Off The Hook - 2003-04-02

[00:00.000 --> 00:04.840]  [SPEAKER_12]: A price that they will pay regardless of the consequences according to Russia.
[00:05.060 --> 00:08.960]  [SPEAKER_12]: She is not talking anymore about dignity, but about destiny.
[00:09.280 --> 00:15.140]  [SPEAKER_01]: Anything that happens in the world affects the Palestinians, and the Palestinians pay the price.
[00:15.300 --> 00:17.040]  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's our destiny.
[00:17.300 --> 00:25.980]  [SPEAKER_12]: A destiny that is still uncertain and risky for Palestinians who didn't forget the continuous Israeli occupation which has lasted since 1967.
[00:26.900 --> 00:30.800]  [SPEAKER_12]: I'm our diverse reporting for Free Speech Radio News, Ramallah.
[00:34.920 --> 00:37.060]  [SPEAKER_16]: This is Free Speech Radio News.
[00:37.260 --> 00:38.500]  [SPEAKER_16]: I'm Deepa Fernandes.
[00:40.240 --> 00:43.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: And this is radio station WBAI in New York.
[00:43.780 --> 00:45.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that means it's time for Off the Hook.
[00:48.160 --> 00:52.640]  [SPEAKER_14]: The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
[00:53.600 --> 00:58.100]  [SPEAKER_14]: I cut myself while shaving, now I can't make a call.
[00:58.820 --> 01:00.920]  [SPEAKER_14]: We couldn't get much worse.
[01:01.640 --> 01:03.460]  [SPEAKER_04]: But if they could, they would.
[01:03.740 --> 01:06.380]  [SPEAKER_04]: From Billy Bump, for the best, expect the worst.
[01:07.080 --> 01:08.860]  [SPEAKER_04]: I hope that's understood.
[01:09.080 --> 01:09.960]  [SPEAKER_04]: From Billy Bump!
[01:16.140 --> 01:17.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: And a good evening to everybody.
[01:17.380 --> 01:18.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: The program is Off the Hook.
[01:18.340 --> 01:22.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Emmanuel Goldstein here with you tonight on this April the 2nd.
[01:23.880 --> 01:25.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have a full studio.
[01:25.820 --> 01:34.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're going to continue our conversation that we began last week on war coverage in the media and how the Internet ties in and things like that.
[01:34.700 --> 01:35.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Bernie S.
[01:35.460 --> 01:36.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: joins us from down there in Philadelphia.
[01:36.720 --> 01:37.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Bernie, how are you doing?
[01:38.680 --> 01:39.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, wait.
[01:39.180 --> 01:39.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: I forgot to press your button.
[01:39.940 --> 01:40.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's my fault this time.
[01:40.720 --> 01:40.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Are you there?
[01:41.600 --> 01:42.200]  [SPEAKER_08]: Oh, good evening.
[01:42.320 --> 01:42.700]  [SPEAKER_08]: There we are.
[01:42.840 --> 01:43.460]  [SPEAKER_08]: Brotherly love.
[01:43.920 --> 01:44.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes.
[01:44.580 --> 01:46.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: You have a clicking phone, I think.
[01:46.340 --> 01:46.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: I hear...
[01:46.640 --> 01:47.560]  [SPEAKER_08]: The clicking phone?
[01:47.560 --> 01:48.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I hear little clicks on the line.
[01:49.300 --> 01:49.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: Oh, no.
[01:49.960 --> 01:54.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: That's some of those people from that African tribe that make those clicking noises that are in here with me.
[01:54.740 --> 01:55.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[01:55.220 --> 01:56.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that's just fine.
[01:56.580 --> 02:01.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, now, you spent today trying to track down somebody from Al Jazeera that we were going to talk to on the radio.
[02:02.180 --> 02:06.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, unfortunately, it's a lot later over there than it is over here.
[02:07.400 --> 02:09.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah, it's about 3 in the morning there right now.
[02:09.380 --> 02:09.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[02:09.600 --> 02:11.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, that complicated matters right there.
[02:11.700 --> 02:12.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: But you did talk to somebody.
[02:12.820 --> 02:14.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: But you want to tell us what they told you?
[02:15.180 --> 02:15.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, yeah.
[02:15.560 --> 02:24.080]  [SPEAKER_08]: I actually had several conversations with people at the Al Jazeera, both at the Washington Bureau and in Qatar, where they're based out of.
[02:24.540 --> 02:33.600]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I spoke to three or four people and finally reached a gentleman named Jihad Hotel, I think his name was.
[02:33.860 --> 02:34.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: His name was what?
[02:35.080 --> 02:36.560]  [SPEAKER_08]: His first name is Jihad.
[02:36.880 --> 02:38.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: His real name is Jihad?
[02:38.880 --> 02:40.560]  [SPEAKER_08]: Believe it or not, that's his first name, Jihad.
[02:40.720 --> 02:41.760]  [SPEAKER_08]: J-A-H-A-D.
[02:42.500 --> 02:42.820]  [SPEAKER_08]: Okay.
[02:43.220 --> 02:43.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: Sounded like a very peaceful guy.
[02:43.880 --> 02:46.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, that could be what people are screaming over there.
[02:46.480 --> 02:47.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: They could just be looking for their kids.
[02:48.280 --> 02:49.720]  [SPEAKER_08]: You know, I never realized that.
[02:49.720 --> 02:49.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[02:50.540 --> 02:51.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, anyway.
[02:51.480 --> 02:55.520]  [SPEAKER_08]: I mean, it'd kind of be like, you know, people here are named Jesus or Jesus.
[02:55.680 --> 02:57.220]  [SPEAKER_08]: You could just be saying, Jesus!
[02:57.700 --> 02:57.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
[02:57.880 --> 03:00.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: And, you know, people could think you'd be cursing or something or whatever.
[03:00.480 --> 03:02.220]  [SPEAKER_08]: And you could just be looking for your friend.
[03:03.080 --> 03:06.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: I had, yeah, I had a friend whose dog was named God, but never mind.
[03:06.520 --> 03:08.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that resulted in kinds of confusion.
[03:09.080 --> 03:13.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, anyway, you talked to this Jihad person in Qatar.
[03:13.540 --> 03:14.020]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
[03:14.500 --> 03:15.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: Very reasonable guy.
[03:16.080 --> 03:17.680]  [SPEAKER_08]: I enjoyed my conversation with him.
[03:17.900 --> 03:20.180]  [SPEAKER_08]: I spoke good English, bit of an accent.
[03:20.360 --> 03:33.700]  [SPEAKER_08]: But what I was trying to do was find someone, your suggestion, who could talk to us a bit on the air tonight about the problems Al Jazeera is facing with regard to getting the news out to America.
[03:33.700 --> 03:38.080]  [SPEAKER_08]: America, as they see it, as all news agencies report the news as they see it.
[03:40.460 --> 03:55.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: And basically, I want to talk with him a little bit about the denial of service attacks, that their website has been subjected to the DNS hijack recently, where their domain was forwarded to another domain by an unauthorized party.
[03:55.280 --> 04:06.540]  [SPEAKER_08]: The problems with them being kicked out of the New York Stock Exchange floor and the NASDAQ floor for no reason, other than they were reporting news, you know, on no other reason.
[04:06.840 --> 04:10.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think the reason that the government gave was that they were not reasonable or something.
[04:10.920 --> 04:13.400]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, the first reason was they didn't have enough room for them.
[04:13.540 --> 04:18.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: But they already had press passes for the area, so it wasn't like they had less room all of a sudden.
[04:18.480 --> 04:19.080]  [SPEAKER_08]: I don't know.
[04:19.080 --> 04:25.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, the Hallmark Channel has room in the Stock Exchange, for God's sake, so the whole thing's really crazy.
[04:26.520 --> 04:28.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, okay, what else did you learn from this guy?
[04:28.860 --> 04:32.820]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, Jahad told me that they've been under attack for quite some time now.
[04:33.000 --> 04:35.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: He wasn't specific about how long, because it was a brief conversation.
[04:36.020 --> 04:44.840]  [SPEAKER_08]: But there was a bit of pain and anguish in his voice about having their website under attack for so many days now.
[04:45.000 --> 04:47.640]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I would be pretty upset myself.
[04:47.640 --> 04:49.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Was he the guy that had to fix it?
[04:50.040 --> 04:50.400]  [SPEAKER_08]: No.
[04:50.540 --> 04:58.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: Actually, there was an IT person that he said I could talk with, but he said that person could not talk about anything other than specific, just technical things only.
[04:58.520 --> 05:00.660]  [SPEAKER_08]: He couldn't talk about their policies or that sort of thing.
[05:00.900 --> 05:04.680]  [SPEAKER_08]: This guy seemed more flexible as far as the things that he could talk about.
[05:05.240 --> 05:08.500]  [SPEAKER_08]: But he said he wasn't up on the specific technical details.
[05:09.680 --> 05:14.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: But we could try to get that other person on the phone maybe next week if they're willing to talk to somebody at 3 in the morning.
[05:14.260 --> 05:19.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: Jihad, unfortunately, when I spoke with him this morning at 11 o'clock, he'd already worked a 19-hour day.
[05:20.580 --> 05:24.240]  [SPEAKER_08]: He's being swamped with calls for interviews.
[05:25.380 --> 05:32.220]  [SPEAKER_08]: And he just said he couldn't bring himself to have an interview at 3 in the morning, considering he hadn't worked for 19 hours straight.
[05:32.580 --> 05:36.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: But the fact that he works 19-hour days, maybe the cycle can work next week.
[05:36.260 --> 05:39.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: So he begins his 19-hour day shortly before our show, and then we can talk to him.
[05:39.920 --> 05:41.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: That would require him to keep a schedule like you.
[05:42.200 --> 05:42.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[05:43.000 --> 05:43.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: Is that unreasonable?
[05:44.080 --> 05:45.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, you know, people do that all over the world.
[05:45.900 --> 05:49.060]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, most people don't have a schedule like a nocturnal bat.
[05:49.840 --> 05:50.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, yeah.
[05:50.540 --> 05:51.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: But if you want to get any work done, you have to.
[05:52.840 --> 05:55.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, okay, so that's promising.
[05:55.240 --> 05:56.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: Maybe we can talk to somebody in the future.
[05:56.940 --> 06:05.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: I just, since we have an Internet connection right here in the studio, I just decided to check out the Al Jazeera English site to see if it ever did come up.
[06:05.620 --> 06:06.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you know what?
[06:06.240 --> 06:06.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: It did come up.
[06:06.880 --> 06:08.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: It just came up now for the first time.
[06:08.320 --> 06:15.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: However, I'm a bit perplexed by this because it says, site under construction, Jazeera Academy, a demo page for Jazeera Academy.
[06:17.360 --> 06:19.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, as far as I know, they're not called...
[06:19.700 --> 06:20.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's not what I saw last week.
[06:20.380 --> 06:21.900]  [SPEAKER_07]: I went to that site last week, and I didn't see that.
[06:22.080 --> 06:26.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, well, they're not called the Al Jazeera Academy, but apparently at this point...
[06:26.960 --> 06:30.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know if they're making it go someplace else, but they...
[06:30.640 --> 06:31.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, you know what?
[06:32.340 --> 06:33.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: I didn't type Al Jazeera.
[06:33.980 --> 06:34.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: I just typed Jazeera.
[06:34.680 --> 06:35.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, yeah.
[06:35.480 --> 06:36.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: Okay, that's...
[06:36.280 --> 06:37.620]  [SPEAKER_08]: H-G-T-P colon slash slash...
[06:37.620 --> 06:38.520]  [SPEAKER_08]: I know about that.
[06:38.660 --> 06:38.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: I know about that.
[06:38.920 --> 06:39.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, the listeners may not.
[06:39.960 --> 06:42.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: The people who didn't listen last week, it's H-G-T-P colon slash slash...
[06:42.440 --> 06:46.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, now I'm getting... You are not authorized to view this page from Netscape, or...
[06:46.560 --> 06:47.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Is that Explore?
[06:47.120 --> 06:47.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, it's Netscape.
[06:49.020 --> 06:49.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: So...
[06:49.380 --> 06:52.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: Can I read the URL to people at home listening?
[06:52.120 --> 06:52.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead.
[06:52.900 --> 06:59.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's HTTP colon slash slash English dot Al Jazeera dot net.
[07:00.040 --> 07:03.860]  [SPEAKER_08]: And that's A-L-J-A-Z-E-E-R-A.
[07:04.000 --> 07:13.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, the odd thing is that I'm getting, according to Netscape, this error is caused when the server has a list of IP addresses that are not allowed to access the site.
[07:13.940 --> 07:15.780]  [SPEAKER_07]: You're not using www, are you?
[07:16.160 --> 07:17.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, no, no.
[07:17.120 --> 07:18.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is coming straight from them.
[07:18.780 --> 07:21.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Or at least that's what Netscape is saying.
[07:21.020 --> 07:24.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: So I'd like to know if other people have gotten that same error, if anybody can actually get through to it.
[07:24.420 --> 07:25.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's kind of interesting.
[07:25.440 --> 07:25.740]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yes, Jim?
[07:26.000 --> 07:29.880]  [SPEAKER_13]: Did you type in English dot Al Jazeera dot...
[07:29.880 --> 07:30.580]  [SPEAKER_13]: Dot net, yes.
[07:30.720 --> 07:32.260]  [SPEAKER_13]: You've typed in the word English at this part?
[07:32.440 --> 07:33.080]  [SPEAKER_13]: Oh, okay.
[07:33.180 --> 07:34.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: I made one mistake.
[07:34.360 --> 07:35.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: I forgot to type the Al.
[07:35.480 --> 07:35.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[07:35.680 --> 07:37.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: I know about the HTTP and all the other stuff.
[07:37.960 --> 07:38.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, yes.
[07:39.800 --> 07:41.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, I'm doing it exactly the way we're supposed to.
[07:41.820 --> 07:46.200]  [SPEAKER_15]: Why don't you try... Why don't you try Internet Explorer?
[07:46.880 --> 07:48.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Why would it work differently in a different browser?
[07:48.800 --> 07:50.180]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, you said...
[07:50.180 --> 07:51.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Look, you want to run over here and type things in?
[07:52.100 --> 07:53.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's very hard to type and talk at the same time.
[07:54.020 --> 07:54.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Go ahead.
[07:54.360 --> 07:55.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, feel free.
[07:55.700 --> 07:57.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: We'll reach them one way or another.
[07:57.680 --> 08:00.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we'll see if we can reach the regular Al Jazeera page as well.
[08:00.920 --> 08:07.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, anyway, so to update people, since our show last week, the Al Jazeera website was quote-unquote hacked.
[08:08.060 --> 08:10.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: And what that means is...
[08:10.600 --> 08:11.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know what that means exactly.
[08:11.840 --> 08:22.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: What basically happened was, according to the Associated Press, hackers on Thursday replaced the English-language website for Arab satellite television network Al Jazeera with a U.S.
[08:22.540 --> 08:25.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: flag and the message, Let Freedom Ring.
[08:25.240 --> 08:42.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, the hackers, calling themselves the Freedom Cyber Force Militia, briefly hijacked Internet traffic designed for Al Jazeera's website and redirected it to a different webpage on computers operated by NetWorld Connections, an Internet provider in Salt Lake City.
[08:43.160 --> 08:45.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, they used a method known as DNS poisoning.
[08:46.420 --> 08:55.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: And basically what that means is they just were able to full network solutions, which is really no big feat at all, into giving up the domain to a different...
[08:56.240 --> 09:00.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think it was a Vancouver-based registrar.
[09:00.560 --> 09:03.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: And what they did there was simply put up their own site.
[09:03.560 --> 09:12.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: They got control of the DNS, and they were able to have fun for a day or so until the rightful owners of the site were able to get it rectified.
[09:12.360 --> 09:14.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it was put back in network solutions' hands.
[09:15.920 --> 09:16.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's a danger there.
[09:16.860 --> 09:17.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, this can happen to...
[09:17.860 --> 09:20.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: This happened to us a couple of years ago when somebody tried to do this.
[09:20.520 --> 09:23.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: We caught it, and we were able to talk to network solutions and prevent it from going through.
[09:24.380 --> 09:27.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: But it's, you know, with enough persistence, this kind of thing does happen.
[09:27.740 --> 09:29.380]  [SPEAKER_08]: So nothing happened to their web server?
[09:29.760 --> 09:30.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't think so.
[09:30.640 --> 09:38.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Based on what I'm looking at here, it looks like they simply did a redirect of some sort by going to a different registrar and simply gaining control of it that way.
[09:40.040 --> 09:41.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, it's...
[09:41.500 --> 09:42.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't think that's going to happen again.
[09:42.860 --> 09:46.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: You can lock domains so that that's impossible to do unless you're...
[09:46.400 --> 09:48.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, you provide certain bits of information.
[09:48.900 --> 09:52.380]  [SPEAKER_08]: But they were being subjected to lots of denial of service attacks.
[09:52.600 --> 09:53.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that was happening before.
[09:53.960 --> 09:56.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: There was denial of service attacks about this time last week.
[09:56.360 --> 10:03.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: And then after we talked about that, I don't know if they stopped or if the denial of service attacks went along with the new domain.
[10:05.620 --> 10:11.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, you know, I still have not been able to get through to the original web page that I thought would be rather interesting.
[10:12.060 --> 10:14.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, a very good story actually appeared in Wired.
[10:14.460 --> 10:15.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: I always like to note when that happens.
[10:16.320 --> 10:19.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Because it happened on the 31st.
[10:19.220 --> 10:24.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: And basically, it's called Hackers Condemn Arab Site Hack.
[10:24.480 --> 10:28.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Don't blame hackers for the attacks that recently took down Arab News Network Al Jazeera's website.
[10:28.980 --> 10:35.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Technically, the site was hacked, but hackers who say they abhor breaking into systems for fun or profit as opposed to malicious...
[10:35.740 --> 10:36.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Here we go, crackers.
[10:37.520 --> 10:43.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: And the amateurs known as script kitties believe shutting off access to information is distinctly un-hacker-like behavior.
[10:44.180 --> 10:46.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: And then they go into the details as to what happened to the site.
[10:46.880 --> 10:48.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: And basically, some quotes here.
[10:48.160 --> 10:57.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: The individuals who did this are committing a computer crime and causing censorships at Oxblood Ruffin, executive director of Hacktivismo, a group that develops tools to circumvent censorship.
[10:57.340 --> 10:59.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: The former would not be tolerated by American courts.
[11:00.120 --> 11:02.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: The latter is, in part, why America went to war in the first place.
[11:03.060 --> 11:04.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Either way, it's not good.
[11:04.680 --> 11:12.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's no difference between the White House censoring a long-time political reporter, Helen Thomas, and packet wankers taking down Al Jazeera.
[11:13.080 --> 11:13.860]  [SPEAKER_07]: Packet wankers?
[11:13.980 --> 11:15.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, they're all cut from the same cloth.
[11:16.040 --> 11:17.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Bullies, cowards, hypocrites.
[11:17.840 --> 11:18.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I couldn't have said it better.
[11:19.140 --> 11:21.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: A bunch of other quotes there, but you'll find that on Wired.
[11:23.280 --> 11:25.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm wondering if that's a technical term, packet wankers.
[11:25.920 --> 11:26.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, it is now.
[11:26.860 --> 11:27.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: It is now.
[11:27.680 --> 11:29.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think that's something I will go into.
[11:29.300 --> 11:29.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: I like it.
[11:29.900 --> 11:30.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: The Newspeak Dictionary.
[11:31.100 --> 11:31.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's a good one.
[11:31.920 --> 11:32.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[11:33.440 --> 11:40.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, I'm glad to see, you know, some kind of a backlash against this sort of thing, because it is extremely wrong.
[11:40.760 --> 11:42.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we're looking for ways...
[11:42.480 --> 11:49.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: I've been talking to people in various parts of the world, looking for ways as hackers to figure out how to bypass things like this, and how to make information more accessible.
[11:49.880 --> 11:54.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's got nothing to do with whether or not you agree with it, or whether or not you think they're doing a responsible job.
[11:54.220 --> 11:56.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: The point is, it's information out there.
[11:56.440 --> 11:57.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: It is a news source.
[11:57.740 --> 12:01.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it's not up to you, me, or anybody else to decide who gets to see it and who does not.
[12:02.640 --> 12:03.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: Shouldn't be.
[12:03.260 --> 12:04.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Very simple, you know.
[12:04.240 --> 12:04.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Extremely simple.
[12:05.400 --> 12:13.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Anyway, meanwhile, in spite of being mostly knocked offline, the website of Al Jazeera was among the most sought after on the Internet last week.
[12:13.840 --> 12:20.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: According to LikeUs, they reported Al Jazeera and variant spellings became its top search term last week.
[12:20.200 --> 12:22.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Three times more searches than sex.
[12:23.360 --> 12:23.820]  [SPEAKER_11]: Wow.
[12:24.020 --> 12:24.160]  [SPEAKER_11]: Yeah.
[12:24.160 --> 12:24.400]  [SPEAKER_11]: Whoa.
[12:24.640 --> 12:25.540]  [SPEAKER_20]: That's no small feat.
[12:26.100 --> 12:29.760]  [SPEAKER_20]: You've got to wonder if there's anyone left who doesn't know how to find sex on the Internet, though.
[12:30.700 --> 12:35.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, if you type sex on the search engine, I mean, how many hits do you get?
[12:36.020 --> 12:37.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: It must be a lot.
[12:37.560 --> 12:38.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: More hits than pages.
[12:38.480 --> 12:39.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, probably.
[12:40.340 --> 12:44.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Al Jazeera drew intense interest in web surfers after broadcast pictures of dead and captive U.S.
[12:44.060 --> 12:44.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: soldiers in Iraq.
[12:45.100 --> 12:45.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: U.S.
[12:45.900 --> 12:48.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: television networks have decided not to air footage of the corpses.
[12:48.400 --> 12:49.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: But they considered it.
[12:49.340 --> 12:51.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: They were given the same information, Al Jazeera.
[12:51.760 --> 12:55.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: See, people seem to think that Al Jazeera went out there and photographed this themselves.
[12:55.460 --> 12:56.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: They did not.
[12:56.140 --> 13:03.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: They simply received a tape from Iraqi television like everybody else did, and they made a different editorial decision, and it's within their rights to do that.
[13:05.880 --> 13:08.100]  [SPEAKER_08]: And chose not to edit it, I might point out.
[13:08.740 --> 13:11.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, well, I mean, I wouldn't know because I haven't seen it.
[13:11.340 --> 13:15.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: Although a few people have offered it to me on the Internet just have not had time to actually look at it myself.
[13:16.080 --> 13:18.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I'm a little bit afraid to, but I think I will in the end.
[13:18.940 --> 13:20.180]  [SPEAKER_08]: How do you feel about...
[13:20.180 --> 13:33.640]  [SPEAKER_08]: I mean, we never really discussed that, Emmanuel, but frankly, I think that that sort of information being kept away from viewers is sort of desensitizes them to the violence that this war is creating.
[13:33.640 --> 13:43.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, yeah, I mean, if you see a bunch of, like, you know, hacked, mangled corpses that used to be American soldiers, it kind of, like, you know, it takes all the fun out of war, you know?
[13:43.820 --> 13:52.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: And people are going to really sort of start questioning things and having second thoughts about the wisdom of doing this in the first place, you know?
[13:52.220 --> 13:56.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: And before you know it, more people will be saying, why are we doing this?
[13:56.300 --> 14:01.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: Or hacked or riddled with bullets from any nationality.
[14:01.620 --> 14:03.640]  [SPEAKER_08]: I mean, just dead people in general is a bad thing.
[14:03.800 --> 14:05.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: We have no problem showing dead Iraqis.
[14:05.940 --> 14:06.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: I've noticed that.
[14:06.480 --> 14:07.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: I've seen that on television.
[14:07.460 --> 14:08.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: I've seen, you know, corpses in the street.
[14:09.120 --> 14:10.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're showing that all the time.
[14:10.240 --> 14:13.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: But apparently if you put a uniform on there, we're supposed to show respect.
[14:14.620 --> 14:22.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, you can say that all you want, but the fact of the matter is we're all in this together and one dead person is as good as another dead person.
[14:22.320 --> 14:35.580]  [SPEAKER_08]: Speaking of uniforms, have you noticed the interesting claims that have been made with regard to Iraqi soldiers allegedly ordering or wearing United States uniforms?
[14:35.920 --> 14:38.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, I see all these reports.
[14:38.320 --> 14:47.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: I hear reports that all these things are happening, that people are being threatened to do this, and that, you know, Iraqi soldiers are setting up camp in elementary schools.
[14:48.180 --> 14:51.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, you know, it's just like the weapons that they're looking for.
[14:52.000 --> 14:54.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: They say these things, but they don't back it up with any evidence.
[14:54.420 --> 14:55.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: How would they know such things?
[14:55.560 --> 15:01.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: They'd have to be pretty deep into these cities they're trying to invade in order to be able to get that information in the first place.
[15:01.100 --> 15:05.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: And if they were there, they should be able to provide some information as to, you know, how to get into the city without being fired upon them.
[15:05.960 --> 15:07.520]  [SPEAKER_08]: I haven't seen pictures of that.
[15:07.600 --> 15:09.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: And also there's been claims by the U.S.
[15:09.540 --> 15:13.120]  [SPEAKER_08]: government that the Iraqi soldiers are wearing civilian clothing.
[15:13.120 --> 15:31.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: So you end up with a situation, I think, where if Iraqi civilians are being killed and shown on television as dead Iraqi civilians, the other side could claim that, well, these weren't really Iraqi civilians.
[15:31.480 --> 15:33.020]  [SPEAKER_08]: See, they're wearing plain clothes.
[15:33.160 --> 15:34.880]  [SPEAKER_08]: Therefore, they could have been Iraqi soldiers.
[15:35.040 --> 15:39.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: Or if you see pictures of people wearing U.S.
[15:39.460 --> 15:48.600]  [SPEAKER_08]: uniforms killing Iraqi civilians, the claim could be made that, well, those are Iraqi soldiers killing those Iraqi civilians.
[15:48.720 --> 15:56.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: So it completely... it gives everybody an out when you see Iraqi civilians dead.
[15:56.860 --> 16:04.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: Either way, one can claim, well, this was either Iraqis wearing American uniforms, or if... you see what I'm saying?
[16:04.580 --> 16:05.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I did a while ago.
[16:05.760 --> 16:07.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: I sort of fell off the bus on the way.
[16:07.200 --> 16:09.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, yeah, no, I get the point.
[16:09.420 --> 16:09.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: I get the point.
[16:10.740 --> 16:15.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think this whole thing about, you know, wearing uniforms, not wearing uniforms, I think it's nonsense.
[16:16.060 --> 16:18.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, it's a war, or it's, you know, called a war.
[16:18.220 --> 16:20.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's really an invasion, as one of our callers said last week.
[16:22.420 --> 16:29.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, if somebody... if a foreign army was invading our country, I'll bet a lot of people wouldn't stop the change, you know, before they started firing their weapons.
[16:30.240 --> 16:33.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, they'd probably come at them all different kinds of ways.
[16:33.720 --> 16:36.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, yeah, maybe they'd try to fool them by dressing as them as well.
[16:36.680 --> 16:41.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, I've seen these things in movies, and the audience always seems to think it's clever when it's our guys doing it.
[16:42.980 --> 16:43.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: How about this?
[16:43.740 --> 16:47.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is an interesting story, too, coming out of Iraq, and especially of interest to us.
[16:49.140 --> 16:59.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Apparently, once it's all over, there is a move to replace the cell phone technology over there, to replace the GSM technology with American CDMA technology.
[17:00.840 --> 17:03.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: As soon as the conflict is over and the country rebuilds.
[17:03.300 --> 17:17.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, according to Congressman Daryl Iza, Republican of California, he introduced a bill based on a letter to the Pentagon, and basically what they're trying to do is just not have GSM, like almost all the rest of the world does, certainly that part of the world.
[17:18.560 --> 17:29.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: If European GSM technology is deployed in Iraq, much of the equipment used to build the cell phone system would be manufactured in France, Germany, and elsewhere in Western and Northern Europe.
[17:30.320 --> 17:31.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, that's the reason.
[17:31.920 --> 17:37.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: Furthermore, royalties paid on the technology would flow to French and European sources, not U.S.
[17:37.280 --> 17:37.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: patent holders.
[17:38.960 --> 17:45.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is according to Congressman Daryl Iza, whatever his name is.
[17:45.680 --> 17:48.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, while Quocom's roots are deeply embedded in U.S.
[17:48.660 --> 17:54.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: military, the wireless giant is taking a neutral stance on the issue, because they probably realize that's smart.
[17:55.520 --> 18:01.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: But politics aside, a massive CDMA launch may cause problems for the region now, but not in the future.
[18:01.260 --> 18:05.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is according to a Silicon Valley Internet reporter.
[18:07.360 --> 18:15.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: If CDMA were the dominant technology in Iraq today, customers traveling to a nearby country that has only a GSM network wouldn't be able to use a CDMA phone there.
[18:15.360 --> 18:17.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Down the road, the lines will be less rigid.
[18:17.760 --> 18:20.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: While the two technologies can coexist, they are not compatible yet.
[18:20.980 --> 18:26.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Both are in evolution from 2G to 3G.
[18:27.020 --> 18:29.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: And supposedly this will work in the future.
[18:30.240 --> 18:34.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: But GSM and CDMA platforms have historically been broken down along geographic lines.
[18:35.140 --> 18:41.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: GSM is used all over Europe, plus many countries in the Middle East, Asia, Africa, South America, Australia, and North America.
[18:41.340 --> 18:42.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's just about everything, isn't it?
[18:42.700 --> 18:54.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: While the United States is firmly rooted in CDMA, and Asia and Latin America have gotten a blitz of CDMA technology courtesy of Qualcomm, but neither country has established a de facto standard.
[18:54.580 --> 18:57.920]  [SPEAKER_07]: This could be called a cellular beachhead of sorts.
[18:58.280 --> 18:58.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[18:58.720 --> 19:04.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: And when you consider that CDMA carriers include Sprint PCS, you have to wonder, haven't the Iraqi people been through enough?
[19:06.060 --> 19:10.260]  [SPEAKER_20]: One is forced to wonder if this congressman doesn't have something else to think about.
[19:10.940 --> 19:15.300]  [SPEAKER_20]: Well, you know, he could be renaming French fries to something else, but somebody already beat him to that.
[19:15.640 --> 19:19.420]  [SPEAKER_13]: I think we should advocate tin cans and string for Iraq.
[19:19.740 --> 19:22.100]  [SPEAKER_13]: Tin comes from Malaysia and Indonesia.
[19:22.860 --> 19:25.920]  [SPEAKER_13]: String comes from the Philippines and similar countries.
[19:26.460 --> 19:28.820]  [SPEAKER_13]: Why not give the third world a bone, so to speak?
[19:30.000 --> 19:31.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think we're giving him a lot of bones.
[19:32.720 --> 19:35.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, uh, no need to be morbid about it.
[19:36.240 --> 19:40.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, now, uh, I don't know if you guys followed the, um, um, the, uh, Peter Arnett story.
[19:41.360 --> 19:42.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: Anyone here following that?
[19:42.520 --> 19:42.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[19:42.940 --> 19:43.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: I have.
[19:43.340 --> 19:43.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Bunch of nods.
[19:44.020 --> 19:49.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, Peter Arnett, as you know, was, um, was one of the main correspondents for Gulf War No.
[19:49.040 --> 19:49.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: 1 for CNN.
[19:50.740 --> 20:05.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, uh, as of last week, he became enemy of the people when he gave an interview to Iraqi TV and, um, and said such things as, uh, as this war is not working and, uh, we're not being told the entire truth, things like that.
[20:05.580 --> 20:11.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, NBC, uh, which is who he was, uh, reporting for, initially backed him up.
[20:11.660 --> 20:16.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: But that didn't last very long once, uh, entities like Fox News and, uh, and Congress got a hold of it.
[20:16.640 --> 20:18.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: And they fired him shortly afterwards.
[20:18.700 --> 20:31.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: And within moments of his being fired, uh, he was, uh, hired by the very newspaper that we, uh, we mentioned last week, the, uh, the tabloid paper in, uh, in London called The Mirror, uh, that's very, uh, anti-war.
[20:31.300 --> 20:34.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Imagine having a tabloid newspaper somewhere and anywhere in the United States.
[20:35.060 --> 20:39.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Are there any that you see in a city that is virulently anti-war?
[20:39.820 --> 20:43.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, is there a single place in this country where you can see that?
[20:43.280 --> 20:48.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, I'm not talking about, you know, alternative or free weeklies or whatever, things put out by activist groups.
[20:48.240 --> 20:51.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm talking about newspapers that everybody reads.
[20:51.460 --> 21:02.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, England is in this war as well, yet you can walk down the street there and you can see newspapers that say this war is a bad idea in, in big letters and nobody tries to hide it.
[21:02.640 --> 21:04.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Nobody tries to, you know, rip it down.
[21:04.580 --> 21:04.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Try this.
[21:05.120 --> 21:05.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Try this.
[21:05.700 --> 21:06.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right?
[21:06.160 --> 21:10.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: We, we were talking about the, um, uh, the red war signs, war stickers that, that, uh, some of us have.
[21:11.160 --> 21:15.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: You stick them on stop signs and pretty soon some, some guy waving a flag comes along and rips it down.
[21:16.620 --> 21:17.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Watch it.
[21:17.220 --> 21:18.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: It happens almost every time.
[21:19.380 --> 21:19.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, imagine...
[21:19.940 --> 21:21.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, they put up a peace sign right under the word stop.
[21:23.300 --> 21:24.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: They put up a what sign?
[21:24.520 --> 21:26.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, you know, these, the people who would tear down the...
[21:26.900 --> 21:27.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: Oh, they put up a peace sign.
[21:27.920 --> 21:28.200]  [SPEAKER_08]: ...the war thing.
[21:28.320 --> 21:30.960]  [SPEAKER_08]: They would put up a peace sign right under the stop.
[21:31.100 --> 21:31.840]  [SPEAKER_08]: Stop peace, yeah.
[21:32.080 --> 21:32.520]  [SPEAKER_08]: Stop peace.
[21:32.700 --> 21:33.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, I don't...
[21:33.000 --> 21:35.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: Obviously, if they're, you know, that would be their viewpoint, yes?
[21:35.000 --> 21:38.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: That, that's, that's how I interpret it, but I don't think they're going to go out and say that.
[21:38.340 --> 21:40.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, they're, they're not quite that stupid.
[21:40.400 --> 21:41.760]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't think so.
[21:42.280 --> 21:43.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, they, they might be getting it.
[21:43.680 --> 21:44.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Some of them might be getting there.
[21:44.680 --> 21:46.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, uh, you know, there are, there are intelligent people on both sides, obviously.
[21:47.100 --> 22:00.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: But what I'm saying is, if you go and you deface some, some piece of, uh, of, of property with, say, a flag or something that says support our troops or something that says America United, whatever, you know, nobody's going to rip that down.
[22:05.160 --> 22:07.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, first of all, people are scared to rip it down.
[22:07.180 --> 22:17.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: But second of all, you know, the, the, the people, the people that I tend to communicate with don't believe in ripping down viewpoints, even if it's not something they're entirely in agreement with.
[22:17.300 --> 22:26.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: However, for this, for this kind of a thing, it's viewed as not only acceptable, but your obligation to rip down anything that's, you know, that's critical, anything that makes you think in a different way.
[22:27.140 --> 22:36.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you just have to ask yourself, if you're one of those people ripping down peace signs, you know, but, uh, but sticking up, uh, flags and pro-war slogans, is, what, what are you really doing?
[22:36.640 --> 22:37.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: What are you really standing for?
[22:37.980 --> 22:40.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, it's, uh, seems kind of, uh, counter free expression.
[22:41.060 --> 22:42.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: And that's what it's supposed to be all about, right?
[22:44.600 --> 22:44.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes.
[22:45.140 --> 22:45.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Right?
[22:45.360 --> 22:45.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: Thank you.
[22:45.920 --> 22:47.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm glad somebody, uh, came up with an answer there.
[22:49.360 --> 22:52.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, I also have something else, which I think is, is, is, is rather disturbing.
[22:52.720 --> 22:54.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: You guys, uh, have you guys seen this?
[22:55.480 --> 22:57.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: This, uh, this sign?
[22:58.180 --> 22:59.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: Not until you're showing it to me.
[22:59.560 --> 22:59.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right, Bernie?
[23:00.680 --> 23:01.720]  [SPEAKER_07]: I can't see it in here.
[23:02.260 --> 23:02.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's right.
[23:03.340 --> 23:08.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, you know, on 30 second commercials, they can send pictures, you know, and, and you can see exactly what's going on.
[23:08.520 --> 23:09.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Why can't we do that?
[23:10.560 --> 23:10.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: This is...
[23:10.920 --> 23:13.740]  [SPEAKER_08]: My sprint phone is three years old, so it doesn't have that capability yet.
[23:13.920 --> 23:14.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Why don't we read it?
[23:14.460 --> 23:15.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: My sprint phone is off.
[23:15.380 --> 23:19.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, basically, it's, it's, it's a picture of, uh, of two people holding a sign.
[23:20.320 --> 23:24.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, um, the sign says, we support our troops when they shoot their officers.
[23:25.260 --> 23:25.560]  [SPEAKER_06]: Ooh!
[23:25.900 --> 23:26.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[23:26.480 --> 23:26.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Ooh.
[23:26.660 --> 23:32.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, I, I, I did some, some research on this last night, uh, because, uh, it, you know, it was annoying me.
[23:32.500 --> 23:34.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: Enough people were talking to me about this that it was annoying me.
[23:34.440 --> 23:35.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: I wanted to get to the bottom of it.
[23:35.800 --> 23:40.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: And when I searched for that phrase, you search for that phrase, you find a lot of stories about that.
[23:40.440 --> 23:43.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: You get the same picture every single time.
[23:43.580 --> 23:46.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, it's not even a, uh, you know, it's no different shots.
[23:46.520 --> 23:48.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's just one shot and that's the shot that everybody has.
[23:49.220 --> 23:50.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: I thought that was kind of unusual.
[23:51.280 --> 23:56.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, and I, I was suspecting that maybe this was something that, uh, you know, only appeared for a moment.
[23:56.920 --> 23:58.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: There was a photo opportunity.
[23:58.200 --> 23:59.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: Someone took a picture, leaked it to the press.
[23:59.700 --> 24:00.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: That was the end of that.
[24:00.780 --> 24:02.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it was not, uh, part of anything.
[24:02.920 --> 24:04.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Did a little more research, though.
[24:04.940 --> 24:10.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, uh, found that, uh, this, this actually took place on March 15th in San Francisco.
[24:11.300 --> 24:16.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, uh, after digging a little more, I actually tracked somebody down who was there, who was near those people.
[24:16.880 --> 24:18.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: In fact, those people might even be considered friends of his.
[24:20.180 --> 24:30.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I had the weirdest conversation trying to explain to this person why such slogans are bad for, for the anti-war movement.
[24:30.460 --> 24:38.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: How this kind of thing is something that a number of people have come to me demanding justification or condemning the entire movement because of that.
[24:39.360 --> 24:42.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, uh, and, and, I mean, he thought it was clever.
[24:42.740 --> 24:44.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: A clever play on words.
[24:44.380 --> 24:45.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: He thought it was being sarcastic.
[24:45.580 --> 24:48.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: You don't, you don't transmit sarcasm very well on the sign, you know.
[24:49.060 --> 24:56.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: And something like this is, um, I mean, basically what you're doing is you're using the war mentality in a different way.
[24:56.900 --> 24:58.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's the same basic thing.
[24:58.380 --> 25:01.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're saying, you know, don't shoot these people, shoot these people instead.
[25:02.320 --> 25:02.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Right?
[25:03.060 --> 25:03.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, what's the difference?
[25:05.940 --> 25:06.440]  [SPEAKER_11]: No, I'm dumb.
[25:06.680 --> 25:06.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Done?
[25:07.360 --> 25:07.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[25:08.300 --> 25:12.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I'm glad everybody agrees, but, um, it just, it bothers me.
[25:12.620 --> 25:24.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: I see the same thing, uh, to a lesser degree in the attitude some people have at demonstrations where, I mean, yeah, the cops are the ones that, uh, wind up hurting people, arresting people, uh, making them suffer.
[25:24.820 --> 25:36.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: But that doesn't mean that the first time you see a cop, you have to, uh, you know, be abusive, shout abuse, uh, side abuses at him or just glare, treat him like an enemy until he proves that he deserves it.
[25:36.220 --> 25:36.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know?
[25:36.780 --> 25:40.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're not going to take the position that the cops are undeserving.
[25:40.920 --> 25:47.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: No, I'm going to take the position that the cops are human beings like everybody else and that, uh, you know, like soldiers are human beings, like Iraqis are human beings.
[25:47.560 --> 25:53.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: Once you label a particular group of people as the enemy, then you're engaged in the same war propaganda that we're trying to fight.
[25:54.300 --> 25:57.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: If they have a serious problem with beating people up, they should quit their jobs.
[25:57.340 --> 25:59.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, you know, a lot of people don't have that option.
[25:59.420 --> 26:01.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: A lot of people can't just quit their jobs and take up another career.
[26:01.960 --> 26:09.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, you know, I've, I've, I've talked to enough people that are on the other side and are, you know, enemies and things like that to know that they don't all support the actions that happen.
[26:10.080 --> 26:12.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, there There are worse cops than other cops.
[26:12.940 --> 26:13.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: There are good cops out there.
[26:13.980 --> 26:18.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, I think people should be assumed to be decent people until they prove otherwise.
[26:19.060 --> 26:26.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, yeah, when they start, you know, hurting people, abusing them, absolutely throw the book at them and, you know, pursue justice at any cost.
[26:26.840 --> 26:36.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: But if they're just standing there, you know, to treat them as if they're some kind of vile scum, that's how you make enemies, you know, and that's not what we're supposed to be doing here.
[26:37.240 --> 26:39.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: I saw a lot of the unhappy cops today.
[26:39.860 --> 26:41.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Where did you see unhappy cops?
[26:41.680 --> 26:42.600]  [SPEAKER_08]: Here in Philadelphia.
[26:42.940 --> 26:46.620]  [SPEAKER_08]: These were actually unhappy federal police, federal park police.
[26:47.920 --> 26:53.500]  [SPEAKER_08]: About 20 of them around Independence Hall, you know, where our Constitution was signed.
[26:53.680 --> 26:55.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, everybody who goes to Independence Hall is unhappy these days.
[26:56.020 --> 27:05.620]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, the reason they were unhappy is because there's been this pissing contest over the past couple of weeks between the mayor of Philadelphia and the federal park police.
[27:06.660 --> 27:13.760]  [SPEAKER_08]: Right at 9-11, right up 9-11, the federal park police closed off the street in front of Independence Hall.
[27:14.940 --> 27:16.480]  [SPEAKER_08]: And it used to be a nice sidewalk.
[27:16.520 --> 27:23.000]  [SPEAKER_08]: You could walk in front of the building on both sides, and it was a nice walkway, bus routes, bike paths, all this.
[27:23.140 --> 27:28.160]  [SPEAKER_08]: It was all blocked off, and you had to really walk several blocks out of your way to get around this blockage.
[27:28.280 --> 27:30.500]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's been there since September 11th, a year and a half ago.
[27:30.500 --> 27:41.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: So, finally, the mayor, under pressure from businesses in the area and people who just like being able to walk around the area when it was free, complained enough.
[27:41.360 --> 27:43.020]  [SPEAKER_08]: And the mayor just said, listen, this is a city street.
[27:43.200 --> 27:44.120]  [SPEAKER_08]: We're going to open it.
[27:44.200 --> 27:46.980]  [SPEAKER_08]: And they announced months ago that the city was going to do this.
[27:46.980 --> 28:01.320]  [SPEAKER_08]: And about three days ago, the federal park police, the federal park service, called Tom Ridge and got Tom Ridge to call the mayor of Philadelphia to say, oh, let's keep this thing closed for a few more months.
[28:01.740 --> 28:08.320]  [SPEAKER_08]: And the mayor said, no, I don't have any new evidence that this is a terrorist target of any kind, no new information.
[28:08.720 --> 28:12.940]  [SPEAKER_08]: And finally, it was open yesterday to great fanfare, and there was a parade and all this.
[28:13.000 --> 28:13.380]  [SPEAKER_08]: It was great.
[28:13.380 --> 28:16.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, the city actually faced off against the federal government, the city of Philadelphia.
[28:16.640 --> 28:16.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Exactly.
[28:16.800 --> 28:18.040]  [SPEAKER_08]: I was amazed to see this.
[28:18.140 --> 28:21.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I don't really like our mayor very much, but he actually stood up and did the right thing this time.
[28:22.040 --> 28:22.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: What's your mayor's name?
[28:23.760 --> 28:24.840]  [SPEAKER_08]: Mayor John Street.
[28:25.440 --> 28:26.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, yeah, I've heard of him.
[28:27.040 --> 28:27.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
[28:27.380 --> 28:30.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it should be pointed out, too, that Tom Ridge is the former governor of Pennsylvania.
[28:30.300 --> 28:30.560]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yes.
[28:30.720 --> 28:34.420]  [SPEAKER_08]: So, it was quite a pissing match, and the federal park police lost this one.
[28:34.600 --> 28:43.580]  [SPEAKER_08]: Oh, and in retaliation, the federal park police suddenly yesterday decided to close Independence Hall to all tourists for an undetermined period of time.
[28:44.120 --> 28:44.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: So, you can't even...
[28:44.780 --> 28:45.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: Before you had to...
[28:45.360 --> 28:47.640]  [SPEAKER_08]: Since September 11th, you had to get a special pass to tour it.
[28:47.880 --> 28:48.980]  [SPEAKER_08]: Now, you can't go in at all.
[28:49.180 --> 28:50.580]  [SPEAKER_08]: So, that's the sort of...
[28:51.220 --> 28:53.420]  [SPEAKER_08]: That's the sort of thing that federal park police are doing now.
[28:53.520 --> 28:59.120]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's like, okay, if you're going to open the street, we're just going to close your tourist attraction here altogether for an undetermined period of time.
[28:59.280 --> 29:02.120]  [SPEAKER_08]: So, now you can walk past the Independence Hall, admire it.
[29:02.300 --> 29:05.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: You can't go inside and see where our constitution was signed anymore.
[29:05.400 --> 29:07.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, is this something that all the public is following?
[29:08.120 --> 29:09.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Is this being covered in the papers?
[29:09.180 --> 29:09.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, yeah.
[29:09.440 --> 29:10.600]  [SPEAKER_08]: This is a big story here in Philly.
[29:10.600 --> 29:11.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: I don't know about the rest of the country.
[29:11.800 --> 29:13.240]  [SPEAKER_08]: That's why I wanted to bring it up on the show.
[29:13.440 --> 29:14.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I hadn't heard of it before.
[29:15.040 --> 29:25.800]  [SPEAKER_08]: The federal park police say now they have to bring in all the special equipment, magnetometers and x-ray machines to screen people going into the building, which makes no sense logically because they've known about this months in advance.
[29:25.800 --> 29:27.100]  [SPEAKER_08]: They didn't order any equipment.
[29:27.400 --> 29:31.060]  [SPEAKER_08]: And why would that suddenly be necessary now just because the street was open?
[29:31.800 --> 29:32.780]  [SPEAKER_08]: I don't get it.
[29:32.940 --> 29:37.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: So, frankly, I think this federal park police thing is just a self-serving power grab.
[29:37.360 --> 29:41.280]  [SPEAKER_08]: I don't think that building is not a terrorist threat.
[29:41.480 --> 29:42.620]  [SPEAKER_08]: I mean, terrorist target.
[29:42.900 --> 29:45.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, no more so than any other building in the world is.
[29:45.440 --> 29:46.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: People don't even work in the building.
[29:46.980 --> 29:47.720]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's an empty building.
[29:48.480 --> 29:53.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: But if you want to see what a police state really looks like, just walk down Wall Street.
[29:53.260 --> 29:55.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: What they've done to that street is abominable.
[29:55.740 --> 29:58.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, there's just one narrow sidewalk to walk down now.
[29:58.440 --> 29:59.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: The rest is all gated off.
[29:59.760 --> 30:04.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: And they have fierce-looking soldiers and cops that are standing there.
[30:05.500 --> 30:11.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, it looks like a military camp is what it looks like.
[30:11.180 --> 30:11.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it's Wall Street.
[30:11.980 --> 30:15.680]  [SPEAKER_20]: It seems to me that if they're going to close the street to traffic, they should let people walk down it.
[30:15.680 --> 30:18.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I mean, what exactly do they think is going to happen?
[30:18.620 --> 30:21.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, their thinking just boggles my imagination.
[30:22.120 --> 30:25.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's that street that goes directly in front of the stock exchange.
[30:25.240 --> 30:25.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: What is that?
[30:25.540 --> 30:25.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: New Street?
[30:26.040 --> 30:26.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Is that what it's called?
[30:26.960 --> 30:27.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Which side?
[30:27.780 --> 30:29.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: On the southern side.
[30:30.120 --> 30:30.360]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.
[30:30.580 --> 30:30.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[30:30.820 --> 30:31.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's New Street.
[30:31.460 --> 30:37.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: So you can't even walk down there unless you're part of NYSE, which I think is some kind of violation of something.
[30:37.240 --> 30:37.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, it's a public street.
[30:38.120 --> 30:41.820]  [SPEAKER_13]: And Broad Street is blocked off totally for that block in front of the stock exchange.
[30:42.100 --> 30:44.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I mean, this kind of thing has got to be challenged.
[30:44.520 --> 30:45.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's got to stop.
[30:45.780 --> 30:49.900]  [SPEAKER_15]: Also, what's weird is that I was in Queens over the weekend.
[30:50.200 --> 30:56.960]  [SPEAKER_15]: And at 2 p.m., when I got to the subway station in Queens, there was no National Guards or anybody there.
[30:57.440 --> 30:58.500]  [SPEAKER_15]: There usually is?
[30:58.820 --> 31:02.960]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, the thing is, when I was leaving at 6 p.m., there were National Guards.
[31:03.140 --> 31:06.200]  [SPEAKER_15]: So apparently they all come in after 3 o'clock.
[31:06.560 --> 31:08.300]  [SPEAKER_15]: That's when they all just appear out of nowhere.
[31:08.460 --> 31:14.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: I went to the Union Square station again, and I didn't see any sign of those National Guard troops that were standing there with machine guns.
[31:14.720 --> 31:15.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, I know a little.
[31:15.700 --> 31:16.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, what do you know about this?
[31:17.100 --> 31:26.540]  [SPEAKER_13]: The police and the National Guard are hitting major hubs and the occasional small station at a, quote, semi-random basis.
[31:27.080 --> 31:28.200]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're doing that on purpose.
[31:28.760 --> 31:29.740]  [SPEAKER_13]: This has been in the papers.
[31:29.740 --> 31:30.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: I didn't think it was an accident.
[31:31.060 --> 31:31.580]  [SPEAKER_13]: No, no, no, no.
[31:31.880 --> 31:36.700]  [SPEAKER_13]: They didn't want to do it on a schedule, because then the bad guys would know their schedule.
[31:36.820 --> 31:45.100]  [SPEAKER_13]: And they don't want to do it regularly, because, you know, if you know that they're at a given place 80% of the time, you wait until they're gone.
[31:45.100 --> 31:48.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, I mean, I was more questioning what the purpose was at all in the first place.
[31:48.560 --> 31:55.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, having six National Guard troops standing in front of a police station with machine guns, what exactly are they protecting, and who are they protecting it from?
[31:55.140 --> 31:58.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: And what, in God's name, do they plan on doing with machine guns in a subway station?
[31:58.960 --> 32:00.520]  [SPEAKER_13]: Those are just M-16s, actually.
[32:01.320 --> 32:03.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, well, it looks like they can fire a lot of bullets.
[32:03.240 --> 32:03.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, they can.
[32:03.680 --> 32:05.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: An M-16 can fire 800 rounds a minute.
[32:05.500 --> 32:06.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: So that, to me, is a machine gun.
[32:06.980 --> 32:10.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, it may not be the politically proper way of saying it, but that, to me, is a machine gun.
[32:10.600 --> 32:11.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, okay.
[32:11.260 --> 32:11.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[32:11.800 --> 32:12.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'll agree with that.
[32:12.340 --> 32:13.740]  [SPEAKER_17]: I'm not going to get into a weapons argument here.
[32:16.720 --> 32:19.520]  [SPEAKER_17]: Today, they were in the Port Authority on the second level.
[32:19.660 --> 32:23.040]  [SPEAKER_17]: They were walking around with the guns, so they were in full presence there.
[32:24.060 --> 32:27.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: And one thing we haven't determined is what kind of...
[32:27.040 --> 32:28.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, do they answer to the police?
[32:29.120 --> 32:30.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: Do the police answer to them?
[32:31.240 --> 32:38.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Can they threaten you with a gun for doing something that is a violation but not a terroristic crime?
[32:39.180 --> 32:42.240]  [SPEAKER_13]: I haven't had that much conversation, but I did have a one-liner.
[32:42.340 --> 32:42.580]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're with them.
[32:42.720 --> 32:43.900]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're a regular army, incidentally.
[32:44.320 --> 32:44.740]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're army?
[32:44.860 --> 32:45.560]  [SPEAKER_13]: They're not National Guard?
[32:45.700 --> 32:45.880]  [SPEAKER_13]: Right.
[32:46.040 --> 32:46.200]  [SPEAKER_13]: Wow.
[32:46.720 --> 32:47.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: When did that change?
[32:48.340 --> 32:50.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: According to everybody I've talked to, that's National Guard.
[32:50.800 --> 32:52.640]  [SPEAKER_13]: Yeah, that's what everybody had been assuming.
[32:52.920 --> 32:56.000]  [SPEAKER_13]: I looked at the insignia and I said, you guys are a regular army.
[32:57.400 --> 32:59.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: So the army has been moved into the streets of New York?
[33:00.040 --> 33:00.920]  [SPEAKER_13]: No, into the subway.
[33:01.380 --> 33:03.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, but, you know, they have to get to the subway.
[33:03.820 --> 33:08.180]  [SPEAKER_13]: They may have been lying to me, but they're wearing army insignia, not National Guard insignia.
[33:08.180 --> 33:10.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: Maybe they're Iraqis wearing our uniforms or something.
[33:10.480 --> 33:12.600]  [SPEAKER_15]: No, what happens is that there's two National Guards.
[33:13.020 --> 33:14.160]  [SPEAKER_15]: There's the U.S.
[33:14.280 --> 33:15.940]  [SPEAKER_15]: Air Force National Guard and there's the U.S.
[33:16.020 --> 33:16.860]  [SPEAKER_15]: Army National Guard.
[33:17.260 --> 33:19.540]  [SPEAKER_15]: So the National Guard wears U.S.
[33:19.620 --> 33:20.300]  [SPEAKER_15]: Army uniforms.
[33:20.580 --> 33:26.920]  [SPEAKER_15]: I've understand it by accident because my friend wanted to join the military and he was investigating all the different agencies.
[33:27.400 --> 33:29.600]  [SPEAKER_15]: And that was one weird thing that pops up.
[33:30.880 --> 33:44.080]  [SPEAKER_20]: I'm wondering if any of our listeners have seen these folks, whatever branch of the military they're from, actually stop terrorism or any crime or do something besides frighten people.
[33:44.100 --> 33:49.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: I haven't seen them interact with anybody except themselves, but I have not seen them talk to anybody or anybody try to talk.
[33:49.780 --> 33:50.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, everyone's scared to death of them.
[33:50.980 --> 33:55.520]  [SPEAKER_13]: I've seen occasional people go up and try to talk to them and they grunt like they did with me.
[33:55.520 --> 34:05.200]  [SPEAKER_20]: But I want to know if anyone has seen them approach someone, if they have initiated an interaction, if they've stopped someone from doing something, if you've seen them poke in a garbage can.
[34:05.340 --> 34:06.900]  [SPEAKER_20]: If you're one of them yourselves.
[34:07.260 --> 34:08.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, give us a call.
[34:08.080 --> 34:09.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Probably not on duty now.
[34:09.340 --> 34:10.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Put down the gun and call us.
[34:10.980 --> 34:16.140]  [SPEAKER_08]: We did receive an email sometime after September 11th, later that year.
[34:16.500 --> 34:22.540]  [SPEAKER_08]: And it was from a National Guard person, I think, who she said the training is very, very slim.
[34:22.540 --> 34:29.120]  [SPEAKER_08]: And she said that in the airports, the National Guard people that had M-16s didn't have any ammunition.
[34:29.680 --> 34:30.040]  [SPEAKER_13]: Right.
[34:30.120 --> 34:32.140]  [SPEAKER_13]: I remember you mentioning that quite some time ago.
[34:32.860 --> 34:33.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[34:33.160 --> 34:34.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that could always change and they wouldn't tell us.
[34:35.140 --> 34:35.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, you never know.
[34:35.880 --> 34:46.720]  [SPEAKER_08]: I'm just saying that that was, you know, a year and a half ago, somebody who was with the National Guard said to us, or said they were with the National Guard, said to us, that they don't have live ammunition with them.
[34:47.340 --> 34:49.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Our phone number is 212-209-2900.
[34:49.700 --> 34:51.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're going to be taking phone calls in just a couple of minutes.
[34:51.840 --> 34:53.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: I wanted to just get over these quick stories.
[34:54.460 --> 35:01.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Two high school teachers said Tuesday they have been placed on leave for refusing to remove war-related student artwork posted in their classrooms.
[35:02.100 --> 35:11.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: Highland high school teachers Alan Cooper and Jeffrey Barrett said they were told, Monday, this is in New Mexico, they were told Monday night they would be suspended if they did not remove the posters.
[35:13.300 --> 35:21.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Barrett, who teaches history and current events, said the student art carried both anti-war and pro-war messages and was created as part of a class assignment.
[35:21.780 --> 35:26.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think this is mostly a violation of the students' rights to have a voice and express their opinions, he said.
[35:26.560 --> 35:31.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Asking me to take down the posters was taking away the voice of the students, and I was not going to do that.
[35:31.800 --> 35:36.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Cooper said one of the signs in question in his classroom read, no war, Mr. Cooper.
[35:36.800 --> 35:39.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Cooper, that's a pretty threatening sign there.
[35:40.740 --> 35:45.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was written by an Afghani student who has had family members killed in U.S.-led bombings in Afghanistan.
[35:46.260 --> 35:50.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: I really agonized over this, said, Cooper, I don't want to be suspended, I just want to teach my classes.
[35:50.720 --> 35:53.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, Jeff, you're a high school teacher.
[35:53.220 --> 35:54.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: See this kind of thing over there?
[35:54.360 --> 35:56.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: You've been advised not to have any war?
[35:56.340 --> 35:59.640]  [SPEAKER_17]: No, it's very interesting because I had a conversation just today with the principal.
[36:00.060 --> 36:03.780]  [SPEAKER_17]: And basically, I do a stamp project with the kids.
[36:03.780 --> 36:09.520]  [SPEAKER_17]: We did an additional project, whether you were pro or anti-war, you could basically put that theme into your stamp.
[36:09.880 --> 36:15.360]  [SPEAKER_17]: And the school does have a zero tolerance when it comes to guns and things.
[36:15.540 --> 36:23.040]  [SPEAKER_17]: But in this kind of instance where, you know, a soldier might, they might have a picture of a soldier with a gun, that's acceptable and it's perfectly fine.
[36:23.040 --> 36:26.360]  [SPEAKER_17]: So I was glad that there wasn't going to be any issues about this.
[36:26.360 --> 36:40.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, it's like whenever I participate in just any kind of an action, you know, whether it's a rally, a march, whatnot, any kind of action, you feel the sense of relief afterwards, like you've done something, you know, you've expressed yourself in some way.
[36:41.020 --> 36:49.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I imagine people that draw up these signs and display them, they must be, you know, feeling that same relief because they've expressed out loud what it is they're feeling.
[36:50.360 --> 36:54.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: And if you keep that bottled up, if you suppress that, I think it's very unhealthy.
[36:54.220 --> 36:57.560]  [SPEAKER_17]: It has led to some very interesting conversations in the classroom as well.
[36:57.880 --> 37:11.200]  [SPEAKER_17]: When, you know, you talk to kids that feel that, yes, war is a good thing, you know, and you just say, well, it's a good thing that we have the guns and the power and the might to invade them instead of the other way around where they could enforce their way of life on us.
[37:11.340 --> 37:17.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: It could be seen as a good thing or it could be seen as like, you know, this gives us the perspective to think about what it must be like for them.
[37:17.400 --> 37:17.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Exactly.
[37:17.800 --> 37:19.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's what I was trying to explain to them.
[37:19.620 --> 37:21.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: By the way, I also wanted to point something out before I forgot.
[37:22.380 --> 37:27.860]  [SPEAKER_18]: I found out last week that a particular reporter from Newsday was over in Iraq.
[37:28.080 --> 37:30.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: And in fact, he was somebody that's been to this radio show.
[37:30.460 --> 37:32.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: He's covered hackers in the past.
[37:32.120 --> 37:33.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: His name is Matt McAllister.
[37:33.560 --> 37:38.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, you know, looking over my email from him and to him, I realized how thorough this guy is.
[37:38.320 --> 37:39.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: He always wanted to get the story straight.
[37:39.860 --> 37:45.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: He always wanted to, you know, when the headline was wrong, he's, you know, trying to fix that even though reporters don't write the headlines.
[37:46.780 --> 37:51.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: And he was one of the reporters that was missing in Iraq last week.
[37:51.800 --> 37:54.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: They had last heard from him in, I believe, Baghdad.
[37:54.800 --> 37:56.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: He was being expelled from the country.
[37:56.080 --> 37:58.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: And then they had lost contact with him and a couple of others.
[37:59.180 --> 38:03.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I'm happy to say they have found him in Jordan or he has found a phone and called back.
[38:04.340 --> 38:06.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, uh, that's, uh, that's some bit of good news.
[38:07.200 --> 38:08.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, was he just on TV?
[38:08.460 --> 38:09.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, that was, that was pretty funny.
[38:10.260 --> 38:13.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: You have CNN on in the background, so his face just popped up.
[38:13.160 --> 38:15.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: So he'll probably be on, on TV talking about these things as well.
[38:16.260 --> 38:19.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, so yeah, it's, you know, it has a personal effect, I think, on a lot of people.
[38:19.900 --> 38:22.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, there's probably somebody you know over there in some regards.
[38:22.640 --> 38:26.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: I mean, there's, you know, 250,000 people there are now, 150,000 more in the way.
[38:26.320 --> 38:27.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: God knows what lies ahead.
[38:27.960 --> 38:37.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, uh, you may think that, you know, once this ends, once, uh, you know, they finally, you know, nail down the last of the people that are, you know, fighting back or whatever, that it's going to end there.
[38:38.240 --> 38:40.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, uh, of course it doesn't end there.
[38:40.340 --> 38:50.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: Even if Iraq becomes completely submissive to the United States' will and becomes, you know, equivalent to a colony or whatever, whatever happens, there's still the whole rest of the world.
[38:50.640 --> 38:53.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, uh, I, I shudder to think what lies ahead.
[38:53.480 --> 38:54.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: I really do.
[38:54.240 --> 38:56.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's going to be, uh, crazy madness.
[38:56.640 --> 38:59.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, Mike, there was a die-in last week, right?
[38:59.360 --> 39:00.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: What was that all about?
[39:00.380 --> 39:01.280]  [SPEAKER_20]: It was Thursday.
[39:01.620 --> 39:01.840]  [SPEAKER_20]: Uh-huh.
[39:02.060 --> 39:08.180]  [SPEAKER_20]: Um, a bunch of folks, my understanding is they, they got down in the middle of, uh, Fifth Avenue, I think?
[39:08.260 --> 39:08.900]  [SPEAKER_20]: You have a news story.
[39:09.100 --> 39:12.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, it was, uh, by, uh, mid-time Manhattan, I think it was Rockefeller Center.
[39:12.780 --> 39:14.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't know if it was on 50th Street and Fifth Avenue.
[39:14.640 --> 39:14.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Right.
[39:14.720 --> 39:14.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's where.
[39:15.020 --> 39:22.240]  [SPEAKER_20]: So they, they went and they, they lied down in the middle of the street, um, in an attempt to kind of stop traffic as, as a protest against the war.
[39:22.460 --> 39:22.660]  [SPEAKER_06]: Mm-hmm.
[39:23.480 --> 39:25.580]  [SPEAKER_20]: And, uh, did they stop traffic?
[39:25.580 --> 39:34.080]  [SPEAKER_20]: Like, they did stop traffic, uh, eventually the police were, opened up one lane, and then eventually they had arrested everyone, uh, so they opened up the rest.
[39:34.240 --> 39:34.420]  [SPEAKER_20]: Uh-huh.
[39:34.600 --> 39:41.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: I, I saw coverage of that on television, and, uh, it seemed like there were more photographers standing in the street taking pictures of the people lying down than there were actually people lying down.
[39:41.800 --> 39:46.260]  [SPEAKER_20]: Some of my friends who were there, I was unable to attend, but some of my friends, uh, report that that was the case.
[39:46.400 --> 39:46.540]  [SPEAKER_20]: Yeah.
[39:46.700 --> 39:48.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, and, you know, the effect is the same.
[39:48.480 --> 39:49.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: Traffic is shut down.
[39:49.920 --> 39:53.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, what's, what's the thinking behind this for people that might not understand?
[39:53.580 --> 39:54.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: What, why stop traffic?
[39:54.820 --> 39:55.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Doesn't that just piss people off?
[39:56.260 --> 40:09.420]  [SPEAKER_20]: Well, I think it does people, piss people off, but, um, you know, uh, it was, it was in the headlines in the times, uh, you know, several hundred thousand people marched, uh, you know, more people march than are actually in Iraq, and that doesn't make the times,
[40:09.660 --> 40:11.160]  [SPEAKER_20]: but, you know, 50 people blocked traffic.
[40:11.280 --> 40:12.260]  [SPEAKER_20]: But it didn't make the times?
[40:12.520 --> 40:15.220]  [SPEAKER_20]: It made the times, but it, you know, it was, it was buried.
[40:15.500 --> 40:15.720]  [SPEAKER_20]: Uh-huh.
[40:16.080 --> 40:20.900]  [SPEAKER_20]: Um, you know, 50 people stopped traffic, and that attracts attention to the issue.
[40:21.060 --> 40:29.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: People have to do what it takes to, uh, you know, to attract attention, and, uh, you know, I can understand that, uh, but, uh, I can also understand people not getting it, too.
[40:29.580 --> 40:34.720]  [SPEAKER_20]: Of course, if you ask three different people who participate with the exact reasons, you'll probably get three slightly different answers.
[40:34.980 --> 40:35.140]  [SPEAKER_20]: Yeah.
[40:35.720 --> 40:39.340]  [SPEAKER_18]: The thing I think we have to realize is that it takes a lot of guts just to do something like that.
[40:39.420 --> 40:44.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: To lie down in the middle of traffic and, you know, with cops yelling at you and people honking and things like that.
[40:45.440 --> 40:51.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: Just regardless of whether or not you agree with what they're doing, I just think that in itself is something that you've got to think about.
[40:51.800 --> 40:53.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: That it takes a bit of guts.
[40:53.800 --> 40:56.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: And we're talking about people, you know, putting themselves in harm's way.
[40:56.820 --> 41:01.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're seeing it on all kinds of angles.
[41:01.560 --> 41:04.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're seeing people being mowed down by bulldozers who are standing in front of them.
[41:05.180 --> 41:12.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: And are they not just as much of a hero, if you want to use that word, as somebody who stands in front of a tank?
[41:13.520 --> 41:15.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, just perspective, I guess.
[41:16.840 --> 41:18.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Here's a letter from a listener.
[41:18.620 --> 41:25.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: I vaguely recall someone on the show lamenting about no longer being able to listen to the BBC World Service free online.
[41:26.320 --> 41:28.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: And he gives information on how to do that.
[41:28.400 --> 41:31.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: Actually, I think it was BBC World we were lamenting.
[41:32.000 --> 41:38.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: But you can listen on bbc.co.uk slash worldservice slash index.shtml.
[41:39.680 --> 41:43.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you can... I think you can listen on any player over there.
[41:43.460 --> 41:45.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Do you have to have a particular real audio player?
[41:45.560 --> 41:45.960]  [SPEAKER_15]: Real player.
[41:46.160 --> 41:46.480]  [SPEAKER_15]: Real player?
[41:46.600 --> 41:48.180]  [SPEAKER_15]: I'm not sure which version, but real player.
[41:48.420 --> 41:48.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay.
[41:49.640 --> 41:50.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Things are out there.
[41:50.520 --> 41:51.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: Shortwave radio.
[41:51.520 --> 41:52.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, shortwave radio, of course.
[41:52.760 --> 41:52.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes.
[41:53.800 --> 42:01.220]  [SPEAKER_20]: I mean, the BBC has, as you know, stopped offering shortwave service to North America, but you can still pick up some of the other services.
[42:01.400 --> 42:01.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: Right.
[42:01.700 --> 42:02.380]  [SPEAKER_07]: Quite easily.
[42:02.820 --> 42:05.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: As for BBC World, that's a tougher thing.
[42:05.120 --> 42:12.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: You can still find that in various places on the net, and you can find it on TV everywhere except in the United States, which occasionally has it on PBS stations.
[42:12.940 --> 42:15.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: I suggest some kind of letter-rating campaign.
[42:15.220 --> 42:16.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm just not sure to who yet.
[42:16.720 --> 42:19.080]  [SPEAKER_15]: Well, the TV channel?
[42:19.180 --> 42:19.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[42:20.240 --> 42:33.740]  [SPEAKER_15]: Also, I want to say one interesting thing is, one of the articles they gave you, on the bottom it says, it's from Yahoo News, apparently reporters in Iraq had some certain model of cell phones taken away from them after...
[42:33.740 --> 42:37.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, satellite phones were taken away because it seemed almost like a threat.
[42:37.680 --> 42:41.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: They were saying that, well, our weapons might target you if you use this phone.
[42:42.040 --> 42:43.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: It was only a specific model, though.
[42:43.800 --> 42:44.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh-huh.
[42:44.500 --> 42:45.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: I wonder how they discovered this.
[42:46.640 --> 42:49.700]  [SPEAKER_20]: Well, for the conspiracy theorist, this is the model...
[42:49.700 --> 42:51.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: What really happened to Rado Rivera, that's what I want to know.
[42:51.320 --> 42:58.840]  [SPEAKER_20]: This is the model of cell phone that... a satellite that works with, you know, a Middle Eastern company rather than the American company.
[42:58.940 --> 42:59.120]  [SPEAKER_20]: Ah.
[42:59.320 --> 42:59.880]  [SPEAKER_20]: I don't know.
[43:00.000 --> 43:00.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, there's your reason.
[43:00.820 --> 43:03.440]  [SPEAKER_20]: I don't want to, you know, suggest that that had anything to do with it.
[43:03.500 --> 43:06.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: And just to calm people down, because we've been getting a lot of mail about this.
[43:06.500 --> 43:07.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: In fact, here's a letter from a reporter.
[43:10.320 --> 43:13.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: As of today, I noticed your web page is back.
[43:13.340 --> 43:13.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Congratulations.
[43:14.800 --> 43:16.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: I was wondering if you have information on this.
[43:16.700 --> 43:17.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: How long was it hacked?
[43:17.600 --> 43:19.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: Do you have information about the guys who did it?
[43:19.820 --> 43:23.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: Did you install any precaution to avoid future attacks like this?
[43:23.180 --> 43:24.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes, we know about the guys who did it.
[43:24.940 --> 43:25.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, we sure do.
[43:25.940 --> 43:30.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: And it's amazing how people just will run with the story even without any backing up whatsoever.
[43:30.720 --> 43:33.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's quite ironic the day that this happened, isn't it?
[43:33.200 --> 43:33.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: It is.
[43:33.540 --> 43:35.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Check your calendar, okay, before you write the news story, hopefully.
[43:36.700 --> 43:47.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I just also want to say, we had a radio show last night on the other station off the wall, and you might have heard some things there that were startling, and you should not be overly concerned.
[43:47.600 --> 43:54.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: However, I'm concerned because it seems to have resulted in people not phoning into that place and pledging during the fundraiser.
[43:55.260 --> 43:59.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't think I got a single call last night for anybody pledging any money.
[43:59.620 --> 44:08.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, you know, I have to pay for that little stunt then by making much better progress next week, which is the last week.
[44:08.180 --> 44:13.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: So please, if you're a fan of Off the Wall, or even a fan of Off the Hook, listen to Off the Wall Tuesday nights at 6.
[44:13.800 --> 44:18.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you can see that on the website or listen to it on WUSB, which is out on Long Island.
[44:19.400 --> 44:22.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, 212-209-2900 is our phone number.
[44:23.160 --> 44:24.560]  [SPEAKER_18]: And shall we go to the phones?
[44:25.700 --> 44:26.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yes, we shall.
[44:26.520 --> 44:27.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, I'm going to go all the way over here.
[44:28.680 --> 44:29.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: And here we are.
[44:29.420 --> 44:29.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good evening.
[44:29.720 --> 44:30.120]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're on the air.
[44:30.760 --> 44:31.460]  [SPEAKER_18]: Hey, how you doing?
[44:31.600 --> 44:31.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good.
[44:31.780 --> 44:31.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: How are you?
[44:32.600 --> 44:33.000]  [SPEAKER_10]: Very good.
[44:33.100 --> 44:33.380]  [SPEAKER_10]: Thank you.
[44:33.840 --> 44:34.320]  [SPEAKER_10]: Love your show.
[44:34.540 --> 44:34.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: Thank you.
[44:36.380 --> 44:51.480]  [SPEAKER_10]: Ironically enough, your last caller that called in about the Liberty Wall down in Philadelphia was a subject of a radio show, which is the, I guess, the affiliate of WNYC in New York.
[44:51.720 --> 44:52.500]  [SPEAKER_10]: It's WHYY.
[44:52.860 --> 44:53.100]  [SPEAKER_06]: Right.
[44:53.100 --> 44:56.460]  [SPEAKER_10]: And I listened to that on my way into work in the morning.
[44:56.460 --> 44:57.780]  [SPEAKER_10]: I live in central New Jersey.
[44:58.680 --> 45:03.400]  [SPEAKER_10]: And they were talking about the same subject that this fellow was just on discussing.
[45:03.720 --> 45:04.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: He's still on, by the way.
[45:05.280 --> 45:05.540]  [SPEAKER_10]: Okay.
[45:06.000 --> 45:14.660]  [SPEAKER_10]: Now, they spoke about the entire transition that it was going through, how the Mayor Streep was objecting to this.
[45:14.660 --> 45:22.520]  [SPEAKER_10]: Then they brought the lady on who was in charge of security of the Liberty, whatever they call it, the Liberty Wall there.
[45:23.780 --> 45:29.540]  [SPEAKER_10]: And for the love of me, this lady had the thickest British accent I ever heard of in my life.
[45:30.220 --> 45:36.000]  [SPEAKER_10]: And from that point forward, I just couldn't listen to the rest of the broadcast.
[45:36.820 --> 45:41.460]  [SPEAKER_10]: I thought the Liberty Bell was all about our freedom from those people.
[45:41.540 --> 45:44.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, you know, I think time has maybe healed that particular wound.
[45:45.020 --> 45:47.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, you know, I could sort of see you being a little surprised.
[45:47.520 --> 45:49.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: But, you know, accents are everywhere.
[45:50.140 --> 45:51.720]  [SPEAKER_18]: Why are there even accents in this room?
[45:52.260 --> 45:53.180]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah, I'm sure there are.
[45:53.320 --> 46:05.920]  [SPEAKER_10]: But I just thought that was the irony of the report was kind of diminished by the fact that we have this British subject protecting our freedom, our examples of freedom.
[46:06.100 --> 46:10.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's basically the museum hires people with accents and they don't think twice about it is what it is.
[46:11.300 --> 46:14.240]  [SPEAKER_13]: I think we should really start a campaign here.
[46:14.360 --> 46:16.400]  [SPEAKER_13]: I mean, this actually is enough.
[46:16.400 --> 46:19.700]  [SPEAKER_13]: We should contact some tabloid and get them on this.
[46:19.900 --> 46:20.940]  [SPEAKER_13]: So, it could be useful.
[46:21.160 --> 46:23.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: You know, usually I think you were kidding.
[46:23.540 --> 46:26.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: But in a day like this, yeah, probably that would work.
[46:26.580 --> 46:27.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: It would work.
[46:27.340 --> 46:28.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's the scary thing.
[46:28.220 --> 46:28.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: Bernie, yes.
[46:30.020 --> 46:31.200]  [SPEAKER_10]: I love you guys' show.
[46:31.200 --> 46:32.360]  [SPEAKER_10]: I got to cut out.
[46:32.520 --> 46:34.500]  [SPEAKER_10]: But I'm going to go back to the radio and listen.
[46:34.740 --> 46:35.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, thanks for calling.
[46:35.620 --> 46:36.020]  [SPEAKER_10]: Thank you very much.
[46:37.620 --> 46:38.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, he's gone.
[46:39.880 --> 46:40.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: Bernie, you had something to say?
[46:40.900 --> 46:48.640]  [SPEAKER_08]: I was going to ask him what he thought about the stand down between the mayor of Philadelphia and the Federal Park Police.
[46:48.820 --> 46:49.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't think he got that far.
[46:50.380 --> 46:50.680]  [SPEAKER_08]: No.
[46:50.920 --> 46:52.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: The accent threw him for a loop.
[46:52.700 --> 46:53.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, there's a lot of people.
[46:53.540 --> 46:56.600]  [SPEAKER_08]: There's people walking down there with baby carriages and bikes.
[46:56.640 --> 46:58.020]  [SPEAKER_08]: And there is a little parade.
[46:58.160 --> 46:58.800]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I just love it.
[46:58.880 --> 46:59.440]  [SPEAKER_08]: It's, you know, people.
[47:00.380 --> 47:02.280]  [SPEAKER_13]: I have some good news for you, Bernie.
[47:02.480 --> 47:05.900]  [SPEAKER_13]: We've named a street after the mayor of Philadelphia because of this.
[47:07.260 --> 47:17.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, actually, it's funny because, Bernie, I guess street is maybe a name from down there because, literally, there is a street called Street Road in Philadelphia.
[47:18.180 --> 47:18.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm not kidding.
[47:18.680 --> 47:19.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Street Road.
[47:19.260 --> 47:21.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: Everybody laughs when we pass it on 995.
[47:21.460 --> 47:21.640]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yep.
[47:22.000 --> 47:24.900]  [SPEAKER_18]: Now, so is the street family something big from that area?
[47:26.280 --> 47:27.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, I don't think it's the same street family.
[47:28.040 --> 47:29.020]  [SPEAKER_08]: Street Road goes way back.
[47:29.200 --> 47:32.920]  [SPEAKER_08]: This is up, I think it's Route 132 or something, up in Ben Salem, Street Road.
[47:33.880 --> 47:35.360]  [SPEAKER_08]: But, yeah, I don't know why that is.
[47:35.360 --> 47:37.080]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, well, that's just a little bit of lore there.
[47:37.580 --> 47:39.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right, 212-209-2900.
[47:39.600 --> 47:40.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: And good evening.
[47:40.320 --> 47:40.740]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're on the air.
[47:41.280 --> 47:41.980]  [SPEAKER_03]: Hi, how are you doing?
[47:42.100 --> 47:42.420]  [SPEAKER_03]: Good, how are you?
[47:42.680 --> 47:43.700]  [SPEAKER_03]: Two things I noticed.
[47:43.920 --> 47:47.380]  [SPEAKER_03]: There is a steady crew of National Guard on 23rd and 6th.
[47:47.980 --> 47:48.620]  [SPEAKER_03]: Pretty steady.
[47:48.700 --> 47:49.460]  [SPEAKER_03]: Not there every night.
[47:49.580 --> 47:55.220]  [SPEAKER_03]: And I asked him one night, walking by my friend, and I said, are those guns loaded?
[47:55.400 --> 47:58.300]  [SPEAKER_03]: He said, oh, I can't tell you that, but they are real.
[48:00.020 --> 48:02.320]  [SPEAKER_03]: So, they probably got the clips in their pocket or something.
[48:02.320 --> 48:06.600]  [SPEAKER_03]: But another thing I noticed, I come from the Bronx, and I take the express bus down.
[48:06.740 --> 48:16.600]  [SPEAKER_03]: So, the off-ramp that goes on to the Tribal Bridge, there's always a state police or a cop there with cones, you know, ready to pull somebody over, a truck or something.
[48:16.880 --> 48:27.480]  [SPEAKER_03]: But I noticed today for the first time, I looked over to the right out the window, and in that neighborhood, there's an on-ramp from the neighborhood itself, and there's nobody stopping trucks coming on.
[48:27.480 --> 48:32.940]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, it's typical of the way these things are put into place.
[48:33.100 --> 48:33.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's just for show.
[48:34.080 --> 48:41.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Like, for instance, on the BQE going southbound to the Williamsburg Bridge, all of a sudden, you'll find two cop cars parked next to each other.
[48:41.200 --> 48:44.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: They're having a nice little chat or something like that, and they're just blocking an entire lane.
[48:44.600 --> 48:45.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: No particular reason.
[48:45.520 --> 48:46.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: They just are doing that.
[48:58.120 --> 48:58.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: So, it's just...
[48:58.980 --> 48:59.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's just eyewash.
[48:59.740 --> 49:01.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: And they're not even looking at the cars going by.
[49:01.500 --> 49:02.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: They're not even looking at them.
[49:02.300 --> 49:03.320]  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, it's eyewash.
[49:03.400 --> 49:04.860]  [SPEAKER_03]: Like you said, it's just show for now.
[49:05.720 --> 49:06.940]  [SPEAKER_03]: All right, continue on.
[49:07.040 --> 49:07.220]  [SPEAKER_15]: Okay.
[49:07.220 --> 49:07.400]  [SPEAKER_15]: Thank you.
[49:07.580 --> 49:07.760]  [SPEAKER_15]: Thanks.
[49:08.540 --> 49:08.820]  [SPEAKER_15]: Yes?
[49:09.520 --> 49:22.140]  [SPEAKER_15]: I actually did some research about not carrying ammo, and it's standard practice letting new recruits not carry ammo in their rifles, or like one or two rounds in their pocket, but nothing else.
[49:22.260 --> 49:26.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, it's not standard to have them roaming around city streets, terrifying people.
[49:26.580 --> 49:29.020]  [SPEAKER_16]: Gee, one or two rounds, you can only kill one or two people.
[49:29.280 --> 49:29.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[49:29.820 --> 49:30.900]  [SPEAKER_16]: But you've got to load them first.
[49:31.620 --> 49:32.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good evening.
[49:32.400 --> 49:32.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're on the air.
[49:33.100 --> 49:33.740]  [SPEAKER_11]: Yes, good evening.
[49:34.180 --> 49:50.220]  [SPEAKER_11]: Yesterday, I was exiting at the Union Square Station along the Lexington Avenue line from the subway, and I saw three camouflaged soldiers or National State, whatever they were, standing oh, about 10 feet apart from each other.
[49:50.500 --> 49:57.240]  [SPEAKER_11]: One of them was roaming around the candy store newsstand concession, you know, walking in and out.
[49:57.800 --> 50:05.260]  [SPEAKER_11]: The thing that really terrified me, their hands were resting near their trigger.
[50:05.620 --> 50:06.060]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh-huh.
[50:07.100 --> 50:08.480]  [SPEAKER_11]: The corpuscles, huh?
[50:08.700 --> 50:10.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, I've noticed the same thing.
[50:11.000 --> 50:19.940]  [SPEAKER_11]: It's just incredibly frightening, and I could, you know, my next immediate leap imaginatively was, you know, which I couldn't possibly conceive.
[50:19.940 --> 50:25.020]  [SPEAKER_11]: What is it like, you know, having those things go off, killing people around you?
[50:25.100 --> 50:33.240]  [SPEAKER_11]: It's, you know, just, and it was the height of the rush hour, and who knows if somebody comes rushing through or something quick, whatever kind of, you know, scenario could happen.
[50:33.420 --> 50:34.560]  [SPEAKER_11]: It was too, too scary.
[50:34.780 --> 50:39.220]  [SPEAKER_11]: And when I got up into the street, I asked, um, they weren't, they looked like cops.
[50:39.360 --> 50:42.880]  [SPEAKER_11]: They were, uh, store department detectives, you know, or whatever.
[50:42.880 --> 50:48.660]  [SPEAKER_11]: You know, who do I complain to about, you know, I want to notify somebody that this is terrifying me.
[50:49.400 --> 50:51.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, that's how I felt, too, and I saw them.
[50:51.240 --> 50:52.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: Who do you complain to?
[50:52.280 --> 51:03.980]  [SPEAKER_11]: And they said, they said there is a district of the, um, um, state, um, I think, uh, either New York City police, they're called down in this Union Square station, you know, over on the northern end.
[51:04.160 --> 51:08.540]  [SPEAKER_11]: He pointed, you know, in the direction, which I will go to the next time I'm in that area.
[51:08.660 --> 51:09.920]  [SPEAKER_11]: I want to find out what's going on.
[51:09.960 --> 51:12.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, that's the same precinct I saw them standing in front of.
[51:12.100 --> 51:14.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's a transit authority, uh, uh, precinct or something.
[51:15.220 --> 51:15.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Transit police district.
[51:16.120 --> 51:16.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[51:16.240 --> 51:16.820]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's what it used to be.
[51:16.820 --> 51:21.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: I doubt they'll be very, uh, helpful, but, uh, you can certainly ask and find out who's, uh, in charge.
[51:21.860 --> 51:22.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: Great, great.
[51:22.820 --> 51:23.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, thank you very much.
[51:23.980 --> 51:25.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right, thanks, uh, thanks for that.
[51:25.620 --> 51:32.460]  [SPEAKER_20]: I offer as an exercise to all our experienced, uh, telephone tree navigators, try and file a complaint with the police department.
[51:32.680 --> 51:33.440]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, it's a lot of fun.
[51:33.520 --> 51:34.660]  [SPEAKER_18]: It'll be a full day of activity.
[51:35.020 --> 51:37.780]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, if you really are into it, they'll go down to the precinct and try to file.
[51:38.480 --> 51:40.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Boy, you'll get all kinds of, uh, sarcastic remarks thrown your way.
[51:41.000 --> 51:41.760]  [SPEAKER_20]: Harder to hang up.
[51:41.760 --> 51:48.460]  [SPEAKER_20]: Uh, a friend tried to file a complaint, uh, about police brutality at the last large mark and, uh, was hung up on.
[51:49.040 --> 51:49.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: Really?
[51:49.640 --> 51:49.780]  [SPEAKER_20]: So.
[51:50.060 --> 51:55.800]  [SPEAKER_18]: If, uh, by the way, you've had any kind of, uh, experience with police brutality, uh, the National Lawyers Guild wants to hear from you.
[51:56.180 --> 51:57.980]  [SPEAKER_18]: I don't have their number in front of me, but they're listed.
[51:58.160 --> 51:58.700]  [SPEAKER_18]: They're everywhere.
[51:58.920 --> 51:59.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: You have their number?
[51:59.500 --> 52:00.100]  [SPEAKER_18]: I have their number.
[52:00.200 --> 52:00.580]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, good.
[52:00.720 --> 52:02.000]  [SPEAKER_18]: But you have to wait for me to look at them.
[52:02.000 --> 52:02.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: Okay, it's on your phone.
[52:03.240 --> 52:05.180]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, and yeah, in fact, I think I have it on my phone too.
[52:05.380 --> 52:10.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, basically, if you saw anything or had any kind of experience yourself, uh, they, they want you to call them and tell them.
[52:10.880 --> 52:15.220]  [SPEAKER_18]: Um, this is at the March 15th, uh, uh, March, March 22nd, March.
[52:15.480 --> 52:15.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: March 22nd.
[52:15.840 --> 52:16.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: And any other activity?
[52:17.280 --> 52:21.920]  [SPEAKER_20]: Uh, their number is 212-679-6018.
[52:22.300 --> 52:23.740]  [SPEAKER_20]: Okay, how's that for information?
[52:24.300 --> 52:32.280]  [SPEAKER_17]: Yeah, I just, I get a kick out of the fact that they're wearing the jungle camouflage uniforms down on the subway and out on the streets in New York City.
[52:32.660 --> 52:34.380]  [SPEAKER_17]: Uh, they almost blend in.
[52:34.440 --> 52:37.400]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, it makes them, it makes them really, you can't see them coming.
[52:37.520 --> 52:38.460]  [SPEAKER_13]: Up against the white tile?
[52:38.580 --> 52:38.640]  [SPEAKER_13]: No.
[52:38.700 --> 52:40.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's what happens when you run into one at full speed.
[52:40.620 --> 52:42.160]  [SPEAKER_18]: You always say, oh, I didn't see you there.
[52:42.260 --> 52:43.480]  [SPEAKER_20]: You blend in so well.
[52:43.620 --> 52:47.520]  [SPEAKER_20]: I realized at one point that they're wearing this camouflage for the express purpose of standing out.
[52:47.660 --> 52:47.920]  [SPEAKER_20]: Mm-hmm.
[52:48.040 --> 52:50.620]  [SPEAKER_20]: So, whoever invented camouflage must be upset.
[52:50.880 --> 52:52.120]  [SPEAKER_16]: I should just mention an anecdote.
[52:52.340 --> 52:56.180]  [SPEAKER_16]: And unfortunately, I've been investigating this for a while and unable to really gain too much ground.
[52:56.320 --> 53:00.880]  [SPEAKER_16]: But, uh, I'll ask our listeners to, to call in or write us if they've noticed anything like this.
[53:00.880 --> 53:06.540]  [SPEAKER_16]: I spotted a, an NYPD cruiser with federal license plates.
[53:07.060 --> 53:07.400]  [SPEAKER_16]: Wow.
[53:07.720 --> 53:09.660]  [SPEAKER_13]: Are you sure it wasn't some sort of federal police?
[53:09.800 --> 53:12.100]  [SPEAKER_13]: Because there's often, uh, on Wall Street...
[53:12.100 --> 53:15.120]  [SPEAKER_16]: NYPD on the side, black on white license plate, U.S.
[53:15.240 --> 53:15.860]  [SPEAKER_16]: government on the side.
[53:16.080 --> 53:16.200]  [SPEAKER_16]: Okay.
[53:16.800 --> 53:18.980]  [SPEAKER_16]: And I haven't seen one since, but it's out there.
[53:19.180 --> 53:20.020]  [SPEAKER_18]: There's probably only a couple.
[53:20.220 --> 53:23.040]  [SPEAKER_18]: And I, you know, there's a couple of taxi cabs out there that are really police cars.
[53:23.040 --> 53:25.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: And you can tell them because they have the old prices on the side.
[53:26.040 --> 53:26.880]  [SPEAKER_18]: They don't think to change them.
[53:26.980 --> 53:28.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: We did see that that one night.
[53:28.280 --> 53:28.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[53:28.480 --> 53:29.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah, we were on the street.
[53:29.420 --> 53:29.640]  [SPEAKER_18]: That was something.
[53:29.800 --> 53:30.520]  [SPEAKER_18]: It almost hit us.
[53:31.240 --> 53:31.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[53:31.660 --> 53:32.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Let's take another phone call.
[53:32.280 --> 53:32.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good evening.
[53:32.560 --> 53:32.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: You're on the air.
[53:33.600 --> 53:34.300]  [SPEAKER_09]: Good evening, gentlemen.
[53:34.420 --> 53:34.800]  [SPEAKER_09]: How are you?
[53:34.920 --> 53:35.040]  [SPEAKER_09]: Good.
[53:35.120 --> 53:35.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: How are you?
[53:36.120 --> 53:37.040]  [SPEAKER_09]: So far, so good.
[53:37.200 --> 53:48.140]  [SPEAKER_09]: I wanted to, uh, mention to you, and, um, I believe, uh, Mr. Goldstein, that, uh, you do, well, you, you and I have run into each other at, uh, the last big demo.
[53:48.520 --> 53:48.940]  [SPEAKER_06]: Uh-huh.
[53:49.180 --> 54:09.080]  [SPEAKER_09]: Um, that, uh, to let you know that the NYPD, after this big die-in, was, uh, detaining people and asking about all the political organizations they belong to and, uh, where they go, and threatening them that if they didn't answer their questions, that they were going to be kept in jail longer if they didn't answer.
[54:09.160 --> 54:10.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: That's a common tactic.
[54:10.500 --> 54:13.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's a common tactic to, uh, try to intimidate people into giving up as much as they can.
[54:14.020 --> 54:17.520]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, while the NYPD's, uh, intelligence squad is on the loose again.
[54:17.760 --> 54:20.820]  [SPEAKER_20]: We have the, the, the 10-second legal training for our listeners.
[54:20.820 --> 54:27.680]  [SPEAKER_20]: If you're ever arrested, the only thing you should say to the police beyond your name and address is, I'm not going to say anything, I'd like to see a lawyer.
[54:28.280 --> 54:28.600]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.
[54:28.980 --> 54:29.440]  [SPEAKER_09]: There you go.
[54:29.760 --> 54:30.900]  [SPEAKER_20]: You don't have to say the first part.
[54:30.980 --> 54:31.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Just say, I want to talk to a lawyer.
[54:32.040 --> 54:39.620]  [SPEAKER_09]: Know your rights and don't believe anything anybody, anybody else tells you about how long you're going to be there or what you're going to do, uh, other than, other than your attorney.
[54:40.540 --> 54:43.480]  [SPEAKER_18]: Sounds like, sounds like you've had, you have the experience to be able to say this.
[54:43.740 --> 54:45.080]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, uh, yeah, you, yeah.
[54:45.200 --> 54:48.540]  [SPEAKER_09]: And you would, you, you would probably know me from that, from that end as well.
[54:48.540 --> 54:53.520]  [SPEAKER_09]: But, uh, but not, but not from, uh, uh, not from the, uh, police department end.
[54:53.800 --> 54:53.980]  [SPEAKER_09]: Uh-huh.
[54:53.980 --> 55:12.700]  [SPEAKER_09]: Anyway, um, the, uh, other thing I wanted to mention is that, uh, um, I've heard recently that, uh, you've seen these, these, these stories and I, I can't attribute them to anybody because every time I, I, I go looking for them, they, they, they quote unnamed sources that the America's being attacked by hackers from Iraq.
[55:12.700 --> 55:15.800]  [SPEAKER_09]: And I'm going like, yeah, okay, fine.
[55:16.020 --> 55:22.320]  [SPEAKER_09]: I, I, I, I, I'm really hesitant about thinking about, uh, electronic warfare being as it is.
[55:22.420 --> 55:35.740]  [SPEAKER_09]: I, I don't discount the fact that it might in fact happen, but, um, I, I, I really don't think that I've, I, I, so far, uh, I've, I just, it's just like that, um, you call it disinformation, propaganda, if you will.
[55:35.980 --> 55:36.140]  [SPEAKER_18]: Yeah.
[55:36.300 --> 55:39.500]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, we have to be able to see when that's, uh, around us and it's around us all over the place.
[55:39.600 --> 55:40.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Listen, thanks for calling.
[55:40.300 --> 55:40.680]  [SPEAKER_18]: We're out of time.
[55:40.880 --> 55:41.240]  [SPEAKER_18]: Right, bye.
[55:41.460 --> 55:41.840]  [SPEAKER_18]: All right.
[55:42.260 --> 55:44.300]  [SPEAKER_18]: And, uh, that's going to do it for us, uh, this week.
[55:44.440 --> 55:45.960]  [SPEAKER_18]: Let's, Leo, you have one more thing to say.
[55:46.000 --> 55:50.680]  [SPEAKER_15]: One more thing is that they dropped the e-bomb on Iraq, on some Iraqi TV station a few days back.
[55:50.860 --> 55:52.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Oh, I used to drop e-bombs all the time.
[55:52.400 --> 55:52.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: E-bombs.
[55:53.000 --> 55:55.280]  [SPEAKER_18]: Well, that's something we'll talk about in, in weeks ahead.
[55:55.440 --> 55:59.260]  [SPEAKER_18]: It's, uh, it seems kind of, uh, kind of strange, but we're going to look into that as well, what an e-bomb is.
[55:59.740 --> 56:02.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, so we'll be back again next week with another exciting edition of Off the Hook.
[56:02.940 --> 56:06.380]  [SPEAKER_18]: I'm sure all kinds of, uh, things will have happened in the world, uh, uh, then.
[56:06.580 --> 56:09.360]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, stay tuned for, I'm not sure what to stay tuned for.
[56:09.360 --> 56:12.620]  [SPEAKER_18]: I think the personal computer show got preempted again, so something else is coming up.
[56:12.800 --> 56:14.200]  [SPEAKER_18]: Uh, oh, yes, and the meeting is this week.
[56:14.300 --> 56:17.420]  [SPEAKER_18]: The meeting is this Friday, uh, 5 o'clock, uh, or thereabouts.
[56:17.600 --> 56:20.600]  [SPEAKER_18]: Check your, your, the back page at 2600 for your local, uh, city.
[56:20.720 --> 56:21.920]  [SPEAKER_18]: See where the meetings are happening.
[56:22.560 --> 56:23.320]  [SPEAKER_18]: We'll see you there.
[56:24.120 --> 56:24.540]  [SPEAKER_18]: Good night.
[56:24.760 --> 56:25.160]  [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, boy.
[56:25.300 --> 56:26.260]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'm all right.
[56:48.770 --> 56:50.790]  [SPEAKER_05]: And that's all it's yours.
[57:06.680 --> 57:07.700]  Are you nosy?
[57:08.460 --> 57:09.400]  [SPEAKER_06]: Then we'll never.
[57:18.720 --> 57:20.660]  [SPEAKER_05]: Just take a look around you.
[57:21.020 --> 57:22.080]  [SPEAKER_05]: What do you see?
[57:22.600 --> 57:25.660]  [SPEAKER_05]: Kids with feelings like you and me.
[57:26.240 --> 57:27.420]  [SPEAKER_05]: Understand him.
[57:27.640 --> 57:29.120]  [SPEAKER_05]: He'll understand you.
[57:29.460 --> 57:30.960]  [SPEAKER_05]: For you are him.
[57:31.140 --> 57:32.640]  [SPEAKER_05]: And he is you.
[57:45.320 --> 57:46.180]  [SPEAKER_05]: And you're funny.
[57:46.760 --> 57:49.730]  And nothing.
[57:49.730 --> 57:56.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Hear, visualize, and remember the sounds of Black Cinema Soul.
[58:01.820 --> 58:06.520]  [SPEAKER_02]: Coming to a theater in your mind is Black Cinema Soul.
[58:07.340 --> 58:10.380]  [SPEAKER_02]: An exploration into blaxploitation.
[58:16.570 --> 58:24.210]  [SPEAKER_02]: Catch the sounds of Black Cinema Soul as presented by the Midnight Ravers on Friday, April 4th, 2003.
[58:24.210 --> 58:26.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: From 12 midnight to 3 a.m.
[58:26.890 --> 58:30.830]  [SPEAKER_02]: on WBAI 99.5 FM in New York.
[58:30.830 --> 58:32.850]  [SPEAKER_02]: A well-known pin.
[58:33.410 --> 58:34.690]  [SPEAKER_02]: Not clinics king.
[58:35.230 --> 58:36.590]  [SPEAKER_02]: Big time racketeer.
[58:37.490 --> 58:38.970]  [SPEAKER_02]: Back in full force.
[58:39.710 --> 58:41.430]  [SPEAKER_02]: This could be one of the big moments in your life.
[58:41.690 --> 58:42.610]  [SPEAKER_02]: Don't make it your last.
[58:45.400 --> 58:47.540]  [SPEAKER_10]: Look, this thing might be bigger than even weak.
[58:47.680 --> 58:48.020]  [SPEAKER_10]: Like it is.
[58:48.620 --> 58:52.840]  [SPEAKER_02]: Join the Midnight Ravers April 4th, 2003.
[58:53.200 --> 58:57.740]  [SPEAKER_02]: And experience Black Cinema Soul.
[59:01.800 --> 59:06.560]  [SPEAKER_02]: The music of the genre known as blaxploitation.
[59:07.060 --> 59:13.640]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right here at Midnight on 99.5 FM WBAI.
[59:14.000 --> 59:18.800]  [SPEAKER_09]: The Midnight Ravers, where every show is a special.
[59:19.840 --> 59:21.200]  [SPEAKER_09]: Occupying armies.
[59:21.760 --> 59:23.060]  [SPEAKER_09]: Occupying armies.
[59:23.060 --> 59:33.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: We believe that as a people living in the United States, it is our responsibility to resist the injustices done by our government in our name.
[59:33.940 --> 59:36.480]  [SPEAKER_19]: Raise our voices again in Washington.
[59:40.810 --> 59:43.310]  [SPEAKER_19]: Saturday, April 12th.
[59:43.470 --> 59:45.310]  [SPEAKER_19]: Stop the war on Iraq.
[59:45.630 --> 59:47.050]  [SPEAKER_06]: No blood for oil!
[59:47.210 --> 59:49.130]  [SPEAKER_19]: Saturday, April 12th.
[59:49.230 --> 59:50.610]  [SPEAKER_19]: Come to Washington, D.C.
[59:50.650 --> 59:52.010]  [SPEAKER_05]: We pledge resistance!
[59:52.450 --> 59:53.710]  [SPEAKER_05]: Surround the White House.
[59:53.710 --> 59:58.570]  [SPEAKER_05]: We could be spending this money on schools, on hospitals, on healthcare.
[59:59.150 --> 01:00:00.690]  [SPEAKER_19]: Come to Washington, D.C.
[01:00:00.950 --> 01:00:03.170]  [SPEAKER_19]: Saturday, April 12th.
[01:00:03.390 --> 01:00:04.370]  [SPEAKER_19]: Business as usual.
[01:00:07.650 --> 01:00:10.790]  [SPEAKER_19]: For more information, call Answer Coalition.
[01:00:11.050 --> 01:00:14.670]  [SPEAKER_19]: 212-633-6646.
[01:00:15.290 --> 01:00:17.010]  [SPEAKER_19]: Bring our Trump call!