The Forum will be broadcast live on Radio WBAI.
Join us Thursday, January 16th for a major forum on the U.S. and the Middle East.
The Forum will be broadcast live on Radio WBAI.
Carrier Wave live radio with Sidney Smith can be heard on alternate Sunday nights, Monday mornings, from 1 a.m. to 3 a.m.
Tune in.
And you're listening to WBAI in New York.
It's one minute after 9 o'clock, and that means it's time for Off the Hook.
The Forum keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a call.
It couldn't get much worse, but if they could, they would.
Bon Diddley Bom, for the best, expect the worst.
I hope that's understood.
Bon Diddley Bom!
And a very good evening.
two, one and all. This is Emmanuel Goldstein. The program is Off the Hook, where we talk
about high tech and low intelligence and various things like that. What will the future be
like, and how will you play a part in it? We'll be talking about that. We'll be going
over some of our terms at the popular request of many of our listeners. But first, here's
one look at the future.
We'll be right back.
Hello.
Hi.
Okay.
Hi.
Your extension or your name
To enter an extension, dial the extension
And then push enter on the end
The last letter, follow my first
Open the door
If you are entering a name, push stop or start
When you have finished dialing an extension
Push enter or enter
Do not push key in 5-7
You will be disconnected
And it's The Who starting us off here
And off the hook
With a song called 905
Will we be reduced to numbers in the future?
Oh yes, most definitely
The only question is
Which numbers will we be reduced to?
Who and how many?
That's what we're here to discuss
That's what we're here to help hash out
On the program, as always
Emmanuel Goldstein with you until 10 o'clock
We'll be taking phone calls at 212-279-3400
If you have any questions, comments, observations
Or information to pass on to us
And we'll be taking a look at exactly
Or sort of what's been going on around here
About in the world
In various forms of media
For instance, this piece from the Boston Globe
Of December 30th, 1991
They report that a disgruntled Honda owner
Called its Better Business Bureau information line
Toll-free customer relations number
So many times
That he clogged the line
He did the same to other 900
Excuse me, 800 numbers
Fatal slip there
And I'll tell you why it's a fatal slip in a second
He did the same to other 800 numbers
Used primarily by Honda employees and dealers
Somehow he got all their numbers
In both cases, he presumably used
An automatic redialing mechanism
Sometimes known as a demon dialer
He then began tying up a Honda facsimile number
Known as fax machines to most people
By transmitting multi-page letters
During a four-day period
American Honda Motor Company says
That it was forced to ask AT&T
To step in and block the calls
Which allegedly came from a Holliston, Massachusetts
Home
However, AT&T security said
That it also had to block any calls
To the Honda numbers
For the entire 508 area code
Which covers west and north of Boston
Attempts to reach the Holliston complainer
Were not possible because
The phone was unlisted
There's a few things wrong with this story
I don't know if it leaps out at you
As dramatically as it does to me
But I somehow doubt the phone company
Would be unable to reach somebody
Because their number was unlisted
It just somehow doesn't make sense to me
There are also questions being raised
As to whether or not caller ID
Might have helped prevent this
Well, I can tell you right here and now
Caller ID wouldn't have made a blessed bit
Of difference here
For one thing, when you're using 800 numbers
You have the capability of finding out immediately
The number of the person calling you
And if not immediately
Everybody has the capability of finding out
When they get their phone bill
And they see all the numbers that called them
No extra machinery to install
To get that particular option
So
Using this as a call for
Caller ID is unfair
To say the least
Continuing to other
Interesting
Stories here
Postal information
This is from a
Contributor to
The Risk's Digest
Douglas Jones
I believe at the
University of Iowa
I recently asked at my post office
How many houses share the same
Zip Plus 4 code with my house
The answer was that
If I lived in a single family dwelling
I almost certainly have a unique
Zip Plus 4 code
I note
That the
United States Postal Service
Known here to
With as USPS
Now provides a complete database
Of Zip Plus 4 addresses
In the country
It's on CD-ROM
And it's included in the
Postal exhibit
In Chicago's Museum of Science
And Industry
Where you can type in your address
As you would on a letter
And it gives you your
Zip Plus 4
In response
I tried it on my address
Here in Iowa
And it worked correctly
In fact I believe they have one
Downtown
At the 24 hour post office
At least they did
A couple of years ago
Now the risk that
Doug Jones sees in this
Is that statistical data
That has traditionally
Been available
Sorted by Zip code
Like census data
May be released
Broken down by
Zip Plus 4 codes
And if this is done
It destroys
Any promise
Of confidentiality
For such data
Of course
There is a benefit
You should be able
To send mail to me
With only a Zip Plus 4
No need to mention
City, state, street
Or house number
Someday you won't even
Have to mention a name
Just write down your number
And it will either
Call you on your
Wrist watch telephone
Or just deliver a piece of paper
To you no matter where you are
And finally
Today a bit on
Infrared barcoded security cards
That can be forged
By laser printers
Now this is posted by
A fellow in
Australia
Well to be honest
It's either Australia
Or Austria
I'm not quite certain
What
See on the internet
On the computer network
Known as internet
There are two letter codes
At the end
That indicate countries
Other than the US
The United States
Doesn't have
A two letter code
Because
Well I guess
We're just number one
Or something
But
For instance
The Netherlands
Is NL
The Soviet Union
And those few connections
That they do have
Is SU
Actually I guess
That will have to change
I don't know
What they're going to do
About that
But what we have here
Is AU
So AU is either
Australia
Or Austria
Not 100% certain
Which it is
But anyway
It came from
George Michelson
And
Speaks in rather
A bizarre way
So
You can
Make whatever
Judgment you wish
They handed the cards
Out in alphabetical
Order to staff
And the
Barcodes
Slash
Card numbers
Were congruent
And the batch
Was sorted
Skilled person
Not self
Examine three
In sequence
Calculated trivial
Encryption
And checksum
Algorithm used
Inferred card
For senior member
Of staff
Used public domain
Code to generate
Barcode strip
On Apple laser writer
Glued to card
And swiped through
Lock
Bingo
Instant access
To secured areas
Leaving calling card
Of self-same
High up
All over the
Online logs
I feel like I'm reading
A bit of Neuromancer here
Infrared readers
Also handle
Normal light codes
Good eyes
Can read
Thick
Slash
Thin
Sequences
In strong
Light
So even if
Numeric code
On card
Doesn't match
Bars
It's forgeable
Infrared
Also pretty
Trivial
To obtain
And I really
Think the
Local admin
Slash security
People have been
Blinded by science
Apart from
Anything else
The electromagnets
Which operate
The door locks
Look very
Subvertible
Nothing new
There
George
Another instance
Of hindering
The novice
And legitimate
Whilst barely
Impeding
Anybody
Intent on
Skullduggery
Ain't it the truth
Good normal
Law-abiding
God-fearing
People
Are the ones
That
Pay the
Price
And are
Inconvenient
By technology
But those
That know
How to get
Around it
Aren't
Affected
In the least
And it's
For those
People
That we're
Here tonight
Now we've
Been asked
On many
Occasions
To please
Define
Our terms
Less politely
We're
Asked
What the hell
Are we talking
About
There's so many
Little things
And so few
People are able
To get
What it is
That we mean
So tonight
We're going
To be
Defining
Defining
Our terms
In a rather
Blatant
Way
We're going
To actually
Show you
What we mean
When we say
Certain things
And that way
There shouldn't
Be any problem
In fact
Maybe you should
Get out a
Tape recorder
Or something
So we won't
Ever have to
Do this again
And you can
Spread it
Around town
And everybody
Will know
What we're
Talking about
From here on
With regards
To a few
Things
Obviously
We can't
Define everything
But it sure
Would make
Life a lot
Simpler
These are
Things that
People should
Know
They should
Have known
For ten
Years now
And it's
About time
That everybody
Knows this
Everybody
From your
Grandmother
To your
Five year old
Son
Everybody should
Know what
These sounds
That you hear
On the telephone
Are
And you
Phone company
Operators out
There that
Have the radio
Turned up
You should know
What these mean
And I know
A lot of you
Don't know
What they mean
Because
Often times
You've got me
On the line
And I ask you
What's that
Noise
And usually
The response
Is well
The phone
Must be
Broken
And no
The phone
Is not
Broken
The phone
Is engaged
In a
Form of
High technology
That you're
Not aware
Of
And you're
Being
Left behind
In the
Eighteenth
Century
And my
Patience
Has begun
To wear
Thin
All right
Let's take
A journey
Let's
Look at
Various
Terms
That we
Use
All the
Time
Some
Things
People
Know
I mean
Everybody
Knows
What a
Dial tone
Sounds
Like
All right
Thank you
Very much
Yes
That's a
Dial tone
That's
That's what
A dial tone
Sounds like
And that's
The sound
You get
When you
Pick up
Your phone
That's
Pretty much
The sound
Everybody gets
When they
Pick up
Their phone
Used to
Be different
Sounds
In various
Areas
But
That's
Pretty much
The sound
Everybody gets
And that's
Pretty much
What happens
If you
Let it
Go on
For too
Long
It hangs
Up on
You
Or gives
You a
Horrible
Sound
Or
Men
Come to
Your door
And
You know
Various
Things happen
If you
Leave your
Phone off
The hook
We don't
Advise it
But there's
Other things
That happen
After you
Get the
Dial tone
You can
Call things
You can
Connect to
Things
You can
Make your
Phone
Do magical
Tricks
Now
Let's take
A listen
To a
Typical
Ring
Alright
We're going
To call
Up
A number
And
Hear
What a
Typical
Ring
Sounds like
And I
Like everybody
To take
To take
Note
Of
This
Why do
We have
Our dial
Tone
Back
You know
I'll tell
You
This
BAI
Phone
System
It
Always
Okay
I think
We got
It now
Alright
I think
I messed
Up that
Time
Let's
Try this
One more
Time
Let's hope
This works
Simple
Simple thing
Of dialing
The phone
Can be
A real
Challenge
Here
Okay
That is
A phone
Ringing
Let's take
A good
Listen
To that
All that
Noise
Is the
BAI
Connection
And that's
What's
Basically
Known
As
Static
On the
Line
As
An
Electronic
Ring
Also
Known
As
ESS
Electronic
Switching
System
Or
Digital
Switching
Even
They all
Kind of
Sound
Exactly
The
Same
Which
Is a
Shame
Really
Because
They
Don't
Have
To
All
Sound
Exactly
The
Same
But
That's
That's
Another
Issue
All
Together
Now
It
Should
Be
Pretty
Simple
To
Tell
The
Difference
Between
An
Electronic
Ring
Thank
You
And
A
Mechanical
Ring
Now
What
We're
Going
To
Hear
Next
Is
A
Mechanical
Ring
Electromechanical
Ring
From
A
I
Believe
This
Is
A
Number
Five
Crossbar
Office
And
You'll
Hear
The
Very
Definite
Difference
Here
Note
The
Click
At
The
End
And
The
Different
Sound
Effect
That's
A
Number
Five
Crossbar
Ancient
From
At
Least
The
1950s
And
Let's
Take a
Listen
To
One
More
Where
Shall
We
Go
For
This
One
Okay
That's
That's
A
Number
One
Crossbar
And
Obviously
That's
People
Should
Be
A
To
Tell
The
Difference
Between
Those
Particular
Rings
Doesn't
Really
Make
Any
Difference
Except
You
Know
That
People
That
Don't
Have
The
First
Ring
Are
Unable
To
Get
Things
Like
Call
Waiting
And
And
Neat
Little
Services
Like
That
Okay
Busy
Signals
Are
Important
Too
It's
Important
To
Know
The
Difference
Between
Busy
Signals
What
They
Sound
Like
So
You
Know
When
You're
Actually
Getting
A
Busy
Signal
And
When
You're
Not
Getting
A
Busy
Signal
All
Right
Now
This
Is
A
Typical
Busy
Signal
I
Think
We've
All
Heard
This
Noise
Millions
Of
Times
Now
That
Is
An
Electronic
Busy
Signal
I
Guess
Is
The
Best
Way
To
Describe
That
But
That's
Coming
From
An
Electronic
Office
Or
A
Digital
Office
And
A
Busy
Signal
From
A
Non
Electronic
Office
A
Mechanical
Office
And
By
Office
That's
A
Term
For
The
Phone
Company
And
Every
Phone
Number
Goes
Through
An
Office
At
Some
Point
That
Is
A
Mechanical
Busy
Signal
Doesn't
Sound
Quite
As
Smooth
And
You
Can
Also
Hear
A
Click
At
The
Beginning
And
At
The
End
Okay
Let's
Listen
To
One
More
Variation
Of
That
And
This
Will
Give
You
A
Pretty
Thorough
Demonstration
That's
Another
Mechanical
Busy
Signal
So
Now
We
Know
The
Difference
Between
Electronic
Rings
Mechanical
Rings
Electronic
Busy
Signals
Mechanical
Busy
Signals
Now
Here's
Where
It
Starts
To Get
Interesting
When
Is
A
Busy
Signal
Not
A
Busy
Signal
When
It's
A
Reorder
What's
A
Reorder
Well
Keep
In
Mind
The
Noise
We
Just
Heard
The
Electronic
Busy
Signal
Get
That
Back
In
Your
Head
Because
We're
Going
To
Call
Something
That's
A
Slight
Variation
Of
That
And
We
Just
Lost
The
Connection
Again
Because
Of
This
Amazing
Wiring
Job
Here
I
Don't
Know
Who
To
Blame
The
Phone
Company
Or
Well
We'll
Get
Into
That
Later
Okay
This
Sounds
Very
Similar
To
The
Busy
Signal
We
Heard
But
It's
Different
Note
It's
Faster
And
We
Can
Get
The
Same
Exact
Noises
From
Those
Other
Offices
That
We
Call
We're
Not
Going
To
Go
Through
That
Because
It'll
Just
Take
Too
Long
But
It's
A
Fast
Version
Of
A
Busy
Signal
And
That
Is
Gotten
Not
When
Your
Phone
Is
Busy
But
When
You
Have
Failed
To
Get
Through
To
The
Phone
Number
That
You've
Called
For
Instance
If
If
I
Was
To
Call
My
House
Say
And
For
Some
Reason
All
Of
The
Circuits
Were
Busy
Going
Out
To
Wherever
It
Is
I'm
Calling
I
Might
Get
That
I
Did
Get
That
Or
A
Recording
Now
The
Busy
Signal
Is
A
Particular
Steady
Repeating
Tone
This
Is
A
Faster
Repeating
Tone
Indicating
That
Something
Is
Wrong
Somewhere
Along
The
Line
So
It's
Important
If
You
Get
An
Operator
On
The
Line
The
Operator
Tells
You
The
Line
Is
Busy
And
You
Hear
A
Noise
Like
That
You
Know
The
Line
Is
Not
Busy
You
Know
The
Line
Is
Having
Trouble
Being
Reached
At
Some
Point
Now
Where
That
Reorder
Is
Coming
From
It's
Hard
To
Say
It
Depends
On
A
Lot
Of
Things
Could
Be
Coming
From
Your
Local
Phone
System
That
You
Are
Calling
Out
Of
Could
Be
Coming
From
Something
That
You're
Not
Supposed
To
Dial
We
Have
That
Here
At
BAI
If
You
Try
Dialing
Things
Let
Let
Try
This
I've
Never
Actually
Tried
Dialing
Something
I'm
Not
Supposed
To
Dial
Here
At
The
Radio
Station
Oh
It
Just
Hung
Up
Immediately
Let's
Try
It
Again
That's
Interesting
It
Rings
Immediately
You
See
I
Got
That
By
Dialing
One
One
Digit
So
You
Can
Get
That
From
Your
Local
System
You
Can
Get
That
At
Any
Point
Between
The
Calling
Phone
And
The
Called
Phone
You
Can
Get
A
Reorder
But
A
Busy
Signal
Technically
Should
Only
Be
Coming
From
The
Phone
Itself
If
It's
Off
The
Hook
For
Whatever
Reason
Okay
Hopefully
That
That
Clears
People
Up
On
That
Troubling
Thing
I
Find
That
To
Be
One
Of
The
Most
Confusing
Aspects
Of
Telephone
Lingo
That
People
Can
Fathom
It's
Extremely
Important
To
Know
When
You're
Actually
Hearing
A
Real
Busy
Signal
And
When
You're
Not
That
Way
You
Won't
Be
Led
Around
By
The
Nose
Okay
Something
Interesting
This
Is
Just
For
For
I
Guess
Informational
Sake
There
Are
Different
Things
Called
Intercept
Recordings
And
Intercept
Recordings
Are
Things
I'm
Sure
We've
All
Heard
Occasionally
Take
A
Listen
To
This
One
Oh
Not
Again
This
Is
Starting
To
Annoy
Me
This
Should
Not
Be
Happening
We
Live
In
The
20th
Century
Here
We
Should
Be
A
To
Dial
A
Telephone
About
All
These
Heartbreaks
Okay
Here
We
Go
The
Number
You
Have
Reached
Two
Seven
Nine
Three
Four
Hundred
Has
Been
Changed
The
New
Number
Is
No
No
No
We're
Not
Going
To
Give
Out
Any
Information
Like
That
But
That
Is
A
Voice
We've
Heard
Many
Many
Times
It's
The
Intercept
Recording
It's
Mechanical
Or
Actually
Automated
Service
As I'm
Sure
99%
Of
Us
Would
Figure
Out
On
Our
Own
And
It
Basically
Tells
Us
What
Has
Happened
To
Certain
Numbers
That
We're
Trying
To
Reach
That
We
Can
No
Longer
Reach
Now
I'm
Going
To
Introduce
You
To
A
Second
Lady
That
Says
The
Exact
Same
Thing
In
Other
Parts
Of
The
Of
The
Country
As
Well
As
This
Part
As
Well
Completely
Different
Person
The
Number
You
Have
Reached
279
3400
Is
Not
In
Service
In
Area
Code
Okay
We're
Not
Going
To
Give
That
Away
Different
Person
Same
Basic
Message
Occasionally
You'll
Find
Weird
Ones
That
Are
Totally
Different
That
Are
Unique
Only
To
One
Or
Two
Areas
In
The
Country
And
In a
Moment
We're
Going to
Hear
One
Of
Those
The
Number
You
Have
Reached
279
3400
Is
Not
In
Service
Please
Check
The
Number
And
Dial
Again
The
Number
You
Have
Reached
279
3400
Is
Not
In
Service
Please
Check
The
Number
And
Dial
Again
Sounds
Like
She's
From
Lost
In
Space
Or
Something
Okay
So
That's
Intercept
Recordings
Now
We
Know
Rings
Busy
Signals
Reorders
And
Intercept
Recordings
Intercept
Recordings
If
You
Really
Want
To
Be
Cool
Are
Sometimes
Called
AIS
Automatic
Intercept
Something
Or
Other
Okay
Now
Home
Stretch
Here
We're
Going to
Take
Phone
Calls
If
People
Have
Any
Questions
Or
Comments
On
All
This
Or
Any
Additional
Bits
Of
Information
They
Like
To
Pass
Along
To
Now
If
You
Call
Something
And
You
Get
A
Strange
Noise
And
You
Want
To
Know
What
It
Is
Well
We
Might
Be
Able
To
Help
You
With
That
There's
Different
Types
Of
Devices
That
You
Can
Be
Connected
To
And
When
The
New
917
Area
Code
Begins
Sometime
This
Year
I
Believe
May
Or
June
It
Will
Be
Starting
Up
That
Area
Code
Will
Be
Devoted
Entirely
To
Various
High
Tech
Items
A
Couple
Of
Which
We're
Going
To
Show
You
Right
Now
Okay
The
First
Thing
You're
Probably
Going
To
Run
Across
Are
Fax
Machines
Fax
Machines
Are
Every
Place
And
It's
Important
To
Know
What
They
Sound
Like
Because
If
You
Reach
One
You
Want
To
Know
If
You're
Talking
To
An
Answering
Machine
Or
Just
Something
That
Can
Not
Possibly
Understand
The
Human
Voice
So
What
You're
About
To
Hear
Now
Is
The
Sound
Of
A
Fax
Machine
Picking
Up
You'll
Hear
No
It hung
Up
On
Me
This
Time
People
Please
Send
Us
Money
So
We
Can
Get
A
Real
Phone
System
Here
Thank
You
This is
Embarrassing
Is
What
This
Is
Okay
We
Made
It
Better
segundo
We
you
you
you
you
okay that's a fax machine and what a uh impressive fax machine that was
now keep that noise in your head don't let it escape because we're going to play something
that's very similar but very different and that's uh what's known as a computer modem
has a very similar sound to it but obviously it goes to a completely different device
and if you listen carefully if you um have a good ear you'll be able to easily tell the
difference between these two devices
so
okay that was a computer modem a slow speed computer modem we're going to now play a high speed
computer modem and those of you who are really good will have no trouble differentiating all three
of these noises
all right that was the bai phone system hanging up on us yet again let's try this one more time
oh
oh
okay
so
Yes, the high-speed computer modem.
Now we know fax machines, computer modems, but there's one more thing left for us to learn before we go to the phone calls, and that's the exciting world of beepers.
Yes, there's beepers to be found out there, and occasionally you will find one, and it's important to know what they are when you find one.
This is what a beeper sounds like when you connect to it.
All right, if you get the beeps and it just pauses, it's waiting for you to key in some digits, so key in some digits.
And always finish with a pound sign.
And it will acknowledge by beeping some more.
Now if you find another kind of a beeper, there's all kinds of different ones out there.
Some will make radically different noises than what we just heard.
You can also call what is known as a tone-only service.
That does not allow you to enter a phone number when you connect to it.
And that's what this next one will sound like.
Eventually, if it ever connects.
Okay, well this time I don't think it was the BAI phone system at fault.
I think New York Telephone failed us.
Not bad. We made about ten phone calls and no failures, so I guess that's above average for the phone company.
Let's give that another try and see how we fare connecting to a beeper that does not take input.
Notice there was no pause to allow you to put in numbers, and it hung up on us.
Those are all the sounds that you can hear these days if you make phone calls a lot and connect to things that sometimes you don't intend to connect to.
There are lots and lots of operators still that will hear those noises and tell you that the phone is out of order.
And will even go so far as to report the phone out of order, thinking that they're doing you a favor when in actuality they're really hindering things quite a bit.
So now we know how to differentiate between a busy, a reorder, we know modems, we know fax machines, we know beepers, we know intercept recordings.
And now I think we're ready for the 90s.
212-279-3400.
If you call that number now, you'll probably get a busy signal, and you should know what that sounds like.
But if you keep calling and keep trying, you'll probably get an electronic ring, and you should know what that sounds like as well.
Any questions, give us a call now. Any comments, give us a call.
So I'd like to throw it open to the first intelligent caller out there that can answer this question correctly.
And these are one of many of our consumer tips that we like to give out on this program.
How can you call, this is within New York, how can you call 411, which is directory assistance, without paying for it?
And, I should add, legally as well.
All right, that's our question for the night.
Feel free to call up with any questions of your own.
All right, let's go to the phones.
Good evening.
Yes, hello?
How you doing?
Okay, I don't know the answer to that question, but...
Okay, that's all right. We don't think any lower of you.
What I want to talk about is, you remember New York Telephone got a rate increase at the end of the 1990s.
It sticks in my head like a nail, yes.
Well, it was announced at that time that there would be a second and third stage of the introduction of higher rates, or different rates.
And what I don't think anyone knows is what's going on right now.
The commission has...
...there and come up with a settlement agreement to stabilize, if possible, the rates for the years 1992 and 93.
Proceedings are going on right now, and it's interesting who's involved in the proceedings and who isn't.
For instance, you have the big banks, very well represented by very competent legal counsel.
Some very large corporations are very well represented.
The public statewide is extremely well represented by the Consumer Protection Board.
And the Department of Law.
Then we have Erie County, the city of Buffalo, and Nassau County are very much involved in this.
On the city of New York, that telecommunications and energy committee is doing some very fine work in the case.
The one county that has a lot of residents who pay phone bills of various kinds but isn't represented, they're in the higher echelon of rate payers.
Not as high as Nassau, by the way, or Erie County.
That's Westchester County.
And the reason I mention all this, if there are people who live in Westchester County and pay phone bills, they might, you know, ask their county executives and so forth, the county law department.
I imagine there's quite a few people in Westchester that are paying phone bills and would be most indignant to realize they're not being represented.
Yeah, and of course, the rest of upstate New York and so forth, I don't see them at these meetings.
But there should be some interesting announcements coming out about this.
The phone company, for instance, has announced that they've arranged for early retirement for large numbers of non-management and management people.
And this is going to give them savings in the multi-millions of dollars, which will mean that their requirement for a rate increase may be lessened by that factor alone.
And those things are being investigated.
And if it doesn't come out of the agreement, we may have initiated several parties like the Department of Law and Consumer Protection Board might initiate a rate reduction application before the commission.
But right now, I just wanted to give you a listener.
You do a fantastic job with the telephones.
And I wanted to give everybody a status report of what's going on so far.
Thanks very much for calling.
You're welcome.
2-7-9-3-400 is our phone number.
And, you know, I have no trouble with early retirement for some people, particularly the people that keep calling me, asking me if I want to get call waiting.
I keep calling once every two months or so saying, well, do you want to get call waiting installed?
And every time they call, I say, sure, sign me up.
And, of course, two weeks later, I get a call from somebody else saying, sir, you can't get call waiting in your area.
You would think that somewhere they would have a little chart that tells them not to call people in this area because they can't possibly get call waiting.
But, no, they do not.
And they have these people waste their time calling every number in an exchange over and over again to ask them questions that don't even pertain to them.
So, yeah, I don't have any trouble with early retirement for them or for the people that set them loose.
2-7-9-3-400, always keep your eyes open for rate increases and things like that and what the phone company is trying to get away with.
Rate reductions are something that we should be looking at in the 1990s.
In all honesty, there's little reason why the rates cannot be rolled back.
Good evening.
Hello.
Yes.
I think I have the answer to your question.
Okay.
What's the answer to the question, which was, how do you dial 411 in New York without paying for it?
Okay.
First, I think they switched over to 555-1212.
Well, either one will work.
Okay.
And the way I get it free is from any pay telephone.
That's correct.
Well, not from any pay telephone, mind you.
Oh, really?
Not from any pay.
If you do that from what's known as a COCOT, which is a customer-owned, coin-operated telephone,
which is a non-New York telephone pay phone, it's very likely they'll charge you up to 50,
maybe even 75 cents for a call to information.
However, Public Service Commission rulings state that they have to keep a phone book on the premises,
either next to the phone or somewhere on the premises of the organization that owns the phone,
which is usually the corner shop or whatever.
So, if they don't do that, they're in violation.
Okay.
Also, I had a question.
Yeah.
You know, the intercept recording that you played, I live in Westchester, 914 area code.
Uh-huh.
And at the end of the recording, they, um, say, you know, you know, they give the recording
that you played, and they say 914-1-T.
Right.
I don't know what they mean by that.
Well, that's, uh, that's a New York telephone recording that you're getting, and that's simply
a, uh, a locator, basically, telling you where the recording is emanating from.
Uh-huh.
What are you trying to call when you get that?
Um, I'm trying to think.
Well, it's usually, um, the number's out of service, or it's been switched to another
number.
Uh-huh.
And, you know, they give the number that it's switched to.
Uh-huh.
It's basically telling you where the recording is coming from.
And it's, it's useful if, say, um, during, during an earthquake or something, you're trying
to call California, and you get a, um, a recording that says 702-1-T, then you say to yourself,
702, that's Nevada.
That means my, my phone call made it all the way out to Nevada and got intercepted there
and, uh, was sent back.
Uh-huh.
So you're able to sometimes figure things out by, uh, by using those codes.
Uh-huh.
So, um, what exactly does the 1-T stand for, though?
You know, I, I used to know that.
It's, um, it's the particular office that the, uh, recording is emanating from, the particular
location.
I see.
I could probably, you know, look that up and find out exactly where that's coming from.
You know, the address and everything of, of where it's coming from.
But to most people, that wouldn't, wouldn't really be of interest anyway.
Uh-huh.
Well, I was just curious.
Yeah.
Well, do I win anything?
Uh, no, just, just our, our respect.
All right.
Great program.
All right.
Thanks for calling.
I guess I should have mentioned that we don't give away prizes.
But, uh, uh, at BAI, that goes without saying.
Good evening.
Good evening.
Uh, I'd just like to say, as far as getting, uh, 411 for free, also, if you're legally blind,
you can, you can get 411 or any other information for free.
Good point.
Now, um, I believe, is that through, uh, TDD?
I, I wouldn't know.
Okay.
I mean, all I know is I, I, I, I'm signed up with AT&T and New York Tel, and I get, uh,
calls for nothing.
Uh-huh.
Actually, that's, that's kind of a silly question, because TDD is a, is a teletype service, and
of course, if you're blind, you wouldn't be able to, uh...
Well, you can do it with a computer, but, uh, deaf people get a reduced rate, uh, because
they have to stay on longer to communicate.
I saw a demonstration of, of a service for, for the deaf, where you call an 800 number,
and you connect via teletype, and you literally type in communication with an operator, and
ask her for the number.
I'm not sure if it's AT&T or New York Telephone, they have an office near Albany, whereas if
you or I wanted to talk to a deaf person, we call that 800 number, and they connect us
to the deaf person, and they act as the go-between, uh, and we get charged for the call to that
person, to that deaf person.
We get charged regular rates, but if the deaf person calls us through that service, he,
he gets charged a reduced rate, uh-huh, because it's on his line.
Uh-huh.
I, I just have a, uh, a few other questions, and this is really my first time, and I imagine
you've been asked this dozens of times before.
I know, for example, if you dial 958, you get your own number played back to you.
Right, I'm told that works in northern New Jersey, isn't it?
Uh-huh.
Uh-huh.
Uh-huh.
Uh, and are there any, like, special numbers that, like, you can give where an average consumer
might be interested?
Well, there's, um, I mean, as far as just strange noises and things?
Say, to get your own phone to ring.
Well, uh, to get your own, it depends where you are, what, what, what...
In the Bronx.
You're in the Bronx, so, um, it would probably be through the 660 exchange for you, uh, but
that, that works differently in different areas of the city.
Uh, in other parts, uh, usually it's an, it's an unused exchange, um...
But what I, I mean, I, I used to dial 660, wait for a dial tone and dial 6 and hang up
and the phone would ring.
Uh, I don't think that works anymore.
Uh, what happens if you dial 660 now?
I haven't tried it in years.
In a lot of places, it's 660 plus the last four digits of your phone number.
Oh, I see.
And you get a dial tone, you, you hang up, pick up again and hang up and it rings.
Uh, and, and other places, it's a, it's a, an exchange similar to 660.
I remember at one point it was 550 in a particular area, but of course, 550 was then taken over
by the conference calls.
Um, it's, it's an unused exchange in most cases for that particular kind of ringback.
But then there's other ones.
Sometimes there's ringbacks hidden in working exchanges.
Uh, so you really have to search around for that and sometimes try to con it out of your
local lineman when he comes over to fix your phone.
Um, so one way to get it for sure.
Okay.
This is, this is a good way to get it.
If you have a, um, some kind of a, a call recorder, like the kind Radio Shack used to
sell, which I'm really kind of annoyed that they stopped selling.
That prints out all the phone numbers that are dialed on your line.
Uh, if you have the phone man over and you say, hey, can you make sure my phone is working
and he'll call the ringback line and have it ring back.
Well, your little Radio Shack machine will print out the number he called.
Well, another thing is you can just record what he's doing and if you've got good enough
ears, you can listen to the tape again.
Yeah.
If, if, uh, you can decode touch tones assuming you use touch tones.
Yeah.
Or even the, if he dials it, you can kind of count the number of, uh.
Well, you can't have another phone off the hook if he's dialing it though.
That's, that's the only problem there.
Uh, there is a, uh, I think Radio Shack even makes it, uh, I'm not, it's the, uh, some kind
of testing equipment where you can actually record off the line and it doesn't look like
a pickup.
Uh, it's, it can hear the line, but it doesn't look like a pickup.
Uh-huh.
Well, there's all kinds of devices like that, so, uh, if you're, if you're really looking
for some bit of information, you'll probably find it.
Thanks very much for calling, uh, see if we can get through a few more phone calls tonight.
Good evening.
Hi, I want to ask about, uh, call forwarding.
Yeah.
And if you dial, can you tell that the phone's been call forwarded?
Well, you know, it's a very interesting question because most cases you cannot, well, at least
you should not be able to, but in some cases you can.
Right, I've experienced that.
And my other part of the question is, if I call, let's say, within 212 and somebody's
got a call forwarded to California, do I pay the cost to go to California or do I pay within
the New York?
No, they, they pay for a call from their home phone to California every time you call their
home phone.
You only pay for a call to their home phone.
Right.
But I've noticed sometimes you call and there's like a short ring and then you hear a different
ring and that's usually a call forwarding.
I was wondering if that's...
Well, that sounds like a, um, uh, a customer installed call, call forwarding device that
simply takes a phone, picks it up, transfers it to another line and makes a call on that
line.
Uh, sometimes you have crude instruments that do that, but phone company call forwarding,
uh, is supposed to work seamlessly.
Uh, but what happens, especially with the DMS 100 switch is that sometimes you'll get either
inordinately long pauses that tells you that something strange is going on, or you'll even
hear the MF tones that tell you what phone number it's being, it's being forwarded to.
So you'll call somebody and you'll hear, you know, after, after about the right amount of
time that it should start ringing, you'll suddenly hear this burst of MF tones, multi-frequency
tones, not touch tones, but those ones you hear sometimes on long distance calls.
And if you're able to translate those, you'll figure out what line it's being, it's being
forwarded to, which is absurd.
There's no reason for that to, uh, be revealed at all.
Right.
So, uh, beware of that.
Thanks a lot.
Okay, thanks for calling.
We have, uh, a couple more phone calls I'm going to try to get to.
Good evening.
Anybody there?
Hello?
Yeah, go ahead.
Oh, good.
Yes.
I had, uh, turn down your radio.
Okay.
My problem is this.
I had two, um, questions.
What would the purpose of a beeper be that you can't input anything into?
I mean, how does that, how does that happen?
Very good question.
Um, the old beepers, beepers of old, were all like that, where you could only call it
and beep somebody, and only one person would ever be beeping you.
For instance, a doctor would only be beeped by his office, so there would be no reason for
him to enter a phone number.
Uh, it's for, it's for circumstances like that where either one person has that number
or you can only be beeped by one particular circumstance.
Gotcha.
That's interesting.
All right, that makes sense.
And my other point, another one I had is that my past couple phone bills just thought
might be of interest.
The last two calls have been like to these faraway places that I don't even know where
they are.
And it's been the last two calls in the past two bills.
And, um, of course they promise.
I mean, they, they show up on your phone bill the same number.
Yeah.
The same, like, last two days of each bill.
Really?
Yeah, it's interesting.
I just, I, knowing you're interested in these matters.
How, how, how long are the calls for?
Oh, serious money, double digits.
But how, how much time is spent on the, uh, uh, close to an hour on one.
Really?
And how far away is this?
Oh, somewhere in the direction of the Caribbean, I guess.
Really?
Now, uh, you have full access to your line?
You know that, that, that's not made on, on your premises anywhere?
Yes.
Um, I, I, I, I, I would, I would definitely suspect that, uh, that somebody somehow is
tapping into your line at some point.
It's interesting.
And, and, I mean, in the past there's been some random things.
You know, there's, you know, there's, like, a, a few of these calls, and then they just,
you know, there, there goes, there's 6-1-1, you call for a check or some kind of nonsense
that we're supposed to come and check the line or do some kind of thing to see if it wasn't
a cross, whatever.
But now they're, you know, they're insisting to have it.
Well, if it's, if it's, like, if it's large fraud like you described, it's likely that
somebody is doing it intentionally.
And the fact that it shows up at the end of every month, maybe they're, they're timing
it, but they're timing it wrong because it should show up at the beginning of the month
so they can get the maximum amount of time before you notice it.
And, but, uh, by no means pay for those calls.
They, they're, they're conciliatory on that point, although they, they, they don't absolutely
swear.
I mean, technically I think that they, I don't know what, they're legal.
Uh-huh.
Tell them, you know, I think.
Well, again, uh, one of those devices would certainly help you out if, uh, if they still
made them, uh, at Radio Shack.
It would tell you when your phone was in use.
Uh, but for now, perhaps you can get a telephone that lights up when someone picks up an extension
and then you can, uh, catch these people red-handed.
Oh, that's thoughtful, too.
That's wonderful.
All right.
Well, good luck on that.
We're going to try to take a couple more phone calls.
Yeah, people can always, uh, tap into your line at some point.
The question is, who's doing it and from where?
Good evening.
Hello.
Go ahead.
Yes, uh, bicycle messengers also use the, um, steepers that can't have, uh, input.
Uh-huh.
Well, they got a, you know, the, it's only the office calling to give you a new assignment.
Yeah.
I understand gangs use them, too, to, uh, to notify everybody to show up at a certain point.
Really?
I would think they have the higher tech ones because it's used in various...
Various trafficking and so on.
Yeah.
Um, like the, uh, uh, I wanted to ask you about, uh, personal communication networks and,
uh, or these things, the, the idea that you have a phone number instead of, uh, a phone.
Uh-huh.
Uh, have you, do you know what I'm talking about?
Uh, vaguely.
That's something that's, that's starting to rear its head.
You mean we're basically, we have a number and we're at that number 24 hours a day no
matter where we go.
Right.
And the nearest phone gets that, uh, call because we're also being tracked by satellite or something.
Yeah.
It's sort of like having a cellular phone implanted into you.
Yeah.
Uh, in the Times Week in Review on Sunday and, uh, shook me up a little.
Yeah, it, it, it shakes me up quite a bit because, uh, while I see some, uh, some advantages
to such technology, I also see a lot of, uh, of possible consequences that can really
be harmful to people's privacy, especially if we get used to that kind of thing.
Uh-huh.
But, um, unfortunately we don't have enough time to even scratch the surface of that,
but that's a, that's a great topic for a future show.
Okay, I, I just wanted to say one other thing, which is, uh, there was, uh, earlier you had
two examples of the, uh, reading of, uh, a number, the number blah, blah, blah is not
in service.
Right.
And the second one you said sounded particularly like it was lost in space.
Yeah.
I think what was going on there years ago, like maybe 15 years ago, I read an article
in the Times about a woman whose voice is actually used for these recordings.
Uh-huh.
And they said that each number, each digit, is recorded seven times.
There's seven versions of it depending on where it falls in the thing, so that you have
the cadence of the reading of a number.
Seven, seven, seven.
Uh-huh.
If all of the sevens are alike, if each digit is alike, it sounded like the second call
that you had.
Yeah.
Uh, it was, each digit was simply recorded once and stuck in wherever, which is why
it sounded so alien.
No falling intonation, yes.
That's probably what happened.
No difference in the intonation, so it sounded like, uh, somebody from, uh,
another planet.
Yes.
Okay.
Thank you.
Thanks very much.
One more call, and then we're out of here.
Good morning.
Good evening, rather.
I'm sorry.
Hi, Emmanuel.
How you doing?
Based on some of your last previous programs, I had subscribed to cable and wireless.
Uh-huh.
Which has some very interesting features, but the one I wanted to mention to you that you
had not mentioned is that by using their local calling option, the 950 number from my own
phone, it seems to me quite possible to take myself completely out of the 9X system.
That's quite true.
If, uh, if you make all your calls using the 950 service, yes, I don't know if you would
save money making all your calls that way.
Uh, for instance, if you called, you know, your next door neighbor, I think it would undoubtedly
be cheaper to use, uh, uh, 9X for that, especially if it's a long call, but not significantly,
especially at night.
They also offer discounts on selected numbers, uh-huh, cable and wireless does, and it just
seems that as a possible kind, I mean, I don't like 9X, I would even pay more to avoid
them, so.
Well, lots of people have that, uh, that feeling towards them.
An interesting method of protest of a large number of people began to do such things.
Uh-huh.
Listen, we have about 10 seconds.
Any, uh, final comments?
Well, just thank you for your show.
Okay.
Take care.
Thanks very much for calling.
At least, uh, one happy person that has, uh, discovered the joys of 950 numbers, which
is something that, uh, we've talked about in the past, and hopefully we'll talk about
in the future.
It's, uh, time for us to get out of here, so, uh, we're going to get out of here and make
room for the, uh, personal computer show.
Program has been off the hook.
This is Emmanuel Goldstein.
I'll be back again, uh, at some point during the marathon, begging for money and things
like that.
Stay tuned, uh, we'll be in touch.
This is WBAI in New York.
We couldn't get much worse.
But if they could, they would.
Bon, diddly, bon, for the best, expect the worst.
I hope that's understood.
Bon, diddly, bon!
Bon, diddly, bon, diddly.
Bon, diddly.
Be blessed.
Oh.
The night of Friday, January the 10th, 3 a.m.