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And you're listening to radio station WBAI in New York.
The time is 8 o'clock.
Time for Off the Hook.
The telephone keeps ringing.
So I ripped it off the wall.
I cut myself while shaving.
Now I can't make a call.
It couldn't get much worse.
But if it could, it would.
But Billy Bump was the best to expect the worst.
I hope that's understood.
But Billy Bump!
Cheers!
Thank you.
And a very good evening to everybody.
The program is Off the Hook.
And for the first time in a long time, I'm back in the studio here in beautiful downtown New York City.
And boy, what an adventure it's been over the past however many weeks.
The show has been on the road, except for Phil, who's pretty much been here the whole time.
Yeah, I actually missed your voice over the phone.
Yeah, I actually missed your voice over the phone.
It does sound better, doesn't it?
Could you call in and maybe patch it through you?
All the time we spend trying to figure out how to make a simple phone call going out, I think calling in would be even more difficult, but maybe we'll try that later.
We have Phil here, and I believe that's Porkchop next to him.
Hello.
How are you doing?
All right.
Porkchop was with us for the first part of the trip out to Las Vegas, serving as sound man for the documentary that we're making on the whole Kevin Mitnick slash hacker scene that's been going on.
And what an amazing story it's been so far.
And, of course, it wouldn't be complete if we did not also give acknowledgement to SNC, who was with us the whole trip.
How are you doing?
Hello out there.
SNC joined us.
That's his birth name, by the way.
You can look it up.
I did, and it really is his name.
That's true.
He was with us from the very beginning.
Was it five weeks ago, six weeks ago?
I don't even remember.
Late July is when we left.
And basically what we did was we journeyed out across New Jersey, across Pennsylvania, all the way over to Kansas City.
Then we went down to Oklahoma and journeyed over to Las Vegas, making sort of a wrong stop along the way.
But that's something we're just going to forget about for now.
And then a lot of time in California, an awful lot of time in California, because there are so many people there to talk to, so many interesting people.
We spent time in San Diego, Los Angeles, and San Francisco, Berkeley area as well.
And I'd say we talked to just about everybody, minus one person, that was involved in this whole takedown scenario.
And, of course, the person we didn't speak to was the guy who was behind the whole takedown thing in the first place, Satomo Shimomura.
We did speak to John Markov, and he gave us quite a bit of time.
We'll have a lot of interesting things to divulge in the, I guess it's months ahead now, because, well, I don't know if people out there, there are very many filmmakers, people who have made things like this.
But we have over 60 hours of footage right now.
And for those of you who follow this kind of thing, we did it in a DV format.
And DV, for those who don't know, is yet another format for people to get all confused with.
It's not DVD.
It's not 8mm videotape.
It looks like that tape, but it won't fit no matter how hard you try to cram it into the machine.
It just won't go in there.
But it's digital video.
And now we just have to figure out how to edit it.
So we're either going to go with something like Adobe Premiere or maybe even an Avid system if we can get our hands on one of those.
So if anybody has any suggestions or ideas or you just happen to have something that you don't need that will do just what we want to do, you can email us at OTH at 2600.com.
OTH, of course, standing for off the hook.
After California, we ventured back in this general direction, heading over the northern part of Nevada, seeing Reno, which I think we mentioned a couple weeks ago on the show, Vile Town.
Then Salt Lake City, Denver, and then the longest drive of my life, Denver to Austin in one sitting, or however many times it took to stand up to get gas.
Then after that, we journeyed to where we were last week, which basically took us through New Orleans.
And last week's show took place from a payphone down in Alabama.
And I still remember that place.
I still have nightmares about it.
It's kind of a swamp we were calling from.
All kinds of weird noises coming from the swamp and insects all over the place.
And that's when we first warned people about the hurricane.
Well, actually, we warned the takedown crew because they were filming in Wilmington, North Carolina.
And a lot of people thought we were joking when we said that Hurricane Bonnie was heading straight for the takedown set.
We weren't joking.
We don't joke.
This was not a humorous anecdote here.
We were actually trying to save some lives.
We were trying to ensure that people were around for future film careers, however ill-conceived.
And, you know, the forecast was right on track.
The hurricane was heading straight for Wilmington.
And, in fact, it did hit Wilmington.
And so did we, actually.
We, contrary to all the advice we gave, and we couldn't really say this over the air last week because we didn't want to inspire people to do the wrong thing.
You know, we have to maintain some sort of maturity on the program.
We didn't want to make it seem as if we were doing something irrational and immature ourselves.
That's why we didn't tell you that right after we hung up the phone last week, we got into the car and started driving like crazy so we could make it in time for the hurricane, which we did.
We made it to Wilmington, North Carolina in the dawn hours just as the hurricane was moving in.
And I got to tell you, it was probably the most frightening experience, one of the most frightening experiences I've ever gone through because here we are in this town that's like, you know, everybody's running for cover.
Literally, people running for cover.
Everybody's off the streets.
We're the only lunatics out there driving around trying to, you know, see what's up, you know, to drop in on the takedown crew and say hi to them.
And we got there.
Of course, nobody else was out.
The takedown crew was not around.
And all the hotel rooms were taken by all the vacationers who were abandoning the beaches.
So it was a scary thing.
Let's just say it all worked out for the best.
We have some other adventures that took place in Wilmington.
The hurricane hit.
It was spectacular.
We have some interesting footage of that as well.
And we found the takedown people.
But we'll talk about that a little bit later.
SNC, you have...
I do believe the worst part of the hurricane was Waffle House did not have any waffles.
Yeah, you know, that was scary.
But, you know, I thank God, and I have thanked God every day since this happened, that there was a Waffle House.
Because we were driving around.
There was nothing.
Everything was closed.
Everything was shuttered up.
Hooters was shut up.
You know, blockbuster video.
It was all closed.
It was scary.
I've never seen anything quite like it.
All civilization just had vanished.
And then, like a beacon, like a star rising in the middle of a stormy sky,
were the Yellow Letters Waffle House.
We don't have those down here, or over here, up here.
But down there, they have them.
And Waffle House, it's like a house where they have waffles.
You know, basically that's what they do.
They, you know, it's waffles.
But when we went there, they didn't have it.
The place was crowded, full of people.
Mostly cops.
Because I guess that's where they went between telling people not to be outside.
And they had no waffles.
They just had, like, ham sandwiches and other things that took literally 30 seconds to make.
You know, I said, okay, I think I'll have this.
And, you know, before I finished with the punctuation for the sentence, it was, you know,
she had come back with what I wanted, which was awful, by the way.
It was terrible.
Because, I don't know, I guess they weren't used to serving this kind of food.
But it was sheltered for us.
And through that Waffle House, we were able to find a place to stay.
We found the last motel room in Wilmington, North Carolina.
So that kept us going for a little while longer.
Scary, though.
Goes to show the kind of thing that can happen in times of crisis.
And that hurricane, of course, never made it up here.
So people here have no idea what it was like.
It was scary.
It really was.
And that's the first time I think I've ever gone to a hurricane.
They've always come to me.
And, you know, I like them.
I like exciting weather.
But that's the first time I ever actually journeyed to one.
Now, as far as the actual takedown set,
it wasn't hard to find because we had the address.
And we went over there, but nobody was there.
There's a little handwritten sign on the guardhouse saying,
Closed, due to Bonnie.
Bonnie being the name of the hurricane.
Also the name of Kevin Mitnick's ex-wife,
which I thought was kind of ironic.
And everybody was gone, so we just kind of wandered around.
And this was with winds in excess of 75 miles per hour.
So wandering was challenging, to say the least.
But, you know, we wandered around places we weren't supposed to wander around in.
But there was nobody to stop us.
We were kind of looking around.
We didn't expect to really see anybody from the crew, from the movie,
at that point in time.
But the next day, after they were picking up the pieces
and power was slowly being restored in various parts of the town,
we went to the one place that had power,
only a couple of places that had power,
and that was at Burger King.
You know, there weren't very many places,
and it wouldn't have been my choice otherwise,
but it was crowded full of people,
literally a half-hour line to get food there, you know,
and people, you know, looting and fighting,
you know, the things you expect in a hurricane.
And after all that had finished,
I met this person who said,
Hey, you look like a film person.
And I guess that's kind of a compliment.
I don't know yet if that's a compliment.
You know, it might not be.
But she asked,
Well, what film are you involved with?
And, you know, it wasn't entirely a lie
when I said I was involved with Takedown,
because that is basically why we were there,
because we wanted to, you know,
talk to the people involved with Takedown.
So, yeah, I said, you know, I'm involved with Takedown.
You wouldn't have to know where they're staying, would you?
She didn't.
She didn't know where they were staying,
but she had a list of possibilities,
possible places where they might be staying.
And we figured, you know, we'd stop by and say hi.
Now, even with a list of possibilities,
it's difficult to find somebody.
What do you do?
You know, you knock on every single room
and see who's around.
You know, it's not that easy.
But we had something on our side.
We had a tremendous advantage.
Stupidity.
Yeah.
Not on our side.
Stupidity on the other side,
because assuming these people wanted to hide,
they weren't doing a very good job of it.
Apparently, they thought it was cool
to slap free Kevin stickers on their cars.
And when we went to one of the hotels,
we saw cars with free Kevin stickers,
and we said,
aha, this is the place.
We found them.
So we were able to walk into the reception room
of the hotel and say,
yeah, we're here to see the takedown people.
Where are they staying?
And, you know, like magic,
they told us everything we wanted to know.
They told us the names.
They told us the room numbers,
social security numbers,
you know, mother's maiden name,
everything.
Everything you could possibly want to know.
You know, they just sort of, you know,
gave it to us in a little form,
and we thanked them graciously,
and then proceeded to knock on some doors.
And we met a couple of people,
and they all said,
hey, you know,
we were expecting to see you.
It's, you know,
they were scared to death.
You could tell by the looks in their faces.
They turned like this ashen white, you know.
And it was funny.
It really was.
But they were happy to see us.
They seemed to be genuinely happy,
and they said,
look, you know,
we definitely want to do something
for your documentary.
We want to talk to you.
And talk to our publicist.
So we went over,
talked to the publicist,
and she was frightened too,
but she made arrangements,
took our numbers,
and said she was going to get back to us.
The next day,
we heard from her,
said that they wouldn't be able
to do anything until Sunday
because Sunday was the day
that they were going back to work.
And, you know,
I tried to call her back.
She didn't give me a phone number,
but I found her phone number anyway
because I sort of pieced it together,
and plus she was listed in the phone book.
And basically what we did was
we called her back
and left a message saying,
look, if it's possible to see
somebody beforehand,
you know,
we'd be out of your hair all the sooner.
There's nothing to do
in this damn town.
There's no power anyplace.
There's no fun.
Let's just, you know,
you guys aren't working.
You're not doing anything right now,
so maybe this would be
a good time to talk to us.
Well, we didn't hear anything back.
They didn't call us back,
didn't get the message
or whatever.
I don't know.
And Sunday came,
and keep in mind,
this was several days afterwards.
You know,
we had to stay in Wilmington,
North Carolina.
Nice place.
Lovely people.
I have no criticism
about the place at all,
but, you know,
a hurricane had just hit.
And, you know,
the first night,
which was a Thursday night,
they had a curfew.
You know,
this wasn't during the hurricane.
This was after.
This was a full day
after the hurricane.
They just say casually,
oh, yes,
there's a curfew in town tonight
from, what was it,
10 p.m.
to 6 a.m.
And I'm like,
whoa,
what is this?
The Democratic Congo here?
What was it?
I'm going to be shot or something
if I'm walking down a street?
What's the meaning of this?
I've never in my life
been in a situation
where by governmental order
I'm not allowed to walk out
outside the street.
You know,
and I was just incredulous.
And I made it my mission
to break the curfew.
One way or another.
The problem is
I couldn't find a reason to.
There was nothing open.
I couldn't go out
to get something
because there was nothing
there to get.
You know,
at one point we decided
we need ice.
You know,
we need ice for our hotel room.
So we're going to go out
to find ice.
But then we found ice
at the hotel.
So that didn't work.
So there was nothing to do,
really.
We couldn't break curfew
because, you know,
there was nowhere to go.
We walked around a little bit,
walked around on the street.
But it was boring.
There was no place to go.
And we were scared.
So, yeah.
So we weren't very
happy being there.
We wanted to leave.
We didn't want to stay there
much longer.
The curfew only lasted one night.
And I still don't know
why there was a curfew.
It didn't make any sense.
And the casualness
with which people accepted it.
Oh, yeah.
Curfew tonight.
Stay in.
He gets shot.
You know, that's something
I can never get used to.
So Sunday comes around.
We get a phone call
from the publicist
saying,
Oh, okay.
It's Sunday.
Now, well, I'm sorry,
but we can't talk to you at all.
That's just,
we're too busy
because we're,
we've got to make up
for all this lost time.
And I'm beside myself.
I'm incredulous.
Lost time.
This lost time.
Six days
of not being on the set.
And
what were these people doing
during that time
when they could have
been talking to us?
They could have told us
at the time,
No, we don't want
to talk to you.
They could have said,
you know,
get out of this town.
Leave now.
You know,
don't come into our hotel rooms.
Don't say anything like that.
They didn't say anything like that.
They didn't,
they didn't give us a clue
until the very last moment.
And then they said,
Well, you know,
sorry, we just can't do it.
So we wasted all this time
in Wilmington, North Carolina,
just sort of wandering around.
And then we figured,
you know,
well,
let's at least say goodbye
to a couple of the people,
you know,
because we had met up
with one of the producers
and we just wanted
to say goodbye.
So we went to the same hotel
and asked them,
you know,
are these guys still here?
The same hotel clerk
that we had seen
the first time
who was,
you know,
gushing all this information
to us
just kind of,
kind of like
staggered back to the wall
and like looked around
and said,
No,
they're all gone.
They're all gone.
They left.
They're not around here anymore.
And we said,
okay,
well,
in that case,
you have a good day.
And we left.
And less than,
less than three minutes later,
my phone rang
and it was the publicist saying,
please don't try to track us down.
You're not going to find us.
So she had the hotel personnel
contacting her
if we even tried to find them.
Now,
this is incredible
because all we wanted to do
was talk to these people
about the film,
you know,
and they seemed willing
to talk to us.
And apparently,
when we found them
the first time,
we had put the fear of God
into them for real
and they had put all kinds of,
like,
you know,
memos and notices up
saying,
well,
you know,
don't ever talk to these people
and if they ever contact you,
contact me immediately.
It was really kind of funny.
And,
you know,
all we were trying to do
was say goodbye,
you know,
say goodbye to these people
and see if they wanted
to work something out
in New York.
But,
you know,
their first way of dealing with it
is just utter suspicion
and hostility
and it was kind of weird.
So we went all the way down
there to Willington,
North Carolina
and we didn't get the interviews
with the people involved
in the film.
But we did get lots of neat footage
and we learned quite a bit too
about the people
putting out the film.
and we,
since we have over 60 hours
of other footage,
you know,
I don't think we really
need to hear from them
but we just thought
we'd give them the opportunity.
I mean,
you guys surprised by this?
Not at all.
Yeah?
They're evil people.
That's it.
Well,
a lot of people told us
to expect them to be evil
but,
you know,
I always like to give people
a chance to prove it,
you know,
and I don't know
if they're evil
but they certainly aren't
very image savvy.
Let's put it that way
because,
you know,
they had an opportunity
to say things in their own words
as far as where this film is going
and,
you know,
we've been hearing a lot of things
over the past few weeks
about just where this film is going
and what's been changing.
There have been changes.
They seem to be making an effort
to,
you know,
to fix things
but are they making
enough of an effort
and are those changes
merely cosmetic
or are they meaningful?
And those are the things
we wanted to tackle.
Those are the things
we wanted to,
you know,
to explore and see
just what the situation was
and unfortunately
we won't have the chance
to,
you know,
to explore it
from their point of view,
you know,
to hear what they have
to say about it.
Do you think it was just
a publicist perhaps
that was getting direct orders
from above?
Here's the thing.
They kept contradicting themselves.
She said that she got her orders
from Miramax,
you know,
directly from Miramax
and then when I said,
well,
can you ask Miramax this?
She said,
well,
they're not around.
You know,
they're not around today.
They're closed.
So if they were closed,
then how could she have
gotten the orders from them?
And,
you know,
if they're too busy
to talk to us,
how could they be off
for,
you know,
for six days?
On the day that they said
they couldn't talk to us,
they were not filming
or doing anything.
Yeah,
they weren't doing anything
and the way we found out this
was we were standing
in the street
and some of the crew
of the film
came up to us
because we had
free Kevin stickers
on our car too
and they said,
hey,
are you involved
with the film?
Of course,
we said yes too.
Brian,
from New York
is in Massachusetts
right now.
He also was on the set.
Brian,
are you there?
Yes,
I am here.
I'm sorry,
I forgot about you.
We called you up
at 8 o'clock
and I totally forgot
you were there
and I didn't bring you in
at all until now.
Sausage over Slam.
Yeah,
Brian is one of the guys
that was with us
from Las Vegas
to California
so we had kind of,
you know,
an alternating crew here
and he did a lot
of the camera work
in that part of the region
and,
well,
now,
any particular
memories that you
want to share?
I remember risking
my life
on the Hollywood Hill.
Oh,
that was something,
wasn't it?
I have nightmares
about that stuff.
Yeah,
now,
in case people
weren't listening
in the last couple
of shows,
what we did was
we,
you know,
it's not as easy
as you might think.
We found the Hollywood,
you know,
we found the word Hollywood
but finding the actual hill
and the road
that goes to that sign
is the really hard part
and we had to drive
around quite a bit.
Finally,
we abandoned the car
and just dove off
into the woods
and started,
you know,
really,
we got off the trail
completely.
We started climbing
a mountain,
you know,
a sheer mountain
and our goal
was to simply stand
in front of the Hollywood sign
with the free Kevin,
you know,
banner that we had used
at the Miramax protest
in New York
and we figured everybody
in Hollywood
would be able to see us.
Of course,
by the time we got there
we were so small
that you couldn't even
see a dot
from down in Hollywood.
The letters are about
50 feet high.
Yeah,
they're pretty tall.
They're scary.
They really are.
And one of the letters
has cameras on it too
so you have to be careful
with that
but everybody told us,
you know,
if you go there
you're going to
ho ho,
you're going to get
in all kinds of trouble
because there's cameras
and there's like people
who live in the woods
that come out of the woods
and attack you
if, you know,
you go near the letters.
Letters are sacred
but, you know,
we went there
and nobody bothered us
except, of course,
the, you know,
the bees.
I do believe the police
showed up three minutes
after we left.
Well, yeah,
there was a police chopper
that went by
and I think they were
looking for us
but they didn't find us
because we had just left.
But, yeah,
that mission was accomplished
and, of course,
Brian,
you had quite a time
because you were
the camera person
at that time
and we left you
I guess about a mile back
while we went
to the letters.
Right.
So that meant,
you know,
as the sun was falling
because, of course,
you know,
with all the foresight
that, you know,
we had to exercise here
we did this
in the last
waning moments
of daylight
so that the darkness
was descending upon us
really rapidly.
We couldn't go back
the way we came
because we didn't have
enough time
so we had to climb
the fence
and, uh,
you really have to make
phone calls here now.
Okay.
Okay.
There's,
Claude the engineer
decided to come in here
and use a phone
and use a speaker phone
and he's getting back
at you for that chaos
from now before.
So anyway,
um,
so we had to scale
the fence
and use the road
which we probably
should have used
to get there
in the first place
and Brian had to
go back
on foot
the way we had
come down a mountain
as it's getting dark
and I didn't realize
that, you know,
you didn't have
your glasses.
Yeah, I didn't have
my glasses.
I didn't realize that.
And I was trying
to, you know,
protect the camera
and all this.
Yeah, the camera
comes first.
It almost fell off
the cliff.
Yeah.
Yeah.
The camera
comes first
but you'll hit
a bee with it,
right?
Yeah.
Those killer bees.
Well, we didn't
find out that the
killer bees were
in the Hollywood Hills
until after we had
left.
I really didn't
know that.
But we kept
them at bay
and we got the
shot we needed
and we were able
to continue on
our way
and talk to
many other people.
And you guys
laugh at me
for carrying my
GPS.
Well, you know,
GPS wouldn't
really have helped
us that much there.
I would have gotten
you out of the
woods at least.
Not really because
we knew the way
we had to go.
It's just a question
of could we do it?
You know, it's like
sheer drops and
things like that.
Mudslides and things.
Yeah, mudslides and
it was very hot.
Earthquakes.
It was extremely hot.
And we had no water.
Right.
So, anyway, we have
this update that I
wanted to share with
people.
This is something
that came in in the
last week or so.
And it's very
important.
It has to do with
the film.
It has to do with
another perspective
on the film.
And I'd just like to
share this.
We posted this to
the Mitnick list
in the last day.
And for those of you
who read the whole
list, if you've read
the takedown book,
you'll know that this
is one of the major
characters involved.
Unfortunately, we weren't
able to speak with this
person, but they were
nice enough to share
some thoughts on the
subject.
Julia Menapace, who
was the significant
other, if you will,
of Shutomo Shimomura,
has been rather quiet
on the whole thing.
And we haven't heard
her point of view
up until now.
So let's take a
listen to this.
This is a letter.
I'm not sure who
this letter is to.
It's to somebody
named Ms. Wilcox.
She sent me a copy
of it.
I would imagine Ms.
Wilcox is involved
with the film in some
way.
I'm just not sure in
what capacity.
So this is the letter
with permission.
We're spreading it
around so people know
what the viewpoints
here are.
Three weeks ago, I
received and read the
screenplay for
Takedown dated July
2nd.
I understand that this
is close to the
version of the story
that Miramax is
currently filming.
It has taken me this
long to do some
research and consider
how I feel.
I know that my
opinion matters little,
especially at this
stage of the game,
but since you asked,
here are my
impressions.
I find it very
unsettling that the
screenplay takes such
liberties with the
facts in portraying
real people and
events.
I understand the
need to tell the
story in a dynamic
and compelling way,
but I question that
this is accomplished
by stereotyping or
villainizing the
participants.
I feel that the
Julia character does
not so much negatively
depict me as it
does generousize me
to fit someone's
image of a person
in her role.
There are many
departures from the
facts.
I am a computer
programmer, not a
psychologist, and
would not presume
to psychoanalyze
Kevin Mitnick
professionally or
otherwise, as does
the character with
my name.
I also never
operated Tsutomo's
scanner.
He did, with the
volume levels set
loud enough to
detect modem tones
but not loud enough
to overhear the
content of
conversations.
This is a point
of law and does
matter, which is,
I suspect, why he
is not shown doing
it himself.
Interesting.
Yeah.
Mr. Shimomura
might have broken
the law there and
managed to back out
of it.
As a love
interest, I am
almost 10 years
older than
Tsutomo, not
younger, and my
ex-partner John
Gilmore is just a
few years older
than I, not
twice my age.
Tsutomo and I
did not live
happily ever
after.
In fact, he
dropped out of
my life shortly
after precipitating
my final break
with John.
I should probably
be grateful that
the triangle between
John, myself, and
Tsutomo has been
regularized in the
screenplay still.
If I am to be
made less
complicated, less
mature, non-technical,
and the authoritative
vehicle for womanly
insight into the human
nature, at least let
me be articulate.
I do try not to
rely too heavily on
the word stuff.
My more pressing
concern about the
script is for some
of the others
depicted, Kevin
Mitnick first and
foremost.
Granted, Kevin is a
habitual offender of
a particular sort, but
he is not violent and
he never physically
attacks Tsutomo.
In fact, he was so
shaken upon his
apprehension that he
spent five minutes
vomiting before the
arrest could proceed.
He is credited in the
film with committing
crimes that we have no
solid evidence to
connect him with, and
attribute it with
skills I would be
very surprised if he
possesses.
Although we witnessed
him accessing stolen
data archives at the
well, there are no
computer forensics proving
that he broke into
Tsutomo's computers, and
if he did, I seriously
doubt that he wrote the
IP spoofing code that
was used in that
attack.
The really interesting
story would be who was
assisting and perhaps
using Mitnick.
I know that Kevin is not
in a good position to
defend himself, and
perhaps it even
pleases him to be cast as
a super hacker, but is
this not libel?
I can tell you, just as
an aside right here, it
does not please him in
any sense to be cast as
a super hacker, or to
even have this film be
made.
Continuing, he is still
pending trial, and to the
extent that this film
influences opinion, it
mixes truth and
falsehood in such a way
that it can only harm
him.
Even if Takedown is not
released until after
Kevin's sentencing, he
still has to get through
the rest of his life,
including any parole
hearings that are to
come.
The screenplay inflates
both his skill set and
his volatility, misrepresenting
the danger that he poses
to the community.
While Mitnick is not in
good standing with the
community, others
unfairly portrayed in
your film are.
John Gilmore, while no
longer my partner, is
well-known and respected
in his circles as an
entrepreneur, philanthropist,
and civil rights crusader.
He is called upon by
publications such as the
New York Times for his
quotes and opinions on
digital privacy and
related subjects.
He only has informal
connections to the well
and was not present at the
meeting which the
screenplay has him run.
There were real conflicts
of interest inherent in the
situation for the well
management to resolve.
Catching the intruder
required allowing him to
continue his activities
unhindered with
unpredictable consequences.
Watching the intruder
also exposed other users
of the well to being
watched, compromising
their privacy.
By allowing us to do
our work there, the well
was making itself
vulnerable to both the
intruder's potential malice
and the displeasure of its
other privacy-loving
members.
Manufacturing a
personal confrontation
between Gilmore and
Satomo in the scenes at the
well obscures these issues
and misrepresents all
parties involved.
The staff of internet
service providers are
permitted by the
Electronic Communications
Privacy Act to view
the contents of user
accounts when in pursuit of
fraudulent use.
With the help of the EFF,
I determined that Satomo,
Andrew, and I were covered
by the same rules since the
well and netcom had
requested our assistance.
It is unfortunate that the
screenplay chooses to
manufacture a confrontation
between Pi and Julia on the
subject rather than
illuminate that fact.
The well policy that users
own their own words is also
misrepresented.
This is not justification for
receiving stolen property, but
rather a strong commitment to the
personal privacy of well
members.
The well management was
concerned that as little
collateral information as
possible be captured and made
public in the process of our
investigation.
We invested weeks of highly
skilled labor to address that
concern.
While the well retains copies of
every file and transaction,
should there be a question of
context, we sifted out only the
material related to Mitnick's
activities as evidence for the
FBI.
Such care was not taken with the
information gathered at netcom,
the other internet service
provider that asked for our
help.
The well and netcom both deserve
credit for putting the interest
of the community at large in
stopping the intruder ahead of
other concerns.
The usual response of an
internet service provider is to
close the security hole if it
can be found and perhaps notify
the users that there was a
breach, but otherwise to ignore
the incident.
It is cheaper overall, but does
nothing to really address the
problem of insecure networks and
the people who exploit them.
What makes this story unusual is
that enough skilled people cared
enough to work together long
enough to make an arrest, not
that Mitnick is unusually
dangerous or malicious.
Perhaps there will be some
disclaimer in the film stating
that while it is based on true
events, it has been heavily
fictionalized.
If the story portrays real people
and events, how can it contain so
many lies, damaging and
otherwise?
If it is a work of fiction, then
why attach the names of real
people to the characters?
I am surprised that such a thing
is even legal, much less
considered ethical.
This fictionalization comes at a
personal cost as some of those
portrayed, but I think it also
costs the film, making a complex
story formulaic and therefore
less interesting.
Again, that was from Julia
Menapace, who was one of the main
characters in both the takedown book
and the upcoming takedown movie.
And I think that just goes to show
right there, the concerns that are
that are, you know, even the people
heavily involved with the whole
chase and pursuit and capture of
Kevin Mitnick realize that the story
is just wrong.
It's not true.
And I'm really glad that they have the
guts to come forward and say that.
Comments?
Well, this on the eve of, you know,
what happened recently, for those on
the list know as well, Kevin's, the
motion to the Supreme Court was
denied.
Yes, that just happened.
Yeah, and I, there's not a lot of
details on the list.
It's only that it's been denied.
They're going to have, you know,
the wordy, lawyer-filled gobbledygook
that they normally put together, you
know, party A says, party B, and all
that stuff.
Well, now, from what I understand,
this happens so fast, within hours,
I think, that it's doubtful that the
Supreme Court even looked at it.
They're saying that a clerk probably
just turned it down right on the spot.
The judge is, the judge's name is
Sandra Day O'Connor.
I've heard of her.
Yeah, I've heard of her a couple
times.
Sandra Day O'Connor was involved in
this?
Yeah, that's her.
Wow.
Yeah.
And, and she didn't say anything?
Any comments?
No, no.
That's, that's why, you know, a lot
of people are saying it was probably a
clerk or someone around the lower
levels that just clicked off the
little box there, you know.
No.
Sorry.
Check one.
Yeah.
Check one for denied.
Check two for denied, or three or
four, you know, denied.
Right.
Okay.
Well, that's, that's real
inspiring, but you know, it
doesn't, it doesn't weaken our
resolve at all.
People have to know about this.
So continue checking the
websites, continue getting the
word out.
We're not backing down.
We're not stopping.
If anything, we're moving faster
than we've ever moved before.
And, you know, it's amazing when
you're out there, how many people
are aware of this case, how many
people support you.
It was funny.
We were standing outside the, the,
the Screen Gem studio down in
Wilmington with a big freak,
Kevin banner.
And as soon as we stood out
there, all these people started
honking as they went by, you
know, Hey, freak.
I don't know if they even knew
who Kevin was, but they, they
were showing their support.
I mean, some people do.
They honk for anything.
Sometimes people, I think you
could put a blank banner up or
just, that's possible.
Yeah.
And they'll just, they'll just
honk.
I mean, it's, but there are a
lot of people out there that,
that do know what the case is
about.
They've heard about it somehow
and, uh, they, they're behind
it.
You know, they, they want to
know more.
So it's up to all of us to
make sure that they get what
they're looking for, that they
get the information.
So that's why we continue to, um,
to get the word out and we
continue to try and do more
things.
So I guess what we have to do
now is figure out what the
next step is going to be.
Obviously we have to do
something with the film that
we're, we're putting together,
but, uh, more urgently we have
to do more things, uh, for
Kevin's case to make sure that,
uh, that he continues to get
more attention and stops being
treated unfairly and is
released enough of this.
You know, I, I don't think we
found a single person who said
that he should still be in
prison, you know?
It seems to me even the film
crew, they're, they're,
they're driving around with
free Kevin stickers.
I mean, unless it's...
Well, they just want to be
cool, you know?
Yeah, well, I know the cool
factors in there, but they,
I mean, I find it surprising
that, you know, they have the
stickers.
I'm sure the crew members even
knew the deal, but, you
know, it's their job.
They can't say, no, we're not
going to work on the film.
Right, because somebody else
will just do it.
It's a job, you know?
That's all it is to them.
I see them putting the
stickers on their cars as a
mockery.
I mean, it's, it's like,
you know, they're just doing
it as a joke, but it's a very
serious situation.
And, you know, them putting
these stickers on their cars,
I don't, you know, think it's
funny.
And they, they are, they're,
they're, they're real bad
people.
I mean, you know, we, like,
they, they try and be, you
know, when we came over there,
they tried to be all smiley and
everything.
They're like happy and like,
oh yeah, we're trying to make
changes and all this and stuff,
but they don't care.
They only care about money.
They're, they're, they're
pressing, they're pressing the
button underneath their desk,
you know, the smithers,
the smithers, release the
hounds.
You know, it's, so, uh, yeah,
that was our, our one visit to,
to them in a friendly location.
And then after that, they made
themselves very hard to find.
But you know, the funny thing
is we did find them again,
right, right after we, we were
packing up outside the studio
because we had done some
shooting there.
Uh, we, we saw a vehicle with a
free Kevin sticker going into
the studio and this was when
they weren't going to the
studio today.
So we, we, we found them
actually going there.
And so what we did was we, we
kind of went around the back,
you know, and we, we, we
started looking for them, you
know, and see where they were.
And we found them, we found,
you know, they were like loading
things into, uh, loading supplies
or whatever, you know, into their,
into their vehicle so they could
get out of there or something.
I don't know.
Then they, they left and we, we,
we pursued them.
Uh, you know, I have no trouble
doing this kind of thing.
You know, it's, it's, it's part
of, it's part of getting a story.
We wanted to see where they
were going, you know, I
want to see what it was all
about.
You know, we weren't going to
do anything.
We just, we were on our way
out of there anyway.
You don't want to go home.
So we started following them
down the streets of Wilmington.
And, you know, here's the thing,
here's the thing that really
annoys me with these rental cars.
You know, we, we put 10,000
miles on, on a rental car
over the past six weeks, you
know, so I guess I can't
complain too much, but they
have these damn running lights
that you can't turn off.
All right.
I don't know what the point
of running lights is.
You know, you should have
some sort of option to like
turn the things off.
So here I am trying to
follow this person.
I'm the only car in the
damn highway with these
blazing lights.
There's nothing I can do
about it.
I'm standing out like a
sore thumb.
I'm trying to, I'm trying to
move back, you know, like,
like, you know, 10 car lanes
or whatever, just so they
won't see me.
But I'm afraid that, you
know, they might know
exactly what's going on.
So I'm following them and
they, you know, they're
going down Market Street,
which is like the main
sudden, and this is with
us about three cars behind
them, they, they make a
left turn into where
there's no driveway.
You know, they just make
this turn and all of a
sudden, you know, what are
they doing?
They're making a left turn
into a curb.
So then they make a U-turn
and they pull into a gas
station.
So I pulled to the right
to see, you know, just
what they're doing if
they're getting gas.
And there's this whole
police barricade thing
going on because some
idiot was, was transporting
a boat down the road and
it crashed into a tree or
something like that.
So half the road's
blocked, there's cops
everywhere, people staring at
the boat in the middle
of Market Street.
And meanwhile, our, you
know, our prey is across
the street, you know,
getting gas or something.
So eventually, you know,
I make my way across the
street to see just what it
is that's taking them so
long.
They're not there.
They're not there.
They escaped.
And, and the other car,
because we had two cars
involved in the chase, the
other car told us that,
yeah, they peeled out and
went down the same
direction.
Wow.
And it was, so that, that
told us that they were
very aware of what was
going on.
It sounds like most of
their actions were driven
by fear, not, not anything
else.
It's hotel.
They had the guy call you
and, uh, yeah.
Oh my.
It was, um, I think, I
think we scared them more
than, than ever before.
Port Shop's leaving.
Say goodbye, Port.
You can't just walk out the
door.
Goodbye, everyone.
All right.
Then we'll catch a train.
Yeah, we'll see you at the
next, uh, next film that we
make.
Next film.
And this Friday.
Uh, and this Friday at the
2600 meetings, which, uh,
take place internationally
as they do every first
Friday of the month.
So, uh, they'll be taking
place here in New York at
the usual place, the City
Corp Center, uh, at, um,
at, uh, where is it?
53rd Street.
You know, I, I, I, there's
so many things I've forgotten
being away so long.
I forgot what floor of the
radio station was on, you
know?
I forgot what, do you know
the CIA, the CIA is on the
floor below us?
Do you know that?
Really?
Yeah, I went there by
accident.
They're very nice.
Were they happy to see you
as well?
Well, no, they knew, they
knew exactly where to send
me.
They knew exactly where, in
fact, they have, they have
a little, like, map of the
studio down there and they
were able to, like, point me
in the right direction.
That was very nice of them.
And they even showed me
where certain things are in
the studio that I could
point out to you later.
Okay.
I'd like to see that.
Yeah.
So that's.
There, like, hidden doors
around here that I can go
downstairs real quick?
Well, there's hidden
devices of various, I'll
tell you later.
I don't want to bore the
little camera.
Yeah.
The meeting site is to be
updated in the next few
hours.
If you're upset about that,
the meeting site will be
updated.
In fact, we're working on
updating everything right
now.
The shows that have been
around, haven't been around
over the past few weeks and
haven't been on the
website, well, they're going
to start being on the
website, I think, starting
tomorrow morning.
We're going to put one up
a day until we're all
caught up.
So you can stop gnashing
your teeth about that.
Although the people that are
gnashing their teeth about
that probably aren't
listening right now anyway.
All right.
Let's take some phone
calls.
212-209-2900.
And Brian, are you still
there in Massachusetts?
I am still here.
Are you able to stay with
us for the phone calls?
Yeah.
Okay, great.
Have you had any sausage
lovers slams lately?
I haven't seen the Denny's
in very long.
Yeah, we had quite a few
adventures at Denny's.
They have all kinds of
little deals there, and we
took advantage of many of
them.
Especially the slams.
The slams, yeah.
If you've ever been to a
Denny's, you know what we're
talking about.
There's no need to get into
more detail than that.
Yeah, but they have no
Denny's in New York.
No Denny's at all.
Do they have them in New
Jersey?
Actually, no.
I think there's a Denny's in
Staten Island, believe it or
not.
I think we're going to have
to go there.
Staten Island?
I think Staten Island has a
Denny's.
New Jersey, they do have a
Denny's, definitely.
Wicked, do you know something
about this?
There's one in Westchester
somewhere.
Westchester?
Yeah.
Well, we're there.
Westchester, after the show.
Yeah, I mean, Wicked's never
had a slam.
I actually spoke with him
about this last night.
He didn't even know what a
slam was.
Okay, well, we're going to
have to school you on that,
that's for sure.
All right, 212-209-2900.
We only have a few minutes
for phone calls, so let's
make them quick.
Okay, now, unlike the last
few weeks where you guys
pressed the wrong buttons.
I'm going to press the wrong
They're all the same.
How can one be possibly the wrong?
Because one of them is the
one we don't want to press,
all right?
And I'm not going to press
that one this time.
Okay, well, I'd like to see you.
Over here, all right?
That's what you do.
You go over to the third tier,
I'm looking at it.
All right, where the purple
ones are.
Yeah, I see it.
All right, you press those
ones instead.
Okay.
You don't go to the red lines
at all.
He's got those covered,
and you avoid the green ones
unless all the purple ones
are taken.
All right.
All right.
Good evening.
You're on the air.
Speak up, please.
Oh, hello?
Yes, how are you?
Hi.
You see how it works?
Yeah, yeah.
Where are you calling from?
California, actually.
What part of California?
Backerville.
It's up by Sacramento.
Okay, okay.
We sort of were near there
at one point.
Yeah, you were by Berkeley,
right?
Yeah.
Let me ask you guys something.
California people,
you call roads,
you put the in front
of the numbers, right?
You call it the 40,
the 101, right?
No.
You don't do that?
No.
I was there.
You do that.
In L.A., in L.A.
You're lying.
Wait, wait.
It's only an L.A. thing?
I don't know.
I mean, the Southern
California people
are kind of strange.
Ah.
I don't know.
Divisiveness in the state here.
They say about the
Northern California people, too.
So, what's on your mind there?
Actually, I was thinking
about building a radio transmitter.
Uh-huh.
And I was wondering
if you knew, like,
any good kits.
I heard the Berkeley kits
are pretty good.
Well, they are.
You know, I don't know
if Free Radio Berkeley
is still selling the kits
after being shut down
by the FCC.
Yeah.
I would ask.
I know they have a website.
If you search for
Free Radio Berkeley,
you'll find it.
Yeah.
I've been to the website
and, you know,
it seemed like
they were selling them there.
Well, those are the best kits
and they are the lowest priced
and they do work
because, as evidenced
by the micro-broadcasting explosion
that took place
over the past couple of years,
they definitely do work.
Now, the question is,
what do you have in mind?
Do you want to start
a micro-broadcasting station?
Yeah.
Okay.
I wish you lots of luck,
but, you know,
there's all kinds of crackdowns
on this
and I think, really,
the only way to, you know,
to battle this
is to battle it,
you know,
is to defy it.
I mean,
I'm not calling for revolution
in the streets,
although, you know,
to a degree,
I guess I am.
It's time people
started challenging things
that were wrong
and, I mean,
how powerful
is your station going to be?
I'm running probably
like 15 watts.
15 watts.
So, you know,
a 15-watt station
is not really going to influence
a 50,000-watt station
in any way
and that's something,
you know,
people need to realize.
You'll be performing
a valuable service.
I mean,
what are you going to be doing
on this radio station?
Do you have any idea?
I don't know,
probably just, you know,
playing some different kinds
of music
that you can't really hear.
Okay.
You know,
maybe I'll do it
in like half an hour
every night
with me talking
or something.
I don't know.
Uh-huh.
Well, as long as it's stuff
that's not available elsewhere,
Yeah.
then go for it.
Like,
I want to put like
a lot of techno
and reggae
and stuff like that.
Techno and reggae.
What a mixture.
Yeah.
Very diverse.
Well,
it's something
you don't really hear
on the radio
all that much.
Well,
I wish you luck.
Let us know what happens,
right?
Yeah,
all right.
All right.
Take care.
Now,
why do I hear a phone ringing?
It's this stupid phone
over here.
What is that phone doing here?
Why is there a phone there?
It's like someone
put their personal phone
on the record player
back there.
You should pick it up.
See who it is.
Put them on the air.
Yeah,
who is this?
What member are you calling?
Can you get them on the air?
Are you calling WBI?
Are you calling the studio line
or are you calling
the office line?
The main line,
the lobby.
Well,
you know,
it's 846 right now
and there's not really
a whole lot of people around.
Yeah.
All right.
Do they want to send money
for contributions
or what do they want to do?
I'm sorry,
you need what?
Okay,
I don't know
who that person is.
Uh-huh.
Oh.
Well,
he's not in the studio
control room right now,
I can tell you that.
And things are kind of
hectic right now,
so I can't really help you.
He might be down the hall,
but,
you know,
uh-huh.
Okay,
well,
you know,
all right,
I'll run down the hall
and check for you
in a few minutes.
If you could
call me back
in about 15 minutes,
how's that?
All right,
yeah,
well,
I know you had a pay phone,
but actually,
I can beat that
because I'm on the air right now.
I can't really talk any longer.
Call us back
and we'll try to help you.
Thank you very much.
Pay phone my foot.
My God,
and he wanted me
to keep talking to him too.
Hey,
all right,
listen,
I don't know why
this phone is here.
I don't know why it's ringing,
but I'm trying to do
a radio show here
and can't be taking messages
for all these people
calling from a pay phone.
Yeah,
like that's supposed
to mean something to me,
calling from a pay phone.
All right,
so let's take some more
real phone calls,
212-209-2990.
Hopefully they're not
on pay phones.
Yeah,
all right.
You know,
I've got some interesting
things about phones.
I learned something
over the past few weeks.
I learned how much better
a technology GSM is
over this CDMA
Sprint PCS nonsense.
I mean,
yeah,
it's cheaper.
It's a lot cheaper
to use Sprint PCS,
but man,
does the quality ever suck.
I mean,
as soon as I got back
to New York,
no,
as soon as I got back
to New York,
it was just one
dropped call after another,
whereas when I was
out in the Pacific,
right,
I was using Pac Bell,
you know,
basically uninterrupted service.
I was driving
at all different speeds
down all different roads,
never got a dropped call.
Bell South,
Bell South,
GSM,
same thing.
The only complaint
I have,
apart from the huge price,
which really is,
you know,
what's making this technology
fall apart,
is the fact that
they don't have competition
and that there are
these gaps
between service areas,
like this PowerTel
down in the Atlanta area,
then there's a gap,
and then all of a sudden
Bell South comes in,
then there's another gap,
and then you get
Sprint Spectrum in D.C.,
and then there's another gap,
and then finally you get
Omnipoint
in the,
you know,
New York,
New Jersey area.
It has to be covered
a lot better than that,
obviously,
and the prices
have to come down,
but boy,
once that happens,
once that actually happens,
there's,
you know,
it's a good technology.
There's a lot more
you can do with it.
You can send,
you know,
email,
you can,
you know,
you can do all kinds
of neat things.
Definitely.
I hear Brian agreeing.
I got my bill,
and it wasn't nearly as much
as I thought it would be.
Well,
was your bill for the calls
that you made out
in California?
Yeah,
my bill was only about
$150 for the whole month.
I'm really afraid
what my bill's going to be like.
I'm really,
I'm really afraid.
Because I was using
two phones every day
in all different cities,
and,
you know,
there's this one company,
okay,
here's the example of stupidity.
There's a company
called Primeco,
which uses the same frequency
as a Sprint PCS
in various parts of the South.
And you see your phone light up,
you know,
you get a signal,
and a little roam light comes on.
You can't make any calls on it.
You know,
they say,
sorry,
there's no roaming allowed.
What's the point
of having a company
using the exact same frequencies,
having your phone work,
except you can't make any calls on it?
And,
you know,
I asked them,
what do I have to do
to make calls on this?
And they say,
sorry,
you can't.
There's just no way.
Just turn your phone off.
There's no point in using it.
So,
it was really
pretty silly.
GSM technology,
just,
you know,
it's the world standard,
but they're messing it up here.
They're messing it up
by charging so much.
So,
it's driving people to Sprint PCS,
which has,
you know,
great deals,
a thousand minutes
for,
you know,
a hundred bucks per month.
You know,
and that's why it's happening.
Now,
maybe Sprint will improve,
but,
you know,
I don't see it happening.
They just,
they just introduced,
you know,
the text messaging,
which is great,
but it's just text messaging.
You have to be at a website
to send it,
or,
you know,
it's a numeric page
that you send from the phone,
but,
you know,
beepers have been around
for a long time.
It's really not a big deal.
They don't have things
where you can get weather
from other states.
You can't get stock quotes.
You can't send email.
You can't get email.
You know,
all these things.
What,
someday?
Is that what they're saying?
You get email.
You get email?
How do you get email?
You send your message
to your number
at messaging.sprintpcs.com.
Well,
nobody ever told me about this.
It says it on the website.
Okay.
They don't,
they don't say it in the bills.
So,
wait a minute.
You're saying that if I send
my phone number
at messaging.what?
.sprintpcs.com.
Okay.
What's going to happen?
Then it'll get to your phone.
I'll see text.
I'll see actual messages.
Really?
That's what the website does.
Okay.
All right.
Well,
if there's somebody out there
that knows my phone number
and is near a computer,
send me some email.
I want to see it.
I want to see it.
And the phone.
Why don't we just broadcast
your number on here right now?
Just read your number out.
I don't,
I don't think that's a good idea.
That's all right.
But,
okay,
well,
that's something.
Now,
how do I send email?
You can't.
Aha!
You can't send email,
can you?
I never said you can.
What's the point of getting email
if you can't respond to it?
Yeah,
it's all your fault again.
Yeah,
what's,
what are you thinking here,
man?
I don't think our listeners know
that Wicked always
does these things to us.
Yeah,
yeah,
well,
okay.
We're going to have to see.
We're going to have to see
what comes of that.
Okay,
let's take another phone call.
You know what I'm going to do?
I'm going to go to that same line.
That's how I'm going to avoid
the curse.
Yeah.
Good evening,
you're on the air.
Uh,
yes.
Uh,
the man who gets to lick
Serena Herschel's vagina
must be...
All right.
You know,
I don't know.
He's got,
he's got agents out there
working
in various ways.
All right.
This is a G-rated program
for kids and stuff like that.
It's kind of
spoon his phone calls.
Well,
not since the whole
Bernie S escapade happened,
but we went up to
like TV NC
or something like that.
13 or something.
All right.
Was he talking about me?
I don't know what he was doing.
Let's,
let's go over here
to this phone line,
which I,
see,
this is a problem.
I have a bad feeling
about this phone line.
Okay,
well...
But I have a worse feeling
about the other one,
so I'm just going to hit this one.
Good evening,
and you're on the air.
Hi,
man.
You see?
I think it all.
Hang up,
hang up,
hang up.
Oh,
go ahead.
Oh,
whoops.
I didn't hang up.
I didn't really.
No,
I didn't hang up.
I leaned against the phone
in the wrong way.
Let's go to this line.
Good evening.
You're on the air.
Speak up,
please.
Hello,
it's Professor Clyde Strawn
in New York.
Do we know you?
While you were gone,
hello?
Yes,
do we know you,
Professor?
From the Pirate Radio Conference
in April.
Ah,
okay.
No,
you're very faint
for some reason
I painted a very large
major dome
at 2600.com.
This is the guy
that did this thing
upstate.
Ah.
You know,
if we had known about this,
we would have been up there.
Yes,
Professor Clyde Strawn.
It was up for about two weeks.
We would have gotten
the 2600 chopper
and all that.
We would have been up there
taking pictures.
Did anybody get a picture of it?
Oh,
I'll just do it again.
That's all.
You'll just do it again.
I have a phone right now.
I can't read it over the air,
but I'll pull out
your operator number.
This is the kind of spirit
I like to see.
You're just going to do it again.
Oh,
yeah.
And it really stuck
and showed like good.
It was up for over two weeks.
Really?
Then it got painted over,
but that's just clearing it
for the next message.
Did you get a picture of it?
No,
I wasn't able to get all,
you know,
like a,
I'll just do it again,
okay?
Okay.
All right.
Contact me via email.
No,
not possible.
Oh,
okay.
Contact me via phone.
Yeah,
the thing is,
I just got a phone,
so I'll leave my phone number.
Okay,
so we'll just find this out.
Yes.
Just,
you know,
check your voicemails
or whatever they call it
at 2600.
We're catching up on all that.
Bye-bye.
Thanks.
See,
that's the kind of spirit
I like to see.
This guy paints,
what was it he painted exactly?
He painted to subscribe
to the mailing list.
Instructions on how to subscribe
to the mailing list.
you send it,
yeah.
What did he paint it on?
Probably some type of,
a wooden sign.
A billboard or something?
Yeah,
I thought it was a blank billboard
that he had.
That's pretty good.
Yeah.
Yeah,
and he's going to do it again,
too.
And you know,
I need to hear from people
when they do things like this.
You know,
if you're going to change
a traffic sign,
you know,
the things that say
normal traffic ahead
or have a nice day
or whatever it is they say,
first of all,
you know,
make sure you're not doing
something that's going to
cause any kind of danger
and, you know,
all informational purposes only
and all that kind of thing.
But if and when you do it,
let us know
so that we,
you know,
can take a picture of it.
Yes.
Can I just take one second out
to say happy birthday
to my mom,
Ellie?
No,
I'm sorry.
You can't do that.
Who will be a year older
than last year tomorrow.
That's what happens
with birthdays.
Yeah,
generally.
Hey,
it's Marco's birthday today too.
Wow.
Yeah.
So it's that kind of,
that kind of...
August and September,
lots of birthdays.
Yeah,
a lot of people seem to have
been born then.
Okay,
let's hurry up
and get one more call in.
Good evening,
you're on the air.
Yes,
Emmanuel.
Hi,
how you doing?
Nice hearing you again.
Good evening,
you're on the air.
Yes,
Emmanuel.
Good evening,
you're on the air.
Good evening,
you're on the air.
Okay,
you're not on the air.
Good evening,
you're on the air.
Speak up,
please.
Okay,
good evening,
good evening,
you're on the air.
Hello?
Yes,
hurry up,
please.
Hi,
why do you just talk
about crap the whole time?
I don't know.
You're not breaking
the exception there.
Good evening,
you're on the air.
Yes,
hi,
I wanted to talk
a little bit about
Sprint TV.
Turn your radio,
turn your radio down.
I know you just talked
about it a little bit,
but I finally gave in.
I thought I was going
to be the last guy
on earth not to have
a cellular phone,
and I went ahead
and got,
and I'm having a lot
of trouble with my
Sprint service,
and I was wondering,
is that Sprint,
or is it...
Yes,
you have Sprint,
you have the right company
if you're having trouble
with your service.
In fact,
there's two things
that we've learned
over the past couple of weeks,
there's some new phrases
going around.
We call it sprinting.
That's when your call
starts getting hard to hear.
It's called
the sprinting effect,
and we also came up
with a present
for Omnipoint
or any other company
out there
that competes with Sprint,
and that's a little slogan
that you might want to use
in your upcoming
advertising campaigns.
Drop them
before they drop you.
Yes,
that's pretty much
what's happening
pretty much like
50% of the time.
Yes,
that's what happens
all the time,
and unfortunately,
we're going to have
to continue in that tradition
because we're out of time,
so do you have
like a one-sentence thing
you want to say?
I also have
a Qualcomm phone.
I mean,
is that equally
a piece of junk?
Qualcomm's are okay.
Yeah,
I mean,
Qualcomm phones
are used for Sprint PCS.
Right.
It's not the phone,
it's the service.
Yeah,
you can't really...
It's not the phone,
it's the service.
Pretty much,
and they've got
a lot of work
to do to improve that.
Anyway,
thanks so much
for calling.
Thanks,
everybody else,
for calling
and for supporting
everything we've been
doing over the past
couple of weeks.
We'll be back again
next week in the studio
with updates
and more information
for you.
Until then,
Manuel Goldstein,
for everybody else,
have yourselves
a good night.
Thank you.
Thank you.
For all of the above, press 4.
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