Off The Hook - 1994-11-23

[00:45.720 --> 00:48.040]  [SPEAKER_02]: And it's just after 10 o'clock.
[00:48.200 --> 00:52.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're listening to radio station WBAI in New York.
[00:53.000 --> 00:54.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: And it's time for Off the Hook.
[02:04.390 --> 02:05.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: And a very good evening to everybody.
[02:05.970 --> 02:07.330]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is Off the Hook.
[02:07.330 --> 02:13.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: A program about technology, computers, telephones, privacy, Big Brother, and all that kind of fun stuff.
[02:14.230 --> 02:16.170]  [SPEAKER_02]: And tonight is a very special night.
[02:16.270 --> 02:26.810]  [SPEAKER_02]: We are currently set up in Columbus Circle, ready to start the Phiber Optik Homecoming Parade, which will eventually land him right here in the WBAI studios.
[02:26.810 --> 02:36.810]  [SPEAKER_02]: Phiber Optik having been locked up in federal prison for 10 months now, since that cold day in January, where we drop them off in School Kill, Pennsylvania.
[02:37.370 --> 02:38.730]  [SPEAKER_02]: Pennsylvania being the prison state.
[02:39.790 --> 02:42.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: And there are being over 1 million prisoners now in this country.
[02:43.150 --> 02:44.870]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's amazing what's going on out there.
[02:45.190 --> 02:52.190]  [SPEAKER_02]: And so, for Fiber, before we actually start the parade, and by the way, if you are in New York City, you might want to rush to Broadway now.
[02:52.330 --> 02:53.290]  [SPEAKER_02]: I just passed by.
[02:53.490 --> 02:55.410]  [SPEAKER_02]: They put up the police barricades for us and everything.
[02:55.550 --> 02:56.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's very nice.
[02:56.270 --> 02:58.670]  [SPEAKER_02]: All these parade preparations, I wasn't really expecting it.
[02:59.150 --> 03:04.090]  [SPEAKER_02]: But just run over there, and very soon you will see Phiber Optik go by in the 2600 van.
[03:05.350 --> 03:08.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: And he'll be seeing the streets of New York for the first time in almost a year.
[03:09.330 --> 03:13.370]  [SPEAKER_02]: But before we cut over there, a special dedication for Fiber.
[03:13.890 --> 03:19.630]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is a song that goes out to him from Neville Staples, a.k.a.
[03:19.750 --> 03:20.650]  [SPEAKER_02]: Judge Roughneck.
[03:20.790 --> 03:23.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's called Rude Boys Out of Jail.
[03:31.230 --> 03:33.090]  [SPEAKER_16]: Rude Boys Out of Jail.
[03:33.090 --> 03:33.150]  [SPEAKER_16]: Rude Boys Out of Jail.
[03:34.070 --> 03:36.010]  [SPEAKER_16]: The two who are here.
[03:37.710 --> 03:39.970]  [SPEAKER_16]: When the people never sleep.
[03:40.990 --> 03:43.110]  [SPEAKER_16]: And then Rude Boys used to creep.
[03:47.080 --> 03:50.340]  [SPEAKER_16]: But he went downstairs and he went downstairs.
[03:50.940 --> 03:53.120]  [SPEAKER_16]: In the people's house.
[03:53.620 --> 03:58.790]  [SPEAKER_16]: To send you some creep like a mouse.
[04:08.060 --> 04:10.060]  [SPEAKER_16]: To be the standard thing.
[04:12.460 --> 04:14.240]  [SPEAKER_16]: He went around the block once.
[04:14.240 --> 04:15.580]  [SPEAKER_16]: To send him here to go back again.
[04:16.220 --> 04:18.520]  [SPEAKER_16]: Because he dropped his head's ass.
[04:19.600 --> 04:20.500]  [SPEAKER_16]: To a tower.
[04:26.350 --> 04:28.730]  [SPEAKER_16]: Now Rude Boys in front of the judge.
[04:29.370 --> 04:31.790]  [SPEAKER_16]: And the judge not only in yet.
[04:32.310 --> 04:34.950]  [SPEAKER_15]: My name is George Roughneck.
[04:35.910 --> 04:38.610]  [SPEAKER_15]: And Rude Boys is here in front of me.
[04:39.710 --> 04:41.890]  [SPEAKER_15]: For stealing and breaking the doors.
[04:43.890 --> 04:44.770]  [SPEAKER_15]: Good boy.
[04:45.570 --> 04:46.150]  [SPEAKER_15]: Rude Boy.
[04:46.150 --> 04:47.090]  [SPEAKER_15]: I have read your papers.
[04:48.030 --> 04:49.170]  [SPEAKER_15]: True and true.
[04:50.490 --> 04:52.290]  [SPEAKER_15]: And there's only one thing for me to do.
[04:52.810 --> 04:54.770]  [SPEAKER_15]: And that is the sentence you...
[04:54.770 --> 04:55.470]  [SPEAKER_15]: for seeking here.
[04:56.690 --> 04:57.590]  [SPEAKER_15]: Take my way.
[05:27.590 --> 05:28.170]  Rude.
[05:56.570 --> 05:57.610]  [SPEAKER_15]: Alright Rude Boy.
[05:59.090 --> 06:00.610]  [SPEAKER_15]: Get in front of me again.
[06:03.190 --> 06:04.770]  [SPEAKER_15]: And I will let you go now.
[06:04.890 --> 06:05.850]  [SPEAKER_15]: You've served your time.
[07:01.250 --> 07:01.850]  [SPEAKER_16]: No!
[07:01.850 --> 07:03.030]  [SPEAKER_16]: No, Rude Boy!
[07:03.330 --> 07:04.230]  [SPEAKER_16]: Don't let me see you, okay?
[07:04.850 --> 07:06.870]  [SPEAKER_16]: Rude Boy's out of jail!
[07:08.270 --> 07:10.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: Rude Boy's out of jail!
[07:11.650 --> 07:13.690]  [SPEAKER_14]: Rude Boy's out of jail!
[07:15.490 --> 07:17.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: Rude Boy's out of jail!
[07:18.790 --> 07:20.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: Rude Boy's out of jail!
[07:22.010 --> 07:23.290]  Rude Boy's out of jail!
[07:23.670 --> 07:25.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: Rude Boy's out of jail!
[07:27.830 --> 07:28.850]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, okay.
[07:29.070 --> 07:29.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Fade away there.
[07:30.230 --> 07:31.530]  [SPEAKER_02]: Rude Boy is out of jail.
[07:32.130 --> 07:33.530]  [SPEAKER_02]: Rude Boy is fiber optic.
[07:33.710 --> 07:35.090]  [SPEAKER_02]: Fiber optic, are you there?
[07:35.350 --> 07:36.490]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yes, I'm here, Emmanuel.
[07:36.630 --> 07:41.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, for the first time since January, you're not in prison.
[07:41.490 --> 07:42.930]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're outside in the free world.
[07:43.470 --> 07:46.050]  [SPEAKER_02]: And right now you're talking to us live from Columbus Circle, is that right?
[07:46.330 --> 07:46.930]  That's correct.
[07:47.270 --> 07:50.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so we have the fiber optic homecoming parade all set to begin.
[07:51.870 --> 07:53.110]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know what they're going to be.
[07:53.270 --> 07:57.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: If they're going to be throwing confetti or shooting off fireworks or balloons or whatnot.
[07:57.550 --> 08:00.130]  [SPEAKER_02]: I hear there's an awful lot of setup going on, though.
[08:00.630 --> 08:04.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: I've been hearing it on the radio all day about preparations on the way for the Great Parade.
[08:05.510 --> 08:10.630]  [SPEAKER_02]: So I guess you guys are ready to start the return home.
[08:10.990 --> 08:11.890]  [SPEAKER_06]: Just about, yep.
[08:12.190 --> 08:15.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, well, tell me what you've done so far.
[08:15.390 --> 08:16.810]  [SPEAKER_02]: You got out actually yesterday, right?
[08:17.010 --> 08:19.090]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, I got out yesterday morning.
[08:20.250 --> 08:24.370]  [SPEAKER_27]: And my girlfriend here, Kathy, picked me up at about 8.30 in the morning.
[08:25.390 --> 08:29.990]  [SPEAKER_27]: And we had a really great lunch, and we drove back, and we got to the city.
[08:30.230 --> 08:31.330]  [SPEAKER_27]: We had a rental car.
[08:31.470 --> 08:34.330]  [SPEAKER_27]: We returned it at Avis, and we took a cab back to my house.
[08:34.750 --> 08:43.630]  [SPEAKER_27]: And on the way back, when we were back in my neighborhood, we pulled over and kept the meter running, and I ran into my favorite local pizzeria and grabbed a couple of slices to go.
[08:43.970 --> 08:44.450]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[08:45.070 --> 08:47.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I'll bet those are the best slices you ever had in your life.
[08:47.870 --> 08:48.910]  [SPEAKER_27]: The best pizza ever.
[08:49.150 --> 08:49.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
[08:50.150 --> 08:50.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's great.
[08:50.930 --> 08:53.330]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, well, now you guys are actually going to start moving now.
[08:53.330 --> 08:53.810]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yep.
[08:54.090 --> 08:54.290]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[08:54.510 --> 08:56.290]  [SPEAKER_02]: I know the people of New York are impatient.
[08:56.530 --> 08:58.030]  [SPEAKER_02]: They don't want to be standing out in the cold.
[08:58.150 --> 08:58.870]  [SPEAKER_02]: It was snowing today.
[08:59.610 --> 09:01.370]  [SPEAKER_02]: You must feel great about that.
[09:01.850 --> 09:06.870]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, actually, I was really glad that the snow didn't start while I was still there, because that would have been really depressing.
[09:07.190 --> 09:07.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[09:08.310 --> 09:10.010]  [SPEAKER_02]: I remember when snow used to be cheerful.
[09:10.470 --> 09:15.770]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, well, it's not cheerful when you're shoveling it or snowblowing it for two months straight.
[09:15.910 --> 09:16.390]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's true.
[09:16.590 --> 09:17.210]  [SPEAKER_27]: Hours a day.
[09:17.210 --> 09:23.450]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right, now, you've been in the free world now for about 24, 36 hours or so?
[09:23.650 --> 09:24.650]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, almost two days now.
[09:24.750 --> 09:24.950]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[09:25.170 --> 09:26.470]  [SPEAKER_02]: And what are your impressions?
[09:26.610 --> 09:27.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: Have things changed?
[09:27.690 --> 09:29.670]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh, certain things have changed.
[09:29.790 --> 09:31.930]  [SPEAKER_27]: And a lot of things have stayed the same.
[09:32.070 --> 09:36.510]  [SPEAKER_27]: Like, I rode the subway for the first time today, and it looked exactly the same.
[09:36.950 --> 09:42.810]  [SPEAKER_27]: But other things that you wouldn't think about, like when I first got back to my neighborhood, everything looked small.
[09:43.910 --> 09:50.130]  [SPEAKER_27]: Like, the houses looked smaller, and just everything seemed smaller, like I grew or something.
[09:50.450 --> 09:50.870]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[09:51.030 --> 09:52.490]  [SPEAKER_27]: Which was really peculiar.
[09:52.690 --> 09:53.570]  [SPEAKER_27]: It was a very strange feeling.
[09:53.710 --> 10:00.770]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I know that happens when you go away from your childhood neighborhood and you come back as an adult, but I don't know if that happens in 10 months.
[10:00.930 --> 10:01.330]  [SPEAKER_27]: No.
[10:02.190 --> 10:03.550]  [SPEAKER_27]: I don't really know what it was.
[10:03.650 --> 10:04.410]  [SPEAKER_27]: It was just really weird.
[10:04.450 --> 10:06.170]  [SPEAKER_27]: I guess it just seemed unfamiliar at first.
[10:06.170 --> 10:06.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[10:06.710 --> 10:07.630]  [SPEAKER_02]: Are you guys moving yet?
[10:08.150 --> 10:09.170]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh, no.
[10:09.270 --> 10:09.810]  [SPEAKER_27]: You're about ready?
[10:09.950 --> 10:11.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, let's get this thing underway.
[10:12.050 --> 10:12.270]  [SPEAKER_27]: Okay.
[10:12.490 --> 10:13.530]  [SPEAKER_27]: We're going to start moving now.
[10:13.770 --> 10:15.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, see if they can honk the van's horn.
[10:15.730 --> 10:16.870]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's see if we can hear that all the way up here.
[10:18.790 --> 10:20.070]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's the intermittent horn.
[10:20.190 --> 10:20.850]  [SPEAKER_27]: It honked once.
[10:20.990 --> 10:21.670]  [SPEAKER_27]: Now it's not working.
[10:21.770 --> 10:24.010]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, there's been a problem with the van's horn.
[10:25.210 --> 10:26.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: It honks sometimes.
[10:26.310 --> 10:27.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: It honks when it feels like it.
[10:27.750 --> 10:28.730]  People are looking at us.
[10:28.950 --> 10:29.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: People are looking at you.
[10:29.950 --> 10:31.050]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's to be expected.
[10:34.420 --> 10:35.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: There you go.
[10:35.080 --> 10:35.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: There it is.
[10:35.540 --> 10:36.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: Or is that someone honking at you?
[10:37.060 --> 10:37.920]  [SPEAKER_06]: No, that was us.
[10:38.140 --> 10:41.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so right now you're in the van and you're coming down Broadway.
[10:42.060 --> 10:44.300]  [SPEAKER_06]: Oh, we will be soon, as soon as the red light changes.
[10:44.440 --> 10:45.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah, of course.
[10:45.120 --> 10:47.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: We will be respecting all traffic laws.
[10:47.360 --> 10:47.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: Of course.
[10:48.080 --> 10:49.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: As required by law.
[10:51.800 --> 10:54.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: Tell us something about what you see as you come down Broadway.
[10:55.300 --> 10:56.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, here we go.
[10:56.240 --> 10:56.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're moving.
[10:56.800 --> 10:57.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[10:57.540 --> 10:58.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yellow cabs.
[10:58.360 --> 10:59.020]  [SPEAKER_27]: Lots of yellow cabs.
[10:59.020 --> 11:00.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Lots of yellow cabs.
[11:01.920 --> 11:03.080]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, police lines.
[11:03.240 --> 11:03.780]  [SPEAKER_27]: Do not cross.
[11:04.100 --> 11:05.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, they put those up.
[11:05.660 --> 11:07.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: I haven't seen one of those in I don't know how long.
[11:07.760 --> 11:07.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[11:08.040 --> 11:09.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's to prevent the crowd from getting too close.
[11:10.060 --> 11:11.060]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, transit police car.
[11:11.140 --> 11:11.540]  [SPEAKER_27]: Look at that.
[11:11.780 --> 11:13.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's probably for our protection, too.
[11:15.920 --> 11:18.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, there's a whole lot of people in the van with you, right?
[11:18.840 --> 11:19.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, there is.
[11:19.640 --> 11:21.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Why don't we ask them to make some noise?
[11:21.160 --> 11:22.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's hear some cheers for Fiber.
[11:22.640 --> 11:23.700]  [SPEAKER_27]: Everybody, make some noise.
[11:28.900 --> 11:30.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, that's pretty impressive.
[11:33.520 --> 11:36.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so you've gone through the light now.
[11:36.480 --> 11:37.800]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yes, we're moving along.
[11:38.860 --> 11:40.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: You'll be passing through Times Square pretty quickly.
[11:43.040 --> 11:44.180]  [SPEAKER_06]: Uh, where are we?
[11:45.080 --> 11:46.580]  [SPEAKER_06]: We're at West 55th Street.
[11:46.720 --> 11:47.740]  [SPEAKER_06]: We're not quite at Times Square yet.
[11:47.800 --> 11:49.080]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, but soon you will be.
[11:49.200 --> 11:49.380]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.
[11:49.560 --> 11:52.220]  [SPEAKER_02]: And if there are people on Broadway right now, you're encouraged to...
[11:52.220 --> 11:53.720]  [SPEAKER_04]: Hey, it's The Late Show with David Letterman.
[11:53.820 --> 11:54.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, there you go.
[11:54.860 --> 11:58.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're encouraged to follow along and beep your horns and wave and...
[11:58.460 --> 11:58.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: There's the horn.
[11:59.340 --> 11:59.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[12:00.500 --> 12:01.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: There you go.
[12:03.300 --> 12:05.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, is it like you expected when you got out?
[12:06.620 --> 12:09.820]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh, no, actually, everything's really strange.
[12:09.820 --> 12:11.140]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's like, uh...
[12:11.140 --> 12:14.180]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's almost as if I was dropped on the planet by a flying saucer.
[12:14.320 --> 12:14.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[12:14.960 --> 12:17.100]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I'm, like, seeing everything for the first time.
[12:17.260 --> 12:28.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: By the way, I should point out that fiber optic is on a cellular phone, and that means that those of you with scanners out there can probably hear this conversation either on 99.5 FM or somewhere up in the 800 megahertz spectrum.
[12:28.620 --> 12:29.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, it's your choice.
[12:30.860 --> 12:31.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: I have a question.
[12:32.100 --> 12:32.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
[12:32.580 --> 12:33.200]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh, I...
[12:33.200 --> 12:36.300]  [SPEAKER_27]: This is the first time I can remember using a cellular phone.
[12:36.500 --> 12:37.680]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, uh...
[12:37.680 --> 12:39.680]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm not going to get a brain tumor or anything.
[12:39.820 --> 12:40.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: Wait a minute.
[12:40.320 --> 12:42.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: You, fiber optic, have never used a cellular phone?
[12:43.040 --> 12:47.600]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, it's a really interesting story, but actually I never got involved in cellular phones.
[12:47.900 --> 12:48.100]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh-huh.
[12:48.280 --> 12:49.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm sort of the same way.
[12:49.300 --> 12:57.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think at this point in time, they're entirely too high-priced, and, um, they just don't really provide that much benefit for the dollar.
[12:57.660 --> 12:58.000]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[12:58.460 --> 13:01.660]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, the signal is terrible, for the most part.
[13:01.860 --> 13:11.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, interestingly, when I first heard about mobile phones, and when I first got interested, or at least thought I was interested in them, there were no cell phones yet.
[13:11.380 --> 13:13.900]  [SPEAKER_27]: It was the Improved Mobile Telephone Service, IMTS.
[13:14.200 --> 13:14.480]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[13:14.480 --> 13:23.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, uh, I had met some people that, uh, that knew a lot about mobile phones and things, except the phones themselves back then were expensive, and those were only mobile phones.
[13:24.400 --> 13:28.000]  [SPEAKER_27]: So it was always the price range that kept me at a distance from the whole thing.
[13:28.160 --> 13:34.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right now cellular phones are, um, are a little too much geared towards, uh, towards businesses and not towards consumers.
[13:34.580 --> 13:34.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[13:35.000 --> 13:42.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: I keep hearing that's going to change, that there are going to be many more frequencies opened up, and, uh, everybody will have a personal communication device of some sort.
[13:43.100 --> 13:44.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, we'll just have to see.
[13:44.140 --> 13:45.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: That will happen in the next couple of years, hopefully.
[13:46.260 --> 13:51.840]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, well, actually, I've been reading that the FCC is, at this very moment, auctioning off the Spectrum.
[13:51.960 --> 13:52.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[13:52.560 --> 13:54.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: To, uh, PCS companies.
[13:55.160 --> 13:56.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, they started that a few months ago.
[13:57.100 --> 13:57.280]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[13:57.820 --> 13:58.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, where are you now?
[13:59.020 --> 14:02.800]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right now, we are 49th Street.
[14:03.100 --> 14:03.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: 49th.
[14:03.580 --> 14:16.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so not quite at Times Square yet, so, uh, those of you waiting in Times Square, let's be a little bit more patient, uh, let's, uh, try and stay calm here as, as fiber optic passes by, and it's really, uh, really quite an event here.
[14:16.860 --> 14:20.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, we've, we've waited for this to happen now for, for so long.
[14:20.160 --> 14:22.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: This, uh, this whole year has gone by really slowly.
[14:23.080 --> 14:25.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, uh, well, here we are, out in the free world.
[14:27.580 --> 14:30.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, of course, fiber will be here real soon at the, at the radio station.
[14:32.100 --> 14:33.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: Live for the first time.
[14:33.400 --> 14:41.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: I guess, I guess we can say now, Mark, um, you know, for the first couple of months while you were in prison, we, we only heard from you on tape.
[14:41.800 --> 14:46.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: But, uh, after a while, uh, we managed to figure out a way to get you on the air live.
[14:46.940 --> 14:47.300]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[14:47.300 --> 14:49.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, I guess it, it won't hurt anybody now to explain how we did that.
[14:50.620 --> 15:01.680]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh, yeah, actually, um, Emmanuel had, uh, one of his lines forwarded to the radio station on Wednesday nights, and that number was authorized on my telephone list.
[15:01.800 --> 15:03.980]  [SPEAKER_27]: We could only call numbers that are pre-approved.
[15:04.780 --> 15:08.220]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, uh, on Wednesday nights, I would just call that number and it would forward to the station.
[15:08.700 --> 15:09.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's right.
[15:09.300 --> 15:12.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: We, we kept that line in service just for you to call in on Wednesday nights.
[15:13.460 --> 15:16.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, in fact, we, we've, we've gotten rid of that line now that you're out.
[15:16.880 --> 15:20.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, but it was, it was as simple as that with, uh, with call forwarding.
[15:20.420 --> 15:23.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: We were able to make the, um, uh, the line go wherever we wanted it to go.
[15:24.180 --> 15:27.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, now, I understand that's against the rules, though, isn't it?
[15:27.560 --> 15:28.640]  [SPEAKER_27]: Technically, it is, yeah.
[15:28.800 --> 15:33.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: Anything like, uh, having somebody make a three-way call or forwarding a phone is all against the rules.
[15:34.080 --> 15:34.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[15:34.540 --> 15:35.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, a lot of things are against the rules.
[15:36.180 --> 15:36.420]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah.
[15:36.720 --> 15:39.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, tell us something about the, uh, the whole checkout procedure.
[15:40.040 --> 15:42.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: It started at, what, 8 o'clock in the morning yesterday?
[15:42.680 --> 15:46.160]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh, they were, they were a little late, so it was more around 8.30-ish.
[15:46.720 --> 15:55.080]  [SPEAKER_27]: But, uh, what happened was, uh, a couple of friends of mine, I, I had been saying goodbye to everybody since the night before, but a couple of friends helped me bring down all my things.
[15:55.160 --> 16:00.700]  [SPEAKER_27]: I had, like, uh, a box of books and magazines and my personal letters and things.
[16:02.200 --> 16:08.680]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, uh, we were waiting and waiting and waiting, and then finally, they showed up and they said they had to set up and all this business.
[16:08.680 --> 16:16.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: But it was actually really funny, because I went in, and what happened was, uh, we just left Times Square, by the way.
[16:16.540 --> 16:16.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[16:17.260 --> 16:24.060]  [SPEAKER_27]: What happened was, I went in, and they started searching through all my things, and they had to have somebody strip search me.
[16:24.060 --> 16:27.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I'm like, I'm thinking to myself, they can't be serious, I'm going home.
[16:27.340 --> 16:29.460]  [SPEAKER_27]: What, would I try to, like, smuggle something out home?
[16:30.100 --> 16:39.340]  [SPEAKER_27]: So what happened, it was funny, we went in the back room, and the guy said, don't worry about it, just take your shoes off really slow, and then just put them back on again and stall for time.
[16:40.240 --> 16:48.580]  [SPEAKER_27]: Because he said, if, uh, otherwise I was going to a halfway house, then it would be a real formality, and they would have had to do it, but he said, since I'm going home, then there's, uh, no problem.
[16:49.080 --> 16:49.280]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[16:49.400 --> 16:55.520]  [SPEAKER_27]: But we just stalled so that the person outside thought that we actually did the strip search, which was, uh, kind of funny.
[16:55.840 --> 16:56.080]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[16:57.100 --> 17:07.160]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, after that, the guy just left, and the woman that was left in, in the room said that she had to get someone else to verify that it was really me that actually did this prison term.
[17:07.420 --> 17:10.780]  [SPEAKER_27]: Like, God forbid, you pay somebody to do your prison term or something, I have no idea.
[17:10.840 --> 17:14.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Isn't it kind of late to verify that it's really you in the prison when you leave them?
[17:14.020 --> 17:15.400]  [SPEAKER_27]: I thought, I thought it was pretty funny.
[17:15.760 --> 17:28.060]  [SPEAKER_27]: So, what she does is that she phones the office in the front of the building, and, um, one of the administrative staff comes up, and, uh, she tells him, she first told him on the phone that, uh, she needed him to verify that it was really me.
[17:28.320 --> 17:33.200]  [SPEAKER_27]: So, he comes up, he comes into the room, and all of a sudden, he says, that's him.
[17:33.440 --> 17:35.460]  [SPEAKER_27]: And she says, no, no, not yet, not yet.
[17:36.220 --> 17:48.140]  [SPEAKER_27]: So then, so then we're standing around, she takes my ID card, and she puts the ID card down on the desk, which has my picture on it, and he sees the ID card, and he goes, that's Tim, she goes, no, no, no, you're getting ahead of yourself.
[17:48.740 --> 18:02.820]  [SPEAKER_27]: So then she takes out my file that has my mugshot holding up my registration number, and there's a thumbprint on it, so I have to go over to the side, and I thought I was going to get all fingerprinted again, I was really annoyed, I was going to get all inked up,
[18:02.980 --> 18:05.200]  [SPEAKER_27]: but it turns out that they only took a thumbprint.
[18:07.200 --> 18:08.300]  [SPEAKER_27]: And when... hello?
[18:08.480 --> 18:09.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: Is that the warning?
[18:09.700 --> 18:11.800]  [SPEAKER_27]: No, I think we're just fading in and out.
[18:12.060 --> 18:14.800]  [SPEAKER_27]: Maybe we're skipping a cell or something.
[18:15.040 --> 18:17.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so there's no time limit on this call.
[18:17.760 --> 18:18.720]  [SPEAKER_27]: No, no, it's good.
[18:20.440 --> 18:22.660]  [SPEAKER_27]: We're about a block away from the station, she says.
[18:22.800 --> 18:23.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, are you coming up here now?
[18:24.680 --> 18:25.220]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's up to you.
[18:25.220 --> 18:26.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's up to you what you want to do out there.
[18:27.400 --> 18:27.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: Let's see.
[18:29.280 --> 18:30.320]  [SPEAKER_27]: Where are we right now?
[18:34.970 --> 18:36.800]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, we're going to be coming up fairly soon.
[18:37.000 --> 18:37.820]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, great.
[18:37.840 --> 18:39.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: Just keep us surprised at the situation.
[18:39.520 --> 18:39.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[18:39.880 --> 18:42.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Don't want to be too shocked when you walk through the door.
[18:42.240 --> 18:42.480]  Right.
[18:44.100 --> 18:50.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, we'll be taking some phone calls, too, in a little bit, so those of you out there that want to greet Fiber personally, you'll have that chance.
[18:50.900 --> 18:53.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so you're at the point where they're starting to recognize who you are.
[18:54.140 --> 18:54.840]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, right.
[18:55.080 --> 19:01.700]  [SPEAKER_06]: So they take the thumbprint, and then the guy says, that's him.
[19:02.020 --> 19:03.400]  [SPEAKER_27]: And then she says, okay.
[19:03.560 --> 19:05.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: And then that was it, after all that time.
[19:05.820 --> 19:07.020]  [SPEAKER_27]: And then it was kind of funny.
[19:07.020 --> 19:16.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: It kind of reminded me of when you give somebody a $50 bill in a supermarket, and they hold it up to the light as if they can tell whether it's real or not.
[19:17.040 --> 19:28.900]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, it kind of reminded me of that, because she proceeded to hold up my ID card with the thumbprint on it, and look at it back and forth between the one that they had when I first got there, and the one they just took.
[19:28.900 --> 19:36.020]  [SPEAKER_27]: Like as if she could read the detail of the thumbprint with her naked eye, which I thought was really funny, because they looked completely different.
[19:37.160 --> 19:38.980]  [SPEAKER_27]: But apparently it was good enough for her.
[19:39.280 --> 19:41.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: What was it like leaving the people behind?
[19:41.960 --> 19:45.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, it was kind of really, really depressing.
[19:45.980 --> 19:49.740]  [SPEAKER_27]: I mean, it was really bad yesterday, but I'm feeling kind of better today.
[19:49.980 --> 19:52.100]  [SPEAKER_27]: I mean, gradually, little by little.
[19:53.120 --> 19:56.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: By people, of course, I should point out, we're referring to the inmates, not the guards.
[19:57.880 --> 19:58.640]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, exactly.
[19:59.420 --> 19:59.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[20:00.180 --> 20:00.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I'm...
[20:00.760 --> 20:01.620]  [SPEAKER_06]: In front of the building now.
[20:02.040 --> 20:03.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're in front of WBAI Studios?
[20:03.860 --> 20:04.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: We are.
[20:04.280 --> 20:04.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[20:05.000 --> 20:05.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well...
[20:05.400 --> 20:05.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: Here's the horn.
[20:06.100 --> 20:08.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: See if you can fight your way through the mob out there and...
[20:08.900 --> 20:09.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[20:09.500 --> 20:10.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: ...come upstairs.
[20:11.160 --> 20:11.710]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[20:12.540 --> 20:14.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: It can be rather difficult sometimes.
[20:15.280 --> 20:18.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so the 2600 van is here.
[20:18.820 --> 20:19.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're now getting out.
[20:20.060 --> 20:23.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: Phiber Optik has arrived at the lobby of the studios.
[20:23.840 --> 20:24.940]  [SPEAKER_06]: We're piling out of the van.
[20:25.120 --> 20:26.380]  [SPEAKER_06]: Oh, look at all this media.
[20:26.620 --> 20:27.660]  [SPEAKER_02]: Please, stand back, people.
[20:27.660 --> 20:29.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you've got to push the media back.
[20:29.280 --> 20:31.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: They're just out of control.
[20:31.640 --> 20:32.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Out of control.
[20:34.180 --> 20:35.200]  [SPEAKER_06]: Please, stuttering down.
[20:35.840 --> 20:38.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: Okay, we're now in front of the building.
[20:38.970 --> 20:40.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, you're in front of the building.
[20:40.600 --> 20:41.340]  [SPEAKER_27]: Is the building open?
[20:41.460 --> 20:41.710]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yes.
[20:41.800 --> 20:41.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah.
[20:42.160 --> 20:42.280]  [SPEAKER_27]: Open.
[20:42.460 --> 20:43.470]  [SPEAKER_02]: Use the other door.
[20:43.700 --> 20:44.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yes, use the other door.
[20:44.940 --> 20:45.820]  [SPEAKER_27]: We're using the other door.
[20:45.970 --> 20:46.210]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[20:46.560 --> 20:48.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Try not to frighten the security guard too much.
[20:48.320 --> 20:52.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: He's sitting there all by himself, and I'm sure however many of you are coming in right now, not 20 or 30.
[20:53.960 --> 20:55.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: He's probably never seen anything quite like it.
[20:56.080 --> 20:57.060]  He's left his post.
[20:57.320 --> 20:57.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh.
[20:58.920 --> 20:59.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, okay.
[20:59.710 --> 21:01.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: In that case, let's not mention it.
[21:01.840 --> 21:02.660]  [SPEAKER_06]: Oh, there he is.
[21:02.730 --> 21:03.380]  [SPEAKER_06]: He's sitting in the back.
[21:03.490 --> 21:03.680]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[21:03.710 --> 21:06.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe he's listening to the radio, and he knows what to avoid.
[21:08.460 --> 21:09.560]  [SPEAKER_27]: Do we have to sign in?
[21:10.060 --> 21:10.970]  [SPEAKER_27]: Or we can go straight up?
[21:11.360 --> 21:11.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[21:12.540 --> 21:14.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: Tell him to say hi for millions of people listening.
[21:15.440 --> 21:15.780]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh-oh.
[21:15.880 --> 21:16.800]  [SPEAKER_27]: We're fading.
[21:16.970 --> 21:17.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: We're in the elevator.
[21:18.250 --> 21:19.750]  [SPEAKER_02]: Has the elevator door closed yet?
[21:21.180 --> 21:21.620]  Yeah.
[21:21.900 --> 21:22.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: I guess it has.
[21:24.560 --> 21:24.990]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[21:25.210 --> 21:29.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, this is another reason why I don't like cellular phones.
[21:29.820 --> 21:30.490]  [SPEAKER_02]: Listen to that.
[21:30.820 --> 21:31.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[21:31.180 --> 21:31.680]  [SPEAKER_02]: Are you there, Mark?
[21:32.710 --> 21:33.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[21:33.400 --> 21:35.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: I can hear you if you can't hear me.
[21:35.510 --> 21:36.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I mean, I can't hear you.
[21:38.510 --> 21:39.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: I can't really hear anything.
[21:40.460 --> 21:44.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: But we do know that fiber optic is being whisked up the elevator.
[21:46.420 --> 21:52.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: All the way up here to WBAI, and maybe we'll get his signal again as he leaves the elevator.
[21:56.770 --> 21:57.670]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that's something.
[21:57.790 --> 21:58.810]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know quite what it is.
[22:02.730 --> 22:04.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, I don't think he's going to fade back in.
[22:04.350 --> 22:06.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think you have to make the call again.
[22:06.510 --> 22:07.210]  [SPEAKER_02]: Is that how it works?
[22:07.910 --> 22:08.630]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, he's gone.
[22:09.410 --> 22:09.770]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[22:09.910 --> 22:13.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: I guess what we'll do is we'll just wait for him to walk through the door, which should be any second.
[22:15.350 --> 22:19.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: And while we're waiting, let's go out the phone number, 212-279-3400.
[22:21.230 --> 22:27.770]  [SPEAKER_02]: Very happy day in the history of Off the Hook, history of the hacker world, and all that kind of thing.
[22:29.750 --> 22:32.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: After 10 months, it's all over.
[22:32.690 --> 22:35.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, I think he's, uh, I think he's arrived.
[22:39.050 --> 22:40.190]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is not him.
[22:40.510 --> 22:40.770]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[22:41.550 --> 22:42.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Is he, uh...
[22:43.650 --> 22:44.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: Where's Mark?
[22:44.410 --> 22:45.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: Is he battling through the mob out there?
[22:46.430 --> 22:47.530]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, come on in.
[22:47.710 --> 22:48.330]  [SPEAKER_02]: Come on in.
[22:50.150 --> 22:50.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[22:52.410 --> 22:56.470]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, let's hear the voice over the microphone now.
[22:56.810 --> 22:58.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm now in the studio.
[22:58.510 --> 22:58.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[22:59.990 --> 23:00.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Welcome back.
[23:02.570 --> 23:04.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, what an ordeal this has been.
[23:06.230 --> 23:09.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: Those, uh, those long drives to Pennsylvania, we don't have to worry about those anymore.
[23:10.210 --> 23:13.650]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, those, uh, phone calls, people are always listening in.
[23:14.250 --> 23:15.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: And the 15-minute time limit.
[23:15.970 --> 23:16.890]  [SPEAKER_02]: 15-minute time limit.
[23:17.010 --> 23:18.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, uh, now we're here until 1145.
[23:19.690 --> 23:22.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, uh, the phone lines are filled with people that want to call in to say hi.
[23:23.490 --> 23:26.650]  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, anything you want to say before we start taking some phone calls?
[23:27.750 --> 23:31.670]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh, uh, well, gee, it's, I mean, it's, it's so overwhelming being back.
[23:33.210 --> 23:34.890]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, the studio looks pretty much the same.
[23:36.070 --> 23:40.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: This studio has looked pretty much the same, uh, for, uh, I don't know, longer than we've been here.
[23:41.770 --> 23:47.170]  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, basically, uh, not, not much has changed on our end.
[23:47.450 --> 23:51.950]  [SPEAKER_02]: But, um, things are, things are definitely changed emotionally here.
[23:52.370 --> 23:55.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: 2-1-2-2-7-9-3-4-100, uh, is our telephone number.
[23:56.030 --> 23:59.850]  [SPEAKER_02]: I guess we should just, uh, start taking some, uh, some phone calls.
[24:00.690 --> 24:01.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: Phiber Optik has returned.
[24:02.510 --> 24:12.030]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, uh, might I say, this whole thing has, has been an inspiration to a lot of people, the way you, uh, you, you, you, you stood up to everything and just sort of hung in there.
[24:12.150 --> 24:19.870]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it must have been, it must have been really hard at times, but knowing that a lot of people were out there sending mail, I guess that, that kind of made the time go by.
[24:21.950 --> 24:26.350]  [SPEAKER_27]: And keeping in contact with people on the phone did make the time go a lot easier, as did the visits.
[24:26.990 --> 24:34.570]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I really appreciate everyone that wrote and everyone that helped me out with, uh, with money for my account, for the commissary and the telephone and things.
[24:34.570 --> 24:36.150]  [SPEAKER_27]: I really appreciate that very much.
[24:38.010 --> 24:54.230]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, uh, I kind of regret, uh, leaving behind the people that I did because, uh, when you get to know people in a really rough environment like that, and you're living with them, like, say, for a year or even longer as other people are, you really, like,
[24:54.330 --> 24:55.250]  [SPEAKER_27]: form a bond with them.
[24:55.950 --> 24:58.310]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, uh, it's, it's really difficult leaving them.
[24:58.810 --> 24:59.050]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh-huh.
[25:01.010 --> 25:06.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, of course, you had to see a lot of people leave before you that, uh, that you had formed bonds with, too.
[25:07.250 --> 25:09.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, uh, that's, I, you know, that's what prison's all about.
[25:09.650 --> 25:10.810]  [SPEAKER_02]: People coming and going.
[25:11.270 --> 25:11.410]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[25:11.410 --> 25:12.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: A lot of goodbyes.
[25:13.230 --> 25:18.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, uh, I, I mean, I don't suppose you'd be really missing the place all that much, but some of the people...
[25:18.550 --> 25:19.710]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, you must have a different...
[25:19.710 --> 25:20.290]  [SPEAKER_02]: I know I do.
[25:20.370 --> 25:23.130]  [SPEAKER_02]: A different perception of what prison is all about, what prisoners are.
[25:23.990 --> 25:28.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, I didn't really know any prisoners beforehand, but when I went over to visit you, I met a lot of people.
[25:29.370 --> 25:29.530]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.
[25:29.630 --> 25:38.250]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, uh, you know, at least in that place, they, most of them seem to be decent people, um, in there for various, uh, minor offenses.
[25:38.670 --> 25:48.610]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, I mean, at least the people that I knew personally that I talked to on a regular basis and stuff, people that I would call my friends, were not there for any horrific crimes or anything like that.
[25:48.910 --> 25:58.870]  [SPEAKER_27]: The, the small circle of people that I tended to associate with were there for really minor things like, say, tax evasion or just something to that effect.
[25:58.970 --> 26:00.390]  [SPEAKER_27]: There was nothing really out of the ordinary.
[26:00.910 --> 26:06.970]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh, so, I mean, there were relatively normal people that were just plucked out of their, out of their environment just like I was.
[26:07.090 --> 26:12.390]  [SPEAKER_27]: So, that's why we, we shared a common problem and, uh, that's how we, we bonded with each other.
[26:12.570 --> 26:15.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think anybody, though, had the attention you had, going in there.
[26:15.450 --> 26:20.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: You had, you had, you had media crews and, of course, the mail you got was, was pretty unprecedented.
[26:21.210 --> 26:26.870]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, initially, when I first got there, for some months afterwards, I just got tons of mail.
[26:27.410 --> 26:29.990]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, it, it died down a bit towards the end.
[26:30.370 --> 26:33.750]  [SPEAKER_27]: But, um, it was very rare that I didn't get mail.
[26:33.930 --> 26:35.730]  [SPEAKER_27]: I got mail just about every day I was there.
[26:36.790 --> 26:43.150]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, um, it got to the point where the media coverage actually helped my stay there.
[26:43.770 --> 26:47.430]  [SPEAKER_27]: Because when I first got there, I knew very few people, if anybody.
[26:47.930 --> 26:59.410]  [SPEAKER_27]: And once I got involved with the media and doing interviews and things, people were curious about what I did on the outside and who these people were that came up and why they wanted to talk to me, of all people.
[26:59.410 --> 27:08.510]  [SPEAKER_27]: so it was, uh, it was something to talk about and it was like, uh, like, it was like a, uh, it was a reason for talking to people.
[27:08.710 --> 27:14.890]  [SPEAKER_27]: Because when you're in there, it's really rare that you would just step up to somebody that you don't know and just start talking.
[27:15.670 --> 27:17.650]  [SPEAKER_27]: Because, uh, that would seem really suspicious.
[27:18.270 --> 27:26.530]  [SPEAKER_27]: Anybody that would seem, like, outwardly talkative when they first get there, you, you would suspect might be an informant or you don't know what.
[27:27.250 --> 27:32.050]  [SPEAKER_27]: But so it was good that with the interviews, it was a conversation piece.
[27:32.230 --> 27:33.370]  [SPEAKER_27]: It was just something to talk about.
[27:36.250 --> 27:43.050]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, well, I think this is something that a lot of us can learn from.
[27:43.250 --> 27:50.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: I guess the important lesson for us here on the outside is when a friend is in a situation like this, don't forget about them.
[27:50.690 --> 27:58.930]  [SPEAKER_02]: Whether it's a situation like this or an illness, something unfortunate that perhaps would be more convenient to just forget about.
[27:59.070 --> 28:05.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: It makes all the difference in the world when people who are leading normal lives don't forget when they care.
[28:07.050 --> 28:11.990]  [SPEAKER_02]: Because, I mean, imagine being in there and not having a single visitor, not getting a single letter.
[28:13.070 --> 28:15.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure a lot of people go through that all the time.
[28:15.490 --> 28:17.450]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, there were people like that that I met.
[28:17.710 --> 28:24.070]  [SPEAKER_27]: And strangely enough, there were other people that would come in off the street that were self-surrenderers.
[28:24.350 --> 28:32.330]  [SPEAKER_27]: And for some reason, when they first start talking to people, would make up their minds that they didn't want their family to visit them.
[28:32.730 --> 28:34.910]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I remember talking to a couple of people.
[28:35.650 --> 28:38.430]  [SPEAKER_27]: And we would tell them that, you know, that's ridiculous.
[28:38.670 --> 28:40.810]  [SPEAKER_27]: That it's going to be a lot worse for the both of you.
[28:40.810 --> 28:53.750]  [SPEAKER_27]: And that once you get your family up to visit and they see that it's not a life-threatening environment, they'll feel a lot more at ease than even if you just spoke to them on the phone or wrote letters and stuff.
[28:53.770 --> 29:04.550]  [SPEAKER_27]: If they actually came up and saw the environment that you were living in, and they would just feel a whole lot better and you would feel a whole lot better as well.
[29:06.250 --> 29:10.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, let's start taking some phone calls so everybody else can get in on this happy event.
[29:11.030 --> 29:12.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: 212-279-3400.
[29:13.990 --> 29:14.570]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening.
[29:14.850 --> 29:15.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're gone.
[29:15.950 --> 29:16.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, good evening.
[29:16.650 --> 29:17.050]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're on the air.
[29:17.510 --> 29:18.710]  Hi, this is Rosenthal.
[29:19.530 --> 29:21.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, well, you'll have to speak up a little louder than that.
[29:22.050 --> 29:22.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: I can barely hear you.
[29:22.710 --> 29:23.370]  [SPEAKER_02]: Can you hear me now?
[29:24.770 --> 29:25.130]  Hello!
[29:25.130 --> 29:26.050]  [SPEAKER_02]: Ah, okay.
[29:26.410 --> 29:27.370]  [SPEAKER_02]: There you are.
[29:27.730 --> 29:28.810]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, you're fine now.
[29:28.950 --> 29:29.210]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[29:29.750 --> 29:30.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: How are you?
[29:30.710 --> 29:31.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: Welcome home!
[29:33.010 --> 29:33.870]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you.
[29:35.010 --> 29:35.530]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, I...
[29:36.030 --> 29:38.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: I suppose I should have mentioned that she was waiting for you.
[29:38.990 --> 29:43.470]  ...that, like, took a brunette guy.
[29:43.790 --> 29:49.510]  [SPEAKER_24]: And I was wondering if you met anyone who you thought might, um, want to hook up with me?
[29:49.610 --> 29:50.110]  [SPEAKER_02]: In prison?
[29:50.590 --> 29:51.610]  [SPEAKER_24]: Yeah, why not?
[29:51.930 --> 29:52.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, what...
[29:52.510 --> 29:54.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, what's wrong with people out here?
[29:55.250 --> 29:57.930]  [SPEAKER_24]: Well, um, I'm having a bit of...
[29:57.930 --> 30:01.570]  [SPEAKER_24]: ...that, like, on the outside, and I just thought, you know...
[30:02.770 --> 30:03.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I don't know.
[30:03.590 --> 30:08.050]  [SPEAKER_24]: People might be more accepting if they're locked up for a while of a large woman, a 300-pound woman.
[30:10.070 --> 30:12.570]  [SPEAKER_02]: Perhaps this is a conversation best carried on in private.
[30:12.750 --> 30:13.190]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
[30:13.730 --> 30:15.570]  [SPEAKER_27]: Mark, do you have any quick answer for this one?
[30:15.810 --> 30:18.210]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, I have no idea.
[30:18.410 --> 30:22.070]  [SPEAKER_27]: I wasn't thinking that I would be acting as a dating service or anything like that.
[30:22.110 --> 30:26.570]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it's one of the fringe benefits of being in a club like the one you've been in for the past ten months.
[30:26.930 --> 30:27.650]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for the call.
[30:27.890 --> 30:28.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening.
[30:28.270 --> 30:28.890]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're on the radio.
[30:29.650 --> 30:29.950]  [SPEAKER_10]: Hi.
[30:31.210 --> 30:31.530]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hello.
[30:31.790 --> 30:32.250]  [SPEAKER_02]: Speak up, please.
[30:32.690 --> 30:32.870]  [SPEAKER_10]: Hi.
[30:32.990 --> 30:35.890]  [SPEAKER_10]: Dave Burstein here from the computer show that you've been on before you.
[30:35.990 --> 30:37.290]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, you guys weren't on tonight.
[30:37.430 --> 30:42.330]  [SPEAKER_10]: We got preempted, so I wasn't there to welcome back Fiber, so I thought I'd come in, call in, and say, welcome back.
[30:42.450 --> 30:45.570]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it's good to hear your voice, and I'm sure Fiber has missed it as well.
[30:45.730 --> 30:46.170]  [SPEAKER_10]: More important.
[30:47.130 --> 30:47.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, thanks a lot.
[30:48.950 --> 30:49.630]  [SPEAKER_02]: Are they still there?
[30:49.910 --> 30:51.890]  [SPEAKER_10]: I'm here, but I've got nothing more to add to that.
[30:51.890 --> 30:52.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, okay.
[30:52.670 --> 30:54.950]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, you guys, you guys will be back...
[30:54.950 --> 30:55.450]  [SPEAKER_02]: Welcome back.
[30:55.930 --> 30:57.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: You'll be back on next week, right?
[30:58.310 --> 30:58.870]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah, we will.
[30:58.970 --> 30:59.190]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[30:59.190 --> 31:01.750]  [SPEAKER_10]: And I hope Fiber will be back on next week and many times in the future.
[31:01.930 --> 31:02.830]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yes, I will, Dave.
[31:03.010 --> 31:05.410]  [SPEAKER_27]: I look forward to running into you in upcoming weeks.
[31:06.330 --> 31:06.730]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[31:06.950 --> 31:07.150]  [SPEAKER_02]: Great.
[31:07.450 --> 31:08.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: Just like old times.
[31:08.830 --> 31:09.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: Take care.
[31:09.610 --> 31:09.750]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[31:10.850 --> 31:17.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: Dave Burstein from the personal computer show, which is usually on every Wednesday night from 9 to 10, will be on next week at that time.
[31:17.770 --> 31:18.370]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening.
[31:18.510 --> 31:18.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're on the radio.
[31:18.910 --> 31:21.970]  [SPEAKER_22]: Hi, I wanted to welcome back Fiber.
[31:23.130 --> 31:25.150]  [SPEAKER_22]: And this is Ruben from the Bronx talking.
[31:25.730 --> 31:26.150]  [SPEAKER_27]: Ah.
[31:26.290 --> 31:27.430]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, I remember him.
[31:27.570 --> 31:28.670]  [SPEAKER_27]: I got some mail from him.
[31:28.770 --> 31:31.890]  [SPEAKER_02]: I remember a phone call from him, I believe, the day you left.
[31:32.230 --> 31:33.270]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yes, that's right, too.
[31:33.510 --> 31:33.710]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[31:33.930 --> 31:34.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, did you take his advice?
[31:35.650 --> 31:42.050]  [SPEAKER_22]: I'm communicating with the Raven and Plastic, who's also somewhere down there.
[31:42.750 --> 31:43.210]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[31:43.410 --> 31:43.990]  [SPEAKER_22]: I don't know what...
[31:43.990 --> 31:48.430]  [SPEAKER_22]: Not in the same state, but they're gone away for a little while as well.
[31:49.170 --> 31:49.650]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[31:49.790 --> 31:50.210]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know...
[31:50.210 --> 31:52.990]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think Mark knows those people.
[31:53.050 --> 31:54.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think I'm familiar with the names.
[31:55.410 --> 31:57.890]  [SPEAKER_22]: He might not know them by those names, but he knows them.
[31:58.410 --> 31:58.870]  [SPEAKER_22]: Uh-huh.
[31:58.970 --> 32:00.210]  [SPEAKER_22]: From the meetings and everything.
[32:00.610 --> 32:06.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, you know, about 100 people show up at those meetings, so it's not possible to know everybody, but it's possible that...
[32:06.230 --> 32:15.610]  [SPEAKER_22]: But when he first came back, and you guys were just talking a little while ago, it sounded like he was getting a little emotional there.
[32:15.730 --> 32:17.730]  [SPEAKER_22]: Emmanuel, was there any tears in his eyes?
[32:18.190 --> 32:19.990]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, you know, I didn't really check.
[32:21.330 --> 32:28.810]  [SPEAKER_22]: Well, anyway, I'm going to let some other people call through, and I'm glad you're out, and try not to get back in.
[32:29.590 --> 32:30.470]  [SPEAKER_27]: Definitely not.
[32:30.690 --> 32:30.950]  [SPEAKER_22]: Yeah.
[32:31.150 --> 32:31.850]  [SPEAKER_22]: Be more careful.
[32:32.670 --> 32:33.030]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[32:33.250 --> 32:33.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for calling.
[32:33.870 --> 32:34.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: See you soon.
[32:35.590 --> 32:37.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: That leads into an interesting point.
[32:37.370 --> 32:43.070]  [SPEAKER_02]: Are you going to do anything different, or not do things as a result of this experience?
[32:43.250 --> 32:46.190]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, maybe we should quantify these things.
[32:46.410 --> 32:46.630]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh-huh.
[32:47.070 --> 32:48.350]  [SPEAKER_27]: What do you mean, exactly?
[32:48.630 --> 32:50.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I mean, has your attitude changed?
[32:50.450 --> 32:54.130]  [SPEAKER_02]: Are you going to maybe not be as outspoken as before?
[32:54.270 --> 33:02.090]  [SPEAKER_02]: Because, remember, the judge said he was sentencing you as a symbol, because you spoke out a lot, because you gave interviews, because you explained things publicly.
[33:03.650 --> 33:04.590]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, I certainly...
[33:04.590 --> 33:05.150]  [SPEAKER_02]: What does this experience tell you?
[33:05.210 --> 33:06.470]  [SPEAKER_27]: I certainly can't let him down.
[33:06.650 --> 33:10.390]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm going to have to continue to live up to my reputation, and to his expectations.
[33:10.550 --> 33:12.750]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm certainly not going to stop talking all of a sudden.
[33:13.030 --> 33:13.310]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[33:13.310 --> 33:20.490]  [SPEAKER_27]: But, uh, I'm certainly going to be very careful not to... not to give them any reasons to charge me with anything.
[33:20.910 --> 33:21.090]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[33:21.990 --> 33:22.350]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[33:22.950 --> 33:25.430]  [SPEAKER_27]: You don't seem embittered by this.
[33:25.930 --> 33:26.710]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, don't worry.
[33:26.830 --> 33:27.990]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm plenty embittered.
[33:28.350 --> 33:31.450]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm just in a really good mood, because this is really fun.
[33:31.630 --> 33:31.770]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[33:32.550 --> 33:33.030]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[33:33.310 --> 33:34.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: 212-279-3400.
[33:35.030 --> 33:36.530]  [SPEAKER_02]: We have some open phone lines, so give us a call.
[33:36.710 --> 33:37.090]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening.
[33:37.150 --> 33:37.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're on the radio.
[33:37.770 --> 33:38.030]  [SPEAKER_08]: Hi.
[33:38.190 --> 33:39.290]  [SPEAKER_08]: Welcome back, Fiber.
[33:39.470 --> 33:40.530]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's your favorite person.
[33:40.590 --> 33:41.030]  [SPEAKER_08]: Call her.
[33:41.150 --> 33:41.950]  [SPEAKER_27]: I think you remember that voice.
[33:41.990 --> 33:43.150]  [SPEAKER_27]: I remember that voice.
[33:43.310 --> 33:44.650]  [SPEAKER_27]: Quite, quite well, yes.
[33:45.630 --> 33:47.090]  [SPEAKER_08]: So, um, so glad you're out.
[33:47.090 --> 33:50.910]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I'll, of course, see you at the meeting on, uh, on December, in the beginning of December.
[33:51.090 --> 33:57.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, yeah, I'm sure you have a lot to tell Fiber as to, uh, what has, what has changed with the phone system in the past 10 months.
[33:57.530 --> 33:57.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: Of course.
[33:57.950 --> 33:59.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, let's, let's give him an alphabetical list.
[34:02.070 --> 34:02.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: Go ahead.
[34:02.550 --> 34:03.730]  [SPEAKER_02]: I know there's a lot you have to tell him.
[34:03.890 --> 34:05.450]  [SPEAKER_08]: Uh, well, I can't think of anything now.
[34:05.530 --> 34:07.150]  [SPEAKER_08]: I just wanted to call in to say, welcome home.
[34:07.310 --> 34:08.250]  [SPEAKER_02]: You can't think of anything?
[34:08.750 --> 34:09.470]  [SPEAKER_02]: Come on.
[34:09.470 --> 34:10.650]  [SPEAKER_08]: All right, Fiber.
[34:10.810 --> 34:13.370]  [SPEAKER_08]: Why doesn't, uh, 950 numbers have ANI?
[34:13.810 --> 34:14.990]  [SPEAKER_02]: Wait, were you asking a question?
[34:15.110 --> 34:16.350]  [SPEAKER_02]: I thought you were going to give him information.
[34:16.350 --> 34:20.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: He hasn't, he hasn't touched a phone, a real phone, since January, for God's sake.
[34:20.690 --> 34:34.290]  [SPEAKER_08]: Um, play with the phones in the Port Authority, uh, the TCG phones in the Port Authority bus terminal, and the, uh, Trade Center, and, um, the, um, the, uh, I think it's, you know, any Port Authority place.
[34:34.610 --> 34:35.810]  [SPEAKER_08]: Like, the Ligotti Airport.
[34:36.970 --> 34:37.290]  [SPEAKER_02]: Why?
[34:37.390 --> 34:38.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: What, what will he find?
[34:38.410 --> 34:38.670]  [SPEAKER_08]: TCG.
[34:38.810 --> 34:40.890]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's the Colcats company, called TCG.
[34:41.010 --> 34:42.650]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's, um, they run on different trunks.
[34:42.710 --> 34:46.030]  [SPEAKER_08]: If they do it, they have a PBX on their trunks, because they have so many Colcats.
[34:47.630 --> 34:50.590]  [SPEAKER_08]: They, uh, have, you know, it's hard to explain.
[34:50.710 --> 34:52.890]  [SPEAKER_08]: You've got to sort of play with it to understand that.
[34:52.990 --> 34:54.230]  [SPEAKER_08]: I've been playing with it lately.
[34:54.490 --> 34:55.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, share some information with us.
[34:55.830 --> 34:58.030]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, this is, this is the program where we share this kind of stuff.
[34:58.130 --> 35:11.290]  [SPEAKER_08]: To be able to do it, you used to be able to dial zero, and it used to be giving you, oh, by the way, when you dialed 1-800-CALL-AT-T on a Colcats, it, it, um, uh, it, oh, it did something.
[35:11.530 --> 35:12.750]  [SPEAKER_08]: You dialed...
[35:13.210 --> 35:13.530]  [SPEAKER_08]: Really?
[35:13.670 --> 35:14.970]  [SPEAKER_08]: That's, that's quite a revelation there.
[35:16.650 --> 35:17.510]  [SPEAKER_08]: Now, you know what it did?
[35:17.670 --> 35:21.930]  [SPEAKER_08]: When I dialed 1-0-2-8-8-8-0, it, it connected me with another operator.
[35:22.090 --> 35:23.970]  [SPEAKER_08]: Instead of AT&T, it connected me with another operator.
[35:24.070 --> 35:25.630]  [SPEAKER_08]: Not this particular Colcats I'm talking about.
[35:25.830 --> 35:30.630]  [SPEAKER_08]: But, um, another Colcats that I, uh, a more sleetier Colcats, I guess I should say.
[35:30.890 --> 35:31.130]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[35:31.130 --> 35:46.630]  [SPEAKER_08]: Um, but the Colcats in the Port Authority Bus Terminal and in LaGuardia Airport and Kennedy Airport, MSA also, and in, um, 34th Street Path Station and down in the Trade Center, uh, you used to be able to dial zero, which will give you the TCG operator,
[35:47.010 --> 35:57.350]  [SPEAKER_08]: that Stanford Telecommunications communications group, and they, you would ask them, uh, instead of, you know how when you dial 411 and ask for a number, they do not give you the option to connect because they know it's a Colcat?
[35:58.030 --> 35:58.210]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hmm.
[35:58.590 --> 35:59.350]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, but...
[35:59.350 --> 35:59.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[35:59.810 --> 36:03.030]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not sure if Mark knows what that is, but basically when you call information now...
[36:03.030 --> 36:04.410]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I heard it today for the first time.
[36:04.410 --> 36:05.030]  [SPEAKER_02]: You did hear that.
[36:05.150 --> 36:05.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[36:05.350 --> 36:08.730]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, they say for an additional whatever, you can, you can be connected.
[36:08.850 --> 36:10.470]  [SPEAKER_27]: I think it was something like 35 cents.
[36:10.470 --> 36:14.850]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's amazing if people would pay that because they're too lazy to get a pen or they can't remember the number.
[36:14.990 --> 36:16.750]  [SPEAKER_02]: For, for one second while they dial it.
[36:16.830 --> 36:16.990]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[36:17.150 --> 36:17.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right afterwards.
[36:17.830 --> 36:21.250]  [SPEAKER_08]: By the way, the chemical bank still has those phones in every single bank.
[36:22.930 --> 36:25.370]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it just wouldn't be the same world if they didn't, would it?
[36:25.610 --> 36:26.330]  [SPEAKER_08]: Of course not.
[36:26.490 --> 36:28.050]  [SPEAKER_08]: I mean, God, you know, God knows.
[36:28.190 --> 36:29.610]  [SPEAKER_08]: What would I do without chemical bank?
[36:29.710 --> 36:33.530]  [SPEAKER_08]: I mean, like, you know, what would anyone do without chemical bank's phones?
[36:33.790 --> 36:34.670]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
[36:35.630 --> 36:36.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: It makes you wonder.
[36:36.930 --> 36:37.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: It makes you wonder.
[36:38.210 --> 36:39.810]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right, listen, thanks for all the updates.
[36:39.990 --> 36:40.210]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[36:40.490 --> 36:41.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: We'll see you at the meeting.
[36:41.410 --> 36:41.570]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[36:42.230 --> 36:49.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, um, we have something that, um, I want to share with Fiber that, uh, has been circulating in various places.
[36:50.070 --> 36:51.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: Special number that you call up.
[36:51.950 --> 36:53.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: I want everybody to listen to this.
[36:53.850 --> 36:54.490]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's get a dial, Tom.
[36:58.690 --> 36:59.850]  [SPEAKER_02]: Listen carefully.
[37:01.910 --> 37:03.070]  [SPEAKER_26]: Be repeated.
[37:03.570 --> 37:07.310]  [SPEAKER_26]: You have reached the AT&T long distance network.
[37:08.350 --> 37:10.810]  [SPEAKER_26]: Thank you for choosing AT&T.
[37:11.890 --> 37:14.150]  [SPEAKER_26]: This message will not be repeated.
[37:14.830 --> 37:18.370]  [SPEAKER_26]: You have reached the AT&T long distance network.
[37:19.610 --> 37:21.990]  [SPEAKER_26]: Thank you for choosing AT&T.
[37:23.130 --> 37:26.170]  [SPEAKER_27]: Actually, uh, that's, that's a really old recording.
[37:26.390 --> 37:26.990]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yes, but...
[37:26.990 --> 37:29.410]  [SPEAKER_26]: The AT&T long distance network.
[37:29.550 --> 37:31.350]  [SPEAKER_02]: But let me point out that usually...
[37:31.350 --> 37:32.870]  [SPEAKER_26]: For choosing AT&T.
[37:32.950 --> 37:35.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: Usually they get it right, and, uh, they only play it once.
[37:36.130 --> 37:36.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[37:36.590 --> 37:37.370]  [SPEAKER_02]: But, um...
[37:37.370 --> 37:40.430]  [SPEAKER_26]: You have reached the AT&T long distance network.
[37:40.510 --> 37:42.850]  [SPEAKER_02]: This, this is something that MCI might have some fun with.
[37:45.310 --> 37:49.210]  [SPEAKER_02]: They are starting to... you can get this, by the way.
[37:49.270 --> 37:52.770]  [SPEAKER_02]: Anybody can call this by calling 1-800-555-0000.
[37:53.570 --> 37:56.470]  [SPEAKER_02]: I understand also... all right, how do we get rid of this now?
[37:58.050 --> 37:59.730]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, it won't be repeated anymore.
[38:01.030 --> 38:08.490]  [SPEAKER_02]: This, if you have AT&T as your long-distance carrier and you dial 700-555-4141, you're supposed to get that message only once.
[38:08.490 --> 38:10.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: I understand it's repeating all the time now, too.
[38:10.510 --> 38:15.630]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, somebody did something wrong in AT&T, and that happens more often than they care to admit.
[38:16.370 --> 38:23.730]  [SPEAKER_02]: There are also some other 555 numbers in the 800 area code that are starting to be used for other things.
[38:23.810 --> 38:26.890]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I think if I can get another line here...
[38:28.030 --> 38:29.870]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think we can get a test recording here.
[38:41.870 --> 38:44.450]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, this is different depending on where you call from.
[38:46.330 --> 38:51.650]  [SPEAKER_04]: You have reached the 800 database test line for the Metro-132 ladder.
[38:53.550 --> 38:55.090]  [SPEAKER_02]: Listen to him cover up the mouthpiece.
[38:59.390 --> 38:59.890]  So...
[39:00.590 --> 39:02.990]  [SPEAKER_04]: You have reached the 800 database...
[39:02.990 --> 39:03.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's a switchman.
[39:03.850 --> 39:05.910]  [SPEAKER_04]: ...for the Metro-132 ladder.
[39:06.090 --> 39:08.350]  [SPEAKER_02]: And that noise in the background is the sound of the switch.
[39:09.190 --> 39:11.290]  [SPEAKER_02]: Actually, the noise...
[39:11.290 --> 39:14.610]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, the noise in the background is most likely the air conditioning system.
[39:14.690 --> 39:14.910]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh-huh.
[39:14.990 --> 39:16.170]  [SPEAKER_27]: So, we just tend not to make noise anymore.
[39:16.170 --> 39:16.550]  [SPEAKER_27]: That's true.
[39:16.670 --> 39:18.110]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, the electronic ones, digital ones don't work.
[39:18.110 --> 39:23.470]  [SPEAKER_27]: And that guy's voice sounds mysteriously just like the guy that does the recordings at Williamsburg, Brooklyn.
[39:23.750 --> 39:24.010]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[39:24.790 --> 39:25.450]  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe it is.
[39:25.510 --> 39:26.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: What's the number in Williamsburg, Brooklyn?
[39:26.730 --> 39:27.630]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's hear that so we know.
[39:27.710 --> 39:27.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh.
[39:29.510 --> 39:30.150]  [SPEAKER_02]: The 9901?
[39:30.410 --> 39:30.670]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah.
[39:31.250 --> 39:32.070]  [SPEAKER_02]: What's an exchange there?
[39:32.290 --> 39:32.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hmm.
[39:33.050 --> 39:33.930]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm trying to remember.
[39:34.910 --> 39:36.010]  [SPEAKER_02]: Come on, Fiber, you can do it.
[39:36.050 --> 39:36.450]  [SPEAKER_02]: You can do it.
[39:38.350 --> 39:38.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: Knowledge.
[39:39.010 --> 39:39.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, boy.
[39:39.610 --> 39:40.050]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's in there.
[39:42.390 --> 39:44.190]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, I just can't remember.
[39:44.270 --> 39:45.990]  [SPEAKER_02]: Can't remember the exchange for Williamsburg.
[39:46.130 --> 39:47.950]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, I'm sure one of our callers will be able to help us on that.
[39:49.750 --> 39:50.630]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to come to you.
[39:50.750 --> 39:54.930]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're on until 1145, so you're going to get that information, and then we'll see if it's the same voice.
[39:55.330 --> 40:00.350]  [SPEAKER_02]: But, yeah, the 555 exchange is starting to be used for information services of different sorts.
[40:00.630 --> 40:00.830]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.
[40:01.730 --> 40:04.510]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, we'll just have to see where that goes, but they're testing it now.
[40:05.670 --> 40:06.930]  [SPEAKER_02]: 212-279-3400.
[40:07.110 --> 40:07.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: Give us a call.
[40:08.350 --> 40:08.750]  [SPEAKER_02]: Off the Hook.
[40:08.850 --> 40:13.090]  [SPEAKER_02]: Phiber Optik is back in the studio after 10 months in federal prison.
[40:13.490 --> 40:13.890]  [SPEAKER_02]: Boy.
[40:14.990 --> 40:15.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening.
[40:15.750 --> 40:15.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're on.
[40:17.290 --> 40:18.010]  [SPEAKER_06]: Hi, Mark.
[40:18.150 --> 40:18.970]  [SPEAKER_06]: I want to wish you back.
[40:19.850 --> 40:20.250]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks.
[40:22.410 --> 40:24.310]  [SPEAKER_06]: And I have a question for you.
[40:24.530 --> 40:24.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: Go ahead.
[40:26.550 --> 40:31.850]  [SPEAKER_06]: Now that you're out of jail, you're having to be able to get fucked up the ass by a manual?
[40:32.490 --> 40:33.110]  [SPEAKER_08]: Good evening.
[40:33.970 --> 40:36.690]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, this is somewhere out in 201.
[40:38.130 --> 40:39.130]  [SPEAKER_09]: A number of things.
[40:39.390 --> 40:45.570]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's great to see you back, although I kind of tuned into the show a little midstream in this internship.
[40:46.450 --> 40:51.930]  [SPEAKER_09]: A little thing about the spring of the autumn 94 issue of 2600.
[40:51.930 --> 40:55.030]  [SPEAKER_09]: They had a nine-exchange card made by Landis and Gear.
[40:56.790 --> 40:57.290]  [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
[40:57.950 --> 41:06.630]  [SPEAKER_09]: And I noticed, I have friends who go back and forth from Israel, and apparently they got a hold of a Bezek telecard, and the description seems to match.
[41:06.830 --> 41:12.750]  [SPEAKER_09]: Would anyone happen to know who makes or what issue at 2600 work and get information about Bezek?
[41:13.290 --> 41:14.890]  [SPEAKER_27]: How do you spell the company name?
[41:16.130 --> 41:19.250]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's transliterated as B-E-Z-E-Q.
[41:20.770 --> 41:20.990]  [SPEAKER_27]: Hmm.
[41:22.450 --> 41:23.530]  [SPEAKER_27]: Can't say I've heard of it.
[41:24.170 --> 41:24.470]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.
[41:24.470 --> 41:32.710]  [SPEAKER_09]: Another thing out here, I've noticed that the 9900 up, the test numbers, there seems to be something happened with certain 9924 exchanges.
[41:32.890 --> 41:34.850]  [SPEAKER_09]: You get this tone like, Beep!
[41:36.150 --> 41:37.670]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I noticed...
[41:37.670 --> 41:38.810]  [SPEAKER_02]: Sounded like a car horn there.
[41:40.470 --> 41:40.950]  [SPEAKER_02]: Interesting.
[41:41.590 --> 41:42.670]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's a new one on me.
[41:42.970 --> 41:52.110]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, if you could quantify the beep, but maybe if Emmanuel could call one of them, I could explain what it is.
[42:01.870 --> 42:04.710]  [SPEAKER_09]: And if you play like some off-key tones...
[42:04.710 --> 42:04.850]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[42:05.230 --> 42:08.190]  [SPEAKER_09]: You get some tones like, Beep!
[42:08.450 --> 42:10.110]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, I know exactly what that is.
[42:10.110 --> 42:10.790]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, what is that?
[42:10.990 --> 42:12.610]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, wouldn't you like to know?
[42:13.010 --> 42:14.290]  [SPEAKER_09]: Is that an R1 gateway?
[42:14.870 --> 42:15.510]  [SPEAKER_27]: What's that?
[42:15.630 --> 42:16.810]  [SPEAKER_09]: Is that an R1 gateway?
[42:17.150 --> 42:26.170]  [SPEAKER_27]: No, actually what it is, it's in New York, in New York City anyway, you'll find the exact same thing in any exchange plus 9968.
[42:26.170 --> 42:31.490]  [SPEAKER_27]: And what that is, is that it's known as a Type 105 test line.
[42:31.990 --> 42:36.070]  [SPEAKER_27]: And it's also known as the ATMS system.
[42:36.230 --> 42:39.030]  [SPEAKER_27]: That's the Automatic Test Measurement System.
[42:39.790 --> 42:47.110]  [SPEAKER_27]: And what it's used to do is that, I can tell you exactly how it works, it's responding to your Touch-Tones completely by accident.
[42:47.270 --> 42:49.730]  [SPEAKER_27]: They're actually programmed in MF tones.
[42:50.110 --> 43:08.110]  [SPEAKER_27]: And the way it works is that a central office, if it wants to test the signal quality of an analog trunk line between that central office and another central office, what it'll do is that it has, in it's translation tables, it has a list of all the test lines that basically,
[43:08.250 --> 43:10.170]  [SPEAKER_27]: that's why they all follow the same pattern.
[43:10.510 --> 43:13.790]  [SPEAKER_27]: Like a Type 105 test line will always be at 9968.
[43:14.250 --> 43:14.690]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh-huh.
[43:14.910 --> 43:20.930]  [SPEAKER_27]: And a Type 102 non-terminating milliwatt test will always be at 9945.
[43:21.430 --> 43:26.610]  [SPEAKER_27]: The reason for that is that when they enter in the translation tables, when they install the switch, all the test lines are the same.
[43:26.890 --> 43:27.170]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[43:27.350 --> 43:37.010]  [SPEAKER_27]: So basically, the way it works is that I could have the central office that I'm at signal, say, for example, that Type 105 test line.
[43:37.510 --> 43:37.770]  [SPEAKER_07]: Right.
[43:37.930 --> 43:43.690]  [SPEAKER_27]: In the distant central office, it would basically dial the number over the trunk that we wanted to test.
[43:44.310 --> 43:51.550]  [SPEAKER_27]: And what it would do is that it would signal back, and basically, by signaling MF tones, we could do various different tests.
[43:54.500 --> 44:08.660]  [SPEAKER_09]: Uh, another thing I noticed, too, I was reading, uh, certain issues at 2600, I was looking at the demon dialer, and I happened to work with computer repair, and I was told something about the Intel 8254 programmable interval timer.
[44:09.140 --> 44:24.140]  [SPEAKER_09]: It can set, like, a number of them to, like, eight megacycles, and you just poke in numbers to determine the, for the dividing factor, you can generate any tones, and, uh, I've sat down, I've, I've spent several weeks wiring up a board, and, uh, I've got,
[44:24.300 --> 44:33.880]  [SPEAKER_09]: I've managed to filter it out, and I've got it to dial DTMF and make some, uh, fake, you know, fake phone sounds, because I get a lot of, a lot of prank calls for where I am.
[44:34.140 --> 44:46.400]  [SPEAKER_09]: For some weird reason, when I, my number was assigned, it was, like, right next to, or right after, some auto repair place nearby, and so I'm always getting calls about water pump this, and catalytic converter, or that.
[44:46.460 --> 44:48.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, those aren't really prank calls, they're just wrong numbers.
[44:49.200 --> 45:00.420]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, you know, like, sometimes people may assume, uh, a business, so, like, uh, you know, because what happens, the, uh, phone company signs blocks of numbers for tie, what they call cross-over, tie-down lines.
[45:01.520 --> 45:09.580]  [SPEAKER_09]: Like, for example, if I, you know, WBAI, you've got 3400, and so on, and so forth, uh, notice I get a lot of calls of that, so.
[45:09.580 --> 45:16.000]  [SPEAKER_09]: So, another thing, too, is I found another exchange, 916-991-3 to 9937.
[45:16.460 --> 45:19.040]  [SPEAKER_09]: It seems to be where all the bad numbers live.
[45:20.060 --> 45:22.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: The bad, what's a bad number?
[45:22.200 --> 45:29.660]  [SPEAKER_09]: I mean, when you get, like, what they call intercept operator, you know, where you get an SIT, and then the message, you know, we're sorry, your call did not go through.
[45:29.920 --> 45:30.860]  [SPEAKER_09]: Please try again later.
[45:31.000 --> 45:31.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is in the 201?
[45:32.340 --> 45:32.720]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.
[45:33.060 --> 45:34.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: 201-916, what?
[45:35.020 --> 45:36.380]  [SPEAKER_09]: Uh, 9-1-1-4.
[45:36.380 --> 45:40.460]  [SPEAKER_09]: In fact, I got, I have a particular office cluster mapped out.
[45:40.740 --> 45:41.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[45:42.040 --> 45:42.840]  [SPEAKER_09]: And, uh...
[45:42.840 --> 45:44.680]  [SPEAKER_02]: 9-1-6, 9-9-1-4 until what?
[45:44.960 --> 45:46.900]  [SPEAKER_09]: 9-9-1-4 up to 9-9-3-7.
[45:47.100 --> 45:50.340]  [SPEAKER_09]: In fact, one of them I found, Sally, you've just activated call trace.
[45:50.600 --> 45:50.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-oh.
[45:51.140 --> 45:51.840]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, I know.
[45:51.920 --> 45:56.140]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's like, hmm, I wonder if star 5-7 gets mapped out to that number.
[45:56.420 --> 45:56.700]  [SPEAKER_09]: Uh-huh.
[45:57.340 --> 45:57.700]  [SPEAKER_09]: Uh...
[45:57.700 --> 45:58.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I like that.
[45:58.280 --> 45:59.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's a question I know a lot of people have.
[46:00.020 --> 46:01.820]  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe we can answer from fiber here.
[46:01.840 --> 46:05.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: Why is that necessary to have those recordings directly dialable?
[46:06.380 --> 46:06.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: Have to exist?
[46:07.300 --> 46:14.040]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, uh, usually what they'll do is, when they first record them, is, um, I'll give you an example.
[46:14.300 --> 46:25.340]  [SPEAKER_27]: On a Northern Telecom DMS-100 switch, there's, uh, there's something called, uh, D-R-A-M-R-E-C, which is the Digital Recorded Announcement Machine Recorder.
[46:26.340 --> 46:34.600]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, uh, basically what they could do is plug in a microphone and, uh, headphones, and that's basically how they actually record all the announcements.
[46:35.060 --> 46:37.820]  [SPEAKER_27]: Some of them come with the switch, but other ones are recorded locally.
[46:37.940 --> 46:40.900]  [SPEAKER_27]: That's why, like, say in New York, you tend to hear the same guy's voice all the time.
[46:41.140 --> 46:41.300]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[46:41.560 --> 46:45.100]  [SPEAKER_27]: What they do is that, uh, when they install the switch, they tend to record them locally.
[46:45.100 --> 46:52.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: And that's why you hear the actual, uh, environmental control unit, or, aka, air conditioner, in the background when, when the guy's talking.
[46:52.820 --> 47:00.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: What they do is, um, like, uh, say for, your call did not go through, or if you'd like to make a call, please hang up.
[47:00.920 --> 47:03.200]  [SPEAKER_27]: Some of them come with the switch and some of them are recorded.
[47:04.320 --> 47:19.340]  [SPEAKER_27]: And they're digitized and stored on disk, and basically every time you, uh, every time you get one of those recordings, I believe what it does is that there's a MasterCop copy on disk, and the actual copy that always gets played every time you hear it,
[47:19.460 --> 47:28.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: is actually stored in, uh, in EEPROM, so that, so that it's, uh, a lot quick, uh, more quickly available than if it was, if it was gotten off disk.
[47:31.120 --> 47:32.000]  And, uh...
[47:32.000 --> 47:33.980]  [SPEAKER_09]: ...the 5ESS switch.
[47:34.200 --> 47:37.680]  [SPEAKER_09]: When you dial 553, you get this waltzing busy.
[47:37.800 --> 47:41.640]  [SPEAKER_09]: It is not, uh, it's not a fast busy, it is not a normal busy.
[47:41.640 --> 47:52.640]  [SPEAKER_09]: It goes, you know, basically, it goes almost three-fourth, three-quarter time, like, bap, bap, bap, for about 12 seconds, and then the line goes dead for five minutes.
[47:54.300 --> 47:55.760]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's 553, and that's it?
[47:55.980 --> 47:56.220]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.
[47:56.420 --> 48:08.820]  [SPEAKER_09]: It only works with certain, uh, uh, I guess it would be EMS, you know, 5ESS, because I would listen for the very slight click, not the double kerchunk, like the 1AESS or the nothing of a DMS-100.
[48:09.040 --> 48:11.560]  [SPEAKER_09]: By the way, Northern Telecom, are they Bell Canada?
[48:11.980 --> 48:12.740]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, no.
[48:12.920 --> 48:21.480]  [SPEAKER_27]: Actually, uh, the way it's, the way it's set up is that, uh, Northern Telecom is, uh, and the actual switching equipment manufacturer.
[48:21.820 --> 48:26.160]  [SPEAKER_27]: The research and the software engineering is done by Bell Northern Research.
[48:26.560 --> 48:31.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: Bell Northern Research, basically, is the R&D wing of Northern Telecom.
[48:31.660 --> 48:37.160]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's mostly owned by Northern Telecom, and a slightly smaller percentage owned by Bell Canada.
[48:37.800 --> 48:38.200]  [SPEAKER_07]: All right.
[48:38.200 --> 48:39.980]  [SPEAKER_27]: But Northern Telecom is its own entity.
[48:40.180 --> 48:41.320]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's not owned by anyone else.
[48:41.820 --> 48:42.180]  [SPEAKER_09]: All right.
[48:42.300 --> 48:43.480]  [SPEAKER_09]: I was just wondering about that.
[48:43.700 --> 48:48.320]  [SPEAKER_09]: Is that like the eighth of the seven sisters of Our Lady of the Dial Tone that's never mentioned, really?
[48:48.500 --> 48:52.120]  [SPEAKER_09]: And that's why, that's one of the reasons why Canada is so wired into us?
[48:53.300 --> 49:05.060]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, uh, I would assume originally that, uh, Alexander Graham Bell must have, uh, I know for a fact that he went around patenting the Bell name and the whole design for the telephone.
[49:06.080 --> 49:13.140]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, uh, what he probably did was, uh, establish Bell Canada at some point in time, or maybe it wasn't him personally.
[49:13.140 --> 49:16.120]  [SPEAKER_27]: I don't know the exact history of Bell Canada itself, per se.
[49:17.160 --> 49:24.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: But, um, a lot of the, uh, equipment, uh, manufacturing is done by, uh, the same companies.
[49:24.620 --> 49:35.400]  [SPEAKER_27]: I mean, Northern Telecom manufactures tons of switches all over the United States, and yet Northern Telecom is based in Canada, and there's also a headquarters in England.
[49:35.920 --> 49:37.940]  [SPEAKER_27]: But they're, they're mainly a Canadian company.
[49:38.440 --> 49:40.820]  [SPEAKER_09]: Another thing, uh, this is when I was growing up.
[49:40.900 --> 49:51.200]  [SPEAKER_09]: In the late 70s, uh, about the time of ELO's release of the Tune Telephone line with their appearance of the ESS ringback, I used, uh, a brother of mine used to dial his number.
[49:51.320 --> 49:53.000]  [SPEAKER_09]: He used to get this, uh, yo-yo tone.
[49:53.100 --> 49:56.560]  [SPEAKER_09]: It goes, ah, ah, ah, ah, this guy's good.
[49:56.800 --> 49:58.080]  [SPEAKER_27]: Hey, that's pretty good.
[49:58.080 --> 49:58.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: You don't need the test.
[49:59.100 --> 49:59.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're just going to have him on the test.
[49:59.920 --> 50:00.040]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[50:01.520 --> 50:04.900]  [SPEAKER_27]: I think, uh, what you're talking about, there's still a lot of those test numbers around.
[50:05.360 --> 50:12.200]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, I thought it might have been associated with a crossbar because, uh, you know, I've been, you know, you know, searching around for that number.
[50:12.360 --> 50:14.840]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's, it's like a, I don't know, it's like a nostalgia.
[50:15.180 --> 50:18.020]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's like, when I was a kid, I used to get it, and it's like, brings back memories.
[50:18.320 --> 50:18.640]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[50:18.860 --> 50:20.280]  [SPEAKER_09]: Might even use it on a punk tune.
[50:20.900 --> 50:23.460]  [SPEAKER_27]: A lot of people, uh, nickname them sweep tones.
[50:23.980 --> 50:29.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: What they're actually used for is on analog switches, not digital, but strictly analog switches.
[50:30.200 --> 50:43.980]  [SPEAKER_27]: And a lot of the older switches, crossbars, step-by-steps, or even 1s and 1As, ESSs, which are analog as well, you'll find these test numbers because they actually used to use those to test signal quality.
[50:44.160 --> 50:49.880]  [SPEAKER_27]: So this is for similar reasons as they now use the type 105 ATMS system.
[50:49.880 --> 50:56.840]  [SPEAKER_09]: And notice there's certain 9922 exchanges that give you this ramping, uh, test that goes...
[50:59.780 --> 51:01.840]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right, that, that's, that's the sweep tone as well.
[51:01.980 --> 51:02.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's just another sweep tone.
[51:03.320 --> 51:03.640]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[51:04.640 --> 51:05.400]  [SPEAKER_07]: All right, uh...
[51:05.400 --> 51:09.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think, I think we've, we've been impressed enough with all these different sounds you can make.
[51:09.660 --> 51:12.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: But, um, keep searching, keep looking for things.
[51:12.800 --> 51:13.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[51:13.760 --> 51:14.040]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[51:14.240 --> 51:14.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: Great time.
[51:15.120 --> 51:15.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks.
[51:15.520 --> 51:16.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for sharing that with us.
[51:17.520 --> 51:22.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, there's a lot of people out there that, that know all this, that can do that.
[51:22.720 --> 51:23.520]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, I just want to add...
[51:23.520 --> 51:24.220]  [SPEAKER_27]: Captain Crunch to Shane.
[51:24.420 --> 51:38.140]  [SPEAKER_27]: I want to add one more thing about the recordings, is that, um, when the recordings are made, when they're actually digitized and stored, the major reason that they have a phone number go to that recording is basically they want to hear how it sounds.
[51:38.460 --> 51:38.640]  [SPEAKER_07]: Right.
[51:38.760 --> 51:44.460]  [SPEAKER_27]: Because it's one thing to hear it in the headset when you play it back yourself, on a computer terminal.
[51:44.780 --> 51:56.120]  [SPEAKER_27]: But it's another thing to actually map it out to a telephone number, and then they would go to a phone and dial it just to see how it sounds over a telephone, to make sure that it's intelligible and not muffled or anything like that.
[51:56.320 --> 52:01.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: That's basically the reason why they have phone numbers, simply to test out the recording to see how it sounds.
[52:02.140 --> 52:05.780]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, let's, uh, check out some of those phone numbers, see what, uh, what we get if we call one.
[52:08.560 --> 52:10.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, let's see if that's the number he gave us.
[52:10.460 --> 52:12.260]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hopefully it's the right number.
[52:12.260 --> 52:13.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're not waking somebody up.
[52:15.740 --> 52:18.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, we have to enter one of those stupid authorization codes.
[52:18.140 --> 52:19.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, let's see if I can figure one out.
[52:21.920 --> 52:22.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[52:22.400 --> 52:26.740]  [SPEAKER_25]: Service cannot be activated because the telephone number is not in our serving area.
[52:27.040 --> 52:27.400]  [SPEAKER_27]: Wow.
[52:30.320 --> 52:31.120]  [SPEAKER_27]: That's interesting.
[52:31.780 --> 52:33.520]  [SPEAKER_27]: It was in the 201 area code?
[52:33.520 --> 52:33.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[52:34.520 --> 52:36.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that was the recording that we got.
[52:36.220 --> 52:36.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[52:36.500 --> 52:37.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: That wasn't something...
[52:37.760 --> 52:40.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: We, we activated that recording by calling that number.
[52:40.620 --> 52:40.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hmm.
[52:40.920 --> 52:42.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's, uh, let's try another one.
[52:42.560 --> 52:43.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: Try one up from that.
[52:45.000 --> 52:46.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Do we have a dial tone here?
[52:46.460 --> 52:46.780]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[53:04.550 --> 53:05.330]  [SPEAKER_25]: We're sorry.
[53:05.610 --> 53:07.130]  [SPEAKER_25]: Your call did not go through.
[53:07.510 --> 53:09.310]  [SPEAKER_25]: Will you please try your call again?
[53:11.290 --> 53:13.070]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's kind of an uninteresting one, isn't it?
[53:13.250 --> 53:13.450]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[53:13.710 --> 53:14.850]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right, we'll try another one a little later.
[53:15.370 --> 53:16.210]  [SPEAKER_02]: But, um...
[53:16.210 --> 53:20.050]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, that's a perfect example of the recordings that come with the switch, basically.
[53:20.370 --> 53:20.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[53:20.730 --> 53:21.770]  [SPEAKER_02]: Those are the generic...
[53:21.770 --> 53:23.130]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, those are your generic recordings.
[53:23.430 --> 53:23.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[53:23.830 --> 53:26.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: And you can change those, or do whatever with them?
[53:26.410 --> 53:28.450]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, you can, but they usually leave them just the same.
[53:28.550 --> 53:29.350]  [SPEAKER_02]: How would one go about...
[53:29.350 --> 53:33.170]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, can you do that remotely, or do you have to be actually inside the switch to change those recordings?
[53:33.370 --> 53:40.730]  [SPEAKER_27]: You can actually access the software tools remotely, but technically you have to actually be there in order to plug in a microphone and a headset.
[53:41.110 --> 53:41.330]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[53:42.850 --> 53:43.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's kind of neat.
[53:43.430 --> 53:48.450]  [SPEAKER_02]: That would be a good thing if somebody could actually figure out how to do that, and they put their own voice on the phone.
[53:49.330 --> 53:49.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[53:49.690 --> 53:53.130]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, no hacker has done that yet, I don't think, but, uh, I'm sure.
[53:53.830 --> 53:54.470]  [SPEAKER_02]: That day will come.
[53:54.910 --> 53:56.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm going to try out one more of these.
[54:02.130 --> 54:03.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's nothing, that's just a reorder.
[54:05.090 --> 54:06.670]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, some of these might not be in service.
[54:07.570 --> 54:09.110]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're discovering this as we go along.
[54:09.390 --> 54:10.650]  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe it was meant to give a reorder.
[54:11.010 --> 54:11.330]  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe.
[54:11.630 --> 54:13.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, well, let's cross that one off the list.
[54:14.610 --> 54:15.470]  [SPEAKER_02]: Want to try one more?
[54:15.910 --> 54:16.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: Sure, why not?
[54:16.550 --> 54:18.530]  [SPEAKER_02]: It could be really a funny recording, so.
[54:23.180 --> 54:27.680]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's the only reason we, uh, do things like this, because we may discover something really interesting.
[54:28.540 --> 54:29.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now another reorder.
[54:29.560 --> 54:30.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: I have a feeling a lot of them are like that.
[54:31.460 --> 54:33.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, let's take some phone calls.
[54:33.480 --> 54:34.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening, you're on.
[54:35.460 --> 54:36.220]  [SPEAKER_02]: Go ahead, speak.
[54:36.220 --> 54:36.260]  [SPEAKER_02]: Mike?
[54:37.380 --> 54:37.740]  [SPEAKER_05]: Hello?
[54:38.020 --> 54:39.160]  [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, I'm on time delay.
[54:39.420 --> 54:40.020]  [SPEAKER_05]: Excuse me.
[54:41.780 --> 54:43.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, don't, don't listen to the time delay.
[54:43.940 --> 54:44.620]  [SPEAKER_05]: Nope, sorry.
[54:44.760 --> 54:45.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: You'll get all confused.
[54:45.620 --> 54:53.240]  [SPEAKER_05]: Um, I was just wondering, uh, I'm an audiophile, I listen to music a lot, and, uh, I enjoy it very much, but, uh, where does the passion lie in this?
[54:53.360 --> 54:55.120]  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't, I just don't understand it.
[54:55.200 --> 54:57.180]  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't mean to be ignorant, but, uh...
[54:57.180 --> 55:01.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, you're, you're asking, where's the passion in, in, in playing around with phones?
[55:01.460 --> 55:04.060]  [SPEAKER_05]: Hacking, I mean, what, what tries you guys to do this?
[55:04.740 --> 55:10.240]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, well, Fiber, I think you're, you're, you're, you're having spent 10 months in prison because of hacking, I guess you're a qualified chance for that.
[55:10.580 --> 55:11.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: Go ahead.
[55:11.320 --> 55:17.340]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, uh, are you talking, uh, strictly about computers, or are you talking about calling strange phone numbers and seeing what they do?
[55:17.420 --> 55:19.580]  [SPEAKER_07]: Like, like the last call, are calling strange phone numbers.
[55:19.740 --> 55:37.660]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, the thing behind that is, uh, if you think of it this way, if you've ever, uh, played with a computer, you're typing things in at a keyboard, and you're seeing the result of what you're typing on a screen, the only difference between freaking and hacking on a computer is that instead of a keyboard,
[55:37.880 --> 55:41.540]  [SPEAKER_27]: you're using a dial or a Touch-Tone keypad to do things.
[55:41.920 --> 55:46.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: And instead of having a screen to see what the result of those things is, you're listening to the result.
[55:46.840 --> 55:53.720]  [SPEAKER_27]: So it's almost as if you were having, uh, this, uh, audible computer respond to, to various different input.
[55:55.340 --> 55:56.500]  [SPEAKER_05]: Right, so...
[55:56.500 --> 56:05.780]  [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, I don't know, I, uh, maybe I'm just not getting it, but, uh, uh, you're just, you're doing it to, to find out something, to, to hear audible tones?
[56:06.080 --> 56:14.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, the thing is that, I mean, obviously, if I was just sitting around dialing things at random and had no idea what they were, then the whole thing would be completely pointless.
[56:14.720 --> 56:19.920]  [SPEAKER_27]: But the, the thing is to find out what that number is, what it does, and what purpose it serves.
[56:21.260 --> 56:24.980]  [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, so just, just basically for, for the general information that it provides.
[56:25.240 --> 56:25.760]  [SPEAKER_27]: Oh, sure.
[56:25.920 --> 56:29.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: I mean, it, it's a, it's a piece of test equipment, basically, a lot of them.
[56:29.680 --> 56:40.760]  [SPEAKER_27]: And by knowing what, the, the purpose that that piece of test equipment serves, and maybe even being able to interact with that piece of test equipment, it's just like programming a computer.
[56:40.980 --> 56:45.640]  [SPEAKER_27]: Only, like I said, you're pushing buttons on a phone, and you're hearing the output instead of seeing it.
[56:46.120 --> 56:46.280]  [SPEAKER_05]: Wow.
[56:46.580 --> 56:47.400]  [SPEAKER_05]: Very interesting.
[56:47.900 --> 56:48.520]  [SPEAKER_05]: Thanks a lot.
[56:48.640 --> 56:48.860]  [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
[56:48.920 --> 56:49.320]  [SPEAKER_05]: Appreciate it.
[56:49.460 --> 56:49.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: Sure.
[56:50.220 --> 56:51.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: I know a lot of people can't understand that.
[56:52.240 --> 56:57.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you know, it's just, there's a limited number of people that, that can appreciate this kind of thing.
[56:57.400 --> 57:03.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I think that's true of virtually anything that, you know, I guess there's a, there's a group of people that go around taking pictures of trains.
[57:03.980 --> 57:04.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[57:04.300 --> 57:08.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, now how many people really understand what that's all about and can get passionate about it?
[57:08.700 --> 57:10.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: But there are a group of people that do that.
[57:10.540 --> 57:23.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, you know, what we're doing might not be as, I guess, passive as taking pictures, but imagine if, imagine if taking pictures of trains was, you know, illegal for some reason.
[57:23.700 --> 57:24.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[57:24.180 --> 57:33.780]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it would be, it would be totally as, as, as screwed up as, as our world has become because of some of the things that, that we do that are considered illegal.
[57:34.320 --> 57:41.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, communicating in certain ways, accessing certain systems, maybe someday using encryption is going to be illegal.
[57:41.820 --> 57:43.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're, we're coming a lot closer to that.
[57:44.980 --> 57:56.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, as, as, as the powers that be understand technology more and understand how much they're not in control, you can look forward to seeing all kinds of bizarre rules.
[57:56.700 --> 58:00.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: And that's, that's something that I think we'll be looking at in the future.
[58:00.640 --> 58:04.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, with the, with the Clinton administration, we've, we've been talking about this.
[58:05.000 --> 58:12.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: They have more of a handle on technology, and that's not necessarily a good thing, especially if, you know, if, if they don't trust us with it.
[58:13.380 --> 58:18.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, is there much appreciation in, in, in prison for technologies or interest in this kind of thing?
[58:18.420 --> 58:26.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm, I met quite a number of people that really wanted to know what I had done and why I do, do the things I do or just to understand.
[58:26.860 --> 58:32.840]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, yeah, sure, there's like people here and there that, you know, want you to do something for them and things like that.
[58:32.960 --> 58:33.880]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, you know, it's really silly.
[58:34.520 --> 58:50.180]  [SPEAKER_27]: But, um, I did meet, uh, a number of people that honestly, you know, just were asking genuine questions just because they were curious and not because, uh, you know, they wanted some fraud committed for them or something really ridiculous.
[58:50.980 --> 58:55.660]  [SPEAKER_27]: But, um, it's interesting how many people are aware.
[58:56.040 --> 59:01.780]  [SPEAKER_27]: I mean, they don't have to be knowledgeable in computers or technology, but just that are interested in it.
[59:02.400 --> 59:03.920]  [SPEAKER_27]: People young and old alike.
[59:04.180 --> 59:10.920]  [SPEAKER_27]: It was, it was really interesting to interact with people that were reading things in the newspaper or might have just come in off the street.
[59:11.440 --> 59:14.080]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, you know, whatever the talk was on the news.
[59:14.640 --> 59:16.740]  [SPEAKER_27]: In fact, I was thinking about it last night.
[59:16.740 --> 59:20.880]  [SPEAKER_27]: I was watching TV, really, for the first time, actually sitting down and watching television.
[59:21.380 --> 59:24.140]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I was just, uh, switching channels around late at night.
[59:25.040 --> 59:29.300]  [SPEAKER_27]: And there was some talk show on, and all of a sudden somebody mentioned email.
[59:29.940 --> 59:40.320]  [SPEAKER_27]: Uh, it doesn't seem very odd in and of itself, but, uh, when you consider that five or ten years ago, no one even knew what email was.
[59:40.520 --> 59:51.660]  [SPEAKER_27]: And the odds of you just, on a whim, switching channels around email, or a talk show having an email address, it's really strange.
[59:51.980 --> 59:53.540]  [SPEAKER_27]: I felt really out of place.
[59:54.860 --> 59:55.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[59:55.680 --> 59:56.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, well, things have changed.
[59:56.860 --> 01:00:00.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: There's a lot more people, uh, um, involved.
[01:00:00.860 --> 01:00:02.780]  [SPEAKER_02]: And that's not necessarily a good thing.
[01:00:03.520 --> 01:00:04.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know?
[01:00:04.260 --> 01:00:07.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: Because a lot of the people involved don't appreciate.
[01:00:07.440 --> 01:00:16.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I've been thinking over the past few weeks that eventually, what could happen with this whole net access thing, where everybody wants access, you'll have two different camps of people.
[01:00:16.000 --> 01:00:23.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: The people like us that, uh, have, have sort of, um, um, plowed a path onto, uh, the electronic superhighway, as they call it.
[01:00:24.440 --> 01:00:26.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: And we, we, we've carved our own little niche into that.
[01:00:26.600 --> 01:00:33.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: And then the other people that want to do something on a, on a commercial level, I think basically what you're going to wind up with, um, are two different nets.
[01:00:34.400 --> 01:00:34.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know?
[01:00:34.920 --> 01:00:40.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: The Internet as we know it, and whatever it is that, uh, Prodigy and AOL and those people want to make.
[01:00:40.340 --> 01:00:43.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: And the two nets will talk, but they'll be totally different.
[01:00:44.460 --> 01:00:45.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, they'll talk to each other.
[01:00:45.560 --> 01:00:50.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: You can send mail from one to another, but, uh, I just don't see how it can all exist as one.
[01:00:50.660 --> 01:00:51.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: I can't.
[01:00:51.240 --> 01:00:52.800]  [SPEAKER_27]: Because you have such radically different views.
[01:00:53.120 --> 01:01:05.640]  [SPEAKER_27]: I, I can't help but thinking about the analogy, and I, and I do quite often, of, um, of American Indians, Native Americans, and the homesteaders coming out to more or less, uh, settle the uncharted territory.
[01:01:05.960 --> 01:01:22.140]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I'm always, I'm always reminded of that every time about how the, uh, how the Native Americans were called savages, and how the hackers are called, uh, rebels and criminals and things like that, and how they have to be, uh, taught a lesson and made civilized so that,
[01:01:22.420 --> 01:01:39.020]  [SPEAKER_27]: uh, a mom-and-pop, uh, computer user can, like, pretty much ride in and, uh, with the government's help, uh, gain access to all the wonderful things that computers can do for them, which, uh, is, is really, uh, utilitarian way of looking at things.
[01:01:39.160 --> 01:01:50.020]  [SPEAKER_27]: They're simply using it to get something and not really appreciating anything that has to do with where did this technology come from, who were the pioneers that, that built it and made it possible.
[01:01:51.900 --> 01:01:55.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, the net is something that, uh, can be used for virtually anything.
[01:01:55.560 --> 01:01:59.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: Computers can be used for whatever it is your imagination allows.
[01:01:59.640 --> 01:02:06.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: And unfortunately, too many people are, are worried about the restrictions, about the rules, about, you know, what they can't do.
[01:02:07.160 --> 01:02:09.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, that's, that's not what it's all about.
[01:02:09.440 --> 01:02:10.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: Do whatever you want.
[01:02:10.340 --> 01:02:10.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: Figure it out.
[01:02:11.040 --> 01:02:20.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: Figure out what the boundaries are, you know, and, and apply the same, uh, the same, uh, moral fabric that you already have in, in real life to computers.
[01:02:20.240 --> 01:02:26.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, um, I, I think that's, uh, that's the guiding force that most of us should, uh, should have in the first place.
[01:02:26.280 --> 01:02:28.500]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, just to shock people a little bit.
[01:02:28.560 --> 01:02:28.740]  [SPEAKER_27]: Okay.
[01:02:29.000 --> 01:02:39.280]  [SPEAKER_27]: I think that people should bear in mind that in prison, the way that things are run is that you're constantly reminded under threat what you can't do.
[01:02:39.420 --> 01:02:39.580]  [SPEAKER_07]: Right.
[01:02:39.780 --> 01:02:54.160]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I think that there's, there are enough horrible places like that where you're told what you can't do and you're, you're repressed and all kinds of horrible things that we don't have to act like that on the outside, especially on, on computer networks.
[01:02:54.160 --> 01:02:58.080]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right, and that's increasingly happening in mainstream society as well, not just in prisons.
[01:02:58.240 --> 01:03:05.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're constantly, we have to have rules and regulations for everything because we just don't know enough to, uh, to take care of ourselves.
[01:03:05.580 --> 01:03:11.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: We have to be told that, you know, we have to wear a seatbelt because we wouldn't know enough to do it on our own.
[01:03:11.400 --> 01:03:18.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: We, we have to not smoke everywhere in certain places because, uh, you know, we, we're not considerate, so we have to have regulations telling us what to do.
[01:03:18.700 --> 01:03:26.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, a lot of these regulations I happen to agree with, but, uh, the fact that we have to have a rule for, you know, for just normal behavior.
[01:03:27.540 --> 01:03:32.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you go to foreign countries, and basically common sense prevails.
[01:03:33.400 --> 01:03:44.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I've mentioned this about, you know, when I went to Argentina, I noticed that, and in Europe too, you know, like doors on trains open whenever people push them, you know.
[01:03:44.940 --> 01:03:47.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think that would work very well here in Manhattan.
[01:03:48.100 --> 01:03:52.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: Traffic is much more chaotic, but people kind of get by.
[01:03:52.900 --> 01:04:00.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm reminded of somebody that I knew in prison who, he was basically treated with the same type of mentality.
[01:04:01.360 --> 01:04:03.660]  [SPEAKER_27]: Basically, he needed an operation.
[01:04:03.660 --> 01:04:07.940]  [SPEAKER_27]: He had a slipped disc or something to that effect in his back.
[01:04:08.080 --> 01:04:08.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[01:04:08.620 --> 01:04:16.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: And he had to go out for an operation at some point because there's no, you know, in-depth medical treatment there.
[01:04:16.900 --> 01:04:19.500]  [SPEAKER_27]: So he had to be taken to the next town where they had a hospital.
[01:04:20.120 --> 01:04:23.060]  [SPEAKER_27]: And he knew he was going to go to the hospital at some point.
[01:04:23.540 --> 01:04:25.520]  [SPEAKER_27]: But all of a sudden, they come and get him.
[01:04:25.980 --> 01:04:30.080]  [SPEAKER_27]: They take him out, and they throw him in the hole, which is basically segregation.
[01:04:31.140 --> 01:04:33.160]  [SPEAKER_27]: And he had no idea why he was going.
[01:04:33.280 --> 01:04:35.600]  [SPEAKER_27]: He thought he might have did something wrong or something like that.
[01:04:36.100 --> 01:04:39.820]  [SPEAKER_27]: And when he came back a couple of days later, I asked him what happened.
[01:04:40.140 --> 01:04:50.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: And he told me that he was scheduled to go for surgery, and he was not supposed to eat for something like a 12-hour period.
[01:04:50.580 --> 01:04:56.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: And it reminds me exactly like what you're saying, that you can't tell a grown man not to eat the night before.
[01:04:56.360 --> 01:04:59.940]  [SPEAKER_27]: You have to go and lock him up where he's not in contact with food.
[01:05:00.020 --> 01:05:01.700]  [SPEAKER_27]: It made absolutely no sense.
[01:05:01.720 --> 01:05:02.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: It was scary.
[01:05:02.380 --> 01:05:02.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[01:05:03.440 --> 01:05:03.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[01:05:04.100 --> 01:05:12.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: We have to have our, you know, our, our behavior controlled, because we're not mature enough to control ourselves.
[01:05:13.400 --> 01:05:18.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's, I don't know, it's a scary world that we seem to be moving into.
[01:05:18.320 --> 01:05:27.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: And computers seem to underline that in some ways, because people seem to want rules and regulations where you really don't need any.
[01:05:27.840 --> 01:05:30.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, no more additional rules regulations, that is.
[01:05:31.100 --> 01:05:31.300]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[01:05:32.680 --> 01:05:34.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: Anyway, let's take some more phone calls.
[01:05:34.980 --> 01:05:36.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's try out one more of those numbers.
[01:05:36.320 --> 01:05:39.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm convinced that we'll find something out there that's, that's interesting.
[01:05:39.320 --> 01:05:39.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: We have a dial tone?
[01:05:40.060 --> 01:05:40.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:05:45.340 --> 01:05:49.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: This may be a totally fruitless search here, but who knows?
[01:05:51.000 --> 01:05:51.860]  [SPEAKER_25]: We're sorry.
[01:05:52.120 --> 01:05:58.020]  [SPEAKER_25]: It is not necessary to dial the digits 950 before the long distance company access code.
[01:05:58.340 --> 01:06:00.500]  [SPEAKER_25]: Please hang up and try your call again.
[01:06:01.040 --> 01:06:01.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: There you go.
[01:06:02.240 --> 01:06:03.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: Bet you never heard that one before.
[01:06:04.500 --> 01:06:05.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, actually, I think I am.
[01:06:07.740 --> 01:06:08.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:06:08.120 --> 01:06:09.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, most of the people out there probably haven't.
[01:06:10.060 --> 01:06:11.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's, that's an interesting recording.
[01:06:12.160 --> 01:06:12.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:06:12.780 --> 01:06:14.260]  [SPEAKER_02]: 212-279-3400.
[01:06:14.380 --> 01:06:18.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: By the way, if you're tuning in for the news, you've noticed that it's not the news tonight.
[01:06:18.220 --> 01:06:30.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Tonight we're going an extra 45 minutes to 1145, right up to when Robert Knight comes in, because of this special event, fiber optic returning, not only to the airways, but to the civilized world, such as it is.
[01:06:31.000 --> 01:06:34.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, anything, any negative, uh, feelings coming back here?
[01:06:34.600 --> 01:06:36.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: Anything looks depressing or?
[01:06:37.340 --> 01:06:39.500]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, uh, tell you the truth.
[01:06:40.080 --> 01:06:42.500]  [SPEAKER_27]: Everything seems, uh, pretty amazing.
[01:06:42.760 --> 01:06:42.960]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[01:06:43.340 --> 01:06:52.680]  [SPEAKER_27]: I mean, uh, experiencing everything again, it's, it's, it's really, in a lot, in some ways, it's kind of overwhelming and maybe even a little scary.
[01:06:52.900 --> 01:06:56.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: But as soon as I get over that feeling, uh, it's, it's really amazing.
[01:06:56.560 --> 01:06:58.900]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm kind of just amazed by everything.
[01:06:59.320 --> 01:06:59.700]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah.
[01:07:00.060 --> 01:07:16.120]  [SPEAKER_27]: I, I, I remember like when I, when I first got out, I was amazed by really the silliest things, like being able to wear my own clothing and being able even to wear a shirt that had a color other than like, you know, khaki or, or gray.
[01:07:16.620 --> 01:07:20.280]  [SPEAKER_27]: Basically all the clothing that we have in there is either khaki or gray.
[01:07:21.180 --> 01:07:28.320]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I mean, some people got, uh, clothing in from the outside, which you have to go through all kinds of major hurdles to do.
[01:07:28.900 --> 01:07:36.120]  [SPEAKER_27]: But, uh, the majority of people didn't even want to bother going through the trouble because it was basically, we're not trying to impress anybody.
[01:07:36.500 --> 01:07:46.840]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I don't, I wouldn't want to look the way I dressed on the street, even to a slight degree, because I think it would, it just seems wrong.
[01:07:47.060 --> 01:07:49.820]  [SPEAKER_27]: And it would just probably confuse me.
[01:07:51.280 --> 01:07:54.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: The fact that I was wearing street clothes and I wasn't on the street.
[01:07:54.520 --> 01:07:57.340]  [SPEAKER_27]: It was, people never really wore street clothes there.
[01:07:57.400 --> 01:08:05.300]  [SPEAKER_27]: The majority of people that I knew, we basically wore khakis if we had to, or whites if we worked in the kitchen.
[01:08:05.880 --> 01:08:13.460]  [SPEAKER_27]: And when we weren't working, we usually wore the same gray sweatpants and sweat jackets that they sold in the commissary.
[01:08:14.340 --> 01:08:18.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: We were wondering, I mean, we would always wonder about these, these things when we came to visit you.
[01:08:18.340 --> 01:08:25.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: But one of the things that, uh, a couple of us were thinking, what would happen if we came dressed in the same outfit that, that you were dressed in?
[01:08:25.660 --> 01:08:28.660]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's how they, they were able to tell the prisoners from the, the free people.
[01:08:28.920 --> 01:08:30.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, would they ask us to stay?
[01:08:30.560 --> 01:08:32.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: Would they get all confused and count us as prisoners?
[01:08:33.700 --> 01:08:34.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, has anyone ever tried anything like that?
[01:08:35.120 --> 01:08:37.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: I've never seen it happen, but that is an interesting question.
[01:08:37.860 --> 01:08:43.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: If they would think you were a prisoner or, or maybe they wouldn't let you in when you came because they would think that you're trying to pull some stunt.
[01:08:44.900 --> 01:08:45.220]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[01:08:45.320 --> 01:08:46.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: We'd definitely be labeled as, as wise guys.
[01:08:47.700 --> 01:08:50.080]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, um, I think we already were though, to start with.
[01:08:51.520 --> 01:08:52.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, um, okay.
[01:08:52.420 --> 01:08:53.260]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's take some more phone calls.
[01:08:53.320 --> 01:08:54.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: 212-279-3400.
[01:08:54.680 --> 01:08:54.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening.
[01:08:55.280 --> 01:08:55.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: Hi, Manuel.
[01:08:55.980 --> 01:08:58.620]  [SPEAKER_08]: Just some Williamsburg exchanges here that you wanted.
[01:08:58.940 --> 01:09:00.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: Ah, I knew you'd come through.
[01:09:00.400 --> 01:09:00.660]  [SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
[01:09:00.880 --> 01:09:02.380]  [SPEAKER_08]: Um, and I wanted to, yes, five real questions.
[01:09:02.720 --> 01:09:02.740]  [SPEAKER_08]: Hi.
[01:09:03.160 --> 01:09:13.140]  [SPEAKER_08]: Um, the Williamsburg-Brooklyn exchanges are 3-8-4, 3-8-7, 3-8-8, and 4-8-6.
[01:09:14.400 --> 01:09:15.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: Any of that ring a bell, Fiverr?
[01:09:16.300 --> 01:09:17.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, vaguely.
[01:09:17.380 --> 01:09:17.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: Vaguely.
[01:09:17.860 --> 01:09:18.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Very vaguely.
[01:09:18.380 --> 01:09:18.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: It'll come back to you.
[01:09:19.000 --> 01:09:20.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: I meant to ask you, Fiverr.
[01:09:20.480 --> 01:09:27.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: Why when you dial zero for local operator or AT&T operator, when you hang up, they seem to hold you on the line when you pick up.
[01:09:27.960 --> 01:09:34.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: In other words, when you dial 102-22 for MCI or another long-distance carrier, when you hang up, you're able to hang up.
[01:09:34.580 --> 01:09:43.100]  [SPEAKER_08]: When you dial 102-88 for AT&T, you hang up, you try and hang up, and it won't release the line until they... That's a remnant of the old system, isn't it?
[01:09:43.460 --> 01:09:44.460]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's still the same here.
[01:09:44.740 --> 01:09:49.780]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, well, actually, I think it's still like that in practically every place I'm aware of.
[01:09:49.960 --> 01:09:57.800]  [SPEAKER_27]: The reason for that is that when you call an operator, they actually reverse the voltage on the line so that normally you're not able to hang up.
[01:09:58.640 --> 01:10:05.760]  [SPEAKER_27]: And it actually keeps the connection open until they hit position release on their console.
[01:10:06.340 --> 01:10:11.880]  [SPEAKER_27]: And that basically restores the trunk and ultimately the phone line to its normal polarity.
[01:10:12.020 --> 01:10:14.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's true of the local operator, but is it still true of AT&T?
[01:10:15.620 --> 01:10:16.500]  [SPEAKER_27]: With AT&T?
[01:10:16.580 --> 01:10:17.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm not exactly certain.
[01:10:17.860 --> 01:10:18.160]  [SPEAKER_27]: It is.
[01:10:18.800 --> 01:10:19.940]  [SPEAKER_27]: You say it is.
[01:10:20.100 --> 01:10:20.340]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[01:10:21.240 --> 01:10:30.980]  [SPEAKER_08]: You could try it if you want, but the other question is that with MCI and the other companies, when you hang up, I know the ANI, does that ANI go away right away when you hang up?
[01:10:31.400 --> 01:10:34.180]  [SPEAKER_08]: And is it the same with AT&T and local operators?
[01:10:34.540 --> 01:10:36.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: Does the ANI go away when they press position release?
[01:10:37.060 --> 01:10:38.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: What do you mean by go away?
[01:10:38.540 --> 01:10:40.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: In other words, they have your ANI.
[01:10:40.880 --> 01:10:43.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: I imagine they can hold on to it as long as they want, depending on their software.
[01:10:44.820 --> 01:10:49.480]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, now, wait, you mean when they're looking at their console and they see where you're calling from?
[01:10:49.620 --> 01:10:49.740]  [SPEAKER_04]: Right.
[01:10:50.100 --> 01:10:50.260]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[01:10:52.940 --> 01:11:02.840]  [SPEAKER_27]: To tell you the truth, I myself have never stood in front of an operator's console, an OSPS console, or a TOPS console, or anything like that.
[01:11:02.840 --> 01:11:03.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know what you do?
[01:11:03.440 --> 01:11:07.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: You call an MCI operator, and you social engineer them, and you find out.
[01:11:07.440 --> 01:11:08.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: You ask questions.
[01:11:08.340 --> 01:11:11.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: Sometimes, you know, you can find that information that way, if you're really interested.
[01:11:11.420 --> 01:11:12.420]  [SPEAKER_08]: Try calling an operator.
[01:11:12.420 --> 01:11:12.760]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
[01:11:13.140 --> 01:11:14.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: And technically, it's not ANI.
[01:11:15.120 --> 01:11:15.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's ONI.
[01:11:16.040 --> 01:11:20.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: When you call an operator, they get operator number identification, ONI.
[01:11:20.540 --> 01:11:22.320]  [SPEAKER_08]: 950 numbers have ANI.
[01:11:22.420 --> 01:11:25.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: I believe 950 numbers know the exchange and area code you're calling from.
[01:11:26.320 --> 01:11:33.180]  [SPEAKER_27]: Some 950 numbers, for some time now, are capable of receiving ANI if they're in equal access areas.
[01:11:33.440 --> 01:11:45.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: Although, for the most part, they've tended to go against that, because originally, when 950s came out, and then they came out with equal access, they classified 950s as feature group B numbers.
[01:11:45.800 --> 01:12:03.920]  [SPEAKER_27]: And feature group D, which indicates equal access, where you have 10 plus dialing, or whether you have 800 numbers that can receive ANI, that's all made possible through what's known as an equal access end office, which basically means a central office switch that's capable of equal access,
[01:12:04.160 --> 01:12:10.880]  [SPEAKER_27]: or transmitting ANI to another long-distance carrier's phone switch at the other end.
[01:12:11.020 --> 01:12:15.940]  [SPEAKER_08]: Can local 7-digit numbers have ANI also, or is it just a 32-900 and 800 numbers?
[01:12:16.960 --> 01:12:18.260]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, sure, they can.
[01:12:18.440 --> 01:12:23.280]  [SPEAKER_27]: I mean, an 800 number technically translates to a normal telephone number.
[01:12:23.760 --> 01:12:26.280]  [SPEAKER_27]: It translates to a POTS telephone number.
[01:12:26.360 --> 01:12:26.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: Some of them do.
[01:12:26.940 --> 01:12:28.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, not always.
[01:12:28.840 --> 01:12:29.820]  [SPEAKER_27]: No, not... yeah, that's true.
[01:12:29.900 --> 01:12:30.520]  [SPEAKER_27]: Not necessarily.
[01:12:31.400 --> 01:12:39.900]  [SPEAKER_27]: But I'm... but in... for all practical intents and purposes, anyone that does is perfectly capable of receiving the ANI.
[01:12:39.980 --> 01:12:41.040]  [SPEAKER_27]: In fact, that's what it's going to do.
[01:12:41.260 --> 01:12:45.480]  [SPEAKER_27]: If they're actually receiving the ANI in real time, and they have...
[01:12:45.480 --> 01:12:52.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: their 800 number happens to translate, the INWATS number translates to an actual POTS number, then yeah, I mean, it's nothing out of the ordinary.
[01:12:53.060 --> 01:12:54.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right, thanks for the call.
[01:12:54.360 --> 01:12:54.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:12:54.500 --> 01:12:55.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right, thanks for the information.
[01:12:55.800 --> 01:12:58.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's see if, uh, if we can recognize this guy's voice here.
[01:13:01.580 --> 01:13:05.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: Calling Williamsburg, and we're going to, uh, try... what happened there?
[01:13:12.290 --> 01:13:12.650]  [SPEAKER_02]: Ooh.
[01:13:15.710 --> 01:13:18.050]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's, uh... that's a high-speed modem, isn't it?
[01:13:18.110 --> 01:13:18.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, it is.
[01:13:19.250 --> 01:13:22.490]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, we're not going to tell you which one of those numbers, uh, yielded that.
[01:13:22.770 --> 01:13:24.350]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're just going to try another exchange.
[01:13:25.270 --> 01:13:26.550]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's kind of interesting, isn't it?
[01:13:26.550 --> 01:13:26.950]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[01:13:27.430 --> 01:13:30.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: Why would they leave a high-speed modem on such an obvious number?
[01:13:32.130 --> 01:13:32.930]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's try this one.
[01:13:33.570 --> 01:13:36.070]  [SPEAKER_23]: Congratulations, you have reached the Williamsburg DS2.
[01:13:36.210 --> 01:13:36.870]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think so.
[01:13:37.010 --> 01:13:37.170]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hmm.
[01:13:37.490 --> 01:13:38.130]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's a woman.
[01:13:38.230 --> 01:13:39.350]  [SPEAKER_02]: Doesn't sound very much like him.
[01:13:39.550 --> 01:13:40.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: No, not at all.
[01:13:40.890 --> 01:13:42.690]  [SPEAKER_24]: DS2, serving code 387.
[01:13:44.850 --> 01:13:49.670]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, well, that was only for one exchange, so maybe she got that exchange and he got all the others.
[01:13:49.890 --> 01:13:52.530]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, I think that they're probably most likely all the same.
[01:13:52.690 --> 01:13:55.270]  [SPEAKER_27]: Let's see what happens when we dial, uh, 388.
[01:13:59.300 --> 01:14:03.440]  [SPEAKER_24]: Congratulations, you have reached the Williamsburg DS2, serving code 388.
[01:14:03.620 --> 01:14:05.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I guess she does each one individually.
[01:14:05.540 --> 01:14:06.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's unusual.
[01:14:06.320 --> 01:14:10.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: Usually they list the exchanges, um, but not in this case.
[01:14:11.840 --> 01:14:14.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, okay, 212-279-3400.
[01:14:14.760 --> 01:14:15.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening, you're on.
[01:14:16.640 --> 01:14:17.000]  [SPEAKER_04]: Hello?
[01:14:17.200 --> 01:14:17.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: Go ahead.
[01:14:17.940 --> 01:14:19.280]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, yeah, I just want to say hi to Mark.
[01:14:19.500 --> 01:14:19.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hi.
[01:14:20.580 --> 01:14:20.940]  [SPEAKER_04]: Mark?
[01:14:21.220 --> 01:14:21.420]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah.
[01:14:22.500 --> 01:14:23.060]  [SPEAKER_04]: Steve Burke.
[01:14:23.560 --> 01:14:24.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: Hey, how are you?
[01:14:24.480 --> 01:14:25.640]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, glad to hear you're out.
[01:14:25.980 --> 01:14:27.400]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, it's great to be out.
[01:14:27.500 --> 01:14:27.980]  [SPEAKER_27]: We missed you.
[01:14:28.100 --> 01:14:28.980]  [SPEAKER_27]: You better go pick that up.
[01:14:29.240 --> 01:14:29.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[01:14:32.080 --> 01:14:34.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, uh, anything you want to say besides welcome back?
[01:14:34.160 --> 01:14:35.620]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, no, that's it.
[01:14:35.860 --> 01:14:36.780]  [SPEAKER_04]: Just wanted to say hi to Mark.
[01:14:37.020 --> 01:14:37.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:14:37.420 --> 01:14:38.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'll definitely see you soon.
[01:14:38.560 --> 01:14:38.860]  [SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
[01:14:39.480 --> 01:14:40.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for calling.
[01:14:40.280 --> 01:14:40.520]  [SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[01:14:41.720 --> 01:14:42.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening, you're on.
[01:14:42.900 --> 01:14:43.640]  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, hi.
[01:14:44.080 --> 01:14:44.900]  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, hi, Mark.
[01:14:45.020 --> 01:14:45.640]  [SPEAKER_03]: Welcome back.
[01:14:45.840 --> 01:14:46.420]  [SPEAKER_03]: Dana here.
[01:14:46.640 --> 01:14:46.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hi.
[01:14:47.120 --> 01:14:53.320]  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, I have some anomalies in the phone system that can be used to the consumer's advantage.
[01:14:53.560 --> 01:14:53.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, boy.
[01:14:54.140 --> 01:14:56.820]  [SPEAKER_03]: Can I reveal them here lest anyone from NYNEX be listening?
[01:14:57.360 --> 01:14:59.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, people from NYNEX never listen to anything, so don't worry about it.
[01:15:00.200 --> 01:15:00.580]  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, fine.
[01:15:00.800 --> 01:15:04.240]  [SPEAKER_03]: When they disconnect outgoing service now, they give you a dial tone.
[01:15:04.380 --> 01:15:05.280]  [SPEAKER_03]: They didn't used to do that.
[01:15:05.340 --> 01:15:08.240]  [SPEAKER_03]: They used to just make your line go dead when outgoing service was there.
[01:15:08.420 --> 01:15:10.800]  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, when outgoing service was disconnected.
[01:15:11.340 --> 01:15:12.500]  [SPEAKER_03]: They try and convince...
[01:15:12.500 --> 01:15:17.820]  [SPEAKER_03]: Now they give you a dial tone, and they try and convince you with a recording when you dial a seven-digit exchange...
[01:15:17.820 --> 01:15:17.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[01:15:17.880 --> 01:15:21.920]  [SPEAKER_03]: ...that you can't dial anything but 911 and your NYNEX billing center.
[01:15:22.060 --> 01:15:23.240]  [SPEAKER_02]: You can call 800 numbers.
[01:15:23.420 --> 01:15:24.000]  [SPEAKER_03]: That's right.
[01:15:24.000 --> 01:15:25.180]  [SPEAKER_03]: You can dial 800 numbers.
[01:15:25.180 --> 01:15:33.020]  [SPEAKER_03]: And now they have these $5 long-distance cards that allow you to get access to various leased lines via 800 numbers, and you can make local calls on these cards.
[01:15:33.240 --> 01:15:39.140]  [SPEAKER_03]: So if you have $5 of long-distance credit, you can dial a long-distance number for about half the per-minute charge.
[01:15:39.340 --> 01:15:40.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: I have a question.
[01:15:40.220 --> 01:15:44.600]  [SPEAKER_03]: And basically, you know, there's really no loss of access at all.
[01:15:44.700 --> 01:15:45.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: I have a question for you.
[01:15:45.720 --> 01:15:51.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: What happens if you call 1-800-CALL-INFO, that MCI service that charges 75 cents for information?
[01:15:51.280 --> 01:15:54.620]  [SPEAKER_03]: I haven't tried that, but I have sort of another related thing to tell you about.
[01:15:55.220 --> 01:15:56.820]  [SPEAKER_03]: Which is when you call directory...
[01:15:56.820 --> 01:16:00.300]  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm not really sure, but maybe you guys knew all about that all along.
[01:16:00.500 --> 01:16:06.780]  [SPEAKER_03]: When you call directory assistance in New York and you ask for a company with, say, an out-of-state number, a New Jersey number...
[01:16:06.780 --> 01:16:14.760]  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, if you call New York Information asking for New Jersey Transit, you can now have them dial the number automatically when you get the voicemail response phone number.
[01:16:15.400 --> 01:16:20.580]  [SPEAKER_03]: Even if you have no long-distance service, you can get the New Jersey number because they give you an open line.
[01:16:21.780 --> 01:16:23.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe you should explain that a little bit.
[01:16:23.680 --> 01:16:23.920]  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[01:16:24.220 --> 01:16:34.320]  [SPEAKER_03]: If you call 411 here in Manhattan and you ask for the number for New Jersey Transit, they will tell you that the number is a 201 number and then you can press the...
[01:16:34.320 --> 01:16:35.520]  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm sorry, I left something out.
[01:16:35.580 --> 01:16:39.060]  [SPEAKER_03]: You can press the star key to have the number dialed automatically for you.
[01:16:39.500 --> 01:16:45.120]  [SPEAKER_03]: And even if you have no long-distance service, they will dial the number and you will get through.
[01:16:45.360 --> 01:16:46.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, there's a very simple reason for that.
[01:16:47.760 --> 01:16:53.260]  [SPEAKER_27]: Northern New Jersey, the 201 area code, is part of the same local calling area as New York City is.
[01:16:53.500 --> 01:16:57.080]  [SPEAKER_03]: But if you don't do it via this line, you can't do it.
[01:16:57.100 --> 01:16:59.560]  [SPEAKER_03]: They will tell you that your long-distance service has been blocked.
[01:16:59.600 --> 01:17:00.560]  [SPEAKER_27]: Ah, but...
[01:17:00.560 --> 01:17:00.900]  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[01:17:00.940 --> 01:17:05.760]  [SPEAKER_27]: In order to call the 201 area code, you do not have to call long-distance because technically it's not.
[01:17:06.600 --> 01:17:08.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it doesn't show up on your NYNEX bill, though, does it?
[01:17:08.840 --> 01:17:11.540]  [SPEAKER_27]: What you do is that if you...
[01:17:12.240 --> 01:17:17.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: Normally, if you dial just 1201, it'll go through your long-distance carrier.
[01:17:17.600 --> 01:17:27.020]  [SPEAKER_27]: But technically, northern New Jersey, the whole 201 area code, is part of the same LADA, the same local access transport area, as New York City.
[01:17:27.100 --> 01:17:28.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's known as LADA 132.
[01:17:28.780 --> 01:17:29.220]  Wow.
[01:17:29.720 --> 01:17:41.560]  [SPEAKER_27]: Which technically says that, well, when they laid out the actual LADA boundaries for what's considered inter-exchange and what's considered local, they didn't fall on area code boundaries.
[01:17:41.920 --> 01:17:42.360]  [SPEAKER_07]: Wow.
[01:17:42.540 --> 01:17:43.780]  [SPEAKER_27]: Or even state boundaries.
[01:17:44.120 --> 01:17:45.840]  [SPEAKER_07]: Just the boundaries they had designed.
[01:17:45.980 --> 01:17:46.200]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[01:17:46.400 --> 01:18:04.880]  [SPEAKER_27]: And if anyone knows a little trivia, the local access transport areas, the way that they were derived is from something that marketing analysts use called a Standard Metropolitan Statistical Area, an SMSA, and those are based on the census taken by the government.
[01:18:05.120 --> 01:18:05.420]  [SPEAKER_07]: Mm-hmm.
[01:18:05.780 --> 01:18:17.700]  [SPEAKER_27]: And basically, long, long ago, when they actually laid out the lay of the land and divided up the whole country into LADA's, it had absolutely nothing to do with a local phone company or area code or state boundary.
[01:18:17.900 --> 01:18:20.180]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's strictly its own boundary in and of itself.
[01:18:20.180 --> 01:18:33.880]  [SPEAKER_03]: So if New York Information gave you, say, a 404 area code, which is Georgia, one would not be able to get through if one didn't have long-distance service?
[01:18:33.880 --> 01:18:35.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think you could do that.
[01:18:35.460 --> 01:18:36.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think they would allow that, would they?
[01:18:37.300 --> 01:18:38.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: If you tried to, say again?
[01:18:39.080 --> 01:18:39.400]  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay.
[01:18:39.540 --> 01:18:40.740]  [SPEAKER_03]: How could you get a 404 number?
[01:18:40.880 --> 01:18:46.920]  [SPEAKER_03]: If you press the star key after getting a phone number from New York Information, it happened to be an out-of-state number that they gave you?
[01:18:47.000 --> 01:18:47.260]  [SPEAKER_07]: Right.
[01:18:47.260 --> 01:18:58.040]  [SPEAKER_03]: If you press the star key to have the number dialed automatically, is the line that they give you to do that a sufficiently open line that would allow you to dial, say, something in Georgia?
[01:18:58.740 --> 01:19:00.540]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'm willing to say that it won't work.
[01:19:00.680 --> 01:19:01.340]  [SPEAKER_03]: It won't work.
[01:19:01.420 --> 01:19:01.780]  [SPEAKER_03]: All right.
[01:19:01.880 --> 01:19:18.560]  [SPEAKER_27]: You're free to try it, but it makes perfect sense with Jersey, because if you want to be able to call anyone out there, if they want to call Northern New Jersey, the 201 area code, and they want to be billed by NYNEX, so you're not subject to all the AT&T tariff charges and things like that,
[01:19:18.720 --> 01:19:27.060]  [SPEAKER_27]: you simply dial 10 NYT, which is 10-698, plus 1-201, the prefix and the suffix.
[01:19:27.220 --> 01:19:27.600]  Cool.
[01:19:27.840 --> 01:19:38.300]  [SPEAKER_27]: Which, the flip side of that, which they advertise all the time, in New Jersey, people in 201 who want to call Manhattan and surrounding areas of New York City, they dial 10 NJB.
[01:19:38.300 --> 01:19:40.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: You see those ads, and you hear them on the radio all the time.
[01:19:40.820 --> 01:19:44.480]  [SPEAKER_27]: It's beyond me why NYNEX does not advertise 10 NYT.
[01:19:44.640 --> 01:19:47.280]  [SPEAKER_27]: I've never seen a commercial or heard something on the radio about it.
[01:19:47.320 --> 01:19:48.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: They probably don't know about it.
[01:19:49.760 --> 01:19:50.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.
[01:19:50.720 --> 01:19:53.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: I have some NYNEX stories I want to tell people, but thanks for the call.
[01:19:53.820 --> 01:19:54.160]  [SPEAKER_07]: Thank you.
[01:19:54.720 --> 01:20:00.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: As you recall, last week, I had quite an adventure getting through to them, as far as just getting them to pick up the phone.
[01:20:01.040 --> 01:20:05.660]  [SPEAKER_02]: That was the big challenge last week, to get them to pick up the phone and take the information.
[01:20:06.280 --> 01:20:07.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, get this.
[01:20:07.460 --> 01:20:10.820]  [SPEAKER_02]: I have flat rate service, which a lot of people here cannot get.
[01:20:11.240 --> 01:20:18.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: Flat rate service allows you to call something in your exchange without being billed either a per call or a timed rate.
[01:20:19.340 --> 01:20:21.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: Now, if I'm not mistaken, that does not exist in New York, right?
[01:20:22.180 --> 01:20:25.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: No, flat rate is not a normal class of service in the city.
[01:20:25.420 --> 01:20:25.420]  Okay.
[01:20:25.460 --> 01:20:31.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: But it is where I am, and I subscribe to it, and I pay an extra $10 for this service on this particular phone line.
[01:20:31.440 --> 01:20:40.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: So imagine my surprise when I looked at my phone bill on the exact same page, that little boxed area that tells you how many calls to particular ladders there are.
[01:20:41.400 --> 01:20:45.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: And everything in my ladder was added up.
[01:20:45.220 --> 01:20:48.820]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, everything in my own exchange, which I knew was being made.
[01:20:48.880 --> 01:20:52.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: I knew that calls were only being made to that exchange because that's the kind of line I had.
[01:20:52.840 --> 01:20:54.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: It was being billed twice.
[01:20:54.500 --> 01:20:58.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: I was paying for flat rate and I was paying for every call, so I wanted to tell them this.
[01:20:58.980 --> 01:21:00.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: And it took forever to get through.
[01:21:00.500 --> 01:21:02.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: I finally did get through, and they couldn't figure it out.
[01:21:03.000 --> 01:21:08.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: And then a couple of days later, I got a call from them saying they were going to credit me something like $75 for this.
[01:21:08.560 --> 01:21:14.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I just, I have to wonder how many people out there are being hoodwinked like this.
[01:21:14.280 --> 01:21:18.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, I don't know why it's happening, but it's the same company.
[01:21:18.680 --> 01:21:22.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, they are the ones that define your service, and yet they're billing you for the wrong service.
[01:21:22.980 --> 01:21:25.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's not like one company isn't talking to another.
[01:21:25.900 --> 01:21:29.680]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I had a horror story trying to switch one line over to AT&T once.
[01:21:29.840 --> 01:21:30.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: It just, it went on for months.
[01:21:31.420 --> 01:21:32.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, AT&T kept switching it.
[01:21:32.880 --> 01:21:33.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: 9x kept switching it back.
[01:21:34.120 --> 01:21:36.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I was in the middle saying, look, guys, switch the line.
[01:21:36.820 --> 01:21:37.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is what I want.
[01:21:37.620 --> 01:21:39.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: And it's like, you don't enter into this.
[01:21:39.840 --> 01:21:40.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, you're just the customer.
[01:21:41.180 --> 01:21:41.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: Stay out of it.
[01:21:42.620 --> 01:21:44.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: But this is just 9x.
[01:21:44.840 --> 01:21:50.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is 9x billing you the wrong way for something clearly saying on the same page that they're not supposed to bill you for it.
[01:21:50.420 --> 01:21:52.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: So folks, check your phone bills.
[01:21:52.740 --> 01:21:55.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: Check them a lot, because there's all kinds of mistakes going on out there.
[01:21:55.920 --> 01:22:03.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: If I can get $75 worth of credit in two months for mistakes like this, I'm sure there are bigger mistakes going on.
[01:22:04.540 --> 01:22:07.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's my 9x peeve for now.
[01:22:08.280 --> 01:22:11.040]  [SPEAKER_02]: But, well, you know, every time, I mean, you know this, Mark.
[01:22:11.320 --> 01:22:13.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: You've dealt with 9x enough times working over at Echo.
[01:22:14.040 --> 01:22:14.260]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah.
[01:22:14.440 --> 01:22:18.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: And anybody that tries to provide Internet service has dealt with 9x.
[01:22:18.860 --> 01:22:20.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't understand what it is they do.
[01:22:20.900 --> 01:22:23.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, how has they managed to get every little small detail wrong?
[01:22:23.720 --> 01:22:29.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, are they running like a gambling operation on the side or something that they're devoting all their attention to?
[01:22:29.580 --> 01:22:33.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: And this phone thing is just something on the side that, you know...
[01:22:33.280 --> 01:22:35.140]  [SPEAKER_27]: I think too many people are just undertrained.
[01:22:35.420 --> 01:22:51.260]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I found out that since I've been away, whenever they've had to get some new phone lines installed at Echo, rather than just calling a normal lineman or normal installation guy, a lot of the times the guy would get there and he wouldn't have the proper equipment with him.
[01:22:51.280 --> 01:22:55.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: He wouldn't properly test the lines and things like that if there was a problem.
[01:22:55.760 --> 01:22:57.540]  [SPEAKER_27]: And it was just a lot of headaches.
[01:22:57.860 --> 01:23:07.120]  [SPEAKER_27]: So at Echo, what they were doing is something that's kind of irregular, but it does work to their advantage is that they were calling a special services technician.
[01:23:07.680 --> 01:23:15.940]  [SPEAKER_27]: Now, for people that don't know, a normal telephone line, normal pot service, even if you have a dozen lines, is not considered a special service.
[01:23:16.200 --> 01:23:21.920]  [SPEAKER_27]: A special service might be considered a lease line for a network connection.
[01:23:22.080 --> 01:23:25.080]  [SPEAKER_27]: It could be considered 800 service.
[01:23:25.300 --> 01:23:26.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: It could be considered any number of things.
[01:23:27.000 --> 01:23:32.480]  [SPEAKER_27]: Basically, any service that isn't POTS, plain old telephone service, can be classified as a special service.
[01:23:33.000 --> 01:23:37.500]  [SPEAKER_27]: Now, there's all different types of departments and sub-departments within the special services division.
[01:23:37.920 --> 01:23:45.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: But the people that are in... that work for special services tend to be much better trained to handle all different types of situations.
[01:23:46.160 --> 01:23:50.780]  [SPEAKER_27]: They're really the technicians that are out there doing really technical things.
[01:23:50.960 --> 01:23:51.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[01:23:51.280 --> 01:23:54.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: When you get someone that knows what they're doing, it's like a breath of fresh air.
[01:23:55.080 --> 01:23:58.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: One time, I remember, I had a number changed.
[01:23:58.540 --> 01:24:02.080]  [SPEAKER_02]: And the clods put the wrong number on the intercept recording.
[01:24:02.180 --> 01:24:03.220]  [SPEAKER_02]: Someone else's phone number.
[01:24:03.620 --> 01:24:09.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: So anyone calling me would say that... would hear that my number was changed to some other guy over in New Jersey or something.
[01:24:09.960 --> 01:24:13.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, I had to tell them, look, this is bad, okay?
[01:24:13.680 --> 01:24:15.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: People are calling me and they're getting the wrong number.
[01:24:15.880 --> 01:24:17.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I don't know why you people did this.
[01:24:17.260 --> 01:24:18.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: Can you please fix it?
[01:24:18.500 --> 01:24:26.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, the standard response, if I got through to a person at all, was to simply wait, you know, a couple of days for this to work.
[01:24:26.540 --> 01:24:29.400]  [SPEAKER_02]: Is this when you had... you mean you had a change notice, what the number was changed to?
[01:24:29.400 --> 01:24:33.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, a change... and finally I got through to a human that understood what I was talking about.
[01:24:33.680 --> 01:24:33.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: Really?
[01:24:33.800 --> 01:24:35.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: He fixed it while I was on the phone.
[01:24:35.740 --> 01:24:35.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
[01:24:36.000 --> 01:24:36.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: They can do this.
[01:24:36.980 --> 01:24:40.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: They can do amazing things if they know what they're doing, you know?
[01:24:40.820 --> 01:24:41.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[01:24:41.320 --> 01:24:43.040]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, uh... Uh-huh.
[01:24:44.140 --> 01:24:45.260]  [SPEAKER_02]: You want me to read this?
[01:24:45.780 --> 01:24:47.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: You want me to read this?
[01:24:47.580 --> 01:24:47.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:24:48.020 --> 01:24:48.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: This over here.
[01:24:48.920 --> 01:24:49.040]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:24:49.380 --> 01:24:55.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: Recently, 9x went on a hiring spree for a temporary limited time phone tech.
[01:24:55.780 --> 01:24:58.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: The only prerequisite was a high school diploma.
[01:24:58.480 --> 01:24:59.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: No experience necessary.
[01:24:59.820 --> 01:25:00.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
[01:25:02.160 --> 01:25:02.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[01:25:02.920 --> 01:25:05.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's... that explains something anyway.
[01:25:05.680 --> 01:25:11.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I don't... I don't understand it, but it is a monopoly, and when that stops, maybe we'll get some competent service.
[01:25:11.680 --> 01:25:20.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: I do know... I read in the paper the other day, Cablevision is starting to provide various services, link-ups to the Internet, for instance.
[01:25:20.440 --> 01:25:20.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
[01:25:21.180 --> 01:25:26.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: Time Warner will be providing local dial tone here in New York City for businesses fairly soon.
[01:25:26.320 --> 01:25:36.040]  [SPEAKER_27]: That's interesting, because at home, we have cable, and we're American Cablevision of Queens, which has since been absorbed by Time Warner over the past few years.
[01:25:36.460 --> 01:25:37.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I noticed something interesting.
[01:25:38.420 --> 01:25:40.580]  [SPEAKER_27]: Our cable boxes are different now.
[01:25:40.720 --> 01:25:45.940]  [SPEAKER_27]: They're a lot smaller, and they're made by another company altogether.
[01:25:46.480 --> 01:25:51.820]  [SPEAKER_27]: Actually, if anybody's curious, I live in Queens, and previously they always used TOCOM boxes.
[01:25:52.280 --> 01:25:55.840]  [SPEAKER_27]: And now they began using general, general instrument boxes.
[01:25:55.980 --> 01:25:56.820]  [SPEAKER_02]: Everyone uses those boxes now.
[01:25:56.820 --> 01:25:57.040]  [SPEAKER_02]: Really.
[01:25:57.200 --> 01:25:58.220]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I noticed something interesting.
[01:25:58.520 --> 01:26:01.340]  [SPEAKER_27]: I looked at this new cable box for the first time.
[01:26:01.440 --> 01:26:02.280]  [SPEAKER_27]: I'd never seen one before.
[01:26:02.400 --> 01:26:04.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: I looked on the back, and guess what?
[01:26:04.860 --> 01:26:09.400]  [SPEAKER_27]: But there was a little tiny hole, and right above that hole, it said, phone.
[01:26:11.000 --> 01:26:11.400]  [SPEAKER_27]: Really?
[01:26:11.620 --> 01:26:19.120]  [SPEAKER_27]: So it seems... I don't know if there's hardware in the box for a phone connection, or whether they're planning to have a phone connection in the future.
[01:26:19.480 --> 01:26:22.620]  [SPEAKER_27]: But there was an unused jack in the back.
[01:26:22.620 --> 01:26:23.720]  [SPEAKER_27]: I don't know if it's connected to anything.
[01:26:23.860 --> 01:26:24.600]  [SPEAKER_27]: It did say phone.
[01:26:24.780 --> 01:26:25.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's something.
[01:26:25.880 --> 01:26:30.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, everyone out there, start turning over your cable boxes looking for that little word that says phone there.
[01:26:30.840 --> 01:26:34.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe that's... I mean, I've got one of those two, but I never looked there.
[01:26:35.200 --> 01:26:37.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: So I'll look, too, and see if it says phone on mine.
[01:26:37.900 --> 01:26:40.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's a hint of things to come, I guess.
[01:26:41.120 --> 01:26:42.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, 212-279-3400.
[01:26:43.100 --> 01:26:47.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: We only have about 15 minutes left here on the Welcome Home Show of Phiber Optik.
[01:26:47.960 --> 01:26:50.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: And you'll be with us in the weeks ahead.
[01:26:51.320 --> 01:26:51.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: Definitely.
[01:26:52.120 --> 01:26:56.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hopefully we'll have all kinds of special subjects to speak about.
[01:26:56.520 --> 01:26:58.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: There's so much that's happened since you went away.
[01:26:58.380 --> 01:27:00.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: And it's impossible to get into it all here.
[01:27:00.800 --> 01:27:02.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: But there's so many changes.
[01:27:02.820 --> 01:27:10.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, the recent elections alone spell out all kinds of rather ominous things that could be ahead of us.
[01:27:10.560 --> 01:27:11.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: We'll just have to see what that means.
[01:27:13.340 --> 01:27:14.800]  [SPEAKER_27]: I have a personal question.
[01:27:14.980 --> 01:27:15.000]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yes.
[01:27:15.000 --> 01:27:16.720]  [SPEAKER_27]: Something that I missed that I heard a little about.
[01:27:17.400 --> 01:27:21.520]  [SPEAKER_27]: Did this Pitaki guy ever return Giuliani's phone call?
[01:27:21.520 --> 01:27:22.260]  [SPEAKER_27]: I heard.
[01:27:22.340 --> 01:27:29.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: I heard this on the radio that he said that he would talk to Giuliani if Giuliani would call during business hours.
[01:27:30.700 --> 01:27:34.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: And you have to wonder, you know, oh, this guy is going to be a lot of fun.
[01:27:34.120 --> 01:27:35.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: This guy is going to be just great to have around.
[01:27:38.180 --> 01:27:41.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's... what has happened in the past couple of weeks at the election?
[01:27:42.100 --> 01:27:45.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I don't understand what people are thinking.
[01:27:45.220 --> 01:27:46.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm just spouting off here.
[01:27:46.760 --> 01:27:47.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is my own personal view.
[01:27:48.020 --> 01:27:50.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: But what is wrong with people out there?
[01:27:50.580 --> 01:27:54.260]  [SPEAKER_02]: They elect people that are in the back pockets of developers.
[01:27:54.520 --> 01:28:00.080]  [SPEAKER_02]: They elect people that are responsible for killing the health care bill, which most people seem to want.
[01:28:00.460 --> 01:28:05.240]  [SPEAKER_02]: They elect people that are against things like the Brady bill, which, again, most people seem to want.
[01:28:05.560 --> 01:28:11.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: They say that they're sick of all this negative campaigning, and they elect the people that are the most vicious of all.
[01:28:11.960 --> 01:28:13.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know what's going through people's minds.
[01:28:13.760 --> 01:28:14.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: I really don't.
[01:28:15.160 --> 01:28:17.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe it's just like a sense of adventure.
[01:28:17.560 --> 01:28:21.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's like, well, let's, Let's, you know, elect Conan the Barbarian and see what happens.
[01:28:21.440 --> 01:28:22.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, it's going to be fun.
[01:28:22.440 --> 01:28:24.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're all going to take a nice long ride into hell.
[01:28:24.980 --> 01:28:27.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, I guess there'll be some bonding going on.
[01:28:28.360 --> 01:28:36.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: But what has happened is a lot more ominous, in my view, than all of Reagan-Bush put together.
[01:28:36.440 --> 01:28:41.240]  [SPEAKER_02]: Because here you have, for the first time, Congress being controlled by Republicans.
[01:28:41.240 --> 01:28:43.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: First time in something like 40 years.
[01:28:43.940 --> 01:28:48.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: And if Clinton loses the next election, you don't know what's going to happen.
[01:28:49.160 --> 01:28:52.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, basically, anything Jesse Helms wants, Jesse Helms will get.
[01:28:52.660 --> 01:28:56.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: Anything Al D'Amato wants, you know, these guys will be running the most powerful country in the world.
[01:28:57.820 --> 01:28:59.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it's going to be interesting.
[01:29:00.020 --> 01:29:03.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, let's try one of those phone numbers again, and then we'll take a couple more phone calls.
[01:29:03.520 --> 01:29:05.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: Um, all right.
[01:29:05.500 --> 01:29:06.040]  [SPEAKER_02]: Do we have a dial tone?
[01:29:06.280 --> 01:29:06.780]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[01:29:08.960 --> 01:29:11.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: Searching for interesting recordings.
[01:29:14.680 --> 01:29:16.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're going to have to enter our special code there.
[01:29:20.220 --> 01:29:21.120]  [SPEAKER_25]: We're sorry.
[01:29:21.380 --> 01:29:24.940]  [SPEAKER_25]: Your call cannot be completed with the access code you dialed.
[01:29:25.060 --> 01:29:29.300]  [SPEAKER_25]: Please check the code and dial again, or ask your long-distance company for assistance.
[01:29:30.380 --> 01:29:31.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[01:29:31.280 --> 01:29:36.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's your standard long-distance access code thing.
[01:29:37.080 --> 01:29:38.260]  [SPEAKER_27]: Now, I'm confused.
[01:29:38.420 --> 01:29:38.640]  [SPEAKER_27]: All right.
[01:29:38.780 --> 01:29:40.760]  [SPEAKER_27]: Was that from the number we called, or was that...
[01:29:40.760 --> 01:29:44.980]  [SPEAKER_02]: No, that was the number we called, because if you recall, the one below that gave us that 950 recording.
[01:29:45.200 --> 01:29:45.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[01:29:45.720 --> 01:29:46.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, um...
[01:29:46.340 --> 01:29:48.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let me go one above that and see if we get something similar.
[01:29:51.620 --> 01:29:59.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: And again, for those of you that want to join the fun, all of this can be found in the, um...
[01:30:00.340 --> 01:30:03.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: 916 exchange in the 201 area code.
[01:30:05.240 --> 01:30:06.060]  [SPEAKER_25]: We're sorry.
[01:30:06.320 --> 01:30:11.720]  [SPEAKER_25]: The long-distance company access code you dialed must be preceded by the digits 950.
[01:30:12.300 --> 01:30:14.400]  [SPEAKER_25]: Please hang up and try your call again.
[01:30:14.980 --> 01:30:18.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: See, that's the exact opposite of the recording we got before.
[01:30:18.160 --> 01:30:19.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: That recording said, don't dial 950.
[01:30:19.760 --> 01:30:21.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: This recording says, do dial 950.
[01:30:21.200 --> 01:30:22.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: I've never gotten that.
[01:30:22.360 --> 01:30:24.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't know how you would get that recording.
[01:30:24.380 --> 01:30:25.220]  [SPEAKER_02]: I really don't.
[01:30:25.700 --> 01:30:35.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: But, uh, yeah, if you check out, uh, 916 exchange in the 201 area code, 9914 through 9937, you'll get all kinds of interesting recordings.
[01:30:35.280 --> 01:30:37.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe some other parts of that exchange, too.
[01:30:37.780 --> 01:30:38.820]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, let's take some phone calls.
[01:30:38.900 --> 01:30:39.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening.
[01:30:39.280 --> 01:30:39.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're on.
[01:30:40.200 --> 01:30:40.620]  [SPEAKER_21]: Uh, hi.
[01:30:40.800 --> 01:30:41.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: How you doing?
[01:30:41.620 --> 01:31:00.700]  [SPEAKER_21]: Yeah, uh, I was just wondering, uh, what you had to say or, uh, advice, uh, opinions, whatever, uh, for people who are not necessarily, uh, you know, in, in the 20th century, but nevertheless know who Emmanuel Goldstein really is and that kind of thing.
[01:31:01.180 --> 01:31:01.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: Wait, wait.
[01:31:01.720 --> 01:31:27.160]  [SPEAKER_21]: For example, like with NYNEX, one of your favorite topics, uh, when I, uh, moved to where I, uh, live currently, uh, I had some crossed lines, apparently, uh, when the phone was put in, uh, uh, calls that I was receiving, I simply did not receive, and calls that were being made from some local attorney were being billed to my number.
[01:31:27.800 --> 01:31:40.200]  [SPEAKER_21]: So I had about 150 calls, uh, a couple of which were to other states and, uh, you know, and, and even the relatively local ones, the counties that I had never made.
[01:31:40.400 --> 01:31:43.280]  [SPEAKER_21]: So I called NYNEX, asked them about it.
[01:31:43.280 --> 01:31:51.440]  [SPEAKER_21]: They said, uh, okay, we'll send you, uh, uh, you know, a listing of the calls, and you circle the calls you claim you didn't make, and we'll, we'll take care of it.
[01:31:51.900 --> 01:31:53.200]  [SPEAKER_21]: So they sent me a list.
[01:31:53.680 --> 01:31:55.840]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, they acknowledged there were crossed wires.
[01:31:56.200 --> 01:31:59.080]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, I have a document saying they came out and fixed the crossed wires.
[01:31:59.760 --> 01:32:02.460]  [SPEAKER_21]: And so there were about 40 calls listed.
[01:32:03.300 --> 01:32:06.020]  [SPEAKER_21]: 30 were calls that I had not made.
[01:32:06.460 --> 01:32:08.520]  [SPEAKER_21]: And the following 10 were calls I had made.
[01:32:08.660 --> 01:32:10.720]  [SPEAKER_21]: It was, I didn't have to, like, you know, pick and choose.
[01:32:11.020 --> 01:32:12.440]  [SPEAKER_21]: They were straightforward.
[01:32:12.700 --> 01:32:14.280]  [SPEAKER_21]: After a certain date, they were all mine.
[01:32:14.720 --> 01:32:16.520]  [SPEAKER_21]: Prior to that, they were not calls I made.
[01:32:17.260 --> 01:32:19.280]  [SPEAKER_21]: So I, I, I called NYNEX.
[01:32:20.060 --> 01:32:23.080]  [SPEAKER_21]: And they told me, all right, we'll send you an itemized bill.
[01:32:23.860 --> 01:32:26.400]  [SPEAKER_21]: And, uh, itemized, uh, listing of the calls.
[01:32:26.920 --> 01:32:32.720]  [SPEAKER_21]: And as I say, there were about 40 calls, uh, as opposed to the 150 had been charged for.
[01:32:33.280 --> 01:32:37.360]  [SPEAKER_21]: Uh, so I called them and asked why there were only 40 listed.
[01:32:37.360 --> 01:32:41.640]  [SPEAKER_21]: They told me that if the calls are under three minutes, they're not on that list.
[01:32:42.040 --> 01:32:44.080]  [SPEAKER_21]: I said, well, okay, whatever.
[01:32:44.660 --> 01:32:47.160]  [SPEAKER_21]: And, uh, but there's also a couple of long distance calls.
[01:32:47.680 --> 01:32:50.080]  [SPEAKER_21]: So they, they owe me about 40, $45.
[01:32:51.000 --> 01:32:59.080]  [SPEAKER_21]: And so they said, well, all right, circle the calls, send them to, um, is so-and-so in, uh, appropriate enough, Valhalla, New York.
[01:32:59.200 --> 01:33:00.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's where that main operation is.
[01:33:00.740 --> 01:33:06.780]  [SPEAKER_21]: And I sent that in, never heard anything, and have made about a half dozen calls since then.
[01:33:07.360 --> 01:33:10.840]  [SPEAKER_21]: And I'm just, uh, you know, what I'm getting at for this type of problem.
[01:33:11.420 --> 01:33:16.780]  [SPEAKER_21]: Uh, if you're not a master solstice engineer over the phone, uh, who do you ask for?
[01:33:16.880 --> 01:33:20.140]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, I've asked for supervisors, and they say, well, there is no supervisor.
[01:33:20.400 --> 01:33:22.560]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, it's kind of like, you know, who's in charge here?
[01:33:22.700 --> 01:33:23.120]  [SPEAKER_21]: Aren't you?
[01:33:23.640 --> 01:33:23.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[01:33:24.000 --> 01:33:25.840]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, it's like, nobody's in charge.
[01:33:25.840 --> 01:33:28.660]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, this is, this is what I tell people to do.
[01:33:28.760 --> 01:33:46.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, if, if you call the 890-1100 number, um, which is what you're supposed to call for, um, for phone bills, uh, and you don't get through right away, uh, by right away, I mean within five minutes, uh, or if you keep getting hung up upon, or if you're nuts not getting a straight answer from anybody,
[01:33:46.580 --> 01:34:00.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: uh, just forget that and call the President's Hotline, which is open 24 hours, and they take more of an interest because they know if you don't get satisfaction from them, you're going to go to the next step, which is the Public Service Commission, and they can get into a lot of trouble from that.
[01:34:00.320 --> 01:34:04.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, again, the number for the President's Hotline is 800-722-2300.
[01:34:05.900 --> 01:34:08.340]  [SPEAKER_21]: 722, that's interesting, 2300.
[01:34:08.500 --> 01:34:15.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, call them, explain to them exactly what you explained to me, and, uh, And this is known officially as the President's Hotline.
[01:34:15.960 --> 01:34:16.400]  [SPEAKER_21]: Yeah, it's...
[01:34:16.800 --> 01:34:19.260]  [SPEAKER_21]: That's how whoever answers the phone would know it as.
[01:34:19.360 --> 01:34:20.240]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's what they call it.
[01:34:20.560 --> 01:34:31.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: And explain exactly what happened, and, you know, if they don't give you satisfaction, which, uh, you know, you're much more likely to get satisfaction from them, but if they don't, the next step is to go to the Public Service Commission, they're only open until 4.30,
[01:34:31.260 --> 01:34:34.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: though, and they're at 800-342-3377.
[01:34:35.340 --> 01:34:38.040]  [SPEAKER_21]: 800-342-3377.
[01:34:38.300 --> 01:34:39.100]  [SPEAKER_21]: 800-342-3377.
[01:34:39.580 --> 01:34:39.680]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[01:34:40.040 --> 01:34:50.220]  [SPEAKER_21]: And then, just to finish up and let someone else on here, uh, the, uh, you know, this is the type of thing people need, you know, you know, idiots like me who really don't know anything.
[01:34:50.540 --> 01:34:57.860]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, you know, a booklet, uh, a book, whatever, that kind of just gets into the basic lowdown.
[01:34:57.860 --> 01:35:08.200]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, and it can get kind of technical, if it wants to, but also kind of in the non-technical realm, or halfway in between, just saying, look, this is what a trunk line is.
[01:35:08.640 --> 01:35:12.620]  [SPEAKER_21]: This is what, you know, A-N-A, A-N-O means.
[01:35:13.100 --> 01:35:14.980]  [SPEAKER_21]: A-N-I, you know, all these things.
[01:35:15.160 --> 01:35:19.580]  [SPEAKER_21]: Just have it condensed into one book, and I'd imagine there'd be quite, I'd buy it.
[01:35:19.580 --> 01:35:27.740]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, something with just sort of, you know, you know, phone, phones and computers for idiots.
[01:35:28.140 --> 01:35:29.060]  [SPEAKER_21]: For complete idiots.
[01:35:29.640 --> 01:35:32.100]  [SPEAKER_21]: For intelligent, but ignorant people.
[01:35:32.800 --> 01:35:35.500]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, that, that's something that I would find very useful.
[01:35:35.660 --> 01:35:40.320]  [SPEAKER_21]: And I would imagine there's probably a couple million people in the country, not to mention outside the country.
[01:35:40.620 --> 01:35:40.960]  [SPEAKER_07]: Uh-huh.
[01:35:41.000 --> 01:35:42.880]  [SPEAKER_21]: You'd find something that got very useful.
[01:35:43.880 --> 01:35:44.360]  [SPEAKER_07]: I agree.
[01:35:44.480 --> 01:35:49.920]  [SPEAKER_21]: So that's something for you and your friend, who I'm glad is out of jail, to think about, I would guess.
[01:35:50.020 --> 01:35:51.820]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, maybe we'll put our heads together on something like this.
[01:35:51.880 --> 01:35:52.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, I do agree.
[01:35:52.900 --> 01:35:54.360]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think that there is a need for something like that.
[01:35:54.360 --> 01:36:00.460]  [SPEAKER_21]: No, because you pick up articles even in, you know, 2600 or whatever, and it's like, if you don't know what you're talking about, or they're talking about...
[01:36:00.460 --> 01:36:00.680]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[01:36:00.900 --> 01:36:02.160]  [SPEAKER_21]: ...it's, you know, it's all Greek to you.
[01:36:02.340 --> 01:36:02.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[01:36:02.560 --> 01:36:02.560]  Right.
[01:36:02.680 --> 01:36:04.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I mean, that sort of caters to a different audience.
[01:36:05.080 --> 01:36:07.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: Those are people that have already gotten to a certain step.
[01:36:07.700 --> 01:36:22.400]  [SPEAKER_21]: As I say, I would not be surprised if there were not quite a number of people who just like, you know, a basic primer, you know, might be kindergarten level to something like fiber optic, but it might be college level to people that don't know anything,
[01:36:23.000 --> 01:36:24.480]  [SPEAKER_21]: and including phone companies.
[01:36:24.960 --> 01:36:30.280]  [SPEAKER_21]: You know, just like what you told me, the president's hotline, you know, just lay it all out, you know, in a book.
[01:36:30.900 --> 01:36:31.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:36:31.300 --> 01:36:31.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:36:31.660 --> 01:36:34.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: Of course, keep in mind that these things are constantly changing.
[01:36:35.260 --> 01:36:35.760]  [SPEAKER_21]: Right, right.
[01:36:35.980 --> 01:36:36.440]  [SPEAKER_21]: Those are always changing.
[01:36:36.740 --> 01:36:43.760]  [SPEAKER_21]: It may be absolutely in maybe three months, but at least some of the fundamental ideas would remain sound.
[01:36:44.240 --> 01:36:44.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:36:44.700 --> 01:36:45.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: Listen, thanks for the suggestion.
[01:36:45.880 --> 01:36:46.160]  [SPEAKER_21]: Okay.
[01:36:46.360 --> 01:36:46.680]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thank you.
[01:36:46.840 --> 01:36:46.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[01:36:46.900 --> 01:36:47.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: Take care.
[01:36:47.320 --> 01:36:52.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Speaking of things always changing, Fiber, this is something that wasn't true when you went in, and now it's true.
[01:36:52.800 --> 01:36:53.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: No more New York telephone.
[01:36:54.400 --> 01:36:55.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's right.
[01:36:55.080 --> 01:36:55.880]  [SPEAKER_02]: NYNEX trucks everywhere.
[01:36:55.960 --> 01:36:56.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: What do you think?
[01:36:56.260 --> 01:36:58.420]  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it must look shockingly different to see all this.
[01:36:58.440 --> 01:37:05.880]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, I did see my first NYNEX truck yesterday, tell you the truth, it looks exactly the same, only it says NYNEX instead of New York telephone with a bell symbol.
[01:37:06.100 --> 01:37:27.340]  [SPEAKER_27]: But when I went away, I was aware that various of the regional bell operating companies were consolidating and financially were referring to themselves as regional holding companies as opposed to regional bell operating companies, though they still technically use the same old term since it was so well known.
[01:37:27.340 --> 01:37:29.060]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, you can say R-Bach, you can't say...
[01:37:29.060 --> 01:37:30.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right, you can't say R-Hook.
[01:37:31.080 --> 01:37:32.860]  [SPEAKER_02]: No, it just doesn't have that ring to it.
[01:37:33.660 --> 01:37:34.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right, let's take another phone call.
[01:37:34.880 --> 01:37:35.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening, you're on.
[01:37:36.760 --> 01:37:38.140]  [SPEAKER_09]: Hello, I kind of called again.
[01:37:38.280 --> 01:37:41.180]  [SPEAKER_09]: The fellow was looking for, like, phone systems for idiots type of book.
[01:37:41.280 --> 01:37:41.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[01:37:43.420 --> 01:37:47.720]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's something I had gotten from a friend of mine, engineering and operations in a bell system.
[01:37:47.720 --> 01:37:50.480]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, I have that book myself, only...
[01:37:50.480 --> 01:37:54.120]  [SPEAKER_27]: I think that goes well above and beyond the idiot level.
[01:37:54.960 --> 01:37:55.640]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, it does.
[01:37:55.880 --> 01:37:57.880]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, it even, I mean, it goes to the history.
[01:37:58.240 --> 01:38:00.520]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's great telephone trivia to start with.
[01:38:00.660 --> 01:38:01.820]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right, definitely so.
[01:38:02.140 --> 01:38:08.580]  [SPEAKER_09]: That's why I've basically, you know, primed myself before I came in contact with the 2600 and you guys.
[01:38:10.160 --> 01:38:13.760]  [SPEAKER_02]: It's a good introduction for some people, but others might find it a bit intimidating.
[01:38:14.080 --> 01:38:14.800]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah, it is.
[01:38:14.800 --> 01:38:19.860]  [SPEAKER_27]: I mean, it's a big textbook and there's lots of acronyms and terms.
[01:38:20.080 --> 01:38:39.700]  [SPEAKER_27]: And, I mean, while it is a really great book to read for the history of how and when they developed various things that they did, I think it's probably still too highly technical in that there should be a book that simply explains really simple and common acronyms and just ground-level stuff.
[01:38:40.100 --> 01:38:40.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I agree.
[01:38:41.040 --> 01:38:41.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for the call.
[01:38:41.740 --> 01:38:42.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: Definitely.
[01:38:42.180 --> 01:38:42.340]  Bye.
[01:38:42.340 --> 01:38:53.140]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think also that book should be from a hacker perspective only because we seem to have a true appreciation for these things, you know, in kind of our semi-mischievous way of looking at it all.
[01:38:53.880 --> 01:38:56.020]  [SPEAKER_02]: That sort of speaks to human nature.
[01:38:56.460 --> 01:39:01.200]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, we don't want to be just filled with rules and regulations.
[01:39:01.500 --> 01:39:03.480]  [SPEAKER_02]: We want to know what's really going on.
[01:39:03.780 --> 01:39:05.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, how does it really work?
[01:39:05.420 --> 01:39:06.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: What happens if you do this?
[01:39:06.400 --> 01:39:07.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: What's the worst thing that can possibly happen?
[01:39:08.440 --> 01:39:10.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: You know, how flimsy is this system?
[01:39:10.320 --> 01:39:11.780]  [SPEAKER_02]: How incompetent are the people running it?
[01:39:11.860 --> 01:39:12.700]  [SPEAKER_02]: Things like that, you know?
[01:39:13.180 --> 01:39:14.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: Because deep down, we all understand that.
[01:39:15.580 --> 01:39:16.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening.
[01:39:16.180 --> 01:39:16.440]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're on.
[01:39:16.940 --> 01:39:17.280]  [SPEAKER_23]: Hello.
[01:39:17.620 --> 01:39:17.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: How are you doing?
[01:39:18.300 --> 01:39:21.440]  [SPEAKER_23]: Yeah, I would like to know that I have someone going on my line in the basement.
[01:39:21.600 --> 01:39:23.400]  [SPEAKER_23]: How would I get a device to detect that?
[01:39:24.760 --> 01:39:29.780]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, a lot of phones these days will light up if somebody picks up an extension, unless, of course...
[01:39:29.780 --> 01:39:38.160]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, even if they disconnect your line from the actual line coming in, your phone will light up if it's either unplugged or in use.
[01:39:39.220 --> 01:39:40.600]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's the simplest way.
[01:39:40.980 --> 01:39:42.780]  [SPEAKER_02]: There are other more complex things you can do.
[01:39:42.940 --> 01:39:43.700]  [SPEAKER_23]: I don't have a phone.
[01:39:43.800 --> 01:39:45.340]  [SPEAKER_23]: It beeps when they hang up.
[01:39:45.580 --> 01:39:46.080]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, yeah.
[01:39:46.220 --> 01:39:47.460]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's basically the same thing.
[01:39:47.600 --> 01:39:49.200]  [SPEAKER_23]: Not when they hook on.
[01:39:49.240 --> 01:39:49.920]  [SPEAKER_23]: It's when they hang up.
[01:39:50.080 --> 01:39:51.920]  [SPEAKER_02]: It does beep a little bit, probably.
[01:39:52.380 --> 01:39:53.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: You probably just don't hear it.
[01:39:53.820 --> 01:39:54.000]  [SPEAKER_23]: Yeah.
[01:39:54.000 --> 01:39:56.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: That's the voltage change there.
[01:39:56.680 --> 01:39:58.020]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, it may or may not.
[01:39:58.240 --> 01:40:02.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I don't know if Radio Shack sells something like this, but I know what other companies do.
[01:40:03.160 --> 01:40:04.460]  [SPEAKER_23]: A voltage change is the same.
[01:40:04.760 --> 01:40:06.460]  [SPEAKER_23]: A device for a voltage change?
[01:40:06.940 --> 01:40:07.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: Yeah.
[01:40:07.560 --> 01:40:12.980]  [SPEAKER_27]: I mean, simply something that, say, might light up when somebody picks up an extension.
[01:40:12.980 --> 01:40:15.980]  [SPEAKER_27]: There's lots of little doodads that accomplish that purpose.
[01:40:16.360 --> 01:40:34.020]  [SPEAKER_27]: Although, again, it would be difficult if somebody, like Emmanuel said, if somebody was in your basement and they removed your wires from the terminals themselves in the junction box and then clipped on, I mean, you know, any extensions in your house simply aren't connected anymore,
[01:40:34.020 --> 01:40:36.040]  [SPEAKER_27]: so you're not going to be able to detect anything.
[01:40:36.160 --> 01:40:41.000]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, when that happens on the phones I have, the phone will light up, indicating there's no phone line attached.
[01:40:41.180 --> 01:40:41.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh, okay.
[01:40:41.720 --> 01:40:42.540]  [SPEAKER_02]: So that will tell you something.
[01:40:42.620 --> 01:40:47.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: But you should also know that the phone company itself does tests on your line, which will cause that very thing.
[01:40:47.700 --> 01:40:49.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: It will cause your phone to either light up or make a chirping sound.
[01:40:50.640 --> 01:40:51.000]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[01:40:51.000 --> 01:41:02.980]  [SPEAKER_27]: Every couple of days, or sometimes daily, there's a system called Predictor used by Ninex that, usually really late at night, it makes the rounds through...
[01:41:02.980 --> 01:41:10.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: There's about half a dozen to a dozen Predictor computers that handle probably all in New York State.
[01:41:11.160 --> 01:41:19.160]  [SPEAKER_27]: And what they do is that they'd systematically test each and every phone line sequentially, one by one.
[01:41:20.040 --> 01:41:24.280]  [SPEAKER_27]: And what it'll do is, well, it uses a system called mechanized loop testing.
[01:41:24.480 --> 01:41:28.660]  [SPEAKER_27]: And it'll automatically test all these lines that it has basically jurisdiction over.
[01:41:29.300 --> 01:41:35.080]  [SPEAKER_27]: And any faults that it finds, like a short in the line or anything at all, it'll make a note of it.
[01:41:35.080 --> 01:41:46.380]  [SPEAKER_27]: And if anyone out there has ever been suspicious of maybe they saw a New York telephone or a Ninex employee up on the telephone pole servicing their line or possibly...
[01:41:46.380 --> 01:41:46.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: At four in the morning.
[01:41:47.060 --> 01:41:47.240]  [SPEAKER_27]: Right.
[01:41:47.380 --> 01:41:54.220]  [SPEAKER_27]: Or even somebody showing up at your doorstep saying that they're going to be doing some maintenance work and you never called them.
[01:41:54.340 --> 01:41:54.960]  [SPEAKER_27]: That's the reason.
[01:41:54.960 --> 01:41:57.580]  [SPEAKER_27]: It was because some fault was automatically detected.
[01:41:58.660 --> 01:42:03.640]  [SPEAKER_23]: Now, this is because my phone calls have been, you know, I had long-distance calls, which was my calls.
[01:42:03.940 --> 01:42:04.300]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[01:42:04.500 --> 01:42:06.220]  [SPEAKER_23]: I'm getting more calls than I make.
[01:42:06.440 --> 01:42:08.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it's not necessarily somebody in your basement.
[01:42:08.640 --> 01:42:12.940]  [SPEAKER_02]: Lots of times a phone company messes up and just wires you into another house.
[01:42:13.120 --> 01:42:14.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: That just happened to a friend of mine.
[01:42:14.580 --> 01:42:18.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: He had somebody else's phone show up in his house.
[01:42:18.500 --> 01:42:23.080]  [SPEAKER_02]: And the way to tell right away, of course, is to dial the ANAC number, which in our area is 958.
[01:42:23.160 --> 01:42:24.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: That'll tell you what your phone number is.
[01:42:24.520 --> 01:42:29.340]  [SPEAKER_02]: If he didn't know that number, though, he would just merrily go on making long-distance phone calls on someone else's bill.
[01:42:29.940 --> 01:42:38.900]  [SPEAKER_27]: Well, the question is, too, I mean, you could usually tell if someone is actually using your line for fraudulent purposes by clipping on in your basement or whatever the case may be.
[01:42:39.300 --> 01:42:42.140]  [SPEAKER_27]: You can usually tell by where the phone calls are, too.
[01:42:42.360 --> 01:42:52.340]  [SPEAKER_27]: If you're noticing lots of calls to South America or the Caribbean or strange places in Africa or Asia, you know that somebody's doing it for fraudulent intentions.
[01:42:52.640 --> 01:42:54.000]  [SPEAKER_23]: But they make local calls, though.
[01:42:54.000 --> 01:42:56.160]  [SPEAKER_27]: You can make local calls for fraudulent purposes, too.
[01:42:56.700 --> 01:43:06.360]  [SPEAKER_27]: That's true, but it's usually less of a problem than if someone is, you know, if you're literally getting hundreds of dollars worth of calls tacked onto your bill.
[01:43:06.600 --> 01:43:10.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: Listen, this is an interesting discussion, but we're going to have to cut it short because we're out of time.
[01:43:10.300 --> 01:43:10.720]  [SPEAKER_02]: We're out of time.
[01:43:10.720 --> 01:43:12.220]  [SPEAKER_02]: I can't believe all this time went by so quickly.
[01:43:12.380 --> 01:43:12.500]  [SPEAKER_02]: Wow.
[01:43:12.500 --> 01:43:15.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: An extra 45 minutes, but it still went extremely fast.
[01:43:16.800 --> 01:43:18.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, again, I want to say welcome back, Fiber.
[01:43:19.100 --> 01:43:22.180]  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure everybody listening right now wants to say the same thing.
[01:43:23.700 --> 01:43:29.900]  [SPEAKER_02]: And hopefully, we'll see you here every week, you know, answering all kinds of questions and being a part of this all over again.
[01:43:30.920 --> 01:43:34.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: And, I don't know, any final words before we turn it over?
[01:43:34.640 --> 01:43:37.200]  [SPEAKER_27]: All I can say, again, is that it's really great to be back.
[01:43:37.520 --> 01:43:39.660]  [SPEAKER_27]: And I look forward to being here weeks in the future.
[01:43:40.560 --> 01:43:40.800]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[01:43:41.080 --> 01:43:43.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, it's good to have you back in the flesh.
[01:43:43.640 --> 01:43:46.120]  [SPEAKER_02]: So, we'll see you in future weeks.
[01:43:46.120 --> 01:43:49.580]  [SPEAKER_02]: We'll be back again next week for our regular time slot, 10 to 11 p.m.
[01:43:49.960 --> 01:43:51.100]  [SPEAKER_02]: Robert Knight's up next.
[01:43:51.120 --> 01:43:52.620]  [SPEAKER_02]: This is WBAI in New York.
[01:43:52.920 --> 01:43:53.960]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks, everybody, for listening.
[01:43:54.180 --> 01:43:57.280]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for supporting us as we went through this difficult ordeal.
[01:43:57.980 --> 01:43:59.260]  [SPEAKER_02]: Let's now look to the future.
[01:44:09.190 --> 01:44:30.610]  [SPEAKER_13]: The telephone keeps ringing So, I ripped it off the wall I cut myself while shaving Now, I can't make a cough It couldn't get much worse But if they could, they would But they'll be born for the best Expect the worst I hope that's understood But they'll be born
[01:44:54.700 --> 01:45:02.940]  [SPEAKER_12]: Thanksgiving is here and that means many of you will be home this Thursday morning to listen to Tahrir, Voices of the Arrow World
[01:45:11.970 --> 01:45:14.230]  [SPEAKER_12]: And what will we cook this week?
[01:45:14.470 --> 01:45:27.750]  [SPEAKER_12]: Well, besides two of Barbara Nimri Aziz's favorite vegetarian recipes, we'll have a special for teachers and children, a visit with Audrey Shabbas at a recent Patterson School district workshop.
[01:45:28.050 --> 01:45:33.210]  [SPEAKER_12]: So join me, Barbara Nimri Aziz, your host, every Thursday at 9 a.m.
[01:45:33.210 --> 01:45:40.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: for Tough Rear on WBAI 99.5 FM listener-sponsored radio in New York.
[01:45:47.590 --> 01:45:48.310]  All
[01:46:03.980 --> 01:46:07.340]  [SPEAKER_16]: Grenadians are left to come out and defend our country.
[01:46:07.760 --> 01:46:12.160]  [SPEAKER_16]: United States paratroopers have invaded Grenada with helicopters, gunships.
[01:46:12.180 --> 01:46:16.380]  [SPEAKER_16]: Canadian people are out and obstruct the enemy's progress.
[01:46:16.380 --> 01:46:21.200]  [SPEAKER_16]: Grenadian people are asked to block all roads and obstruct the enemy's progress.
[01:46:21.500 --> 01:46:22.080]  [SPEAKER_16]: Grenadians...
[01:46:22.080 --> 01:46:45.900]  [SPEAKER_01]: In commemoration of the 11th anniversary of the invasion of Grenada, the Midnight Ravens presents Invasion 201, directed and starring Ronald Reagan, George Bush, Eugenia Charles, with a cast of thousands, script written and produced by the Pentagon, coming on WBAI 99.5 FM on Friday,
[01:46:46.400 --> 01:46:52.960]  [SPEAKER_01]: November 25th, from midnight to 3 a.m., Invasion 201, coming soon.
[01:46:55.760 --> 01:46:59.720]  [SPEAKER_20]: The Midnight Ravens, where every show is a special.
[01:47:24.110 --> 01:47:31.650]  [SPEAKER_19]: WBAI presents the Mighty Sparrow Calypso King of the World in concert one night only, December 2nd at 8 p.m.
[01:47:32.030 --> 01:47:33.650]  [SPEAKER_19]: We're Ferris Mooth Hall.