Off The Hook - 1998-04-07

[00:01.160 --> 00:02.340]  [SPEAKER_09]: Hey, what's the time?
[00:02.540 --> 00:03.200]  [SPEAKER_09]: 8 o'clock.
[00:03.440 --> 00:03.960]  [SPEAKER_09]: You sure?
[00:04.240 --> 00:04.850]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, I'm sure.
[00:04.980 --> 00:05.960]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's 8 o'clock Wednesday.
[00:06.280 --> 00:07.860]  [SPEAKER_09]: I thought it was later than that.
[00:08.040 --> 00:09.260]  [SPEAKER_09]: It was, but not anymore.
[00:09.600 --> 00:13.260]  [SPEAKER_09]: You better be here at 8 o'clock Wednesday night for the Personal Computer Show.
[00:13.540 --> 00:18.990]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm Joe King, and I'd like you all to join me on the Personal Computer Show Wednesday nights from 8 to 9.
[00:19.490 --> 00:24.020]  [SPEAKER_12]: Hey, Keith, Dave Burstein, and I will be doing the same show we've been doing for the last decade or so.
[00:24.200 --> 00:26.220]  [SPEAKER_12]: News from the world of hardware and software.
[00:26.830 --> 00:28.300]  [SPEAKER_12]: Reviews of the latest and greatest.
[00:28.900 --> 00:30.540]  [SPEAKER_12]: Interviews with the folk who make all this work.
[00:30.560 --> 00:34.180]  [SPEAKER_12]: And most important of all, calls from you in the audience.
[00:34.480 --> 00:38.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: We'll try to answer your questions about computers and the problems you're having with them.
[00:38.560 --> 00:39.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: So please tune in.
[00:39.980 --> 00:52.180]  [SPEAKER_12]: Whether you use a Mac or an IBM, or you don't even use a computer, there'll be something for you on the Personal Computer Show, here on WBAI 99.5 FM, from 8 to 9, every Wednesday night.
[00:58.140 --> 01:02.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes, but it's not Wednesday, it's Tuesday, and it's 8 o'clock, which means it's time for...
[01:03.120 --> 01:04.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: Off the hook.
[01:07.660 --> 01:12.020]  [SPEAKER_15]: The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
[01:12.940 --> 01:17.320]  [SPEAKER_15]: I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a call.
[01:18.110 --> 01:20.060]  [SPEAKER_15]: I couldn't get much worse,
[01:26.550 --> 01:28.690]  [SPEAKER_07]: hope that's understood, but make me...
[02:20.620 --> 02:22.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: And a very good evening to you, one and all.
[02:22.740 --> 02:24.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is Emmanuel Goldstein here in New York.
[02:24.720 --> 02:25.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: Excuse me.
[02:25.380 --> 02:26.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: And Bernie S.
[02:26.480 --> 02:27.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: over there in Philadelphia.
[02:29.480 --> 02:32.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, on hold in Philadelphia.
[02:32.220 --> 02:33.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: Bernie, you're there live now, right?
[02:34.000 --> 02:34.920]  [SPEAKER_04]: Now I'm here, yes.
[02:34.920 --> 02:35.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, I'm sorry about that.
[02:35.920 --> 02:47.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: We had quite an experience over the weekend at the micro-broadcasting convention, and we certainly have that to talk about and to bring folks up to date on, because there's all kinds of interesting things happening now and on the horizon.
[02:49.140 --> 02:53.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, of course, we had some fun and adventures with our friends over at Sprint PCS.
[02:53.780 --> 02:56.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: In fact, that is still going on right now.
[02:57.420 --> 03:04.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: You may not know it, but all kinds of exciting things are happening involving Sprint PCS, some of which, Bernie, you do not know about.
[03:05.580 --> 03:05.980]  [SPEAKER_04]: Wow.
[03:06.120 --> 03:09.840]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, I'm talking to you over Sprint PCS right now, so that's apropos.
[03:10.080 --> 03:17.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, well, we'll try to be careful as to what we do, but I guarantee you, by the end of tonight, there's going to be a bit of mayhem down there.
[03:17.940 --> 03:18.380]  [SPEAKER_16]: Uh-oh.
[03:18.640 --> 03:18.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[03:20.120 --> 03:23.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: They're not going to like the things that we come up with on this particular show.
[03:24.000 --> 03:25.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, now, we had...
[03:25.540 --> 03:37.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: I suppose we might as well dive into it first by telling what happened with the, I guess, daylight savings thing that took place this weekend.
[03:37.180 --> 03:43.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: As many of you know, daylight savings time happened, and that, of course, causes all kinds of problems for people in the technological world.
[03:44.220 --> 03:48.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I'm still walking around finding clocks I didn't know I had, microwave oven clocks, fax machine clocks.
[03:48.740 --> 03:50.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, they all have to be changed at some point.
[03:51.000 --> 03:52.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, in the car, there's a clock.
[03:53.120 --> 03:55.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, and the computers are smart.
[03:55.800 --> 03:57.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: The computers know to change at a certain time and date.
[03:58.640 --> 04:01.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: They just take care of it automatically, and they let you know sometimes.
[04:01.740 --> 04:02.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hey, I took care of this.
[04:02.820 --> 04:03.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: You don't have to worry about it.
[04:03.980 --> 04:10.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: Which is great, except in the case of Windows 95 in the fall, when, for some reason, they decide to, um...
[04:10.760 --> 04:16.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: At 2 o'clock, it says, I've changed the time to 1 o'clock, as I'm supposed to, because daylight savings time no longer exists.
[04:17.120 --> 04:21.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: And then at 2 o'clock, when the second 2 o'clock comes around, it does it again.
[04:22.260 --> 04:25.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: And it causes more problems when it does that.
[04:25.760 --> 04:26.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: It doesn't do it a third time.
[04:26.620 --> 04:27.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: It only does it twice.
[04:28.500 --> 04:31.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: But that doesn't happen in the spring, because the clocks move ahead.
[04:31.060 --> 04:41.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, we decided, since we have Sprint PCS phones, that it would be fun to see how they changed.
[04:41.480 --> 04:50.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: Because, as we've said before on this show, that the clock is set not by the user, but by the network.
[04:50.500 --> 04:59.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: So when you see the time on your phone, it's coming directly from the Sprint PCS switch, which I guess, you know, you get the time for free, I guess.
[05:00.020 --> 05:02.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, they should maybe promote that.
[05:02.700 --> 05:04.120]  [SPEAKER_04]: And a free clock with every phone.
[05:04.240 --> 05:04.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: Free clock, yes.
[05:05.060 --> 05:06.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: And a free date, too, whatever you call that.
[05:06.860 --> 05:08.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: You always know what date it is.
[05:08.420 --> 05:10.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: In some cases, you know, the day, too.
[05:10.080 --> 05:11.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't get the day of the week, because I have a cheapo phone.
[05:11.800 --> 05:12.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: But you get the day of the week, I believe.
[05:13.420 --> 05:13.700]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[05:13.820 --> 05:14.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: So you know today is Tuesday.
[05:15.200 --> 05:15.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: I do.
[05:15.740 --> 05:16.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I don't.
[05:17.240 --> 05:18.080]  [SPEAKER_04]: It must be Belgium.
[05:18.860 --> 05:19.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[05:19.460 --> 05:22.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: So the thing is, we thought, what's going to happen at 2 o'clock?
[05:22.200 --> 05:24.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's going to go from 1.59 to 3.
[05:25.300 --> 05:27.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: And we thought it would be kind of cool to find out.
[05:27.260 --> 05:28.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, Bernie, why don't you tell us what happened?
[05:29.080 --> 05:31.140]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, we stayed up entirely too late.
[05:31.760 --> 05:36.100]  [SPEAKER_04]: You know we've got nothing better to do if you stay up late to watch the clocks change on your PCS phone.
[05:36.220 --> 05:38.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: I have to say, we got all kinds of looks from the people down there.
[05:38.260 --> 05:42.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, you know, there's plenty of strange people that go to a micro-broadcasting convention, you know, that run pirate radio stations.
[05:43.020 --> 05:46.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: But I think we were stranger than they were because of the things we were doing, you know, with phones.
[05:47.760 --> 05:49.200]  [SPEAKER_04]: So we stayed up way too late.
[05:50.540 --> 05:57.960]  [SPEAKER_04]: Actually, we called for PCS first to ask them how this was going to work, to find out if they had anticipated such a thing.
[05:58.360 --> 06:07.160]  [SPEAKER_04]: Or whether they were as blindsided as some of these mainframe operators are as far as the year 2000 bug or whatever lies around the corner.
[06:07.520 --> 06:24.640]  [SPEAKER_04]: But she assured me, this female representative at Sprint PCS, she assured me that it was all taken care of and that at exactly 2 a.m., my PCS handset would reflect Eastern Daylight Savings Time.
[06:24.940 --> 06:30.500]  [SPEAKER_04]: So I was excited to see my clock turn backwards at 2 a.m.
[06:31.380 --> 06:32.400]  [SPEAKER_04]: So we stayed up.
[06:35.480 --> 06:37.640]  [SPEAKER_04]: And we were quite disappointed.
[06:40.000 --> 06:40.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[06:40.720 --> 06:41.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, there's more to the story.
[06:43.140 --> 06:45.180]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, 2 o'clock came and went.
[06:45.620 --> 06:47.940]  [SPEAKER_04]: And we called and called back.
[06:48.340 --> 06:51.840]  [SPEAKER_04]: And they said, well, maybe it'll happen later this night.
[06:54.100 --> 06:56.540]  [SPEAKER_04]: And, you know, we waited another hour.
[06:56.760 --> 07:00.940]  [SPEAKER_04]: We thought, well, maybe they have it done by Central Time.
[07:02.340 --> 07:06.540]  [SPEAKER_04]: So we thought that's where their representative we talked to was in Texas.
[07:06.740 --> 07:08.820]  [SPEAKER_04]: So we thought, well, maybe Central Time.
[07:09.160 --> 07:10.500]  [SPEAKER_04]: Is that Central Time, Texas?
[07:11.220 --> 07:12.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: I believe it is, yes.
[07:12.680 --> 07:12.980]  [SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
[07:13.080 --> 07:15.180]  [SPEAKER_04]: So we figured, well, maybe it's where their headquarters is.
[07:15.260 --> 07:17.120]  [SPEAKER_04]: And she couldn't tell me where their main computer was.
[07:17.760 --> 07:19.220]  [SPEAKER_04]: It just surprised me.
[07:19.980 --> 07:22.000]  [SPEAKER_04]: But anyhow, we waited until Central Time.
[07:22.100 --> 07:23.100]  [SPEAKER_04]: 3 o'clock came and went.
[07:23.300 --> 07:24.380]  [SPEAKER_04]: And nothing.
[07:25.120 --> 07:26.880]  [SPEAKER_04]: So actually, the clock would have jumped forward.
[07:26.980 --> 07:27.820]  [SPEAKER_04]: That's what we were looking for.
[07:27.940 --> 07:28.560]  [SPEAKER_04]: But it didn't happen.
[07:29.120 --> 07:31.340]  [SPEAKER_04]: But, well, finally, we were just too tired and we went to sleep.
[07:31.780 --> 07:37.040]  [SPEAKER_04]: While I was on the phone, though, I asked him some other questions about some other service problems that you and I and other people were experiencing.
[07:37.040 --> 07:39.580]  [SPEAKER_04]: But maybe we should jump to that topic shortly.
[07:42.240 --> 07:45.720]  [SPEAKER_04]: So Monday, or I'm sorry, Sunday morning, was it?
[07:46.580 --> 07:50.060]  [SPEAKER_04]: We awoke to find that our clock still had not changed.
[07:52.940 --> 07:55.800]  [SPEAKER_04]: And was it the same way with your Omnipoint handset, or had that changed?
[07:55.940 --> 07:57.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, Omnipoint is controlled by the user.
[07:57.680 --> 07:58.920]  [SPEAKER_04]: Ah, okay.
[07:59.460 --> 08:05.940]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, anyhow, I called Sprint PCS back, and they said, well, reboot your phone.
[08:07.560 --> 08:10.440]  [SPEAKER_04]: And rebooted the phone, and then it reflected the correct time.
[08:10.620 --> 08:16.180]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, what puzzles me is if the system clock is controlled by...
[08:16.180 --> 08:22.380]  [SPEAKER_04]: controlled and kept timely by the central computer, by the network, then why was it not reflected?
[08:22.640 --> 08:24.520]  [SPEAKER_04]: They were at a loss to explain this to me.
[08:25.440 --> 08:34.360]  [SPEAKER_04]: But I do have the correct time now, albeit it's a few seconds off compared to National Bureau of Standards, which I can tune into at 10 megahertz on my shortwave radio.
[08:34.640 --> 08:35.280]  [SPEAKER_04]: Have you noticed that?
[08:36.560 --> 08:37.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: I have not.
[08:37.900 --> 08:43.220]  [SPEAKER_04]: They're two or three seconds off, according to the government's atomic clock in Fort Collins, Colorado.
[08:43.220 --> 08:45.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: I never really checked that closely.
[08:46.540 --> 08:48.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: I figure it's close enough, you know.
[08:48.160 --> 08:49.000]  [SPEAKER_04]: You know me.
[08:49.620 --> 08:50.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes, I do.
[08:52.180 --> 08:54.200]  [SPEAKER_04]: So, anyhow, I don't know.
[08:54.200 --> 08:55.220]  [SPEAKER_04]: I don't think it was that big a deal.
[08:55.360 --> 09:07.960]  [SPEAKER_04]: But, you know, if I had an important meeting in the morning and was relying upon my supposedly always trustworthy clock on my Sprint PCS handset, I would have been late for that appointment.
[09:08.220 --> 09:08.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh, yeah.
[09:09.160 --> 09:12.600]  [SPEAKER_04]: And as it was, we were late about an hour to the...
[09:12.600 --> 09:17.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, the reason we were late an hour is because we stayed up all night trying to see what would happen to the stupid phone.
[09:17.960 --> 09:18.880]  [SPEAKER_04]: So it's still Sprint's fault.
[09:19.120 --> 09:19.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[09:20.940 --> 09:21.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[09:21.500 --> 09:28.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, actually, I have to confess, I was away just now because I have a special 800...
[09:28.060 --> 09:30.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: I still call the 800 numbers, even though they're 888 numbers.
[09:30.280 --> 09:32.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: But this is a 888 number that I want to call.
[09:32.440 --> 09:36.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: And the only way I had recorded it was by calling it before on my Sprint PCS phone.
[09:36.860 --> 09:39.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: But I apparently made more than 10 calls coming in here.
[09:40.060 --> 09:41.020]  [SPEAKER_08]: And you lost the number.
[09:41.080 --> 09:42.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: And it just scrolled right off the screen.
[09:42.640 --> 09:44.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I had to sort of go into my brain and find it again.
[09:44.940 --> 09:45.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: And fortunately, I just did.
[09:46.340 --> 09:48.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I really didn't hear anything you just said.
[09:49.340 --> 09:53.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: Did you get into the scientific explanation that the Sprint representatives gave us?
[09:53.860 --> 09:54.820]  [SPEAKER_04]: About the time issue?
[09:55.160 --> 09:57.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, about the time and about the satellites and things like that.
[09:57.240 --> 09:58.640]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, no, I didn't get into that.
[09:58.780 --> 10:01.440]  [SPEAKER_04]: I said that that was a topic we should discuss after the time issue.
[10:01.520 --> 10:17.360]  [SPEAKER_04]: But when I called the night before Fox were to move ahead forward an hour, I also brought up that I've been having some service problems the past few weeks, as you have and other people I've talked to, who I told them how great Sprint PCS is, and now it's not.
[10:17.460 --> 10:21.440]  [SPEAKER_04]: And I'm looking like an utter fool for recommending a service that's no longer reliable.
[10:21.640 --> 10:25.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, people somehow blame us, you know, when we recommend something and then it goes bad.
[10:25.660 --> 10:32.300]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, people look to me and you and other people in this circle for advice for this sort of stuff.
[10:32.460 --> 10:37.120]  [SPEAKER_04]: And then when things change up on us, we look bad.
[10:37.320 --> 10:39.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: Things do change with time.
[10:39.140 --> 10:47.100]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, I was asking about problems that we're all experiencing on Sprint PCS, such as drop calls when you're in a stationary position.
[10:47.340 --> 10:49.660]  [SPEAKER_04]: So you're not moving around, but the call just vanishes.
[10:50.520 --> 10:50.820]  Okay.
[10:50.820 --> 10:53.680]  [SPEAKER_04]: Or you make a call and you get a reorder, like a fast busy.
[10:54.140 --> 10:56.240]  [SPEAKER_04]: Or you make a call and it just doesn't go through.
[10:56.500 --> 11:01.640]  [SPEAKER_04]: Or you make a call and it appears to go through on your display, as its seconds are ticking off, but you hear no audio.
[11:02.860 --> 11:06.500]  [SPEAKER_04]: And the person at the other end, their phone rings and they hear no audio.
[11:06.540 --> 11:08.140]  [SPEAKER_04]: And all these sorts of things are happening.
[11:10.100 --> 11:12.380]  [SPEAKER_04]: This has been happening to me over the past two months.
[11:12.420 --> 11:15.040]  [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know, what time frame have you noticed this has been getting worse?
[11:15.040 --> 11:19.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I always have trouble with the message notification, you know, taking sometimes hours to get to you.
[11:20.060 --> 11:20.380]  [SPEAKER_12]: Uh-huh.
[11:21.600 --> 11:26.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: As far as actual problems with calls, I don't know, it varies because I'm in different areas.
[11:26.500 --> 11:28.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Some areas it's good, some areas it's bad.
[11:28.000 --> 11:34.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: I've noticed a lot of congestion recently, and I assume that's because a lot of people are signing up and they're not really getting more lines, which is, you know, not very nice.
[11:35.900 --> 11:46.420]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, uh, I, I asked, uh, the, uh, very polite and, uh, seemingly helpful Sprint PCS representative Saturday night, you know, what, what would be the cause of this?
[11:46.520 --> 11:48.600]  [SPEAKER_04]: That, you know, I've, I've addressed this to them repeatedly.
[11:49.240 --> 11:55.040]  [SPEAKER_04]: If the problems persist, you know, I've taken to not recommending the service to other people now because of these problems.
[11:55.280 --> 11:55.560]  Right.
[11:55.860 --> 11:59.500]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, uh, actually it was a gentleman who I spoke to that night.
[11:59.500 --> 12:06.800]  [SPEAKER_04]: And, uh, he said, well, you know, we've been having a lot of high winds out, uh, in various parts of the country.
[12:06.980 --> 12:07.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: High winds, yes.
[12:07.920 --> 12:11.760]  [SPEAKER_04]: High winds, uh, uh, due to El Nino.
[12:11.880 --> 12:12.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: El Nino, yes.
[12:13.240 --> 12:13.520]  [SPEAKER_04]: El Nino.
[12:13.740 --> 12:15.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: So El Nino strikes again.
[12:15.460 --> 12:21.920]  [SPEAKER_04]: And he surmised, he surmised that, uh, some of these system problems could indeed be due in part to El Nino.
[12:22.660 --> 12:35.660]  [SPEAKER_04]: And I said, well, you know, I've heard El Nino being blamed for a lot of things, but it was the first time I've heard it being blamed for affecting a, uh, um, a wireless communication system in, in an area where El Nino really hasn't had any effect on the weather.
[12:35.860 --> 12:36.160]  [SPEAKER_04]: Like, uh...
[12:36.160 --> 12:37.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, affecting the onset of daylight savings time, too.
[12:38.000 --> 12:38.500]  [SPEAKER_04]: Like Pennsylvania.
[12:38.820 --> 12:40.040]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, that, we, we're getting to that.
[12:40.200 --> 12:40.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: Mm-hmm.
[12:40.680 --> 12:41.280]  [SPEAKER_04]: We're getting to that.
[12:41.740 --> 12:56.480]  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, then, uh, uh, uh, he said the other reason could be sunspots, which, uh, can have an effect on certain radio frequencies, but that's, uh, at a 1,900 megahertz.
[12:57.100 --> 13:04.180]  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, maybe on the shortwave band, like below 30 megahertz, you'll, you'll use some, or on CB, which is like 27 megahertz.
[13:04.520 --> 13:15.160]  [SPEAKER_04]: Current PCS is at 1,900 megahertz, and those frequencies, sunspots just don't really have a bunch of an effect unless it's an amazing solar flare that would, you know, that would fry you.
[13:15.320 --> 13:17.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, we need to get to the end of the story, Bernie.
[13:17.480 --> 13:22.860]  [SPEAKER_04]: Okay, to make a long story short, you've been egging me on, like, with all this, and I've been trying to be as detailed as possible.
[13:23.440 --> 13:25.940]  [SPEAKER_04]: So, uh, he said, talk about it's going to cause this problem.
[13:26.080 --> 13:28.520]  [SPEAKER_04]: So, I, I told him I was kind of dubious about that.
[13:28.600 --> 13:41.500]  [SPEAKER_04]: The next morning, I called another sprint PCS representative to ask her comment on this, and she said that, well, yes, the high winds may have, may have blown their satellite a little bit to the left or a little bit to the right.
[13:41.740 --> 13:43.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: High winds up by the satellite.
[13:43.500 --> 13:43.940]  [SPEAKER_04]: That's right.
[13:44.120 --> 13:54.720]  [SPEAKER_04]: It, uh, you know, at first of all, I was surprised to hear her, to hear her say where it's satellite, because, uh, as far as I knew, from my research, the sprint PCS network is, is a terrestrial network.
[13:54.920 --> 13:55.660]  [SPEAKER_04]: It doesn't go through satellites.
[13:55.780 --> 13:57.660]  [SPEAKER_04]: It goes through, you know, fiber optics.
[13:58.360 --> 13:59.820]  [SPEAKER_04]: But anyway, I said, are you sure?
[14:00.020 --> 14:00.500]  [SPEAKER_04]: Satellite?
[14:00.820 --> 14:05.100]  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, both local and long, long distance and local calls are carried by satellite?
[14:05.420 --> 14:06.380]  [SPEAKER_04]: She said, oh, yes.
[14:06.960 --> 14:18.360]  [SPEAKER_04]: I said, well, just from my, uh, experience with ham radio satellites and that sort of thing, I know that there's a, uh, time delay with any kind of, uh, satellite telephone communication.
[14:18.700 --> 14:29.720]  [SPEAKER_04]: Like, the better part of a second it takes to, uh, or at least a good half second for the signal to, to travel the speed of light all the way up to the 22,300 mile Clark belt.
[14:30.860 --> 14:32.740]  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, first discovered by Arthur C.
[14:32.860 --> 14:34.120]  [SPEAKER_04]: Clark, if you don't know.
[14:34.800 --> 14:38.960]  [SPEAKER_04]: And, uh, and I said, well, how, how have you solved the speed of light issue?
[14:38.960 --> 14:44.860]  [SPEAKER_04]: How have you, uh, I, I told her I wasn't experiencing this latency problem with PCS, this delay.
[14:45.460 --> 14:51.620]  [SPEAKER_04]: Like, you know, in the old days when you had a call to go through a satellite, you knew it because it sounded, you know, like you were in a big echo chamber.
[14:51.660 --> 14:53.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, it was a good one second delay or something.
[14:53.440 --> 14:54.220]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it was really bad.
[14:54.560 --> 14:57.000]  [SPEAKER_04]: I said, well, you folks deserve a Nobel Peace Prize.
[14:57.140 --> 14:59.760]  [SPEAKER_04]: You have, you have solved, you've proven Einstein wrong.
[14:59.880 --> 15:07.340]  [SPEAKER_04]: You have been able to make your, your, your signals travel to the satellite and back faster than the speed of light.
[15:09.020 --> 15:10.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'll bet Anneli Point can't do that.
[15:11.080 --> 15:11.740]  [SPEAKER_04]: Warp speed.
[15:11.960 --> 15:12.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[15:12.440 --> 15:14.480]  [SPEAKER_04]: And PCS signals travel at warp speed.
[15:14.840 --> 15:19.300]  [SPEAKER_04]: Then you actually sit down to calculate whether it was warp one, warp two, certainly not warp nine.
[15:19.560 --> 15:21.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, you know, time gets affected when you go that fast.
[15:21.940 --> 15:22.340]  [SPEAKER_04]: Exactly.
[15:22.560 --> 15:24.440]  [SPEAKER_04]: So that was the theory we finally came up with.
[15:24.780 --> 15:28.320]  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, you and I and some other technical types that were with us that weekend.
[15:28.980 --> 15:41.360]  [SPEAKER_04]: Surmise, since the signals were traveling greater than the speed of light, it must have caused a tear or a, a ripple in a space-time continuum.
[15:41.620 --> 15:42.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Must have been.
[15:42.940 --> 15:43.870]  [SPEAKER_04]: Causing the...
[15:45.020 --> 15:45.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: An anomaly.
[15:45.980 --> 15:46.660]  [SPEAKER_04]: An anomaly.
[15:46.900 --> 15:46.980]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[15:47.160 --> 15:47.260]  [SPEAKER_04]: Exactly.
[15:47.460 --> 15:47.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Exactly.
[15:48.040 --> 15:54.460]  [SPEAKER_04]: Causing the time to shift backwards, time warp, exactly one hour.
[15:54.740 --> 15:55.100]  Uh-huh.
[15:55.380 --> 16:03.340]  [SPEAKER_04]: Which would have compensated exactly for the one hour anomaly we're experiencing by not having the clock move forward an hour.
[16:03.680 --> 16:05.300]  [SPEAKER_04]: So it's interesting how this all works out.
[16:05.360 --> 16:09.620]  [SPEAKER_04]: We discovered, um, not only a problem, but we found out why the problem was occurring.
[16:09.620 --> 16:17.300]  [SPEAKER_04]: It was because of this, uh, this ripple, this anomaly in the space-time continuum caused by a sprint PCS signal traveling faster than the speed of light.
[16:18.540 --> 16:25.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, in the end, we still don't know what happened with the, uh, daylight savings time shift.
[16:25.440 --> 16:30.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, with my phone, it, it, it seemed to, uh, it seemed to have changed on its own by 10 a.m.
[16:30.560 --> 16:33.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: With other people, they had to turn their phone on and off for it to work.
[16:34.080 --> 16:42.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, someone else I know, their phone, uh, uh, stayed on standard time until they got into a strong signal area, then it went into, uh, daylight savings time.
[16:42.880 --> 16:46.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: So we're going to have to wait until October to really, you know, experiment with this one more time.
[16:47.380 --> 16:49.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: And by then, by then, who knows how fast they'll be going.
[16:50.280 --> 16:50.920]  [SPEAKER_04]: I can't wait.
[16:51.180 --> 16:51.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[16:51.980 --> 16:52.320]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well...
[16:52.320 --> 16:57.940]  [SPEAKER_04]: If this continues, uh, we may, uh, we may be experiencing, uh, other things from the past.
[16:58.380 --> 17:04.240]  [SPEAKER_04]: Sort of like a deja vu all over again as these, as these, as these, as these sprint BCS signals travel faster than the speed of light.
[17:04.380 --> 17:07.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, Bernie, I have sort of, um, uh, a revelation here.
[17:07.400 --> 17:10.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's something that I, I actually, um, was playing around with today.
[17:10.640 --> 17:12.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, you ever, you ever call star two on your sprint phone?
[17:13.040 --> 17:14.840]  [SPEAKER_04]: I do, and it doesn't work like it used to.
[17:15.020 --> 17:15.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, why not?
[17:15.860 --> 17:16.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: What do you get?
[17:16.720 --> 17:19.160]  [SPEAKER_04]: I don't, uh, a lot of times I don't even get a connection now.
[17:19.920 --> 17:25.120]  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, I ended up just dialing the, uh, the 800 number or the 888 number, whatever it is.
[17:25.200 --> 17:25.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, the 888 number.
[17:26.040 --> 17:27.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's what I want to try right now.
[17:27.540 --> 17:28.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, just to...
[17:28.500 --> 17:29.120]  [SPEAKER_04]: Do you have that number?
[17:29.200 --> 17:33.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: I do have that number because I remembered it in my head and, uh, I, I managed to figure out what it was.
[17:33.380 --> 17:34.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: So we're going to call that now.
[17:35.460 --> 17:39.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I'm going to, well, first of all, the first time we call it, it's probably not going to work.
[17:39.920 --> 17:43.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: In fact, it might not work a few times because it's sort of a trick to this.
[17:43.520 --> 17:45.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, what I'm trying to do will always work with star two.
[17:46.040 --> 17:48.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: So every sprint PCS customer has the ability to do this.
[17:49.080 --> 17:55.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: And it's something that you're really not supposed to be able to do, but, uh, apparently the good folks at sprint think it's okay.
[17:56.760 --> 18:01.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um, when we call this number the first time, you're going to hear this sound like a slamming door.
[18:01.600 --> 18:02.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know why.
[18:02.460 --> 18:04.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: You just hear this sound like a slamming door.
[18:04.400 --> 18:04.980]  [SPEAKER_04]: Like this?
[18:06.280 --> 18:07.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Almost exactly like that, yeah.
[18:07.780 --> 18:07.980]  [SPEAKER_04]: Wow.
[18:08.560 --> 18:09.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's, uh, that's incredible.
[18:10.080 --> 18:17.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, so yeah, you do hear that sound and then it, it goes to a recording saying we're going to connect your call now or something, something bizarre like that.
[18:17.220 --> 18:18.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: So let's, uh, get a dial tone.
[18:20.500 --> 18:21.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: And we're going to call the number.
[18:25.540 --> 18:26.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: Listen carefully.
[18:41.000 --> 18:42.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Or was I right or was I right?
[18:42.880 --> 18:44.440]  [SPEAKER_04]: That was a door slam if I ever heard one.
[18:44.760 --> 18:46.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: Please hold while we connect your call.
[18:47.460 --> 18:49.260]  [SPEAKER_04]: Please hold while we slam a door in your face.
[18:51.040 --> 18:52.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: The mysteries of sprint.
[18:54.440 --> 18:55.560]  [SPEAKER_04]: Ask what that sound is.
[18:56.340 --> 18:57.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: You think they call their own numbers?
[18:58.460 --> 18:58.820]  [SPEAKER_04]: Never.
[18:59.460 --> 19:02.640]  [SPEAKER_04]: In fact, I, I know that they don't ever call it because I found something else.
[19:02.760 --> 19:05.420]  [SPEAKER_04]: All of our advocates are currently assisting other customers.
[19:05.620 --> 19:08.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, their, their advocates are busy right now, so, uh...
[19:08.020 --> 19:09.040]  [SPEAKER_04]: What do they call them advocates?
[19:09.140 --> 19:09.720]  [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know.
[19:09.900 --> 19:11.260]  [SPEAKER_04]: They've never advocated anything on my behalf.
[19:11.380 --> 19:14.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: They should call them counselors because that's what people need when they go through this service.
[19:14.820 --> 19:20.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um, what, uh, what we want to do, though, is not get an advocate or a counselor or a representative or whatnot.
[19:20.200 --> 19:22.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: We want to get something computer-ish.
[19:22.860 --> 19:34.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I've discovered, through a couple hours of playing around today, and things I really shouldn't be playing with, that you can use that slamming door to your advantage by hitting Touch-Tones as the door slams.
[19:34.580 --> 19:35.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, listen to what happens.
[19:41.870 --> 19:44.890]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm going to try to hit some ones as the door slams.
[19:59.190 --> 20:00.150]  [SPEAKER_06]: Uh-oh.
[20:00.150 --> 20:03.070]  [SPEAKER_06]: All of our advocates are currently assisting other...
[20:03.070 --> 20:04.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: I might have hit too many ones.
[20:05.270 --> 20:06.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: So we're going to try it again.
[20:08.730 --> 20:09.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: Didn't want to get it wrong, you know?
[20:13.980 --> 20:16.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: This time I'll try to hit it as the door slams.
[20:16.160 --> 20:16.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: How's that?
[20:18.620 --> 20:19.000]  [SPEAKER_04]: Reaction.
[20:20.280 --> 20:21.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, the timing is everything.
[20:22.700 --> 20:23.080]  [SPEAKER_04]: Ah.
[20:24.580 --> 20:25.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, and one more.
[20:25.860 --> 20:26.340]  [SPEAKER_04]: Too slow.
[20:31.310 --> 20:34.290]  [SPEAKER_05]: Thank you for using Sprint PCS Connection.
[20:34.350 --> 20:34.710]  [SPEAKER_05]: We have a different...
[20:34.710 --> 20:37.410]  [SPEAKER_05]: To obtain account information, press 1.
[20:37.730 --> 20:37.890]  [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
[20:37.890 --> 20:43.330]  [SPEAKER_05]: To learn more about features such as voicemail, caller ID, and call forwarding, press 2.
[20:43.510 --> 20:44.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, this is the best part.
[20:44.930 --> 20:48.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: Take a listen to this when I hit 1 for automated account information.
[20:49.050 --> 20:53.090]  [SPEAKER_06]: Please enter your Sprint PCS phone number, including the area code.
[20:53.470 --> 20:54.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[20:54.910 --> 20:56.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's try this number.
[20:56.210 --> 21:01.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I'm going to turn down the audio so that nobody can hear what I am dialing.
[21:01.890 --> 21:05.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I'm also going to talk over it in case, for some reason, you can hear the sounds.
[21:05.610 --> 21:06.370]  [SPEAKER_14]: Listen to this.
[21:06.770 --> 21:15.850]  [SPEAKER_06]: As of April 7th, 1998, at 5.22 a.m., your account balance is $0.
[21:16.650 --> 21:29.870]  [SPEAKER_06]: Your last payment of $143.47 was posted to your account on March 19th, 1998.
[21:30.390 --> 21:32.450]  [SPEAKER_06]: To repeat this information, press 8.
[21:32.830 --> 21:34.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, Bernie, do those numbers sound familiar?
[21:35.910 --> 21:38.230]  [SPEAKER_04]: Those particular numbers, they sound very familiar.
[21:38.430 --> 21:40.770]  [SPEAKER_04]: In fact, that sounds like that was my last Sprint PCS bill.
[21:40.870 --> 21:41.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: That was your last bill.
[21:41.950 --> 21:46.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: In fact, I was able to find that out just by calling this number and figuring out a way to get around the slamming door.
[21:47.190 --> 21:47.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: But...
[21:47.510 --> 21:48.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: I feel so violated.
[21:48.870 --> 21:49.890]  [SPEAKER_14]: You should feel violated.
[21:49.950 --> 21:55.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: And the thing is, what makes it even worse is that you don't need to play that slamming door trick if you have a Sprint PCS phone.
[21:55.130 --> 22:00.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: All you have to do is dial star 2 and then hit 1 for an option and simply enter the phone number.
[22:00.890 --> 22:04.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: They say, on the Sprint phone, they say, for verification, enter your phone number.
[22:04.970 --> 22:05.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: There's no verification.
[22:05.770 --> 22:06.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: They don't verify anything.
[22:06.850 --> 22:09.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: All they do is take that number and give you all the information you want.
[22:09.430 --> 22:15.430]  [SPEAKER_04]: And they take great pains to verbally ask you your spoken password whenever you're requesting account information.
[22:15.670 --> 22:18.790]  [SPEAKER_04]: They can just as easily have you spell that password out on the Touch-Tone phone.
[22:19.370 --> 22:20.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's true, too.
[22:20.370 --> 22:22.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: Although that password is pretty worthless, too, from what I hear.
[22:23.770 --> 22:24.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, it's...
[22:24.490 --> 22:25.550]  [SPEAKER_04]: Listen, I checked it.
[22:25.670 --> 22:26.150]  [SPEAKER_04]: What do they call it?
[22:26.210 --> 22:27.030]  [SPEAKER_04]: The automated...
[22:27.810 --> 22:28.170]  [SPEAKER_04]: Whatever.
[22:28.390 --> 22:30.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: The automated privacy invasion feature.
[22:30.410 --> 22:30.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[22:30.750 --> 22:33.790]  [SPEAKER_04]: That feature, I've used it to check my own balance in the past.
[22:33.790 --> 22:45.990]  [SPEAKER_04]: And about a month ago, I checked it, and it was almost two weeks behind on updating a payment I made in cash at my local Sprint PCS store.
[22:46.610 --> 22:52.350]  [SPEAKER_04]: And I called repeatedly saying, well, listen, you know, I can see it taking a couple of days to reflect this payment.
[22:52.450 --> 22:55.730]  [SPEAKER_04]: But it was a glitch between two different computers Sprint PCS had.
[22:56.490 --> 23:04.250]  [SPEAKER_04]: The computer system that the person I was talking to, her screen showed that, yes, I had made the payment when I said I made it.
[23:04.350 --> 23:14.570]  [SPEAKER_04]: But the automated system said I was a deadbeat and hadn't paid that I was in arrears, that I hadn't paid my bill, and it was past due.
[23:14.850 --> 23:18.270]  [SPEAKER_04]: And I was quite concerned about this, maybe showing up on my credit record or whatever.
[23:20.850 --> 23:26.190]  [SPEAKER_04]: And apparently now it's current, but it was two weeks behind, which is pretty disturbing.
[23:26.370 --> 23:26.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: That is disturbing.
[23:27.110 --> 23:30.370]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, you know, I'm more disturbed by the fact that they don't fix things like this.
[23:30.370 --> 23:31.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: In fact, I called them to ask them about this.
[23:32.010 --> 23:34.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: I know people who have managed to block that feature.
[23:34.970 --> 23:38.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: So you can block it, but they don't think you can.
[23:38.190 --> 23:42.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you call a customer representative now and ask them to block it, they'll say, you can't.
[23:42.450 --> 23:43.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: There's no way to block it.
[23:43.430 --> 23:45.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: Of course, they're wrong, because you can.
[23:45.270 --> 23:46.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: I've seen it happen.
[23:46.950 --> 23:52.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: But I think what people need to do, Sprint customers, that is, is call them right now, or after the show, anyway.
[23:53.610 --> 23:55.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: The number, obviously, if you have a Sprint phone, is Star 2.
[23:56.090 --> 24:00.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: There's no charge for that from the phone, except for the radiation going into your head.
[24:00.730 --> 24:09.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: Or you can use a regular phone and dial 1-888-211-4727 and simply, well, first, play around all you want and find out everyone's balance.
[24:09.690 --> 24:11.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, you know, you can go through random numbers.
[24:11.490 --> 24:14.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: You can go through strangers, just cool-sounding numbers, people all over the country.
[24:14.850 --> 24:20.090]  [SPEAKER_04]: I have some Sprint PCS telephone numbers of some of the higher-ranking officials at Sprint PCS.
[24:20.110 --> 24:21.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, that's the kind of thing I'd like to have.
[24:22.050 --> 24:27.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: Not, you know, not over the air, obviously, but if you could get that to me after the show, I'll have a field day finding out how much they owe.
[24:28.490 --> 24:33.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: And as long as people, you know, are made aware of this, I think it's a lot happier and healthier for everybody.
[24:33.530 --> 24:37.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, you know, to have a feature like that and not tell people that, hey, there's no verification whatsoever.
[24:37.870 --> 24:43.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: We went through this with NYNEX a couple of years ago, and, you know, we thought maybe they might have learned, but apparently they don't listen.
[24:44.110 --> 24:44.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: They don't listen to me.
[24:44.610 --> 24:58.670]  [SPEAKER_04]: My favorite system was the original MCI friends and family system that allowed you to check not only the account balance and things like that, but the relationships, like brother-in-law, that sort of thing, of what people they had in their circle of family and friends.
[24:58.710 --> 24:59.390]  [SPEAKER_04]: That was hilarious.
[24:59.570 --> 25:00.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: That was horrible.
[25:01.570 --> 25:10.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: And it's, you know, we have new services, new features, new technologies, but the same old stupidity of people running them and just not getting it right.
[25:10.490 --> 25:14.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I'd like to hear... I'm sure in a week this feature will no longer exist.
[25:14.570 --> 25:15.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: At least I sure hope so.
[25:15.950 --> 25:17.250]  [SPEAKER_04]: Boy, you're pretty positive.
[25:17.470 --> 25:27.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, it took that long for MCI to get rid of theirs, and NYNEX didn't take too much longer to get rid of, you know, their bill verification service that allowed anybody to check up on you.
[25:28.450 --> 25:34.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I guess, you know, a lot of people right now are going to check on everybody they know and perhaps a few people they don't know, and then they'll complain about it.
[25:35.250 --> 25:36.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: And then it'll go away.
[25:37.050 --> 25:37.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: We'll see.
[25:38.010 --> 25:42.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: But again, the number for Sprint is 1-888-211-4727, that's Sprint PCS.
[25:42.730 --> 25:44.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: You've got to do that trick with the slamming door, obviously.
[25:44.790 --> 25:49.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know what that's all about, but if you have a Sprint phone to start to, we'll take you directly there.
[25:49.330 --> 25:50.430]  [SPEAKER_04]: Here's something else you could do.
[25:50.510 --> 25:53.890]  [SPEAKER_04]: You could just call Sprint PCS numbers at random, knowing, you know, the exchanges.
[25:54.210 --> 25:54.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[25:57.150 --> 26:01.590]  [SPEAKER_04]: Sprint PCS 432 exchange, but I'm sure there's, you know, you have your own exchanges up there.
[26:01.930 --> 26:05.610]  [SPEAKER_04]: Just call numbers at random, and with luck, you'll actually don't even call the numbers.
[26:05.750 --> 26:23.790]  [SPEAKER_04]: Call the Sprint PCS service number, and after the slamming door, hit the 1, then enter random numbers, get account balances, then call those actual Sprint PCS phone numbers, and tell the person, or leave them a voicemail saying, you know, it was so easy to check your personal financial information by doing this.
[26:23.790 --> 26:25.410]  [SPEAKER_04]: I think you should call Sprint PCS and complain.
[26:25.630 --> 26:30.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, you know, what I did, what I did today, I called somebody, you know, I checked my friend's balance, and I called them today.
[26:31.070 --> 26:34.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: In my voice, they recognized me saying, hello, it's Emmanuel from Sprint PCS.
[26:34.730 --> 26:36.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: I see you still owe $142.
[26:37.570 --> 26:39.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: When can we expect payment on that?
[26:39.250 --> 26:44.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, they were kind of confused, to say the least, and it's a fun gag, I guess, to play on your friends.
[26:44.770 --> 26:46.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: Or enemies, too, for that matter.
[26:47.530 --> 26:50.370]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, so that's enough of Sprint PCS for now.
[26:50.450 --> 26:52.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: Of course, we have other things to talk about.
[26:52.150 --> 27:02.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: In fact, when we get back, we're going to update people on exactly what happened at the first micro-broadcasting convention on the East Coast.
[27:02.430 --> 27:03.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is Off the Hook.
[27:03.510 --> 27:04.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: Stay tuned.
[27:09.070 --> 27:50.030]  [SPEAKER_17]: I never thought I'd be so cruel And now I had to bring nearly every room Just to survive I need to get by I get up in the morning, I go to town There's nothing there, so I just hang around Time passes by But I still have to try Start up for a C1 Start up for all your needs If you make your mind up Then you will succeed Start up for what you want Start up for all your needs If you make your mind up
[27:50.360 --> 27:51.530]  [SPEAKER_17]: Then you will succeed
[28:01.830 --> 28:04.890]  [SPEAKER_17]: Now I find out it's the only way.
[28:05.250 --> 28:07.090]  [SPEAKER_17]: Where did I go wrong?
[28:08.330 --> 28:10.670]  [SPEAKER_17]: My life carries on.
[28:11.730 --> 28:12.710]  [SPEAKER_17]: Yeah, yeah.
[28:13.030 --> 28:15.550]  [SPEAKER_17]: So now what's left for me to do?
[28:16.370 --> 28:19.350]  [SPEAKER_17]: I can't see no other way through.
[28:19.630 --> 28:21.450]  [SPEAKER_17]: I don't want to steal.
[28:22.450 --> 28:24.950]  [SPEAKER_17]: Just to get my next meal.
[28:25.870 --> 28:26.870]  [SPEAKER_17]: Yeah, yeah.
[28:27.650 --> 28:29.210]  [SPEAKER_17]: Stand up for what you want.
[28:29.410 --> 28:31.130]  [SPEAKER_17]: Stand up for all your needs.
[28:31.310 --> 28:34.390]  [SPEAKER_17]: If you make your mind up, then you will succeed.
[28:34.970 --> 28:36.370]  [SPEAKER_17]: Stand up for what you want.
[28:36.650 --> 28:38.310]  [SPEAKER_17]: Stand up for all your needs.
[28:38.510 --> 28:41.430]  [SPEAKER_17]: If you make your mind up, then you will succeed.
[28:54.050 --> 29:02.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't think we could have a more apropos sentiment than what took place this past weekend in Philadelphia at the micro-broadcasting convention.
[29:02.650 --> 29:05.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: Standing up for what you want and believe in.
[29:05.690 --> 29:07.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: A lot of people... how many people do you think showed up, Ernie?
[29:09.670 --> 29:10.870]  [SPEAKER_04]: 150 to 200 people.
[29:11.010 --> 29:13.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's a lot of people to come to something like that.
[29:14.010 --> 29:19.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: And what I learned over this weekend, as far as the broadcasting part of this, is that this is real.
[29:19.510 --> 29:20.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is happening.
[29:20.570 --> 29:26.030]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is something that's taking place not just in New York, not just in Philadelphia, not just in Berkeley, all throughout the nation.
[29:26.050 --> 29:29.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Every city seems to have at least one micro-broadcasting station.
[29:30.530 --> 29:35.170]  [SPEAKER_14]: People going... taking back the airwaves and challenging what has happened to them.
[29:35.250 --> 29:41.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Some cities, like, say, San Diego, I've heard that 12 out of 13 stations there are owned by the same company.
[29:42.150 --> 29:49.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, you have the morning crews of these, you know, these stupid morning DJ people that, you know, say obnoxious things on the radio.
[29:50.290 --> 29:53.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: They compete with each other, and they're passing each other in the hallway.
[29:53.690 --> 29:58.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, the same... the stations that allegedly are competing with each other really are part of the same building.
[29:58.870 --> 29:59.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: And it's sick, you know.
[30:00.010 --> 30:02.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's a horrible thing that's happened to radio.
[30:02.090 --> 30:03.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: There's no competition anymore.
[30:03.550 --> 30:10.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's all of this homogenous crap that you just, you know, hear from city to city, the same songs, the same sentiments.
[30:10.550 --> 30:12.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: And people have finally, finally had enough of this.
[30:13.070 --> 30:25.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: A lot of it is because of the Telecommunications Act of 1996, which allowed megacorporations to own multiple stations and newspapers and all media outlets, cable TV companies, cable channels.
[30:25.970 --> 30:31.170]  [SPEAKER_14]: So you have, you know, every form of expression being controlled by one entity.
[30:31.550 --> 30:33.330]  [SPEAKER_04]: Right now you have, uh...
[30:33.330 --> 30:34.050]  [SPEAKER_04]: You still hear me okay?
[30:34.390 --> 30:34.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: I hear you fine.
[30:35.390 --> 30:37.230]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I'm going down a metal stairwell.
[30:37.390 --> 30:37.990]  [SPEAKER_04]: I'm just going to...
[30:37.990 --> 30:38.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, okay.
[30:38.550 --> 30:39.470]  [SPEAKER_04]: You have over...
[30:39.470 --> 30:41.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: You are sounding a little Darth Vader-ish there.
[30:43.430 --> 30:43.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[30:44.950 --> 30:46.430]  [SPEAKER_04]: Half of all radio...
[30:47.590 --> 30:47.990]  [SPEAKER_04]: Are...
[30:47.990 --> 30:49.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: Half of all radio stations.
[30:49.230 --> 30:49.890]  [SPEAKER_04]: Over half.
[30:50.010 --> 30:51.790]  [SPEAKER_04]: In other words, most of all radio stations...
[30:51.790 --> 30:51.950]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[30:51.950 --> 30:53.850]  [SPEAKER_04]: Are owned by ten corporations now.
[30:54.190 --> 30:54.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[30:54.670 --> 30:55.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: Owned by one of ten corporations.
[30:56.170 --> 30:56.390]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yep.
[30:56.890 --> 30:57.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: That is, uh...
[30:57.870 --> 30:59.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: That is really sad to hear that.
[30:59.670 --> 31:02.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, WBAI is an exception, uh...
[31:02.250 --> 31:03.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: A very rare exception.
[31:03.130 --> 31:05.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: You don't have stations like this in other cities.
[31:05.290 --> 31:12.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: You have some non-commercial stations in some places, but, unfortunately, those are being corrupted, too, uh, by...
[31:12.210 --> 31:18.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: by interest, different interests, uh, you know, multi-corporate, megacorporation interests, uh...
[31:18.510 --> 31:19.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, and the...
[31:19.470 --> 31:21.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: The community stations are just vanishing.
[31:21.410 --> 31:22.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: Left and right.
[31:22.330 --> 31:23.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, they can't afford to operate.
[31:23.850 --> 31:24.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: And they...
[31:24.230 --> 31:36.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: Their, their signals just are, are kind of, uh, degrading because all these other stations are popping up next to them with, you know, religion and NPR and all the people who have money that are just, uh, kind of stepping on them.
[31:36.570 --> 31:38.210]  [SPEAKER_04]: The FCC is selling out.
[31:38.470 --> 31:44.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, the FCC, I mean, basically on Friday, there was an FCC spokesperson there.
[31:45.070 --> 31:45.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: And...
[31:45.410 --> 31:47.550]  [SPEAKER_04]: Not just, not just a spokesperson, Emmanuel.
[31:47.770 --> 31:47.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[31:47.910 --> 31:54.870]  [SPEAKER_04]: This was the chief, the, from Washington, D.C., the chief of compliance and enforcement for the Federal Communications Commission.
[31:55.150 --> 31:55.350]  [SPEAKER_04]: Mm-hmm.
[31:55.670 --> 32:07.110]  [SPEAKER_04]: The self-described top cop of the FCC came to our conference to address, uh, what, uh, what one NPR affiliate here referred to yesterday morning as a hostile crowd.
[32:07.890 --> 32:09.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I don't know what he expected.
[32:09.430 --> 32:10.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: Of course the crowd's gonna be hostile.
[32:10.730 --> 32:15.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: These are people that, uh, you know, are operating radio stations that he wants to shut down.
[32:15.990 --> 32:17.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that he has vowed to shut down.
[32:17.810 --> 32:23.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, of course, they're going to be rather hostile towards this person that has openly expressed hostility towards them.
[32:23.850 --> 32:24.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, I think...
[32:24.410 --> 32:26.230]  [SPEAKER_04]: Shut down by any means necessary.
[32:26.230 --> 32:28.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think, I think it was, uh, you know, an important thing.
[32:29.110 --> 32:34.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: He, he showed a lot of courage to be there in front of a hostile crowd to express what he believed in.
[32:34.290 --> 32:47.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: But I, I hope it was not lost on him that all these people, by operating their radio stations, are showing the same kind of courage by standing up to the FCC, by standing up to these mega corporations and, and their lock on the FM radio dial.
[32:48.050 --> 32:55.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um, but I'll tell you, you know, when I first got there, it seemed, you know, I'm sure a lot of people get this impression whenever you go to a, a gathering like this.
[32:55.090 --> 32:59.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: Everybody seemed to be totally out of, you know, out of their heads, crazy, insane, misfits of society.
[33:00.210 --> 33:09.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: And as you stay for the entire weekend and talk to these people, learn more about them, see where they're coming from, they become the sanest people in the world.
[33:09.390 --> 33:10.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, have you, gone through things like that?
[33:11.190 --> 33:11.730]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, sure.
[33:12.130 --> 33:12.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[33:12.270 --> 33:14.930]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that happened, that happened to me in the hacking community as well.
[33:14.950 --> 33:15.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, God, yeah.
[33:15.870 --> 33:26.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, and, and the sad thing is when you see people in the hacking community, uh, sort of passing judgment on other people in other communities that, uh, you know, may seem a little strange or abnormal.
[33:26.650 --> 33:28.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: The thing is, we're all strange and abnormal.
[33:28.910 --> 33:31.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: As soon as you, you know, fit in, you start to fade out.
[33:32.010 --> 33:41.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, uh, these, these misfits of society are actually the ones that are doing things, that are getting things done, uh, standing up to these, these rules that we've all just sort of accepted without question.
[33:42.270 --> 33:58.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, where is it written that, uh, you know, Westinghouse and, and Capital City and Disney and, you know, all these, all these military contractors have the right to have these 50,000 watt stations every place where there's virtually no public input whatsoever.
[33:59.130 --> 34:01.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: You don't have any say in what, what music is played.
[34:01.450 --> 34:09.170]  [SPEAKER_14]: You don't have any say in, in, uh, what kinds of shows are put on, what kind of music is put on, what kind of discussion there is, if there's any discussion at all.
[34:09.370 --> 34:10.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: You have no say whatsoever.
[34:11.170 --> 34:12.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's, uh, it's hardly freedom.
[34:12.910 --> 34:21.410]  [SPEAKER_04]: Someone we had dinner with, uh, Saturday night or Friday, I guess it was, uh, one of those nights, they told us that, uh, in one market, some city, I can't recall what it was.
[34:21.570 --> 34:21.650]  [SPEAKER_04]: San Diego?
[34:21.650 --> 34:21.950]  [SPEAKER_04]: San Diego?
[34:22.050 --> 34:23.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: All about the 13 stations on by the same people.
[34:24.210 --> 34:24.570]  [SPEAKER_04]: Exactly.
[34:24.990 --> 34:26.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that's, uh, that's pretty sad.
[34:26.670 --> 34:27.490]  [SPEAKER_04]: That's not diversity.
[34:27.890 --> 34:29.630]  [SPEAKER_04]: That's, uh, that's pretty depressing.
[34:30.050 --> 34:33.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, well, I mean, they compete against each other, but they just happen to be owned by the same entity.
[34:34.330 --> 34:36.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, you, you, you explain that to me.
[34:36.210 --> 34:37.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't, I don't get it.
[34:37.550 --> 34:41.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, so yes, there are a lot of things that will be happening with, uh, with micro-broadcasting.
[34:41.590 --> 34:43.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: What do you think came out of the conference?
[34:43.390 --> 34:45.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: Was there a renewed sense of spirit?
[34:45.630 --> 34:46.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: Was there anything concrete?
[34:46.930 --> 35:03.130]  [SPEAKER_04]: I think a lot of stations, uh, a lot of people who were involved with various stations across the country who came were, uh, were really uplifted to find out that, uh, other people in other areas who had also gone through the same trials and tribulations getting their own stations on the air,
[35:03.330 --> 35:05.390]  [SPEAKER_04]: uh, have been going through the same sort of stuff.
[35:05.550 --> 35:19.990]  [SPEAKER_04]: Technical problems, problems with, like, how to put together a democratic station organization, all these sorts of things that really felt good to associate with people that, uh, you could identify with who'd also, all gone through the same things in their own towns and cities.
[35:20.370 --> 35:20.650]  [SPEAKER_08]: Mm-hmm.
[35:20.870 --> 35:28.650]  [SPEAKER_04]: And, uh, of course we could all rally around, uh, uh, our universal opinion that the FCC was, uh, was being unfair.
[35:28.770 --> 35:33.010]  [SPEAKER_04]: It wasn't just the FCC, the chief, the top cop of the FCC that came to address this Friday night.
[35:33.010 --> 35:49.350]  [SPEAKER_04]: It was, uh, uh, the head of the Pennsylvania ACLU, Stefan Presser, who vowed to defend, uh, one of the Philadelphia pirates, uh, Radio Mutiny, who, or their several friends that I know, and, uh, vowed to defend them in any legal action that the FCC would,
[35:49.410 --> 35:51.930]  [SPEAKER_04]: uh, intend to take against the Radio Mutiny.
[35:52.130 --> 35:56.970]  [SPEAKER_04]: So, uh, it's, uh, it's going to be an interesting battle.
[35:57.110 --> 36:04.910]  [SPEAKER_04]: If they want to take Radio Mutiny off the air, they're going to go into a protracted, uh, federal, uh, court battle with, uh, ACLU.
[36:05.070 --> 36:06.550]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's going to be kind of like the CDA case.
[36:07.310 --> 36:08.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: I got to see Radio Mutiny, actually.
[36:09.090 --> 36:13.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: I went down there and, uh, it, it operates, you know, in just a, just a house.
[36:13.310 --> 36:14.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: A lot of pirate stations do.
[36:15.230 --> 36:15.810]  [SPEAKER_04]: Now, is it true?
[36:15.830 --> 36:23.750]  [SPEAKER_04]: I heard the sign-off that night on Radio Mutiny, and I, uh, I heard someone humming the Star-Spangled Banner.
[36:23.910 --> 36:25.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, it's possible that might have happened, yes.
[36:26.130 --> 36:29.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, you don't know what you're going to hear on a radio station like that.
[36:29.890 --> 36:30.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, I was just curious.
[36:30.550 --> 36:32.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: You think WBAI is unpredictable, but, uh...
[36:32.950 --> 36:36.910]  [SPEAKER_04]: I was just curious if you were one of those people who was humming the Star-Spangled Banner at sign-off.
[36:37.030 --> 36:38.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: I can't hum worth a lick.
[36:38.470 --> 36:42.170]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's, uh, you know, it's basically, I can't verify one way or another.
[36:43.190 --> 36:44.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: But let's, let's move on to something else.
[36:45.210 --> 36:52.170]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, and, and say that this month coming up there will be all kinds of, uh, of things going on with micro-broadcasting in different cities.
[36:52.190 --> 36:54.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: A lot of stations will be coming back that have...
[36:54.010 --> 36:54.610]  [SPEAKER_04]: April 15th.
[36:55.050 --> 36:56.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, do we want to give out an exact date?
[36:56.750 --> 36:57.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: Is that the...
[36:57.150 --> 37:03.330]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, April 15th is a traditional, uh, popular, uh, protest day because it's, uh, fax day.
[37:03.470 --> 37:06.470]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's a day you have to fork over all your hard-earned money to the federal government.
[37:06.510 --> 37:10.010]  [SPEAKER_04]: That money that they haven't stolen from you already through withholding during the rest of the year.
[37:10.550 --> 37:16.830]  [SPEAKER_04]: So, uh, I know that, uh, Steel List Radio in, uh, New York has announced that they will be going back in the air April 15th.
[37:17.190 --> 37:18.850]  [SPEAKER_04]: And so will several other stations as well.
[37:18.850 --> 37:21.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: I wasn't sure that was a public announcement, but, uh...
[37:21.110 --> 37:22.770]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, they announced it publicly at the conference.
[37:22.910 --> 37:23.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: It is now, I guess.
[37:23.810 --> 37:25.070]  [SPEAKER_04]: There were a couple hundred people there.
[37:25.210 --> 37:25.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[37:25.870 --> 37:32.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, uh, yeah, they'll be coming back on the air, uh, and, uh, other stations, other, other states and cities will be as well.
[37:32.410 --> 37:36.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I think you'll, you're gonna see a lot more people doing this.
[37:36.610 --> 37:39.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: A lot more people saying, hey, you know, we can run a station too.
[37:39.350 --> 37:41.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is a need that's not being filled.
[37:41.550 --> 37:48.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I think that's the most important thing is to, um, if, if you decide to do something like this, go for something that isn't being done already.
[37:49.090 --> 37:59.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, there's no point in having the same thing just being dredged up all over again and having duplication of something that, uh, you know, why would somebody listen to a pirate station that's playing commercial music?
[37:59.770 --> 38:00.450]  [SPEAKER_14]: It doesn't make any sense.
[38:00.770 --> 38:01.110]  [SPEAKER_04]: Exactly.
[38:01.490 --> 38:01.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's one thing.
[38:01.970 --> 38:04.870]  [SPEAKER_04]: Not just, not just music, but, uh, there's a lot of local programming.
[38:05.030 --> 38:15.810]  [SPEAKER_04]: And Radio Mutiny in Philadelphia has an incredibly wide range of, of, of programming, interview programs, magazine shows, uh, public health, uh, oriented shows, all kinds of things.
[38:15.950 --> 38:21.350]  [SPEAKER_04]: You're just simply not gonna hear on, on any kind of radio station, commercial or, or PBS, anything like that.
[38:21.430 --> 38:21.550]  [SPEAKER_04]: Right.
[38:21.670 --> 38:29.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: And there's also, you know, the issue of, uh, of, of censorship and indecency, which is something that, uh, that commercial radio does not address.
[38:30.010 --> 38:32.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Stations like WBAI can't address.
[38:32.830 --> 38:37.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: We, we, we, we were the ones that started the whole thing with, uh, the seven dirty words of George Carlin.
[38:37.990 --> 38:41.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, uh, it's, um, you know, it's, it's something that does need to be addressed.
[38:41.810 --> 38:59.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I think the, the micro-broadcasting, uh, of, you know, that's taking place in this country is the perfect forum to finally challenge the nonsense that's going on where you have to censor virtually every song you put onto the radio and not talk about certain subjects and all kinds of other things because you don't want to offend the most conservative of people in the country.
[38:59.330 --> 39:00.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, you know, there's dials.
[39:00.410 --> 39:03.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: There's dials, there's switches, there's all kinds of things you can do if it offends you.
[39:03.990 --> 39:06.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, just move on to someplace else that doesn't offend you.
[39:06.310 --> 39:07.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's how we live our lives.
[39:07.410 --> 39:08.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's how you have to live your life.
[39:09.050 --> 39:17.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: Anyway, what I'd like to do is, uh, just give out the address for a magazine that I, I came across while I was down there because, um, people need to know what's going on in this, in this movement.
[39:17.970 --> 39:22.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I think that's, uh, that's probably the best way to do it is to, is to read a common thing.
[39:23.050 --> 39:25.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, Hobby Broadcasting's magazine, that just started coming out.
[39:25.890 --> 39:37.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: And if you write to them at, uh, Hobby Broadcasting Care of Cabinet Communications, Post Office Box 642, Mont Alto, Pennsylvania, 17237.
[39:37.410 --> 39:39.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: Ask them for subscription information.
[39:39.690 --> 39:50.690]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, I'm sure, I don't know if it shows up on newsstands anyplace, but, um, uh, you can certainly ask for a subscription or a sample copy or something like that and say you heard it here on Off the Hook.
[39:51.010 --> 39:52.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: And maybe that'll mean something.
[39:52.330 --> 39:52.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know if it will.
[39:53.390 --> 39:54.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um, we're going to take some phone calls.
[39:54.850 --> 39:56.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: 212-279-3400.
[39:56.490 --> 40:03.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: People have anything to say about this topic or other topics that, uh, we've covered tonight or haven't covered tonight, uh, feel free to give us a call.
[40:03.810 --> 40:08.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, we are broadcast at 99.5 FM in New York City, also over the Internet throughout the world.
[40:08.970 --> 40:12.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: And usually we get a couple hundred people every week listening in various parts of the planet.
[40:12.710 --> 40:14.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, um, we never know who's going to be out there.
[40:15.110 --> 40:16.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's take our first phone call.
[40:16.290 --> 40:17.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: 212-279-3400.
[40:18.350 --> 40:19.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: And good evening.
[40:19.270 --> 40:19.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's you.
[40:19.630 --> 40:20.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're on the air.
[40:20.570 --> 40:21.370]  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, hi, Emmanuel.
[40:21.490 --> 40:22.110]  [SPEAKER_03]: How are you?
[40:22.190 --> 40:22.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm pretty good.
[40:22.690 --> 40:22.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: How are you?
[40:22.930 --> 40:23.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: Where are you calling from?
[40:23.810 --> 40:26.250]  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, actually I'm calling from the big New York City.
[40:26.490 --> 40:27.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: New York City?
[40:27.370 --> 40:27.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[40:27.410 --> 40:28.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, the signal's really getting out tonight.
[40:28.790 --> 40:28.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[40:29.090 --> 40:30.110]  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I have two questions for you.
[40:30.230 --> 40:30.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: Go ahead.
[40:30.730 --> 40:33.410]  [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, first one is, uh, where's Fiber these days?
[40:33.850 --> 40:37.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, Fiber is, uh, he's out there someplace.
[40:37.450 --> 40:37.690]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, yeah?
[40:37.690 --> 40:38.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's all, that's all I know.
[40:39.150 --> 40:40.190]  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, okay.
[40:40.730 --> 40:48.390]  [SPEAKER_03]: All right, second question is, um, is there such a thing as a legal, free, local phone call in New York?
[40:48.570 --> 40:50.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: A legal, free, local phone call.
[40:51.250 --> 40:53.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, well, what is it you want to do?
[40:53.230 --> 40:54.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: You want to just call somebody and not pay any money?
[40:55.070 --> 41:01.150]  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, basically, um, I just want to make, like, local calls from my, from my apartment, like, for free.
[41:01.350 --> 41:03.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, where, where, what area code are you in?
[41:03.830 --> 41:04.370]  [SPEAKER_03]: Uh, 212.
[41:04.610 --> 41:06.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're in 212, and you just want to call in 212 area code?
[41:06.770 --> 41:06.930]  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
[41:07.130 --> 41:13.890]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, there's all kinds of, of, of, of plans Bell Atlantic has, and I believe you can get, uh, well, there's obviously, how long have you had your phone line for?
[41:14.250 --> 41:15.510]  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, like a couple months.
[41:15.710 --> 41:20.570]  [SPEAKER_03]: I, I, I asked, I asked them, though, and they, they, like, said that there, that, like, there wasn't a plan for that.
[41:20.570 --> 41:32.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, you won't qualify for unlimited regional, but it doesn't matter because you can get, uh, I believe it's flat rate that, uh, you pay a certain amount, and, um, I'm not sure if they actually offer that in New York City, to be honest.
[41:32.210 --> 41:37.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: I know they offer it on Long Island where you can pay a certain amount and call a region as many times as you want.
[41:37.610 --> 41:45.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: I do know you have untimed service in New York where, where you don't have to pay per minute, but you may not have where you don't pay for every call.
[41:46.010 --> 41:53.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Someone, someone who is more familiar with the actual billing in New York City can perhaps, uh, correct me on this, uh, but there are, there are certain plans.
[41:53.350 --> 42:03.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: I know there's other companies, too, that you can, uh, you, you can subscribe to, you know, like MCS or, uh, um, other companies that are popping up almost every day.
[42:03.410 --> 42:05.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you look at the beginning of your phone book, you'll see them.
[42:05.990 --> 42:08.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: There's bound to be something that offers you unlimited local dialing.
[42:08.830 --> 42:09.890]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's not something unusual.
[42:09.890 --> 42:11.370]  [SPEAKER_14]: It happens all over the country.
[42:11.590 --> 42:15.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, if it's not in New York, it should be and it probably will be really soon.
[42:15.930 --> 42:16.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: Alrighty.
[42:16.510 --> 42:19.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just keep asking around and if we hear something here, of course, we'll report it.
[42:19.510 --> 42:19.890]  [SPEAKER_13]: Okay, thanks.
[42:20.130 --> 42:20.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: Thanks for calling.
[42:21.830 --> 42:23.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: 212-279-3400.
[42:23.070 --> 42:23.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening.
[42:23.390 --> 42:23.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're on the air.
[42:24.830 --> 42:25.770]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, hi, Armand.
[42:26.070 --> 42:27.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're on the air right now.
[42:27.390 --> 42:28.170]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, hi, good evening.
[42:28.310 --> 42:29.570]  [SPEAKER_13]: I'm calling you from New York City.
[42:29.690 --> 42:30.530]  [SPEAKER_13]: I live in New Jersey.
[42:30.750 --> 42:36.330]  [SPEAKER_13]: I told you a while ago my water company wants to use our private phone lines to read the meters.
[42:36.510 --> 42:36.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[42:36.930 --> 42:38.510]  [SPEAKER_13]: No public hearings, no nothing.
[42:38.710 --> 42:52.990]  [SPEAKER_13]: I even put an ad in the local newspaper about it saying in the lease they should have it manually connectable so we could just plug it in at a designated day, for instance, when they pick up garbage maybe once a week or maybe even twice a month.
[42:53.930 --> 42:55.850]  [SPEAKER_13]: Can I force the issue in your opinion?
[42:55.970 --> 43:00.990]  [SPEAKER_13]: Because one of your guests was talking about they have to ask permission to mess with your phone line.
[43:01.110 --> 43:03.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, that's to actually put something on your line.
[43:03.650 --> 43:04.710]  [SPEAKER_13]: I mean, it's a done deal.
[43:04.710 --> 43:08.870]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're already in mailers to the homes even though they haven't hit our house yet.
[43:09.070 --> 43:09.710]  [SPEAKER_13]: Here it is.
[43:09.830 --> 43:10.590]  [SPEAKER_13]: They show a picture of it.
[43:10.930 --> 43:19.610]  [SPEAKER_13]: And even though there's only like 22,000 people in our community they're giving the rap that they could tap into the phone like, you know, anytime they want.
[43:19.770 --> 43:22.730]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're even saying oh, we'll be doing it perhaps once or twice a week.
[43:23.310 --> 43:25.310]  [SPEAKER_13]: In other words, it isn't just to read a bill.
[43:25.470 --> 43:27.170]  [SPEAKER_13]: It's going to be like an ongoing thing.
[43:27.350 --> 43:30.810]  [SPEAKER_13]: And would you know do we have rights to demand public...
[43:30.810 --> 43:32.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, here's what I'm like...
[43:32.110 --> 43:33.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm not clear about this.
[43:33.250 --> 43:34.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: How do they know your phone number?
[43:34.870 --> 43:36.270]  [SPEAKER_13]: They don't know my phone number.
[43:36.390 --> 43:42.390]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're going to come into our house and just literally go to our phone lines and put a cord from them to the new water meter.
[43:42.590 --> 43:45.070]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're going to just tap into our phones physically.
[43:45.110 --> 43:52.170]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're going to go into our houses and put a doohickey from our phone lines to a water meter in the basement.
[43:52.990 --> 43:53.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: I see.
[43:53.690 --> 43:55.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: So they don't actually have to call your number.
[43:55.910 --> 43:56.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: They just...
[43:56.490 --> 43:56.830]  [SPEAKER_13]: Oh, yes.
[43:56.890 --> 43:57.750]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're going to call the number.
[43:57.750 --> 43:58.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, that's what I'm confused about.
[43:58.890 --> 44:02.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: How do they get the number, knowing how to, you know, how do they know what number to call?
[44:02.710 --> 44:06.630]  [SPEAKER_13]: Well, if they're using the phone lines, they have to have a deal with the phone company, I guess.
[44:06.830 --> 44:07.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: Bernie, do you know anything about this?
[44:08.050 --> 44:11.070]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, if they're going to be at the side of the building connecting a...
[44:11.070 --> 44:12.130]  [SPEAKER_04]: This is Ridgewood, New Jersey.
[44:12.130 --> 44:14.370]  [SPEAKER_04]: What if you're in an apartment building or something?
[44:14.570 --> 44:14.710]  [SPEAKER_04]: Hello?
[44:14.970 --> 44:15.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, we know it's Ridgewood.
[44:16.310 --> 44:17.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let Bernie speak.
[44:17.470 --> 44:17.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: Go ahead.
[44:18.630 --> 44:26.570]  [SPEAKER_04]: If they're on the side of a building with a lot of people, like a lot of tenants in it, they're going to have to know what your phone number is so they can make sure they're connecting it to the right line.
[44:27.310 --> 44:33.930]  [SPEAKER_04]: Now, they could connect something to a phone line and dial in an ANAC number that would read their phone number back or something like that.
[44:34.090 --> 44:35.810]  [SPEAKER_04]: But this whole thing makes me pretty uncomfortable.
[44:35.810 --> 44:42.970]  [SPEAKER_04]: I would just simply disconnect the thing and maybe once a month reconnect it for five minutes or whatever.
[44:42.970 --> 44:45.850]  [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know whether the thing calls out or does it answer a call from...
[44:45.850 --> 44:47.330]  [SPEAKER_13]: My question is simpler than that.
[44:47.410 --> 44:50.010]  [SPEAKER_13]: Can we legally go to some commission about it?
[44:50.050 --> 44:50.930]  [SPEAKER_13]: I guess I'll hang up.
[44:51.870 --> 44:53.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, well, that's really smart.
[44:53.410 --> 44:54.510]  [SPEAKER_13]: Oh, very frustrated.
[44:54.510 --> 45:00.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: I guess I was going to ask him what his concern was, but we'll never hear his concern now because he hung up.
[45:00.630 --> 45:02.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, well, I don't know.
[45:02.950 --> 45:07.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: I would imagine you can go to all the hearings you want and simply make it an issue.
[45:08.050 --> 45:11.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: And I'm sure they will come up with a plan for people who don't want to be part of this.
[45:11.990 --> 45:21.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, you can't really impose new things on people without, you know, expecting them to react in some way and having some sort of a plan for people who don't want this.
[45:21.990 --> 45:25.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, there's a plan for people who don't want caller ID, who don't want their number being sent across.
[45:26.090 --> 45:29.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: If the phone company had it their way, everybody's number would be sent across at all times.
[45:29.550 --> 45:33.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: And then, you know, caller ID would actually be a service that, you know, would be worth more.
[45:34.530 --> 45:40.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: But people raise questions about privacy issues, so they change the rules.
[45:40.490 --> 45:54.770]  [SPEAKER_04]: Any recording device, and this is a recording device, you record the meter readings connected to a phone line, it wouldn't be too hard for somebody to make something that would look like a water company recording device.
[45:54.850 --> 46:01.010]  [SPEAKER_04]: Put that on the phone line and have that instead record all the phone numbers that you dial or record your conversations or whatever.
[46:01.010 --> 46:02.570]  [SPEAKER_04]: Right, the pen register type of thing.
[46:02.670 --> 46:07.730]  [SPEAKER_04]: And just, you know, I just, I'm very disturbed by the idea of anybody other than me connecting anything to my phone line.
[46:07.810 --> 46:09.070]  [SPEAKER_04]: Of course, that's why I don't use a phone line.
[46:09.170 --> 46:13.830]  [SPEAKER_04]: I use a wireless phone that I think is a bit more secure than on a wired line.
[46:13.930 --> 46:16.070]  [SPEAKER_04]: At least nobody's going to be on the side of my house hooking anything up to it.
[46:16.190 --> 46:18.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, it's pretty funny, because a couple of years ago, it was the exact opposite.
[46:18.710 --> 46:26.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: A cellular phone was something that, you know, everything is broadcast, and you could just simply listen to people's conversations, which you can still do quite a bit.
[46:26.330 --> 46:31.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: A lot of people still use regular analog cells, and even though it's illegal, you can just turn on a radio and listen to them.
[46:32.070 --> 46:33.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, it's pretty funny.
[46:33.290 --> 46:39.030]  [SPEAKER_14]: We have this thing that someone sent in to us, user instructions for the Centex Ovation System.
[46:39.350 --> 46:47.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, this, we were talking about similar things a couple of weeks ago as far as buildings where people are allowed entry by telephone.
[46:47.350 --> 46:49.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, here are the exact instructions on how this works.
[46:50.070 --> 46:53.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: Your building has been equipped with a Centex Ovation System.
[46:53.050 --> 46:58.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: The following steps are involved in using the visitor entry capability of the Ovation System.
[46:58.450 --> 47:06.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: Number one, the Ovation System uses your existing phone lines to let you talk to visitors and allow them access to your building, if you so desire.
[47:06.550 --> 47:11.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: A visitor is instructed to find your directory code and enter your code on the keypad.
[47:12.090 --> 47:15.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: The system then connects itself to your telephone line and rings your telephone.
[47:15.870 --> 47:27.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: I should point out that when it does this, you can hear very clearly either the DTMF or the rotary pulse of your phone number in the street as it's connecting you to the person that you're trying to ring.
[47:27.470 --> 47:31.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: Number two, upon answering the telephone, you will be in a normal conversation with the visitor.
[47:32.090 --> 47:36.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: Be sure to speak clearly and strongly so the visitor can hear you over any noise at the door.
[47:37.130 --> 47:39.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: And also, anyone else in the street can hear you.
[47:39.590 --> 47:44.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you are on the telephone when a visitor attempts to contact you, you will hear two tones.
[47:45.130 --> 47:48.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is the call waiting feature, which we have nothing to do with.
[47:48.730 --> 47:53.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: Dialing a two on your telephone will place your call on hold and connect you to the visitor.
[47:54.150 --> 47:54.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: Pretty interesting.
[47:54.970 --> 47:57.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: You dial two and all of a sudden you're connected to somebody else.
[47:58.350 --> 48:03.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: It sounds like they put in some sort of, you know, a Centrix type system into these buildings.
[48:04.210 --> 48:05.850]  [SPEAKER_04]: All it is is like an auto dialer, isn't it?
[48:06.270 --> 48:08.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, the dialing a two part is different.
[48:08.470 --> 48:10.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, when you get call waiting, you don't dial two.
[48:10.350 --> 48:11.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: You have to hit flash hook.
[48:11.530 --> 48:12.190]  [SPEAKER_09]: Oh, I see what you're saying.
[48:12.190 --> 48:14.450]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, so this is something new that they put on everybody's lines.
[48:14.610 --> 48:17.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: Dialing a two again will switch you back to the normal telephone call.
[48:18.490 --> 48:24.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Number three, once you have put the normal call on hold and answered the visitor call by pressing a two, you may take one of two actions.
[48:25.030 --> 48:29.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: Number one, dial a nine to open the door and let the visitor into the building.
[48:29.510 --> 48:34.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: Number two, dial a two to switch back to normal telephone call that you have on hold.
[48:34.730 --> 48:44.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: While connected to the visitor ten seconds prior to the end of the call, you will begin to hear a short tone each second to signal you the call is about to end.
[48:44.950 --> 48:47.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: Press the star key to hang up without allowing entry.
[48:48.970 --> 48:51.550]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm not quite sure how they know when the end of the call is coming.
[48:51.670 --> 48:59.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: While connected to the visitor 10 seconds prior to the end of the call, you'll begin to hear a short tone each second to signal you that the call is about to end.
[48:59.570 --> 49:02.350]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's probably a time-out and it lets you know 10 seconds before that.
[49:02.470 --> 49:05.690]  [SPEAKER_14]: I guess they don't want people talking for long periods of time on these little intercom things.
[49:05.970 --> 49:12.750]  [SPEAKER_04]: What if the visitor brings a Touch-Tone, a portable Touch-Tone dialer with them and plays that 9 into the mouthpiece of this phone?
[49:12.750 --> 49:20.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: I imagine they have been somewhat smart enough to cut off the mouthpiece so that they can't do that.
[49:20.390 --> 49:21.950]  [SPEAKER_04]: But you have a pretty wild imagination.
[49:22.310 --> 49:23.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, here's the thing.
[49:23.650 --> 49:26.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: When I was in California a few years ago, we were playing with things like this.
[49:26.790 --> 49:28.890]  [SPEAKER_14]: And we weren't trying to get into people's apartments.
[49:28.950 --> 49:31.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: We were trying to make phone calls on the things because, you know, it plays a dial tone.
[49:32.230 --> 49:35.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: But the DTMF didn't seem to be loud enough to break the dial tone.
[49:36.210 --> 49:37.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's the problem we ran into.
[49:37.770 --> 49:40.570]  [SPEAKER_04]: How about with an inductive coupler around the earpiece?
[49:40.570 --> 49:43.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I'm sure other scientific methods have been tried in other cities.
[49:43.990 --> 49:48.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: And maybe those people in charge of that research can get back to us and let us know how they fared.
[49:49.150 --> 49:55.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: Continuing with these instructions, if you hang up your phone during a visitor call, after putting an outside call on hold, your telephone will ring.
[49:56.250 --> 49:59.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: When you pick up the phone, you will be connected to the outside call that was put on hold.
[49:59.590 --> 50:07.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you hang up from an outside call while a visitor is waiting, your phone will ring and you will be connected with the visitor when you pick up the phone.
[50:08.310 --> 50:11.450]  [SPEAKER_14]: Regardless of who is on hold, the system will automatically hang up after three rings.
[50:11.890 --> 50:18.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: I feel sorry for, you know, senior citizens and people that aren't really, you know, into all this technology, having to deal with all this.
[50:19.070 --> 50:20.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: What was that horrible noise?
[50:21.490 --> 50:22.590]  [SPEAKER_04]: I'm sitting on the street.
[50:22.990 --> 50:23.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh.
[50:23.610 --> 50:24.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, well, you know...
[50:24.750 --> 50:25.750]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's a motorcycle.
[50:25.930 --> 50:26.450]  [SPEAKER_14]: Whatever you're into.
[50:27.030 --> 50:33.690]  [SPEAKER_14]: Number four, if you dial the nine, the ovation system will unlock the door for a preset period of time and a tone will be heard on the speaker.
[50:34.530 --> 50:36.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: And the person will enter your building.
[50:37.430 --> 50:37.710]  Uh-huh.
[50:38.150 --> 50:39.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's pretty nice to know that.
[50:39.990 --> 50:43.650]  [SPEAKER_04]: Two years ago, I lived in an apartment building where there was an Entregard system.
[50:44.110 --> 50:50.050]  [SPEAKER_04]: And I used to delight in using my then cellular phone to stand out in front of the building.
[50:50.090 --> 50:51.230]  [SPEAKER_04]: Actually, I could do it with a cordless phone.
[50:51.310 --> 50:51.830]  [SPEAKER_04]: I did that, too.
[50:52.790 --> 50:57.190]  [SPEAKER_04]: Calling the phone number, I found out what the phone number was that the Entregard system was connected to.
[50:57.330 --> 50:59.010]  [SPEAKER_04]: That was simply an auto-dialer kind of thing.
[50:59.170 --> 50:59.390]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh-huh.
[50:59.390 --> 51:06.570]  [SPEAKER_04]: It did run to a hardware thing to the front door when you hit a touchdown nine or I think it was a five there.
[51:06.890 --> 51:06.990]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh-huh.
[51:06.990 --> 51:15.250]  [SPEAKER_04]: Anyway, when the UPS man or the mailman or whoever would come to the door, they'd enter a special code that would just let them in.
[51:15.370 --> 51:16.830]  [SPEAKER_04]: I never knew what that code was.
[51:17.050 --> 51:20.370]  [SPEAKER_04]: But they'd have to pick up the phone, get a dial tone, and enter this code.
[51:20.590 --> 51:22.710]  [SPEAKER_04]: So I would wait for them to pick up the phone.
[51:22.850 --> 51:29.030]  [SPEAKER_04]: And as soon as they picked up the phone, or see them approaching the phone out front, I would call that number assigned to that pair.
[51:29.750 --> 51:35.510]  [SPEAKER_04]: And they'd pick up the phone, and I could say things to them like, you know, come back later, we're not ready for you, or whatever.
[51:36.270 --> 51:37.930]  [SPEAKER_04]: And they got a kick out of that.
[51:38.690 --> 51:45.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: But a number of years ago, you know those ATMs that have the phones that you pick up if you have trouble?
[51:45.190 --> 51:47.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, they're regular phone lines, and they dial regular numbers.
[51:47.750 --> 51:53.370]  [SPEAKER_14]: And if you're fortunate enough to find out the phone number of that phone line, you can call into it.
[51:53.670 --> 51:57.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: And usually they have the bell disconnected, so it's ringing, but nobody knows it's ringing.
[51:57.850 --> 52:04.370]  [SPEAKER_14]: So then, people would pick up the phone, and the number would dial because it wouldn't check for a dial tone.
[52:04.690 --> 52:07.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: In actuality, though, it would be picking up the incoming call that we were making.
[52:08.170 --> 52:11.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: And at that point, the person would be connected to someone they thought was the bank.
[52:11.930 --> 52:18.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: And we used to, this was a number of years ago, a long time ago, way past any statute of limitations that I know of.
[52:18.390 --> 52:21.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: And we would just say something like, bank, you know?
[52:21.490 --> 52:22.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: We wouldn't even give the name.
[52:22.810 --> 52:27.370]  [SPEAKER_14]: And then they'd ask us a question, and we'd just be totally obnoxious to them, saying, we can't do that.
[52:27.850 --> 52:29.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, we have better things to do than help you.
[52:30.050 --> 52:34.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, of course, there was a surge in people switching to different banks that month.
[52:35.350 --> 52:37.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: But I think you can still do it to this day.
[52:37.570 --> 52:39.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, of course, we've moved on to bigger and better things.
[52:39.470 --> 52:40.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's take another phone call.
[52:40.850 --> 52:42.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: 212-279-3400.
[52:42.150 --> 52:42.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening.
[52:42.570 --> 52:43.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're on Off the Hook.
[52:43.810 --> 52:44.410]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes, hello.
[52:44.630 --> 52:44.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: How are you doing?
[52:45.470 --> 52:49.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I wanted to tell you about those intercoms that you were talking about.
[52:49.810 --> 52:50.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes.
[52:57.950 --> 52:58.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: Touchstones?
[52:58.550 --> 52:58.890]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[52:59.110 --> 52:59.330]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay.
[52:59.490 --> 53:05.370]  [SPEAKER_02]: And those tones, if you could decode them, you can actually punch them on the keypad, and it'll open the door automatically.
[53:05.590 --> 53:08.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: Those tones, are they heard by the person in the street or the person in the apartment?
[53:08.830 --> 53:09.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: No, the person in the apartment.
[53:10.410 --> 53:12.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: So they hear a string of touchstones.
[53:12.330 --> 53:17.130]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, when you press 9, you hear, like, a string of touchstones, like, let's say, about 5 to 6.
[53:17.250 --> 53:17.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: Really?
[53:17.490 --> 53:18.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: 6 of them, yeah.
[53:18.630 --> 53:30.490]  [SPEAKER_02]: And if you decode those tones, you can actually go downstairs in the street, press the pound key to get the dial tone, and then punch in a code, and the door, you hear a loud beep, and the door would, you know, open.
[53:31.070 --> 53:31.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's interesting.
[53:32.110 --> 53:32.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's very interesting.
[53:34.030 --> 53:42.570]  [SPEAKER_02]: Actually, I never really got a... I never knew about the... if you press 2, the 2 feature, if it clicks, it flashes over.
[53:42.790 --> 53:42.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[53:43.250 --> 53:44.330]  [SPEAKER_02]: But, um...
[53:44.330 --> 53:45.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: You may have a different system.
[53:45.750 --> 53:46.050]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[53:46.050 --> 53:51.190]  [SPEAKER_02]: You see, I'm... also, I try to make phone calls out of that, as well, but it doesn't work.
[53:51.330 --> 53:53.930]  [SPEAKER_02]: It only... because once you dial four digits...
[53:53.930 --> 53:54.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[53:54.390 --> 53:56.070]  [SPEAKER_02]: It automatically rings someone's apartment.
[53:56.510 --> 54:06.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, it's because it's, uh, it's some sort of an internal system there, so that... it probably won't work for that reason, but I'm more concerned with the special code that opens up the door that, you know, if that gets out.
[54:07.010 --> 54:07.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[54:07.390 --> 54:09.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, all you have to do, really, do you have a tape recorder?
[54:09.690 --> 54:10.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just record those tones.
[54:10.930 --> 54:12.530]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I tried to... I tried to record it.
[54:13.010 --> 54:14.570]  [SPEAKER_02]: Actually, I'm going to try that tonight.
[54:14.750 --> 54:14.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[54:14.970 --> 54:16.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: To see if I could decode those tones.
[54:16.950 --> 54:18.710]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, I know it's about five to six.
[54:18.870 --> 54:19.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[54:19.250 --> 54:22.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: And I know it starts with, uh, I think a three.
[54:22.650 --> 54:22.910]  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh-huh.
[54:22.910 --> 54:23.770]  [SPEAKER_02]: Mine starts with a three.
[54:23.890 --> 54:25.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: I think they all have different ones.
[54:25.430 --> 54:28.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's possible it might even be some silver box tones in there, which would be A, B, C, D.
[54:28.910 --> 54:35.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: What you should do, record those, call up the 2600 Voice BBS, and there's a feature there that allows you to, uh...
[54:35.870 --> 54:36.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: Decode the tones, yeah.
[54:36.490 --> 54:38.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: Decode Touch-Tones, including A, B, C, and D.
[54:39.210 --> 54:40.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, I didn't know that.
[54:40.150 --> 54:43.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, so that way, if those tones are in there, you'll know what they are.
[54:43.950 --> 54:44.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, cool.
[54:44.210 --> 54:44.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: And get back to us.
[54:44.750 --> 54:45.450]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let us know what they are.
[54:45.530 --> 54:49.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, if people can enter a building just by entering a code, that's something that needs to be known.
[54:49.890 --> 54:50.110]  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
[54:50.610 --> 54:50.950]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[54:51.130 --> 54:51.330]  [SPEAKER_02]: All right.
[54:51.330 --> 54:51.790]  [SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for calling.
[54:52.170 --> 54:53.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: We are out of time already.
[54:54.550 --> 54:55.690]  [SPEAKER_14]: Boy, time goes by fast.
[54:56.510 --> 54:57.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, Bernie, um...
[54:57.750 --> 54:57.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[54:57.950 --> 54:59.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: Anything you need to leave us with?
[54:59.930 --> 55:13.270]  [SPEAKER_04]: I just wanted to thank the Federal Communications Commission's top compliance and enforcement officer for coming to the East Coast Micro Broadcasting Conference, and for unwittingly broadcasting his own message over a pirate radio station that he vowed to shut down.
[55:13.630 --> 55:19.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, let's give some credit to Porkshop, our real audio person, for actually managing to figure this one out, where...
[55:19.290 --> 55:20.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: What was it that happened again?
[55:20.230 --> 55:37.590]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, the audio from the Friday night debate with the FCC was actually transmitted by Sprint PCS to a phone number, which was then forwarded to a secret number at the Radio Mutiny, which was then fed into a phone patch, then out through the air at 91.3 MHz,
[55:37.810 --> 55:50.750]  [SPEAKER_04]: picked up by someone else who fed that audio into their computer, digitized it, sent it up to Porkshop, who then ran it out via real audio to the world, where we believe it was picked up by a shortwave radio pirate in the Midwest and broadcast on 69.55 kHz.
[55:50.910 --> 56:00.750]  [SPEAKER_04]: So the FCC got quite a lot of broadcast time over pirate radio stations that night, which I imagine didn't make them too happy that they were breaking a law.
[56:00.750 --> 56:08.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, it's good to reach a lot of people, and they certainly reached a lot of people over this weekend, and hopefully we'll be updating folks with what happens in the weeks ahead.
[56:09.270 --> 56:13.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: Bernie, thanks very much for being with us, and thanks again to all those people who showed up over the weekend in Philadelphia.
[56:13.730 --> 56:14.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is Emmanuel Goldstein.
[56:14.950 --> 56:17.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: We'll be back again with another edition of Off the Hook next week.
[56:18.070 --> 56:18.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: Until then, good night.
[56:27.260 --> 56:31.760]  [SPEAKER_15]: The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
[56:32.660 --> 56:37.340]  [SPEAKER_15]: I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a cost.
[56:38.000 --> 56:40.040]  [SPEAKER_15]: It couldn't get much worse,
[56:44.260 --> 56:45.460]  [SPEAKER_07]: to stay for worse.
[56:46.000 --> 56:48.960]  [SPEAKER_07]: I hope that's understood, but make me move!
[57:47.020 --> 57:56.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: As a result of the recent elections in India, our government led by the right-wing Hindu fundamentalist party, the BJP, has come into power.
[57:56.780 --> 57:59.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: How did this happen, and what are its possible consequences?
[58:00.380 --> 58:20.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: On Wednesday, April 8th at 9pm, the Asia-Pacific Forum at WBAI brings you a special hour-long program on the Indian elections, produced by the progressive South Asian magazine, Samar, carrying interviews with political figures and commentators, based both in India and here in the U.S.
[58:20.700 --> 58:32.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: So don't forget to tune in on Wednesday, April 8th at 9pm, here on WBAI 99.5 FM, for an in-depth look at the Indian elections and their aftermath.
[58:35.580 --> 58:40.920]  [SPEAKER_10]: Tune Tuesday night for a special edition of the Weaponry Show.
[58:41.200 --> 58:47.900]  [SPEAKER_10]: The Tuskegee Airmen and their descendants, what are they doing in general aviation today?
[58:48.360 --> 59:00.360]  [SPEAKER_10]: This question will be answered Tuesday night on Weaponry, 12 midnight, WBAI New York, 99.5 FM.
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[01:00:08.380 --> 01:00:10.420]  [SPEAKER_01]: And good evening.
[01:00:10.600 --> 01:00:13.680]  [SPEAKER_01]: The time is 9.01 and 30 seconds.
[01:00:13.980 --> 01:00:24.840]  [SPEAKER_01]: You're listening to WBAI's Arab Voices Crescent Rising, heard every Tuesday from 9 to 10 here on WBAI 99.5 FM.
[01:00:24.840 --> 01:00:32.940]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm your host, Barbara Nimri-Aziz, inviting you to relax for the next hour and join us today when we celebrate the Hajj.
[01:00:33.080 --> 01:00:40.980]  [SPEAKER_01]: We say Eid Mubarak to all our Muslim community members here and abroad all over the world.
[01:00:41.240 --> 01:00:44.640]  [SPEAKER_01]: Muslims are celebrating the great Eid al-Adha.
[01:00:44.860 --> 01:00:48.380]  [SPEAKER_01]: And our program is going to be precisely about Eid.
[01:00:48.380 --> 01:00:55.200]  [SPEAKER_01]: First, an interview with author Michael Wolff, and then a segment produced by our own Ibrahim Gonzalez.
[01:00:55.480 --> 01:00:57.860]  [SPEAKER_01]: So relax and stay tuned.