of history in the decade.
And if you look at the last several decades,
there's been enormous progress
in terms of universal suffrage,
in terms of the eight-hour day,
the right to unionize.
Decade for decade,
there's been enormous social progress
because there's an engine there.
It's not just because intellectuals
meet around the campfire and say,
let's have an eight-hour day.
It's because people by the millions
are willing to devote their lives
to that kind of struggle.
And that's why I think
that we shouldn't get pessimistic
just because the left in the past
has made mistakes.
Professor of Physics in New York
for Radio WBAI-FM.
In 1492, as you probably know,
Columbus set foot on the New World soil
and then they were using a different calendar.
That was Julian, now it's a Gregorian.
And the significance of that
is that today actually marks half a millennium
since Columbus came to the shores here.
Nine days ago, nine days ago,
they celebrated, they mourned.
For the rest of today,
for what little is left of today,
you might give some reflection
to what the sea brought
and to the soil that once was fertile
that's now buried under the pavement.
Hi, this is Chet Jackson,
and I want you to join me for Night Flight
on Sunday mornings at 3 a.m.
right after Labrish on WBAI-FM.
We will still play all the R&B classics
along with the best in new contemporary music.
There will be interviews and special features
from the people who influence
and produce the music as well.
So join me on Sundays at 3 a.m.
for the Night Flight
on 99.5 FM WBAI, New York City.
You cry, cry, a river
It's a bit of light
And it's just about 9 o'clock.
You are tuned to WBAI in New York.
It's Wednesday night,
and that means it's time for Off the Hook.
BELL RINGS
The telephone keeps ringing
So I ripped it off the wall
I cut myself while shaving
Now I can't make a cough
It couldn't get much worse
But if they could, they would
Bumb-diddly-bomb
But the best, expect the worst
I hope that's understood
Bumb-diddly-bomb!
BELL RINGS
Well, we're at a crossroads here.
We always seem to be at a crossroads in the world of technology,
especially over the last 20 years or so with the computer revolution.
Boy, what a bloody one that was.
With telephones becoming more intelligent than the people that live in your homes,
and with Big Brother getting bigger every day.
It's amazing.
It's fascinating.
It's scary.
And it's something we talk about here on Off the Hook,
something we'll be talking about tonight.
We're pretty much devoting the program, as we've talked about in past weeks,
to the subject of caller ID,
which is something that is actually popping up in various places.
I've been speaking to some people out on the island
who swear by everything that is sacred to them that caller ID now works.
I'd like for people to be able to tell me if they've had any experiences.
This is within New York.
We know it works in New Jersey.
Of course, people in New Jersey are welcome to join in on the conversation as well
to tell us various educational bits that we might need to know and get ready for.
But it's not supposed to be working in New York yet, not until November.
If it is, then please let us know about that.
It's not going to be coming to New York right away, New York City that is.
However, it will be coming to Brooklyn.
It will be coming to Queens and various other parts as well.
Well, there's all kinds of things that we must know as far as how to use your telephone,
how to protect your privacy, and it gets kind of tricky at some points,
and we're going to try to help you out as best we can.
So call in with any questions to 212-279-3400.
Before we get started, a couple of news items that appeared in the New York Times over the past week.
A computer glitch at a regional air traffic control center forced departing flights to be delayed
for up to 90 minutes last week at the three major airports in the New York region,
leaving, yeah, you guessed it, thousands of travelers crammed into waiting areas.
The breakdown deprived air traffic controllers of what are called flight data strips,
computer printouts they use to identify and keep track of departing planes and their flight plans.
At the same time, it deprived the controllers of the ability to identify arriving flights.
It's a real neat thing to be able to do, but they could not do it.
With radar blips still appearing on their screens,
the controllers, using radio contact with the pilots, were able to talk down the incoming flights,
and one of those incoming flights was Air Force One carrying George Bush.
For a time, and here's the interesting part,
the controllers also switched to a backup computer that provided the required information,
though less quickly.
Safety was never compromised.
Now, they don't really go into detail as to why the backup computer was not used instantly
and for the entire period, but for a good couple of hours there, things were hectic,
and it's not the first time this has happened.
And interesting postscript to that story.
Flights at Newark were delayed later on that night when an apparently disturbed man,
only his underwear ran across two active runways shortly before 9 p.m.
Yeah, and that didn't mess things up as badly as the computers, but it was a valiant effort nonetheless.
And there's also some mayhem going on in Connecticut where the rate of payphone calls may be about to go up.
Now, that might not be so shocking as you might at first think when you consider that payphones in Connecticut only cost a dime.
That's right, there's still 10 cents.
And according to tariffs that Southern New England Telephone is filing with the equivalent of their public service commission,
the 10-cent phone call in Connecticut would vanish after 39 years.
And they're filing that on November 12th as part of a package intended to increase revenues by $160 million in the next three years.
And if it takes effect next summer, it will mean that Arkansas will be the only remaining state
where local calls of unlimited duration will still cost a dime.
You know, I'm surprised Clinton hasn't said something about that.
You know, the only state where phone calls are still a dime.
I mean, that could get you some votes.
So, the State Department of Public Utility Control will be holding public hearings on the proposed increases.
And they will evaluate the proposals based on the degree to which the company is investing in infrastructure modernization
and whether more competition should be permitted.
But it will indicate the end of a tradition.
I should also point out that Southern New England Telephone is not one of the Bell operating companies.
They are an independent phone company, which is something that you find throughout the country.
Finally, the fall issue of 2600 has hit the U.S. Postal Service.
It's in the mail now.
And included in this issue are such things as hacking more bulletin board system software.
This one known as AMI Express.
Also a way to defeat callback verification.
And another guide to cocots, those strange payphones that look and talk differently from the ones we grew up with.
Also a review of sneakers, a review of the hacker crackdown.
A virus written in C that can be used for all kinds of interesting things.
There's a general guide to hacking and a reprint from a New York telephone pamphlet of many years ago
with specific instructions on how to use a dial telephone.
Something that could come in handy.
In fact, a lot of people don't know how to use a dial telephone because they've grown up with touchtones.
So they honestly don't know what to do.
They see this round thing and I've heard stories.
And it becomes especially confusing when you try to dial a pound sign or a star or something like that.
And there's a couple other things in there as well.
Some surprises and the usual.
That is the announcement that has just come out.
Okay, it's about 10 minutes after 9 o'clock or so.
We're going to take some phone calls at 212-279-3400.
Fiber Optic is here.
He's got some information that...
Well, it's interesting information.
It might take a bit of time before we actually realize what this information is.
But it's...
What it portends is, I guess, a trend that we're modernizing and we're going down a one-way street and we are not coming back.
And this has to do with Brooklyn, Queens, the Bronx, the areas around us.
What do you got?
Okay, this is an update for the entire 718 area code.
And it reflects how many offices have been cut over to Signaling System 7 or SS7.
For those who don't know, Signaling System 7 is a newer digital signaling network that ties together switching systems.
And basically, it'll make possible all sorts of new services, like the class features, for instance, that are becoming available.
Those being return call, call repeat, call trace, and, of course, caller ID.
SS7, that's the one that's always crashing, right?
Well, I wouldn't blame it on SS7.
It was AT&T, actually, their long-distance network, where they were cutting over some older toll offices from the previous signaling system.
And there was a software glitch, but...
It was SS7, though, right?
Well, it was related, yeah.
Okay.
Just wanted to make that point.
Yeah.
But the statistics that I came up with are, I guess, fairly impressive moving along.
The fact that they have set November 1st as a deadline, I think they've accomplished quite a lot so far.
Now, in as much as...
Well, the boroughs in 718, obviously, are Queens, Brooklyn, Staten Island, and the Bronx.
Well, the Bronx is a new one.
Yeah, a new one in 718.
In fact, the Bronx right now is both 212 and 718.
Yeah.
Kind of dual identity there.
Yeah, I believe the beginning of 1993 it'll be finalized.
And as things would go, there are 14 switches in the Bronx.
Actually, actually 15.
When you say switches, it's...
Well, the actual switching system, the computer that controls phone service for an entire exchange.
So a typical switch would consist of what?
Well, all the hardware and software necessary to provide phone service.
For an area.
Yeah, for an area.
For a few tens of thousands of subscribers.
Okay.
And as things would go, in the entire 718 area code, there is only but one mechanical switch left.
One electromechanical switch in the entire area code.
And it's Entrapment Avenue.
Just one.
Just one.
One office or one exchange?
Just a single exchange.
A single switch.
This is depressing.
I remember a couple of weeks ago, we announced the demise of 762 and 718.
Yeah.
And there have been a lot that have fallen over the past year or so.
Now it's only one left?
Yeah, Trapment Avenue is an old No. 5 crossbar.
And not only is it the last one, but it's already being cut over to the Trapment Avenue 5 ESS.
Do you know the exchange of that?
I can't say I recall.
Sorry.
Okay.
If anybody knows that, please call in with that.
Because I'd like to hear before they cut it over.
They might be cutting it over in a few minutes.
Well, yeah.
We should expect it fairly soon.
I don't know if it'll be a few minutes.
But we'll see.
So out of the 14 in the Bronx, the 14 switches, none of them are SS7 capable.
Which means no one yet has any of the new class features, a.k.a. phone smart.
And, of course, they don't have caller ID either.
Let's start off with Queens.
In Queens, there are 24 switches.
And when I say a switch, a single central office obviously can have more than one switch.
And there are a couple of offices, at least, that have maybe three switches in them.
So if you're in Queens, you're in one of these.
Yeah, you would be in one of these.
And you can probably find out by calling your exchange followed by 9901.
Yeah, provided it's a digital switch.
Right.
And out of these 24, 10.
10 are SS7 capable.
And out of those 24, 20 are digital.
And 4 are still analog.
A 1 or a number 1A ESS.
These, as the trend seems to be, in offices where they only have one switch, and that switch happens to be an older analog electronic switch, it seems that these are not being cut over to SS7.
And I don't know how they're going to handle this, whether they're going to upgrade the switch, or they're going to just trash it in favor of a newer digital switch.
However, in offices where they do have more than one switch, and one of these switches happens to be an older analog, but there are other digital switches in the office, I've noticed the trend is they happen to phase out the analog switch and actually move the exchanges that were on that analog switch onto one of the digital ones.
So the people can easily get a class in SS7.
So they keep the same phone number, but basically the switches do different.
Move the prefixes over to the digital switch and simply retire the analog switch.
Okay.
So that's the situation in Queens, 10 out of 24.
On to Brooklyn, there are 33 switches in Brooklyn, and 20 out of the 33, better than half, are already cut over.
Now, I should mention that there are two offices in Queens, Bayside and the old Idlewild office, which is now known as the JFK office.
Those are two offices that will be cut over soon.
They're in the process of being cut over.
And in Brooklyn, the Troy Avenue digital switch is in the process of being cut over.
That's not included in the 20.
So it should be 21 out of the 33.
So that's better than half.
So we're really getting there.
And finally, in Staten Island, there are five switches in Staten Island, four digitals and one analog.
And four out of those five, all four of the digitals are already cut over to SS7.
And that's how it stands in the 718 area code.
I'd say on a whole, we're better than half.
Do you have an idea when this started, when they started putting SS7 in?
It's hard to say.
If I had to make a guess, I'd have to say that they started planning it earlier this year.
Because I know up in, well, at least in this area.
See, up in Poughkeepsie and some of the test areas, you know, outlying the city,
Poughkeepsie and Kingston and Rockland and surrounding areas upstate,
they've had SS7 for at least two years already.
I've spoken with a friend of mine who lives upstate,
and they've had the PhoneSmart or the Class features for at least a good two years now.
Now, the features don't seem to be as rich as what they are in the Bell Atlantic area,
where they have even more features like selective call blocking
and selective call forwarding and all that business.
9x is only offering these four so far, the return call, repeat dial,
customer trace or call trace, and caller ID.
So I guess after this trial phase, you see, right now,
officially starting November 1st, for the people that don't have it yet,
you'll be able to play with these features for an undetermined amount of time.
The caller ID, we were told, would only be available
for people who subscribe to it after November 1st.
But as Emmanuel is saying,
it seems like some people claim that they're able to get it to work now in parts of Long Island.
Yeah, that's what we want to hear.
If people have gotten it to work in any of these areas where it's not really supposed to be yet,
please let us know.
We'd like to know what kind of things you're able to find out.
Also, if we can run down what the codes are that people can dial to experiment with various things.
Right now, and every time we say star, you can substitute star with 1-1 if you have a rotary phone
or if you just don't like dialing star, star 6-9 is call return.
That's if somebody calls you, you can call them back.
You don't have to pick up the phone either.
If they call you, let the phone ring once.
I understand you can just star 6-9 them and their phone will ring,
assuming they're connected to one of those SS7 things.
Yeah, provided they're on the network.
Yes, if that's so.
I understand it works island-wide now.
It's not limited to a local community or anything like that.
Oh, yeah, no doubt it'll be connected up with northern New Jersey, which is part of our ladder.
The problem I foresee with that is that you'll end up calling someone back and it'll be long distance.
Right.
I think that'll be a problem because you'll have no way of knowing.
Yeah, that will be a problem.
I mean, I foresee a new scam somehow where somebody calls from a number that charges an outrageous amount.
I don't know how a 900 number would make an outgoing call,
but someone's going to figure this out.
Mark my words.
They're going to call you and you're going to star 6-9 them.
You're going to wind up calling a 900 number and paying $50 for it.
Just mark my words.
It's going to happen somehow or something like that.
So, wow.
Okay, star 6-9 is one.
And there's a similar one called star 5-7, which is called trace.
It doesn't call the person back.
However, it reports the fact that this person called you and it assumes that you were annoyed by that fact.
And it doesn't really do anything other than that.
Yeah, it basically claims that it's reporting the number provided it was able to get a fix on the number.
It basically reports it to the annoyance call bureau.
I can't imagine how seriously the annoyance call bureau would take this because I'm just guessing that people are going to play with it to see what it does.
And I know people just for fun have pretended that they were annoyed by their friend and vice versa.
Or by another phone in their own home.
Yeah.
Or things like that.
Yeah, you have to experiment to figure out just how it works.
Then there's star 6-6, which is repeat dial.
Let's say you get a busy signal and you want to just keep trying over and over again.
What it will do is ring you back with a special ring, like two or three short rings, that tells you that that phone has become free.
And as soon as you pick up your phone, that phone will begin to ring.
Now, you can have some fun with this because if you dial star 6-6, you'll get a recording telling you that it's going to call you as soon as that phone becomes free.
If you pick up the phone and somehow you manage to pick up that other phone within that time, in other words, the person was talking on the phone you were trying to call, they hung up, which triggered the system to call you back saying, hey, that phone is free.
But before you pick up your phone, that other person picks up his phone again, so it's busy once more.
Well, when you pick up your phone, you'll get an interesting recording saying, the phone number you are trying to call has become busy again.
Sorry, and it will also say you have to reset, you have to dial star 6-6 again.
Now, I tried this yesterday from out on the island, and it didn't work.
They said you had to reprogram, you had to dial star 6-6 again, and it kept trying, even though it told us that.
So the programming is kind of weird.
Yeah, I've noticed there's a bug with that repeat dial.
I know in other areas, like in Bell Atlantic, New Jersey Bell, there's a, along with the return call, call return, there's a, it'll keep trying to get through with call return, sort of like the same way repeat call keeps trying to get through if the number is busy.
In much the same way with return call, if you try to return the call to someone and it's busy, it can keep trying.
And you can tell it, you can tell it to cancel with star 8-9.
Right.
And I know in other areas, like I say in New Jersey Bell, along with the star 6-6, there's a star 8-6.
Say, for instance, you want to disable the repeat call.
You can't.
You have to wait until it calls you back, and then you just pick up and hang up.
You can't cancel it.
No, there's no way to cancel.
In other areas, there's a star 8-6 to explicitly cancel.
Well, then what's star 8-9 for?
Star 8-9 is to cancel a repetitive return call.
As opposed to?
See, repeat call is if it's busy, you're specifically telling it to keep trying.
With return call, you miss the call and you want to call the number back.
If the number isn't busy, you'll simply get through.
It's a combined feature.
Yeah, I thought star 8-9 encompassed both.
I thought star 8-9 was repeat darling.
Doesn't clear the repeat call.
I don't think average people are going to be able to grasp all of this.
It's kind of crazy.
Well, the thing you just remember is that 6-9 is like 8-9.
They both end in the 9.
That's how they're all going to be.
And then 6-6 will have 8-6.
The corresponding disable feature will begin with an 8 as opposed to a 6.
Now, there's also a very important one known as star 6-7, which I'm kind of annoyed at this, actually.
The way it works is you dial star 6-7.
And if you don't have your number blocked, in other words, when you make a phone call, your number is sent out to other people, if you dial star 6-7, it will block your number for that call only.
Now, if you decided to get blocking on all of your calls and make that the default, and you dial star 6-7, then it will send you a number.
So it's kind of like a switch to the opposite of whatever it is you've set your line to be.
If you're blocking all numbers, it will send it.
If you're not blocking, it will block for that one call.
Now, my problem with that is how do you know, if you're making a phone call from a phone, say, at a friend's house, which one he selected?
There's no way of telling.
If you dial star 6-7, it's just going to give you a dial tone.
And, you know, if he already was blocking the calls in the first place, then you're cheerily sending his number out, thinking that you're blocking it.
You know, it's kind of that they should have a different code just to block and a different code, you know, that works regardless of whether or not you have it turned on or off.
Yeah, it seemed the best that they could do was give you little stickers to put on your phone, indicating to someone that would use it what the default setting was.
But I don't think it's very effective.
Yeah, I mean, people can make mistakes in the switch.
They can accidentally program your phone to do the wrong thing.
It would be nice to be able to dial something and get a confirmation tone saying you're not going to have your number sent.
Because I know the case is going to happen where somebody ordered call blocking and they didn't get it.
And they're not going to know.
How are they going to know until somebody says, hey, I can see your number?
But it could take months for somebody to say that.
And in the meantime, their privacy has been invaded.
They did claim with the announcement that there was an 800 number that you could call to check to see whether or not you were sending caller ID info or not.
Now, from what I've heard, this 800 number does not yet connect to anything.
It doesn't exist.
But I'd be curious to see once after November 1st comes, the caller ID is officially available.
Now, that 800 number can't read your caller ID.
It can only access a database to say whether or not you've ordered it.
Is that correct?
Well, it was very vague in the notice.
We can only guess what this number does.
If all it does is access a database, I mean, databases are only as accurate as the information put into them.
So that's not a very reliable thing.
So I guess it remains to be seen.
There's one more thing before we get to some phone calls.
Again, our number is 212-279-3400.
And that is there are actually two technologies at work with regards to similar kinds of things.
One is caller ID that we're discussing now.
And the other is something known as ANI, automatic number identification, where your number is sent when you call things like 800 numbers.
You want to just briefly, in layman's terms, explain the difference between the two?
Yeah, ANI is sent on analog trunks in the form of multi-frequency tones.
And it comes into play not only for signaling to 700, 800, and 900 numbers who the originating party is and the type of phone he's on,
but it's also in very practical uses like identifying to enhance 911 service where you're calling from
or in older accounting systems for billing purposes, identifying where you're calling from.
So it has numerous uses.
It's just a shame that nowadays it's being abused by businesses with 800 numbers to invade your privacy.
That's what that caller ID will be as well.
Yeah.
I mean, it's very simple to simply cross-reference something and have, say, a CD-ROM on a computer
that when it sees a certain number it looks it up, and that CD-ROM comes from the phone company,
it has the whole phone book in there.
Oh, yeah, companies are doing this now.
And it seems that the companies that were doing it stopped because people who were calling some 800 service,
like American Express, for instance, and the representative answered the phone saying the person's name.
They didn't like that, did they?
Yeah, they didn't like that very much.
But they can go even further than that.
I mean, name and address is nothing.
They can tie into your entire credit report, your arrest record, everything, before they even pick up the phone.
There's no limit.
Now, is that true of Annie as well?
Do you see the number before you pick up, or do you only see the number after you pick up?
Oh, no, no, it's sent while the call is in transit.
Okay.
They could see it before they answered the phone.
And the thing that's a shame is that at least caller ID is out in the open,
and they're offering ways to block it.
Mm-hmm.
With A&I, I mean, it's more or less hush-hush, not that it's a top secret,
but, I mean, I wouldn't think the average person on the street knows about it.
They wouldn't really know that if they're going to call some 800 number,
especially like some suicide hotline or an AIDS hotline,
and it's very likely that if the person at the other end wanted to know,
they could find out this person's phone number.
Now, why are there two technologies?
Why not simply use A&I for everything?
Well, you see, A&I is, you know, it predates SS7,
and obviously as SS7 becomes more dominant,
then it'll obviously be the most efficient network,
and it'll be years before it's linked nationwide.
SS7 now is only available within a single ladder at most,
a ladder being a local access and transport area.
But what's the reason why they simply didn't just go with A&I and not develop caller ID?
Well, SS7, there's a lot more to it.
I mean, it's a digital packet switching network.
There's a lot more.
Since switches now more and more are being computerized,
it only makes sense that you can convey much more information
in digital electronic form between these switches
rather than having to convert it into crude multi-frequency tones,
actual audible tones that are simply signaled between the offices,
which it's like comparing smoke signals with microwave radio.
Well, do you think then that caller ID will replace A&I?
Well, A&I still remains the most reliable,
as it can be sent on a nationwide basis.
SS7 currently cannot.
Of course, the day will come when it can.
But as of yet, the local Bell operating companies,
which are setting up their little SS7 networks,
are not connected in any way so far to AT&T's nationwide SS7 network,
that being their long-distance company.
Their entire long-distance service is SS7 in the entire country.
I'm sure once the Bell operating companies start linking up
the local SS7 networks with the nationwide long-distance SS7 networks,
things will start to happen in many ways.
What about Sprint MCI?
They have SS7 as well?
Oh, I don't recall.
Sprint brags to have a nationwide fiber-optic network.
I couldn't imagine them not having SS7.
It only makes sense.
And, of course, I might want to add that with the advent of SS7 now,
it also invites ISDN, which will bring about,
hopefully will bring about, many new high-tech services to the home.
Hopefully.
Of course, they're going to aim it more towards businesses at first,
for digital switch communication.
And there's a whole range of potential horror stories there as well.
Yeah, that's very true.
That's something for a show in a year or so, or maybe less.
You've got to take the bad with the good.
Yeah, yeah, but you've got to know what's happening before it happens,
before it's too late.
Okay, 212-279-3400.
We're going to take some phone calls from listeners out there.
We're talking about, that's a strange noise,
we're talking about caller ID and very strange noises.
Apparently there's something wrong with the phones.
I heard on the show before this that there was something.
Yeah, hear that noise?
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, you there?
Uh, well, wait a minute.
Now, it's interesting that there's a voice there,
because we didn't pick up the phone.
Now, uh, are you calling us?
Hello?
Can you guys hear me?
Uh, I can hear you, but are you calling us?
Uh, I, I hear you.
Uh-oh.
See, he's coming in and out.
That's interesting.
Hmm.
Okay, I'm trying to figure out what's going on here.
One line has gone off.
All right, now I think someone else is there.
Anybody there?
Is anyone there?
I, I, I heard, I heard our, one of our voices there.
This is not good.
No, this is, uh, a telephone call-in show.
You're gonna...
Your phone system is messed up.
Yeah, uh, we're starting to realize that.
Um, but...
It's kind of hard to have one-second conversations with people.
Hello?
Hi, how you doing?
Oh, no.
As I'm pointing out here, it's very difficult.
Okay, I think the problem stems from, um...
Uh, okay, if we could just make sure that nobody calls, uh, 3407.
If anybody's calling 3407 now, please hang up.
I think that might be causing the problem.
And, uh, if it's not causing the problem, then, then we'll, we'll figure it out.
But that's the only way we can solve this problem, is if, uh, people stop calling that line.
So that we can try and, uh, troubleshoot this.
Uh, so far, I still see that line ringing.
So, um, what I'm gonna have to do is, uh...
Paul, do you know what's wrong with these phones?
I got 3407.
Indeed, I do.
What's going on here?
Well, I don't, I don't know the etiology of this problem, but...
I've been set up, haven't I?
No, no, we've all been set up.
The solution is, ask your listeners to call 279-3407.
Oh, really?
Now, it's harder to get through that way, but, uh, you, you'll get a business signal
more of the time.
As a matter of fact, it may even be too light.
But, but, but who, who are we getting now?
Well, I...
These people are popping onto the radio.
I know.
I, somebody...
Where are they coming from?
I think the phone company actually came here and fixed the phone.
You let the phone company in here?
Somebody else did.
I'm not responsible.
Well...
But now, your listeners have the info, 3407-3407.
Well, that's, that's fine.
I mean, they're all ringing, but the problem is, how do we keep the, the, the people from popping
onto the air uninvited?
No, no, no, 3407, they won't.
You'll get nice connections on 3407.
But somebody is popping on the line.
We hear them.
I'm not pressing any buttons.
What?
I don't know what I'm supposed to...
I, standing here, I can't see that, but have you hung up on the last...
I haven't even touched the phone yet, and people are on the air.
Look, I'll turn on the thing, and then, see, there's people, there's somebody there,
right?
What am I happening?
See?
See?
There's people there, and...
This wasn't happening before.
The, the, the whole phone system is going, going completely crazy here.
Uh, see, they're all ringing, but none of them are ringing.
None of them, uh, and this one down here seems to be a problem.
This one down there.
You, that, that, that hasn't worked for a while.
Don't worry about that.
You'll never, never bother, don't ever bother with that.
Let's just see if this makes any difference to anything.
Claude is hanging up on everybody.
Um, even though they're not on...
Actually, you're pressing the red button.
Okay, and now let's pick up this phone call, and...
Yes.
Hi, Emanuel.
Hi.
Emanuel.
Okay.
Is this you?
Yes.
I bet you, all right, all right, keep rolling.
All right, hi, I have some questions.
Claude, I don't know what you did, but stay here.
Oh, no.
Now somebody else has just popped in.
All right.
All right.
How many people are here now?
Can you hear me now?
I hear everybody, yes.
All right.
Okay, well, somebody speak, and let's see if we can have some semblance of order.
All right, I'm speaking now, and I want to talk about the, um, uh, SS7.
Oh, no.
Now, you see that, you hear that noise?
I do hear it.
It's like it's ringing voltage.
It's a ring voltage.
Yeah.
Now something is...
Must be your system.
All right, look, you see all those wires back there?
Pull them all out.
Now we've got a wise guy on the line.
Now, okay, this can't go on like this.
Um, how do you have a call-in show when you don't have phones?
You're, you're, you're the, the, the, you're the phone expert.
Well, yeah, I have a feeling I'm being, I'm being, you know, set up here in some way.
Okay, now there's, there's a, okay, wait, I think I might have an answer.
I might have an answer.
All these little phone lines have individual volume controls.
Oh, hi.
I was calling WBAI.
Uh, keep talking, please.
Oh.
Okay, right now I'm turning the volume down on every single one of them.
All right, there is no way anybody can speak on the air now.
She can't either.
We'll have to live with that, unfortunately.
Only two of those controls work.
What?
Only two of the controls work?
Why do we have ten controls if only two of them work?
Because perhaps I can only get two of them to work.
Listen, the two of them work...
This is, this is your fault, listeners.
You have not sent us enough money.
Obviously, we...
Listen, listen...
I still hear people.
I've turned them all off and I still hear people.
Only two of those controls work.
Any event.
The first control works at the very top on the left there.
And the fifth...
And that works with the first five lines.
And then...
All right, let's try it with the first five lines, then.
Well, yeah, good luck.
Okay, I've turned it up.
And so far, nothing.
So I'm going to pick up a line now.
And let's see what happens, all right?
I didn't touch anything yet.
I hear a click.
Okay, see, that's the problem there.
Okay, now I'm going to try on the second five.
And see what we can get there.
Hello?
Good evening.
Are you there?
Yes.
Okay.
I was wondering, do you know how long...
This is the longest conversation we've had tonight.
Go ahead.
How much charge there?
Are they going to continue to charge for touchstone phones?
And are they...
Is that always going to be the case?
Well, they've brought the charge down.
It's like a dollar and change now.
That's per month.
Per month.
Yeah.
Plus installation, quote-unquote.
It's a rip-off, obviously, because...
And, you know, I think this extends to all the other services as well.
For instance, Star 6-9.
They charge you 75 cents each time you call return somebody.
Now, you know, it doesn't cost 75.
You're not making a special kind of a call.
You're using part of the network.
And obviously, there's an initial cost to set this whole network up.
But, you know, a per-call thing of 75 cents is kind of ridiculous.
That's like charging you...
Well, they do that because they want you to subscribe to it.
Uh-huh.
If you subscribe to it, you're charged by the month instead of by the number of times you use it.
Right.
But you'll use your phone more if all these services are available to you.
For instance, in an office environment, they don't charge you to make internal calls because it doesn't cost anything.
The network costs something, and that's what people pay for.
Or, and I think if we just had a network fee of some sort, you know, to pay for the system, we wouldn't have to charge for all these...
Well, I'm the first caller.
It's gotten through clearly, and I've used a rotary.
Uh-huh.
Now, you're the person that was just on the line asking about touchtone, right?
Yeah.
Okay, good.
Well, you've set a record tonight.
Well, maybe there's something to be said for the rotary after all.
Uh-huh.
Because that's what I used.
Okay.
So, thank you.
Okay.
Thanks for calling.
Bye.
Uh, okay.
As far as I know, as far as I know, yeah, this is what you have to do, folks.
We're going to give you two phone numbers to call, and one of these numbers has never been given on the air before.
But this is an emergency.
We have no choice.
Okay.
212-279-3407, you can call, and also 212-279-3405.
3405.
Everybody else, you've got to hang up, because you'll never get on, because there's something wrong with the first five lines.
So, 3405 and 3407.
And I think that will work.
Okay.
Let's see if we can actually have a second phone call tonight.
Good evening.
Hello.
Yeah, you're on the air.
Yeah, hi.
My question is, does the 911 system in New York City list your address when you call it?
No, currently in New York City, they do not have Enhanced 911.
Oh, okay.
Only in New York City.
Now, but they can call you back or something.
They can, if you call 911, I always had the impression they could find out who you were.
No, that's not true.
Not in New York City.
Unless you tell them what your number is.
But they won't have your address in any emergency.
Oh, well, if they don't have your number, they certainly don't have your address.
That's why they ask you what your address is.
Okay.
See, with Enhanced 911, not only will they get your number from A&I, there's also something at work called ALI, Automatic Location Identification, which is specific to the Enhanced 911 system.
Is New York City planning to get it to Enhanced 911 system?
Well, I certainly hope so.
Okay.
All right, that's my question.
Thank you.
Okay.
I still have to say, though, that I've heard stories in the past where people say they called 911 and, you know, that time in city court, for instance, when the hackers were accused of pranking 911.
You know, how would they even know to accuse them of something?
Well, that's because that other fine gentleman that was there, looking over their shoulders, called up the police and told them to come down.
Uh-huh.
That's interesting.
Especially since nobody was doing it in the first place.
But, um, I don't know.
It's not the kind of thing you can really experiment with.
I mean, you know, but if people have experiences in the past where they have called 911 and been called back or have heard that, you know, their address was transmitted or something, let us know.
But I do know they do not have Enhanced 911 here, but I thought they had something a little cruder or just a method or something like that.
But we'll find out.
Okay.
2-1-2-2-7-9-3-4-0-5.
2-1-2-2-7-9-3-4-0-7.
Good evening.
Hello.
How you doing?
Is this WBAI?
Yes, you're on the air.
Oh, okay.
So from what I understand, the, uh...
They have the ability to call you back, uh, the police, because most people call through the operator.
They dial the operator and they say, hook me in to the police.
Well, I guess that's one way of doing it.
So that's why I know a person was coming when the kids did that.
Does the operator stay on the line?
Yeah, well, they stay on the line, they connect to the police, and, uh, even though the kids hung up, the police called back my house.
I said, somebody from the house called the police.
I see.
And where do you live?
I live in Jersey.
All right, well, do they have enhanced 911 in Jersey?
Uh, that's something I don't know.
Okay, it's possible they do, so that's something I'm not too certain about.
Well, that's certainly very plausible that they called through the operator.
Certainly the operator knows where you're calling from, so that would make sense.
Yeah, see, I would have assumed that the operator would have hung up, but, uh, whatever.
Yeah.
Anyway, you've got a great show, guys.
Okay, thanks for calling.
Thanks.
All right, uh, and those of you calling the regular number,
you're not going to get through because our phone system is all messed up, uh,
so you have to call 3405 or 3407.
212-279-3405 or 3407.
Everyone else, you're wasting your time.
Good evening.
Hi, let me get my question.
Could you hold?
Okay.
How does he get through all the time?
I don't understand it.
All right, once again, um, all right, now, what I wanted to ask you is about the, um, SS7.
Right.
Um, I've noticed that, um, I, well, first of all, uh, I noticed that when you call a number
that has a recording, like, you know, the, you know, doo-doo-doo, the number you have reached,
if you call, if that number has, uh, a digital switch, a 5ESS, which my number, the 225 exchange
in the 718 area code is on a 5ESS, there's clicks before the recording, but if you call
718-777, there's a ring before the recording.
Why is that on a DMS?
DMSs can do different things.
Well, if you try calling 225 in the 718 area code, 225-9872, and then, uh, 718-777-777,
to, uh, see how they, um, you know.
Well, I just want to add that just because you're getting a recording doesn't mean you're
getting it from that office.
Offices share the, uh, automated intercept system.
Uh, cluster of offices share a specific hardware that generates certain recordings that are not
specific to any one office.
Right, I know, but I, I've noticed this all the time that on a DMS, uh, switch, an exchange
that's hooked up to a DMS switch, it always gives a ring before the recording.
An exchange that's hooked up to a number 5ESS or a number 1ESS, uh, it gives a click.
Well, it's, it's kind of hard to, uh, to analyze, uh.
Well, if you were to, um, you know, uh, call number 718-225-9872 and 718-777-777, you'll
find out.
And the last thing I wanted to tell you is that, did you know if, if you make a recording
that says, um, uh, the number you have reached has been disconnected, temporarily disconnected,
and calls are being taken by such and such, that's, that that costs $40?
Why can't you just have your answering machine do that?
Well, you could do that, except, uh, then you won't get your phone disconnected.
I mean, they, they only do that if you want your phone actually disconnected.
Well, that's true, but why would you?
Well, I guess people have their reasons.
Well, for one thing, when you, when you pay that $40 and you don't have to pay the monthly
fee to have your phone.
That's true.
Yeah, so, I don't know, you know, somebody goes away for a couple of months, maybe they
want to do it that way.
Well, if you try 718-777-7777 and 718-225-9872, you'll know what I mean.
Okay, right now we don't have, uh, the ability to call anything, but we're lucky we can take
calls, uh, but I'm sure our listeners can, uh, can check into that and let us know what
they think.
All right, now this line here is kind of a weird one.
I'm not sure what we're going to get when we pick this one up because it's, uh, it's,
it's flashing in a weird kind of way, so be prepared for something strange.
Anybody there?
Yeah.
Ah, okay, go ahead.
Uh, I just have a very simple question.
Is caller ID in effect in Westchester right now?
Uh, it's planned for Westchester, I don't think so, I don't think it's, it's there yet.
You can experiment, though, you can dial star 6, 7, see if you get a, uh, a flashing dial
tone, which means that, uh, they're, they're installing it if they have not already.
Right.
And, uh, try a couple other things as well.
I just, I just want to add that, uh, I'm noticing in certain areas where, uh, it's, it's,
uh, completely evident that they've already installed SS7.
And, uh, for instance, you can block caller ID.
Right.
I've noticed that in a lot of these areas, they haven't yet installed the feature package
with, uh, the return call and the repeat call and all that business.
And, uh, it's kind of strange that they haven't.
You'd figure once they cut over the, the system that they'd install the new software, but they
seem to be lagging.
Now, what, how could you block it?
I, if you dial star 67, you'll block the caller ID information from being sent.
But that, that's per call, right?
Not necessarily, because if you already have blocking on, if you dial star 6, 7, you unblock
it.
Yeah.
So that's what's confusing here.
The default is obviously going to be to not to block.
So, in other words, if you, if you just want to block it forever, I mean.
Yeah, you have to specifically request from them that you want your default to be to always
block.
Okay, so you call the telephone company?
Yeah, you call your local, uh, business office and tell them that.
And trust that they get it right.
Yeah.
And that, that, once you do that, if you dial star 67, then you'll enable caller ID for
the, only for the duration of that call.
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
All right.
That's all I wanted to know.
Okay.
Thank you.
It seems to me that if, um, if they give you a recording saying, well, we're retrying
the number now, we're going to make your phone ring in a special way when, when it becomes
free, why can't they give you a recording saying your call is now unblocked or your call
is now blocked?
Yeah.
Instead of giving you a pulsing dial tone, which doesn't really tell you anything.
So that's, uh, one of the many questions that I've got for these people.
All right.
212-279-3405.
212-279-3407.
Don't call 212-279-3400.
A few people still are.
It's broken.
All those lines up there are broken.
We don't know why.
Good evening.
Yes.
Good evening.
Uh, not that you have to address this tonight, and I know it's not exactly the topic, but
in regard to the voting machines, to what extent couldn't that be controlled by some
agency of the government so that, let's say, uh, shall we say, Bush would be reelected
when actually the vote might even be, uh, against him?
You see what I mean?
In other words, to what extent do I know that the thing is an honest, uh, appraisal of all
the, uh, you know, votes of the people, and then, of course, even the electoral college,
uh, shenanigans, you know what I mean?
Well, it's, it's like anything else.
You know, it's, uh, uh, uh, you've got to, you've got to trust technology and something
that's, uh, as important as, uh, as elections, as voting.
I don't know.
I don't know if I could ever trust technology for that.
It's, you know, it's, it's going to be experimented with.
It's around the corner.
It's, uh, it's something that, uh, you know, a lot of people are, are playing around with,
but as to whether or not it's really going to happen, I don't know.
I mean, um, it'd be fun to play with, and I'm sure somebody would figure out a way to
manipulate it.
Uh, I only hope that the first person that does that is a hacker and not, not a government
official, because, uh, at least that way, you know, you'll, you won't get a dictator
elected or something.
You know, you'll get, I don't know, Wozniak elected.
I don't know.
Good evening.
Anybody there?
Hello?
Yeah, go ahead.
Hi, how you doing?
Okay.
I'm curious to find out, because I live in the Poughkeepsia area, but I'm one of, I'm
in one of the towns, which, uh, has an old office or something, they tell me, so the
caller ID doesn't work here, and I ask them if, uh, I call an area which does have caller
ID, if my number would appear, and they said it wouldn't, and I'm wondering if that's true.
Oh, no, absolutely, yeah, it's absolutely, that, that's, that's the truth.
Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
Before you say that, though, keep in mind that sometimes the phone company says something
is not being cut over, but it's still an SS7.
I mean, they may have told him, because, I know this from experience, because my exchange
has gone digital, and they tell me that it's one of the older ones, so that's why I don't
have call return.
However, people can call return me, and, and that's, that goes contrary to everything they
told me.
When I told them that, they say, no, you're wrong.
The person must have known your phone number and called you.
No, well, they were, they were obviously wrong there, but I mean, this is, this certainly
doesn't seem like the case.
As I had mentioned, Poughkeepsie has had the class, and, well, caller ID was just recently
made available, but they've been SS7 capable for two years now, and you would have gotten
it with everyone else two years ago.
And it's, it's no surprise that you're, you're probably on an older analog switch, and there
simply aren't any digital switches in your central office.
And because of that fact, you're simply going to have to wait around longer to either get
moved on to a digital switch, or, uh, hope that maybe they'll invest in your older office
to upgrade it.
I see.
Okay.
I also, um, because I'm, wanted to ask a question about, uh, something that came up on last show,
and that is, uh, the number for the preferred calling card was given.
I lost that number and called, uh, ITT Metro Media, and they told me that it's not being offered.
I'm wondering if you have that number.
Uh, I asked to speak to a supervisor, because it's being offered, you just have to be persistent.
I don't know why they're, they're being difficult about that, because it's, it's one of the best
things they offer.
Uh, I'm, I don't have the number with me, but it's Metro Media Long Distance, listed in
800 Information, and, um.
And is, is there such a thing as perhaps a guide to long distance companies and or access
codes out there anywhere in a book, or perhaps through 2600?
Well, we publish things occasionally, but you have to remember it's different in every part
of the country, and it's always constantly changing as well.
But, uh, you know, we try to keep people updated, and if there's other sources, we'll let you
know about that as well.
Where can I get a copy of 2600, say, around Grand Central, if you know?
Uh, around Grand, I don't really know.
Uh, downtown, there's a bunch of places that, that, that have it, a bunch of bookstores.
What's the number to 2600?
Uh, I'll give you the phone number, it's 516-751-2600, and that should tell you everything
you need to know.
Great.
Okay?
Bye-bye.
Thanks for calling.
Bye.
Good evening.
Okay.
Good evening.
Yeah, back to, uh, Caller ID.
Yeah.
It is, uh, it's true that you have to, uh, lease a device from, uh, Bell, right?
No, no.
No, that's not at all.
No.
It's up to you to buy a Caller ID box from, uh, a private vendor.
I see.
So that has nothing to do with the $6 a month charge, right?
No, the, the, the, it's $6 or $6.50, that's entirely for the service.
But without the box, the service is completely useless.
Now, prices for boxes range anywhere from $40 to $100 and something, but, uh...
Ah, so that's where they get you.
Okay.
Oh, yeah.
You, you have to, uh, you could, you could go to most electronic stores.
I mean, uh, like J&R Music World, I know, sells them.
I'm sure pretty soon everyone is going to sell them.
Every company can make their own, uh, Caller ID device, right?
Oh, yeah.
Look in mail order because, uh, that's where you find the, the lowest price.
Yeah, you'll, you'll probably find the bargains there, uh, coupled with all sorts of, you
know, memory features.
That's why anybody knows the information sent can simply make a device to take it, right?
What's that?
Anybody who knows the information sent, you know, between the, between the rings...
Oh, yeah.
They can make a device, right, to read that information.
Very quickly, one non-sequitur, what's the legality of using, uh, silver box tones, A,
B, C, and D?
Well, it depends what you do with them.
You can send any tones you want over the phone and there's really nothing wrong with that.
Um, but, um...
So, for example, uh, having one or even using it on, on, say, a college campus, that's
perfectly, perfectly, uh, legal, right?
Well, if you use it to, to make a free phone call, it's that act that would be illegal,
making the free phone call.
Not, not, not necessarily using the tones.
Okay.
It's using the tones with the intent.
Okay, so what's practical, perfectly legal?
Well, the tones in and of themselves are completely legal because they're part of the standard
touch tone set.
They're just not included on, on the keypad on your phone, but your phone is perfectly capable
of generating them.
Yeah, but, uh...
But, uh, as opposed to, like, say, uh, MF tones on a blue box or something, those tones
are entirely illegal.
It's, it's illegal to possess that, that sort of device because the tones can only be used
for one thing, whereas the quote-unquote silver box tones, A, B, C, and D, are simply general
purpose extensions to, uh, the standard touch tone keypad.
And they can have any wide variety of uses, just like the star and number sign are left for
general purpose.
Okay, so, so there's nothing wrong with that, with using those tones or, you know, punching
them down, uh...
Oh, no, not at all.
They do.
Yeah, as opposed to blue box.
Okay, thank you very much.
Great show.
And, uh, and the, uh, it is on newsstands now, 2600?
Yeah, you'll find it in various places.
Ask for it.
Okay, thank you very much, Paul.
Okay.
I don't know if I, if I, I certainly don't agree with what the phone company says that,
uh, possessing those tones is illegal because, you know, you, we've played those tones over
the air.
People want to know what they sound like.
They want to know what we're talking about.
So, if you have the tones, it doesn't necessarily mean you're going to use them for, you know,
an illegal purpose.
Uh, there's, you know, a very good reason to have the tones, and that's for education,
learning how it all works.
And, um, I just cannot go along with, uh, somebody saying that possessing something that
produces tones is illegal.
And, uh, go to my grave saying that.
Good evening.
Hello?
Yeah, go ahead.
Yeah, hi, um, didn't you and Fiber Optic used to be, you both were hackers at one time,
right?
Uh, you don't really put that in the past tense.
Once a hacker, you're always a hacker of a sense.
It's a state of mind.
Yeah, you change what you do.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, but that's, that's pretty much why we're here.
And, um, you used to call it, like, hack systems and stuff, right?
We used to hack systems?
Yeah.
Well, I mean, you know, you can't get too specific as to what you use your hacking abilities
to do.
Mm-hmm.
Basically, you know, we're, we're, we're both explorers and we learn things.
And we, we spread knowledge.
Hmm.
Um, what kind of systems do you hack when you, well, what systems did you hack?
Uh, well, there's, you know, the phone system is, is probably the biggest system
out there to, to play with and to figure out what it does.
Well, let's just, uh, distinguish hack synonymous with learn.
Right.
No, but would you, like, carry your scan and look for stuff and then, like, Unixes and
faxes and would you, like, explore those type of things?
We, we explore, you know, we really can't answer anymore because, because.
You're skating the fine line in the gray area.
Yeah, and since, since fiber optic is under federal indictment at the moment.
Yeah, those aren't wise questions.
We don't want to, uh, we don't want to, like, you know, delve into things that might be
misinterpreted or anything like that.
But, uh, um, good questions.
But not, not appropriate for right now.
Good evening.
PAI?
Yeah, go ahead.
Hi, yes.
Go ahead.
Hello?
Yeah.
Am I on the air?
Not anymore.
Good evening.
Hi.
Uh, I'm calling about what you said before about, uh, Connecticut is the only state,
uh, uh, Arkansas will be the only state left after Connecticut stops the 10 cent call.
Isn't that what you said?
I have a feeling I'm about to be corrected, yes.
Well, Vermont still has 10 cents.
Do they?
Yep.
Oh, that's interesting.
The New York Times doesn't seem to know that then because I was, I was quoting from
them.
Is that 10 cents unlimited?
What do they know?
Yeah, is it 10 cents for an unlimited call?
Uh, I, I don't know.
I never saw how long I could speak on it.
Actually, I don't think it's unlimited on any, I don't see how a pay phone can be unlimited.
I don't think a pay phone is ever unlimited.
Yeah, I don't know if that was, that was right either, but that is interesting.
Uh, what is the phone company there, do you know?
In Vermont?
Yeah.
Oh, it's Ninex.
Yeah, but, uh.
New England Telephone?
No, but we're, we're New York Telephone here, so they're what?
They're New England Telephone, yeah.
Okay.
New England Telephone, yeah.
So does that mean all of New England Telephone is 10 cents?
Like New Hampshire, are they 10 cents?
I don't know, I didn't, but next time I go up when I hit the border, when I cross the
different states, I'll try for you.
Uh, I don't know.
Okay.
And it's awful, because if you don't know about it, it's such a waste, you know, you throw
quarters in until you find out, finally, it's a dime.
Well, New Jersey is 20 cents, and most people just throw a quarter in.
Oh, well, I'm glad you told me that.
Yeah, who has two dimes, you know?
And it's, it's another example of a phone company ripoff, they don't credit you for
that initial deposit.
Yeah.
You'd think that, you know, they would know that you're putting in a quarter instead of
a dime.
That's right.
And give you 15 cents credit, but they don't.
And how about when you don't have a nickel to put in, and you put a dime in?
No matter what you put in, it only counts for a nickel, but that's only on local calls.
Only local calls, but, uh, you know, I cannot believe that they don't have the sophistication
to, uh, to distinguish.
Oh, surely they do.
They just want to turn a book.
Well, thanks very much for your show.
It's very interesting.
Okay, thanks for calling.
It's the same time I've listened, I guess.
Okay, thanks for calling.
Thanks, bye.
And we have time for a couple more calls.
Good evening.
Yes, hi.
Hi, go ahead.
I had a brief question.
Yes.
About caller ID.
Yes.
Um, in, in New York City, Brooklyn, can you, what is the, the system for caller ID suppressed
in other words if you don't want people to be able to?
All right, there's, there's two ways of doing it.
One way is to tell the phone company that you want all your calls blocked.
All right, but you have to tell them that.
They, they are going to assume that you're, you're going to simply love giving out your
number to everybody you call.
Uh, the other way is if you do.
And is that free?
Uh, yes.
Yeah, that's free.
Oh, yes, that's free.
And, uh, that'd be, that'd be held to pay if it wasn't.
Uh, that's, that's power of the consumer for you.
But there's, the other way, if you, if you have a phone that doesn't block, you dial
star six, seven, and then that does block it.
However, there's a danger there because if by some chance you think that the phone you're
at is, um, is unblocked and you dial star six, seven, and in actuality that phone is
blocked, by dialing star six, seven, you're unblocking it.
There's no way to tell the difference.
And how can you find out if, is it, is it a phone or a phone line?
We don't know yet exactly how to find out.
Uh, I mean, if it's your phone, you should know yourself.
If it's somebody else's phone and they're not around to ask, uh, supposedly there's
an 800 number you can call, but we have not seen that work yet.
So there, at that moment, there is no way of knowing.
Yeah, if this is just in your own home, you just assume that, uh, it is being sent.
If you're in one of these areas where caller ID is, uh, soon to become available, just assume
your number is by default being sent.
So you dial star six, seven, or on a rotary phone, one, one, six, seven to block it for the
duration of that call only.
So you have to do this for every call you make?
Oh, yeah.
That's, that's if you want to, that's if you are changing whatever the default setting
is.
Yeah.
Or else, uh, as we say, call your local business office, tell them you want to change your default
to always block.
Yeah.
Or call call block.
And then star six, seven would take on the opposite meaning.
Right.
Okay.
So if I call up the phone company and tell them I don't want caller ID to be received from
my phone.
Right.
It'll never be received.
Right.
All call blocking, yeah.
Yeah.
You should test it with a friend before you assume.
Yeah, make, make sure you test it because they mess things up quite a bit.
Right.
Now let's get somebody who has a caller ID phone and.
Yeah.
Right.
Is this supposed to be in effect in New York City or is this in different neighborhoods?
Uh, November 1st, uh, most every place except Manhattan.
Manhattan is going to take quite a while to cut over.
But, uh, the rest of the boroughs, uh, the outskirts of the city, part of upstate, uh,
will all be cut over.
Okay, we're out of time, but thanks for calling.
All right.
And, uh, that's, uh, pretty much going to do it for us.
This has been Off the Hook, and we've been talking about caller ID.
We will be talking about caller ID again, uh, in future programs.
I want to thank Fiber Optic for coming by and, uh, giving us information.
Thank the listeners for being so patient with our phone system.
And, uh, stay tuned for the personal computer show.
Good night.
Good night.