Off The Hook - 1999-10-05

[00:01.930 --> 00:10.530]  [SPEAKER_01]: It's 7 p.m., so you guys driving home, tell all your friends, you know, mainstream media is certainly not covering this show.
[00:11.270 --> 00:15.010]  [SPEAKER_01]: So we're going to be on, starting this, it's going to be an incredible show.
[00:15.250 --> 00:20.770]  [SPEAKER_01]: It's going to be, it's one of the books, one of the ten best-sold books in the Amazon bookstores on the Internet.
[00:21.270 --> 00:29.790]  [SPEAKER_06]: Having that train, pout cocaine, Casey Jones, you better watch your speech.
[00:29.790 --> 00:31.350]  [SPEAKER_12]: George W.
[00:31.830 --> 00:40.170]  [SPEAKER_12]: Bush hopes those nagging questions will blow over when he comes to New York for a $1,000-a-plate luncheon with Governor George Pataki.
[00:40.450 --> 00:57.250]  [SPEAKER_12]: But that may be just a pipe dream when the families of more than 30,000 Rockefeller drug law prisoners, mostly black, Latino, and poor, gather to protest the mandatory 15-year-to-life sentences low-level offenders are serving for their youthful indiscretions.
[00:57.250 --> 01:06.010]  [SPEAKER_12]: Governor Pataki, along with legislative leaders in Albany, have jointly stalled meaningful reform of the outdated Rockefeller laws.
[01:06.010 --> 01:21.070]  [SPEAKER_12]: And that's the last straw, according to the William Moses Kunstler Fund for Racial Justice, which invites you to join the two governors for lunch at 4.30 on October 5th at the Sheraton Hotel on 7th Avenue and 53rd Street.
[01:21.070 --> 01:30.790]  [SPEAKER_12]: For further information, call the Kunstler Fund at 212-539-8441 or visit the Kunstler.org website.
[01:31.130 --> 01:43.090]  [SPEAKER_12]: That's Tuesday, October 5th at the Sheraton for a protest lunch with the two Governor Georges sponsored by the Kunstler Fund at 212-539-8441.
[01:43.650 --> 01:45.450]  [SPEAKER_12]: It's about time.
[01:53.110 --> 01:58.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, it's a little late, but if you hurry, you can still grab those Republicans and annoy them as they're coming out.
[01:58.890 --> 01:59.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: Leave the cocaine home.
[02:00.710 --> 02:02.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's 8 o'clock, time for Off the Hook.
[02:06.110 --> 02:10.610]  [SPEAKER_08]: The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
[02:11.530 --> 02:16.090]  [SPEAKER_08]: I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a cough.
[02:16.830 --> 02:21.370]  [SPEAKER_07]: It couldn't get much worse, but if they could, they would.
[02:21.370 --> 02:24.270]  [SPEAKER_07]: Funding it wrong for the best, expect the worst.
[02:24.930 --> 02:26.770]  [SPEAKER_07]: I hope that's understood.
[02:27.110 --> 02:27.790]  [SPEAKER_07]: Funding it wrong!
[03:39.880 --> 03:45.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: And good evening everybody, this is Off the Hook, the program that deals with technological issues, from a hacker perspective.
[03:45.580 --> 03:48.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: We come your way every Tuesday night from 8 to 9 p.m.
[03:48.180 --> 03:50.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: right here on Listener Sponsor WBAI in New York.
[03:51.440 --> 03:53.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: My name is Emmanuel Goldstein, joined tonight with Isaac.
[03:54.020 --> 03:54.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: How you doing, sir?
[03:54.680 --> 03:56.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: By Isaac, actually, is the proper way to say it.
[03:56.320 --> 03:56.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: How have you been?
[03:57.000 --> 03:57.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, I'm fine, yourself?
[03:58.420 --> 03:59.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: Pretty good, pretty good.
[03:59.280 --> 03:59.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good.
[03:59.620 --> 04:01.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: Dodging the spraying trucks and helicopters and things like that?
[04:02.080 --> 04:02.660]  [SPEAKER_15]: Of course.
[04:02.900 --> 04:05.380]  [SPEAKER_15]: It's not just insecticide spray anymore.
[04:05.560 --> 04:06.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's true, yeah.
[04:06.660 --> 04:09.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: And you've been dodging helicopters most of your life, so...
[04:09.100 --> 04:09.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's also true.
[04:09.960 --> 04:12.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're already well-trained, as far as that goes.
[04:14.940 --> 04:19.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Actually, a lot of interesting things have happened in the past seven days.
[04:20.120 --> 04:26.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: Not the least of which is the introduction of a new area code, one that affects you, but I'm sure you don't know anything about it because you live with your head in the sand, right?
[04:26.540 --> 04:27.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: As do most New Yorkers.
[04:27.980 --> 04:28.480]  [SPEAKER_15]: Very true.
[04:28.720 --> 04:29.860]  [SPEAKER_15]: What is this new area code that affects you?
[04:29.860 --> 04:33.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: Does anybody know what the new area code was introduced in New York this past week?
[04:33.060 --> 04:33.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, there is that one that you lost.
[04:33.840 --> 04:34.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: Nobody knows.
[04:34.640 --> 04:34.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[04:35.220 --> 04:36.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, mine...
[04:36.000 --> 04:36.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: Suffolk County.
[04:36.320 --> 04:36.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yours changed.
[04:37.000 --> 04:39.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, 631 will be introduced on November 1st.
[04:39.740 --> 04:40.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, it will?
[04:40.180 --> 04:41.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: In Suffolk County, yes.
[04:41.200 --> 04:41.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, okay.
[04:41.520 --> 04:41.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[04:41.760 --> 04:44.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: So that does not count.
[04:44.620 --> 04:50.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: But there is one right here in the metropolitan area, and I can see that our callers are getting...
[04:50.020 --> 04:50.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: 646, the Manhattan number?
[04:50.840 --> 04:53.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: 646 is Manhattan, but that's been here, I think, since July.
[04:55.000 --> 04:55.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: For a while.
[04:55.200 --> 04:59.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: Even though I've never seen a 646 number, and I don't know anybody who has a 646 number, so...
[04:59.980 --> 05:01.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: It was an act of legislation.
[05:01.560 --> 05:02.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I suppose that's what it was.
[05:02.980 --> 05:05.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: But no, there's another area code that was introduced just on October 1st.
[05:05.640 --> 05:09.080]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, there was that Westchester thing with the 914 and the other...
[05:09.080 --> 05:09.540]  [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, but...
[05:09.540 --> 05:10.260]  [SPEAKER_15]: We talked about that.
[05:10.260 --> 05:11.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know that's got nothing to do with this.
[05:11.620 --> 05:13.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: It hasn't even been decided yet how they're going to do that.
[05:13.240 --> 05:14.340]  [SPEAKER_15]: I'm just trying to cover all the bases.
[05:14.540 --> 05:17.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, well, what I'll do is I'll go directly to the Bell Atlantic webpage here.
[05:17.820 --> 05:18.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-oh.
[05:18.100 --> 05:19.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: If I happen to bring in with me.
[05:20.480 --> 05:28.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: October 1st, 1999, the Bronx, Brooklyn, Queens, and Staten Island will be getting a new area code known as 347.
[05:29.200 --> 05:29.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: What?
[05:29.980 --> 05:30.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: 347, that's right.
[05:30.760 --> 05:32.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is old news, Isaac.
[05:32.220 --> 05:33.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's an overlay, or...?
[05:33.320 --> 05:35.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: Clearly you're not paying attention, because this has been...
[05:35.140 --> 05:35.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm never paying attention.
[05:35.800 --> 05:37.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: I've known about this for over a year.
[05:38.280 --> 05:40.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: Current customers keep the same area code.
[05:40.560 --> 05:41.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, good.
[05:41.160 --> 05:42.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Unless you don't pay your bill.
[05:42.820 --> 05:44.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, yeah, but that's...
[05:44.560 --> 05:52.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, but any customers who order new service, add an additional line or move, may be assigned the new 347 area code when 718 numbers are unavailable.
[05:52.360 --> 05:53.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Most important.
[05:53.320 --> 05:53.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[05:53.540 --> 05:54.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Do I now have to dial 10?
[05:55.380 --> 05:57.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Ah, well, here's important information to help you.
[05:57.840 --> 05:57.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: Ah.
[05:58.720 --> 06:04.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: Beginning October 1st, all calls between area codes 718 and 347 must be dialed with 10 digits.
[06:05.000 --> 06:08.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: 718 customers, again, you keep your regular phone numbers, all right?
[06:08.180 --> 06:11.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: To reach someone in another area code, you dial one plus area code, as you normally do.
[06:11.280 --> 06:17.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: To reach someone in the same area code, simply dial the seven-digit telephone number, as you do today.
[06:17.300 --> 06:17.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Ah.
[06:17.360 --> 06:18.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, that's reassuring.
[06:18.220 --> 06:19.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: Calling rates will not change.
[06:20.020 --> 06:21.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: A local call remains...
[06:21.160 --> 06:22.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: I wonder if we can hold them to that.
[06:22.960 --> 06:24.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: They say here, calling rates will not change.
[06:24.440 --> 06:24.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: Calling rates will not change.
[06:24.900 --> 06:26.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: They can never change calling rates now.
[06:26.720 --> 06:27.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's not bad.
[06:27.400 --> 06:27.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: I like that.
[06:27.900 --> 06:30.040]  [SPEAKER_15]: As long as the other area code exists.
[06:30.320 --> 06:30.660]  [SPEAKER_15]: They can't go down either.
[06:30.660 --> 06:33.840]  [SPEAKER_15]: So we need to have somebody with 347, like, stay.
[06:34.080 --> 06:37.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: You have to wonder, you know, how thick people are, though, that they have to say these things.
[06:37.660 --> 06:40.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: There is no change in the way customers reach 911.
[06:40.540 --> 06:41.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: Why would there be a change?
[06:41.840 --> 06:44.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, if you're in 347, you have to dial 9-1-2.
[06:44.540 --> 06:44.900]  [SPEAKER_09]: You know?
[06:45.020 --> 06:47.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's like, we can't handle 9-1-1 in 347.
[06:47.460 --> 06:49.280]  [SPEAKER_15]: No, it's 1-7-1-8-9-1-1.
[06:49.400 --> 06:51.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, don't you get the impression they're speaking down to us?
[06:51.740 --> 06:53.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: Like, we really don't understand anything?
[06:53.560 --> 06:59.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: What I don't understand is why they have to come up with this stupid system in the first place, where they come up with an area code like 347, which you don't even know about and you live there.
[06:59.660 --> 07:00.220]  [SPEAKER_09]: I don't know about, no.
[07:01.640 --> 07:02.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Four-digit area codes, man.
[07:02.680 --> 07:03.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: It would have solved so many problems.
[07:05.080 --> 07:05.360]  [SPEAKER_15]: Anyway...
[07:05.360 --> 07:08.520]  [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, but you can't go back in time to say, let's use four digits.
[07:08.720 --> 07:10.200]  [SPEAKER_15]: Do you have to deal with what we have right now?
[07:10.200 --> 07:12.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, but I was back in time and I was talking about it then.
[07:12.940 --> 07:15.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: So that's just the way it was.
[07:16.460 --> 07:19.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: Here's another tip for morons when giving a telephone number.
[07:19.340 --> 07:20.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: Be sure it includes the area code.
[07:23.240 --> 07:25.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: And this is, of course, an overlay area code.
[07:25.980 --> 07:31.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: It basically is something that is not geographical within the old area code.
[07:31.200 --> 07:33.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: So I keep my 718 and I'm a very happy client.
[07:33.460 --> 07:33.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[07:33.840 --> 07:39.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: But what's unusual is that in most cases, overlays do require 10-digit dialing even within your area code.
[07:39.460 --> 07:46.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: But because here in New York we bitch about things so much, they made a special exception both for 646 and 347.
[07:46.300 --> 07:48.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: So that's a good thing.
[07:48.780 --> 07:49.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's good to be in New York.
[07:49.900 --> 07:52.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's see if there's any 347 numbers out there.
[07:53.620 --> 07:54.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's see.
[07:54.280 --> 07:55.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: What will we dial?
[07:56.780 --> 07:57.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh...
[07:57.100 --> 08:00.320]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, you could test 555-1212 and see if it works on the exchange.
[08:00.600 --> 08:01.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, but then we pay a good amount of money for that.
[08:01.860 --> 08:02.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, yes.
[08:02.700 --> 08:04.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's just see if there's any exchanges whatsoever.
[08:04.580 --> 08:04.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, dial to them?
[08:05.100 --> 08:05.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: Alright.
[08:05.680 --> 08:08.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's see if we can actually call 347 in the first place.
[08:08.120 --> 08:10.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: It might not even allow us to get there.
[08:11.340 --> 08:11.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: 1-347.
[08:13.080 --> 08:14.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's dial our own phone number.
[08:14.560 --> 08:14.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[08:17.120 --> 08:17.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: 209-2900.
[08:18.800 --> 08:19.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's see what we have.
[08:24.280 --> 08:24.940]  [SPEAKER_06]: It's ringing.
[08:32.070 --> 08:35.110]  [SPEAKER_16]: I'm sorry, your call cannot be completed as dialed.
[08:35.290 --> 08:39.870]  [SPEAKER_16]: Please check the number and try your call again, or ask your operator for assistance.
[08:40.130 --> 08:40.710]  [SPEAKER_16]: Thank you.
[08:42.110 --> 08:42.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hmm.
[08:44.070 --> 08:46.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's a very generic message there.
[08:46.530 --> 08:46.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes.
[08:47.270 --> 08:48.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: But it did go through.
[08:48.230 --> 08:48.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: It went somewhere.
[08:49.110 --> 08:49.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[08:49.470 --> 08:49.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: It went somewhere.
[08:50.110 --> 08:51.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: So it's at least been arrived.
[08:51.890 --> 08:53.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: Is there any other number we can think of that might work?
[08:54.590 --> 08:54.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um...
[08:54.950 --> 08:57.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, a number that always works, no matter where you call.
[08:58.490 --> 08:59.970]  [SPEAKER_15]: What about the, uh...
[08:59.970 --> 09:01.650]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, no, that'll probably...
[09:03.530 --> 09:07.030]  [SPEAKER_15]: Oh, if we knew an exchange, we could just dial the Info 9901.
[09:07.490 --> 09:07.730]  [SPEAKER_15]: Uh-huh.
[09:07.830 --> 09:08.710]  [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, but we don't know the exchange.
[09:08.930 --> 09:09.110]  [SPEAKER_15]: We don't know an exchange.
[09:09.110 --> 09:09.810]  [SPEAKER_15]: That's the problem.
[09:10.050 --> 09:12.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: What's the first exchange they would assign?
[09:12.710 --> 09:13.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, 2-2-2.
[09:13.790 --> 09:14.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, 2-2-1.
[09:15.070 --> 09:15.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, let's try that.
[09:16.370 --> 09:16.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Ready?
[09:26.260 --> 09:27.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: This could be the same error message.
[09:37.790 --> 09:38.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yep, same error message.
[09:38.720 --> 09:39.520]  [SPEAKER_15]: This is a long delay.
[09:39.760 --> 09:39.920]  [SPEAKER_15]: Mm-hmm.
[09:39.920 --> 09:41.020]  [SPEAKER_15]: I'm sorry, your call.
[09:41.120 --> 09:42.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, now, here's the thing.
[09:42.440 --> 09:44.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, nobody is being cut over to this area code.
[09:44.860 --> 09:47.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: So there's nobody that we can say, hey, call us from this area code.
[09:47.780 --> 09:52.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: Or, you know, call the 2600 Voice BBS and hear your number given with the, uh, with the area code.
[09:52.690 --> 10:02.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, if you got a phone number in Brooklyn after Brooklyn, Queens, Staten Island, or the Bronx after October 1st, you may very well have a 347 area code.
[10:02.050 --> 10:04.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, if that's the case, uh, we'd like to hear from you.
[10:05.670 --> 10:05.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[10:06.140 --> 10:07.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's pretty exciting news right there.
[10:07.780 --> 10:12.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, not nearly as exciting as, uh, you hear this, this piece of trash yesterday in the news?
[10:12.980 --> 10:14.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: MCI's buying Sprint?
[10:14.160 --> 10:15.040]  [SPEAKER_15]: Oh, that little thing?
[10:15.160 --> 10:15.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, that little thing.
[10:16.470 --> 10:17.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: $129 billion deal.
[10:18.040 --> 10:19.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: What, what, what gives here?
[10:19.550 --> 10:22.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's the biggest, every, every week we talk about the biggest corporate takeover in history.
[10:22.880 --> 10:23.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, every week there's a new one.
[10:24.070 --> 10:24.520]  [SPEAKER_15]: That's the news, too, yeah.
[10:24.640 --> 10:27.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, I don't know how much more you can, you can, you can get after this.
[10:27.480 --> 10:29.260]  [SPEAKER_15]: Microsoft acquires the United States government.
[10:29.920 --> 10:34.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, that's not going to be worth that much, but, um, this is, this is really troubling.
[10:34.880 --> 10:36.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, there's no more competition.
[10:36.440 --> 10:38.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, MCI was always number two, Sprint was always number three.
[10:38.760 --> 10:39.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now there's no more number three.
[10:39.690 --> 10:40.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: Who's going to be number three?
[10:40.520 --> 10:43.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is going to be a number one and a number two, and no one's going to know who number three is.
[10:43.540 --> 10:43.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: Sorry?
[10:43.930 --> 10:44.540]  [SPEAKER_15]: Who was number four?
[10:45.040 --> 10:45.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know.
[10:45.670 --> 10:46.860]  [SPEAKER_15]: They kind of bounce up, you know?
[10:46.950 --> 10:49.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think that was Worldcon before they were taken over by MCI.
[10:49.600 --> 10:50.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know.
[10:50.260 --> 10:50.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know.
[10:51.020 --> 10:52.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: There was USTel, but that got taken over by Sprint.
[10:53.120 --> 10:56.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: They're all being taken over and, and turned into one big megacorporation.
[10:56.400 --> 10:57.260]  [SPEAKER_15]: Like in the beginning.
[10:58.040 --> 11:01.480]  [SPEAKER_15]: Perhaps this is the natural progression of how things are supposed to be.
[11:01.860 --> 11:03.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, it's a natural progression.
[11:03.440 --> 11:06.460]  [SPEAKER_15]: And the whole breakup of an AT&T was a very big mistake.
[11:06.520 --> 11:12.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, the natural progression of life is death, so I don't necessarily hold that as an optimistic thing.
[11:13.140 --> 11:19.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: MCI Worldcon early Tuesday struck a $129 billion pact to take over Sprint in a much-rumored deal.
[11:19.660 --> 11:22.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: In fact, somebody called us last week and rumored it right over the air.
[11:23.220 --> 11:24.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: And there were rumors before that, even.
[11:25.370 --> 11:28.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that would be the world's largest corporate takeover.
[11:28.760 --> 11:32.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: The all-stock transaction linking the second and third largest U.S.
[11:32.120 --> 11:35.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: long-distance carriers includes Sprint's PCS cellular business.
[11:35.520 --> 11:36.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: What are they going to call it now?
[11:36.240 --> 11:37.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: MCI-PCS?
[11:37.480 --> 11:38.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, actually, I know what they're going to...
[11:38.520 --> 11:39.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's too long an acronym.
[11:39.380 --> 11:40.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know what the new company is going to be called, right?
[11:40.820 --> 11:41.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: What?
[11:41.260 --> 11:41.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: You don't know.
[11:41.860 --> 11:42.600]  [SPEAKER_15]: Sprint Worldcon?
[11:43.040 --> 11:43.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: No.
[11:44.110 --> 11:44.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just Worldcon.
[11:44.960 --> 11:45.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just Worldcon?
[11:45.400 --> 11:45.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just Worldcon.
[11:45.720 --> 11:46.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: No MCI, no Sprint.
[11:47.180 --> 11:48.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's what I'm told.
[11:48.500 --> 11:52.220]  [SPEAKER_15]: They take the smallest company in the merger's name and they apply it to all three?
[11:52.420 --> 11:52.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know.
[11:52.980 --> 11:54.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I mean, it does sound pretty all-enveloping.
[11:55.260 --> 11:56.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, Worldcom, I understand.
[11:57.260 --> 11:58.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's a good name.
[11:58.560 --> 12:01.380]  [SPEAKER_15]: You got Sprint, you have MCI, which were two, like, enormous ones.
[12:01.480 --> 12:06.420]  [SPEAKER_15]: And you had Worldcom, which was comparatively small, but you've got to take that name and apply it to the other two at.
[12:06.600 --> 12:10.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: The new company to be called Worldcom will control about 32% of the U.S.
[12:10.260 --> 12:14.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: long-distance telephone market in the rapidly consolidating telecom sector.
[12:14.800 --> 12:20.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: Sprint was seen as an attractive target because of its broadband Internet connection network and its cellular business.
[12:20.300 --> 12:24.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: So right away, all that's being taken over by a huge megacorporation.
[12:25.650 --> 12:27.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: And you know what really sucks about this?
[12:27.680 --> 12:29.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: Someone already registered Worldcom sucks.com.
[12:30.160 --> 12:30.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Aw.
[12:30.780 --> 12:32.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: But I got the other one, the obscene one.
[12:32.880 --> 12:34.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, using one of me.
[12:34.220 --> 12:38.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: The fworldcom.com off the other registrar there.
[12:38.830 --> 12:39.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: I see.
[12:39.120 --> 12:42.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: By the way, did you check out fgiuliani.com recently?
[12:42.820 --> 12:43.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: Whoa!
[12:43.900 --> 12:45.620]  [SPEAKER_15]: I received a couple of emails about it.
[12:45.620 --> 12:48.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: That is a piece of work right there.
[12:48.280 --> 13:01.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: So if you know what I'm talking about, if you know the four-letter word beginning with F that we can't say over the air, and you know how to spell Giuliani after that, and know how to affix a .com to that and stick a www in front of it, go there for a real piece of artwork.
[13:03.660 --> 13:06.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: I happen to be keeping an eye on that.
[13:06.260 --> 13:07.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: I know that it's getting a lot of hits.
[13:08.040 --> 13:08.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hmm.
[13:08.780 --> 13:09.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Like over a thousand.
[13:10.560 --> 13:11.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's a lot.
[13:11.220 --> 13:12.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just by word of mouth.
[13:12.360 --> 13:13.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, wow.
[13:14.500 --> 13:20.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, so if you didn't make it to the museum, this is the next best thing as far as hard appreciation.
[13:22.040 --> 13:23.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: We have other bits of news.
[13:23.800 --> 13:27.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: In fact, I'd like to read some mail.
[13:28.240 --> 13:31.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Some mail concerning the Kevin Mitnick case.
[13:32.200 --> 13:37.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, every once in a while, we send out Kevin's mail every couple of weeks or so, usually.
[13:39.280 --> 13:42.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: People email to Kevin, and we send it to him in prison.
[13:43.080 --> 13:43.980]  [SPEAKER_15]: We print it out.
[13:44.140 --> 13:44.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: We print it out.
[13:44.780 --> 13:48.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: So yeah, obviously it would be kind of nasty to send a disk, which obviously he can't make any use of.
[13:49.140 --> 13:51.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: But we go through it.
[13:51.280 --> 13:52.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: We weed out all the spam.
[13:52.700 --> 13:53.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's a lot of spam.
[13:53.820 --> 13:55.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: People send pictures.
[13:55.330 --> 13:56.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, come on.
[13:56.260 --> 13:59.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: People send GIFs and JPEGs in email to Kevin in prison.
[14:00.240 --> 14:01.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: How is he supposed to read that?
[14:03.520 --> 14:05.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: So we filter that kind of garbage out.
[14:05.860 --> 14:08.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: But some of this mail is just priceless.
[14:09.200 --> 14:13.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, we look at it on the way out, and he gets it all, but some of it is just unbelievable.
[14:13.980 --> 14:15.400]  [SPEAKER_15]: Like the American Express, you know.
[14:16.120 --> 14:16.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, the...
[14:16.540 --> 14:17.830]  [SPEAKER_15]: Shoes, $29.95.
[14:18.240 --> 14:20.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I'm not talking about the advertisements.
[14:20.880 --> 14:21.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm talking about the people.
[14:21.980 --> 14:22.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh.
[14:22.480 --> 14:23.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: The people are just unbelievable.
[14:23.880 --> 14:26.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, you too can send mail to Kevin in prison.
[14:26.020 --> 14:29.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: By the way, he'll be in prison until January 21st, 2000.
[14:29.620 --> 14:34.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: And he told me the other day that he even has a time when he'll be released, and that is 9 a.m.
[14:34.280 --> 14:34.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: Pacific time.
[14:35.020 --> 14:35.200]  [SPEAKER_17]: Wow.
[14:35.200 --> 14:37.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: So we're not sure what's going to happen out there yet.
[14:37.740 --> 14:40.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: If there's going to be a big celebration, keep tuned.
[14:40.440 --> 14:41.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: We'll let people know about that.
[14:41.900 --> 14:42.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: Better question?
[14:42.600 --> 14:42.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes.
[14:42.740 --> 14:44.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: Is there going to be somebody there to pick him up?
[14:44.120 --> 14:44.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, of course.
[14:44.860 --> 14:45.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[14:45.100 --> 14:47.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: And probably carry him all over the place like, you know, a football star.
[14:47.960 --> 14:48.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: But we'll see.
[14:48.830 --> 14:50.040]  [SPEAKER_15]: As long as it's not a gross state one.
[14:50.220 --> 14:56.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: Keep checking the website, www.freekevin.com or 2600.com, and listen to this show, of course.
[14:56.940 --> 15:01.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: We won't be on next week or the week after that because of fundraising, but we'll be on in force after that.
[15:02.280 --> 15:03.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, here's some mail.
[15:04.080 --> 15:07.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: And this is really some funny stuff.
[15:08.980 --> 15:10.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hi, my name is Chrisitin.
[15:11.700 --> 15:12.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: She misspelled her own name.
[15:13.100 --> 15:13.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: Chrisitin.
[15:13.500 --> 15:19.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: My name is Chrisitin Brady, and I do not know if any other kid can do this, but I can stretch my skin really far.
[15:19.680 --> 15:22.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: I can stretch my neck a little, and I can also stretch the skin on my knee and on my elbow.
[15:23.120 --> 15:23.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: I can stretch my skin.
[15:23.830 --> 15:24.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: I do not know how far.
[15:25.200 --> 15:29.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: But all the kid in my school thing, I am so weird that all of my friends call me stretch.
[15:30.520 --> 15:38.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I figured this out when my friend wanted me to go over to where she was, and she pulled my elbow, and I like stretch, and my friends was like, ew, and I was like, cool.
[15:38.740 --> 15:42.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: And since then, I can stretch my skin, so can you please email me back soon?
[15:44.100 --> 15:46.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I'm 12 years old.
[15:46.520 --> 15:47.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: I was born in Jersey City.
[15:47.600 --> 15:50.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: I am 12 right now, going to be 13 in November, and I am a girl.
[15:52.020 --> 15:52.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's nice.
[15:52.580 --> 15:53.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: Sincerely, Christine Brady.
[15:54.500 --> 15:55.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, come on.
[15:55.420 --> 15:57.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is mail from the heart here.
[15:57.320 --> 15:59.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is America speaking.
[16:00.300 --> 16:03.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: We have this mail from Jarrod, all caps.
[16:04.520 --> 16:07.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: He was very good, but it is my time now.
[16:09.540 --> 16:10.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's all it was.
[16:11.300 --> 16:12.040]  [SPEAKER_15]: All in caps?
[16:12.040 --> 16:13.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: All in caps.
[16:15.220 --> 16:17.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'll be hearing from him in prison at some point, I guess.
[16:18.580 --> 16:19.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Probably screaming at the top of his lungs.
[16:19.360 --> 16:19.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know what?
[16:19.740 --> 16:22.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: The same person sent another piece of mail right after that.
[16:22.920 --> 16:24.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: This one in lowercase.
[16:24.820 --> 16:25.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: Ooh.
[16:25.420 --> 16:26.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hello, Mr. Mitnick.
[16:26.820 --> 16:28.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: First, I want to say that I understand you.
[16:29.240 --> 16:31.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: That makes one of us, because we don't understand you.
[16:32.280 --> 16:34.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: Second, why did you give them to catch you?
[16:37.240 --> 16:39.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: You had discovered that this is not you.
[16:39.560 --> 16:40.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: You never steal anything.
[16:41.400 --> 16:42.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: You never steal anything.
[16:43.080 --> 16:44.040]  [SPEAKER_15]: Still S-T-I-L-L?
[16:44.240 --> 16:44.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[16:45.300 --> 16:46.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Don't mail or email me.
[16:47.040 --> 16:48.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: I know you don't have time.
[16:48.720 --> 16:50.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Please, when you're back from prison, do not do that again.
[16:50.620 --> 16:51.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: I count on you.
[16:53.800 --> 16:54.280]  [SPEAKER_15]: One.
[16:54.740 --> 16:55.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[16:56.360 --> 16:56.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: One what?
[16:57.330 --> 16:58.780]  [SPEAKER_15]: He counts on Kevin.
[16:59.080 --> 16:59.540]  [SPEAKER_15]: One.
[16:59.540 --> 17:00.330]  [SPEAKER_15]: Never mind.
[17:00.480 --> 17:00.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[17:01.180 --> 17:11.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hello, this is Daniel Edmund McDonald, Connor Franklin Jonas, Brad Dean Jonas, and Regal Cantaras-Brickin emailing you to tell you that we think we beat a Guinness Book of World Records.
[17:11.800 --> 17:16.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: First of all, Brad invented a paper airplane that we flew farthest and longest time in the air.
[17:16.880 --> 17:22.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: At least we think it beat the record because it flew over the trees at 1,000 feet in the air and 1,500 feet away from us.
[17:22.540 --> 17:23.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: Please send us back.
[17:24.800 --> 17:25.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: Send this back to what?
[17:26.000 --> 17:27.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: We'll send them back, all right.
[17:27.260 --> 17:29.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: Why are they telling Kevin Mitnick this?
[17:29.200 --> 17:29.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't...
[17:29.380 --> 17:31.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, we have the guinnessrecords.com site, but...
[17:31.560 --> 17:31.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's true.
[17:31.980 --> 17:33.540]  [SPEAKER_15]: I guess we should put a little link up there.
[17:34.040 --> 17:35.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, we take people's word for things like this.
[17:35.720 --> 17:35.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: Highest than...
[17:35.780 --> 17:37.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: Paper airplanes flying 1,000 feet up in the air.
[17:37.840 --> 17:38.120]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, what are you going to do?
[17:38.200 --> 17:39.240]  [SPEAKER_15]: Send somebody out to verify it?
[17:39.720 --> 17:41.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, you've got to verify it.
[17:41.020 --> 17:42.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: You can't just take some kid's word about it.
[17:43.740 --> 17:44.320]  [SPEAKER_15]: I don't know.
[17:44.420 --> 17:44.640]  [SPEAKER_15]: I don't know.
[17:44.640 --> 17:46.560]  [SPEAKER_15]: They took the press's word on what Kevin did.
[17:47.100 --> 17:52.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, here's another all-caps letter, which beats out these ones in intelligence.
[17:53.240 --> 17:55.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're a screw-up and have been since you were a kid.
[17:55.320 --> 17:58.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: You were messing around with other people's computers and stealing software and services.
[17:58.400 --> 18:00.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: You knew what you were doing was illegal, and you did it anyway.
[18:00.900 --> 18:02.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: You were caught, and you did it.
[18:02.340 --> 18:03.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: Quit your whining and pay the piper.
[18:04.060 --> 18:05.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: Jesus Christ, just grow up.
[18:05.560 --> 18:10.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: You have a brain and some talent, and you've been pissing it away on stupid bull-ass for years.
[18:10.880 --> 18:12.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: Grow up and do something productive.
[18:12.640 --> 18:13.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: I have zero sympathy for you.
[18:14.100 --> 18:17.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: Stop wasting your life on stupid antics while you still have life left to live.
[18:18.420 --> 18:19.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: Sincerely annoyed, Robert M.
[18:19.560 --> 18:21.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Whitney Sr., 32-year-old father of three.
[18:21.940 --> 18:23.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Painter at state.
[18:24.100 --> 18:26.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: I swear, it looks like a five-year-old wrote this.
[18:28.220 --> 18:29.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: And it's just unbelievable sometimes.
[18:29.860 --> 18:30.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: Or an AOLer.
[18:30.680 --> 18:35.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, we send this to Kevin because he gets a big kick out of it as well, you know, the so-called critics.
[18:35.800 --> 18:42.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, you know, it's very rare that you actually get to talk to somebody who is a critic who phrases things in a rational way.
[18:42.480 --> 18:44.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: Instead, it's like, you should be locked up for the rest of your life.
[18:44.740 --> 18:46.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, we don't mind if you're getting raped in prison.
[18:46.880 --> 18:47.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: You should die there.
[18:48.080 --> 18:54.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, those aren't exactly rational arguments to pose to people that are in prison for accessing a computer.
[18:55.000 --> 18:55.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know?
[18:55.760 --> 19:00.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe someone who killed your mother, you might, you know, phrase things in that way and have that kind of passion.
[19:00.940 --> 19:04.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: But this is somebody who simply looked at software.
[19:04.700 --> 19:05.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know.
[19:05.040 --> 19:05.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: You have to wonder.
[19:05.580 --> 19:06.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: What's up with these people?
[19:06.640 --> 19:08.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: What are they so upset about?
[19:08.320 --> 19:09.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: What are they afraid of?
[19:10.120 --> 19:10.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, continuing.
[19:11.820 --> 19:16.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: I have read the facts presented on your website and have to say that the entire world is against you.
[19:17.440 --> 19:18.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: That is what they would have us believe.
[19:18.980 --> 19:19.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Rewritten history.
[19:20.040 --> 19:24.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Do you think possibly that you might be free if you did not hack into systems illegally and with malicious intent?
[19:25.200 --> 19:26.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: But you did nothing wrong, correct?
[19:27.260 --> 19:27.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[19:27.860 --> 19:39.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: I hope you rot in prison and that if you get out sometime, that you learn not to blame others for what you brought on yourself and that your spinmeisters who like waving web after web of lies, distortion, and half-truths get what is coming to them.
[19:40.120 --> 19:40.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: Karma.
[19:40.820 --> 19:42.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: It is called karma, brother.
[19:42.300 --> 19:43.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: What goes around, comes around.
[19:44.680 --> 19:45.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, gotta go play outside.
[19:45.940 --> 19:46.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: A nice day today.
[19:47.020 --> 19:48.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: Too bad you cannot join in.
[19:49.080 --> 19:50.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: But what do I know?
[19:50.080 --> 19:51.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: I use web TV, right?
[19:51.620 --> 19:52.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: Ha ha.
[19:52.820 --> 19:53.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Toss a salad for me.
[19:53.880 --> 19:56.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now put on a dress and dance like a nice little cellmate.
[19:57.860 --> 20:00.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: That piece of wisdom coming from Chuck Anderson of Dayton.
[20:02.420 --> 20:03.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, it gets worse.
[20:03.500 --> 20:11.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, we're only reading the ones that are somewhat clean, but for people that think it's all fun and games out there, that everybody's joining hands and singing kumbaya.
[20:12.100 --> 20:12.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's not quite like that.
[20:12.980 --> 20:15.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: There's a lot of naysayers.
[20:16.560 --> 20:19.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: But I have to say, a lot of horses would show more intelligence than this.
[20:21.900 --> 20:23.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Finally, this is the last one we're going to read.
[20:24.140 --> 20:30.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: I find it incomprehensible that anyone with Kevin's record and attitude can continue to be supported and even revered by the number of people who do.
[20:31.300 --> 20:43.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: It just proves what I have known for a long time that a large number of the disassociated youth of this culture who are the technology experts and programmers upon whom the society must come to rely are misanthropes and, in some cases, outright sociopaths.
[20:43.400 --> 20:47.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't see what is funny about hacking into important systems and damaging or destroying them.
[20:47.860 --> 20:55.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's this American myth that the government and big business are automatically bad and individuals with cunning and creativity are good, no matter how destructive they are.
[20:56.260 --> 21:01.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: And Kevin's repeated history of violating the terms of parole indicate that he has no particular desire to stop.
[21:02.500 --> 21:07.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: Again, there's no history of violating parole and, in fact, it was proven in court that he did not violate parole.
[21:08.220 --> 21:10.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: It simply did not come when they called him.
[21:10.280 --> 21:11.920]  [SPEAKER_15]: Though that gentleman does make some other good points.
[21:12.120 --> 21:12.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[21:12.680 --> 21:13.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: Go ahead.
[21:14.100 --> 21:18.100]  [SPEAKER_15]: He mentioned that the government is automatically assumed to be demonized.
[21:18.120 --> 21:19.200]  [SPEAKER_15]: I'll agree with that.
[21:19.320 --> 21:19.940]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, I don't see...
[21:19.940 --> 21:20.580]  [SPEAKER_15]: It's not right.
[21:20.780 --> 21:21.820]  [SPEAKER_15]: I don't see how...
[21:21.820 --> 21:25.960]  [SPEAKER_15]: The destruction of very important systems for no apparent reason is also not right.
[21:25.980 --> 21:27.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right, but what does that have to do with this case?
[21:27.380 --> 21:31.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: First of all, the government is not automatically assumed to be bad, all right?
[21:31.220 --> 21:34.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: Otherwise, if they were automatically assumed to be bad, we'd be breaking them out of prison right now.
[21:34.700 --> 21:35.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: Instead, we respect the laws.
[21:35.980 --> 21:37.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: We don't encourage people to break laws.
[21:38.900 --> 21:42.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: The destruction of computer systems has got nothing to do with Kevin Mitnick's case whatsoever.
[21:43.500 --> 21:53.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, I mean, why don't you just throw in and, you know, murdering and torturing people and, you know, having sex with their torsos afterwards is a very bad thing because it's got about as much to do with this case as that does.
[21:53.700 --> 21:59.260]  [SPEAKER_15]: I didn't say it was appropriate for the particular person sending the email to, but I agree with some of those points.
[21:59.260 --> 22:03.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're saying he's making good points, but the points absolutely have nothing to do with the case.
[22:03.420 --> 22:05.000]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, they're kind of fringe.
[22:05.300 --> 22:05.940]  [SPEAKER_15]: We'll leave it at that.
[22:06.640 --> 22:06.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[22:06.980 --> 22:07.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[22:07.220 --> 22:09.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, there is no cause here, no greater good.
[22:09.660 --> 22:12.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is just run-of-the-mill vandalism and destruction just with a new face on it.
[22:12.740 --> 22:16.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Criminals are still criminals no matter how many people put up a website to deify them.
[22:17.400 --> 22:20.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: Our society depends upon information systems for survival.
[22:20.500 --> 22:30.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: What he has done, and here comes the good analogies here, is the equivalent of blowing up tracks along the transcontinental railroad in 1870 or poisoning the horses for the Pony Express.
[22:31.280 --> 22:34.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: These are analogies that are being said for the first time.
[22:34.420 --> 22:36.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: There is nothing funny or novel about it.
[22:36.600 --> 22:38.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Gee whiz, nobody gets hurt when you poison a horse.
[22:38.920 --> 22:41.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: When you blow up railroad tracks, hey, that's just free expression.
[22:41.820 --> 22:42.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Come on, guys.
[22:44.240 --> 22:45.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's terrorism, plain and simple.
[22:45.980 --> 22:51.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, he defines terrorism and then decides to blanketly encompass other things.
[22:52.520 --> 22:56.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: His weapons of choice are a keyboard and a modem instead of a gun or a bomb.
[22:57.180 --> 23:03.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: Do you see a similarity between guns and bombs and keyboards and modems?
[23:04.760 --> 23:05.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't.
[23:06.300 --> 23:08.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: The potential effects on society are no less serious.
[23:09.500 --> 23:11.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: A lot of people say the same thing about words.
[23:11.980 --> 23:13.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Words, you know, words carry a lot of weight.
[23:13.880 --> 23:17.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, you know, we don't outlaw words, nor should we ever outlaw words.
[23:18.360 --> 23:20.760]  [SPEAKER_15]: Nor do we outlaw guns, nor should we ever outlaw guns.
[23:20.840 --> 23:22.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, don't get me started on that.
[23:22.700 --> 23:24.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Don't get me started on guns.
[23:26.320 --> 23:31.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: For those reasons, I don't think it's a stretch to call his deeds crimes against humanity.
[23:32.460 --> 23:36.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is especially true if his hero or cult-like status encourages a number of others to follow in his footsteps.
[23:37.020 --> 23:39.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: He's a common criminal and needs to be sentenced as such for his acts.
[23:39.860 --> 23:40.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, great.
[23:40.620 --> 23:43.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: A common criminal would be out maybe four years ago.
[23:44.100 --> 23:45.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: He was not sentenced like a common criminal.
[23:46.020 --> 23:46.460]  [SPEAKER_17]: I would agree with you there.
[23:47.580 --> 23:55.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: As for the misleading information on your website, government conspiracies, overly harsh sentences, et cetera, you're either sadly naive or just outright liars.
[23:55.560 --> 24:01.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: First of all, as a former law clerk in federal district court, oh boy, I can tell you that sentencing in U.S.
[24:01.260 --> 24:07.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: government courts is governed 100% by sentencing guidelines written by Congress, and there is little discretion left to individual judges.
[24:08.280 --> 24:08.720]  [SPEAKER_15]: Okay.
[24:09.080 --> 24:09.800]  [SPEAKER_15]: That's arguable.
[24:09.900 --> 24:14.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, there is some truth in that, but what does that have to do with saying the sentence is overly harsh?
[24:14.380 --> 24:19.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: The sentence is still overly harsh no matter if it's Congress saying it, a judge, or whoever.
[24:20.040 --> 24:21.980]  [SPEAKER_15]: What was Kevin finally sentenced to?
[24:22.120 --> 24:29.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: He was sentenced to, I guess it's four years and 11 months or something total?
[24:29.360 --> 24:36.660]  [SPEAKER_15]: Now, is that because they had to chew up the years that he spent in prison waiting to be sentenced or was it because that was the reasonable sentencing to give?
[24:36.660 --> 24:40.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: There was no mandate saying they had to sentence him to that.
[24:40.360 --> 24:42.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, he did sign a sentencing agreement.
[24:42.080 --> 24:47.160]  [SPEAKER_15]: So it was convenient to say, all right, well, we'll just take all the time you've spent in prison and we'll add six months to it.
[24:47.160 --> 24:47.720]  [SPEAKER_15]: Let's put it this way.
[24:47.800 --> 24:52.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: If he went another five years before he made an agreement of any sort, they would not be offering him this deal.
[24:52.760 --> 24:55.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: They'd be offering him a deal saying that he had to spend 10 years in prison.
[24:55.960 --> 24:56.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[24:56.420 --> 24:57.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, that's how it works.
[24:57.660 --> 24:58.440]  [SPEAKER_15]: But it would have the time served.
[24:58.860 --> 25:01.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, but they always bring it up to whatever it is that you served.
[25:01.180 --> 25:04.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: If he had made this agreement two years ago, then possibly he'd be out then.
[25:04.260 --> 25:04.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[25:04.720 --> 25:06.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: But of course, they didn't offer the agreement back then.
[25:06.120 --> 25:07.180]  [SPEAKER_15]: I'm just trying to clarify that.
[25:07.340 --> 25:07.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[25:08.640 --> 25:14.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: There are certain minimums and those can be added on by objective factors that are brought up by prosecutors during trial or sentencing.
[25:16.700 --> 25:19.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: It goes on and on and on and on about various things like that.
[25:21.480 --> 25:25.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: I love the fact that Kevin is now complaining about the estimate for his restitution.
[25:25.940 --> 25:33.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: Actually, I didn't see Kevin complaining about that anywhere, but this person says you don't punch someone in the nose and then complain that you thought it would cost less for the plastic surgery.
[25:33.660 --> 25:35.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: These analogies are just, you know, off the wall here.
[25:36.600 --> 25:39.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: If life in prison were possible for these crimes, I'd like to see him get it.
[25:40.980 --> 25:41.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: Former law clerk.
[25:42.380 --> 25:47.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: As it is, I hope the combination of prison time and restitution will put to rest any question of this guy ever doing anything like this again.
[25:49.520 --> 25:50.120]  [SPEAKER_15]: I don't know.
[25:50.980 --> 25:53.420]  [SPEAKER_15]: At least he was sensible in most cases.
[25:53.800 --> 25:54.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: Sensible?
[25:54.280 --> 25:55.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: Saying someone should go to prison for life?
[25:55.500 --> 25:56.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: For looking at software?
[25:57.260 --> 25:58.280]  [SPEAKER_15]: Christenton or whatever her name was?
[25:58.300 --> 26:00.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, yeah, you're always going to find people who are a little crazier than the next person.
[26:01.100 --> 26:01.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[26:02.740 --> 26:07.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: Speaking of which, David Schindler, the prosecutor, assistant U.S.
[26:07.860 --> 26:17.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: attorney, David Schindler's drab 11th floor office at the federal courthouse belies his status as the man who put the most notorious hackers of the 90s behind bars.
[26:17.160 --> 26:19.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, he's now moving on up.
[26:19.800 --> 26:20.660]  [SPEAKER_15]: Where is this article from?
[26:20.660 --> 26:22.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is from ZDTV or ZDNet, actually.
[26:25.060 --> 26:27.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: This month, Schindler 37 is leaving his wife as a pro...
[26:27.900 --> 26:29.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm sorry, his life.
[26:29.940 --> 26:31.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: I really didn't mean to say that.
[26:31.400 --> 26:32.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's retract that one pretty quickly.
[26:32.760 --> 26:34.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: I've just seen that phrase so many times it just sort of fell off my tongue.
[26:35.040 --> 26:36.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Leaving his life as a prosecutor.
[26:37.900 --> 26:38.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: Leaving his wife...
[26:38.880 --> 26:41.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: Obviously, if she has any brain, she'll be leaving him first.
[26:41.580 --> 26:42.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, that's...
[26:42.420 --> 26:48.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Settling into a swank new workplace as partner at the law firm of Latham and Watkins.
[26:49.680 --> 26:56.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: Behind him, he leaves a legacy that includes not only bringing down a governor, but also locking up the most high-profile hackers yet to hit the computer industry.
[26:57.280 --> 27:08.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: At Latham's offices, housed in a sleek glass building that towers over the rest of downtown L.A., Schindler will tackle intellectual property, internal investigation, and other computer-related cases.
[27:08.360 --> 27:13.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: Schindler says he's leaving because after ten years in the federal prosecutor's office, it was time to do something different.
[27:13.620 --> 27:19.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: It sort of got to the point where I realized I wanted some new challenges and a change of venue.
[27:21.520 --> 27:22.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[27:22.220 --> 27:25.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, well, at least he won't be putting people in prison.
[27:26.600 --> 27:28.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: He'll be trying to keep people out of prison, I guess, as a lawyer.
[27:29.180 --> 27:32.220]  [SPEAKER_15]: No, he'll just be trying to make them pay lots and lots of money.
[27:32.340 --> 27:33.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, that too.
[27:34.260 --> 27:37.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, we'll be taking phone calls 212-209-2900.
[27:37.720 --> 27:39.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: Some, uh...
[27:39.240 --> 27:39.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Did you hear about this?
[27:40.460 --> 27:42.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: Get the buzz from Sam Donaldson.
[27:42.540 --> 27:46.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: ABC trumpets and ads for its first Internet news broadcast live, only on the web.
[27:46.840 --> 27:49.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: As it turns out, Donaldson isn't the only one live on the web.
[27:49.680 --> 27:56.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: According to a report from AP, viewers who email messages to Donaldson and his guests are getting a lot more exposure than they bargained for.
[27:56.460 --> 28:02.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: Chatters who posted comments on the news program's website following Monday's debut show had their four-digit Internet address posted to.
[28:03.640 --> 28:04.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: I guess they mean...
[28:04.740 --> 28:05.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: Four-digit?
[28:05.260 --> 28:06.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, this is...
[28:06.080 --> 28:07.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: Dotted quad, or...?
[28:07.040 --> 28:09.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, this is, uh...
[28:09.300 --> 28:10.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: This, uh...
[28:10.360 --> 28:11.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: Who did I get this from?
[28:12.400 --> 28:13.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm not sure.
[28:13.100 --> 28:13.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is the standard.
[28:13.920 --> 28:14.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's what it is.
[28:14.380 --> 28:15.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: The standard.com.
[28:15.620 --> 28:17.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think they mean IP address.
[28:17.300 --> 28:17.440]  [SPEAKER_15]: Okay.
[28:17.620 --> 28:18.500]  [SPEAKER_15]: So this is a dotted quad.
[28:18.600 --> 28:21.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: That address is an ID that anyone can use to track down real-world identities.
[28:22.860 --> 28:23.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: Take Mark from D.C.
[28:23.960 --> 28:30.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: He wondered when Monday's program guest, FCC Chairman William Kennard, would take a greater role in bridging the digital-economic divide.
[28:31.620 --> 28:37.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: Using the four-digit IP address that abcnews.com published, AP was able to identify him as a Justice Department employee.
[28:38.600 --> 28:39.480]  [SPEAKER_15]: So, uh...
[28:39.480 --> 28:41.920]  [SPEAKER_15]: Or he was just working from the Justice Department network.
[28:42.340 --> 28:50.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: The thing is, you have to realize if you send mail over the Internet in any regards, unless you really go to some trouble, your computer is identified.
[28:50.720 --> 28:57.860]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, I find it interesting that they say they're the first news broadcast to deal with interviews and things when CNN Talkback Live has been doing this for how many years?
[28:58.240 --> 28:58.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[28:58.880 --> 29:00.280]  [SPEAKER_15]: And there's many more, too.
[29:00.560 --> 29:03.440]  [SPEAKER_15]: So, I'm not exactly sure what the big deal is.
[29:03.500 --> 29:06.300]  [SPEAKER_15]: I was at CNN Talkback Live once, so I was down in Atlanta.
[29:06.700 --> 29:07.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, they have that right in the mall.
[29:07.980 --> 29:08.660]  [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, it's kind of cool.
[29:09.040 --> 29:09.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: I got to take it.
[29:10.820 --> 29:13.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: Russian Internet company resistance wins for now.
[29:13.340 --> 29:24.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: The former KGB lost a round to a local Internet service provider in Volgograd that challenged its Swarm 2 regulations at an attempt to put all Internet communications in Russia in the hands of the secret police.
[29:25.280 --> 29:35.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: Bayad Slavia managed to score because it was the first ISP who took trouble to litigate itself out of the FSB grip, according to GIST Newsflash, an industry newsletter.
[29:36.120 --> 29:43.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Other telecoms prefer to resort to the traditional Russian means of informal negotiations, which FSB almost always wins.
[29:43.940 --> 29:51.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: St. Petersburg freedom advocate Boris Postensev tells the Moscow Times this doesn't mean that the pressure's off.
[29:51.100 --> 29:52.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: They'll try to tackle him from another angle.
[29:53.340 --> 29:57.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: GIS-T reports that Bayad Slavia's satellite connection remains unplugged.
[29:59.160 --> 30:02.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, the battles for freedom of speech go on.
[30:02.160 --> 30:03.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: All kinds of different places.
[30:04.120 --> 30:16.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: Researchers from France's National Center for Scientific Research warned in a newsletter last week that French buyers of Apple's new iBook notebook computer could be in for a nasty surprise if they use the machine's airport wireless transmitter for accessing the Internet.
[30:16.700 --> 30:31.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: The device uses the same 2.4 gigahertz wave band reserved by the French military, meaning an iBook user surfing the web near an army unit could end up scrambling defense force communications and thus risk a $30,000 fine and six months in jail.
[30:31.680 --> 30:39.760]  [SPEAKER_15]: It's kind of fun when they pull out the DF gear and you have 14 guys in BDU show up with M16s at your small little happy looking iBook.
[30:39.760 --> 30:52.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: A clearly irked rear-admiral Jacques Bissard, head of the National Military Bureau for Frequency Use, told Asians France Press, unlike other countries in Europe, this wave ban is allocated for military use in France.
[30:53.100 --> 31:00.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: He added, Apple probably didn't think about it and the problem wasn't resolved in time, but we're not going to scrap all our communications equipment simply because iBook has suddenly shown up.
[31:01.180 --> 31:03.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, it should be an interesting...
[31:03.120 --> 31:04.440]  [SPEAKER_15]: It should be easy enough to filter.
[31:05.180 --> 31:12.040]  [SPEAKER_15]: I mean, I doubt very much that the transmitters within the iBook themselves are strong enough to really do much of anything.
[31:12.400 --> 31:16.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: The Justice Department is trying to save children before they turn into hackers.
[31:16.500 --> 31:32.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: With its $300,000 funding of the Cyber Citizen Partnership, an awareness campaign coordinated by the Information Technology Association of America, the Justice Department assumes the unusual role of helping to educate budding web users about how to be responsible law abiding surfers.
[31:33.500 --> 31:43.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: The Cyber Citizen Partnership announced in March is a joint justice ITAA effort aimed at protecting the country's Internet infrastructure from outlaw hackers and other criminals.
[31:44.080 --> 31:52.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: Faced with a security breach, law enforcement officials don't know at first if they're confronting a foreign terrorist, a college student, or a couple of sixth graders who are having some fun with dad's computer.
[31:55.200 --> 31:59.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes, that's inspiring, don't you think?
[32:00.300 --> 32:05.900]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, I've been debating that with somebody who emails OTH recently.
[32:07.900 --> 32:09.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, it could be good and bad.
[32:11.140 --> 32:13.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm trying to find the actual website here.
[32:14.040 --> 32:16.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: I imagine if you wander around the Justice Department, you'll find it.
[32:19.380 --> 32:19.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know.
[32:20.040 --> 32:25.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: It basically oversimplifies things and demonizes people in unnecessary ways.
[32:26.140 --> 32:27.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: Again, our phone number 212-209-2900.
[32:27.980 --> 32:30.440]  [SPEAKER_14]: A couple more pieces of mail, then we'll get right to the phone calls.
[32:31.220 --> 32:32.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is from a listener.
[32:32.800 --> 32:37.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: You had a guy on one time talking about the Ontario Real Estate Online Services, Oreos.com.
[32:38.200 --> 32:39.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, he never got back to me.
[32:39.340 --> 32:41.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Discussing that Nabisco was fighting for the domain name.
[32:41.200 --> 32:42.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, not only that, he let the domain name go.
[32:43.120 --> 32:43.340]  [SPEAKER_09]: Really?
[32:43.520 --> 32:45.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, and it was lying around.
[32:45.580 --> 32:51.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: This person, Bob from New York City, mailed us saying that he found out that it was available to the public.
[32:52.380 --> 32:53.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, guess who grabbed it?
[32:53.660 --> 32:54.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: You grabbed it?
[32:54.120 --> 32:54.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: We grabbed it, yes.
[32:55.060 --> 32:57.360]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, I offered to host his site in the States.
[32:57.420 --> 32:59.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, now you can do it because now it's our site.
[33:00.000 --> 33:05.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: So if anyone has any suggestions for what we should put on Oreos.com, please let us know.
[33:05.280 --> 33:06.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: OTH at 2600.com.
[33:06.540 --> 33:07.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: Just email us.
[33:08.520 --> 33:11.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is regarding the gentleman with the mouse cursor pointer problem, if you recall.
[33:12.480 --> 33:13.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: There are two things it could be.
[33:13.740 --> 33:23.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: To my knowledge, having had it happen once or twice with my machine, it happens when you get the combination of a browser running and the Windows swap file system being totally screwy as it is, becoming overloaded.
[33:23.700 --> 33:27.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: When this happens, Windows is unable to render both the browser content and the pointer.
[33:27.880 --> 33:36.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: Other than that, there is supposedly unverified a small virus that affects Windows swap system effectively shutting down Windows use of your system RAM.
[33:37.400 --> 33:43.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, uh, I don't think, uh, he offered a solution to this point.
[33:43.800 --> 33:44.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Not the problem.
[33:45.160 --> 33:47.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, uh, now, now we really have something to worry about.
[33:48.160 --> 33:48.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[33:49.940 --> 33:56.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: I know that this Friday, October 1st, uh, being the first Friday of the month, 2600 will be holding the monthly meeting at the Citicorp Center by the pay funds.
[33:56.840 --> 33:58.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: The problem is, I don't know what time it is.
[33:59.180 --> 34:01.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Could you reply to me and let me know what the time is?
[34:01.560 --> 34:03.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, obviously, we can't get to this person in time.
[34:03.580 --> 34:05.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I, I, but...
[34:05.360 --> 34:06.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's five-ish for next month.
[34:06.600 --> 34:08.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, it's basically the way it works.
[34:08.700 --> 34:11.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: This is why we do this because it's, it's, it's, it's simple to remember.
[34:11.900 --> 34:14.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: All meetings take place the first Friday of every month.
[34:15.440 --> 34:17.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: And most times, they start at 5 p.m.
[34:18.020 --> 34:22.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, in the magazine, on the website, we, uh, we give different times.
[34:22.460 --> 34:23.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: It starts at 6 p.m.
[34:23.300 --> 34:24.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: or if it starts at 4 p.m.
[34:24.570 --> 34:25.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, we mention that.
[34:26.460 --> 34:27.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, um...
[34:27.090 --> 34:28.200]  [SPEAKER_15]: Whenever you get out of work.
[34:28.460 --> 34:28.860]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[34:29.020 --> 34:31.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: Basically, let's get down there whenever you, whenever you can.
[34:31.740 --> 34:35.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, first Friday of the month seems to be working with, uh, with most people.
[34:40.780 --> 34:44.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: And the second Tuesday of the month, then someone's going to want to have it on the third Wednesday of the month.
[34:44.420 --> 34:47.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: And before you know it, nobody knows when 2600 meeting day is.
[34:47.840 --> 34:51.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, um, we're open to suggestion for those people.
[34:51.400 --> 34:53.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: I know there are also smaller towns that want to have meetings, too.
[34:54.760 --> 34:55.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: And...
[34:55.110 --> 34:56.740]  [SPEAKER_15]: If you have a close-knit community, go ahead.
[34:57.200 --> 35:03.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: What I was thinking of doing, just every shopping mall, every shopping mall in the world has a hacker time.
[35:03.720 --> 35:06.260]  [SPEAKER_14]: A time where hackers can come to the food court.
[35:06.460 --> 35:06.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes.
[35:07.040 --> 35:08.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: And let's say it's Friday at 5 p.m.
[35:08.700 --> 35:09.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: Every Friday at 5 p.m.
[35:09.610 --> 35:10.760]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you're in a food court, that's...
[35:10.760 --> 35:12.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's when the hackers, you know, get together.
[35:12.610 --> 35:16.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: Because we can't possibly list every single town with a mall in the magazine.
[35:16.320 --> 35:19.630]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, this is the general idea behind the monthly meetings as we've structured them, though.
[35:20.000 --> 35:20.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[35:20.300 --> 35:22.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: But the thing is, there are so many people who want to have meetings.
[35:22.500 --> 35:25.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: So many people from so many towns who can't travel to big cities.
[35:25.720 --> 35:27.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, again, we're open to a suggestion on that.
[35:27.320 --> 35:29.340]  [SPEAKER_14]: OTH at 2600.com is our email address.
[35:30.860 --> 35:41.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Dear, off the hook, just wanted to let you know that I tried dialing 700-XXXXX and 700-555-4141 on my cell phone, and they worked identifying the regional carrier as NYNEX.
[35:42.120 --> 35:47.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes, they do still live, and the long distance as Sprint, which is my cellular carrier.
[35:48.080 --> 35:50.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: I also tried this on my office phone, and it did not work.
[35:50.500 --> 35:51.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: We don't have a sophisticated PBX.
[35:52.040 --> 35:53.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's an old AT&T Merlin system.
[35:53.660 --> 35:56.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: When you dial 9, you get an honest-to-God outside dial tone.
[35:56.440 --> 36:02.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: I do know, however, that my employer is not using Bell Atlantic for a carrier, though I can't ever remember what the name of the carrier is.
[36:03.020 --> 36:03.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: Merlin's cool.
[36:03.860 --> 36:04.300]  [SPEAKER_14]: From Albany.
[36:04.380 --> 36:05.600]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, Merlin's okay, but...
[36:05.600 --> 36:06.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: I like Merlin.
[36:06.800 --> 36:16.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think there are some COs that don't have the 700 exchange working quite properly yet, so that might be the problem in that particular situation.
[36:16.300 --> 36:20.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: Again, 700 plus four digits will tell you your regional carrier.
[36:20.660 --> 36:25.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: 1-700-555 plus just about any four digits, but 4-1-4-1 is usually what people use.
[36:25.880 --> 36:27.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: That will tell you your long-distance company.
[36:28.760 --> 36:35.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: And finally, this in response to the MasterCard that I was forcefully sent a few weeks ago.
[36:35.540 --> 36:39.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: I know of AT&T's UCS MasterCards firsthand because I got one as well.
[36:39.800 --> 36:41.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Though mine was actually asked for.
[36:41.660 --> 36:46.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: They love giving credit cards to us stupid college kids to max out and pay $200 a month in fees for.
[36:46.620 --> 36:57.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: Anyway, if you haven't verified yours yet, they do ask you to Touch-Tone in your social security number as a supposed security measurement to make sure it's really you activating your card and not some guy who picked it up out of the mail or something.
[36:57.560 --> 37:00.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: I found UCS to be one of the worst financial organizations ever.
[37:01.060 --> 37:03.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: They have held payments before to get late fees out of me.
[37:03.840 --> 37:05.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: The bill was due on the 15th.
[37:05.160 --> 37:08.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mailed to check out to them on the 2nd and it just so happens to get posted the day after the due date.
[37:09.240 --> 37:18.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: They hawk their cards to naive college students just out of high school, recruiting heavily on campuses, hoping to lure kids into purchasing all sorts of stuff and getting interest from them for years to come.
[37:19.500 --> 37:37.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: Several uses for a non-activated UCS AT&T MasterCard should include but not be limited to A, burning, B, shredding, C, lockpicking, D, rather odd square frisbees, E, burning again, a drastic campaign attempting to discredit an otherwise cripple AT&T and Citibank for unethical business practices.
[37:37.160 --> 37:38.380]  [SPEAKER_14]: I like that one.
[37:38.500 --> 37:38.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, it's a good one.
[37:39.320 --> 37:40.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: G, burning some more.
[37:41.100 --> 37:43.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, it has to melt before it burns.
[37:43.400 --> 37:43.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes.
[37:44.060 --> 37:45.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that melt comes from Jason.
[37:45.460 --> 37:47.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Thanks, Jason, for all the helpful suggestions there.
[37:48.520 --> 37:49.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[37:49.180 --> 37:50.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: 212-209-2900.
[37:50.860 --> 37:52.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's see who's out there.
[37:52.500 --> 38:10.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, you know, in addition to the merger of Sprint and MCI, which I believe still can be defeated by either the FCC or the shareholders, there's the largest radio gathering, you know, they own something like 500 stations, AM-FM, was taken over by Clear Channel.
[38:10.660 --> 38:13.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: So now we have an entity that owns 900 radio stations.
[38:14.100 --> 38:14.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's amazing.
[38:15.180 --> 38:15.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[38:15.400 --> 38:16.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: Where are we going?
[38:16.260 --> 38:16.940]  [SPEAKER_14]: What is going to happen?
[38:17.020 --> 38:19.500]  [SPEAKER_14]: I just, it's like a science fiction story.
[38:19.700 --> 38:20.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: It really is.
[38:20.980 --> 38:21.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[38:21.280 --> 38:22.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: 212-209-2900.
[38:23.260 --> 38:23.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening.
[38:25.460 --> 38:25.800]  [SPEAKER_17]: Hello.
[38:26.060 --> 38:26.760]  [SPEAKER_17]: Yeah, speak up, please.
[38:26.840 --> 38:27.460]  [SPEAKER_17]: Yes, Emmanuel.
[38:28.000 --> 38:29.580]  [SPEAKER_17]: I don't know what that sound was, but...
[38:29.580 --> 38:34.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: That sound was the sound of your voice, and you'll have about 10 seconds more to listen to it.
[38:34.460 --> 38:34.920]  [SPEAKER_17]: Well, deep.
[38:35.220 --> 38:39.880]  [SPEAKER_17]: Anyway, you were talking about corporate mergers with MCI and Sprint and all that.
[38:40.060 --> 38:51.340]  [SPEAKER_17]: You know, I just got, you know, my phone bill with, of course, the $3 monthly service charge minimum thing where I don't use a long distance call, where I don't tell you when I don't...
[38:51.340 --> 38:52.200]  [SPEAKER_17]: Your time is up.
[38:52.320 --> 38:53.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's a dollar and four cents.
[38:53.040 --> 38:55.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: Put a comma in your sentence and make a question, quick.
[38:55.180 --> 39:04.780]  [SPEAKER_17]: And then, when I disconnect the long distance and have no long distance company, they have the audacity to call me and say, oh, well, you're not using Sprint or MCI or whatever it was.
[39:05.120 --> 39:05.600]  [SPEAKER_17]: Did you...
[39:05.600 --> 39:07.820]  [SPEAKER_17]: Why is that that you're not using Sprint?
[39:07.900 --> 39:08.700]  [SPEAKER_17]: And I just tell them...
[39:08.700 --> 39:09.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: What's your question, Rebel?
[39:10.180 --> 39:18.440]  [SPEAKER_17]: Okay, my question is that how are we going to avoid these charges, these $3 monthly, and then if you dial a carrier access code, if you don't have a long distance company...
[39:18.440 --> 39:19.540]  [SPEAKER_17]: Right, they charge you for that, too.
[39:19.700 --> 39:20.220]  [SPEAKER_17]: Of course.
[39:20.740 --> 39:21.260]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, they're...
[39:21.260 --> 39:29.700]  [SPEAKER_15]: If you list yourself without long distance, you'll get charged a buck four each month for not having a long distance carrier, and then you use one of those 1010 numbers, and it'll just sit on your bill.
[39:29.800 --> 39:30.260]  [SPEAKER_15]: That's what I do.
[39:30.860 --> 39:32.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: Which 1010 number do you use?
[39:34.140 --> 39:34.500]  [SPEAKER_15]: 1010660.
[39:34.700 --> 39:35.840]  [SPEAKER_15]: They sent me something in the mail.
[39:36.120 --> 39:37.960]  [SPEAKER_14]: And they don't charge you per usage?
[39:38.320 --> 39:39.160]  [SPEAKER_15]: I think they do.
[39:39.420 --> 39:42.360]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, they don't charge you like a $3 fee if you start using it?
[39:42.480 --> 39:43.020]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, no, no.
[39:43.220 --> 39:43.740]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't think so.
[39:43.740 --> 39:44.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: A lot of these companies do.
[39:45.280 --> 39:46.100]  [SPEAKER_15]: I've never checked.
[39:46.400 --> 39:48.900]  [SPEAKER_15]: I've only called long distance like once or twice.
[39:49.840 --> 39:52.240]  [SPEAKER_15]: Actually, I think the one time I used 1010220.
[39:54.340 --> 39:55.680]  [SPEAKER_15]: So, regardless, I don't...
[39:55.680 --> 39:59.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's a rip-off, and they get you every way you face.
[39:59.380 --> 40:00.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's an unfortunate thing.
[40:01.020 --> 40:03.740]  [SPEAKER_15]: I suggest going back to smoke signals or flares.
[40:04.020 --> 40:04.320]  [SPEAKER_15]: Good evening.
[40:04.420 --> 40:04.780]  [SPEAKER_15]: You're in the air.
[40:06.500 --> 40:07.220]  [SPEAKER_14]: Speak up, please.
[40:07.440 --> 40:07.840]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes, go ahead.
[40:08.320 --> 40:14.660]  [SPEAKER_03]: Hey, I just wanted to tell you about PC Weeks having a Hack PC Week $1,000 prize thing.
[40:14.840 --> 40:17.180]  [SPEAKER_03]: They're trying to find Linux and NT security holes.
[40:17.380 --> 40:18.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: Didn't they do that a couple of weeks ago?
[40:19.300 --> 40:19.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: Or is this a new one?
[40:20.720 --> 40:22.600]  [SPEAKER_03]: I just heard about it a couple of days ago.
[40:22.740 --> 40:23.960]  [SPEAKER_03]: I figured I'd call in and ask.
[40:24.300 --> 40:26.660]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, do you have any information like websites or anything like that?
[40:26.900 --> 40:28.820]  [SPEAKER_03]: It's hackpcweek.com, I think.
[40:29.040 --> 40:29.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[40:29.740 --> 40:30.720]  [SPEAKER_03]: That's pretty straightforward.
[40:30.960 --> 40:34.140]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, that's pretty straightforward, and hopefully somebody will win that challenge.
[40:34.280 --> 40:36.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: I heard a rumor that somebody did win that challenge, actually.
[40:36.340 --> 40:39.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes, but I have serious problems with that entire system.
[40:39.560 --> 40:44.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I do too, because when someone says hack this site, you don't know if there's even a site attached to it.
[40:44.260 --> 40:46.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: You have no idea exactly what it is that they're doing.
[40:46.060 --> 40:47.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's a big publicity stunt for them.
[40:47.700 --> 40:48.060]  [SPEAKER_14]: Precisely.
[40:48.180 --> 40:50.700]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, and you don't really get anything out of it.
[40:51.060 --> 41:01.880]  [SPEAKER_14]: And, you know, if you stick like a dead site up there with just a name on it and you say, hack this site, you know, we had 30,000 attempts in 24 hours and nobody got in, you don't tell people, hey, there wasn't a system there to hack into in the first place,
[41:01.940 --> 41:02.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: which is why nobody got in.
[41:02.960 --> 41:12.960]  [SPEAKER_15]: Even if there is a system that's there, do you think that the people who are actually talented enough to do something are going to waste their time throwing themselves at this site for even a thousand bucks?
[41:13.100 --> 41:13.480]  [SPEAKER_15]: Probably not.
[41:13.740 --> 41:15.160]  [SPEAKER_15]: A thousand bucks is kind of interesting.
[41:15.420 --> 41:16.060]  [SPEAKER_15]: It's somewhat new.
[41:16.200 --> 41:27.340]  [SPEAKER_15]: But I've seen a lot of these companies who just throw up a website and say, hack us, at which point when they don't get hacked in two weeks, they say, oh, our wonderful product is so completely secure, nobody can possibly get into it.
[41:27.500 --> 41:32.280]  [SPEAKER_15]: Then they market on that little platform that they've created for themselves artificially.
[41:32.460 --> 41:38.380]  [SPEAKER_15]: And then sometime down the line, their product is going to fail miserably when somebody with talent is going to attack it.
[41:38.460 --> 41:49.580]  [SPEAKER_14]: See, now, I believe, and this is something we came up with a couple of years ago on the show, if they really are that, in love with their product, they really think it's secure, then give us a list of the people currently using it.
[41:49.640 --> 41:52.000]  [SPEAKER_14]: And we'll try to hack them because we know they're using systems.
[41:52.200 --> 41:54.160]  [SPEAKER_14]: If it's really that secure, then they're fine.
[41:54.320 --> 41:58.560]  [SPEAKER_14]: And then you have some motivation to actually learn something.
[41:58.760 --> 42:01.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: People aren't motivated by $1,000 and I'm motivated by the money aspect.
[42:02.000 --> 42:03.120]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's not what hacking is.
[42:03.440 --> 42:04.120]  [SPEAKER_15]: Certain people are.
[42:04.200 --> 42:06.980]  [SPEAKER_14]: Certain people are, but they're usually not the hacking type in the first place.
[42:07.120 --> 42:09.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: They're the profit-oriented people that give everybody a bad name.
[42:09.680 --> 42:14.280]  [SPEAKER_14]: And that's what they're trying to draw out by putting these financial incentives on things.
[42:14.680 --> 42:20.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hackers do it for the love of knowledge and just for the sake of wasting a whole lot of time and staying up all night.
[42:20.560 --> 42:20.720]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[42:21.320 --> 42:22.460]  [SPEAKER_14]: 212-209-2900.
[42:22.540 --> 42:22.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening.
[42:22.940 --> 42:23.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're on the air.
[42:24.740 --> 42:25.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hello?
[42:25.280 --> 42:25.780]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes, go ahead.
[42:29.440 --> 42:31.320]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, you're going to have to talk a lot faster than that.
[42:31.380 --> 42:31.620]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening.
[42:31.680 --> 42:32.240]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're on the air.
[42:33.160 --> 42:33.780]  [SPEAKER_13]: Hi, how are you doing?
[42:33.900 --> 42:34.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: Pretty good.
[42:34.640 --> 42:37.500]  [SPEAKER_13]: I try calling into the new overlay area codes.
[42:38.080 --> 42:45.980]  [SPEAKER_13]: When I try calling from the number you want to try dialing is the business office for Bell Atlantic 890-2700.
[42:46.220 --> 42:48.360]  [SPEAKER_13]: It exists in all Bell Atlantic area codes.
[42:48.480 --> 42:48.960]  [SPEAKER_13]: Thank you, sir.
[42:49.020 --> 42:49.460]  [SPEAKER_13]: That's good.
[42:49.540 --> 42:52.220]  [SPEAKER_13]: Including 646 and 347.
[42:52.460 --> 42:57.400]  [SPEAKER_13]: However, when I try dialing it from my AT&T cell phone, AT&T blocks it.
[42:57.620 --> 42:57.820]  [SPEAKER_14]: Really?
[42:57.920 --> 42:59.540]  [SPEAKER_14]: So AT&T doesn't yet know about 347.
[42:59.740 --> 42:59.960]  [SPEAKER_13]: Right.
[43:00.060 --> 43:10.580]  [SPEAKER_13]: But if you try from a landline phone, you try dialing, well, a Bell Atlantic landline phone, you dial into it, you go through right to the business office and you go into their voicemail prompt, which of course tells you that it's closed.
[43:10.580 --> 43:10.840]  [SPEAKER_13]: Right.
[43:12.240 --> 43:12.520]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[43:12.660 --> 43:13.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's a winner.
[43:13.340 --> 43:13.800]  [SPEAKER_14]: Thank you, sir.
[43:13.880 --> 43:14.480]  [SPEAKER_14]: Thanks for the information.
[43:14.700 --> 43:14.900]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay.
[43:15.480 --> 43:16.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, it's interesting.
[43:16.540 --> 43:18.080]  [SPEAKER_14]: AT&T doesn't yet know about this.
[43:18.200 --> 43:21.040]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know how they charge us, they try to charge us to tell us about area codes?
[43:21.120 --> 43:23.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: Do you think we can get some money out of them for telling them about an area code?
[43:23.980 --> 43:24.420]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know?
[43:24.620 --> 43:25.420]  [SPEAKER_12]: Give it a try.
[43:25.560 --> 43:26.180]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm not going to.
[43:26.300 --> 43:26.680]  [SPEAKER_14]: Not this time.
[43:26.740 --> 43:29.200]  [SPEAKER_14]: But I will try the, I will try calling the numbers to see if it works.
[43:31.720 --> 43:32.400]  [SPEAKER_14]: 8900, right?
[43:32.860 --> 43:33.080]  Yeah.
[43:42.430 --> 43:42.770]  [SPEAKER_16]: Uh-oh.
[43:44.930 --> 43:46.710]  [SPEAKER_16]: I'm sorry, your call cannot be completed.
[43:46.710 --> 43:47.270]  [SPEAKER_16]: Didn't work from here.
[43:47.490 --> 43:49.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: So it's not programmed everywhere, apparently.
[43:50.090 --> 43:51.310]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, who do we use as a carrier?
[43:51.690 --> 43:53.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um, we don't use Bell Atlantic, I think.
[43:53.890 --> 44:00.010]  [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, that's, if it's just Bell Atlantic, they're obviously on top of it, but it might take a little longer to propagate through everywhere else.
[44:00.070 --> 44:00.270]  [SPEAKER_15]: Right.
[44:00.510 --> 44:01.390]  [SPEAKER_15]: Which is kind of silly.
[44:01.550 --> 44:04.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: They did start using it already, so it's kind of annoying.
[44:04.190 --> 44:05.570]  [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah, it's a little bit of a problem.
[44:05.970 --> 44:06.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, let's take another phone call.
[44:06.890 --> 44:07.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening, you're on the air.
[44:09.130 --> 44:09.530]  [SPEAKER_04]: Hello.
[44:09.830 --> 44:10.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, speak up, please.
[44:11.250 --> 44:14.150]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, yeah, I just want to let you know I found another Dictaphone thing.
[44:14.270 --> 44:14.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: You did?
[44:14.870 --> 44:15.250]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[44:15.770 --> 44:18.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: And is it as bad as the one we found a couple of weeks ago?
[44:19.030 --> 44:19.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[44:19.610 --> 44:19.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: Really?
[44:20.230 --> 44:20.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yep.
[44:20.670 --> 44:22.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, that's certainly something.
[44:22.430 --> 44:24.410]  [SPEAKER_15]: What kind of organization is it?
[44:24.710 --> 44:25.710]  [SPEAKER_15]: It's another hospital.
[44:25.770 --> 44:26.230]  [SPEAKER_15]: It's another hospital.
[44:26.230 --> 44:26.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: Another hospital.
[44:27.350 --> 44:39.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: Um, well, I'll leave this up to you if you want to email us the information or, I don't advise giving out the information on the air only because it could, you know, really mess things up for people who are in hospitals.
[44:39.790 --> 44:40.890]  [SPEAKER_04]: How about I talk to you later?
[44:41.270 --> 44:42.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: That sounds good.
[44:42.290 --> 44:42.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: That sounds good.
[44:43.230 --> 44:44.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: Wait, now, are you the person who found the first one?
[44:44.770 --> 44:45.010]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yes.
[44:45.230 --> 44:46.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, well, tell us something about that.
[44:46.850 --> 44:47.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: I didn't recognize your voice.
[44:47.870 --> 44:48.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'm sorry.
[44:49.250 --> 44:53.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: You actually just found this by dialing randomly?
[44:53.770 --> 44:53.970]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[44:54.910 --> 44:55.750]  [SPEAKER_04]: That's what I did.
[44:56.070 --> 44:57.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's pretty amazing.
[44:58.250 --> 44:58.470]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[44:58.850 --> 45:00.510]  [SPEAKER_04]: You just come across a lot of stuff that way.
[45:00.890 --> 45:01.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh-huh.
[45:02.390 --> 45:03.370]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, it's another...
[45:03.370 --> 45:04.530]  [SPEAKER_04]: They don't have passwords set up.
[45:04.650 --> 45:05.750]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's the same deal.
[45:05.750 --> 45:16.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: Okay, well, for those people interested, we'll look into this and if it does pan out, you can count on another story on our webpage and maybe some other news organizations will take an interest this time.
[45:16.210 --> 45:24.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: But, yeah, you know, I have to say it was a very responsible thing the way that you released the information.
[45:24.610 --> 45:29.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, you didn't use it for any bad purposes or, you know...
[45:29.790 --> 45:30.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[45:30.530 --> 45:32.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, what could you have done?
[45:33.790 --> 45:34.430]  [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know.
[45:35.750 --> 45:37.310]  [SPEAKER_04]: I had enough information about people.
[45:37.450 --> 45:40.110]  [SPEAKER_04]: I could, you know, terrorize people if I wanted to, you know.
[45:40.530 --> 45:46.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, yeah, you can always terrorize people but I think you can also add information to their charts.
[45:47.510 --> 45:49.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: You can delete information.
[45:49.650 --> 45:49.870]  [SPEAKER_15]: Yeah.
[45:50.330 --> 45:52.570]  [SPEAKER_15]: But it didn't even occur to you to do these kind of things.
[45:52.590 --> 45:54.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right, and hopefully I'm not inspiring you to do that now.
[45:54.750 --> 45:55.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: Exactly.
[45:55.610 --> 45:59.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: But that's what a lot of people seem to fail to realize.
[45:59.670 --> 46:04.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: When they hear about things like this, hackers could have done this, but...
[46:04.330 --> 46:05.710]  [SPEAKER_04]: We don't all have bad intentions.
[46:06.210 --> 46:06.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right, right.
[46:07.610 --> 46:11.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, basically, for people who are looking for interesting things, what kind of advice would you give them?
[46:13.530 --> 46:17.650]  [SPEAKER_04]: If you're really bored one day, just pick up the phone, start dialing in, you know, total free numbers.
[46:18.010 --> 46:18.290]  [SPEAKER_13]: Uh-huh.
[46:19.230 --> 46:21.190]  [SPEAKER_04]: Come across a lot of nifty little things.
[46:22.390 --> 46:28.490]  [SPEAKER_04]: Voicemail systems that have a whole bunch of stuff in them, like cellular phone companies that have, you know, their passwords set up to default.
[46:29.610 --> 46:30.490]  [SPEAKER_04]: all kinds of stuff.
[46:30.610 --> 46:33.370]  [SPEAKER_04]: They talk about passwords to switches and...
[46:33.830 --> 46:34.230]  [SPEAKER_04]: Wow.
[46:34.410 --> 46:35.530]  [SPEAKER_04]: You come across a lot of stuff.
[46:35.750 --> 46:38.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: Do you dial sequentially or randomly?
[46:38.690 --> 46:42.630]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, sequentially, if I find a couple good things in that same area.
[46:43.230 --> 46:43.370]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh-huh.
[46:43.370 --> 46:48.970]  [SPEAKER_04]: Sometimes I'll just bounce around, like different numbers, or, you know, I'll start from zero, zero, zero, zero and work my way up.
[46:49.790 --> 46:54.270]  [SPEAKER_14]: There are three toll-free area cuts now, 800-888 and 877.
[46:54.510 --> 46:55.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: Which is your favorite?
[46:55.130 --> 46:56.110]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, 888.
[46:56.350 --> 46:56.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: Why is that?
[46:57.250 --> 46:59.230]  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, just find the needed stuff in 888.
[46:59.610 --> 46:59.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: Really?
[47:00.190 --> 47:00.430]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
[47:00.670 --> 47:01.470]  [SPEAKER_04]: It's probably newer.
[47:01.670 --> 47:02.290]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, it is newer.
[47:02.490 --> 47:03.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: They do put newer things.
[47:03.350 --> 47:05.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: But do you think people would know more?
[47:05.730 --> 47:08.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know, the people who put things up more recently would be aware of security.
[47:09.410 --> 47:10.190]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, they're not.
[47:11.550 --> 47:12.770]  [SPEAKER_04]: Maybe they don't care, you know?
[47:13.010 --> 47:15.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: Maybe they think nobody is ever going to find out about it.
[47:15.710 --> 47:16.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, well...
[47:16.430 --> 47:17.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: We're here to tell them different.
[47:17.570 --> 47:19.610]  [SPEAKER_04]: Some of us don't have lives we scan all day.
[47:21.250 --> 47:24.370]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, hey, thanks for the information, and I guess I'll be in touch with you later.
[47:24.610 --> 47:24.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[47:24.790 --> 47:25.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, take care.
[47:25.890 --> 47:26.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, bye.
[47:26.930 --> 47:28.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's our anonymous contributor there.
[47:29.170 --> 47:31.110]  [SPEAKER_15]: There's nothing wrong with not having a life.
[47:31.690 --> 47:32.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: No?
[47:32.330 --> 47:32.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, that's true.
[47:33.730 --> 47:34.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: You know that better than anybody.
[47:34.730 --> 47:35.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Nothing at all.
[47:35.450 --> 47:35.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[47:36.810 --> 47:38.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, good evening.
[47:38.270 --> 47:38.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're on the air.
[47:39.690 --> 47:41.450]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'm calling about the...
[47:41.450 --> 47:49.750]  [SPEAKER_05]: You know, earlier you said about how stupid it is that, you know, there's all these new airy codes coming up in New York City and the whole area.
[47:50.550 --> 47:58.710]  [SPEAKER_05]: But you said, you know, a long time ago that you said there was an alternative solution instead of the three-digit area code.
[47:58.850 --> 47:59.150]  [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[47:59.890 --> 48:01.390]  [SPEAKER_05]: What do you mean by that?
[48:01.510 --> 48:14.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: The alternative solution that I came up with and I know other people came up with was to have a four-digit area code where basically you keep the unique three-digit area code, say, in our case in our case it was 2-1-2 and you simply add a digit.
[48:14.230 --> 48:25.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: So instead of having 2-1-2 and 6-4-6 and 3-4-7 and even 7-1-8 you could have had 2-1-2-1 2-1-2 2-1-2-3 and that way anybody calling you would know where they're calling.
[48:25.930 --> 48:35.030]  [SPEAKER_14]: They'd recognize the 2-1-2 area code yet it wouldn't be 2-1-2 anymore it'd be 2-1-2-X but I think that's a whole lot better than introducing area codes where even the people who live there don't know about them.
[48:35.230 --> 48:35.550]  [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[48:35.690 --> 48:36.770]  [SPEAKER_05]: Random numbers generated.
[48:36.770 --> 48:43.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, and you know we're going to run out of those too anyway so eventually we will have to expand the number of digits in the phone number.
[48:43.650 --> 48:44.090]  [SPEAKER_15]: Wait a second.
[48:44.370 --> 48:44.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[48:44.910 --> 48:53.310]  [SPEAKER_15]: You're now calling for people to dial 11 digits and you absolutely have to dial 11 digits because even the people in 2-1-2 have their numbers changed.
[48:53.910 --> 48:59.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, I'm sure you could figure out a way around that where you just you don't dial the 2-1-2 you just dial the 4th digit.
[49:00.830 --> 49:01.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean...
[49:01.630 --> 49:04.490]  [SPEAKER_05]: So it would have to be something aside from a 1 or a 0.
[49:04.730 --> 49:04.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[49:05.210 --> 49:07.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, if it was a universal system it wouldn't matter.
[49:07.310 --> 49:10.070]  [SPEAKER_15]: You're in the doctor's office at 1-2-3-4-5-6-7.
[49:10.190 --> 49:10.350]  [SPEAKER_15]: Right.
[49:10.630 --> 49:12.450]  [SPEAKER_15]: I'm the...
[49:13.010 --> 49:15.590]  [SPEAKER_15]: I don't know McDonald's at 1-2-3-4-5-6-7.
[49:15.790 --> 49:15.990]  [SPEAKER_15]: Uh-huh.
[49:16.070 --> 49:16.970]  [SPEAKER_15]: You have 2-1-2.
[49:17.190 --> 49:19.410]  [SPEAKER_15]: I'm a brand new McDonald's I have 2-1-2-1.
[49:19.630 --> 49:19.890]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, no.
[49:19.970 --> 49:21.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: I have 2-1-2-1 you have 2-1-2-2.
[49:21.550 --> 49:22.450]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, so you lose...
[49:22.450 --> 49:23.090]  [SPEAKER_15]: Everybody has 4 digits.
[49:23.110 --> 49:24.550]  [SPEAKER_15]: So you lose your 2-1-2.
[49:24.570 --> 49:24.810]  [SPEAKER_15]: Exactly.
[49:24.930 --> 49:25.890]  [SPEAKER_15]: Everybody loses...
[49:25.890 --> 49:27.590]  [SPEAKER_14]: There are no more 3-digit area codes.
[49:27.710 --> 49:28.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's how the plan works.
[49:28.830 --> 49:39.310]  [SPEAKER_15]: So now you're not only forced to go to a 10-digit code like even or like being forced to do where you have to dial 10 digits.
[49:39.490 --> 49:39.630]  [SPEAKER_15]: Uh-huh.
[49:39.690 --> 49:42.510]  [SPEAKER_15]: Now you have to dial with no possible exceptions.
[49:42.750 --> 49:43.310]  [SPEAKER_15]: 11 digits.
[49:43.430 --> 49:53.690]  [SPEAKER_14]: Not necessarily because let's say we keep the 1-plus plan you know, where you dial 1 in front of an area code and we don't use 1 as a first digit after the new 4-digit area code.
[49:53.810 --> 49:54.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: You could still...
[49:54.670 --> 49:57.090]  [SPEAKER_14]: Actually, you don't use 1 as the 4th digit of the area code.
[49:57.470 --> 50:06.170]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you dial, say, 2-1-2-3-4-5-6 you would be getting the equivalent of 2-1-2-2-2-1-2-3-whatever.
[50:07.230 --> 50:09.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: I can write it out for you later on paper.
[50:09.250 --> 50:13.030]  [SPEAKER_14]: But basically, you don't have to dial an area code every single time with that plan.
[50:13.490 --> 50:14.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: You definitely don't.
[50:14.570 --> 50:15.330]  [SPEAKER_15]: Questionable, but okay.
[50:15.590 --> 50:15.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right.
[50:16.150 --> 50:16.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: Thanks for the call.
[50:17.070 --> 50:18.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's go on to another call here.
[50:18.990 --> 50:19.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening.
[50:19.330 --> 50:19.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're on the air.
[50:20.390 --> 50:20.990]  [SPEAKER_02]: Good evening.
[50:21.690 --> 50:22.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hi.
[50:22.030 --> 50:22.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hello.
[50:22.230 --> 50:22.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes, go ahead.
[50:23.430 --> 50:28.630]  [SPEAKER_02]: Isn't Bill Atlantic bitching that it's running out of phone numbers in New York City or is this just in Manhattan?
[50:29.790 --> 50:32.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think they're bitching about running out of phone numbers everywhere.
[50:32.770 --> 50:42.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: Because I just got something in the mail and they just contacted me on the phone that they're offering phone numbers that people can call me on.
[50:43.230 --> 50:43.470]  [SPEAKER_06]: Right.
[50:43.730 --> 50:48.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: But I can't call out on and they're like additional phone numbers in my prefix.
[50:48.610 --> 50:53.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, and they ring differently when they call you it rings two short rings and one long one or something crazy like that.
[50:53.630 --> 50:53.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[50:53.770 --> 50:56.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, they're giving away these things for virtually nothing.
[50:56.330 --> 50:57.570]  [SPEAKER_02]: If they're running out of phone numbers how is this possible?
[50:58.150 --> 51:03.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: Because that's why they're running out of phone numbers because they're giving away all these other numbers and encouraging people to use them.
[51:04.290 --> 51:07.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: And not only that for large corporations it's even worse.
[51:07.790 --> 51:11.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: They give them away in blocks of 10,000 when only a handful are used.
[51:12.970 --> 51:14.310]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, here's something else.
[51:14.530 --> 51:31.950]  [SPEAKER_02]: You're always crying that you can't get the time for free if you're an AT&T customer and you're calling outside of your timed area you get a little recording that says it's 7 or whatever time it is in the area where you were calling.
[51:32.050 --> 51:32.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's right.
[51:32.490 --> 51:33.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: You do get that only...
[51:33.510 --> 51:34.330]  [SPEAKER_15]: Are you paying for those minutes?
[51:34.810 --> 51:37.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, because that happens while the phone is ringing.
[51:37.450 --> 51:39.410]  [SPEAKER_14]: Sometimes it even gets cut off by the person answering.
[51:39.910 --> 51:40.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's okay then.
[51:40.850 --> 51:43.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: It only happens when you're calling within the United States.
[51:43.010 --> 51:45.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: It would be nice if it happened if you're calling all different parts of the world.
[51:45.810 --> 51:50.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: And it doesn't happen in the same area because you have to call somebody out of the area and hope that they don't pick up.
[51:50.910 --> 51:53.250]  [SPEAKER_02]: You have to call somebody out of your time region.
[51:53.390 --> 51:53.570]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[51:53.790 --> 51:58.230]  [SPEAKER_02]: You have to call out of the time zone and it happens before it starts ringing.
[51:58.430 --> 52:02.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: No, actually I have to disagree with that because I've had people pick up in the middle of that recording.
[52:03.330 --> 52:06.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: So, it might take a little longer for some exchanges to start ringing.
[52:07.150 --> 52:15.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: It might take a little longer for people to actually pick up but otherwise people would be complaining that it takes longer to connect a call now and I don't think they want that.
[52:16.610 --> 52:17.290]  [SPEAKER_02]: Another thing.
[52:17.410 --> 52:17.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes.
[52:18.210 --> 52:18.850]  [SPEAKER_02]: Bell Atlantic.
[52:19.030 --> 52:21.650]  [SPEAKER_02]: Doesn't Bell Atlantic take care of all of New York State?
[52:22.390 --> 52:24.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: They take care of most of New York State.
[52:24.290 --> 52:26.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: There are some parts of Rochester that have independent phone companies.
[52:27.270 --> 52:31.150]  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, I mean like they take care of what, the 516 like Rhode Island, Suffolk, Nassau County?
[52:31.150 --> 52:33.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: With the exception of Fishers Island, 788 Exchange.
[52:33.590 --> 52:40.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so if I'm calling within the Bell Atlantic region, shouldn't I be charged for a local call?
[52:41.170 --> 52:44.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you're calling within a particular ladder, yes.
[52:44.390 --> 52:50.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you're calling say up to Buffalo, then that's considered a long distance call even though it's within the same phone company.
[52:50.650 --> 52:51.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, maybe a regional call.
[52:52.050 --> 52:53.130]  [SPEAKER_14]: That is not a regional call.
[52:53.190 --> 52:53.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's a long distance call.
[52:54.010 --> 52:54.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Really?
[52:54.330 --> 52:54.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[52:54.550 --> 52:58.270]  [SPEAKER_02]: What if I'm calling from let's say Brooklyn to let's say Nassau County?
[52:58.550 --> 52:59.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: That's a regional call.
[53:00.430 --> 53:05.710]  [SPEAKER_02]: But again, like, you know, it's like what decides what's regional, what's local, and what's long distance?
[53:06.070 --> 53:10.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Regional is within your ladder, but not within your local calling area.
[53:10.330 --> 53:11.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: For instance, Brooklyn to Brooklyn is local.
[53:12.050 --> 53:14.570]  [SPEAKER_14]: Brooklyn to Nassau is regional.
[53:14.710 --> 53:16.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: Brooklyn to the Bronx is also local.
[53:17.670 --> 53:19.210]  [SPEAKER_14]: Nassau to Suffolk is regional.
[53:19.390 --> 53:21.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: So now you can have a choice of regional companies.
[53:22.570 --> 53:35.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: Now, if you go outside the ladder, like, say, north of 914, say, Suffolk County to Albany, that's a long distance call, even though both companies, even though the company is the same on both ends, you need a long distance carrier to get there.
[53:36.790 --> 53:37.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hmm.
[53:37.710 --> 53:38.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's confusing as hell.
[53:39.030 --> 53:46.230]  [SPEAKER_15]: The best guide is like the front of your white pages where they list the tables for the different rates for calling various prefixes and different area codes.
[53:46.450 --> 53:46.670]  [SPEAKER_15]: Uh-huh.
[53:47.250 --> 53:48.490]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, they're running out of space.
[53:48.610 --> 53:50.030]  [SPEAKER_14]: You ever see the area code maps now?
[53:50.230 --> 53:50.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: They're scary.
[53:51.170 --> 53:53.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: You can't, you need to, like, zoom in on all of them now.
[53:53.950 --> 53:56.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: Chicago alone has something like eight area codes.
[53:56.750 --> 53:58.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: All right, let's see if we can fit in a couple more phone calls.
[53:58.830 --> 54:00.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening, you're on the air.
[54:01.230 --> 54:03.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, that's an interesting call right there.
[54:04.170 --> 54:04.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: Let's try this one.
[54:04.570 --> 54:05.430]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening, you're on the air.
[54:06.050 --> 54:06.330]  [SPEAKER_10]: Hello?
[54:06.570 --> 54:07.050]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yes, go ahead.
[54:07.050 --> 54:13.890]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah, are you aware of the new marketing scheme by Bell Atlantic about local calling packages?
[54:14.790 --> 54:16.010]  [SPEAKER_14]: Uh, why don't you tell us?
[54:16.170 --> 54:16.350]  [SPEAKER_10]: Okay.
[54:17.270 --> 54:28.050]  [SPEAKER_10]: About a month ago, I got a little thing in with my bill that said now you don't have to pay for every local call, which I thought was great because my local calls were more than my long distance, usually.
[54:28.610 --> 54:31.550]  [SPEAKER_10]: And they tried to get like 10.6 cents a call or something like that.
[54:31.970 --> 54:42.210]  [SPEAKER_10]: So the packages were, I think, 200 calls for $19.95 a month, $300 for $29.95, and $400 for $49.95.
[54:42.890 --> 54:46.170]  [SPEAKER_10]: So none of those packages really suited me, so I called them up.
[54:46.290 --> 54:49.530]  [SPEAKER_10]: They didn't mention any other packages or any unlimited options or anything like that.
[54:49.710 --> 54:49.870]  [SPEAKER_13]: Okay.
[54:50.050 --> 54:56.010]  [SPEAKER_10]: When I called them, they were very reluctant to tell me that for $26, you can have unlimited calling.
[54:56.610 --> 54:59.370]  [SPEAKER_10]: They don't mention it in any of their advertisements in their bill.
[54:59.690 --> 55:12.390]  [SPEAKER_10]: So there's a lot of people, I would assume, who aren't calling them up or, you know, or they're calling up and asking for one of these packages for paying $40 for $400 calls when I could make $800 calls and pay $26.
[55:12.910 --> 55:16.330]  [SPEAKER_10]: They don't advertise their unlimited package for $26.
[55:16.870 --> 55:20.710]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, I mean, there are a couple of different unlimited type of packages they have.
[55:20.830 --> 55:28.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: One involves calling everything within your region, say, the metropolitan area, Nassau County, Western Suffolk, or Eastern Suffolk.
[55:28.210 --> 55:34.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you call within one of those zones, you pay for each call, but it's not timed.
[55:34.590 --> 55:44.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: Or you could have another service where you can call as many times as you want and not pay anything but to a smaller region, like, say, your central office and a couple of the surrounding ones.
[55:44.510 --> 55:44.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[55:44.770 --> 55:49.330]  [SPEAKER_14]: And then you pay per minute for every call inside your region outside of that.
[55:49.590 --> 55:49.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: Right.
[55:49.830 --> 55:51.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: So those are the two basic rates.
[55:51.890 --> 55:53.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know about this new one that they're introducing.
[55:53.910 --> 55:54.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: It sounds like a scam, though.
[55:55.610 --> 56:01.950]  [SPEAKER_10]: What I'm trying to bring up here is the fact that they are, you know, they enclosed this mailer and it gives you these three options.
[56:02.530 --> 56:14.090]  [SPEAKER_10]: And then when I called them and asked them if there were any more options, they said no at first, and then they finally, with a little prodding, told me, yeah, for $26 I can have unlimited to the same areas, you know what I'm saying, to the same regions.
[56:14.370 --> 56:14.670]  [SPEAKER_06]: Right.
[56:14.750 --> 56:24.710]  [SPEAKER_10]: All I'm trying to bring to your attention is the fact that, you know, why spend $40 to get $400 calls, when you can get unlimited calls for $26, there's no need to pay any more than $26.
[56:25.570 --> 56:26.350]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, that's true.
[56:26.530 --> 56:35.750]  [SPEAKER_10]: And, you know, I think it's, I tried to leave a voicemail for Asa Ahrens about this, because I think a lot of people are getting these bills, and a lot of people don't question these things about Bell Atlantic.
[56:36.010 --> 56:38.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, or they have so many phone numbers they don't even look at the bills anymore.
[56:38.810 --> 56:39.170]  [SPEAKER_10]: Exactly.
[56:39.470 --> 56:45.990]  [SPEAKER_10]: And it's like, you know, there's people now who don't know about the $26 unlimited who are paying $40 for $400 calls.
[56:46.150 --> 56:50.630]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, the two phrases to remember are flat rate calling and message rate calling.
[56:50.790 --> 56:51.970]  [SPEAKER_14]: Those are the two services offered.
[56:52.290 --> 56:54.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: Simply ask, what does it cost to use this?
[56:54.870 --> 56:55.770]  [SPEAKER_14]: What does it cost to use that?
[56:56.010 --> 56:58.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: And don't accept any more hype.
[56:58.330 --> 56:59.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: Thanks for the call.
[57:00.030 --> 57:01.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: I guess we have time for one more quick one.
[57:02.290 --> 57:02.730]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good evening.
[57:02.830 --> 57:03.230]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're on the air.
[57:03.870 --> 57:04.210]  [SPEAKER_11]: Hi.
[57:04.690 --> 57:14.030]  [SPEAKER_11]: What are you guys rating lately as the best all-around cell service, in terms of service, not price, but continuous service in the area?
[57:14.210 --> 57:15.030]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, I'll tell you this.
[57:15.030 --> 57:16.150]  [SPEAKER_15]: It's not Sprint PCS.
[57:16.230 --> 57:21.110]  [SPEAKER_15]: It depends on where you want to go, and I've never heard anyone really complain about Bell Atlantic.
[57:21.810 --> 57:22.650]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah, that's true.
[57:22.730 --> 57:24.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: Though I don't really know anybody who uses Bell Atlantic.
[57:24.750 --> 57:26.930]  [SPEAKER_15]: I know a couple of people, but they're usually very happy about it.
[57:27.830 --> 57:29.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: I'll say this about Omnipoint.
[57:29.330 --> 57:37.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: I was talking to somebody on the phone the other day from New Jersey, all the way out to the island I was driving, and I didn't lose signal once, and it sounded good the whole time.
[57:37.970 --> 57:44.530]  [SPEAKER_14]: The disadvantage is that I'm going to have to put my house up for sale to pay for that call because, you know, they're very expensive.
[57:44.970 --> 57:48.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: Sprint PCS is cheap, but the service is really, you know, questionable at best.
[57:49.770 --> 57:58.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: Speaking of questionable things, and then we're out of here, driving in tonight, I have to see this little blue Xerox mimeograph piece of paper on the toll booth.
[57:58.990 --> 58:04.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: I don't know whose idea it is to put that there, but, you know, I had to stop to read it because it obviously has something to do with E-ZPass.
[58:05.290 --> 58:08.070]  [SPEAKER_14]: I mean, you know, this is a really stupid way to get word out.
[58:08.170 --> 58:10.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: You're going to cause an accident by making people stop to read this thing.
[58:11.090 --> 58:15.990]  [SPEAKER_14]: Apparently now, it's against the law for you not to have your E-ZPass on your window.
[58:16.230 --> 58:17.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: You can't hold it in your hand anymore.
[58:17.830 --> 58:20.670]  [SPEAKER_14]: You'll get a fine, a $10 fine, if they catch you doing it.
[58:21.110 --> 58:24.850]  [SPEAKER_14]: Isn't that amazing how they, how the city is just like slowly changing the rules?
[58:25.010 --> 58:29.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: First, it's like, oh, you can keep it in this little aluminum bag and, you know, use whenever you want.
[58:29.190 --> 58:37.890]  [SPEAKER_15]: So it won't be charged or, well, I know people who have two E-ZPasses, one for their company and one for their personal use, and you have to like put the one that you don't want charged into your silly little bag.
[58:38.130 --> 58:38.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: Yeah.
[58:38.830 --> 58:42.250]  [SPEAKER_14]: Well, now you would have to mount it on your window before you actually go through the toll booth.
[58:42.250 --> 58:45.610]  [SPEAKER_14]: If you're caught holding it in your hand, you're subject to a fine.
[58:46.170 --> 58:47.150]  [SPEAKER_14]: No reason for this.
[58:47.150 --> 58:48.690]  [SPEAKER_14]: It doesn't work any differently.
[58:48.710 --> 58:51.030]  [SPEAKER_14]: It's going to work if you hold it in your hand as well as put it on your window.
[58:52.350 --> 59:02.470]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think it's in keeping with the other recent change which says that it's not legal anymore to swap the tags, to use it for one car this day, one car another day.
[59:02.550 --> 59:03.830]  [SPEAKER_14]: It has to match.
[59:04.230 --> 59:06.390]  [SPEAKER_14]: Can you say tracking device?
[59:06.390 --> 59:07.510]  [SPEAKER_14]: Oh, I can say it all right.
[59:08.570 --> 59:08.930]  [SPEAKER_14]: Good.
[59:08.990 --> 59:09.750]  [SPEAKER_14]: I knew you could.
[59:09.790 --> 59:11.790]  [SPEAKER_14]: I think a lot of people are starting to believe it.
[59:12.390 --> 59:13.910]  [SPEAKER_14]: We'll see how that transpires.
[59:14.270 --> 59:22.810]  [SPEAKER_14]: Hey, we won't be back next week or the week after that because of fundraising, but you can catch a brand new edition of Off the Hook in three weeks at the usual time from 8 to 9 p.m.
[59:23.090 --> 59:24.310]  [SPEAKER_14]: Thanks to everybody for calling in.
[59:24.430 --> 59:26.950]  [SPEAKER_14]: Thanks to all those people listening over the Internet and various other places.
[59:27.350 --> 59:38.190]  [SPEAKER_14]: And you can write to us, OTH at 2600.com on the Internet, or if you have pencil and paper, write to Off the Hook, care of WBAI, 120 Wall Street, New York, New York, 100005.
[59:38.650 --> 59:43.110]  [SPEAKER_14]: Until three weeks from now, this is Emmanuel. Night from Isaac as well.
[59:43.610 --> 59:44.870]  [SPEAKER_14]: We'll see you in three weeks.