Off The Hook - 2004-08-11

[00:05.950 --> 00:12.630]  [SPEAKER_00]: And you're listening to radio station WBAI New York, where the time is exactly 7 o'clock.
[00:13.270 --> 00:15.410]  [SPEAKER_00]: Time once again for Off The Hook.
[02:18.140 --> 02:19.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: And a good evening to everybody.
[02:19.160 --> 02:19.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: The program is Off The Hook.
[02:20.010 --> 02:22.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: Emmanuel Goldstein here with you on this Wednesday night.
[02:22.740 --> 02:24.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: Back for the first time in a couple of weeks.
[02:25.240 --> 02:27.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: Mike and I back from the Maritimes.
[02:28.010 --> 02:28.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: A lot of fun, huh?
[02:29.100 --> 02:29.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[02:29.760 --> 02:30.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: Your mic is not up.
[02:30.900 --> 02:31.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, say that again.
[02:31.920 --> 02:32.510]  [SPEAKER_00]: I said yes.
[02:32.700 --> 02:33.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, that's better.
[02:34.960 --> 02:37.510]  [SPEAKER_00]: And of course, Jim joins us over there from the outside room.
[02:37.560 --> 02:37.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: Hello.
[02:37.820 --> 02:38.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: How are you doing?
[02:39.060 --> 02:39.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: Great hiked.
[02:39.740 --> 02:39.880]  [SPEAKER_00]: Hey.
[02:40.070 --> 02:40.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome.
[02:40.880 --> 02:42.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: Bernie S., you're in Philadelphia.
[02:42.340 --> 02:46.140]  [SPEAKER_10]: I'm on a landline, so I'm sure I sound better than Sprint PCS.
[02:46.200 --> 02:47.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, that's amazing.
[02:47.340 --> 02:49.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: You're on a landline, and it's like I'm talking to a different person.
[02:50.080 --> 02:51.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's like you're right here in the studio.
[02:51.580 --> 02:52.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's almost like that.
[02:52.400 --> 02:52.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: Almost.
[02:53.180 --> 02:53.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: Except that we can't see.
[02:53.800 --> 02:56.640]  [SPEAKER_10]: I was not having good times in the Maritimes, though.
[02:57.100 --> 02:58.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you weren't in the Maritimes.
[02:58.340 --> 02:58.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: No.
[02:58.660 --> 03:00.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: So it's not like you were having bad times in the Maritimes.
[03:01.740 --> 03:02.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we were there.
[03:02.580 --> 03:03.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: We talked about it last night on Off The Wall.
[03:04.280 --> 03:07.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: So if people want more details on that, I guess they can tune in there.
[03:07.420 --> 03:12.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: But we do have a couple of interesting things to point out, including things that happened again at the border.
[03:13.710 --> 03:18.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: And some telephone-related type things, including clarification.
[03:18.080 --> 03:25.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: We talked last time we were on the air about the workers' strike at Alliant, the main phone company up there in the Maritimes.
[03:25.960 --> 03:26.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: Is that right, Mike?
[03:26.460 --> 03:27.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: They're the main company?
[03:27.680 --> 03:28.140]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yes.
[03:28.140 --> 03:31.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: They handle the payphones, the cell phones.
[03:31.380 --> 03:32.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: They're all over the place.
[03:32.360 --> 03:32.720]  [SPEAKER_00]: All over.
[03:32.960 --> 03:34.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: We spelled it wrong.
[03:34.440 --> 03:35.780]  [SPEAKER_06]: This is the problem.
[03:36.420 --> 03:41.140]  [SPEAKER_06]: Companies, people naming companies, if you use made-up words, people are going to spell them wrong.
[03:41.260 --> 03:41.400]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.
[03:41.620 --> 03:46.640]  [SPEAKER_06]: So the correct spelling of Alliant is A-L-I-A-N-T.
[03:46.860 --> 03:47.800]  [SPEAKER_06]: There's only one L.
[03:48.140 --> 03:48.280]  [SPEAKER_06]: Right.
[03:48.560 --> 03:54.980]  [SPEAKER_06]: If you spell two L's, you'll find some other company in the U.S., also called Alliant, whose workers also went on strike.
[03:54.980 --> 03:57.640]  [SPEAKER_06]: But that strike is over, so we don't really want to talk about it.
[03:58.980 --> 03:59.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, my goodness.
[04:00.200 --> 04:05.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we're sorry to that company for any turmoil that may have been caused by BII listeners calling, demanding that this be settled.
[04:06.330 --> 04:10.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: But there is a website somewhere out there about this, about the strike, correct?
[04:10.330 --> 04:10.540]  [SPEAKER_06]: Right.
[04:10.700 --> 04:14.700]  [SPEAKER_06]: The workers are represented by two unions.
[04:14.860 --> 04:20.200]  [SPEAKER_06]: There's one in Nova Scotia and a different union in the other three maritime provinces.
[04:20.200 --> 04:26.710]  [SPEAKER_06]: The union in Nova Scotia is called the ACTWU, which I'm sure stands for something wonderful.
[04:27.000 --> 04:31.830]  [SPEAKER_06]: And their website is, of course, ACTWU.ns.ca.
[04:32.640 --> 04:33.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[04:33.300 --> 04:34.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's something.
[04:34.240 --> 04:35.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: And does that have all the information on the strike?
[04:35.830 --> 04:37.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's got all kinds of information.
[04:37.440 --> 04:37.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[04:38.000 --> 04:41.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: There's no simpler URL for people to find out information about this?
[04:41.920 --> 04:43.260]  [SPEAKER_06]: What's complex about that one?
[04:43.270 --> 04:43.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[04:43.480 --> 04:47.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, just type in Alliant, A-L-I-A-N-T, and strike, I guess, into Google.
[04:47.800 --> 04:49.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm sure you'll find all kinds of other things as well.
[04:49.680 --> 04:51.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: But that strike has been going on for how long now?
[04:52.380 --> 04:56.360]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, it was 14 weeks as of two weeks ago, so I guess 16 now.
[04:56.480 --> 04:56.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: Mercy.
[04:57.200 --> 04:59.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: And we didn't even know about the strike, let alone the company.
[04:59.700 --> 05:08.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: So hopefully we can follow that information and be able to update it as it progresses or regresses or whatnot.
[05:09.860 --> 05:13.880]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, we had fun with our own phones as we were driving up there.
[05:14.200 --> 05:16.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, you have a deal with AT&T.
[05:16.300 --> 05:21.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: You have AT&T, GSM, I have T-Mobile, and I also have Verizon, CDMA.
[05:22.920 --> 05:27.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, I was surprised by how much CDMA coverage there is up there.
[05:27.270 --> 05:29.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: In fact, I had coverage almost the whole time.
[05:29.540 --> 05:35.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: It was very reliable as far as figuring out what time zone I was in because there's several different time zones.
[05:35.540 --> 05:37.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: There's Atlantic that Nova Scotia is in.
[05:37.480 --> 05:41.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: There's Newfoundland time, which is an hour and a half ahead of us as opposed to just an hour.
[05:41.740 --> 05:45.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: And then on St. Pierre, the French island, they're actually two hours ahead.
[05:45.940 --> 05:53.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, there was no coverage at all on St. Pierre, CDMA-wise, but I was able to pick up a Newfoundland signal, for the time at least, and get that.
[05:53.180 --> 05:54.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: Actually, I was able to make a phone call, too.
[05:54.500 --> 05:58.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: I called O to find out what the company was, and they said they were Alliant.
[05:59.380 --> 06:02.540]  [SPEAKER_06]: I don't know if we should admit what company was.
[06:02.700 --> 06:05.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, Alliant is the CDMA company up there.
[06:05.420 --> 06:11.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, when you were using your GSM, on your AT&T GSM, what company were you going through?
[06:12.120 --> 06:15.780]  [SPEAKER_06]: I was using either Rogers or Fido slash MicroSale.
[06:15.960 --> 06:16.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[06:16.620 --> 06:20.160]  [SPEAKER_04]: Did it greet you when you went into Canada with an SMS?
[06:20.340 --> 06:22.260]  [SPEAKER_04]: Because I remember a friend of mine having that happen to you.
[06:22.280 --> 06:26.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: I had a greeting from, I think it was Rogers that greeted me, but they greeted me.
[06:26.280 --> 06:26.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: It was the other one.
[06:26.960 --> 06:28.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: Was it the other one, Micro, whatever?
[06:28.200 --> 06:29.560]  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that was the one that greeted me.
[06:29.560 --> 06:29.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[06:30.520 --> 06:31.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: Who's making that noise?
[06:31.880 --> 06:32.580]  [SPEAKER_10]: Oh, I'm sorry.
[06:32.720 --> 06:35.060]  [SPEAKER_10]: It's my computer telling me I have email.
[06:35.480 --> 06:37.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: You have an error tone as your email alert?
[06:38.020 --> 06:39.520]  [SPEAKER_10]: A special information tone.
[06:39.820 --> 06:40.200]  [SPEAKER_00]: Wow.
[06:41.020 --> 06:42.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: I was looking for a phone off the hook somewhere.
[06:43.600 --> 06:46.200]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, okay, so I got a greeting from Microtel.
[06:47.300 --> 06:47.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: Microtel.
[06:47.840 --> 06:48.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: These names.
[06:49.160 --> 06:54.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they greeted me a full day after I arrived, so I'd already been, you know, receiving phone calls and sending SMSs.
[06:54.820 --> 06:57.120]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, the thing is, I couldn't use my phone very much.
[06:57.420 --> 07:02.850]  [SPEAKER_00]: Mike was able to use his phone a lot more than me because he has a special deal with AT&T.
[07:02.940 --> 07:04.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: You call it the, what deal again?
[07:04.220 --> 07:05.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: The imperialism plan.
[07:05.580 --> 07:05.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: Imperialism plan.
[07:05.980 --> 07:07.220]  [SPEAKER_06]: Which is not the official title.
[07:07.280 --> 07:09.580]  [SPEAKER_06]: You should not call up and ask for the imperialism plan.
[07:09.680 --> 07:12.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, they might get better luck than you have dealing with them.
[07:12.580 --> 07:14.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: You have these long conversations with AT&T every time I call.
[07:14.660 --> 07:19.920]  [SPEAKER_06]: Every time I call AT&T, I wait 10 minutes on hold, and then no matter what I want from them, it takes a further 10 minutes.
[07:19.920 --> 07:33.020]  [SPEAKER_06]: But what I wanted in this particular case was what they call the North America package, which, in terms of telephone service, makes Canada part of the United States, is the easiest way to explain it.
[07:33.020 --> 07:33.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: Isn't that something?
[07:33.640 --> 07:40.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: So they just suddenly become part of the U.S., and you can go there and call from there and call to there, and it's like nothing...
[07:40.280 --> 07:43.600]  [SPEAKER_06]: It's just part of the, you know, the free long distance enrollment thing.
[07:43.600 --> 07:44.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh-huh.
[07:44.240 --> 07:51.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: So you were able to make phone calls up there, and it just got added to your minutes, or you had free nights and weekends, and you could talk as long as you wanted.
[07:51.520 --> 07:51.840]  [SPEAKER_06]: Right.
[07:52.120 --> 08:02.060]  [SPEAKER_06]: The one catch is that this apparently doesn't apply to data, so I still got to charge the roaming rate when I use GPRS, which they call M-mode in AT&T speak.
[08:02.520 --> 08:02.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: Interesting.
[08:03.020 --> 08:05.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, me, on the other hand, I had to pay 69 cents a minute.
[08:05.900 --> 08:11.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: I had to pay, I think, 20 cents for roaming, and 49 cents for long distance, or vice versa.
[08:11.920 --> 08:15.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not sure which, but I called T-Mobile to ask them, do you have such a plan?
[08:15.980 --> 08:17.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they said right away, no, we don't.
[08:17.740 --> 08:23.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think they've gotten many calls from people asking about, you know, expanding their calling plan to Canada.
[08:25.160 --> 08:28.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah, a lot of phone calls I didn't make when I was up there because of that.
[08:28.720 --> 08:31.850]  [SPEAKER_00]: And it's also expensive on CDMA as well, about the same price.
[08:32.000 --> 08:36.900]  [SPEAKER_06]: The one thing, of course, is to remember to cancel the imperialism plan when I got back.
[08:37.000 --> 08:38.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, that was the half hour on the phone with AT&T yesterday.
[08:38.660 --> 08:39.940]  [SPEAKER_06]: That was another 20 minutes, yeah.
[08:41.100 --> 08:42.200]  [SPEAKER_00]: But they did...
[08:42.200 --> 08:43.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: They did it.
[08:43.120 --> 08:44.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: They almost deleted something you needed, though, right?
[08:44.760 --> 08:51.680]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, they were a little confused because I also have the feature where you can just call internationally from the U.S.
[08:52.800 --> 08:53.680]  [SPEAKER_06]: And they...
[08:53.680 --> 08:54.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: That's a feature.
[08:54.580 --> 08:56.920]  [SPEAKER_06]: You know, I'm not going to ask questions.
[08:57.120 --> 08:57.240]  [SPEAKER_06]: Okay.
[08:58.420 --> 09:00.840]  [SPEAKER_06]: I had to just make sure that they didn't delete that.
[09:01.480 --> 09:01.780]  [SPEAKER_06]: Okay.
[09:02.000 --> 09:05.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I think we did okay, cell phone-wise.
[09:05.380 --> 09:08.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, my SMS messages, because I was communicating with people via SMS while I was up there.
[09:08.960 --> 09:10.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: What can I expect to pay for those?
[09:10.960 --> 09:12.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: You should look at your phone bill.
[09:12.340 --> 09:13.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I haven't gotten it yet.
[09:13.300 --> 09:14.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, when you do, look at it.
[09:14.500 --> 09:14.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[09:15.020 --> 09:15.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: Report back.
[09:15.500 --> 09:18.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: So it's going to be, you know, a big surprise when I find out.
[09:20.140 --> 09:20.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[09:20.580 --> 09:22.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, I guess...
[09:22.020 --> 09:22.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: And connectivity-wise.
[09:23.000 --> 09:23.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: How do we do connectivity-wise?
[09:24.600 --> 09:27.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: I know we were in one place that had free Wi-Fi.
[09:28.520 --> 09:31.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: We went to this bar in St. Pierre that had Internet access.
[09:32.700 --> 09:36.940]  [SPEAKER_06]: The main problem with that bar was they had the French-style Azzerty keyboard.
[09:37.220 --> 09:39.080]  [SPEAKER_06]: And so I didn't know where all the letters were.
[09:39.420 --> 09:40.200]  [SPEAKER_06]: It was a little...
[09:40.200 --> 09:42.340]  [SPEAKER_06]: It took a very long time to find the keys.
[09:42.340 --> 09:43.540]  [SPEAKER_06]: It was over a modem.
[09:43.880 --> 09:45.940]  [SPEAKER_06]: And who knows where the modem went.
[09:46.100 --> 09:50.040]  [SPEAKER_06]: And it was pretty good to get Internet in really the middle of nowhere.
[09:50.040 --> 09:52.960]  [SPEAKER_06]: But it was not the most efficient Internet.
[09:52.960 --> 09:54.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: What was the name of the phone company there?
[09:54.440 --> 09:55.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: Spam was the name of the phone company?
[09:56.380 --> 09:57.020]  [SPEAKER_06]: SPM Telecom.
[09:57.260 --> 09:58.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: SPM Telecom.
[09:58.300 --> 10:00.060]  [SPEAKER_06]: Standing for St. Pierre and Michelin.
[10:00.360 --> 10:00.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[10:01.020 --> 10:01.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[10:01.440 --> 10:01.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: So.
[10:02.080 --> 10:03.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, leave out the A.
[10:03.140 --> 10:05.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they, of course, were the GSM provider as well in that area.
[10:06.940 --> 10:13.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: When we were on the air last, we made a special offer to people in Halifax that we would meet them at a particular place.
[10:13.120 --> 10:14.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: I believe it was Argyles, was it?
[10:15.000 --> 10:15.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[10:15.520 --> 10:15.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: Argyles Street?
[10:15.900 --> 10:17.460]  [SPEAKER_06]: The Argyle on Argyle Street.
[10:17.460 --> 10:22.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: And we have to apologize because, well, we told people to meet us at 10 o'clock, which is the exact time that they stopped serving food.
[10:22.960 --> 10:23.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: We didn't know that, you know.
[10:24.240 --> 10:28.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: We offered to buy people dinner and at 10 o'clock, precisely on the nose, that's when their kitchen closes.
[10:28.300 --> 10:31.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: We were confused because the night before we saw people out there until midnight.
[10:31.280 --> 10:32.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: I guess they were just drinking.
[10:32.880 --> 10:36.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: But it didn't matter anyway because nobody showed up and we didn't really have to worry.
[10:36.300 --> 10:39.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: But we did get a letter from somebody saying, I'm listening to the show at 4 a.m.
[10:39.960 --> 10:42.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: on Thursday, July 29th right now, and I am in total shock.
[10:42.660 --> 10:44.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: I missed meeting Emmanuel by only a block.
[10:44.740 --> 10:49.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: I went out to downtown Halifax at 10.10 and went to a club a block away from the Argyle.
[10:49.620 --> 10:53.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: I now sit here at home, writing this completely bummed out that I missed such an opportunity.
[10:54.180 --> 10:59.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: I wish Emmanuel all the best of luck on his trip, and I'm sorry to hear he will miss the Tall Ships Festival in Halifax.
[10:59.780 --> 11:00.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: Cheers from Wade.
[11:01.160 --> 11:02.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, Wade, we're sorry we missed you as well.
[11:02.580 --> 11:06.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: But as it turns out, you know, the place wasn't really open anyway.
[11:06.760 --> 11:07.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: We had a lot of fun in your city.
[11:08.440 --> 11:10.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm sure we'll be back up there again sometime soon.
[11:10.620 --> 11:12.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: But the Tall Ships, yeah, we totally missed the Tall Ships.
[11:12.480 --> 11:16.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: We saw a couple of them, but we had to leave the day before they actually arrived.
[11:17.840 --> 11:21.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: Anything else that we have technology-wise to share with the people from up there?
[11:22.520 --> 11:23.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: Do we want to talk about the border?
[11:23.980 --> 11:25.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well, we can get right into the border crossings.
[11:25.940 --> 11:33.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: We talked about what happened to us when we went over to Yarmouth from Bar Harbor on the Cat Ferry.
[11:33.540 --> 11:34.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: We talked about that two weeks ago.
[11:35.980 --> 11:38.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: And then what we did was we drove through Nova Scotia.
[11:38.720 --> 11:45.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: We took the ferry over to Port-au-Basque, drove all the way through Newfoundland, went over to St. Pierre, Michelin, the French islands, came back, drove up to St. John's.
[11:45.780 --> 11:47.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: Wonderful city, great place.
[11:47.200 --> 11:48.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: I highly recommend it.
[11:48.480 --> 11:49.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, you don't have to do all this driving.
[11:49.940 --> 11:54.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: You can probably just get on an airplane and fly to St. John's and have a great time up there and be in a completely different place.
[11:55.180 --> 11:59.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: But then after that, we took a 14-hour ferry ride from...
[11:59.560 --> 12:00.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: 17-hour.
[12:00.480 --> 12:03.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: It turned out to 17 hours because we had a sick passenger and it had to turn around and go back.
[12:03.820 --> 12:04.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: And we were asleep.
[12:04.820 --> 12:05.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: We didn't know that happened.
[12:06.360 --> 12:08.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: So that was the longest boat ride I think I've ever taken in my life.
[12:08.880 --> 12:10.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: The longest any kind of a ride I think I've ever taken.
[12:11.380 --> 12:14.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: We wound up back at North Sydney, Nova Scotia.
[12:14.460 --> 12:18.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: We drove through there, through New Brunswick, and then crossing the border...
[12:18.780 --> 12:20.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: What was the city we crossed the border at?
[12:20.840 --> 12:22.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's called Houlton, Maine.
[12:22.580 --> 12:23.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: Houlton, Maine, okay.
[12:23.400 --> 12:24.720]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's definitely in Maine.
[12:25.260 --> 12:25.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[12:25.640 --> 12:28.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, the first indication of trouble came when...
[12:28.840 --> 12:30.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, the guy was really friendly.
[12:31.100 --> 12:33.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: He's like this kind of gruff, bearded guy.
[12:33.500 --> 12:34.720]  [SPEAKER_00]: He's like, hey, fellas, how you doing?
[12:35.220 --> 12:36.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: He's like kind of a Smokey the Bear kind of guy.
[12:37.440 --> 12:39.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: And you know, when they're that friendly, you know there's something up.
[12:39.680 --> 12:40.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know there's more to it.
[12:40.980 --> 12:42.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: They're never that friendly and they just let you go.
[12:44.180 --> 12:47.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, he started just asking a lot of questions, right?
[12:47.860 --> 12:49.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: Remember some of the things he was asking?
[12:49.560 --> 12:51.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: What we did for a living, obviously.
[12:51.540 --> 12:52.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: Where we had gone.
[12:54.020 --> 12:54.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: Where we were going.
[12:55.060 --> 12:56.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: If we had any illegal drugs with us.
[12:56.740 --> 12:57.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: Illegal drugs.
[12:58.000 --> 12:58.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: Weapons.
[12:58.540 --> 12:59.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: That kind of thing.
[12:59.780 --> 13:01.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: And he looked at our passports.
[13:01.540 --> 13:07.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I knew there was trouble when he looked at my passport and he wanted to know the purpose of my visit to Russia last year.
[13:09.380 --> 13:11.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, what do you say to something like that?
[13:11.180 --> 13:12.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: The purpose of my visit to Russia?
[13:13.140 --> 13:13.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: Gathering intelligence.
[13:14.260 --> 13:14.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know?
[13:15.320 --> 13:17.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: Figuring out ways to subvert the system.
[13:17.340 --> 13:20.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you know, someone should tell this guy Russia's not even communist anymore.
[13:21.480 --> 13:22.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: They're supposedly our friends.
[13:22.640 --> 13:24.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, why would he want to know why I went to Russia?
[13:25.330 --> 13:26.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: Really very bizarre.
[13:29.080 --> 13:29.720]  [SPEAKER_00]: And then...
[13:29.720 --> 13:30.640]  [SPEAKER_10]: So, what did you say, Emmanuel?
[13:30.780 --> 13:32.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I said I just went there as a tourist.
[13:33.140 --> 13:35.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: I was careful to say tourist, not terrorist.
[13:35.520 --> 13:36.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, very...
[13:36.420 --> 13:38.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: You've got to be careful the way you pronounce things these days.
[13:38.720 --> 13:38.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: With an extra syllable in there.
[13:39.120 --> 13:39.880]  [SPEAKER_00]: Extra syllable, yeah.
[13:41.680 --> 13:43.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: And he wanted to search the trunk.
[13:44.060 --> 13:44.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.
[13:44.600 --> 13:47.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: He asked, like, how many things we were declaring.
[13:47.680 --> 13:50.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: And we both got two bottles of wine from St. Pierre.
[13:50.540 --> 13:52.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, we made sure that we told him that we had that.
[13:52.580 --> 13:53.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know?
[13:53.360 --> 13:55.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: And he wanted to know the total value of everything that we had.
[13:56.480 --> 13:58.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: I forgot about the CDs I had in my trunk.
[13:58.380 --> 14:00.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: I bought CDs from Newfoundland and Nova Scotia.
[14:00.480 --> 14:01.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: But he didn't seem to care about that.
[14:02.560 --> 14:05.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: And then he wanted to see my driver's license.
[14:05.000 --> 14:07.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, okay, this is where things got difficult.
[14:07.260 --> 14:09.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: Because, as many people know, I don't carry a wallet.
[14:10.280 --> 14:11.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: I just don't.
[14:11.260 --> 14:12.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't like carrying wallets.
[14:12.480 --> 14:13.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: They're very thick.
[14:13.420 --> 14:13.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: They're bulky.
[14:14.360 --> 14:16.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, plus, if you lose them, you lose everything.
[14:16.660 --> 14:18.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, why should I have to carry a wallet?
[14:19.080 --> 14:23.540]  [SPEAKER_04]: Not to mention that your contents of your wallet wouldn't actually fit into it.
[14:23.540 --> 14:25.120]  [SPEAKER_00]: I have a lot of credit cards, yes.
[14:25.340 --> 14:27.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: I, you know, some people collect baseball cards.
[14:27.640 --> 14:28.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: I collect credit cards.
[14:29.040 --> 14:29.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm not ashamed.
[14:30.000 --> 14:30.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: That's what I do.
[14:32.080 --> 14:37.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: But, when I reached for my license, which is what he wanted to see, well, it wasn't right there.
[14:37.680 --> 14:39.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, I had to reach in and get all my cards.
[14:39.760 --> 14:42.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: And his eyes just literally bugged out of his head.
[14:42.520 --> 14:44.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: I said, oh, can I see all of those cards?
[14:45.200 --> 14:45.780]  Oh, great.
[14:45.980 --> 14:47.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I said, yeah, sure.
[14:47.380 --> 14:48.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I don't have anything to hide.
[14:48.840 --> 14:50.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: Here, take a look at the cards.
[14:51.800 --> 14:54.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: And then he got to the cards that had the funny names on them.
[14:54.800 --> 14:55.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, the different...
[14:55.560 --> 14:56.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I...
[14:56.000 --> 14:57.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: This is completely legal.
[14:57.500 --> 15:06.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: You can go to your credit card company and say, I'd like to get an extra card for a friend or for a relative or for, you know, the name of my dog or whatever.
[15:06.780 --> 15:07.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, you can do this.
[15:07.900 --> 15:08.880]  [SPEAKER_00]: People do it all the time.
[15:09.340 --> 15:10.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: Apparently, he never heard of that before.
[15:11.040 --> 15:13.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: And immediately, as soon as he saw that I had different names, that was it.
[15:13.800 --> 15:15.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, okay, pull your car in there.
[15:15.440 --> 15:18.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: And he did say, pull your car into the bay, right?
[15:18.480 --> 15:18.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[15:18.780 --> 15:20.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: He said, pull your car into the bay.
[15:20.800 --> 15:24.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: And so what I did was, I figured, you know, he was going to come out and tell us to do something else.
[15:25.480 --> 15:29.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: And while I was waiting, I made a phone call to a friend of mine just to say, hey, guess what?
[15:29.620 --> 15:32.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: We're being detained again in case something happens to us.
[15:32.020 --> 15:34.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: This is the last you may hear.
[15:35.540 --> 15:41.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: And as soon as the voicemail picked up, because the person didn't pick up, the voicemail picked up, and I started leaving a message.
[15:42.140 --> 15:44.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: Within one second after that, it turned into a reorder.
[15:44.220 --> 15:45.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: A fast, busy signal.
[15:45.800 --> 15:48.720]  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think it's something that came from the actual place.
[15:48.720 --> 15:56.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: I just thought it was a bad coincidence, because at that very moment, the guy came up to us and said, sir, I told you to come inside and put down that phone.
[15:56.920 --> 15:58.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: He was very angry that I was making a phone call.
[15:58.800 --> 16:00.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: And he had never told us to come inside.
[16:01.200 --> 16:07.640]  [SPEAKER_10]: If, Emmanuel, they were using a... if he just switched on a cellular jammer, I don't think you would have heard the reorder.
[16:07.800 --> 16:08.700]  [SPEAKER_10]: It just would have gone dead.
[16:08.840 --> 16:09.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: That's what I think, too.
[16:09.500 --> 16:15.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think it would have just given me maybe the drop signal signal from my phone itself, or it just might have gone dead completely.
[16:15.240 --> 16:17.540]  [SPEAKER_10]: But I wouldn't put it past him to try something like that.
[16:17.620 --> 16:19.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: The timing was just rather bad.
[16:19.480 --> 16:20.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: So then we had to go inside.
[16:20.700 --> 16:25.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: He told me to leave my phones in the car, and to lock the car...
[16:25.620 --> 16:28.120]  [SPEAKER_00]: No, to unlock the car and leave the keys in the car.
[16:28.240 --> 16:29.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: They wanted to go for a ride or something.
[16:31.120 --> 16:37.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: So then he told us to go into this little lobby area where they had a couple of suspicious-looking people there.
[16:38.020 --> 16:38.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: And what did he say then?
[16:39.020 --> 16:40.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: He said to sit in the red chair.
[16:42.080 --> 16:44.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: Sit in the red chairs, because there were two of us.
[16:44.160 --> 16:49.400]  [SPEAKER_06]: There were some red chairs and some blue chairs in the little area.
[16:49.420 --> 16:50.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's a semi-circle.
[16:50.280 --> 16:53.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: There were blue chairs on the outside, and then there were red chairs on the inside.
[16:54.380 --> 16:58.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: So Mike sat in the last red chair, and I sat in the first blue chair.
[16:58.900 --> 17:01.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: To me, that was just a way of exercising defiance.
[17:02.200 --> 17:04.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: And to them, it might have seemed like stupidity.
[17:04.860 --> 17:07.750]  [SPEAKER_00]: But I just wanted to see if that would set them off.
[17:08.440 --> 17:12.970]  [SPEAKER_00]: Because a stage like that, you know that there's nothing that they can find on you.
[17:13.160 --> 17:14.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: You're not doing anything illegal.
[17:15.020 --> 17:20.250]  [SPEAKER_00]: And you just want to see what it is that they're going to decide to get angry about.
[17:20.680 --> 17:25.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, they were going after the whole credit card thing, and they were freaking out over this.
[17:25.160 --> 17:26.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I've been through this before.
[17:26.210 --> 17:29.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: I've been through this discussion before at Border Crossings.
[17:30.480 --> 17:32.250]  [SPEAKER_00]: The Canadian Border Crossing in particular.
[17:32.440 --> 17:33.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: That's the only one that seems to care about this.
[17:33.940 --> 17:36.710]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I explained to them exactly how this works.
[17:36.710 --> 17:38.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they just were not getting it.
[17:38.940 --> 17:41.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: They kept asking, why would you want to do something like that?
[17:41.580 --> 17:45.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, the people I hang out with, they find that kind of thing funny.
[17:45.750 --> 17:48.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, the people I hang out with wouldn't find that kind of thing funny.
[17:48.060 --> 17:50.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I don't hang out with the people you hang out with.
[17:50.710 --> 17:52.250]  [SPEAKER_00]: There was no nice way of saying that.
[17:52.420 --> 17:53.970]  [SPEAKER_10]: You didn't say he has no sense of humor.
[17:53.970 --> 17:54.970]  [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't say that.
[17:55.210 --> 18:01.470]  [SPEAKER_00]: I tried to be, you know, very upfront, honest with them.
[18:02.680 --> 18:05.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: Volunteering information, not too much information.
[18:05.440 --> 18:11.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: You always want to answer that question but not give information out that they might use in a bad way.
[18:13.140 --> 18:14.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: They kept us there for a while.
[18:14.860 --> 18:21.990]  [SPEAKER_06]: Meanwhile, George Bush, Dick Cheney, Tom Ridge and some unidentified person were staring down at us.
[18:21.990 --> 18:23.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: They had these pictures.
[18:23.710 --> 18:26.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: Dick Cheney on the left and George W.
[18:26.660 --> 18:27.250]  [SPEAKER_00]: Bush on the right.
[18:28.020 --> 18:29.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: I would think it would be the opposite order.
[18:29.400 --> 18:31.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think you would put the head of the country to the left.
[18:32.080 --> 18:32.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think they did.
[18:32.440 --> 18:32.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: Because you read left to right.
[18:33.620 --> 18:33.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[18:34.470 --> 18:35.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: I guess maybe they did.
[18:35.470 --> 18:35.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: You're right.
[18:36.800 --> 18:38.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: And yeah, those pictures were staring down at us the whole time.
[18:38.970 --> 18:40.750]  [SPEAKER_00]: They also had, oh yeah, they had this amazing picture.
[18:40.820 --> 18:43.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: Of course, I couldn't take a picture of it because my camera was in the car.
[18:43.700 --> 18:46.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: And God only knows what they would have done if I tried to take a picture in that place.
[18:46.340 --> 18:52.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: Because they had this picture of the World Trade Center being hit by the terrorist planes.
[18:53.140 --> 18:54.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: Except they didn't have the terrorist planes.
[18:54.700 --> 18:56.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: They had the stars and stripes.
[18:56.920 --> 18:58.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: They had a flag in the background.
[18:58.360 --> 19:04.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: And it looked, in this picture, and if you want to see it for yourself, get pulled over in that particular station and go and look.
[19:04.680 --> 19:11.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: It looked like one of the red stripes of the flag was piercing the World Trade Center and causing it to explode.
[19:13.240 --> 19:17.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: I couldn't think of a better symbolic picture.
[19:17.780 --> 19:18.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they had it right there.
[19:19.780 --> 19:21.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, we were looking at that for a while.
[19:21.880 --> 19:23.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: And then they went out to search the car.
[19:23.400 --> 19:26.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: And that's the part that was kind of troublesome, don't you think?
[19:26.460 --> 19:27.200]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think so.
[19:27.540 --> 19:29.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: They searched the car without us being there.
[19:29.560 --> 19:36.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: When we got searched going into Canada, they were very careful to make sure that we were there at all times and we were watching everything they were doing.
[19:36.860 --> 19:39.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they were telling us what they were doing as they were doing it.
[19:39.220 --> 19:43.200]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they were kind of almost, you know, apologetic.
[19:43.680 --> 19:45.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: These guys, they said, you stay there.
[19:45.680 --> 19:49.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: And two of them went out and they searched through our car without us being able to watch what they were doing.
[19:50.200 --> 19:52.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I've been searched before in the United States.
[19:52.960 --> 19:55.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they always allowed you to see what was going on.
[19:55.940 --> 19:57.120]  [SPEAKER_00]: Who knows what these people were doing?
[19:57.200 --> 19:59.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: Who knows what they could have taken, what they could have planted?
[19:59.220 --> 20:01.300]  [SPEAKER_10]: Were you asked for permission to search your car?
[20:01.380 --> 20:02.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: No, we were not.
[20:02.320 --> 20:03.660]  [SPEAKER_05]: We were not asked for any permission.
[20:04.160 --> 20:07.900]  [SPEAKER_05]: You should complain at least about not observing them search the car.
[20:09.220 --> 20:13.820]  [SPEAKER_05]: Aside from the fact I'm going to say this on the radio, perhaps you should even lie and say things were taken.
[20:13.820 --> 20:16.520]  [SPEAKER_05]: But, of course, now that I've said that, they'll come back and get this tape.
[20:16.700 --> 20:20.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well, you see, that's my policy when I talk to people like this.
[20:20.360 --> 20:21.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: Never lie about anything.
[20:22.020 --> 20:29.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: Doesn't mean you have to volunteer information, but don't have things that you're trying to hide and, you know, look nervous as a result of it.
[20:29.020 --> 20:34.180]  [SPEAKER_10]: It's a felony besides to lie to a law enforcement official.
[20:34.760 --> 20:35.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: So if you say...
[20:35.460 --> 20:37.280]  [SPEAKER_10]: That's how they got Martha Stewart for just lying.
[20:37.420 --> 20:38.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: Federal level.
[20:39.060 --> 20:44.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: That means don't tell them you think they did a good job or anything like that because that is a lie and you could get in trouble for it.
[20:44.860 --> 20:46.720]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, seriously, you should complain to...
[20:46.720 --> 20:49.180]  [SPEAKER_05]: This was Border Patrol, INS, Homeland Security?
[20:49.420 --> 20:49.580]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[20:49.740 --> 20:51.120]  [SPEAKER_05]: That's what it says, Homeland Security now.
[20:51.280 --> 20:51.500]  [SPEAKER_05]: Right.
[20:52.080 --> 20:53.420]  [SPEAKER_05]: It's under Homeland Security.
[20:53.420 --> 20:56.000]  [SPEAKER_05]: You should complain and say, Hey, they searched my car.
[20:56.460 --> 20:57.040]  [SPEAKER_05]: I don't...
[20:57.040 --> 20:59.400]  [SPEAKER_05]: It turns out they didn't take anything, but they could have.
[20:59.660 --> 21:03.520]  [SPEAKER_05]: You know, why couldn't you just let me watch them search the car?
[21:03.680 --> 21:05.120]  [SPEAKER_06]: Jim, I'm one step ahead of you.
[21:05.300 --> 21:06.580]  [SPEAKER_06]: I'm one step ahead of you.
[21:07.620 --> 21:07.900]  [SPEAKER_06]: Go ahead.
[21:08.140 --> 21:09.220]  [SPEAKER_06]: I already wrote them a letter.
[21:09.400 --> 21:09.560]  [SPEAKER_06]: Good.
[21:09.700 --> 21:11.280]  [SPEAKER_06]: We'll report back if they reply.
[21:11.540 --> 21:14.360]  [SPEAKER_10]: It calls into the question the whole probable cause thing.
[21:14.420 --> 21:15.780]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, you were a U.S.
[21:15.840 --> 21:17.560]  [SPEAKER_10]: citizen on U.S.
[21:18.220 --> 21:19.300]  [SPEAKER_10]: in the U.S., right?
[21:19.680 --> 21:20.060]  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
[21:21.120 --> 21:22.300]  [SPEAKER_10]: And you were...
[21:22.300 --> 21:28.740]  [SPEAKER_10]: Your car was searched by law enforcement officials, and you were not asked for, nor did you give consent.
[21:29.580 --> 21:30.680]  [SPEAKER_10]: And that remains...
[21:30.680 --> 21:37.240]  [SPEAKER_10]: That leaves open the thing of whether there was probable cause that you had to believe that you had committed a crime.
[21:37.420 --> 21:41.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you know, they were confused by the whole credit card thing, and I'll give them that.
[21:41.220 --> 21:41.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: Fine.
[21:41.560 --> 21:42.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, you don't understand that.
[21:42.680 --> 21:43.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: I'll explain it to you.
[21:43.480 --> 21:44.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: You want to search the car?
[21:44.380 --> 21:45.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: I would even give consent.
[21:45.520 --> 21:49.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: I didn't like the fact that they were doing it without us being able to watch it.
[21:49.860 --> 21:51.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: Like, we were able to in the past.
[21:51.340 --> 21:53.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I tried several times to explain to them.
[21:53.580 --> 21:55.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, eventually I think they understood.
[21:55.540 --> 21:56.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: In fact, they might have understood the whole time.
[21:57.020 --> 22:03.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: If you're going to steal somebody's identity or commit credit card fraud, you don't carry all the different identities with you.
[22:03.280 --> 22:08.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: And you don't have the same account number as the person that you're trying to steal the identity with.
[22:08.860 --> 22:09.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: That's not how it works.
[22:09.960 --> 22:11.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they must know this.
[22:11.540 --> 22:19.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: And there was one time where one of the guys was coming up to me, and he just was asking me, have you ever been in trouble with the law for credit card fraud?
[22:19.800 --> 22:20.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I said, no.
[22:20.980 --> 22:28.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: And he just kept staring at me like I was going to crack under his, you know, Kojak stare or whatever he thought he was giving me.
[22:28.640 --> 22:30.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I just said again, no.
[22:32.100 --> 22:33.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: Go away now.
[22:33.100 --> 22:34.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: And he did.
[22:35.240 --> 22:41.120]  [SPEAKER_06]: Just to clarify on what Bernie said, when you're crossing the border, you have no rights, basically.
[22:41.880 --> 22:42.920]  [SPEAKER_06]: Your normal U.S.
[22:42.980 --> 22:45.980]  [SPEAKER_06]: citizen rights don't apply when you're at the border crossing legally.
[22:46.200 --> 22:49.820]  [SPEAKER_10]: I'm wondering, yeah, I'm wondering about that legal no man's land.
[22:49.960 --> 22:51.560]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, that's the first I've heard of that.
[22:52.300 --> 22:53.280]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, you're a U.S.
[22:53.680 --> 22:55.660]  [SPEAKER_10]: citizen in the United States.
[22:55.660 --> 22:56.320]  [SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm.
[22:57.740 --> 22:59.840]  [SPEAKER_10]: So do you relinquish?
[22:59.960 --> 23:06.740]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, is there a sign or something that says, like, once you cross this line, you agree to give up your Fourth Amendment rights?
[23:07.460 --> 23:09.540]  [SPEAKER_10]: I mean, did you see a sign that said something like that?
[23:09.640 --> 23:11.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: No, and I don't agree that that's true.
[23:11.720 --> 23:13.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think they're violating your rights.
[23:13.100 --> 23:13.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think so, too.
[23:13.820 --> 23:15.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't think you've given up your rights.
[23:15.040 --> 23:17.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think these people are just overstepping the boundaries.
[23:17.850 --> 23:24.640]  [SPEAKER_06]: Speaking purely legally rather than what actually makes sense, you have not yet entered the United States.
[23:24.640 --> 23:24.920]  [SPEAKER_06]: Ah.
[23:25.140 --> 23:28.260]  [SPEAKER_06]: And therefore, you do not have the legal rights.
[23:28.440 --> 23:32.380]  [SPEAKER_06]: Whether or not they have the moral right to be searching you for no good reason is another thing.
[23:32.380 --> 23:33.440]  [SPEAKER_06]: You were not in the United States.
[23:33.640 --> 23:34.180]  [SPEAKER_06]: Is that what you're saying?
[23:34.700 --> 23:36.100]  [SPEAKER_06]: In a legal sense, yes.
[23:36.300 --> 23:37.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: In a physical sense, we were.
[23:37.660 --> 23:37.800]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah.
[23:39.460 --> 23:42.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: And there was another thing, too, I did just to test the system.
[23:42.860 --> 23:44.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: Because I was very confident at that point.
[23:44.400 --> 23:45.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: I knew they weren't going to find anything.
[23:46.080 --> 23:47.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: I knew everything I was telling them was the truth.
[23:47.600 --> 23:49.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I knew eventually they had to let us into the damn country.
[23:50.700 --> 23:52.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: But I decided I wanted to go to the bathroom.
[23:53.200 --> 23:56.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, we were sitting there and nothing was happening.
[23:56.180 --> 23:56.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: They were searching our car.
[23:56.920 --> 23:58.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: I figured, you know, I'm going to go to the bathroom.
[23:58.580 --> 24:03.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: And as soon as I started walking to the bathroom, one of the officers who was left behind said, Sir, where are you going?
[24:03.380 --> 24:04.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: I said, I'm going to the bathroom.
[24:04.360 --> 24:05.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: Sir, please sit down.
[24:05.720 --> 24:07.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, I want to go to the bathroom.
[24:07.360 --> 24:08.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: Can I not go to the bathroom?
[24:08.880 --> 24:11.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: I have to check to make sure it's okay for you to go to the bathroom.
[24:12.120 --> 24:13.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: And so I asked, are we under arrest?
[24:14.560 --> 24:15.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: Are we being held here?
[24:15.860 --> 24:20.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: And she just ran out to ask the guys if it was okay for me to use the bathroom.
[24:20.700 --> 24:22.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: But to be honest, I didn't have to use the bathroom.
[24:22.700 --> 24:30.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: I wanted to see if this would be an issue, if they would actually try to keep me in one position where I couldn't move and they wanted to keep an eye on me at all times.
[24:30.300 --> 24:31.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: I was trying to assess the situation.
[24:31.860 --> 24:34.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: And eventually she came back and said, yes, it's okay, you can use the bathroom.
[24:34.860 --> 24:44.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: When I went in there, I just took a look around to see if they had cameras, to see if they had somebody watching over me, to see if they had any way of possibly monitoring somebody in that situation.
[24:44.260 --> 24:48.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: It also told me that they didn't think I was a drug mule that was going to flush the evidence.
[24:48.660 --> 24:57.660]  [SPEAKER_10]: If they thought that, they would have watched you go to the bathroom and the contents of your bowels would have gone into a special chute that was sprayed with water for inspection later.
[24:57.920 --> 25:01.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I would have noticed that too, and I would have commented on it, but that did not happen.
[25:02.440 --> 25:06.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I didn't notice anything inside that looked like it was a way of monitoring.
[25:06.940 --> 25:09.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: However, you know, they're very good at this kind of thing, so who knows.
[25:09.940 --> 25:18.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: And at the very end, when it was all over, after they had searched our car, I said to them, I hope we didn't cause too much confusion, which was my way of saying, boy, are you stupid?
[25:18.860 --> 25:20.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they said, oh, no, not at all.
[25:21.200 --> 25:22.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they were eager to get us out of there.
[25:23.020 --> 25:24.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: It was like, you know, this had never happened.
[25:24.840 --> 25:26.200]  [SPEAKER_00]: Please don't ever mention this to anybody.
[25:27.240 --> 25:30.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: So that was our little visit through customs on the way in.
[25:30.720 --> 25:35.780]  [SPEAKER_10]: Mike, I'm curious as to what your letter said and what you find out from this letter.
[25:36.160 --> 25:47.580]  [SPEAKER_06]: I will, if you really want, you and anyone else who emails OTH at 2600.com can receive a copy of my letter, and I will report on the show if they should say anything interesting in reply.
[25:48.440 --> 25:48.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[25:48.960 --> 25:50.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: We do have other things to discuss tonight.
[25:51.000 --> 25:54.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: First of all, one very quick piece of news.
[25:54.680 --> 25:57.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: You might have heard this, actually, if you're watching the Weather Channel or something.
[25:58.220 --> 26:00.880]  [SPEAKER_00]: There's a potential hurricane building up in the Gulf.
[26:01.560 --> 26:02.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: Bonnie.
[26:02.220 --> 26:02.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: Hurricane Bonnie.
[26:03.100 --> 26:08.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: If you recall Freedom Downtime, Hurricane Bonnie hit us in Wilmington, North Carolina.
[26:08.700 --> 26:15.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: For the past six years, this storm has been apparently back in the Gulf, and it's reared its ugly head again.
[26:15.900 --> 26:18.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: And now it's heading right for the United States.
[26:18.220 --> 26:20.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: I had no idea that storms...
[26:21.260 --> 26:24.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you know, the big spot on Jupiter is a storm.
[26:24.240 --> 26:26.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: That's been around for hundreds of years, so I guess it's possible.
[26:26.360 --> 26:30.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: But, yes, Hurricane Bonnie may be back, so be careful.
[26:31.040 --> 26:34.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: I've seen the storm firsthand, and it's something you don't want to mess with.
[26:35.100 --> 26:39.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: And it's also the name of Kevin Mitnick's ex-wife, just in case anybody forgot that fact.
[26:40.760 --> 26:43.820]  [SPEAKER_05]: I hate to break this to you, but they reused the names.
[26:45.700 --> 26:46.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: They reused...
[26:46.580 --> 26:47.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: Why would they reused the names?
[26:47.900 --> 26:48.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: That's really silly.
[26:48.360 --> 26:52.540]  [SPEAKER_05]: Unless it's really a gigantic storm, they reused the names.
[26:52.960 --> 26:54.000]  [SPEAKER_05]: Okay, well, that's...
[26:54.000 --> 26:54.640]  [SPEAKER_05]: Who's to say?
[26:54.760 --> 26:59.900]  [SPEAKER_10]: You know, I'm looking at a map of Bonnie right now, and it's, like, right over Cuba.
[26:59.900 --> 27:02.860]  [SPEAKER_10]: But you never hear, when we listen to U.S.
[27:02.980 --> 27:06.140]  [SPEAKER_10]: weather forecasts, they pretend that Cuba doesn't even exist.
[27:06.500 --> 27:13.560]  [SPEAKER_10]: You know, typically the weathercaster will, like, stand in front of the map, like, blocking out Cuba so you can't see it.
[27:13.680 --> 27:17.760]  [SPEAKER_10]: And they won't mention anything about all the death and destruction the hurricane is causing in Cuba.
[27:17.900 --> 27:20.900]  [SPEAKER_10]: They only mention, like, Florida and the other Caribbean islands.
[27:21.020 --> 27:21.560]  [SPEAKER_10]: You ever notice that?
[27:21.580 --> 27:30.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, actually, Bernie, that's not entirely true, because if it does cause massive death and destruction to Cuba, we will focus on all the suffering Cubans and how they wouldn't be suffering if they were only an American state.
[27:30.900 --> 27:32.520]  [SPEAKER_10]: And then the hurricane would avoid them.
[27:32.620 --> 27:32.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
[27:32.980 --> 27:33.220]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yes.
[27:34.020 --> 27:35.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: Or something like that.
[27:35.680 --> 27:39.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: We had a 2600 meeting last Friday, as we do the first Friday of every month.
[27:39.780 --> 27:41.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: This one was rather unusual.
[27:42.830 --> 27:44.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: It was alfresco, was it not?
[27:44.700 --> 27:46.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: It was alfresco, all right, but...
[27:46.420 --> 27:47.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, boy.
[27:47.380 --> 27:50.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, well, as we've been discussing...
[27:50.300 --> 27:51.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: No, wait, we haven't been discussing.
[27:51.640 --> 27:52.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: We haven't been on the air since this happened.
[27:53.340 --> 28:03.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: The whole craziness with the new terror threat hitting the financial buildings, because apparently somebody took pictures of the buildings a couple of years ago, and they showed up someplace.
[28:04.260 --> 28:05.020]  [SPEAKER_04]: Pakistan, I think.
[28:05.360 --> 28:05.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[28:06.380 --> 28:07.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: Apparently that's the way to get attention.
[28:07.700 --> 28:11.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: If you take a picture of a building and send it to Pakistan, all hell will break loose.
[28:11.860 --> 28:22.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: So they closed out the atrium, which is where we have our meetings, in the Citigroup building, not before they had a press conference.
[28:22.180 --> 28:22.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: Is that right, Bernie?
[28:23.040 --> 28:23.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: Several.
[28:23.880 --> 28:25.540]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yes, there were several press conferences.
[28:25.540 --> 28:41.200]  [SPEAKER_10]: In fact, I believe the First Lady and Mayor Bloomsburg and Tom Ridge actually sat in the atrium the day after the announcement to reassure everyone that the atrium and the Citicorp Center was a safe place to be, and then they promptly closed it off to everybody.
[28:41.780 --> 28:42.240]  [SPEAKER_05]: Unbelievable.
[28:42.740 --> 28:44.700]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, the first press conference was Monday.
[28:44.960 --> 28:49.400]  [SPEAKER_05]: That was Laura Bush and her two daughters and the governor.
[28:50.080 --> 28:52.860]  [SPEAKER_05]: The next day it was Tom Ridge and the mayor.
[28:53.800 --> 29:00.140]  [SPEAKER_05]: And then they decided that the high-profile people have been there, let's not tempt fate, and they threw everybody out.
[29:00.920 --> 29:09.420]  [SPEAKER_04]: Because when I called them to find out about the meeting, I mean, if it would be open, and they said, oh, yeah, no problem, it's open, and it was closed.
[29:09.600 --> 29:13.120]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you know, part of the problem is that you don't know who to call in that place.
[29:13.140 --> 29:16.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's very difficult to find somebody who's actually in charge.
[29:16.440 --> 29:25.900]  [SPEAKER_05]: Now, I think this is perhaps getting ahead of the story and everything, but I was thinking we should find a lawyer who specializes in buildings and landmark law.
[29:26.620 --> 29:29.320]  [SPEAKER_05]: You may say, what, Jim has gone off the deep end?
[29:29.400 --> 29:30.000]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, maybe so.
[29:30.200 --> 29:30.840]  [SPEAKER_05]: I've said that before.
[29:31.180 --> 29:32.140]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, yeah, exactly.
[29:32.260 --> 29:32.960]  [SPEAKER_05]: It hasn't stopped me.
[29:33.020 --> 29:34.240]  [SPEAKER_05]: You've been in the water for a while.
[29:37.420 --> 29:38.780]  [SPEAKER_05]: But the point is this.
[29:39.200 --> 29:43.800]  [SPEAKER_05]: Citibank got a variance to build that tall because of a public atrium.
[29:43.980 --> 29:46.220]  [SPEAKER_05]: If the atrium is closed, it is not there.
[29:46.360 --> 29:49.160]  [SPEAKER_05]: If it is not there, they should tear down that building.
[29:49.380 --> 29:50.000]  [SPEAKER_05]: Let's sue.
[29:50.080 --> 29:50.880]  [SPEAKER_05]: Close the whole building.
[29:50.980 --> 29:52.180]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, close the whole building.
[29:52.180 --> 29:53.000]  [SPEAKER_05]: We must sue.
[29:53.160 --> 29:58.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: In all fairness, is this Citigroup doing this, or are they being ordered to do this by the government?
[29:58.800 --> 29:59.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: Irrelevant.
[29:59.720 --> 30:00.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: Why is that irrelevant?
[30:00.680 --> 30:01.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's not irrelevant.
[30:01.420 --> 30:06.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, if they're not allowed to open, you can't really blame them for not being open.
[30:06.980 --> 30:08.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: You can blame the government for forcing them not to be open.
[30:09.120 --> 30:10.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: I can and do blame them.
[30:11.580 --> 30:17.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we had the meeting on Friday, and it was a very bizarre meeting because we had to stand outside the whole time.
[30:17.420 --> 30:18.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: There were cops.
[30:18.560 --> 30:19.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: There were security people.
[30:19.900 --> 30:22.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: There were guys walking around with machine guns.
[30:23.120 --> 30:23.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: Cops.
[30:23.560 --> 30:25.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: Not just people, random citizens.
[30:26.480 --> 30:29.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: I can just see the parents out there freaking out whose kids go to these meetings.
[30:30.860 --> 30:32.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: And it was extremely weird.
[30:32.660 --> 30:33.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, people at the meeting were great.
[30:33.980 --> 30:36.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: Everybody was having a good time, doing what we usually do.
[30:36.900 --> 30:43.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I do have to also give credit to the cops because they didn't harass us in any way.
[30:44.040 --> 30:46.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I was expecting something to happen.
[30:46.500 --> 30:54.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: Red Hack, you fell asleep at one point sitting on the wall, which I was sure they were going to say something about who's this vagrant sleeping on the wall there.
[30:54.400 --> 30:55.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: We even have a picture of it.
[30:55.880 --> 30:56.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they didn't.
[30:56.740 --> 30:58.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: They turned a blind eye to that.
[30:58.620 --> 30:59.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: There was an incident.
[30:59.780 --> 31:04.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: I got involved in an incident within five minutes of the meeting beginning because I took a picture of the building.
[31:04.700 --> 31:07.140]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, I think you intentionally got involved.
[31:07.200 --> 31:11.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, again, I was testing the limits to see just what I was going to be told not to do.
[31:12.020 --> 31:17.120]  [SPEAKER_00]: I took a picture, and sure enough, an employee of Citigroup said, you can't do that.
[31:17.220 --> 31:17.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: Don't take a picture.
[31:17.800 --> 31:19.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I'm standing on a sidewalk.
[31:19.960 --> 31:21.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm standing on a sidewalk taking a picture of a building.
[31:22.100 --> 31:24.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I said, of course I have the right to take a picture of a building.
[31:25.280 --> 31:30.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: And then a minute later, a cop walked over to me and said, they don't want you to take a picture of the building.
[31:31.100 --> 31:37.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: I said, yeah, I know they don't want me to, but what I'm saying is I have the right to take a picture of the building despite the fact that they don't want me to.
[31:38.060 --> 31:39.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: And he nodded his head and walked away.
[31:40.680 --> 31:43.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, we understood each other on that level, which was a good thing.
[31:43.840 --> 31:49.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I think that's important for people to be testing the system to make sure it's not abusing their rights that way.
[31:49.560 --> 31:52.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, we have a lot of reports coming in of people...
[31:52.480 --> 31:56.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: There's this guy in Queens who was arrested because he videotaped buildings.
[31:57.540 --> 32:04.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: He's in federal custody right now in North Carolina after being caught videotaping buildings and transportation systems in several U.S.
[32:04.480 --> 32:04.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: cities.
[32:04.960 --> 32:06.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: His name is Kamran Akhtar.
[32:07.360 --> 32:10.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: They say so far they haven't found any ties to terrorism.
[32:11.420 --> 32:15.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: And the law enforcement officials are defining him as a video buff.
[32:17.560 --> 32:25.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: But he's in custody because apparently he gave, as Bernie was pointing out, a conflicting statement to a federal official.
[32:25.780 --> 32:28.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: And if you do something like that, they'll go after you.
[32:28.320 --> 32:29.280]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, not exactly.
[32:30.560 --> 32:33.180]  [SPEAKER_05]: The guy was in, I believe, Charlotte, North Carolina.
[32:34.120 --> 32:35.960]  [SPEAKER_05]: And he was...
[32:36.880 --> 32:39.400]  [SPEAKER_05]: I saw the cop that arrested him on TV last night.
[32:39.520 --> 32:43.600]  [SPEAKER_05]: The cop, I believe, said he was in an automobile taking videotapes.
[32:43.680 --> 32:44.800]  [SPEAKER_05]: And the cop said, what's up?
[32:44.800 --> 32:47.220]  [SPEAKER_05]: And he gave conflicting stories to the cop.
[32:47.340 --> 32:48.080]  [SPEAKER_05]: The cop hauled him in.
[32:48.160 --> 32:56.940]  [SPEAKER_05]: It turns out he's an illegal alien who's been here 16 years and overstayed his deportation order by six years.
[32:57.380 --> 33:02.420]  [SPEAKER_05]: That's why he's in federal lockup now, because he overstayed a deportation order.
[33:03.520 --> 33:07.380]  [SPEAKER_05]: The New York cops have no record of him.
[33:07.380 --> 33:10.120]  [SPEAKER_05]: And they're of the opinion he's a video buff.
[33:10.320 --> 33:20.050]  [SPEAKER_05]: But yet, the descriptions of the videos seem to suggest that they're all landmarks and financial institution buildings in various cities throughout the South.
[33:21.160 --> 33:28.840]  [SPEAKER_05]: Dams in Texas, the governor's mansion, assorted buildings in Texas, Carolinas, and such wise.
[33:29.040 --> 33:29.860]  [SPEAKER_05]: So I don't know.
[33:29.940 --> 33:30.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: This could go either way.
[33:30.740 --> 33:40.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, the way the story is being reported throughout the media is that he was arrested after videotaping buildings or for videotaping buildings.
[33:40.360 --> 33:50.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: So the effect that has on the average person who isn't violating any laws, who isn't an illegal alien, is that if I start taking pictures of buildings, I'm going to get in trouble.
[33:50.380 --> 33:51.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm not going to take pictures of buildings.
[33:51.800 --> 33:54.640]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, that's the intention of the news media in this case.
[33:54.640 --> 33:57.260]  [SPEAKER_05]: They are trying to tie it in.
[33:57.260 --> 33:57.920]  [SPEAKER_05]: Why is that their intention?
[33:58.540 --> 34:02.540]  [SPEAKER_05]: They're trying to tie it in to all the other news that's going on.
[34:02.700 --> 34:09.620]  [SPEAKER_05]: If it's just video buff gets arrested because he overstayed his detention order, it's two paragraphs on page eight.
[34:11.310 --> 34:17.140]  [SPEAKER_05]: Whereas it's a big story that'll sell papers if it's another terrorist caught, perhaps?
[34:17.930 --> 34:22.160]  [SPEAKER_10]: Maybe the media wants a monopoly on taking videos.
[34:22.620 --> 34:24.450]  [SPEAKER_00]: That's not impossible, too, actually.
[34:24.640 --> 34:29.390]  [SPEAKER_00]: The point is, taking pictures of a building is not, never has been, and never will be a threat.
[34:29.680 --> 34:30.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: All right?
[34:30.320 --> 34:32.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe terrorists do take pictures.
[34:32.140 --> 34:34.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: But, you know, terrorists do all sorts of things that average people do as well.
[34:34.910 --> 34:40.450]  [SPEAKER_00]: You cannot allow this to stop you from doing things that are completely within your rights.
[34:41.180 --> 34:43.370]  [SPEAKER_00]: And that's why people should continue to take pictures.
[34:43.450 --> 34:52.930]  [SPEAKER_00]: In fact, I think people should en masse go out and start taking pictures of these bridges and buildings and whatnot just to...
[34:52.930 --> 34:54.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: What's that beep?
[34:54.080 --> 34:55.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's Bernie.
[34:55.560 --> 34:56.350]  [SPEAKER_00]: Are you beeping, Bernie?
[34:56.460 --> 34:57.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: Stop that.
[34:57.800 --> 34:59.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: People should be taking pictures.
[34:59.390 --> 35:06.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: Bus loads of people should descend on financial buildings and bridges and dams and whatever else, and people should snap away.
[35:06.910 --> 35:10.720]  [SPEAKER_10]: Don't forget the Amtrak, the current still-running Amtrak contest.
[35:12.000 --> 35:13.850]  [SPEAKER_10]: I think it's called See Yourself on a Train.
[35:14.140 --> 35:14.820]  [SPEAKER_10]: And you can...
[35:14.820 --> 35:19.820]  [SPEAKER_10]: Whoever takes the best pictures of Amtrak trains can win, like, a nationwide trip on Amtrak.
[35:19.950 --> 35:20.520]  [SPEAKER_10]: It's still running.
[35:20.740 --> 35:20.930]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[35:21.140 --> 35:22.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: And take pictures of subways.
[35:22.850 --> 35:23.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: Inside the subway.
[35:23.700 --> 35:24.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: Outside the subway.
[35:24.460 --> 35:35.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: There are no laws prohibiting you from taking pictures on a public city street or in any part of non-private property.
[35:35.540 --> 35:39.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now, I know people are going to say Emmanuel's advocating terrorism by telling people to take pictures.
[35:40.480 --> 35:41.930]  [SPEAKER_00]: And people will say that.
[35:41.930 --> 35:46.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: But, um, I think, you know, we have to stand up for what little rights we have left.
[35:47.760 --> 35:53.830]  [SPEAKER_05]: Another thing we should possibly do is, uh, we should pick at the, uh, the tip of Manhattan.
[35:54.350 --> 36:00.180]  [SPEAKER_05]: Because I don't know if people out in the rest of America know this, but the stump of liberty has reopened.
[36:00.660 --> 36:03.560]  [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, that's what some people are calling the Statue of Liberty.
[36:03.750 --> 36:18.060]  [SPEAKER_05]: Because now, although, uh, you can go on the island, which you could, uh, after 9-11, you can also now go into the base of the statue and look through a glass ceiling at the stairs that you're no longer allowed to climb.
[36:18.290 --> 36:20.870]  [SPEAKER_05]: Wait, do you mean they opened the Statue of Liberty, but they didn't open the stairs?
[36:21.460 --> 36:22.430]  [SPEAKER_05]: They opened the base.
[36:22.580 --> 36:23.980]  [SPEAKER_05]: You can't go up the Statue of Liberty?
[36:24.120 --> 36:25.200]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, you can go into the base.
[36:25.330 --> 36:26.810]  [SPEAKER_10]: You can get under her skirt, that's it.
[36:27.250 --> 36:32.060]  [SPEAKER_04]: And, and even for that, don't you need to give them, like, two forms of ID and go through a bomb-sniffing machine?
[36:32.060 --> 36:32.410]  [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, yeah.
[36:32.600 --> 36:36.500]  [SPEAKER_05]: Uh, remember we talked about that Amtrak station in New Carrollton, Maryland...
[36:36.500 --> 36:38.370]  [SPEAKER_05]: New Carrollton, Maryland...
[36:38.370 --> 36:38.480]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yes.
[36:38.480 --> 36:42.560]  [SPEAKER_05]: ...which had the puffer, the device that smells you, to see if you've got explosives?
[36:42.790 --> 36:45.450]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, they've got one of those on Liberty Island now.
[36:46.040 --> 36:46.270]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yep.
[36:46.580 --> 36:47.410]  [SPEAKER_05]: How about that?
[36:47.600 --> 36:47.810]  [SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.
[36:48.450 --> 37:06.660]  [SPEAKER_05]: So, uh, what I was thinking is, we buy fireworks in North Carolina or someplace, take them apart, and just after it rains, uh, the evening before, just before sunrise, around the Statue of Liberty, where the line will form for Liberty Island, just throw the gunpowder on the ground in the puddles.
[37:06.660 --> 37:08.790]  [SPEAKER_05]: So people, traipse through the puzzle...
[37:08.790 --> 37:12.950]  [SPEAKER_00]: You see, you're going, you're going to measures that I think are well beyond what we need to go to.
[37:14.120 --> 37:14.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh...
[37:14.560 --> 37:15.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: Just don't do that in an airport.
[37:15.520 --> 37:16.850]  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm saying pictures.
[37:17.160 --> 37:18.890]  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know about throwing gunpowder into puddles.
[37:19.060 --> 37:21.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm taking pictures of buildings and bridges and monuments.
[37:21.680 --> 37:21.850]  [SPEAKER_00]: No, no, no, no.
[37:21.910 --> 37:23.850]  [SPEAKER_05]: But the point is, it'll get on people's shoes.
[37:24.000 --> 37:26.960]  [SPEAKER_05]: The puffer will detect this on thousand people.
[37:27.550 --> 37:30.120]  [SPEAKER_05]: I think it's a great, a great bit of, uh, of protest.
[37:30.600 --> 37:32.600]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, you, you, you can say that, I guess.
[37:32.680 --> 37:33.930]  [SPEAKER_05]: It's just a theoretical idea.
[37:34.200 --> 37:40.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: Anyway, the point is, with, with these meetings that we have once a month, they're, it's going to get kind of inconvenient when the weather starts getting bad.
[37:41.020 --> 37:42.330]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, and who knows?
[37:42.520 --> 37:44.930]  [SPEAKER_00]: They kept the Statue of Liberty, uh, closed for almost three years.
[37:45.310 --> 37:52.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, maybe they're going to close the atrium of the Citigroup building, and, uh, we'll have to meet out in the street every time with, with gun-toting cops everywhere.
[37:53.140 --> 37:56.330]  [SPEAKER_00]: We don't need this, and I think we need to get to the bottom of it.
[37:56.960 --> 38:00.390]  [SPEAKER_00]: I've tracked down a phone number for Citigroup, all right?
[38:00.500 --> 38:08.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I called them several times, have yet to get a call back, have yet to get any kind of a comment from them as to just what the, um, what the plan is.
[38:08.250 --> 38:13.350]  [SPEAKER_00]: I've heard a rumor that they're going to reopen it next Monday, maybe, but that rumor comes from one of the employees inside.
[38:14.950 --> 38:15.310]  [SPEAKER_04]: Um...
[38:15.310 --> 38:17.730]  [SPEAKER_04]: Do you still have the number for their security line I gave you?
[38:17.830 --> 38:22.330]  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't have that number because that number really isn't going anywhere that anybody can answer questions.
[38:22.870 --> 38:25.910]  [SPEAKER_00]: This number, they can answer questions, but they just aren't doing it.
[38:25.910 --> 38:29.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, it's 212-751-1007.
[38:29.950 --> 38:36.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: If you call that number, you'll get somebody at Citigroup, and, uh, maybe they'll, they'll answer your question, maybe they won't.
[38:36.310 --> 38:37.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: Maybe they'll call you back, maybe they won't.
[38:39.180 --> 38:39.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: We need to know.
[38:40.100 --> 38:42.730]  [SPEAKER_00]: We need to know if this, uh, public space is going to be open.
[38:43.500 --> 38:46.450]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, um, we need to put pressure on them to, uh, to stop this nonsense.
[38:46.620 --> 38:48.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: There is no new threat.
[38:48.250 --> 38:50.120]  [SPEAKER_00]: This is, uh, something from several years ago.
[38:51.100 --> 38:53.810]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, uh, you know, threats exist all over the place.
[38:53.810 --> 38:58.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, we're told to live our lives normally, and then this kind of thing happens, and we can't.
[38:58.810 --> 39:01.250]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, um, let us know if you, if you find anything.
[39:01.310 --> 39:07.270]  [SPEAKER_00]: Also, you know, if you have any good pictures, I don't want to start too much trouble here, but, uh, you know, people have the right to take pictures.
[39:07.390 --> 39:10.330]  [SPEAKER_00]: People have the right to, to document things in public spaces.
[39:10.330 --> 39:13.310]  [SPEAKER_00]: If you have pictures of buildings and bridges, send them on in.
[39:13.540 --> 39:15.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: And we'll put them on the website if we get enough of them.
[39:15.480 --> 39:17.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: And then people don't have to take pictures anymore.
[39:17.790 --> 39:20.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: And they'll be there, and everybody can inspect them.
[39:20.680 --> 39:36.290]  [SPEAKER_10]: Manuel, uh, I just want to touch briefly on the, the rationale behind closing, uh, closing all these buildings or for this whole security scare was, was because, uh, supposedly this, uh, this guy in Pakistan was found to have, uh, have all these pictures on his,
[39:36.290 --> 39:37.290]  [SPEAKER_10]: uh, laptop hard drive.
[39:37.330 --> 39:57.980]  [SPEAKER_10]: And I've heard the media repeatedly report this guy as an Al-Qaeda-affiliated computer engineer who was, who was supposedly, uh, coordinating secure communications between Al-Qaeda leadership, um, via encrypted email or other encrypted messaging, uh, methods.
[39:58.660 --> 40:05.120]  [SPEAKER_10]: Um, it seems to me that if someone was, was doing that, why wouldn't they just encrypt their hard drive?
[40:05.540 --> 40:12.040]  [SPEAKER_10]: And, uh, you know, because obviously they would be suspecting they could be a target of, uh, you know, investigation.
[40:12.040 --> 40:20.960]  [SPEAKER_10]: But, I don't know, it just seems pretty illogical to me that this guy was supposedly a computer engineer, security expert for secure communications, and he doesn't encrypt any of the files on his hard drive.
[40:21.120 --> 40:21.410]  [SPEAKER_10]: Mm-hmm.
[40:21.460 --> 40:23.660]  [SPEAKER_10]: It just, it just, it just, totally illogical.
[40:23.830 --> 40:25.160]  [SPEAKER_10]: So, I think the story's made up.
[40:25.270 --> 40:29.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: Now there's some doubt that he's even that, that he's even, uh, any kind of a consultant at all.
[40:30.180 --> 40:36.390]  [SPEAKER_10]: Well, I, I question this story at all, and the timing of it, right after the, the Democratic National Convention.
[40:37.200 --> 40:39.680]  [SPEAKER_10]: Um, it just, the whole thing just seems to smell rotten.
[40:39.680 --> 40:43.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: And you can only imagine what kinds of things are going to be introduced in the, in the couple of weeks ahead.
[40:43.640 --> 40:49.770]  [SPEAKER_00]: We have the Republican Convention, which will be taking place, what, uh, is it two weeks from now, or is it, uh, three weeks from now?
[40:49.980 --> 40:50.450]  [SPEAKER_00]: Two weeks.
[40:50.600 --> 40:52.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: Two weeks from now, at this time.
[40:52.390 --> 40:54.750]  [SPEAKER_00]: Twenty, twenty-eighth, twenty-ninth, something like that.
[40:54.930 --> 40:56.830]  [SPEAKER_00]: There's going to be a, uh, convention in this town.
[40:56.830 --> 41:02.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: We, we happen to have, uh, some events that our listeners might be interested in, that was leaked to us by a friendly listener.
[41:02.290 --> 41:15.230]  [SPEAKER_00]: And again, if you have things to give to us, please, you can either email them to us, othat2600.com, or mail them to us at, uh, off the hook care of WBAI, 120, Walt, do you have something to say to interrupt the address?
[41:15.390 --> 41:15.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: Go ahead.
[41:15.930 --> 41:16.810]  [SPEAKER_00]: I have to start again now.
[41:17.060 --> 41:23.370]  [SPEAKER_00]: Off the hook care of WBAI, 120 Wall Street, 10th floor, New York, New York.
[41:23.370 --> 41:26.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: 1-0-0-0-5.
[41:26.410 --> 41:32.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, Jim, we got a piece of email that, uh, a confused listener, uh, wrote in.
[41:32.660 --> 41:34.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't want to say confused, but maybe an agitated listener.
[41:35.320 --> 41:39.810]  [SPEAKER_00]: Um, he actually wanted us to reply an email about this, but I think it's something that we should talk about on the air.
[41:40.140 --> 41:44.200]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, how come you can't have one person read the entire address if someone wants to send mail?
[41:44.520 --> 41:48.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: The zip code is always read by a different person than reads the rest of the address.
[41:49.040 --> 42:01.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: And I can understand why this might upset some people, but you have to understand that there's, uh, what we have here is something called compartmentalization, where certain bits of information are in the domain of some people and other people, uh, it's,
[42:01.040 --> 42:02.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: it's done for everybody's security, actually.
[42:02.750 --> 42:02.830]  [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[42:02.890 --> 42:06.390]  [SPEAKER_00]: If Al-Qaeda or, or someone else captures us...
[42:06.390 --> 42:07.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: I won't know the zip code.
[42:07.580 --> 42:08.450]  [SPEAKER_00]: You won't know the address.
[42:08.730 --> 42:08.950]  [SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.
[42:09.180 --> 42:10.370]  [SPEAKER_00]: And that's the way I think we should...
[42:10.370 --> 42:16.810]  [SPEAKER_10]: The studio there is known as a SCIF, which is a CIA acronym for Secure Compartmentalized Information Facility.
[42:16.960 --> 42:17.120]  [SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.
[42:17.850 --> 42:23.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: And this is necessary for the protection of our listeners and the staff, and of course everybody in this fine city of ours.
[42:24.040 --> 42:29.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: And that's, uh, I think you'll find, if you listen to other radio shows in, in the city, that's how everybody else does it.
[42:30.200 --> 42:33.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: Go ahead, listen, when you hear the address, it's, it's, it's mandated, it's required.
[42:33.960 --> 42:34.200]  [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[42:34.330 --> 42:35.290]  [SPEAKER_00]: We have to do it that way.
[42:35.390 --> 42:35.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[42:35.520 --> 42:38.890]  [SPEAKER_05]: All these, all these other stations are, are, are in danger.
[42:39.580 --> 42:44.730]  [SPEAKER_05]: If, if, if you know what hits the fan, only WBAI will remain as your source of information.
[42:45.140 --> 42:45.430]  [SPEAKER_05]: Why?
[42:45.660 --> 42:47.330]  [SPEAKER_05]: Because we're organized in cells.
[42:47.580 --> 42:52.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: I hope that puts an end to all the questioning, because it's really, you know, it's really a burden to all these questions.
[42:53.250 --> 42:55.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, Red Hack, you had something to interrupt with a second ago.
[42:55.500 --> 43:01.040]  [SPEAKER_04]: There was also, I remember Mike, uh, gave us a copy on Friday of the, the, the, the protesters' guide to the RNC.
[43:01.180 --> 43:02.600]  [SPEAKER_04]: Is there anywhere where people can get that?
[43:02.660 --> 43:03.980]  [SPEAKER_04]: Because that had a lot of the events also.
[43:03.980 --> 43:14.160]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, the, the folks who put this together, I'm really impressed with how, how beautifully this map of, uh, of Manhattan with, with interesting spots for RNC protesters came out.
[43:14.680 --> 43:24.790]  [SPEAKER_06]: Their website is rncguide.com, and, uh, if you go there and, uh, you can poke around, there's a PDF up there, I think, and there's probably some way to get a paper copy.
[43:24.850 --> 43:30.830]  [SPEAKER_00]: If you're lucky enough to have a paper copy, it's something you'll, you'll hold dear to your heart for many years to come if it's not ripped out of your hands by a cop.
[43:31.380 --> 43:38.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: Um, now, uh, Red Hat, you have, you have, uh, a list of some, uh, some, uh, things that are going on.
[43:38.160 --> 43:40.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: You want to pick a couple at random, and, uh, maybe we can spread more of them later.
[43:41.250 --> 43:43.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay, um...
[43:43.100 --> 43:44.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: These are RNC events.
[43:45.860 --> 43:46.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: Right.
[43:47.400 --> 43:47.730]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh...
[43:47.730 --> 43:49.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: Or, Jim, if you want to read one, since...
[43:49.640 --> 43:52.000]  [SPEAKER_05]: I, you know, I, I, I, I'm a Republican.
[43:52.200 --> 43:53.420]  [SPEAKER_05]: I, I can't, uh...
[43:53.420 --> 43:56.120]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, just because you're going to all these things doesn't mean that we can't as well.
[43:56.120 --> 43:57.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: Hey, I was invited.
[44:01.560 --> 44:11.620]  [SPEAKER_06]: All right, well, I would just like to invite our, our listeners, uh, to, to, to an event on Thursday, September 2nd, uh, hosted by, hosted by the New York delegation.
[44:12.180 --> 44:20.840]  [SPEAKER_06]: It'll be at Madame Tussard's The Wax Museum, which is, uh, 234 West 42nd, near 7th Avenue, uh, from 5 to 7 p.m.
[44:20.920 --> 44:22.460]  [SPEAKER_06]: And it, it sounds like a fun party.
[44:22.580 --> 44:24.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: How will you be able to tell the Republicans from The Wax Figures?
[44:25.680 --> 44:26.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
[44:28.100 --> 44:29.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: I'm so nasty.
[44:29.660 --> 44:31.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, don't you guys have anything that you want to share?
[44:31.860 --> 44:33.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: Red Hike, you look perplexed.
[44:33.560 --> 44:35.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: They're all so good, or are they all so bad?
[44:36.840 --> 44:37.680]  [SPEAKER_04]: I'm, I'm reading.
[44:38.460 --> 44:40.240]  [SPEAKER_04]: I want, I want, I want to pick a good one.
[44:40.260 --> 44:41.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, you know what, just jump in with something.
[44:41.620 --> 44:43.520]  [SPEAKER_05]: Don't, don't mention the ones I'm going to, okay?
[44:44.020 --> 44:44.200]  [SPEAKER_05]: All right.
[44:44.600 --> 44:45.380]  [SPEAKER_05]: Which ones are you going to?
[44:45.660 --> 44:46.640]  [SPEAKER_05]: The ones with the stars.
[44:46.920 --> 44:47.660]  [SPEAKER_05]: The ones with the stars.
[44:48.620 --> 44:51.220]  [SPEAKER_05]: The asterisks, you mean, or, or the, the, the luminaries?
[44:51.600 --> 44:52.660]  [SPEAKER_05]: No, well, that too.
[44:53.480 --> 44:56.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: All right, well, uh, we're going to take phone calls 212-209-295.
[44:56.380 --> 44:59.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: But I also wanted to mention, the Olympics are coming up later this week.
[44:59.280 --> 45:00.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: Boy, everything's happening at once.
[45:00.800 --> 45:02.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, uh, oh boy.
[45:02.280 --> 45:03.880]  [SPEAKER_00]: You want to talk about, uh, security.
[45:04.440 --> 45:08.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: Uh, if you're going to the Olympics, you'd better be careful what you say and do in public.
[45:09.420 --> 45:11.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: Software will be watching and listening.
[45:11.780 --> 45:21.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: Recent leaps in technology have paired highly sophisticated software with street surveillance cameras to create digital security guards with intelligence-gathering skills.
[45:21.600 --> 45:29.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: It is a very vast network and it is the first time it is being done on such a scale at an international level, according to a Greek police spokesman.
[45:29.040 --> 45:44.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: The system, developed by a consortium led by San Diego-based Science Applications International Corp, or SAAC, cost about $312 million and took up a sizable chunk of Athens' record security budget of more than $1.5 billion.
[45:44.320 --> 45:58.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: It gathers images and audio from an electronic web of over 1,000 high-resolution and infrared cameras, 12 patrol boats, 4,000 vehicles, 9 helicopters, a sensor-laden blimp, and 4 mobile command centers.
[45:59.360 --> 46:14.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: Spoken words collected by the cameras, yes, I said that, spoken words collected by the cameras, with speech recognition software, are transcribed into text that is then searched for patterns, along with other electronic communications entering and leaving the area,
[46:14.260 --> 46:16.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: including email and image files.
[46:16.420 --> 46:19.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: The system, which includes components already used by U.S.
[46:19.640 --> 46:26.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: and British government intelligence agencies, covers all of Greater Athens, Nine Ports, airports, and all other Olympic cities.
[46:26.160 --> 46:31.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: Can you imagine they have to scan all the different languages that must be spoken there for various words and phrases?
[46:32.060 --> 46:33.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's really, uh...
[46:33.220 --> 46:38.820]  [SPEAKER_10]: They spent, Emmanuel, well over $50 million for security at this event.
[46:39.320 --> 46:40.580]  [SPEAKER_10]: That's a lot of money.
[46:40.580 --> 46:41.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: It is a lot of money.
[46:41.720 --> 46:51.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: And according to this here, they can distinguish the sound of a flat tire from an explosion or a gunshot and inform the user at the command center of the incident.
[46:51.940 --> 46:57.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: This is also the case with any anomaly in the picture, such as a traffic jam.
[46:58.580 --> 47:09.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: Technology also allows the users of the system at the main command center to save and analyze data from the surveillance network and beyond, and the material from the closed-circuit cameras is kept for seven days.
[47:09.040 --> 47:09.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, right.
[47:11.200 --> 47:13.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: So specific incidents can be analyzed in depth.
[47:14.120 --> 47:16.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: They're going to have this for years, and they're probably going to keep it installed.
[47:17.780 --> 47:26.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: Much of the analysis is enabled by software from London-based Autonomy Corporation, whose clients include the United States National Security Agency.
[47:26.160 --> 47:31.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: They parse words and phrases collected by surveillance cameras and in communications traffic.
[47:31.560 --> 47:32.320]  [SPEAKER_00]: They've been doing it for years.
[47:33.180 --> 47:38.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: In June, the Greek government expanded surveillance powers to screen mobile and fixed-line telephone calls during the Olympics.
[47:39.220 --> 47:44.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: It listens, reads, and watches, according to Autonomy's chief marketing officer.
[47:44.000 --> 47:51.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: Then it synthesizes, beyond Greek and English, the software understands Arabic, Farsi, and all major European languages.
[47:51.640 --> 48:01.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: Other companies in the SAIC consortium include Germany's Siemens, General Dynamics, and Honeywell International, and the Israeli company Elbit Systems.
[48:03.440 --> 48:05.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: Several Greek companies also are participating.
[48:06.380 --> 48:10.780]  [SPEAKER_00]: Wait, so folks who speak like Pashto or something are immune from this?
[48:10.900 --> 48:14.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, they're not saying that specifically, but you could make that assumption, I suppose.
[48:14.620 --> 48:14.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[48:15.040 --> 48:21.580]  [SPEAKER_00]: Network of sensors designed to detect chemical agents has also been deployed near Olympic venues and around the capital, including on the security blimp.
[48:22.340 --> 48:27.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: Advanced technology is also used in the creation of the Olympic credentials, which use such security features as holograms.
[48:28.200 --> 48:29.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: Weren't we using those years ago, Bernie?
[48:30.020 --> 48:30.340]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[48:30.980 --> 48:32.240]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I guess they took notes.
[48:32.840 --> 48:40.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: All cardholder information, such as a person's photo and passport number, are printed on a very thin film designed to make the cards impossible to forge.
[48:43.580 --> 48:46.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: This really is going to give people nightmares, I think.
[48:47.420 --> 48:51.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, everybody's cellular phone calls are going to be monitored and listened.
[48:51.400 --> 48:52.880]  [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, that's a phone tap, isn't it?
[48:53.260 --> 48:53.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[48:54.060 --> 48:54.920]  [SPEAKER_10]: You're in Greece.
[48:55.120 --> 48:55.780]  [SPEAKER_10]: You have no...
[48:55.780 --> 48:56.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's like Echelon.
[48:57.120 --> 48:58.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's exactly like Echelon.
[48:58.300 --> 49:02.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: In fact, they didn't mention Echelon, but some of this technology is precisely what they've been using.
[49:03.280 --> 49:05.440]  [SPEAKER_05]: And it's all going to be undone by low-tech.
[49:05.640 --> 49:06.820]  [SPEAKER_05]: You have something for us, right?
[49:06.820 --> 49:07.220]  [SPEAKER_05]: I picked out some events.
[49:07.220 --> 49:07.360]  [SPEAKER_05]: Okay.
[49:07.460 --> 49:09.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: We have some events, and then we're going to take some phone calls.
[49:09.820 --> 49:11.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: 212-209-2900.
[49:11.320 --> 49:11.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: Go ahead.
[49:11.420 --> 49:12.820]  [SPEAKER_04]: One of them I actually have a question about.
[49:13.360 --> 49:17.080]  [SPEAKER_04]: Generally, when does the New York Public Library close during the week?
[49:17.340 --> 49:17.620]  [SPEAKER_04]: Jim?
[49:18.040 --> 49:19.040]  [SPEAKER_05]: Oh, well, it depends.
[49:19.700 --> 49:22.580]  [SPEAKER_04]: 5 o'clock for the main branches, usually.
[49:22.680 --> 49:22.800]  [SPEAKER_04]: Right.
[49:23.180 --> 49:30.380]  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, if you want to stay late, they are having a reception and dinner at the New York Public Library on Tuesday, the 31st.
[49:31.540 --> 49:31.900]  [SPEAKER_04]: For...
[49:31.900 --> 49:33.860]  [SPEAKER_04]: It doesn't really say, so I know.
[49:34.020 --> 49:36.280]  [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know how they're going to decide who can come in or not.
[49:36.380 --> 49:37.280]  [SPEAKER_04]: Maybe you need a badge.
[49:37.760 --> 49:38.600]  [SPEAKER_04]: Something like that.
[49:38.840 --> 49:39.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: Hmm.
[49:39.500 --> 49:39.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: Interesting.
[49:39.940 --> 49:41.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: Tuesday, the 31st, you say?
[49:41.380 --> 49:41.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yes.
[49:42.040 --> 49:43.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, then that means it's not two weeks from now, is it?
[49:43.960 --> 49:44.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's three weeks from now.
[49:45.240 --> 49:47.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: If today is the 13th...
[49:48.100 --> 49:48.460]  [SPEAKER_05]: No, it's not...
[49:48.460 --> 49:49.640]  [SPEAKER_05]: Well, Friday is the 13th.
[49:49.860 --> 49:50.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: No, but today is the what?
[49:50.900 --> 49:51.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: The 11th?
[49:51.280 --> 49:52.200]  [SPEAKER_05]: Today would be the 11th.
[49:52.740 --> 49:53.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: 18th.
[49:53.080 --> 49:53.500]  [SPEAKER_00]: Two weeks.
[49:55.520 --> 49:55.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: About?
[49:56.100 --> 49:56.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: No, three weeks.
[49:56.980 --> 50:00.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: Because the 18th and the 25th and the 30... or the 24th...
[50:01.300 --> 50:02.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: Someone help us out here with a calendar.
[50:02.840 --> 50:03.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: Good God.
[50:03.100 --> 50:03.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: Whatever it is.
[50:03.460 --> 50:04.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's three weeks from now.
[50:04.300 --> 50:05.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: The 31st.
[50:05.220 --> 50:05.300]  [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[50:05.400 --> 50:06.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: I think it's three weeks, not two weeks.
[50:06.960 --> 50:14.600]  [SPEAKER_04]: And after that, if you've, you know, gone to the dinner, you can go to a game at Yankee Stadium between the Yankees and the Cleveland Indians.
[50:14.600 --> 50:16.540]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, they can't have reserved the whole stadium, can they?
[50:16.760 --> 50:17.500]  [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know.
[50:17.680 --> 50:21.040]  [SPEAKER_04]: If you're interested in that event, though, you can call Mary Sue Hempler.
[50:21.280 --> 50:29.060]  [SPEAKER_00]: Let's not give out the phone numbers on the air, but this will be spread around various ways.
[50:29.180 --> 50:35.720]  [SPEAKER_04]: And on the next day, there's a grill at Bryant Park, a barbecue, I guess.
[50:35.940 --> 50:37.740]  [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, I've been to grills at Bryant Park.
[50:37.860 --> 50:38.320]  [SPEAKER_04]: They're very nice.
[50:38.440 --> 50:40.100]  [SPEAKER_04]: So that's from 4.30 to 7 p.m.
[50:40.120 --> 50:41.720]  [SPEAKER_04]: And there's a phone number associated with that.
[50:41.720 --> 50:43.060]  [SPEAKER_04]: But I guess maybe you have to call ahead.
[50:43.400 --> 50:44.820]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, we're going to look into this a little bit more.
[50:44.940 --> 50:48.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: And if people have more information to give us, please forward it on down to the addresses we gave before.
[50:49.400 --> 50:56.920]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, of course, if you have any way of getting us into some of these things, including the conference itself, we promise not to cause any problems.
[50:56.920 --> 51:00.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: We're just going to be very observant and tell people what we see, because that's what we do.
[51:01.000 --> 51:02.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: 212-209-2900.
[51:02.580 --> 51:03.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: Let's take our first listener phone call.
[51:03.720 --> 51:04.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: Good evening.
[51:04.380 --> 51:04.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: You're on.
[51:04.880 --> 51:05.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: Good evening.
[51:05.460 --> 51:05.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: How are you doing?
[51:06.020 --> 51:10.320]  [SPEAKER_08]: This is in relation about the transit systems getting photographed or filmed or whatever.
[51:10.720 --> 51:18.400]  [SPEAKER_08]: Back in August of 2001, I was filming the last days of the PCC trolleys in Newark, New Jersey's subway system.
[51:18.840 --> 51:21.580]  [SPEAKER_08]: And I had no problem hanging out the window with my camera.
[51:21.580 --> 51:28.240]  [SPEAKER_08]: I had no problem riding up and down the transit system for hours, filming, videotaping, and taking still photos.
[51:28.520 --> 51:33.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: In fact, train crews were running around with cameras, because at the end of the week, they were going to be scrapped or whatever.
[51:34.180 --> 51:42.580]  [SPEAKER_08]: But I got scolded by a transit cop in the lobby of Penn Station, Newark, for videotaping the lamps and the big bull head over the door and things like that.
[51:43.120 --> 51:51.460]  [SPEAKER_08]: According to cousins of mine who are PATH employees, there is apparently no legal restriction on photographing, but they just heavily discourage you.
[51:52.620 --> 51:53.900]  [SPEAKER_08]: They've been doing it for years.
[51:54.160 --> 51:55.980]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's like when we were filming Freedom Downtime.
[51:56.320 --> 52:01.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: We were told that we were not allowed to film prisons, even prisons that were visible from city streets.
[52:01.940 --> 52:04.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: But there's no law anywhere that says you're not allowed to do this.
[52:04.740 --> 52:05.640]  [SPEAKER_00]: You'll just get scolded.
[52:06.020 --> 52:07.220]  [SPEAKER_00]: You'll get yelled at.
[52:07.240 --> 52:08.080]  [SPEAKER_00]: You might even get detained.
[52:08.080 --> 52:08.720]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's possible.
[52:08.880 --> 52:13.200]  [SPEAKER_00]: But I think people need to be willing to take that risk to preserve their rights.
[52:13.200 --> 52:16.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: You are allowed to take pictures of things that are in public areas.
[52:16.660 --> 52:27.920]  [SPEAKER_10]: All the Bureau of Prisons even had a sign on the new federal facility they built here in Philadelphia saying that it was against the law to take any photographs.
[52:28.140 --> 52:30.840]  [SPEAKER_10]: It was in the Freedom Downtime movie, that sign.
[52:31.060 --> 52:32.180]  [SPEAKER_10]: Yeah, I worked outside the Navy.
[52:32.500 --> 52:37.680]  [SPEAKER_10]: When I called the BOP, I talked to five different people, and they all said, well, there really isn't such a law.
[52:37.780 --> 52:38.380]  [SPEAKER_10]: We just said that.
[52:38.700 --> 52:38.800]  [SPEAKER_08]: Yeah.
[52:38.960 --> 52:44.260]  [SPEAKER_08]: There's a Navy base near where I work, and they have these signs deep in the woods saying photography prohibited.
[52:44.800 --> 52:45.620]  [SPEAKER_08]: Well, guess what?
[52:45.680 --> 52:48.100]  [SPEAKER_08]: You've got hunters in the perimeter during deer season.
[52:48.280 --> 52:49.420]  [SPEAKER_08]: So what the hell is that all about?
[52:49.980 --> 52:50.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah.
[52:50.740 --> 52:52.180]  [SPEAKER_08]: Guns are allowed, but cameras aren't.
[52:52.340 --> 52:52.600]  [SPEAKER_08]: Oh, yeah.
[52:52.720 --> 52:53.300]  [SPEAKER_08]: They're more dangerous.
[52:54.040 --> 52:54.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for your call.
[52:54.880 --> 52:55.220]  [SPEAKER_08]: Quite all right.
[52:55.280 --> 52:55.700]  [SPEAKER_08]: Have a good one.
[52:56.920 --> 52:58.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: 212-209-2900 is our phone number.
[52:59.560 --> 53:00.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: And good evening.
[53:00.300 --> 53:00.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: You're on.
[53:01.940 --> 53:02.460]  [SPEAKER_00]: That's us.
[53:03.220 --> 53:03.800]  [SPEAKER_00]: Speak up, please.
[53:03.900 --> 53:04.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: You're on.
[53:04.820 --> 53:05.340]  [SPEAKER_07]: Hey, how are you?
[53:05.560 --> 53:05.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: Pretty good.
[53:05.980 --> 53:06.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: How are you doing?
[53:07.580 --> 53:09.540]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'm actually listening on the internet.
[53:09.600 --> 53:11.020]  [SPEAKER_07]: I don't know if it's delayed, so...
[53:11.020 --> 53:11.860]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's a little bit delayed, yeah.
[53:11.900 --> 53:13.420]  [SPEAKER_00]: So you want to turn it down so you don't get confused.
[53:13.540 --> 53:13.600]  [SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.
[53:13.820 --> 53:14.680]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'll just turn it down.
[53:14.900 --> 53:16.000]  [SPEAKER_07]: Hey, I'm from Miami.
[53:16.000 --> 53:18.760]  [SPEAKER_07]: Just wanted to say hi to you guys, and my name is Brian.
[53:19.000 --> 53:19.420]  [SPEAKER_07]: How are you doing?
[53:19.620 --> 53:21.180]  [SPEAKER_07]: I was at the Hope Conference.
[53:22.200 --> 53:25.540]  [SPEAKER_07]: My first conference since I moved here to the States three years ago.
[53:25.700 --> 53:27.900]  [SPEAKER_07]: So I just wanted to thank you guys for everything.
[53:28.160 --> 53:28.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: Did you have fun?
[53:29.020 --> 53:29.800]  [SPEAKER_07]: Oh, yes, a lot.
[53:29.940 --> 53:30.780]  [SPEAKER_07]: Brian, where are you from?
[53:31.180 --> 53:32.060]  [SPEAKER_07]: I'm from Argentina.
[53:32.420 --> 53:32.660]  [SPEAKER_07]: Wow.
[53:33.480 --> 53:36.380]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, so I'm kind of representing that country right now.
[53:37.000 --> 53:38.740]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, I hope you're at the next one, too.
[53:38.840 --> 53:44.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: We've heard nothing but good things from people who had a great time at the conference and were still getting reports.
[53:44.220 --> 53:47.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: And, yeah, it was a blast.
[53:47.180 --> 53:47.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: It really was.
[53:47.920 --> 53:48.040]  [SPEAKER_00]: It was awesome, yeah.
[53:48.220 --> 53:50.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: And a lot of people learned all kinds of things.
[53:50.280 --> 53:55.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: We are trying to get the audio and video together, and it's just been a question of catching up to all kinds of other things.
[53:55.530 --> 53:58.020]  [SPEAKER_00]: So that will be available as soon as we can possibly do it.
[53:58.040 --> 53:58.700]  [SPEAKER_07]: Yeah, I'm looking up to that.
[53:59.280 --> 54:00.400]  [SPEAKER_07]: Took a lot of pictures also.
[54:00.620 --> 54:04.320]  [SPEAKER_07]: So I just want to say hi to my friend Jody from Rhode Island also.
[54:04.520 --> 54:04.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[54:05.080 --> 54:06.680]  [SPEAKER_07]: And thank you for everything again.
[54:06.960 --> 54:07.280]  [SPEAKER_00]: All right.
[54:07.580 --> 54:08.480]  [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks for calling.
[54:08.800 --> 54:08.920]  [SPEAKER_07]: Bye.
[54:09.460 --> 54:10.760]  [SPEAKER_00]: 212-209-2900.
[54:11.420 --> 54:12.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: And good evening.
[54:12.260 --> 54:12.520]  [SPEAKER_00]: You're on.
[54:13.240 --> 54:13.940]  [SPEAKER_09]: Hi, Manuel.
[54:14.180 --> 54:14.500]  [SPEAKER_09]: How are you doing?
[54:14.800 --> 54:15.020]  [SPEAKER_09]: Hi.
[54:15.080 --> 54:16.520]  [SPEAKER_09]: This is Gene from Pennsylvania here.
[54:17.000 --> 54:17.300]  How are you?
[54:17.700 --> 54:18.140]  [SPEAKER_09]: Okay.
[54:18.760 --> 54:24.620]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yes, on your conference up there, it was the very first one that I went to, the good news is it's fantastic.
[54:24.620 --> 54:26.460]  [SPEAKER_09]: The bad news is it wasn't long enough.
[54:27.480 --> 54:28.720]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, it was three days long.
[54:28.880 --> 54:31.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, I don't know how much more we could stand for all this coordination.
[54:32.520 --> 54:33.120]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, I know.
[54:33.240 --> 54:34.520]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's quite an undertaking.
[54:34.520 --> 54:35.200]  [SPEAKER_09]: I know that.
[54:35.840 --> 54:40.640]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's just that I wanted to attend as many of them conferences up there as possible.
[54:40.820 --> 54:41.640]  [SPEAKER_09]: You know, the lectures.
[54:41.820 --> 54:42.380]  [SPEAKER_00]: The panels, yeah.
[54:42.380 --> 54:51.920]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, I mean, it was a real chore just to, you know, get the list and go through them and any changes that came up and all that, you know.
[54:52.360 --> 54:54.160]  [SPEAKER_09]: I do have one technical question, though.
[54:54.300 --> 54:54.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: Go ahead.
[54:54.920 --> 55:05.080]  [SPEAKER_09]: I've been bothered by about the last two, two and a half, maybe three years with a condition that either I get it when I pick up the phone or it leaves it on my answering machine.
[55:05.700 --> 55:09.500]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's an off-hook signal, okay?
[55:09.860 --> 55:11.220]  [SPEAKER_09]: The fast-pulsing, right?
[55:11.780 --> 55:15.320]  [SPEAKER_09]: It'll get through to my answering machine and leave it on there.
[55:15.440 --> 55:17.720]  [SPEAKER_09]: Now, I phoned the police department about this.
[55:17.780 --> 55:20.100]  [SPEAKER_00]: You phoned the police about an off-hook tone on your answering machine?
[55:20.260 --> 55:23.540]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, the thing of it is, it came in by itself, okay?
[55:23.760 --> 55:24.120]  [SPEAKER_09]: Okay.
[55:24.660 --> 55:29.300]  [SPEAKER_09]: And when I talked to him about it, he says, oh, that's two machines trying to talk together.
[55:29.660 --> 55:36.060]  [SPEAKER_09]: Like, one of the machines is programmed one digit off and it automatically got, you know, it just got through.
[55:36.440 --> 55:38.540]  [SPEAKER_09]: And he says, we don't worry about those things.
[55:38.680 --> 55:39.660]  [SPEAKER_09]: But what is it?
[55:39.660 --> 55:41.240]  [SPEAKER_09]: That's what I'm trying to find out.
[55:41.260 --> 55:49.000]  [SPEAKER_00]: Well, what I'm not sure if I'm understanding completely, but what it sounds like to me is that something is calling in and something is not hanging up.
[55:49.280 --> 56:00.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: I know this used to happen a lot on old-fashioned answering machines that didn't detect when the phone actually was disconnected and would just keep recording.
[56:00.680 --> 56:05.260]  [SPEAKER_00]: And sometimes you get, say, 45 seconds or a minute of just the off-hook tone until it timed out.
[56:05.420 --> 56:08.280]  [SPEAKER_10]: Gene, is this an old tape-based answering machine?
[56:09.060 --> 56:10.300]  [SPEAKER_09]: Oh, what, mine?
[56:10.500 --> 56:10.680]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.
[56:10.960 --> 56:14.640]  [SPEAKER_09]: No, no, this is the latest, whatever they're selling around, you know, digital...
[56:14.640 --> 56:15.580]  [SPEAKER_09]: Do you have caller ID?
[56:15.940 --> 56:16.100]  [SPEAKER_09]: No.
[56:16.520 --> 56:17.500]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, wait a minute, wait a minute.
[56:17.580 --> 56:18.000]  [SPEAKER_09]: Maybe it does.
[56:18.000 --> 56:18.540]  [SPEAKER_09]: I don't use it.
[56:18.980 --> 56:19.340]  Okay.
[56:19.340 --> 56:22.400]  [SPEAKER_10]: Well, if you have it, you might want to see who called you at that time, if possibly.
[56:22.400 --> 56:27.980]  [SPEAKER_09]: Well, it's, yeah, I went through that, you know, you call back or, you know, you use a star six, seven or whatever.
[56:28.220 --> 56:28.360]  [SPEAKER_09]: And?
[56:28.740 --> 56:32.840]  [SPEAKER_09]: And, of course, it says, it is not in my territory, so they can't trace it, you know?
[56:33.160 --> 56:33.500]  Wow.
[56:34.520 --> 56:36.060]  [SPEAKER_09]: But, you know, it bothers me.
[56:36.180 --> 56:38.320]  [SPEAKER_09]: I don't, I assume other people have come along with it.
[56:38.380 --> 56:41.520]  [SPEAKER_09]: I know one other person beside myself has gotten this.
[56:41.700 --> 56:48.560]  [SPEAKER_09]: And this comes up, my God, it must be at least, oh, God, 15, 16 times, maybe 20 times a month.
[56:49.080 --> 56:49.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: And it goes on and on.
[56:49.940 --> 56:50.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: Is it about the same time?
[56:50.500 --> 56:51.440]  [SPEAKER_00]: About the same time every day?
[56:52.400 --> 56:53.340]  [SPEAKER_09]: It's arbitrary, really.
[56:53.640 --> 56:54.680]  [SPEAKER_00]: Is it ever in the middle of the night?
[56:55.800 --> 56:59.780]  [SPEAKER_09]: The only time I, the latest I ever got it was about 12, 15 a.m.
[57:00.320 --> 57:00.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: Interesting.
[57:01.140 --> 57:06.180]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah, and as I said, it's been on for about, oh, two, two and a half years or so like that.
[57:06.220 --> 57:09.160]  [SPEAKER_09]: And I just wondered, I figured it was a harassment situation.
[57:09.420 --> 57:12.480]  [SPEAKER_09]: But this thing has got to, it's got to, it's got to call my line.
[57:12.620 --> 57:13.520]  [SPEAKER_09]: My line picks up.
[57:13.800 --> 57:19.040]  [SPEAKER_09]: And the next thing it does, it goes right into the off tone hook, or off hook tone.
[57:19.480 --> 57:21.560]  [SPEAKER_09]: And it goes on and on until it times out, whatever.
[57:21.560 --> 57:21.700]  [SPEAKER_09]: Yeah.
[57:21.940 --> 57:24.060]  [SPEAKER_09]: Call Verizon's Annoyance Call Bureau.
[57:24.280 --> 57:24.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
[57:24.560 --> 57:25.360]  [SPEAKER_00]: See if they can help you out.
[57:25.360 --> 57:26.560]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's in the front of your phone book.
[57:26.700 --> 57:27.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: Unfortunately, we're out of time on this.
[57:28.020 --> 57:29.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: We can't pursue it anymore.
[57:29.920 --> 57:31.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: But I don't know.
[57:31.280 --> 57:35.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: You know, it used to be back in the day when you get phone calls that were mysterious.
[57:35.900 --> 57:37.660]  [SPEAKER_00]: You didn't go and call the cops right away.
[57:38.760 --> 57:39.180]  [SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.
[57:39.220 --> 57:39.960]  [SPEAKER_00]: This seems kind of strange.
[57:40.300 --> 57:40.620]  [SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
[57:40.680 --> 57:41.160]  [SPEAKER_00]: We're out of time.
[57:42.200 --> 57:43.880]  [SPEAKER_00]: We're going to be back again next week.
[57:44.040 --> 57:44.900]  [SPEAKER_00]: Mike, you have something for us?
[57:45.240 --> 57:53.680]  [SPEAKER_06]: Well, the music that you're going to play, I just want to point out that the folks who do this will be in New York City on Friday the 20th.
[57:54.000 --> 57:55.940]  [SPEAKER_00]: And this is something we picked up in Newfoundland.
[57:56.060 --> 58:00.840]  [SPEAKER_00]: It's a song about Newfoundland and about how you better not mess with Newfoundland, especially you people in Montreal.
[58:00.840 --> 58:07.160]  [SPEAKER_06]: Yeah, we hope that the folks, when they come to New York to do their concert, do not lose their mind.
[58:07.500 --> 58:08.740]  [SPEAKER_06]: What's the band name?
[58:08.960 --> 58:09.700]  [SPEAKER_00]: The Navigators.
[58:10.300 --> 58:11.400]  [SPEAKER_00]: So, we've already started.
[58:11.560 --> 58:12.140]  [SPEAKER_00]: We'll see you next week.
[58:12.300 --> 58:17.400]  [SPEAKER_01]: Here's the reasons why I'm free as the wind and the waves wash the sands.
[58:17.560 --> 58:21.140]  [SPEAKER_01]: There's no place I would rather be than here in Newfoundland.
[58:21.380 --> 58:25.120]  [SPEAKER_01]: I spent some time in New York State and barely lost my mind.
[58:25.280 --> 58:28.900]  [SPEAKER_01]: The city life's too fast for me, nobody had the time.
[58:28.900 --> 58:32.620]  [SPEAKER_01]: Cement and steel and flash and ice was all that I could see.
[58:32.840 --> 58:36.460]  [SPEAKER_01]: It may be good for New York State, but it's not even good for me.
[58:36.740 --> 58:40.280]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm a Newfoundlander born and bred and I'll be one till I die.
[58:40.560 --> 58:44.200]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm proud to be an islander and here's the reasons why.
[58:44.440 --> 58:48.060]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm free as the wind and the waves wash the sands.
[58:48.300 --> 58:51.820]  [SPEAKER_01]: There's no place I would rather be than here in Newfoundland.
[58:52.200 --> 58:55.500]  [SPEAKER_01]: Now in Montreal, the Frenchmen say that they own Labrador.
[59:05.860 --> 59:10.820]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm a Newfoundlander born and bred and I'll be one till I die.
[59:11.180 --> 59:14.840]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm proud to be an islander and here's the reasons why.
[59:15.160 --> 59:18.680]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm free as the wind and the waves wash the sands.
[59:18.680 --> 59:22.420]  [SPEAKER_01]: There's no place I would rather be than here in Newfoundland.
[59:56.040 --> 01:00:03.620]  [SPEAKER_01]: Now that the oil is on our shore, we'd better take the time to develop a bit more carefully or else you're going to find.
[01:00:03.850 --> 01:00:07.200]  [SPEAKER_01]: What could have been the answer to our poor economy?
[01:00:07.500 --> 01:00:11.270]  [SPEAKER_01]: Has changed our way of living and destroyed our fishery.
[01:00:11.560 --> 01:00:15.100]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm a Newfoundlander born and bred and I'll be one till I die.
[01:00:15.100 --> 01:00:18.960]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm proud to be an islander and here's the reasons why.
[01:00:19.140 --> 01:00:22.840]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm free as the wind and the waves wash the sands.
[01:00:23.040 --> 01:00:26.520]  [SPEAKER_01]: There's no place I would rather be than here in Newfoundland.
[01:00:26.800 --> 01:00:30.310]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm a Newfoundlander born and bred and I'll be one till I die.
[01:00:30.680 --> 01:00:34.230]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm proud to be an islander and here's the reasons why.
[01:00:34.460 --> 01:00:38.160]  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm free as the wind and the waves wash the sands.
[01:00:38.500 --> 01:00:41.840]  [SPEAKER_01]: There's no place I would rather be than here in Newfoundland.
[01:00:43.740 --> 01:00:45.440]  [SPEAKER_03]: Ah, yes.
[01:00:46.310 --> 01:00:50.060]  [SPEAKER_03]: There's nothing I like more than Newfoundland music.
[01:00:50.660 --> 01:00:51.380]  [SPEAKER_03]: Right?
[01:00:51.730 --> 01:00:52.600]  [SPEAKER_03]: Isn't that stuff great?