...regularly contributes to that magazine.
Second of all, I would agree that the whole concept of a one world government doesn't
seem as far-fetched as it used to be at the height of the Cold War when you had this polarization
of the entire planet.
In fact, I think that the motion toward a one world, even in light of all the nationalist
outbreaks, seems to make more sense given the fact that unless we do have a strength
in the United Nations, we're going to continue to see the blood feuds of the last thousand
years being played out, not along ideological lines, but simply along hatred lines and very
petty kinds of considerations that could be very easily raised to the level of genocide
like what we're seeing here.
So I think in that sense, the motion toward a one world government makes a lot more sense
than it did at the height of the Cold War when it seemed virtually impossible with the
United Nations stalled between the two gigantic superpowers.
And lastly, you mentioned, yeah, why can't BAI gain more access to the established media?
Well, we try.
We do send press releases out.
However, there is something called self-censorship.
That is, if you're part of the established media and you tend to be sympathetic toward
many of the positions of BAI, you realize that your boss has a blue pencil.
And if you stick your neck out too much, he may use that blue pencil on your paycheck.
So there is something called self-censorship, even though, of course, it's not this monolithic
conspiracy, especially in the smaller communities.
There definitely is self-censorship going on in the editorial boards of many media outlets.
Well, unfortunately, time is up.
This is Dr. Michio Kaku, and again, this has been Exploration.
And starting next week, we're going to have coverage of the Republican National Convention
aired from Houston, Texas.
In fact, on Monday and Wednesday of next week, in the evening, I'll be part of the evening
commentary commenting on the Republican National Platform's position on weapons and the environment.
Well, unfortunately, that's all we have for Exploration.
This is Dr. Michio Kaku, professor of nuclear physics at the Graduate Center of the City
University of New York, and this has been a weekly program that airs every Wednesday
evening from 8 o'clock to 9 o'clock, and discusses the issue of war, peace, and the
environment.
Good evening.
The following preview has been approved for all audiences.
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I'm Michael G. Haskins, host of Half Past Three with Michael G. Late-night, early-morning
radio coming your way alternating Tuesdays, 3.30 to 6 a.m.
The only program in the metropolitan area dedicated to late-night workers, early-morning
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And at the station you're listening to now, it's just about 9 o'clock, which means once
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I'm Michael G. Haskins, host of Half Past Three with Michael G. Late-night, early-morning
radio coming your way alternating Tuesdays, 3.30 to 6 a.m.
The only program in the metropolitan area dedicated to late-night workers, early-morning
risers, and people who are out where they've got no business being with someone they've
got no business being with.
And a very good evening to one and all, the program is Off the Hook.
This is Emanuel Goldstein with you until 10 o'clock, talking about high-tech, low-intelligence,
and the changing world they're in.
We'll be taking phone calls for a good part of the evening with questions, comments, observations,
that kind of thing on computer hackers, changing technology, your own personal experiences,
and things of that nature.
My number is 212-279-3400.
Leave off the 212 if you're in the area codes.
Add a 9 if you're inside an office.
And of course, dial 1 where appropriate.
You know, there comes a time in everybody's life when you have to sort of face the inevitable.
And that time came for me back in my senior year of high school, when I realized that I was a hacker.
And now, after a good deal of counseling and, you know, self-observation, looking deep within
one's soul, you realize that what started off as just a game of curiosity has become something so much more complicated,
so much more meaningful.
And I guess that's similar to various endeavors people get involved with throughout the course of their lives.
You wouldn't think that just playing with a computer after school, and I'm talking about a DEC-10 system.
Yeah.
One of the oldest computers I can possibly think of, one of the slowest computers I can possibly think of.
This is back in the days when 300 baud was considered fast.
Well, these days 9600 baud is considered slow.
But that particular chain of events led like a stepping stone to a series of different events.
And now today we have a world where computer hackers are looked upon as tantamount to terrorists,
where freedom of speech is being threatened on a daily basis, and where nobody really knows what lies ahead.
Now, you know, when you get involved with something like this, you don't think that you're doing it to change the world
or to make a significant difference. You're just out to have fun.
You're out to explore. You're out to answer those questions nobody else will.
And you wander around and you do things that some people will frown upon, others won't understand.
And there are those few that will actually condemn what you do and think that you're dangerous.
And throughout my early hacking years, that's precisely what happened.
You know, I plod along trying to find things out, trying to learn how particular systems work,
exploring where some people say you shouldn't explore, making free phone calls, figuring out how the whole network works.
And then you translate that into something that could be a bit more meaningful.
You try to communicate with more people and share knowledge.
And right about that time is when you get hit with your first count of conspiracy
and, you know, trying to overthrow various governments and things like that.
Because when they see you talking to other people and teaching other people and learning from other people,
that is when you become dangerous.
Communication has always been the biggest fear of those in power.
Communication amongst the masses.
That's partly why phone calls are made rather difficult for most people to obtain legally.
That is, calling around the world, speaking to people whenever you want to speak to for however long you want to speak to them.
It's always something that's just a little bit out of reach.
Well, computer hackers and phone freaks know that that's not necessarily so,
that it is possible to communicate with anybody, anytime.
It's only a question of desire, knowledge and skill.
And as the years passed by, I found myself more and more involved in spreading information
and learning things from people that I've never met, people around the world,
and finding that same curiosity, that same desire to share information.
And as we get closer to the present day,
it's become so much more apparent that there's a bigger picture here than just playing games with computers and phones.
It's a question of control, a question of power,
a question of what people wish to prevent us from actually doing and having.
And as we progress into the 90s, we realize that this is a fight that's not going to end,
not in a conceivable future.
Right now, we're playing on the front line as far as freedom of information, freedom of technology.
And who would ever think that when you get involved with something as a kid,
that it can progress to something so serious?
That's, I guess, a word of maybe warning to people out there that are just starting out.
Because it leads to interesting things.
I don't regret any of this because it's fascinating.
It's more fascinating with every passing year.
But if you're looking for something just to pass the time and that's it,
you might get more than you bargained for.
You know, a lot of times you have to also do the unpopular thing to stand up for your beliefs.
And that's something that hacking has taught me more than anything.
You wouldn't think that based on what the media says.
You would think that hacking is something that degenerates you and makes you lose all your values.
But in actuality, I've gotten most of my values through hacking,
through communicating with people, through realizing what the difference is between right and wrong.
And lots of times you will see right and wrong right there in your own community.
And the question is, do you know when to speak up and when not to speak up?
Interesting question, I think.
Our number is 212-279-3400.
And we're going to take some phone calls, answer some questions,
and spread a bit of information in that way of ours.
Here's a bit of information.
A book has come out called the National 800-900 Telephone Service Code Book.
Sounds really illegal, I suppose.
A directory of the hidden codes in 800 and 900 long-distance phone numbers,
plus a listing of long-distance carrier access codes.
1,641 listings.
It's kind of silly, actually.
This book really contains things that are not hidden.
I mean, anybody can find out this information.
And it's not a code book in that it has illegal information or anything like that.
This is all information that people have the right to know.
For instance, what telephone exchanges are carried by what long-distance companies.
I'll read you what's on the back of this book.
Did you know that the first three digits after the 800 in every toll-free phone number are a hidden code,
identifying the specific long-distance carrier handling the call?
Well, Jiminy Cricket, I'm knocked over by that.
Same with 900 numbers.
Did you know that every long-distance phone company has a three-digit dial-up code number
for directly accessing its facilities from any phone?
Private direct access numbers are also held by states, federal agencies,
military switchboards, banks, satellite companies, data and computer services,
emergency networks, credit card companies, radio paging services,
and large corporations for their own internal voice and data communications.
This unique reference guide for the first time offers the key to all of these hidden codes.
In addition, an explanation of 800 service, 900 service, and direct access CIC codes is provided along with other information.
This data can be put to many professional uses or to add to one's hobby interest in communications
or merely used to keep a person informed regarding systems encountered by most of us on a daily basis.
Don't get me wrong, I think the idea for this book is great.
I think these kind of books should be passed around and people should learn this information.
But there's nothing secret about this.
This is public information.
It's the kind of thing that should be passed along.
For instance, me telling you that the 800 exchange of 788 belongs to Sprint.
Now that's not exactly earth-shattering news.
You won't see that on World News Tonight or anything like that.
But it's information that's in this book.
It's information that people should know.
It's the kind of thing that people deserve to know.
I'll read you a short piece in here, and I'll tell you how to obtain this book if you're so interested in it.
It's called Making it Hard for Hackers.
Unix System Laboratories, AT&T of Summit, New Jersey,
produces computer software that is used by universities, telephone companies, corporations, financial institutions, and others.
Noting that many of the users of their software maintain vital records and files,
Unix has developed software that the company claims is impervious to hackers attempting to break in via telephone
to cut checks, change credits, school or employment records,
or pry industrial, military, and other secrets from unattended computers.
Of course, that's not the kind of thing hackers generally do.
They do break in, but they don't tend to steal things.
And of course, we all know when AT&T says that something is impregnable,
we know just how much value to put into that.
As of this writing, Unix claims that nobody has been able to hack through their security system,
and Unix has proudly challenged any would-be intruder to best or worst at,
actually, I'm sorry, I skipped a couple of lines there because it's at the bottom of the page,
any would-be intruder to give it a whirl.
The company has established a toll-free dial-up number hackers could use
to do their best or worst at attempting to get through the system.
The new Unix software has been redesigned specifically to dumbfound hackers.
The people who run most corporate mainframe computers,
they're called systems administrators,
usually have free access to their systems via special super-user logins.
Under the new security-enhanced Unix system,
this all-powerful, omnipotent user has been eliminated,
and basically, roles have been assigned.
For instance, someone doing a file system backup can do only backup
and cannot read the contents of files.
At publication time, the toll-free hacker test number had not been announced.
Those interested might wish to check directly with Unix to find out the number
and confirm that the test is still in effect.
Their telephone number is 1-800-233-1222.
We welcome any feedback as to what exactly can be found at that particular number.
The National 800-900 Telephone Service Codebook is obtainable from CRB Research Books, Inc.
They publish all kinds of interesting things.
Written by Kenneth Sperry.
CRB Research can be reached at P.O. Box 56, Comac, New York, 11725.
And they may very well have put out some more material like this since this book has come out.
Again, a guide to 800 and 900 prefixes.
Now, I should also point out that that's about to change.
It's going to be a period where you won't be able to tell.
In other words, while 788 may be U.S. Sprint,
in the future, every single 800 number is going to go to a unique company.
In other words, 788-1234 could be Sprint.
1235 could be MCI.
It won't necessarily be dependent upon the exchanges.
So, we're talking about technology that changes so quickly,
it's kind of hard to have a book to keep up with it.
You need more of a computer program, really, that keeps updating itself every day.
Sort of like directory assistance or something like that.
All right, we're going to take some phone calls.
212-279-3400, that's our telephone number.
Give us a call and tell us what is on your mind.
Let's go to the phones.
Good evening.
Hi.
How are you doing?
I don't have a very exciting call, but I'd like to know,
can you tell me, on an ordinary telephone line, there's a red and a green,
which is when the line is open, the positive side?
That's a very basic question there.
There doesn't seem to be any in the textbooks,
and I realize a lot of phones don't seem to be sensitive to the polarity,
but I do believe if you're hooking up a system,
you'd be smart to hook it up the way that...
These days, I don't think it really makes a difference that much.
I mean, I believe red is tip, or I don't know.
To give you an example, I never even paid attention to that.
You know, you can change the polarity.
I don't want to have to call a phone company.
No, you definitely don't.
Maybe that's the only thing I can do.
You don't want to do that.
Well, they won't tell you anyway, and if they do tell you, it'll be completely wrong.
What exactly are you trying to do?
Are you just trying to hook up a phone?
I'm just hooking up, you know, wiring a phone system.
And I was just kind of curious what the proper way to do it,
because the first line is usually red and green,
and the second line, I guess, is black and yellow.
As long as it's the same on both ends.
You see, that's really all you have to worry about,
because, you know, you have a red wire and a green wire going from point A to point B.
You know, the wires are the same.
They're not any different.
So as long as you're...
I understand.
I have an electrical background.
I just...
Right.
When there's a code, there's a code, and you can't intuit that.
Yeah, I realize that, but what I'm saying is,
sometimes the phone company puts it in a weird way.
You know, it's red is one way, green is the other way.
So while I could say, you know, red is positive...
Well, be consistent, I guess.
Be consistent, yeah.
And you'll know very quickly if it's hooked up wrong.
And if it's hooked up...
You only have two choices.
Polarity sensitive.
You don't need all four wires.
Like, you know, it was used in the past.
Nobody uses ground anymore.
One other question, and it's quite interesting.
It has to do with call waiting.
And, you know, your friends, and they're interesting, the phone freaks.
I really do get bothered where people feel that they have impunity
to enter into other people's private worlds.
Well, what makes you think hackers are the ones that are guilty of that?
Well, I think human beings are guilty of it,
and if people have developed that power.
You know, the article in the New York Times a couple of weeks ago
seemed to indicate that the hackers get kind of bugged at each other.
Well, you know, I'll be honest with you.
That article was a travesty.
I talked to that reporter for at least an hour,
and he did not print anything, any even conception of what I tried to explain to him.
He had the story written from the start, apparently,
and made it seem as if we had a couple of roving hacker gangs
that are fighting against each other.
That's not the case at all.
Why don't you talk about it on the air, then?
Well, that's what I'm doing.
We've got individual people.
I just want to know if...
I'm sorry.
I want to know if you got that impression from reading the article at all,
that we're not talking about roving gangs.
We're talking about individual people that are into this kind of thing
that each have a different case that, you know, are not really harming anybody.
I mean, I'm sure that's not the impression you got.
Well, the impression that I got is that they had gotten certain kinds of information
concerning their credit record
and were making it public or misusing it in ways
or even phoning it up into systems.
It wasn't totally clear what they were doing wrong,
but, you know, even the intention of doing it is kind of stepping over the line.
Well, the thing is, you know, you can say that somebody posted a credit report someplace.
Sure.
Now, somebody can say this person did it.
Somebody else will say this other person did it.
It's really impossible to say who did and who did not.
And you can do it in other ways besides hacking.
You can be an attorney.
Of course.
You can file an incorrect legal report into a credit area.
But if you think that these teenage kids are the only people that are seeing our credit reports,
you know, that's something you're definitely missing because anybody can do it.
I think what Unix is doing is, if what you said earlier, I had not heard of this,
is the most intelligent thing, you know, which is to dare people to break their system
rather than get involved in this legal BS.
Well, you know, a lot of those dares are really kind of tainted because, you know,
my view on that, there was a company that did this a few years ago.
They said that they had some kind of a dare, even though I don't know anybody that took it up.
They said 10,000 hackers tried to break in and they couldn't.
And my challenge to them was, well, okay, if it's so secure, why don't you tell us who's using the system now?
And we'll see if we can break into that.
Well, you know, if they make the dare reasonable and put a little cash up front.
Well, you see, you don't know.
They could just have a modem hooked up to nothing, you see,
and you don't know for sure what's there until you see it in use, in actual use.
So if it is such a secure system and nobody can get in,
then what's the harm in telling us who is actually using the system
and see if maybe we can get information through social engineering,
through trashing, through all the usual ways?
Well, I'm sure what that article said, it seemed that was the way things were revealed anyhow.
You know, either through college connections or...
Well, then if that's the case, then the test is completely useless
because obviously those conditions won't be there if it's an isolated test.
There won't be any social interaction.
There won't be any trashing.
There won't be anything that we can actually get information from.
Yeah, well, it's a complicated thing,
and the real problem is that the people in managing systems are lazy, in my opinion,
and they don't really want to put out the work to look at all the possibilities.
So they tend to leave the doors open and then go bananas when somebody walks through.
Well, yeah, it's ridiculous because, you know,
I was reading about insurance policies now
that the phone company is offering to various other companies to protect their phone bills, basically,
because now it's actually toll fraud, you know,
abuse of phone companies or abuse of, you know, calling cards or whatever.
It's become a business of sorts for the phone companies
because now they sell insurance at huge rates to companies to protect them
in case somebody figures out how to use their phone system
and make all kinds of free calls all around the world.
What we've actually done is we've created such a fragile system here
where it's very easy for somebody simply by pressing a few buttons
to cause tens of thousands of dollars in damage.
Now, I ask, do you blame the person who is really not doing anything that different
than somebody who would say, you know, shoplift something in the past?
Do you blame him with causing tens of thousands of dollars of damage
when the intent was pretty much the same as shoplifting?
Or do we blame people that design systems that are so fragile
that somebody can go in there and do something that easily?
In the past, you never could have done something like this.
Even more bizarre than shoplifting is how these guys figure out what these costs are,
which is totally insane.
I don't think they have any idea whether something is worth a dime or $50 million.
Well, they say they have these vastly overinflated costs of what things cost,
whether it's documents, phone calls, use of a computer system,
and the government just believes them.
They just believe whatever they say without checking it out,
and they charge people with crimes of stealing millions of dollars
when it's, in fact, just copying a file or something as simple as that.
You know, a cellular phone at a buck a minute or something plus or minus 50 cents is insane.
You know, it's not clear that...
You know, one of the things that occurred years before...
Excuse me?
Hello?
This is the New York telephone operator with an emergency interruption for 212-279-3400.
Operator, can you tell them to go away? We're on the air.
Can you tell them not to do that again?
Oh, I'm sorry about that.
Oh, that's okay.
It's kind of clever, I guess, to break into...
I thought it was me, but it didn't make any sense.
No.
Anyhow...
We're going to let you phone them and go out over the air, but...
Right.
But that was... No one ever did that before on this show.
I don't have to say that.
It's all very exciting.
But, you know, one of the things that they had discovered...
It cost me $1.50 to do that.
...when the government investigated the books of the phone company when they were a monopoly
was that frequently the phone company was so lazy
it just wouldn't take advantages of all sorts of tricks in the tax code.
If it had been a competitive situation, it could have reduced its costs here and there and everywhere.
But because it was a monopoly, it didn't feel any obligation to reduce its costs,
and it would just merely announce to the PUC what it needed, and they'd give it to them.
Uh-huh. Yeah.
And playing to a fact is that one of the things I don't understand
is why the cable companies can't get into the phone business and create a competition there.
Well, you see, I would support that if, you know...
I mean, I support that right away without any conditions.
I would support the phone companies getting into the cable business,
which is the converse of what you say,
if there was competition on the local level with phone companies,
if we had a choice of New York Telephone or something else.
They'd both be in competition with each other,
and hopefully it would be real competition rather than pretend competition.
Right. And I think there should be more competition on all levels,
not just with two companies, not just the cable company and the phone company.
There should be a whole lot, you know, five or six different companies.
Oh, well, yes. I mean, but, you know, the point was,
the original argument was that we can't afford all these wires overhead.
Well, that's getting ridiculously simple to do now.
There's all kinds of fiber-optic technology.
There's really no limit to what we can do.
Right. But, you know, the game changes, but the rules don't.
Well, you see, that's an interesting point,
because we are playing by the rules of big business.
And what you're seeing, you know, a lot of people think that this whole hacking thing
is just a bunch of kids playing around.
Like I said a few minutes ago, it gets into something much bigger than that.
It starts out with kids playing around,
but it turns into something, a very real conflict of individual needs
and big business needs.
You know, it's the contrary worlds.
The big business world talks in tens of thousands of dollars
for a ten-page document or something like that,
whereas an individual sees it as something fairly meaningless.
While individuals get more and more control over technology,
you're going to see more and more of a conflict between these two worlds.
Well, I'm sure that's true, and I'm sure that you just have to look
at what went on in China with the faxes
that made everybody very nervous in China at the time.
Well, that's, you know, a widely publicized example
of individual control over technology,
and I'm sure you'll see some more dramatic examples of that...
Sure.
...with computer networks and phone devices
that can do all kinds of interesting things.
There's, you know, a lot of interesting things ahead.
Technology is definitely the place to be
at this particular time in history.
Well, we have the education president
who can't even find the on-off switch in his computer.
Yeah, well, we'll write him up in the history books.
Take care.
All right.
Thank you.
212-279-3400.
If you get a busy signal, just try again and be patient.
That cost $1.50 to do that, you know,
to break into a phone call like that.
Good evening.
You're on the air.
Well, you're not on the air anymore.
Good evening.
You're on the air.
Hi.
I have some questions.
I bet you that was a computer hacker that did that.
Well, yeah, you know, somebody that knows
how to ask for things from the operator.
Anyway, I have a question.
Where I work, we have a PBX with voicemail and things like that.
It's a DID, direct inward dialing PBX.
Right, yeah.
And what they do is on certain phones,
they make it so that you can't dial long distance
when you dial 9 and then you try to dial long distance.
Right.
And what it also does is it makes it
so that you can't dial 0 or 00 or 10XXX.
Okay.
I found a way to break that.
Okay, wait, let me see if I can figure this out.
There's a way to break that.
You can't dial carrier access codes.
You can't dial 1+, doesn't allow 1+.
Right.
Doesn't allow 0 or 00.
Let's see, what else could you possibly try?
How about tripping down to a dial tone
after it connects to something else?
Do the same restrictions apply?
What do you mean by that?
Well, let's say you call something, somebody hangs up,
and then the phone just goes back to a dial tone.
Sometimes, I don't know if it's a physical hardware device
that's attached to that one.
I never tried that.
All right, try that.
And then just dial 0 and it might go through.
That's 90% of the cases how things work.
How about, you say you can't dial 1+, either.
Well, right, that's correct.
Really, so you can really only dial, how do you, wait,
how do you dial 718, say?
You have to dial 1 for that.
You could dial 1718.
That's like the only area code you could dial.
I see, so all the area codes are blocked.
Supposing you dial the non-existent area code.
What do you mean non-existent area code?
Something like 910 or something like that.
It gives you a reorder tone.
Really.
Again, reorders sometimes time out
and trip down to dial tones.
I'm trying to think if there's something else
that might work.
I'm kind of stumped at the moment.
That's not to say I wouldn't.
It depends on my system, my way, I mean.
Pound signs, stars, sometimes they do weird things.
Pound signs?
Okay, I got it, I got it.
You get something like call forwarding,
no, not call forwarding, but speed dialing.
And you speed dial and program that to go to an operator.
Sometimes, that will bypass whatever restrictions,
hardware restrictions.
It's the best I can come up with.
Okay, but what my idea was is that,
you know 959-1230, right?
Coin test.
Okay, that's run by AT&T.
So if you dial that from, if you just dial 9,
get a dial tone, outside dial tone,
and dial 959-1230, get an AT&T operator.
And you could say to the operator,
oh, I'm sorry, I dialed the wrong number.
Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait a minute.
But that's, you can only make one distance call.
Wait a minute.
Now, first of all, I thought the number was 0959,
1-2-3-0.
Believe it or not, it only works on a digital switch.
Uh-huh.
All trunks, we have a trunk that's on an electronic switch
and a trunk that's on a digital switch.
And it only works on that trunk with a digital switch.
If you try it with the electronic switch,
it'll give you a recording, an outside recording.
Right.
So you just dial the 959, you see,
on a pay phone, believe it or not,
this is weird because on an electronic switching,
a pay phone that's electronic switching,
you just dial 959, 1-2-3-0.
Right.
On a pay phone that's digital switching,
you dial 0, a long-distance area code,
plus 959, 1-2-3-0.
But here, it's sort of weird.
It works backwards.
You just dial 959, 1-2-3-0.
And you can do this in your house, actually.
You just dial 959, 1-2-3-0,
and you get the long-distance operator,
the AT&T operator.
Okay, now, the other thing was
when you dial 959, 1-2-3-0,
I was always under the impression
that you got a computer that said,
coin test, please insert coin.
That's on the pay phone.
Only from a pay phone,
so from a home phone, you get an operator.
Right.
That's never happened to me.
I'll try it right now, in fact.
I'm not sure if we're digital or electronic or what here.
Well, you're electronic.
So you're saying it wouldn't work from here.
You could try it.
But did you know that the TAPS operators
are getting new equipment
that makes them directory assistance operators?
Are they really?
Yeah, that's what I heard from an operator.
I don't know when, but they say that.
Operators are traditionally
the last people to find out about these things,
so I don't know for sure.
And also, if you dial star-0 on some cold-cut phones,
you get how much money's in the cold-cut phone.
Really?
Just dial star-0, and the voice will say.
Well, now, you bring up a very interesting point,
because at 2600, we're constantly striving
to get information about these
customer-owned coin-operated telephones,
and people have been sending us printouts of,
if they call up with a 300-watt modem,
they call a pay phone,
it spits out all this data.
And also, there's other phones that you call up,
and you hear four tones, and it says,
Thank you.
Right. No, no, no.
It says, Thank you, and then four tones.
You're right. Okay.
Thank you, four tones.
Thank you, and then some touch tones,
which I don't know what means.
Including a couple of silver box tones,
which is the fourth column.
Touch tones?
Yeah. Well, touch tones and silver box tones,
which is the A, B, C, D that's not on your phone.
That's to the right of the rightmost column.
Right.
Now, nobody has been able to figure that system out,
and I'm surprised,
because surely somebody out there must have one of these phones,
and they know how it works.
So, definitely send in that information.
You know, it's not to rip off pay phones.
It's to understand the technology,
because some of them have monitoring devices.
You can listen to the pay phone.
You can listen to the area around the pay phone.
I think we need to know how it works.
What do you do to override restrictions?
Like you said, you know how to do that.
Well, it's different for every system,
but there's usually something someplace.
Right.
Just like I found this 9591230 way.
Yeah. Well, that's pretty ingenious.
There's other things you can do, you know, with 800 numbers
and call forwarding and diverters and things like that.
There's never a complete lockout,
unless you're confined to only on-site calls,
and on-site is completely secure.
And did you know that a telephone company repairman told me
that if you dial 450 in the 718212 area,
I don't think it works anymore, because I tried it.
You get the ACTS machine, meaning you not only do coin tests,
but it didn't do like a current test,
how much current is going through it.
450 does a lot of weird things in a lot of places.
And all I say is if you're going to try that, be careful,
because you don't know what you're going to expect.
But I can tell you that has had some very, very unpredictable results.
But do you know how to get anything besides the coin test from that system?
You haven't figured that out.
No, I have not. I have not figured it out at all.
And I also have not figured out the 660 system of callbacks.
You used to be able to dial 660 and get somebody in the central office.
Sometimes, yeah. Sometimes that does work.
But 660 works differently in various parts of New York and throughout.
I'm going to try calling a couple of these things now,
and we'll see what happens.
Thanks very much for calling.
Okay.
All right.
We're going to try with, let's see, what shall we try first?
Let's try the 959-1230 business.
Got a dial tone there.
959-1230.
Let's see what we get.
Okay. Recording from New York.
Don't know what AP stands for, but we can speculate.
All right.
So that doesn't work from this particular switch.
That's not to say it wouldn't work from another phone number
and cause all kinds of interesting –
959, I do know, is blocked from many areas.
So I don't think we can call anything in that exchange.
It's a telephone company-operated exchange, as is 890.
However, that exchange is not blocked.
Okay.
Our number is 212-279-3400.
We're also going to try 660 and see what that does from here.
Let's give that a try.
660.
All right.
This one is waiting for more digits, I believe.
So let's add some more digits.
Okay.
It seems to be waiting for even more digits.
So let's add three more.
Okay.
Wait a minute.
Wait just one minute here.
I wasn't expecting this.
Okay.
Okay.
Okay.
I don't know exactly what's going on here, but I dialed 660,
and then I dialed 10 more digits.
I don't even remember what those 10 digits were.
They were pretty much at random.
So I'm going to try this again with 10 completely different digits.
Let's see what happens.
Okay.