You've been listening to Free Speech Radio News.
From Pacifica Station KPFK in L.A., I'm Aura Bogado.
And you're listening to Radio Station WBAI in New York, where the time is just about
seven o'clock on a Wednesday, and that means it's time for Off the Hook.
Really?
Okay.
I hit all the right buttons, I really did, and I was timing it so well, and the machine
just decided not to work.
I don't know why.
Let's try it again.
You see, I'm pressing the buttons, right, and it's—there we go.
This is our theme.
The telephone keeps ringing, so I ripped it off the wall.
I cut myself while shaving.
Now I can't make a call.
We couldn't get through.
No, you totally could!
You can get in there... Very easily!
What?
Well, no, we all could, I think.
We're talking about going to Cuba, actually, after the conference,
and figuring out who can get in and who can't.
I can get in. RedHack, you can probably get in.
I can probably get in.
It's not a question of getting in.
You don't have a microphone, RedHack. How did that happen?
Share Mike's microphone.
All right.
All right. I'm sorry, Mike, what were you saying?
It's not a question of getting in.
It's a question of getting out?
It's a question of re-entering the United States.
Well, yeah, but doing it legally.
I have a foreign passport, so I guess.
It's still not legal.
It's still not legal because as a U.S. citizen, you're not allowed to go.
Yeah, but I'm not going as a U.S. citizen. I'm going as a different citizen.
It doesn't matter.
You have a fake passport?
But you and I already went following the U.S. law.
Let's discuss that on the radio, please.
Yeah, well, the thing is to always have another way of doing things
in case the first way doesn't work.
They do make it more and more restrictive as time goes on.
I had a friend who years ago was able to go with his girlfriend
because she had family in Cuba,
and then George Bush changed it so that you can't actually bring anyone with you.
You can still go visit if you have family, but you can't take anyone as a guest.
Interesting.
So you wouldn't be able to go legally either then, I guess,
because you don't have that.
Not legally, no.
All right. Interesting.
I mean, if I got caught, I'd get fined, right?
That's what the penalty is.
Yeah, something like $10,000.
You can go to Cuba, but you can't spend money.
That's the trick.
And good luck.
It's legal to go to Cuba, but it's not legal to spend money there.
Good luck not spending money when you go to a foreign country.
You could barter.
Maybe they just give you everything for free. I don't know.
The U.S. government defines spending money so broadly
that among other things they include is the airport departure tax
and the landing fees that your airline has to pay
and the boat fees that your boat has to pay if you go on a boat.
So they've really got all their bases covered.
The thing is, as journalists, we can all go,
and that's the important thing to remember.
And we can go legally, and we did go legally.
We did go a couple of years ago and filed some amazing reports from there.
Good evening.
This is Off the Hook.
Actually, we're sorry.
We're having a conversation.
We figured we'd join in progress rather than just start the show.
But this is what it's like all the time when we're not on the air.
We're constantly just throwing things around
and hashing out all kinds of subjects and topics and things like that.
It's really fascinating.
Laszlo, did I hear your voice?
And it's not a fundraiser, which is amazing.
Yeah, you're here in the studio, and we're not raising money.
Why did you push your microphone away?
That one's broken.
Is it really?
I promise.
Hey, this doesn't work very well.
Well, why don't you take that big sock off of it,
and maybe it won't sound so awful.
No, I don't think it's the windscreen.
Well, take that off.
Yeah, but it's amazing to finally be invited here.
Go ahead.
Try it.
Try it now.
No.
Yeah, I can't even find.
Wow.
It's this big yellow thing.
Yeah, get rid of that.
In radio, those things have names, but I don't know what they're called.
I don't know.
Why do you need a windscreen when there's no wind in here?
Don't you hate jargon?
I was talking about jargon last night on the other show,
and I just hate jargon.
Radio jargon, I hate.
You know?
The big felt thing that covers the microphone,
rather than calling it a windscreen.
And they call those pots.
Pots, yeah.
What a stupid word.
It's short for potentiometer, by the way.
Wow.
All right.
Well, regardless.
It's because it comes near the pan control, basically.
Thank you, Mike.
Thank you.
I see you dove right into the jargonese world here.
We have a full cast of characters here.
It's only going to get bigger and bigger as the conference gets closer,
isn't it?
Who do we have tonight?
Well, me, Emanuel.
There's Mike over there.
Hi, again.
And Redhack.
Hey.
Somehow, can you just put the mic between the two of you
so he doesn't have to keep leaning over?
And Laszlo joining us from Radio Land and Grand Theft Auto Land.
Grand Theft Auto 4, which came out April 29th.
Now, when I tell people you're involved in Grand Theft Auto,
lots of times I get like a knowing wink and a smile,
but I don't think they realize I'm talking about the game.
Right.
And not the actual practice.
True.
Although I'm not sure what you do in your spare time.
When you're working on video games, there is no spare time.
True.
It's nights and weekends.
For over a couple of years, we worked on that game.
So then you're not actually out there stealing cars and doing all kinds of things.
No.
We're creating a virtual world where you can steal cars.
But you don't have to.
You can hail taxis in Grand Theft Auto 4.
Now, you're giving a talk about Grand Theft Auto
at the last Hope Conference in July.
Yes, I'm talking about the media and hacking the media
and how to get your views into the media and what's wrong with blogs,
all sorts of things.
And you're going to fit all this into an hour.
Yes.
Wow.
And there will be questions allowed to be asked.
I think you're coming right before Adam Savage too.
So there's going to be a lot of interesting stuff going on.
I'm also emceeing at the last time.
You are.
So I go up and I introduce people and really screw up their names,
which is awesome.
And you're also locking the doors when we're all done.
No.
Because everyone else is going to be out.
No, usually around 10 o'clock I go across the street and get a six-pack
and then try to get the day's woes off of me.
All right.
Lexicon's here as well.
Absolutely.
How are you doing?
Good.
How's planning going on the second floor of the conference?
Very good, very good.
We have a big map going.
A map.
Lots of projects.
You'll need a map to get around for sure.
Yes, absolutely.
Wow.
And there's not Kevin over on the other side.
Hello.
How are you?
Almost well.
Yeah, almost well.
Well, good for you.
And you fed a stray cat today, so karma is on your side.
Yes, yes, I did.
Good for you.
And Rob T. Firefly joins us.
Good evening.
And you're involved with Gray Frequency over on the other side of the room
with all kinds of artwork for the conference.
Anything you want to let slip as far as what to look forward to?
Stuff to let slip.
Well, you'll basically, when you see our work lining the walls
and other areas of this convention, you'll know where you are,
which I think is important.
Absolutely, yeah.
Well, not to say that we're going to have GPS coordinates
or anything on the actual artwork,
but you'll definitely know that you're in the right place.
Let's put it that way.
Did somebody tell him our ideas?
And down in Philadelphia, do we have Bernie S.?
We do not have Bernie S.
Wait, wait.
You're right.
We don't.
He's not there.
What happened?
I don't know.
I called him.
He didn't answer.
I presume he's not in cell phone range,
which means when I just now texted him to get the phone number of where he is.
You texted him?
You're sure you texted him?
I'm sure, but I don't think it'll work.
He's got a mobile phone from like 1987.
No, no, he has a brand new mobile phone.
Oh, did he?
He was always so proud of his mobile phone.
It's the oldest one in the world.
Well, Mike did text it.
I can't say that word.
I'm trying to say texted, and I just can't do it.
Because the last phone he had was in a briefcase,
and when you sent a text message, he had to actually set up a printer.
All right, well, the quest for Bernie S. has begun,
and maybe we'll find him.
Maybe we won't, but that's part of the excitement of Off the Hook.
Did we mention the name of the program?
Yes, we did at the top of the hour.
What's the name of the conference, this big hacker conference?
The Last Hope.
It's the Last Hope, the hackers on planet Earth,
taking place at the Hotel Pennsylvania.
The first two letters of each word spells out hope, too, in fact.
And that's taking place July 18th, 19th, and 20th of this year.
And more information at www.hope.net.
All kinds of good speakers.
When I try to tell people about this, they get intimidated
because they're like, oh, it's a hacker conference.
But there's people playing like old Atari games.
There's people messing around with Segways.
There's always that TV-be-gone guy there
that has the remote control on your keychain.
Mitch Altman, yeah, he'll be giving a talk.
You can turn TVs off at bars.
It's a lot of pranks.
A lockpicking workshop, and the Hackerspace Village,
where all kinds of hackerspaces from around the world
will be converging in a giant gathering point.
Let's not forget Power Tool Racing.
What exactly is that?
I think, Mike, maybe you can describe this better than I can.
Power Tool Racing, it sounds scary.
Sounds like he might lose a limb.
I think you've said all I know about it,
which is Power Tool Racing sounds scary, yes.
I think that's all that needs to be said, is Power Tool Racing.
There will be Power Tools, and they'll be racing.
And so I asked Nick Farr, who's not really organizing it,
but allocating it, the space.
He's taking all responsibility for it.
Yeah, it's all his fault if you get hurt.
Will they take off the blades or something?
And he said no, they'll race with the blades on.
Awesome.
Well, it's the only way they can move,
so I have to assume they will keep the blades on.
I assume they would take the blades off
and hook it to a gear or something so it would go,
but no, it races, and it's, I don't know.
I think there's a skateboard involved in that.
A skateboard is always involved somewhere.
And, of course, as NotKevin said, we have the Segways.
Are they coming back?
They're coming back.
Those are fun.
We have to figure out how to get them, too.
We'll work that out later.
And I see I'm looking at a map now,
that preliminary map that's been printed out.
We have a Lego table, so we're going to be playing with Legos.
I knew this was happening eventually.
Bring your old Legos.
Bring your old Legos.
Dump them on the table so everybody can play.
Well, how will you know which Legos are yours in the end?
You have to individually initial each one.
We're going to melt them.
Okay.
And we mentioned the lockpicking village,
which is always a lot of fun to be in.
In addition, Lexicon, there's going to be a radio station.
Tell us something about that.
Radio Statler is going to broadcast over the Internet
for three days straight.
Statler.
I'm confused.
It's called the Hotel Pennsylvania.
Why are you calling it Radio Statler?
Because the Hotel Pennsylvania was originally called the Hotel Statler,
and we think it's a cooler name.
Wow.
How about that?
And I think the Hotel Statler used to have a radio room.
Yes.
Up on the 18th floor, there was a radio room,
which is the floor we're on.
And when it became the Hotel Pennsylvania,
there was no longer a radio station on top of the hotel.
But now there will be again.
There will be again.
In fact, in addition to that,
there'll be a ham radio station on the 18th floor as well.
Bernie, if you were here,
this would be the point where you'd jump in and tell us all about it.
But he's not.
Maybe sometime.
Well, actually, RedHack, you're a ham, aren't you?
You've got a ham license.
I am because Bernie told me to get one.
Yeah, well, you got one,
and now you're the representative ham in the room.
So tell us what kinds of things go on
on ham radio stations that operate out of conventions.
I'm going to let Bernie answer it.
Okay, well, I'm sure Bernie will.
Does the ham station broadcast like the entire weekend?
I think so.
Basically, people send in QSL cards from all over the world, right?
Can you curse on ham radio?
You know, these are questions to ask Bernie,
and I'm sure he'll be aching to answer them as soon as.
He's run out of ribbon on his text machine.
He gets into range.
Anything else we need to know about the radio station, Lex?
Well, we want people to do shows,
and we want some help with engineering.
So anybody who wants to volunteer can email projects at hope.net.
Can we curse on this station?
Is that the most important thing to you?
It's on the internet.
I'm leading up for a little tie-in.
You can go hog wild on the internet.
I think that's the actual slogan of the internet.
Is there going to be a pirate radio station set up at this hacker conference?
I'm not involved.
Yeah, Radio Statler is not an over-the-air radio station.
It's broadcasting on the internet.
Now, of course, as I mentioned when I went to Austin,
there's this great pirate station there,
which broadcasts legally because they broadcast on the internet,
and somebody else is taking that signal
and broadcasting it over a vacant FM frequency.
So if somebody were to do that, like...
Well, I mean, if someone were to do that, it would have nothing to do with us.
Right. I got you.
You probably could hear it throughout the entire metropolitan area, though, very easily.
I mean, there are pirate stations all throughout the metropolitan area,
throughout the non-commercial band.
Go through Brooklyn.
Every single frequency seems to be taken by Haitian stations, really.
You'll just hear them everywhere.
There's all kinds of religious stations in the non-commercial band
and all kinds of other things.
If you just look around, you'll find them.
So these radio stations just have, like, 20 watts or something like that.
They're on top of a second-story apartment,
and yet they're reaching at least three boroughs.
So you can do a lot with the homemade radio.
What frequency is it going to be?
We have no idea about that.
Getting back to the second floor,
we also have the Capture the Flag competition.
Yes, Packet Wars will be coming to Hope.
Packet Wars. Tell us something about this.
Packet Wars is an organization that puts on tournaments
for Capture the Flag and many other scenarios involving network security.
And they'll be running pickup games where anyone can join.
Pickup games.
Well, you can just walk right in.
And pick up a game.
Pick up a game.
Not literally pick it up, but you join.
And they'll also be running a competition.
So if a bunch of your friends want to get there and form a team,
you can compete against other teams, and prizes will be awarded.
Is there something to do beforehand?
Or do people just come into the conference and get involved?
People can just come into the conference.
Okay, cool.
So nonstop game action.
We have, I see here, a laptop work area.
What's that all about?
Well, it's just going to be some empty tables
with power available and Ethernet drops,
so you can come and plug in your laptop
so you're not going over the wireless,
which is relatively insecure.
And it's a little bit more secure
if you plug in your laptop with the Ethernet cable.
So it's just a place to come and work and do whatever you want to.
You could bring a desktop, too, though, couldn't you?
You could.
Although, if you park it there for several days, we may remove it.
Well, if you park it unattended, yes, anybody might remove it.
Is there going to be retro computing?
Yes, on Saturday.
There's a general demo area,
and a group called March is coming to do a vintage computer demo.
That's always amazing when they set up all those old computers,
and they'll let you sit down at them and hack code.
Yes, definitely, and see what they used to be able to do in the old days.
And I see, Mike, we have a big vendor area,
and hopefully we're getting a lot of vendors coming in.
Yes, many vendors are already vending.
Well, not already vending, but already making plans to vend.
And if you would like to be among them,
then email vendors at hope.net.
What kinds of things might people vend?
I mean, I know the 2600 store is going to be down there as well,
and we'll have T-shirts and issues and things like that.
But in the past and in the present, what kinds of things have we seen?
We've got some RFID-blocking wallets from our friends at Differware.
So you can put your RFID thing in it, and it will be blocked.
You mean like a passport cover?
Yes.
Those are excellent.
They have those.
And they have them in non-leather as well for people who care.
And all kinds of stuff.
We've got booksellers.
There's typically some cool T-shirts down there and lockpicks.
Someone's selling track pants, whatever that is.
I think it's a form of pants.
Track pants.
I cannot wait for this.
And TV beguns, of course, and brain machines and all that kind of stuff.
I don't think he's allowed to leave the hackerspace to go to the vendor area,
but you can maybe look at him.
Well, we'll be vending some sort of his wares going on
and all kinds of other hacker-related material and computer-related material.
And, again, as Mike said, if you are interested, time is running short on this.
It's a good deal for people that want to sell stuff
and actually pay for the conference.
You can do it if you have something that people want.
So email vendors at hope.net.
Rick Dakin will be there.
Rick Dakin will be there.
Rick Dakin will be there selling his book.
Steve Romban's victim.
Yes.
And I think Steve will be there as well and all kinds of other people.
And we're going to have the 2600 book there.
Wow.
You've got to tell me these things so I can save them a table.
Yeah.
Actually, Wiley Publishing is going to be there independently of us,
and they'll have a lot of books there.
And these are the best of 2600 books that run 888 pages from what I'm told.
And it's coming out.
So it's like the 666 and then two more?
Pretty much, yeah, because we just had so much stuff.
But, yeah, that's going to be coming out right before the conference.
So I haven't seen it yet myself, but that's going to be exciting and fun.
And you've got all the talks and the speakers are posted at Hope.net now.
Yes.
That got posted after the show last week.
We have all 100 talks.
Actually, I think we had one cancellation, so it's down to 99.
That guy sucks, by the way.
Yeah, it happens.
What a jerk.
Well, it means somebody else can squeeze in now.
But we really do have a packed schedule.
We've never had this many talks before.
So if you go to Hope.net and click on the, I believe, the Speak section,
you'll see everything that is scheduled.
The times, the actual days and times, we're releasing that over the weekend
because we're checking with everybody to make sure the schedules mesh okay
and that there are no conflicts and things like that.
But so far it looks like.
But the conference is in New York City in July on the 20th?
18th, 19th, and 20th.
18th, 19th, okay.
Yes.
Good.
Right in the middle, right across the street from Penn Station.
You can't get more Midtown than that.
Hooray.
Yeah.
Yay, Midtown.
Midtown rocks.
There's a Sbarro in the corner, yo.
Yeah.
All kinds of cool things like that.
There's also good food not far away.
Yeah.
That's quite true.
There's all sorts of things, and we'll be advising people where to go.
And if you go to some of the bars after some of the talks,
some bars you go into and your cell phone doesn't work.
Oh, because of the cell phone jammers.
Yeah.
People might be selling those too.
Yeah.
I don't know if that's legal, but we'll see.
Okay.
Well, Laszlo, welcome.
You're not here that often.
No, I'm not.
It's good to see you in the studio.
I think it's particularly apropos that you're here this week
because it was kind of a monumental and sad event losing George Carlin this week.
And, of course, George Carlin has a lot of significance here at WBAI
because I don't know if it's been reflected in all the news stories about him,
but talk about the seven dirty words and the fight with the FCC.
That was us.
We're the ones that played that track many years ago, I think, in the 70s,
73 maybe, 72, and basically the FCC came after us and we had to pay a big fine
and the seven dirty words kind of became legendary as a result of that.
But at least we stood up to the FCC.
Today, I don't know if we could do that because of the incredible fines attached to these things.
$10,000, that's nothing.
They would charge you something like $300,000 per word.
Right, per incident.
Yeah.
That's seven words.
There's a list right behind your head.
Yeah.
As our general manager said, that's our budget for the year if we played all seven dirty words.
Now, with that, though, I'd like to play something from George Carlin,
and I think it's also apropos because it has to do with things we talk about all the time,
airport security.
We're always talking about airport security.
And he had, in his later years, he had some really choice remarks to say about that,
about airport security.
Now, I just actually got this on the way in, so I haven't had time to actually screen it myself.
But I'm assuming it's clean because it's George Carlin,
and I don't think he would say anything that would.
I mean, he learned his lesson from the seven dirty words thing in the 70s.
He's not going to go and say more.
Yeah, I don't think he ever used the C word again.
No, he didn't use, what, Carlin?
No, he didn't.
He basically became a very G-rated type of comedian.
Did a lot of great comedy about family values.
Yeah, totally.
So I didn't feel like I had to audition this first.
The nice thing about Carlin, though, was that he had a lot of great political views and stories.
But he would then go on and do a whole segment on farts or scabs.
He never took himself too seriously.
No.
He didn't become just the jaded guy that complained about politicians.
He complained about politicians, and then he complained about weird visual effects and strange puss.
And he just had this way with voices and this way of communicating ideas and thoughts,
ways that you would just say, yeah, that's exactly it.
You got it.
And sometimes he would say things that were completely off the wall and offensive.
But still, somehow it was okay.
And I just think that people listening now will appreciate this.
So here we go.
Again, I'm assuming this is clean.
Why are all these people waving at me from the other room, giving me timeouts?
They look really concerned.
Maybe they're just saying hi.
What?
I'll go in and talk to them later.
But people seem to be, yeah, lock that door, please.
They look like VIPs, too.
They look like station higher-ups.
Yes.
And you can tell because they look more liberal than the other people.
They sure do.
Okay.
We're playing George Carlin.
He can't stop us.
Airport security.
You know, I've been out here all this time, and I haven't been complaining about anything yet.
I think it's time we moved right into the complaint department.
You know, because, listen, this is just a series of things that are pissing me off, all right?
Because I don't have pet peeves.
I have major psychotic f***ing hatreds, all right?
And I'll tell you this.
It makes the world a lot easier to sort out.
First thing on my list tonight, airport security.
Tired of this s***.
There's too much of it.
There's too much security at the airports.
I'm tired of some guy with a double-digit IQ and a triple-digit income,
rooting around inside of my bag for no reason and never finding anything.
Haven't found anything yet in anybody's bag.
Haven't found one bomb in one bag.
And don't tell me, well, the terrorists know their bags are going to be searched,
so now they're leaving their bombs at home.
There are no bombs.
The whole thing is f***ing pointless.
And it's completely without logic.
There's no logic at all.
They'll take away a gun but let you keep a knife.
Well, what the f*** is that?
In fact, there's a whole list of lethal objects they will allow you to take on board.
Theoretically, you could take a knife, an ice pick, a hatchet, a straight razor,
a pair of scissors, a chainsaw, six knitting needles, and a broken whiskey bottle.
And the only thing they're going to say to you is,
that bag has to fit all the way under the seat in front of you.
And if you didn't bring a weapon on board, relax.
After you've been flying for about an hour,
they're going to bring you a knife and fork.
They actually give you a f***ing knife.
It's only a table knife, but you could kill a pilot with a table knife.
Might take you a couple of minutes, you know.
Yeah, especially if he's hefty, huh? Yeah.
But you could get the job done, if you really wanted to kill the prick.
There's a lot of things you could use to kill a guy with.
You could probably beat a guy to death with the Sunday New York Times, couldn't you?
Or, suppose you just had really big hands.
Couldn't you strangle a flight attendant?
You could probably strangle two of them, one with each hand.
You know, if you were lucky enough to catch them in that little kitchen area.
Before they break out the f***ing peanuts, you know.
But you could get the job done, if you really cared enough.
So why is it they allow a guy with big powerful hands to get on board an airplane?
I'll tell you why.
They know he's not a security risk, because he's already answered the three big questions.
Question number one.
Did you pack your bags yourself?
No.
Carrot Top packed my bags.
He...
He and Martha Stewart and Florence Henderson came over to the house last night.
Fixed me a lovely Lobster Newberg.
Gave me a full body massage with sacred oils from India.
Performed a four-way around the world, and then they packed my bags.
Next question.
Have your bags been in your possession the whole time?
No.
Usually the night before I travel, just as the movie goes on.
The night before I travel, just as the moon is rising.
I place my suitcases out on the street corner and leave them there unattended for several hours.
Just for good luck.
Next question.
Has any unknown person asked you to take anything on board?
Hmm.
Well, what exactly is an unknown person?
Surely everyone is known to someone.
In fact, just this morning, Kareem and Yousef Ali Bengaba...
...seemed to know each other quite well.
They kept joking about which one of my suitcases was the heaviest.
And that's another thing they don't like at the airport.
Jokes.
You know?
Yeah, you can't joke about a bomb.
Well, why is it just jokes?
What about a riddle?
How about a limerick?
How about a bomb anecdote?
You know, no punchline, just a really cute story.
Or, suppose you intended the remark, not as a joke, but as an ironic musing.
Are they prepared to make that distinction?
Why, I think not.
And besides, who's to say what's funny?
Airport security is a stupid idea, it's a waste of money...
...and it's only there for one reason, to make white people feel safe.
That's all.
The illusion.
The feeling and illusion of safety.
To placate the middle class.
Because the authorities know they can't make an airplane completely safe.
Too many people have access.
You'll notice the drug smugglers don't seem to have a lot of trouble...
...getting their little packages on board, do they?
No, and God bless them too.
Yes.
Oh, and by the way, an airplane flight shouldn't be completely safe.
You need a little danger in your life.
Take a f***ing chance once in a while, will you?
What are you going to do, play with your prick for another 30 years?
What, are you going to read People Magazine and eat at Wendy's till the end of time?
Take a f***ing chance.
Besides, even if they made all the airplanes completely safe...
...the terrorists would simply start bombing other places that are crowded.
Porn shops, crack houses, beauty bars and gang bangs.
You know, entertainment venues.
The odds of you being killed by a terrorist are practically zero.
So I say relax and enjoy the show.
You have to be a realist.
You have to be realistic about terrorism.
Certain groups of people, certain groups...
...Muslim fundamentalists, Christian fundamentalists, Jewish fundamentalists...
...and just plain guys from Montana...
...are going to continue to make life in this country very interesting for a long, long time.
That's the reality.
Angry men in combat fatigues talking to God on a two-way radio...
...and muttering incoherent slogans about freedom...
...are eventually going to provide us with a great deal of entertainment.
Especially after your stupid f***ing economy collapses all around you...
...and the terrorists come out of the woodwork.
You'll have anthrax in the water supply and sarin gas in your air conditioners.
There'll be chemical and biological suitcase bombs in every city.
And I say enjoy it. Relax. Enjoy the show.
Take a f***ing chance. Put a little fun in your life.
To me, terrorism is exciting. It's exciting.
I think the very idea that you can set off a bomb in a marketplace...
...and kill several hundred people is exciting and stimulating...
...and I see it as a form of entertainment.
Entertainment. That's all it is.
Yeah.
But I also know that most Americans are soft and frightened and unimaginative...
...and they don't realize there's such a thing as dangerous fun.
And they certainly don't recognize a good show when they see one.
I have always been willing to put myself at great personal risk...
...for the sake of entertainment.
And I've always been willing to put you at great personal risk for the same reason.
Far as I'm concerned, all of this airport security...
...all the searches, the screenings, the cameras, the questions...
...it's just one more way of reducing your liberty...
...and reminding you that they can f*** with you anytime they want.
As long as you put up with it.
As long as you put up with it.
Which means, of course, anytime they want.
Because that's what Americans do now.
They're always willing to trade away a little of their freedom...
...in exchange for the feeling, the illusion of security.
Oh, yes. And that's George Carlin.
Actually, that was pre-9-11.
It was 1999.
But I think his message pretty much stayed the same.
In fact, it intensified afterwards.
I'm sorry, folks.
I realize some of you might have been offended by those audio problems that we had.
Certain words, for some reason, just sort of blanked out.
I don't know why.
I think there's some kind of automated device we have that does that.
It's very odd.
It is odd.
If those words go through, just chaos reigns on the land.
Yeah, so we didn't want that to happen.
So we turned on the machine that stops that.
But was anybody offended by the actual words that did go through?
Plain. Totally offended.
You're totally offended?
Okay. Well, then, Rob?
The.
He didn't like that word.
Not a fan.
The broken whiskey bottle scared me.
Uh-huh. And Bernie down in Philadelphia.
You keep saying that.
Well, I'm hoping he's there.
There's a light right here when he's there, and there's no light right there now.
What if the light was burned out?
That's the quietest Bernie's ever been.
Well, maybe he's stunned into silence.
A lot of people are.
Imagine hearing this on the radio.
Now, Laszlo, you work in or have worked in commercial radio.
I'm still doing radio.
I'm doing a radio show on Saturday on XM.
Tell us how to get it.
Well, pay money.
And on XM202 on Opie and Anthony's channel, I do a talk show.
The Laszlo Show, which used to be on KROQ here in New York,
has moved to satellite where I can say the seven words.
Will you say them this week just for us?
Yes.
Really? I'll tune in for that.
I'll get an XM receiver somehow.
Yes, 9 p.m. on XM202.
All right.
Those are in all the new cars, right?
I'll bust into one of those and get one of the XM things.
You can listen to it online, too.
It streams.
Oh, okay. I'll do that then.
That's free to listen to online?
Yeah, you can send it.
It'll do it free for a little while, for like a day or something.
Okay.
Well, then I'll do it for that day.
But, you know, we were supposed to be on XM for a little while.
Remember that?
I know.
I was trying to get this show on XM.
We were talking to some people at XM.
They were very enthusiastic about getting off the hook
or a variant of off the hook on XM,
and then they got fired or something.
And then nobody else ever picked it up after that.
I think we're too controversial for them.
Well, there's a whole public radio channel on XM.
What really disturbs me, though, about satellite radio in general
is there's so many conservative stations, like the family talk stations.
There's a ton of them.
Oh, yeah.
And then there's like one channel with Randy Rhoades on it.
And she's not even that good.
Right. The balance is—
I'm sorry. I had to say it, but she's not that good.
I listen to her on the—
The balance is really bad.
I've talked to the guys in charge of programming there,
and they said, well, you know, they think that's where the market is.
You know, let us show them where the market is.
Right.
Because they couldn't find anything out there.
We'll point our way to the market, and they'll see.
But what's really interesting is one of the highest-rated channels on XM
is the comedy channel.
Really?
And you can turn on there and listen to Carlin bits uncensored.
Yeah.
Yeah, and that's the only—
I mean, you can't do that on commercial radio, right?
It's—I don't know why.
Even the tame pieces, they would never play that.
What's really bizarre about the whole FCC thing with Carlin,
and I know from reading an interview the other day,
he was quite proud of what this station did
and how they stood up for everything through that whole mess.
But it's really odd that the FCC has set these rules now,
and corporate radio is scared to even go beyond them.
After 10 o'clock on corporate radio, you can say profane words.
But CBS and Clear Channel and the like have blanket policies.
There's FCC violation or what the FCC deems is bad,
and then there's another layer of even more words.
You should see the book that CBS—
when we were on KROQ, they gave us this book that was like an inch thick
of all the things that we could not do, could not talk about.
They said you couldn't make jokes about religions.
Even Pacifica, our parent, goes beyond what the FCC says.
The safe harbor is pretty much restricted as well.
Yeah, they don't care about this.
So this is the danger when you have censorship,
is that it inspires self-censorship on top of that just to be safe.
The college station I work at out on the island,
for a time, the safe harbor was 10 to 6.
Well, they felt it should be 11 to 5 just to be safe,
and then they figured, well, maybe it should be 12, and then 12, 15.
It just kept getting smaller and smaller, and it was pretty insane,
and this is happening all over the place.
How much of the world is like that?
I don't think that—I mean, obviously, there will be some countries
that have very restrictive radio, but in general, I remember being—
Western countries tend not to.
Yeah, I remember being in Finland, and I was just listening to the radio
in the middle of the day, and the radio hosts were watching this online video,
this viral video that involved two girls in a cup,
and they were commenting on it, and you could hear it in the background.
This was two girls in the World Cup, right?
It was like a soccer thing.
And they were reacting like any normal person would to such a video,
and words and all, and I was kind of amused by it
because I knew that if I was here—
Well, I mean, we all remember the Janet Jackson thing in the Super Bowl
and how that traumatized the nation, but I once read this story about
there was full frontal nudity on a Spanish television,
a children's television show once,
and basically the reaction was that they just said,
please don't do that again because it might not be appropriate for kids.
Something just happened, and everybody got over it,
and they kind of just chalked it up as something a little bit amusing,
and nobody was traumatized, so it's a fundamental difference.
Do you think with the influx of the values from other parts of the world,
as IKEA spreads through the nation, that maybe we'll adopt more of those
sort of like Swedish and Finland kind of—
Those Nordic values.
No, the answer to your question is no.
We'll just get a bunch of cheap crappy furniture.
Listen, it's all about what you challenge and what you stand up for.
I mean, a lot of us, we like to be victims.
We like to say, oh, look how we're being oppressed,
and we're not going to be able to say this anymore,
so we're going to have to restrict freedom even more,
and we kind of do it to prove a point.
I think we need to stand up more and just say,
no, we're not going to do this, and take the risk.
Nobody's willing to take the risk.
Now, obviously, here at this station, we basically live day to day,
but something like CBS, Clear Channel, they have the means.
They can fight.
People like Howard Stern, they have the money.
They can stand up to the powers that be, and I think it's an obligation.
I think you have to do that.
Yeah, but they don't care enough.
I mean, they're making money, and that's all they care about.
That's the problem.
We need someone who makes money and cares.
Well, they are making money.
The issue is, and it's one of the reasons I've been so proud working on
Grand Theft Auto and working with Rockstar,
so many media companies, when people get up in their face
and say, you can't do that, they backpedal.
And if you look at what CBS and all these other media companies do,
they're backpedaling and backpedaling and backpedaling,
making their content softer,
and subsequently less people want to consume that content.
You know, I'm good friends with Opie and Anthony,
and those guys are constantly chastised and told words that they've been using
for 10 years on the air can suddenly not be used anymore.
And it's frustrating for them as broadcasters,
but also how can you set those rules when anybody in America can get on the
internet and go to break.com or YouTube or whatever
and find insanely offensive stuff?
Now, well, that's why I read a report today where the majority of Americans
seem to favor the creation of an FCC for the internet.
Yeah.
Actually, I have it right here.
A recent poll from Rasmussen shows that just under half of Americans believe
that a regulatory body similar to the FCC should regulate the internet
in the same manner as TV and radio.
35% disagree, 16% have no opinion.
The creation of such a commission would be difficult to ever come to fruition,
obviously, and with issues such as net neutrality facing the web,
government regulation of online content would be an uphill battle,
to say the least.
Now, here's how it breaks down.
Women surveyed felt stronger about internet regulation than men,
55% in favor, 25% opposed,
20% undecided.
46% of men surveyed opposed such regulation,
with 42% in favor, 12% unsure.
Where do they find these people?
I don't know, but they are out there.
I think we all know this.
They found the people with telephone lines is what they found.
Well, I think most people do have telephone lines.
That's weird.
But getting back to Opie and Anthony,
now these are the guys that encourage people to have sex in St. Patrick's Cathedral.
Not only, well, no, they didn't encourage people to have sex in St. Patrick's Cathedral.
It was part of a promotion, and even stranger,
it was a promotion sponsored by Sam Adams.
It was called Sex for Sam,
and people would call while they were having sex in public,
or somebody was observing it,
the people having sex in public,
and different places throughout New York,
and then some dummies decided to go into the church,
and then all hell broke loose.
Well, they aired it, and they pretty much,
they were a part of it.
There's no question about that.
Correct.
My question to you is, you know these guys,
do they really care about the freedom of speech aspect of it,
or do they just care about the ratings?
More of the freedom of speech.
Really? Okay.
Yeah, it's not just the ratings.
And to be honest, they're more interested in just entertainment.
You know, it's so difficult,
and when I was doing the Laszlo show on KROQ,
it's so difficult entertaining people
when every month it seems
you get pushed more and more towards this
everything has to be okay for kids.
You know, there needs to be entertainment for adults,
and it's amazing that you can't say the F word on the radio
because you're afraid that children might hear it,
which is basically the issue, isn't it?
Children use it more than we do.
Right.
I don't know if you've been around some teenagers,
even eight-year-olds,
but the mouths on them are unbelievable.
I used it when I was four.
Really?
Yeah, I set the record in Jamaica, Queens.
Apparently.
Nice.
That's why I'm told that.
But, yeah, so, I mean, it's basically an issue
that doesn't seem to be changing.
That's what worries me.
It seems like we're just kind of mired in this whole
these are the words you cannot say,
these are the thoughts you may not express,
and I'm afraid we're just going to get used to it.
And, you know, it's so silly that people can take offense.
I guess I get the intent behind the word or something
because I remember when I was a small kid,
I learned a word in Finnish that I had no idea what it meant,
but I used it all the time because I'd heard it,
and it turns out it was like the worst curse you could say in Finnish,
and I was just saying it all the time.
And if you say it here, we get in trouble for that, too,
because we're supposed to know somehow all the languages,
so don't ever say it.
Well, I won't say anything then.
Yeah, please.
But, I mean, just so at what point did it become offensive
when somebody told me what it meant?
Was it about fish?
All right.
Well, just to give people information.
The Finns, they like fish.
That's true.
Did you eat a lot of fish?
I did.
Dude, you've got to talk on the mic.
Sorry.
Radio 101, bro.
Yeah, I know.
You guys got to learn how to use microphones and talk into them.
Fair enough.
All right.
So, basically, let me give the facts about this whole FCC versus Pacifica thing,
because we did play the Carlin,
and I think it's important that the facts be known.
And we'll take some phone calls.
We've got Laszlo here in the studio from commercial radio and Grand Theft Auto
and things like that.
No, satellite radio.
Satellite radio.
What's commercial?
Do you have commercials?
Yeah, we do play commercials,
which I actually encourage because you've got to go to the bathroom
because we drink beer on the show.
And you can do that, too, because you can't do that here.
Of course, we just have common sense,
but also I think it's against FCC regulations to have alcohol.
You're not allowed to drink on the air.
Yeah.
We don't even allow soda in here because people spill things.
On satellite, there's drugs consumed on the air.
All right.
Well, we don't have to get into all those details.
I mean, not on my show much.
Uh-huh.
Anyway, back in 1973, that's when we played the piece called Filthy Words,
George Carlin routine broadcast here over WBAI in the afternoon.
And basically what happened is this father complained to the FCC
that his son had heard the routine and was deeply disturbed by it.
It took five years.
It took five years for the U.S. Supreme Court to hear this case.
By which point the son was probably, like, growing up and no longer offended.
I'd like to track these people down.
I mean, I'm not saying that like a threat.
I'd like to track these people down and ask them what they think now.
See if he's still offended.
Yeah.
See if he's been ruined for life, this kid.
Maybe he has been, though.
What would you say if he was?
Then I would say the FCC is right, and I would apologize.
Words hurt.
They're more hurtful than bombs.
Anyway, the U.S. Supreme Court upheld the FCC action,
which basically was reprimanding us.
The vote was five to four, so it was pretty close.
They ruled that the routine was indecent but not obscene.
The court accepted as compelling the government's interest in, one,
shielding children from patently offensive material,
and, two, ensuring that unwanted speech does not enter one's home.
Yeah, good luck with that.
Wait, wait.
So when there's, like, people screaming outside my window, the FCC will, like, come help me?
It is going through the airwaves.
It's going through the air.
Yeah, and they are in charge of that.
It's entering my home.
The court stated that the FCC had the authority to prohibit such broadcasts during hours
when children were likely to be among the audience
and gave the FCC broad leeway to determine what constituted indecency in different contexts.
We were fined $10,000.
In 1973, that was a billion dollars.
Yeah, and we also had legal bills of a few hundred thousand dollars,
which I don't think we ever paid.
And that's the thing.
Isn't it also that these words aren't, like, written down somewhere?
You can't say these.
They're written down right on the wall here.
But isn't the FCC able to decide?
Tomorrow they could say that paperclip is offensive, and then if I said that on the air?
Yeah, they could, I suppose.
That's sort of the domino effect of these things, you know?
Slippery slope, all that.
Well, I myself am offended by paperclips.
All right, well, we'll get right on.
If someone from FCC is listening.
Yeah, get on the petition there.
Now, Leslie, I want to ask you something, and we'll take phone calls, 212-209-2900.
Now, working on Grand Theft Auto, this is a game about people stealing cars
and being violent and hitting people with baseball bats and all kinds of other things going on.
Have you guys ever been put under pressure to tone it down a little bit?
And if so, how?
Well, it seemed like every game that we released, we got just dragged across the coals.
And with this last one, Grand Theft Auto IV, which came out April 29th,
it seemed the media started to sort of get it that it's an entertainment art form,
much like a movie or a TV show on HBO.
Now, don't get me wrong.
The press still loves to attack video games and so forth.
But if you do an edgy adult crime fiction story and put it on HBO and call it The Sopranos,
you get a wall full of awards.
If you do an edgy crime fiction story in a virtual city and call it Grand Theft Auto,
then you've got people coming out of the woodwork.
And it's basically people don't have an issue with Grand Theft Auto.
Their issue is with video games.
It's a media that confuses them, and they're intimidated by it.
And it's interesting.
I did interviews on radio stations nationwide and internationally around the world.
I went on a media tour before the game came out.
You have to be really careful what you say because any quote,
and I learned a lot about the media,
any quote that you give on a radio station on the West Coast will all of a sudden be taken out of context
and put in a story in The Washington Post.
I mean, I was printed in newspapers nationwide, and it was really bizarre.
But once people actually play Grand Theft Auto, they realize that it's a comment.
It's satire on American consumerism and culture.
There's fake radio stations with fake commercials and fake DJs that are all making fun of this crazy commercialism,
the love of war.
There's a conservative station in there that's a spoof of conservative talk radio,
and there's a spoof of NPR in it, and we make fun of liberals.
Can we put a whole episode of Off the Hook on the next one?
Only if we could make fun of how boring the show is.
Yeah, we could do that.
Totally.
We did it all the time.
That's one of the things that we always do with Grand Theft Auto and the comedy in the game
is you have to make fun of both sides politically with equal enthusiasm
because the left and the right both need to be skewered and called out.
Let's take some phone calls.
We're with Lazlo.
It better not be Bernie.
Grand Theft.
Well, we've been trying to reach him, but I don't think he's there.
Lazlo from Grand Theft Auto and XM Radio and all kinds of other fun things.
He's been with us for a long time, and let's see who's out there.
Good evening.
You're on.
Yeah.
That's Bernie.
I bet you have a better phone system at XM, don't you?
It's pretty nice.
Good evening.
You're on Off the Hook.
Oh, hi there.
I love the show.
I'm looking forward to the live show.
Thanks.
I don't know what that noise is.
Don't worry.
It sounds like a ring, doesn't it?
Oh, can you hear me?
Yeah, I hear you, but I hear this weird squelching kind of noise.
We think your line is tapped.
Yeah.
That was my speakerphone.
Okay.
I love your show.
I'm looking forward to the last Hope Conference.
I mailed you a postal money order for $75 four weeks ago, and I still don't have my ticket.
You mailed it to who?
Middle Island, New York.
Okay.
Well, you should be getting it.
Let me give the phone number out for anybody who has any questions about their Hope tickets,
whether it's through the radio station or through 2600.
It's 631-751-2600, and the people there will be very helpful as far as tracking down your
order and reassuring you that everything will be okay, and everything will be okay.
I left two messages for Mary, and I still haven't heard.
Suddenly, this is the customer support line.
This is a radio show.
Send an email to oth at 2600.com if you haven't received any satisfaction, and we'll personally
pursue it, all right?
I appreciate it.
Thanks.
All right.
No problem.
Again, 631-751-2600 is the number to resolve those issues, and don't worry.
They will be resolved one way or another.
We still have a little bit of time.
You can also pay cash.
We should point that out.
You don't have to buy in advance.
You can show up at the show and pay cash and go under an assumed name.
You might not get the special RFID tags, which some people might not want anyway, but we
have, I think, 1,500.
Are you going to track me during the show?
We can.
Lex, do you want to tell us something about this?
It's the AMD project, we're calling it.
Yeah.
We're giving 1,400 people at the door an RFID tracking tag, and we're going to track where
they go during the conference and who they hang out with.
This is all in good fun, though, not nosy.
Yeah.
We're going to ask them their interests through a web survey, and we're going to do data mining
based on what time the seminars were and whether they were in a certain seminar.
If they lied on the survey, we'll find out which things they were interested in.
This is all in good fun, but someday it might not be so easy to opt out of it, so it's kind
of fun to learn to see how the system works and how to manipulate it.
And it comes with a blinking red light.
Blinking red light.
Blinking red light.
What's really interesting about what we're doing here is that we're opening the system,
and when you get tracked by RFID in other situations, like by the federal government
and your passport and that sort of thing, you don't get to figure out anything about
what they're doing with the data.
You don't see any part of the system.
And this is your chance to do that.
Our system is completely transparent, and it's a big fun game, too, so we're really
opening up the technology and letting people have a peek under the hood.
Yeah.
And this is your badge, right?
The show badge?
That's right.
And if you actually go across the Whitestone Bridge with it, it charges a manual $5.
Yeah, don't do that, please.
Let's take another phone call.
And good evening.
You're on Off the Hook.
Ah, okay.
I was listening to the George Carlin stuff earlier, and I was kind of wondering, has
anyone ever gotten into the proposition that the federal government probably doesn't really
have the right to control radio waves?
Because it's part of the electromagnetic spectrum, you mean.
How do they have the right to do that?
Well, because I know how they got it at first.
It was kind of a military thing based upon people using the radio to do things, you know,
give coded messages or what have you during wartime.
But that was kind of an emergency situation.
That emergency situation no longer exists.
I think we're at war, sir.
Are we not at war against bad things?
Right, but right now, there's so much technology that coded messages could be given on that
at this point, radio would be somewhat superfluous.
And also, they don't have the right to tax, because me and Wesley Snipes both stop paying taxes.
All right, good luck with that.
But I think the sad fact is that once you give up rights, you don't get them back.
And that's something that people should keep in mind whenever they do give up anything.
I think the federal government's role in radio wave control is mostly because you have to have a traffic cop
because you can't have two stations on the same frequency.
Well, that's, yeah, okay.
Just for technical reasons, you have to have a traffic cop.
And that's what the FCC was originally started to do, not to regulate content.
They've gone way out of control.
To make sure 99.5 doesn't wander over to 102.7, which we used to do.
No, we never did that.
And good evening.
They hung up.
They're now lobbying to regulate satellite radio.
They're lobbying to regulate everything.
Good evening.
You're on Off The Hook.
Hi.
This is the first time I'm calling you guys.
It's a great show.
I've always enjoyed listening to you.
Cool.
Thanks.
There's something that George Carlin has written about aging, which is pretty funny, too.
Like kids, when they are small, they just are so happy to grow up.
They say, I'm 5 1⁄2, I'm 6 1⁄2.
And then in middle age, they start saying, now you turn 30.
And it's pretty funny.
I'll send it to you.
Yeah, he had a great sense of reality of how things actually work and what we all think and all that.
Exactly.
And when you get to be 100, now you become a kid again and you say, I'm 100 1⁄2.
Yes, absolutely.
And you start hiding your age when it's in the middle.
And when you become 100, you say, I'm 100 1⁄2.
I was listening to you about all this hysteria about things, the words on the radio, all this was being shown on TV.
It did amaze me, the whole hoopla that happened about Janet Jackson in that little one millisecond.
I was watching that because I don't watch football, but I like the show in the middle.
So I was watching that show.
It's just the people repeating the scene over and over and over again, which disgusted me the same way when the shuttle exploded.
They kept on showing the same thing over and over again as if you weren't convinced the first time.
So now they are acting hypocrites.
They always suffer.
Oh, we were so shocked.
They were not shocked.
If you were shocked, you wouldn't show it again.
So in case everybody missed it, you want everybody to see your millisecond of shock.
This is so much hypocrisy in this thing.
And I love George Carlin and I love your show.
Thank you very much.
Thanks.
Thanks for your call.
Thank you, Ms. Cleo.
All right.
And good evening.
You're on Off the Hook.
Oh, no, look at that.
What's wrong with his phone system?
Good evening.
You're on Off the Hook.
Oh, I object to Carlin praising drug dealers and Mugabe should be supported.
BAI is attacking Mugabe.
All right.
You know, if you call every single program and say the same thing, you've got mental problems.
Face it.
And get treatment, please.
Because I'm so sick of people that just say the same thing over and over again.
Does that guy call a lot?
Every single show, over and over, saying the same thing.
And he's not the only one.
So many people do this.
You should put him as one of the crazy callers on the next Grand Theft Auto.
Yeah.
You know what?
There's a job for you there.
But seriously.
You can't really parody something.
I know.
Say something different and relevant.
It's not that much to ask.
When you're a lonely man and you've got a box on the wall that talks to you,
you have to call every hour and say the same thing over and over.
Good evening.
You're on Off the Hook.
Hi.
Two comments.
Yes.
One, perhaps you could convince the publisher of your best of 2,600 to expand it to 2,600 pages.
And then you could leave it in some of the things that you cut so painfully.
Yeah.
Well, nobody would ever be able to pick it up then, would they?
Well, it would be multi-volume.
You could have one volume for each decade.
Well, you know, I did want to do that.
I thought that would be a good idea, but I wasn't able to sell that.
My other comment was many years ago, I think it was back in 1976,
back when there were records and tapes,
I was offered as a premium the record and or tape album that had George Carlin's
Seven Dirty Words on it.
And my premium was never given to me.
Do you know if there's anyone there now that it's come out in the new edition,
All My Stuff, who could help me fulfill my dream?
Now, wait.
When did this happen?
Yeah.
What year was this?
I believe it was back in 1976.
Wow.
You hold a grudge, woman.
You're saying that you didn't get your premium from 1976.
It's nice to know that the same complaints just keep going from decade to decade.
Gosh, we'd have to track down some people.
Well, you know, George Carlin is definitely, you know, the topic of the day.
Absolutely.
You know, I'm sure somebody would be able to help out somehow.
But, you know, I would say call the premiums people here,
but, boy, that would just be cruel to them, wouldn't it?
They already have enough people complaining about current ones,
let alone one from 1976.
I don't know.
I don't know.
You have me speechless here.
It's very nice of you to keep listening to the station,
even though you've been waiting for over 30 years.
It really is, and hopefully one day it will show up.
Can no one help me?
You know, we'll ask around.
That's all we can do.
You certainly could try the premiums department,
but if they even have a copy, you know, they might not.
All right.
We're going to get one more phone call in, and good evening.
You're on off the hook.
Speak up, please.
Hello?
Yes, go ahead.
You're on the air.
Oh, hi.
Yes.
Turn down the radio, please.
You're going to confuse everybody.
I wanted to talk to you about your discussion of, say,
quote dirty words on the radio.
Yes.
I'm listening to you via WBCQ, your shortwave relay on 7415.
And you do know that WBCQ advertises itself as a, quote,
free speech radio station, right?
That's what I hear, yes.
Well, I've heard all of the dirty words,
and I think I've actually heard the Carlin bit on WBCQ.
They do not restrict themselves, and I think any of you
and any of your broadcasters, any of your fellow programmers
and the like who are concerned about not being able to say
what they want to say over commercial FM radio
should buy some time on WBCQ.
It's very, very cheap.
Their voices will be heard all across the country,
and they can say anything they want.
Okay.
Well, I'm sure.
They have stations that are incredibly obscene.
I'm not sure exactly how they get away with that,
because they are subject to various kinds of regulations.
Nobody seems to stop it.
Well, okay.
I might come to a crashing halt now.
Thanks for blowing the cover, dude.
I guess people will find out.
Maybe we can find out some clues as to why that is.
But thanks for that call.
We're out of time, so once again,
we want to remind people to go to www.hope.net
for more information on the conference.
Laszlo, you have something to say?
Yes, and my website is lazlow.com
if you want more information on the show I'm doing on Saturday.
And Laszlo will also be speaking at the last Hope Conference
on Sunday, the Sunday of the conference,
talking about Grand Theft Auto and all kinds of other fun things.
And we can be reached, oth2600.com,
if you have anything to say.
This is Emanuel for Off The Hook.
Have a good night.