
Back
And they said
Fine
And to this day
I'm still
Receiving the call
Waiting service
But I'm not
Being charged
For it
And I guess
My question is
Is this ever
Going to
Are they ever
Going to
Dig this out
Or can I just
Continue enjoying
This mistake
Or should I
Eventually
They'll probably
Say
Call them
And call them
And say
Listen
You guys
Have made
A mistake
Here
Or can they
Charge me
For all
These months
No they
They can't
Charge you
Even if you
Hadn't told
Them that
They can't
Charge you
Retroactively
For something
Like that
What they'll
Do is
The worst
Thing they'll
Do is
They'll call
You and say
Hey it looks
Like you have
Call waiting
We're going to
Disconnect it
Unless you
Start paying
For it
And as of
That date
And you
Don't have
To worry
About paying
For something
That you
Certainly didn't
Want and you
Said quite a
Few times that
You didn't
Want it
So I wouldn't
Worry about that
All this is
Is a simple
Choice on a
Computer
Yes no
Call waiting
Yes or no
And someone
Just didn't
Put the n
On top of the
Y
That's all
This is
And until
Someone gets
Around to doing
That you have
Call waiting
And if you
Need to turn
It off for
Any time
You can always
Dial star
Seven zero
They don't
Tell you that
But that
Turns it off
For the length
Of one call
Okay
Alright thanks
For calling
Alright that's
Going to be
Our last call
Unfortunately because
We are running
Out of time
And it's just
About almost
One o'clock
Bob Fass is
Coming in
And it's
Been fun
It's been a lot
Of fun
It's been educational
And there's a lot
Of people out there
Sorry to all those
We didn't get to
It's
It's something
To keep aware
Of
And if you
Want to write
To us here
At the radio
Station
And share
Your experiences
Maybe we can
Read them over
The air
Next time
In two weeks
The address
Is WBAI
Program is
The fifth
Corner
This is
Emanuel Goldstein
And the address
Is 505
8th Avenue
New York
New York
10018
And remember
To keep
Looking around
Keep experimenting
Keep learning
Because if you
Don't you're
Going to be
Victimized
Thanks for
Listening
I'll see
You in
Two weeks
The Autonomous
Commie Republic
Which is part
Of the Russian
Federation
Is situated
In the far
Northwest
Of Europe
And spreads
Up to the
Arctic part
Of the Ural
Mountains
It's crossed
By nine
Northern
Parallels
Ten fair-sized
European states
Could be placed
On its territory
Besides indigenous
Residents
That is the
Commie people
There are also
Russians
Ukrainians
Nenetses
Chuvashis
And Tatars
And now
Let's go back
Into history
A little bit
For all those
People going to
Call up to
To say
What is this
It's negative land
A track entitled
Time Zones
See you in two weeks
And the tent
Was suddenly filled
With an announcer's
Voice speaking
Commie
Then with music
From Moscow
Followed by
English and
French speech
The recording
Was made at the
Moscow Theater
Of musical
Miniatures
Now back to
Modern times
Your attention
Please
At the recommendation
Of the International
Time Bureau
Commencing at
23 hours
59 minutes
60 seconds
UTC
An extra second
Will be inserted
Into the
NBS timescale
This adjustment
Is required
To maintain
Internationally
Coordinated
Universal time
As broadcast
From these stations
In close agreement
With UT1
Or astronomical time
WA-6-O-D-B
With a question
And uh
Do you know
How many time zones
There are in the
Soviet Union
And about power
We got so much
Power now
Do you know
How many time zones
There are in the
Soviet Union
We got so much
Power now
That's ridiculous
Do you know
How many time zones
There are in the
Soviet Union
Power
And all that
That's power
We got so much
Power
That's ridiculous
We have
Power
Power
Power
Power
Power
Power
Now
It's ridiculous
We got so much
Power now
Do you know
How many time zones
There are in the
Soviet Union
It's not even
Funny
You know
That's ridiculous
Do you know
How many
It's not even
Funny
You know
That's ridiculous
You know
How many
That's
That's ridiculous
Do you know
How many times
That's ridiculous
It's not even
Funny
You know
It's not even
Funny
It's not even
Funny
Do you know
how many time zones there are in the Soviet Union?
It's not even funny.
How many time zones?
Yeah. We have four in this
country, right? How many time zones?
Yeah. One, two, three.
Four in this country, right? Yes, sir.
Four.
One, two, three. Yes, sir. Right.
One, two, three. Yes, sir.
Four time zones?
Yeah. We have four in this country, right?
No, sir.
We have... Yes, sir.
And... Do you know how many time zones
they have? Yes, sir.
Four. No, sir. I never...
Sorry to interrupt this,
but I was told that I didn't give the
time for the hacker meeting tomorrow,
and if you're interested in showing up,
it starts at 5 p.m., between 5
and 8 p.m. at the Citicorp Center.
You all know where that is in New York City
in the lobby area. That's all.
Back to negative land.
11.
11. It's not even funny.
11.
11. That's ridiculous.
11.
11. That's what we can do.
We can go anywhere,
because we live here.
We can go anywhere else.
Yeah, but not only the right of free travel,
I'm saying 11.
11.
One, two, three. Yes, sir.
The 11.
11.
That's how big they are.
Yeah. Yeah.
11.
That's how big they are.
Yeah. Yeah.
I can believe that.
I'm a firm believer in that.
All right.
One, two, three.
Four.
Yes, sir.
One, two, three.
Yes, sir.
Yes, sir.
The Soviet Union's the whole half side of the world.
Yeah.
And we're just on a little, one little tent of the globe.
Yeah.
They, uh, when you talk about fighting,
we're a country that, uh, we're a firm believer on Christ,
and it's called help thy neighbor.
Do not kill, do not, you know, steal, cheat, lie from everybody.
That's why we have to have computers, because, man, nobody is perfect, you know.
It's not even funny.
You mean?
And about power, man, nobody is perfect, you know.
So what is your point?
Nobody is perfect, you know.
And as illustration that nobody is perfect,
let me remind you that you're listening to WBAI.
WBAI in New York.
Hi, this is Rosemary Reed,
and I'm inviting you to come join us in celebrating our 30th anniversary
on a Moonlight River cruise.
Dance to DJs Delphine Blue and Al Angeloro,
and live music with Professor Yolange and his African Contempo,
and Chico Alvarez and Nosotros.
Join us aboard the Floating Hospital at Pier 84 at 44th Street and 12th Avenue
at 7.30 p.m. for a cruise around Manhattan,
returning at 1 a.m.
Tickets for this benefit are $50 per person.
The proceeds from this event will go towards...
to hear you onto the floor.
Thank you.
Bye-bye.