WEBVTT 00:00.000 --> 00:02.500 I love my binary revolution radio. 00:02.500 --> 00:04.700 I love my Radio Freak America. 00:07.300 --> 00:09.500 You got your freak in my revolution. 00:09.500 --> 00:12.400 You got your revolution in my Freak America. 00:12.400 --> 00:16.400 That's some tasty binary revolution Radio Freak America. 00:16.400 --> 00:20.900 With Stank Dog as usual and with Dual Parallel Special Freak Sauce. 00:30.000 --> 00:33.000 I see in binary, I speak source code. 00:33.000 --> 00:37.000 Step on my toes, I'll post a million jpegs of you in a fag pose. 00:37.000 --> 00:40.000 In your digital stance, getting firewalled ho. 00:40.000 --> 00:42.000 Cause I'm riding the net in my six foe. 00:42.000 --> 00:44.000 I was a dick with my 56. 00:44.000 --> 00:47.000 Now with my cable, I'm able to get that stable. 00:47.000 --> 00:49.000 On the out, my name is Ace and I'm a Leo. 00:49.000 --> 00:53.000 On the digital highway, my name is Neo and I'm a hero. 00:53.000 --> 00:56.000 In a flash, I'll school you on burning Dreamcasts. 00:56.000 --> 00:59.000 You need some ISOs? Let me through my hard drive rifle. 00:59.000 --> 01:01.000 Our exchange you could never stifle. 01:01.000 --> 01:04.000 In a digital hug, you just caught the love bug. 01:04.000 --> 01:06.000 I bootlegged your CD. 01:06.000 --> 01:08.000 I caused a fight between Un and Jay-Z. 01:08.000 --> 01:10.000 Your CG, it's all good to be free. 01:10.000 --> 01:13.000 Whether we take it by force or we take it nicely. 01:13.000 --> 01:15.000 You feel that rattle in your bones? 01:15.000 --> 01:17.000 When I tell you we just hacked out Jones? 01:17.000 --> 01:19.000 And NASDAQ leaves you flat on your back? 01:19.000 --> 01:21.000 Cause I am he who loves to hack and crack. 01:21.000 --> 01:24.000 Cause I am he who loves to hack and crack. 01:24.000 --> 01:27.000 This is dedicated to the hackers and the criminals. 01:27.000 --> 01:32.000 Serial codes, source codes, ISOs, RANs, SIFs, SIFs. 01:32.000 --> 01:35.000 This is dedicated to the hackers and the crack. 01:36.000 --> 01:41.000 Alright, and welcome to episode 4 of Binary Revolution Radio. 01:41.000 --> 01:45.000 I am StankDawg and I'm joined as always with... 01:45.000 --> 01:46.000 Wintermute! 01:46.000 --> 01:47.000 In the house! 01:47.000 --> 01:49.000 In the house! 01:49.000 --> 01:50.000 Wait a minute! 01:50.000 --> 01:53.000 Wait a minute, what's wrong with this picture? 01:53.000 --> 01:54.000 What's wrong with this picture? 01:54.000 --> 01:57.000 I'm Wintermute and I've hit puberty. 01:58.000 --> 02:00.000 I was going to piss him off. 02:00.000 --> 02:01.000 Over the weekend? 02:01.000 --> 02:02.000 We don't know where he is! 02:02.000 --> 02:04.000 Actually yeah, we know where he is. 02:04.000 --> 02:05.000 You do know where he is? 02:05.000 --> 02:06.000 Okay. 02:06.000 --> 02:09.000 Yes, actually we had a little interaction, a little encounter this weekend. 02:09.000 --> 02:14.000 Actually, Mute and I met in real life and went to Universal Studios Florida this weekend. 02:14.000 --> 02:18.000 So that was a pretty good weekend, had a lot of fun. 02:18.000 --> 02:25.000 So, because Mute is on to bigger and better things and out this week unable to record, 02:25.000 --> 02:30.000 I had to, you know, go through the minor leagues to try to come up with a last minute replacement. 02:30.000 --> 02:34.000 And in case you don't already know, mystery guest, please introduce yourself now. 02:34.000 --> 02:35.000 I'm Duel. 02:35.000 --> 02:37.000 Duel Parallel. 02:37.000 --> 02:38.000 In the house! 02:38.000 --> 02:41.000 It's not quite the same. 02:41.000 --> 02:42.000 Yeah, I know. 02:42.000 --> 02:43.000 That's his catchphrase. 02:43.000 --> 02:44.000 It's like regal or something. 02:44.000 --> 02:45.000 That's his catchphrase. 02:45.000 --> 02:46.000 We'll have to leave him with that one. 02:46.000 --> 02:49.000 It's like Duel off the freaking, you know, the street or something, you know. 02:49.000 --> 02:52.000 This is the infamous Duel Parallel from Radio Freak America. 02:52.000 --> 02:53.000 Thank you very much. 02:53.000 --> 02:57.000 The greatest hacking freaking underground show on the internet. 02:57.000 --> 02:58.000 Check it out. 02:58.000 --> 02:59.000 Wednesdays. 02:59.000 --> 03:00.000 Come on man, I'm pimping it. 03:00.000 --> 03:01.000 Wednesday? 03:01.000 --> 03:03.000 Oh yeah, Wednesday on Rant Radio. 03:03.000 --> 03:05.000 Same station you're on. 03:05.000 --> 03:08.000 And it is a good show. 03:08.000 --> 03:09.000 You will like it. 03:09.000 --> 03:12.000 No, it's on the 8th Pacific, Wednesday nights. 03:12.000 --> 03:16.000 You can download it at oldskoolphreak.com afterwards, shortly afterwards. 03:16.000 --> 03:18.000 I'm usually pretty good about getting it up soon. 03:18.000 --> 03:19.000 We've got a great show now. 03:19.000 --> 03:20.000 What? 03:20.000 --> 03:22.000 You're pretty good at what? 03:22.000 --> 03:25.000 Oh shit, no! 03:25.000 --> 03:26.000 No! 03:26.000 --> 03:29.000 Man, you just walked right in. 03:29.000 --> 03:31.000 I didn't even have to trick you into saying that. 03:31.000 --> 03:32.000 You're recording this show. 03:32.000 --> 03:34.000 You know what, I'm just going to leave it in. 03:34.000 --> 03:39.000 I won't even save that for a blackmail situation like you did to me on your last episode. 03:39.000 --> 03:41.000 No, I didn't know such thing. 03:41.000 --> 03:43.000 You totally took my phrase. 03:43.000 --> 03:45.000 Look, for those... 03:45.000 --> 03:50.000 Yeah, you just owned me, you know, while I was down and out freaking on travel. 03:50.000 --> 03:55.000 Well, just to set the record straight to the listeners who were listening to our opening, 03:55.000 --> 03:58.000 that was one of our outtakes from Radio Freak America on the last episode. 03:58.000 --> 04:00.000 Duel was giving me a little payback. 04:00.000 --> 04:04.000 You know, when I call and when I'm talking to Duel and we're getting ready to do the show, 04:04.000 --> 04:05.000 I know he's recording everything. 04:05.000 --> 04:07.000 No, I let you know. 04:07.000 --> 04:14.000 I know, and I know and I just play along and I just say funny things and, you know, it comes out of context. 04:14.000 --> 04:19.000 You know, the actual context, I don't mind that Duel records me, but when I'm talking to your mom, Duel, 04:19.000 --> 04:21.000 I really think you should turn the recorder on. 04:21.000 --> 04:22.000 I'm just saying. 04:22.000 --> 04:24.000 That's fine. 04:24.000 --> 04:26.000 Seriously, they're hilarious. 04:26.000 --> 04:28.000 I've got tons of outtakes for the next special. 04:28.000 --> 04:32.000 If anybody hasn't listened to episode 50 of Radio Freak America, check it out. 04:32.000 --> 04:33.000 It's pretty funny. 04:33.000 --> 04:34.000 I saved up all those outtakes. 04:34.000 --> 04:36.000 Here's what I do before the show. 04:36.000 --> 04:38.000 Like, thanks, we get everybody together. 04:38.000 --> 04:39.000 It's kind of... 04:39.000 --> 04:41.000 It's two-fold, right? 04:41.000 --> 04:44.000 There's a double... 04:44.000 --> 04:45.000 How do I say it? 04:45.000 --> 04:47.000 We're killing two birds with one stone. 04:47.000 --> 04:50.000 We're getting the mood up and energy up for the show. 04:50.000 --> 04:52.000 As well as checking sound levels. 04:52.000 --> 04:54.000 So everybody knows we're recording. 04:54.000 --> 04:58.000 And we end up saying a lot of funny stuff and it leads to, you know, hilarious highlights. 04:58.000 --> 04:59.000 Or lowlights. 04:59.000 --> 05:05.000 But, if you use it in a different context, it can be used to one's advantage as it was. 05:05.000 --> 05:08.000 One person's highlight can be another person's lowlight. 05:08.000 --> 05:09.000 Yes, exactly, exactly. 05:09.000 --> 05:10.000 So, no, it's all in good fun. 05:10.000 --> 05:11.000 This is fun, by the way. 05:11.000 --> 05:14.000 We do this all the time and I'm sure you've got... 05:14.000 --> 05:15.000 I even said on... 05:15.000 --> 05:19.000 I said, when he pays me back, I said, he can do an entire episode of all of my weird 05:19.000 --> 05:21.000 and crazy and rude outtakes. 05:21.000 --> 05:22.000 Yeah, I could. 05:22.000 --> 05:23.000 I definitely could. 05:23.000 --> 05:25.000 I'm trying to say this is fun, being a guest. 05:25.000 --> 05:26.000 What? 05:26.000 --> 05:27.000 Just like this show where I was on travel and I called in. 05:27.000 --> 05:28.000 This is fun. 05:28.000 --> 05:32.000 I told you for how long how fun it was to be on RFA. 05:32.000 --> 05:33.000 Yeah, now I see why. 05:33.000 --> 05:34.000 It's a blast. 05:34.000 --> 05:35.000 I can surf, I can kick back. 05:35.000 --> 05:36.000 It is. 05:36.000 --> 05:37.000 It's a blast. 05:37.000 --> 05:39.000 Everybody should do a show. 05:39.000 --> 05:41.000 Do a show or get to be on somebody's show. 05:41.000 --> 05:42.000 It's so much fun. 05:42.000 --> 05:43.000 Thank you. 05:43.000 --> 05:48.000 And since you mentioned that, I am actually going to try to start rotating in some other 05:48.000 --> 05:49.000 guests. 05:49.000 --> 05:50.000 I know I spoke to... 05:50.000 --> 05:54.000 I probably shouldn't ruin it by saying it right now, but I spoke to some individuals 05:54.000 --> 05:55.000 in particular. 05:55.000 --> 05:56.000 They know who they are. 05:56.000 --> 05:57.000 Don't jinx it. 05:57.000 --> 05:58.000 What's that? 05:58.000 --> 05:59.000 Don't jinx it. 05:59.000 --> 06:00.000 No, no, no. 06:00.000 --> 06:01.000 We're definitely going to work. 06:01.000 --> 06:04.000 I mean, it's just a matter of timing and getting together for it. 06:04.000 --> 06:06.000 So, we'll be mixing the guests in. 06:06.000 --> 06:10.000 I still am too cheap to get a third line, you know, be able to do three-way calling. 06:10.000 --> 06:14.000 Maybe I'll work that in sometime soon, but hey, you know, what are you going to do? 06:14.000 --> 06:15.000 Yeah. 06:15.000 --> 06:19.000 Um, let's actually move into some housekeeping topics. 06:19.000 --> 06:25.000 I had put out a request, a challenge, a contest last episode for people to write show notes. 06:25.000 --> 06:28.000 Well, I guess nobody wants to write show notes. 06:28.000 --> 06:29.000 Well, wait a minute. 06:29.000 --> 06:30.000 I don't want to write show notes. 06:30.000 --> 06:32.000 I don't even like doing it and I have to write them for the show. 06:32.000 --> 06:34.000 I had to as well, but wait a minute. 06:34.000 --> 06:35.000 You just started, right? 06:35.000 --> 06:39.000 I mean, you just put the message out last show, right? 06:39.000 --> 06:40.000 Yeah, we just put it out last week. 06:40.000 --> 06:41.000 That's true. 06:41.000 --> 06:42.000 Ah, don't sweat it, man. 06:42.000 --> 06:44.000 Well, we'll give it a little more time. 06:44.000 --> 06:45.000 There's an address. 06:45.000 --> 06:48.000 You listened to last episode three, you'll hear where the address was to mail stuff in 06:48.000 --> 06:50.000 if you just still want to do it. 06:50.000 --> 06:56.000 Um, I do write notes for the show, for us, so we know what topics to cover, but my shows 06:56.000 --> 07:00.000 are, my notes are just way, way, way, way, way too verbose. 07:00.000 --> 07:04.000 I mean, it's like, you know, downloading the notes might take longer than downloading the 07:04.000 --> 07:05.000 show. 07:05.000 --> 07:06.000 Right. 07:06.000 --> 07:10.000 So, you know, I guess at some point if we want to, I can actually put up the text file 07:10.000 --> 07:14.000 and let people download my notes that I wrote to go along with the show. 07:14.000 --> 07:16.000 But, um, yeah, we'll, we'll see. 07:16.000 --> 07:19.000 If anybody wants to write the notes, listen to the last episode and you'll find directions 07:19.000 --> 07:23.000 on how to, and, um, if not, eventually when I get around to it, yeah, I'll probably post 07:23.000 --> 07:25.000 up the notes that I write. 07:25.000 --> 07:26.000 Um. 07:26.000 --> 07:27.000 Okay, too, because I listen to it. 07:27.000 --> 07:30.000 I just listen to, I actually listened to episode three twice this weekend. 07:30.000 --> 07:31.000 It was, I liked it so much. 07:31.000 --> 07:32.000 It was so good. 07:32.000 --> 07:33.000 Right. 07:33.000 --> 07:36.000 So I, maybe, you know, while I'm listening sometime, I'll, I'll start pounding stuff 07:36.000 --> 07:37.000 out for you. 07:37.000 --> 07:41.000 Yeah, that, that, that's true because, you know, I listen to stuff at work, you know, on my 07:41.000 --> 07:44.000 headphones, so a lot of times I might not listen to it a week or two later. 07:44.000 --> 07:45.000 So, yeah, we'll, we'll give it some time. 07:45.000 --> 07:46.000 Cool. 07:46.000 --> 07:52.000 Um, yeah, and actually, I didn't get really any email, so I take that as a good thing. 07:52.000 --> 07:54.000 I guess episode three was a step up. 07:54.000 --> 07:59.000 I guess we covered a lot more topics, had a lot more fun, a lot more diversity in the, 07:59.000 --> 08:00.000 in the topics and the subject matter. 08:00.000 --> 08:03.000 So, um, yeah, I, I'm, I'm hoping anyway. 08:03.000 --> 08:07.000 I don't want to say that I think we're getting better, but I hope we're getting better each 08:07.000 --> 08:08.000 and every episode. 08:08.000 --> 08:13.000 I mean, like you said, well, this is, this is episode four we're recording now and, you know, 08:13.000 --> 08:17.000 you know, hopefully episode five will be better and six will be better, et cetera, et cetera. 08:17.000 --> 08:21.000 Um, we can only hope to be around as long as Radio Freak America. 08:21.000 --> 08:25.000 You will be and I guarantee you'll get better and it's good already. 08:25.000 --> 08:27.000 I mean, I had fun listening to it. 08:27.000 --> 08:28.000 It's fun. 08:28.000 --> 08:30.000 I, it's, I wouldn't do it if it wasn't fun. 08:30.000 --> 08:31.000 I'm having a blast. 08:31.000 --> 08:32.000 Yeah. 08:32.000 --> 08:33.000 Absolutely a blast. 08:33.000 --> 08:34.000 So. 08:34.000 --> 08:35.000 And it's going to be fun for the listeners too. 08:35.000 --> 08:36.000 So yeah, you're, you're there, man. 08:36.000 --> 08:37.000 Well, between, between this and RFA. 08:37.000 --> 08:38.000 Yeah. 08:38.000 --> 08:39.000 I, this is, this is my release. 08:39.000 --> 08:41.000 This is my outlet for the week of having fun. 08:41.000 --> 08:43.000 So I absolutely have a blast. 08:43.000 --> 08:44.000 Right on. 08:44.000 --> 08:49.000 Um, actually we usually go into like our personal, you know, what we were doing this 08:49.000 --> 08:51.000 week, what kind of playing around we did. 08:51.000 --> 08:55.000 Did you, I know you have got Project Walmart Freedom going on. 08:55.000 --> 08:57.000 Have you got any news or anything going on? 08:57.000 --> 08:59.000 That is exactly what I've been doing. 08:59.000 --> 09:03.000 I've been frequenting Walmarts and that's scary, first of all. 09:03.000 --> 09:05.000 Did you say frequenting or freaking? 09:05.000 --> 09:06.000 Frequent, yes. 09:06.000 --> 09:07.000 Both. 09:07.000 --> 09:08.000 Both. 09:08.000 --> 09:10.000 And, uh, you know, learning a lot about stuff. 09:10.000 --> 09:14.000 I've got a link up on Old School Freak about something I learned about, uh, just been messing 09:14.000 --> 09:18.000 with their technology in general and getting, harvesting lots of phone numbers as well. 09:18.000 --> 09:21.000 You know, doing a little social engineering on their internal system. 09:21.000 --> 09:23.000 And actually I haven't gotten very far at that. 09:23.000 --> 09:27.000 You know, it's like I call up people, they don't know anything about the store they work 09:27.000 --> 09:28.000 in. 09:28.000 --> 09:29.000 It's weird. 09:29.000 --> 09:30.000 Well. 09:30.000 --> 09:31.000 There are other avenues. 09:31.000 --> 09:32.000 It's on a need to know basis. 09:32.000 --> 09:34.000 So I guess it depends on who you talk to. 09:34.000 --> 09:35.000 I guess. 09:35.000 --> 09:39.000 I get more stuff from, like, the notes that people write down, you know, to help themselves 09:39.000 --> 09:40.000 remember stuff, I guess. 09:40.000 --> 09:42.000 You know, and start just checking stuff out. 09:42.000 --> 09:43.000 So that's what I've been doing. 09:43.000 --> 09:45.000 Project Wal-Mart Freedom is what I've been working on. 09:45.000 --> 09:47.000 And it's a very impressive text file. 09:47.000 --> 09:51.000 Big shout out to Bland because he's been putting in some great stuff, so. 09:51.000 --> 09:52.000 And lots of other people. 09:52.000 --> 09:54.000 Too many people to list right now. 09:54.000 --> 09:55.000 It's going to be a great text file. 09:55.000 --> 10:00.000 But, yeah, just, again, all the names are going to be included in the text file. 10:00.000 --> 10:02.000 So, you know, send the stuff in. 10:02.000 --> 10:04.000 Listen to RFA for that information. 10:04.000 --> 10:07.000 Um, did you want to, did you have a special email address or something that you had ever 10:07.000 --> 10:08.000 set up? 10:08.000 --> 10:09.000 I don't remember. 10:09.000 --> 10:10.000 Oh, right now. 10:10.000 --> 10:11.000 Just send it to Zool at OldSkoolphreak.com. 10:11.000 --> 10:12.000 Good. 10:12.000 --> 10:13.000 Good deal. 10:13.000 --> 10:16.000 Even if it's one pay phone number, send it, and you'll get your name on there. 10:16.000 --> 10:17.000 That's all in it. 10:17.000 --> 10:18.000 That's all it takes. 10:18.000 --> 10:19.000 Yeah. 10:19.000 --> 10:20.000 Yeah. 10:20.000 --> 10:21.000 It's going to be a good text file. 10:21.000 --> 10:22.000 Yeah. 10:22.000 --> 10:23.000 It's going to be some rad shit. 10:23.000 --> 10:24.000 Guy in Canada sent me some good stuff. 10:24.000 --> 10:25.000 I've been getting pictures as well. 10:25.000 --> 10:27.000 If you want to take a picture of a pay phone, send it to me. 10:27.000 --> 10:31.000 Especially if you can get maybe the Walmart logo in the background or something of the 10:31.000 --> 10:32.000 pay phone. 10:32.000 --> 10:33.000 Yeah. 10:33.000 --> 10:34.000 That would be really cool. 10:34.000 --> 10:35.000 Any pictures of Walmart would be good. 10:35.000 --> 10:36.000 Yeah. 10:36.000 --> 10:38.000 That's what I've been working on, and it's paying off, man. 10:38.000 --> 10:40.000 Thanks to everybody that's been sending stuff in. 10:40.000 --> 10:42.000 It's a community article. 10:42.000 --> 10:43.000 It's everyone's article. 10:43.000 --> 10:47.000 Honestly, I don't know of anything like this that's been done before. 10:47.000 --> 10:48.000 I mean, honestly, I don't. 10:48.000 --> 10:54.000 I mean, because think about it, we've got across this nation and Canada as well, so we've 10:54.000 --> 10:57.000 got two nations, two great nations, and all over. 10:57.000 --> 10:58.000 It's just, it's amazing. 10:58.000 --> 11:01.000 Yeah, and we've talked about this before. 11:01.000 --> 11:02.000 The internet doesn't have borders. 11:02.000 --> 11:03.000 Right. 11:03.000 --> 11:07.000 You know, so there's always good information, always different information out there, 11:07.000 --> 11:10.000 so that's really, really cool stuff. 11:10.000 --> 11:11.000 PWF has blown up. 11:11.000 --> 11:15.000 Keep sending it in, and again, this has never been done before. 11:15.000 --> 11:19.000 Should we make up some Project Walmart Freedom theme music? 11:19.000 --> 11:20.000 That would be rad. 11:20.000 --> 11:21.000 It would be nice. 11:21.000 --> 11:26.000 We need, like, some gunfire and some military chanting in the background or something. 11:26.000 --> 11:28.000 I don't know, but I've been told. 11:28.000 --> 11:30.000 Yeah, I must shop at Walmart. 11:30.000 --> 11:31.000 Yeah, something scary. 11:31.000 --> 11:33.000 It'd have to be, you know, like, horror music, I think. 11:33.000 --> 11:36.000 You know, we actually, later on the show, I have a Walmart topic. 11:36.000 --> 11:39.000 I probably could segue into it now, and I'm going to stick with the... 11:39.000 --> 11:41.000 You're going to stick with the notes? 11:41.000 --> 11:44.000 Yeah, I'm going to go through, actually, because I had a couple other things I wanted to do. 11:44.000 --> 11:49.000 Just a couple quick mentions here. 11:49.000 --> 11:50.000 The... 11:50.000 --> 11:58.000 Back on RFA 47, I think it was, the one that Mutant and I, the Mutant Stank, Stank and Mute Special episode 11:58.000 --> 12:03.000 that we filled in for you one week, we had mentioned a topic on a Federal Express hack, 12:03.000 --> 12:07.000 a Federal Express vulnerability, if you want to call it, that we talked about. 12:07.000 --> 12:14.000 And I just had opportunity this past week to confirm that that still has yet to be fixed. 12:14.000 --> 12:15.000 Really? 12:15.000 --> 12:17.000 They still have not made the fix. 12:17.000 --> 12:20.000 Now, I'm not going to go over that whole thing again, because it was kind of long. 12:20.000 --> 12:26.000 The short version is they have a vulnerability in the way that you access and print out shipping labels online 12:26.000 --> 12:32.000 that will let you backdoor into their system and get email addresses and personal addresses 12:32.000 --> 12:37.000 and shipment information on anybody else that's been shipped to from that company. 12:37.000 --> 12:40.000 So, yeah, go back and listen to RFA episode 47. 12:40.000 --> 12:42.000 See, this is why we have archives. 12:42.000 --> 12:43.000 And mirrors. 12:43.000 --> 12:44.000 Thanks to all the mirror people. 12:44.000 --> 12:45.000 Absolutely. 12:45.000 --> 12:46.000 Very much thanks to the mirror. 12:46.000 --> 12:50.000 Anybody hosting a mirror and has the show notes that, you know, this is how people can 12:50.000 --> 12:55.000 go back and find information, because information, some of it can be dated, but some of it doesn't. 12:55.000 --> 12:59.000 So that's why I wanted to touch on that and let everybody know that that's still going on, 12:59.000 --> 13:00.000 still a problem. 13:00.000 --> 13:05.000 And I had another, you know, someone asked me this question this week. 13:05.000 --> 13:06.000 And, Duel, let me ask you this. 13:06.000 --> 13:09.000 Since you've been around, you've had the site up for a long time, this is a question that, 13:09.000 --> 13:14.000 I don't know, I don't know if philosophical or just a decision that needs to be made. 13:14.000 --> 13:20.000 How would you react if a company, even let's say it's a security, 13:20.000 --> 13:30.000 some kind of internet like, I don't know, McAfee or some security intrusion detection software 13:30.000 --> 13:34.000 company or something like that, they came to you, they saw your hacking site, and they 13:34.000 --> 13:38.000 wanted to, or they asked you if you would put advertising on your site for them. 13:38.000 --> 13:39.000 No. 13:39.000 --> 13:41.000 And just no simply that quickly? 13:41.000 --> 13:42.000 Yep. 13:42.000 --> 13:46.000 So even if they offered to pay you X number for every, even if it wasn't click through, 13:46.000 --> 13:51.000 they just said, you know what, you put ads up for us on your site and we'll pay, we'll 13:51.000 --> 13:52.000 pay for your hosting. 13:52.000 --> 13:53.000 Oh. 13:53.000 --> 13:54.000 We'll pay your 10, 15 a month. 13:54.000 --> 13:55.000 No. 13:55.000 --> 13:56.000 None, not whatsoever. 13:56.000 --> 13:59.000 Let me think about it, no. 13:59.000 --> 14:01.000 So no hesitation, huh? 14:01.000 --> 14:02.000 None whatsoever. 14:02.000 --> 14:12.000 What if, what if Rant Radio were to request or require that you put in a 30 second commercial 14:12.000 --> 14:14.000 on your show? 14:14.000 --> 14:15.000 Bye bye. 14:15.000 --> 14:16.000 Bye bye. 14:16.000 --> 14:17.000 You'd leave? 14:17.000 --> 14:18.000 Yep. 14:18.000 --> 14:19.000 Hmm. 14:19.000 --> 14:21.000 Where are we going to, see we have to get that other thing set up, our other project, 14:21.000 --> 14:22.000 we won't go into that. 14:23.000 --> 14:24.000 It really, you wouldn't. 14:24.000 --> 14:25.000 No, we'd have to, yeah. 14:25.000 --> 14:26.000 Yeah. 14:26.000 --> 14:31.000 I mean, you really feel that strongly that no advertising whatsoever, I mean does it matter 14:31.000 --> 14:33.000 if it was a security or a legitimate thing? 14:33.000 --> 14:37.000 What about, what if I asked you to put in a link to, well see I guess that's kind of 14:37.000 --> 14:40.000 different though, when we link to each other. 14:40.000 --> 14:41.000 Yeah. 14:41.000 --> 14:42.000 If we link to each other it's different. 14:42.000 --> 14:43.000 Say, what if I asked you to link to my site? 14:43.000 --> 14:45.000 But that's, that's a whole different thing really. 14:45.000 --> 14:46.000 No, no, no. 14:46.000 --> 14:47.000 You're not, yeah. 14:47.000 --> 14:48.000 You're not wanting a product. 14:48.000 --> 14:49.000 Yeah. 14:49.000 --> 14:51.000 Well, yeah I guess I see that. 14:51.000 --> 14:53.000 So, just no advertising whatsoever. 14:53.000 --> 14:55.000 It's just absolutely completely out of the question? 14:55.000 --> 14:56.000 Uh, yeah. 14:56.000 --> 14:57.000 Why? 14:57.000 --> 14:58.000 Why do you ask? 14:58.000 --> 14:59.000 Well, I'm just curious. 14:59.000 --> 15:04.000 It came up in a conversation with somebody, um, that, what would it hurt if it was a small 15:04.000 --> 15:09.000 advertisement at the bottom of the page or if it was just a little link box or something. 15:09.000 --> 15:15.000 Not obtrusive, no, no shockwave or no flash animation, no plugin, nothing like that. 15:15.000 --> 15:19.000 Just a small banner or link box or something like that. 15:19.000 --> 15:24.000 Then everything I've ever said would, would have been for naught. 15:24.000 --> 15:25.000 Hmm. 15:25.000 --> 15:26.000 Everything. 15:26.000 --> 15:27.000 Everything would be shit. 15:27.000 --> 15:28.000 I would be shit. 15:28.000 --> 15:30.000 Oh great, there's something else for you. 15:30.000 --> 15:34.000 Yeah, man you're giving me a lot of outtakes I can pull from this episode. 15:34.000 --> 15:35.000 Exactly. 15:35.000 --> 15:37.000 Thanks for having me on your show. 15:37.000 --> 15:41.000 No, seriously, I mean, it would, it would be, I, it would be worthless. 15:41.000 --> 15:45.000 Everything that has been done and would be done in the future would be worthless. 15:45.000 --> 15:47.000 I, and, and not to mention, I just don't want that. 15:47.000 --> 15:48.000 That's not the point. 15:48.000 --> 15:52.000 The point is, you know, honestly, I want to be, you know, it's nice to be around radio, 15:52.000 --> 15:55.000 it's nice to have listeners, don't get me wrong, but I want to be underground, man. 15:55.000 --> 15:57.000 I don't want to be freaking, I don't want to be mainstream. 15:57.000 --> 15:58.000 That's the whole point of this. 15:58.000 --> 16:00.000 I want to be, can I swear on your show? 16:00.000 --> 16:01.000 Oh, absolutely. 16:01.000 --> 16:02.000 By all means, we love it. 16:02.000 --> 16:06.000 Actually, I've been trying to cut back, but, you know, it's hard. 16:06.000 --> 16:09.000 I don't really, yeah, I've tried for a while, I don't really care anymore. 16:09.000 --> 16:15.000 I mean, well, it's just like, it's, there's, well, there's a lot of things that I, I don't 16:15.000 --> 16:20.000 agree with, you know, in traditional thinking and conventions and in this society, but, um, 16:20.000 --> 16:25.000 you know, it would just, it would, I lost my train of thought there. 16:25.000 --> 16:27.000 You wanted to cuss, so go ahead. 16:27.000 --> 16:33.000 Well, yeah, honestly, uh, I, I want to, oh, now remember, I don't want to be mainstream. 16:33.000 --> 16:34.000 I want to be able to say fuck. 16:34.000 --> 16:35.000 Mm-hmm. 16:35.000 --> 16:40.000 You know, I think you should be able to say fuck in the medium that we're, you know, 16:40.000 --> 16:41.000 we're airing on. 16:41.000 --> 16:44.000 Um, I mean, that's the whole point. 16:44.000 --> 16:45.000 Well, we don't have to deal with- 16:45.000 --> 16:50.000 I want to show kids, and I want to say fuck, you know, and I'm not, and I'm not saying that, 16:50.000 --> 16:55.000 you know, so we'd have this, you know, a new man show with technology. 16:55.000 --> 16:59.000 No, I'm just saying, it's, how do I say it, it's a, uh. 16:59.000 --> 17:02.000 Well, I, I think I know, you know, it's, we don't have to deal with the FCC. 17:02.000 --> 17:04.000 We don't have the seven words you can't say on radio. 17:04.000 --> 17:06.000 We don't have to, that's the whole point. 17:06.000 --> 17:14.000 This shit, fuck, cunt, hell, yeah, all that, we want to, it's almost like a feeling. 17:14.000 --> 17:19.000 You know, I want that feeling where you know, you know, and whether, whether you get it 17:19.000 --> 17:24.000 because you're hearing swearing, or whether you get it because you're hearing about, you 17:24.000 --> 17:29.000 know, hacking or freaking, I want people to get that feeling that, you know what, this 17:29.000 --> 17:31.000 isn't the usual shit we're listening to. 17:31.000 --> 17:32.000 This is different. 17:32.000 --> 17:33.000 Right, we- 17:33.000 --> 17:34.000 I'm getting different information. 17:34.000 --> 17:38.000 I'm getting a different viewpoint that's not shoved down my throat every day on the radio 17:38.000 --> 17:41.000 and TV and billboards and advertisements. 17:41.000 --> 17:44.000 And, I want to keep that. 17:44.000 --> 17:46.000 That's the whole point. 17:46.000 --> 17:49.000 Honestly, I wanted to be the media. 17:49.000 --> 17:52.000 I wanted, I wanted a show that I would want to listen to. 17:52.000 --> 17:57.000 Not all this drivel, you know, that you're being brainwashed with all the time. 17:57.000 --> 18:01.000 And, uh, you know, I like that freedom to be able to say, fuck. 18:01.000 --> 18:04.000 You know, and fuck the RAA and the MPAA. 18:04.000 --> 18:06.000 And yeah, and that's the more important part. 18:06.000 --> 18:08.000 It's not only, you know, we, the language we're saying is a joke. 18:08.000 --> 18:09.000 We can, yeah, we can emote. 18:09.000 --> 18:12.000 We can make our emotions clear with whatever we want. 18:12.000 --> 18:16.000 But, yes, we can talk about whatever we want to talk about. 18:16.000 --> 18:18.000 No one's going to fire us. 18:18.000 --> 18:20.000 No one's going to tell us what we should and shouldn't say. 18:20.000 --> 18:23.000 And we don't have to worry about advertising and offending people. 18:23.000 --> 18:24.000 And, yeah, I agree. 18:24.000 --> 18:26.000 That's absolutely, you know, one of the greatest feelings 18:26.000 --> 18:29.000 and something they really can't take away from us on the internet. 18:29.000 --> 18:31.000 They can try, and they are trying. 18:31.000 --> 18:32.000 Yeah. 18:32.000 --> 18:38.000 No, I actually, the reason, the reason I brought up the advertising is because I, I pretty much 18:38.000 --> 18:39.000 agree with you. 18:39.000 --> 18:42.000 But I was trying to be open-minded, and that's why I wanted to bring it on the radio to see 18:42.000 --> 18:46.000 if any listeners had any different feelings or you had any different feelings. 18:46.000 --> 18:50.000 So, you know, what if it gets to a point, like right now, we are underground. 18:50.000 --> 18:51.000 We are small. 18:51.000 --> 18:54.000 And, yeah, I mean, I don't mind staying that way. 18:54.000 --> 18:57.000 But I also, at the same time, want Binary Revolution to be successful. 18:57.000 --> 18:59.000 I want to gain more listeners. 18:59.000 --> 19:03.000 So, it's going to come to a point where, especially, for example, let's say Hack TV. 19:03.000 --> 19:07.000 Now, that's going to be a lot of bandwidth and a lot of people downloading, and that's 19:07.000 --> 19:09.000 going to cost a lot of money. 19:09.000 --> 19:10.000 And I don't mind paying for it. 19:10.000 --> 19:12.000 I love doing it, and that's what I'm doing. 19:12.000 --> 19:16.000 But I'm wondering, is there ever going to come a point, and I'm thinking realistically 19:16.000 --> 19:20.000 now, not idealistically, but realistically, is there going to come a point where they're 19:20.000 --> 19:24.000 going to say, listen, you know, your bandwidth bill this month is $500 because you've got 19:24.000 --> 19:25.000 all this stuff. 19:25.000 --> 19:29.000 You know, am I going to be able to realistically, financially support that? 19:29.000 --> 19:35.000 And if not, would advertising of my choice and what I control, you know, I still would 19:35.000 --> 19:40.000 have, no, I'm not going to have Microsoft advertising, or yes, I am going to have, you 19:40.000 --> 19:41.000 know, this. 19:41.000 --> 19:45.000 I'm trying to think open-mindedly, would I go for it, or, and if not, what is the 19:45.000 --> 19:46.000 alternative? 19:46.000 --> 19:48.000 Yeah, but you're giving everything up. 19:48.000 --> 19:50.000 It's like you're giving up your principles. 19:50.000 --> 19:51.000 That's the whole point of everything. 19:51.000 --> 19:55.000 I couldn't afford to keep the archive servers up. 19:55.000 --> 19:56.000 Server, pardon me. 19:56.000 --> 19:57.000 So I got rid of it. 19:57.000 --> 19:58.000 You'll find another way. 19:58.000 --> 20:02.000 I'm not saying you right now, but whoever would be doing this would find another way. 20:02.000 --> 20:03.000 You can find another way. 20:03.000 --> 20:04.000 Money is never a problem. 20:04.000 --> 20:06.000 You want to get your message out. 20:06.000 --> 20:09.000 If you want to do the right thing, money is not a problem. 20:09.000 --> 20:14.000 I think that would, it would just wipe out every, every good thing you'd want to do. 20:14.000 --> 20:18.000 If you can't afford the bandwidth, you know, for the hack TV site. 20:18.000 --> 20:20.000 I know we're speaking hypothetically here. 20:20.000 --> 20:23.000 If you can't afford the bandwidth, then find another way. 20:23.000 --> 20:24.000 Don't do it. 20:24.000 --> 20:25.000 Do something else. 20:25.000 --> 20:27.000 You know, do it in the future. 20:27.000 --> 20:30.000 You know, honestly, it's not, it just wouldn't be worth it. 20:30.000 --> 20:31.000 It would just, all for naught. 20:31.000 --> 20:33.000 It would make everything all for naught. 20:33.000 --> 20:35.000 Yeah, you're probably right. 20:35.000 --> 20:39.000 And hopefully, you know, the other thing is I, back to the, to the project Walmart Freedom, 20:39.000 --> 20:41.000 that gives me things like that. 20:41.000 --> 20:46.000 And things like, like VoodooHow volunteering to do some, you know, teaching in the IRC channels 20:46.000 --> 20:47.000 and stuff like that. 20:47.000 --> 20:54.000 Things like that give me just in such a great feeling of faith and trust in the community 20:54.000 --> 20:58.000 and in my fellow hackers that we will find a way. 20:58.000 --> 21:01.000 Maybe I might not find a way, but we will find a way. 21:01.000 --> 21:06.000 And I have friends and people that I can count on to come through with other solutions 21:06.000 --> 21:10.000 so that hopefully, you know, we won't ever have to come to that decision. 21:10.000 --> 21:11.000 Yeah. 21:11.000 --> 21:12.000 Yeah. 21:12.000 --> 21:13.000 And I mean, face it. 21:13.000 --> 21:18.000 I mean, we probably won't, you know, we're not going to be making money anytime soon on 21:18.000 --> 21:19.000 this stuff. 21:19.000 --> 21:21.000 Everybody does it for the love of technology, right? 21:21.000 --> 21:22.000 Right. 21:22.000 --> 21:23.000 Same reason we do the shows. 21:23.000 --> 21:24.000 Right. 21:24.000 --> 21:25.000 Yeah. 21:25.000 --> 21:26.000 All right. 21:26.000 --> 21:27.000 Let's use Sean Kay as an example, if I may. 21:27.000 --> 21:28.000 I mean, he does some good shit. 21:28.000 --> 21:33.000 To see that man make money and what he does, because he does it well and I enjoy it. 21:33.000 --> 21:34.000 You know? 21:34.000 --> 21:35.000 And I agree. 21:35.000 --> 21:40.000 But I don't think, I don't think he would ever give in to advertising. 21:40.000 --> 21:41.000 I don't know. 21:41.000 --> 21:44.000 And maybe that is the question. 21:44.000 --> 21:49.000 What happens when you get to the point, I mean, he's going to get big enough where he 21:49.000 --> 21:55.000 can make money or will make money if, boy, I think I see what you're saying. 21:55.000 --> 21:56.000 I think I see the point now. 21:56.000 --> 22:00.000 I'm just, you know, it's, hopefully it'll never happen and hopefully there'll be a solution. 22:00.000 --> 22:02.000 And also, let's be realistic. 22:02.000 --> 22:07.000 By the time this might happen, there may be new breakthroughs in technology where bandwidth 22:07.000 --> 22:12.000 is cheaper and that problem is therefore no, you know, it's a moot point by then because 22:12.000 --> 22:18.000 we are honestly going to a, you know, looking for a future where we deliver a high bandwidth 22:18.000 --> 22:21.000 content and television streaming TV over the internet and things like that. 22:21.000 --> 22:24.000 So, maybe by then it will not be a problem. 22:24.000 --> 22:26.000 That's just one example though. 22:26.000 --> 22:31.000 I think you should ask or somebody should ask Sean Kaye that very same question because 22:31.000 --> 22:32.000 think about it. 22:32.000 --> 22:35.000 How is he supposed to grow and change without some kind of sponsorship? 22:35.000 --> 22:38.000 Can he grow and change without some kind of sponsorship? 22:38.000 --> 22:41.000 Could he ever be just, you know, like PBS, you know? 22:41.000 --> 22:42.000 I don't know. 22:42.000 --> 22:48.000 But is it necessarily bad change if you have, I mean, do you necessarily have to sell out? 22:48.000 --> 22:51.000 I mean, you're kind of making it sound like it's selling out if you were to do some 22:51.000 --> 22:52.000 of these. 22:52.000 --> 22:56.000 Or are you just compromising to continue getting out your same message? 22:56.000 --> 23:00.000 I mean, if it ever came to the point where it's like, yeah, we're going to support you 23:00.000 --> 23:04.000 but you can't bad mouth Microsoft anymore because they're one of our sponsors, then hell yeah, 23:04.000 --> 23:05.000 I'm going to be like, you know what? 23:05.000 --> 23:06.000 Fuck you. 23:06.000 --> 23:07.000 Screw you guys. 23:07.000 --> 23:08.000 I'm going home. 23:08.000 --> 23:10.000 You know, I'm going cartman on somebody. 23:10.000 --> 23:11.000 I'm out. 23:11.000 --> 23:15.000 And then, you know, like that's why we discussed we have alternatives we can try and make happen 23:15.000 --> 23:16.000 if we can. 23:16.000 --> 23:19.000 And, you know, we could be the next ones to start something like that. 23:19.000 --> 23:21.000 You know, another revolution. 23:21.000 --> 23:25.000 You know, the Sean Kaye example really made me see why you asked this question now. 23:25.000 --> 23:27.000 That really made me realize that, yeah. 23:27.000 --> 23:30.000 Well, anyway, I just wanted to throw it out there and kind of, because it is sitting in 23:30.000 --> 23:34.000 the back of my head and, you know, I just, I don't know what to think about. 23:34.000 --> 23:37.000 I, I, the first thing I said was like you, I'm like, no, no. 23:37.000 --> 23:39.000 And then I'm like, well, then again, you know. 23:39.000 --> 23:40.000 You made me think. 23:40.000 --> 23:41.000 You made me think it through. 23:41.000 --> 23:42.000 What would it hurt? 23:42.000 --> 23:43.000 And then again, would it help? 23:43.000 --> 23:44.000 And would I sell out? 23:44.000 --> 23:45.000 And what's the, anyway. 23:45.000 --> 23:47.000 I didn't mean for it to get that deep, but yeah, okay. 23:47.000 --> 23:52.000 I just wanted to throw that out there and, you know, it's, you know, it's not quite as 23:52.000 --> 23:53.000 simple as saying no. 23:53.000 --> 23:55.000 I mean, you got to think about it sometimes. 23:55.000 --> 23:56.000 So. 23:56.000 --> 23:57.000 Apparently not. 23:57.000 --> 24:01.000 Let's, um, let's go into some actual topics. 24:01.000 --> 24:09.000 Um, I read an article this week on, it was actually a debate in Network World magazine, 24:09.000 --> 24:12.000 um, which is a weekly magazine that I get. 24:12.000 --> 24:13.000 I'm sorry, monthly. 24:13.000 --> 24:14.000 It's not weekly. 24:14.000 --> 24:15.000 It's monthly. 24:15.000 --> 24:16.000 That's a real big one. 24:16.000 --> 24:17.000 Yes. 24:17.000 --> 24:20.000 It's real, like almost newspaper size, or I guess not quite that big. 24:20.000 --> 24:21.000 Half newspaper size. 24:21.000 --> 24:24.000 Um, and they had, and they're hit and miss. 24:24.000 --> 24:25.000 You know, sometimes articles are great. 24:25.000 --> 24:26.000 Sometimes they really suck. 24:26.000 --> 24:28.000 Sometimes they're very anti-hacker, whatever. 24:28.000 --> 24:30.000 This one I thought was very intriguing. 24:30.000 --> 24:34.000 I thought it was a good discussion, a good debate that we could kind of continue online. 24:34.000 --> 24:39.000 And the topic was, are filters more effective than laws in stopping spam? 24:39.000 --> 24:45.000 Do you filter the spam out, or do you pass laws to stop spam in general? 24:45.000 --> 24:49.000 So, they had two people debating, one debating each side. 24:49.000 --> 24:53.000 And, um, actually I did, honestly, I should have wrote their names and shared them here. 24:53.000 --> 24:58.000 But, um, I wrote down some of the points they made, and I thought we could kind of kick them around a little bit. 24:58.000 --> 25:04.000 Because, I guess, you know, for a debate, somebody has to take a pro, somebody has to take a con. 25:04.000 --> 25:14.000 Um, when they, when the person was, um, supporting the idea of filtering, he pointed out, first of all, they, the statistics they used in this article were horrible. 25:14.000 --> 25:18.000 You know, if you're going to use statistics, make them something that people can understand. 25:18.000 --> 25:19.000 Right. 25:19.000 --> 25:24.000 So, he was talking about the new Bayesian filters and how much more effective they are than the older filtering systems. 25:24.000 --> 25:27.000 And it says that, this is what they said. 25:27.000 --> 25:34.000 They said that they let through about two and a half spams out of a thousand, with about .5 per 1,000 false positives. 25:34.000 --> 25:35.000 Makes sense. 25:35.000 --> 25:37.000 Well, I can't do that kind of math in my head. 25:37.000 --> 25:40.000 I'm from, you know, I, I went to school in the country. 25:40.000 --> 25:42.000 We didn't get up to a thousand in our counting. 25:42.000 --> 25:43.000 It's on a farm. 25:44.000 --> 25:47.000 I, you know, so I, basically, let me translate that for anyone. 25:47.000 --> 25:51.000 Why not just, ugh, you know, make everything out of a hundred, a percentage. 25:51.000 --> 25:52.000 Right. 25:52.000 --> 25:53.000 It's easy and simple. 25:53.000 --> 25:58.000 So, converting that, basically what they're saying is that one out of every 400 spams get through. 25:58.000 --> 26:03.000 So, it blocks 399, and one spam slips through. 26:03.000 --> 26:12.000 And, at the same time, the more dangerous thing, the thing that people worry about more often is if you accidentally block out legitimate email. 26:12.000 --> 26:13.000 Right. False positive. 26:13.000 --> 26:14.000 Right. 26:14.000 --> 26:22.000 And this one is basically said, he's saying statistics are about one in every 2,000 valid emails gets blocked as though it was spam. 26:22.000 --> 26:24.000 So, you lose one out of 2,000. 26:24.000 --> 26:25.000 Right. 26:25.000 --> 26:31.000 So, for stopping, you know, 399 out of 400, you got that risk of losing one out of 2,000. 26:31.000 --> 26:40.000 Is that, are those acceptable losses or do you have, you know, I, I still find that I, people say they sent me an email and I never got it. 26:40.000 --> 26:43.000 Is that being filtered out, do you think? 26:43.000 --> 26:44.000 Possibly. 26:44.000 --> 26:47.000 Do you know if your email service uses Bayesian filters? 26:47.000 --> 26:48.000 Hmm. 26:48.000 --> 26:49.000 Um. 26:49.000 --> 26:50.000 Find that out. 26:50.000 --> 26:51.000 Yeah. 26:51.000 --> 26:55.000 I, you know, I, I hate spam just like everybody else. 26:55.000 --> 26:57.000 Well, you know what, maybe you should go on before we comment. 26:57.000 --> 26:58.000 Okay. 26:58.000 --> 26:59.000 All right. 26:59.000 --> 27:00.000 A couple more points on the pro filter. 27:00.000 --> 27:01.000 We'll do it like that. 27:01.000 --> 27:02.000 We'll hit the pro filter, then the pro law. 27:02.000 --> 27:03.000 Yeah. 27:03.000 --> 27:04.000 Um. 27:04.000 --> 27:15.000 Another thing about the pro filtering is that even if you block on client side or server side, even if you block those email, they still traveled to get to that block. 27:15.000 --> 27:24.000 So they left whatever, you know, goat sex site or whatever they're sending out and, and ate, and you see, you'd be mad if they blocked that, right? 27:24.000 --> 27:25.000 Oh, totally. 27:25.000 --> 27:26.000 Totally. 27:26.000 --> 27:29.000 So, but I mean, it traveled and ate up bandwidth on the ride. 27:29.000 --> 27:38.000 So, sure, you have a filter and you can block it on the client side or server side, but it did cost, there is a cost of transmitting that mail. 27:38.000 --> 27:52.000 And that actually sounds like an argument against filters, but what they, the debate or the argument here was that if the drop in response rates, because all of them are blocked, you know, 399 didn't get through. 27:52.000 --> 28:07.000 Therefore, people aren't going to click through 399 of them, so the percentage is so much lower, the click-through rate will be lower, and the senders of that email will give up thinking they're not getting, because they're getting blocked, and they will stop sending that mail. 28:07.000 --> 28:10.000 Now, to me, that seems kind of naive. 28:10.000 --> 28:11.000 They're not going to stop. 28:11.000 --> 28:17.000 They're going to, every time you find a way to block them, just like hackers, you know, and a lot of hackers get hired by companies like this, believe it or not. 28:17.000 --> 28:20.000 A lot of hackers come up with these scripts and ways to work around. 28:20.000 --> 28:24.000 Every time they try to stop it, they're going to come up with a way to circumvent it. 28:24.000 --> 28:27.000 So, I didn't, that one I didn't think was a very strong argument. 28:27.000 --> 28:32.000 Another one was, actually, this was an anti-law. 28:32.000 --> 28:44.000 He was countering, you know, a lot of people say, when you're making laws, one of the concerns is, how do you stop spammers without stopping legitimate email advertising? 28:44.000 --> 28:58.000 You know, if you're going to pass a law against spam or against advertising an email, do, aren't there people that have a right to send targeted advertising, opt-in type advertising? 28:58.000 --> 29:08.000 And, you know, that can accidentally, probably very easily and frequently be blocked, even though they're opt-in lists and stuff like that. 29:08.000 --> 29:09.000 Right. 29:09.000 --> 29:10.000 You know? 29:10.000 --> 29:12.000 I mean, is there such a thing as legitimate email advertising? 29:12.000 --> 29:13.000 Let me ask you that. 29:13.000 --> 29:15.000 Of course there is, if you opt-in, yeah, of course. 29:15.000 --> 29:19.000 But you would hope, well, you would have to, boy, that's difficult. 29:19.000 --> 29:25.000 Either you change your filters to accept that, or, guess what, you're not getting that email. 29:25.000 --> 29:26.000 Yeah, yeah. 29:26.000 --> 29:28.000 Yeah, and how do you, and that is the huge problem. 29:28.000 --> 29:31.000 How do you determine the legitimate ones from the non-legitimate ones? 29:31.000 --> 29:34.000 Unless you have a list of all of the opt-in spammers. 29:34.000 --> 29:46.000 Instead of having a list of all the known spammers and blocking them, maybe you have a list of all the known valid, maybe have them register somewhere and have them on an allow list. 29:46.000 --> 29:47.000 I don't know. 29:47.000 --> 29:48.000 I just, you know? 29:48.000 --> 29:49.000 Yeah. 29:49.000 --> 29:51.000 I don't know what kind of solutions are going to come up, but that seems like a possibility. 29:51.000 --> 29:52.000 Right. 29:52.000 --> 29:55.000 Because, I mean, I opt-in to all the ghost sex sites I could find. 29:55.000 --> 29:56.000 Well, I mean. 29:56.000 --> 29:57.000 They get blocked. 29:57.000 --> 29:59.000 How do you keep up with all those emails, though? 29:59.000 --> 30:00.000 Because there must be a lot of those. 30:00.000 --> 30:01.000 There is. 30:01.000 --> 30:02.000 There is. 30:02.000 --> 30:03.000 And it's upsetting when I don't care. 30:03.000 --> 30:04.000 Yeah. 30:04.000 --> 30:07.000 Well, you know, luckily, you got 399 blocked, you still get one that comes through. 30:07.000 --> 30:08.000 That's right. 30:08.000 --> 30:09.000 Lucky me. 30:09.000 --> 30:10.000 And that's all you need. 30:10.000 --> 30:11.000 They all link to each other anyway, trust me. 30:11.000 --> 30:17.000 You know, and it's the same thing with telemarketers. 30:17.000 --> 30:22.000 I mean, really, it is the same thing that, you know, you have the do not call list now. 30:22.000 --> 30:24.000 Do they have a do not email list? 30:24.000 --> 30:26.000 Is that something we should come up with? 30:26.000 --> 30:27.000 Is that a reasonable possibility? 30:27.000 --> 30:30.000 Or is the do not call list going to be a failure as well? 30:30.000 --> 30:31.000 Do not call is doable. 30:31.000 --> 30:33.000 I think a do not email would just be. 30:33.000 --> 30:34.000 Ridiculous. 30:34.000 --> 30:35.000 Yeah, totally. 30:35.000 --> 30:37.000 We'll be, to say the least. 30:37.000 --> 30:40.000 You know, and the most powerful argument on, 30:40.000 --> 30:43.000 on filters as more effective than laws, 30:43.000 --> 30:45.000 is that filtering works now. 30:45.000 --> 30:47.000 There are filters out there. 30:47.000 --> 30:49.000 With the statistics I mentioned earlier, 30:49.000 --> 30:51.000 there are filters that work. 30:51.000 --> 30:52.000 How long will it take? 30:52.000 --> 30:55.000 I mean, I've ranted and bitched about the government 30:55.000 --> 30:57.000 and how long it takes them to pass laws 30:57.000 --> 30:59.000 and how long it takes them to get things done. 30:59.000 --> 31:00.000 And then they do it half-assed. 31:00.000 --> 31:01.000 They don't do it right. 31:01.000 --> 31:04.000 I mean, how long have we been waiting on that do not call list? 31:04.000 --> 31:06.000 You know, it's been needed for years and years. 31:06.000 --> 31:08.000 Telemarketing has been a, it's not a recent problem. 31:08.000 --> 31:11.000 It took them this long to evaluate it. 31:11.000 --> 31:13.000 So how long will it take them to come up with laws 31:13.000 --> 31:17.000 and make them work and then start applying them to people? 31:17.000 --> 31:21.000 On the other hand, on the pro-law side, 31:21.000 --> 31:24.000 this, this, I thought this was just a brilliant quote, 31:24.000 --> 31:25.000 the way it was worded. 31:25.000 --> 31:27.000 Now, I'm not saying, you know, credibility. 31:27.000 --> 31:29.000 I just, if you think about this, 31:29.000 --> 31:31.000 the quote that this person said, it said, 31:31.000 --> 31:35.000 filtering is no more a solution to the spam problem 31:35.000 --> 31:38.000 than it is to water pollution. 31:38.000 --> 31:41.000 Now, if you think about that, filtering water, 31:41.000 --> 31:44.000 filtering polluted water from plants and stuff like that, 31:44.000 --> 31:46.000 they don't care about that. 31:46.000 --> 31:48.000 They're going to keep right on polluting. 31:48.000 --> 31:50.000 They're going to keep right on pouring chemicals 31:50.000 --> 31:54.000 six-eyed fish and, you know, 16-legged frogs 31:54.000 --> 31:56.000 spinning around out there with nuclear waste 31:56.000 --> 31:59.000 if we did not have laws to back them up. 31:59.000 --> 32:00.000 Right. 32:00.000 --> 32:03.000 You know, so filters in that situation don't work. 32:03.000 --> 32:05.000 And he's making the metaphor, the comparison, 32:05.000 --> 32:06.000 that they're not going to work here. 32:06.000 --> 32:07.000 Very good. 32:07.000 --> 32:09.000 And like you mentioned earlier, the false positives. 32:09.000 --> 32:11.000 False negatives, false positives. 32:11.000 --> 32:12.000 Those are the two problems. 32:12.000 --> 32:13.000 Yeah. 32:13.000 --> 32:16.000 I mean, it seems, you know, I guess it sounds good. 32:16.000 --> 32:18.000 One in 400 slip through. 32:18.000 --> 32:19.000 You know, you delete that one. 32:19.000 --> 32:22.000 But the one out of 2,000 valid emails gets blocked. 32:22.000 --> 32:25.000 You know, is that, I mentioned earlier, is that acceptable losses? 32:25.000 --> 32:29.000 That's the biggest problem that ISPs face filtering on the server side 32:29.000 --> 32:33.000 is because as soon as they block out an email of, you know, 32:33.000 --> 32:37.000 someone's order or someone's personal information, 32:37.000 --> 32:40.000 a job application or an interview or, you know, 32:40.000 --> 32:43.000 something along those lines, you know, all hell's going to break loose. 32:43.000 --> 32:45.000 An important email could get blocked. 32:45.000 --> 32:47.000 And it's not yet a perfect science. 32:47.000 --> 32:48.000 Right. 32:48.000 --> 32:50.000 Do you think maybe they could use, I don't know, 32:50.000 --> 32:52.000 like levels of filtering like the ISP? 32:52.000 --> 32:55.000 They use some more reliable filtering software, 32:55.000 --> 33:01.000 meaning fewer false positives or false positives. 33:01.000 --> 33:04.000 And, you know, so... 33:04.000 --> 33:05.000 But it can never... 33:05.000 --> 33:09.000 Less likely to lose, you know, a real email. 33:09.000 --> 33:12.000 But you can never be 100% perfect. 33:12.000 --> 33:14.000 Well, no, it would be 100%, but it'd be closer, right? 33:14.000 --> 33:15.000 We're getting out to the sixth, you know, 33:15.000 --> 33:18.000 you're getting out to the tail, the tail end of the bell curve there, 33:18.000 --> 33:20.000 so you can get a better... 33:20.000 --> 33:22.000 And even if you offered them levels, 33:22.000 --> 33:25.000 they're always going to have to take the most conservative one. 33:25.000 --> 33:26.000 Right, well... 33:26.000 --> 33:27.000 Always, so... 33:27.000 --> 33:28.000 Right, well, that's what I'm saying. 33:28.000 --> 33:30.000 Make sure, even more so, right? 33:30.000 --> 33:33.000 So maybe they let a little more spam through, 33:33.000 --> 33:35.000 but again, they're letting a lot... 33:35.000 --> 33:39.000 You know, you're not getting so many false positives. 33:39.000 --> 33:46.000 And then more restrictive filtering, you know, at the enterprise side. 33:46.000 --> 33:47.000 I don't know. 33:47.000 --> 33:48.000 You know, it's just a thought. 33:48.000 --> 33:49.000 Levels of filtering, maybe. 33:49.000 --> 33:52.000 Well, it's definitely going to evolve. 33:52.000 --> 33:58.000 I know this is spam, you know, further into the infrastructure. 33:58.000 --> 33:59.000 I don't know. 33:59.000 --> 34:02.000 Well, you know, I can tell you, where I work, we had filters on, 34:02.000 --> 34:06.000 and we had complaints of people who were not getting valid, legitimate email, 34:06.000 --> 34:09.000 or so they say, and they had to take it off. 34:09.000 --> 34:10.000 No problem. 34:10.000 --> 34:11.000 You know? 34:11.000 --> 34:14.000 And we are using, you know, this fairly recent up-to-date filtering software, 34:14.000 --> 34:17.000 and it still doesn't do the job well enough for us, so... 34:17.000 --> 34:18.000 Gary. 34:18.000 --> 34:19.000 Yeah. 34:19.000 --> 34:20.000 Well, I mean, it's going to evolve, and it's going to get better. 34:20.000 --> 34:21.000 We know that. 34:21.000 --> 34:23.000 You know, of course, it has to. 34:23.000 --> 34:24.000 It has to. 34:24.000 --> 34:25.000 Right. 34:25.000 --> 34:26.000 Here's another. 34:26.000 --> 34:30.000 This is one of the stronger points also. 34:30.000 --> 34:34.000 Bottom line, it costs money for filters. 34:34.000 --> 34:37.000 It costs money to filter out that mail. 34:37.000 --> 34:39.000 Like I said, it does take up bandwidth. 34:39.000 --> 34:42.000 Even if you filter it out at the server or client side, it's going to eat up bandwidth. 34:42.000 --> 34:44.000 That costs money. 34:44.000 --> 34:46.000 Software to buy software for your company. 34:46.000 --> 34:48.000 You're buying site license for X number of users. 34:48.000 --> 34:50.000 That costs a lot of money. 34:50.000 --> 34:52.000 Well, implementing laws is not free. 34:52.000 --> 34:53.000 Well, that's a good point. 34:53.000 --> 34:54.000 It's a very good point. 34:54.000 --> 34:58.000 So, which, you know, and that's the whole point, really, of the debate. 34:58.000 --> 35:00.000 Which is the better way to go? 35:00.000 --> 35:03.000 Do you, you know, do you burden the companies, the individual people? 35:03.000 --> 35:08.000 Should I, okay, should you, dual parallel, as a user at home, 35:08.000 --> 35:14.000 have to buy your own $30 or $40, whatever, if it's that cheap, personal filter? 35:14.000 --> 35:17.000 If I want to continue to use one email address forever, yeah. 35:17.000 --> 35:20.000 Then, does that sound right to you? 35:20.000 --> 35:22.000 Uh... 35:22.000 --> 35:24.000 And that's just for an individual. 35:24.000 --> 35:26.000 What about, what if you owned an ISP? 35:26.000 --> 35:27.000 Now, that's different. 35:27.000 --> 35:28.000 Yeah, there's a different story. 35:28.000 --> 35:29.000 Right. 35:29.000 --> 35:30.000 For an individual, you don't touch it. 35:30.000 --> 35:31.000 Get another email address. 35:31.000 --> 35:32.000 That's what I say. 35:32.000 --> 35:33.000 Right. 35:33.000 --> 35:34.000 There are solutions for individuals. 35:34.000 --> 35:40.000 I have, what is it, CloudNet, CloudMark SpamNet, I think I have on mine. 35:40.000 --> 35:42.000 And it does a pretty decent job of filtering. 35:42.000 --> 35:46.000 It still lets quite a bit few, more than one out of 400, I have to say. 35:46.000 --> 35:47.000 Do you have to pay for it? 35:47.000 --> 35:48.000 Do you have to pay for it? 35:48.000 --> 35:49.000 Um... 35:49.000 --> 35:53.000 Actually, gosh, I wish this was a tip I could have given a while back, but I didn't foresee 35:53.000 --> 35:54.000 it happening. 35:54.000 --> 35:55.000 Um... 35:55.000 --> 35:56.000 It was beta. 35:56.000 --> 35:57.000 And it was free. 35:57.000 --> 35:59.000 And it was supposed to be free. 35:59.000 --> 36:00.000 Uh-huh. 36:00.000 --> 36:02.000 And when they finally came out with a fine... 36:02.000 --> 36:06.000 This was early on in it when spam was a, you know, a growing problem and people were 36:06.000 --> 36:08.000 just wanting to make solutions. 36:08.000 --> 36:09.000 Um... 36:09.000 --> 36:10.000 It was free. 36:10.000 --> 36:14.000 Well, I guess it got really popular and they realized they could make a buck. 36:14.000 --> 36:19.000 So when they finally released the official version 1.0, they started charging for it. 36:19.000 --> 36:20.000 Good for them. 36:20.000 --> 36:24.000 However, if you still have the beta version installed and running, every time it comes 36:24.000 --> 36:27.000 up and says, hey, there's a new version, are you ready to upgrade? 36:27.000 --> 36:31.000 You just say, hell no, I'll stick with the free version, thank you very much. 36:31.000 --> 36:34.000 So I wish I could have given that advice back when they were still giving the free version 36:34.000 --> 36:35.000 out. 36:35.000 --> 36:38.000 I'm sure if you probably went hunting on the net somewhere, you could probably find one of 36:38.000 --> 36:41.000 the old beta versions and it works just as well. 36:41.000 --> 36:42.000 Really? 36:42.000 --> 36:44.000 Is there a site that archives old software like that? 36:44.000 --> 36:45.000 Oh, I can't remember the name. 36:45.000 --> 36:50.000 I know there were some sites that downloaded specific, like, old versions of AOL and old 36:50.000 --> 36:51.000 versions of... 36:51.000 --> 36:52.000 Yeah, yeah. 36:52.000 --> 36:53.000 But I don't know if they would have something like this. 36:53.000 --> 36:55.000 Um, but again, you know, once something... 36:55.000 --> 36:56.000 That's the great thing about the net. 36:56.000 --> 37:00.000 Once it's out there, you know, I'm gonna have to break... 37:00.000 --> 37:03.000 Damn you, you always pull out these country sayings out of me. 37:03.000 --> 37:05.000 There's an old saying, once... 37:05.000 --> 37:07.000 You can't put the shit back in the horse. 37:07.000 --> 37:09.000 That's really disgusting. 37:09.000 --> 37:14.000 Once it's out on the net, once it's been released, once it's out there, it's out there. 37:14.000 --> 37:17.000 Actually, I'd like to correct you, you can put the shit back in the horse. 37:17.000 --> 37:18.000 Oh, well, excuse me. 37:18.000 --> 37:20.000 I guess if you have the proper materials. 37:20.000 --> 37:23.000 Yeah, you're right, you're right. 37:23.000 --> 37:24.000 You know, so... 37:24.000 --> 37:28.000 Yeah, I'm sure if it's, you know, if you guys look for it, it's Cloudmark is the name 37:28.000 --> 37:30.000 of the company, Cloudmark. 37:30.000 --> 37:33.000 And I think it's called SpamNet. 37:33.000 --> 37:37.000 So if you go look, I'm sure the company's probably Cloudmark.com or something like that, but if 37:37.000 --> 37:41.000 you go look for some old betas, you should be able to plug those in and they should work 37:41.000 --> 37:42.000 fine. 37:42.000 --> 37:45.000 So, good luck with all that. 37:45.000 --> 37:46.000 Yeah. 37:46.000 --> 37:51.000 So, bottom line is, and we kind of already have touched on a lot of these, but basically, 37:51.000 --> 37:53.000 I think we need both. 37:53.000 --> 37:56.000 I don't think it is a clear either or one or the other situation. 37:56.000 --> 37:59.000 You've got to have laws, effective laws, of course. 37:59.000 --> 38:02.000 You don't want to just throw laws around willy-nilly that you can't enforce or do anything. 38:02.000 --> 38:04.000 You definitely got to have laws. 38:04.000 --> 38:06.000 I mean, do you agree with that? 38:06.000 --> 38:07.000 Definitely not willy-nilly laws. 38:07.000 --> 38:09.000 Well, I mean, nobody wants willy-nilly laws. 38:09.000 --> 38:10.000 Yeah, I totally agree. 38:10.000 --> 38:13.000 Actually, I'm glad I stopped myself. 38:13.000 --> 38:15.000 I was going to say that at the very beginning. 38:15.000 --> 38:16.000 We need both. 38:16.000 --> 38:20.000 You have to have both if you're going to have any kind of effective, you know, spam denial. 38:20.000 --> 38:25.000 Because, you know, obviously, filters aren't going to do it. 38:25.000 --> 38:27.000 Technology is not always the answer, believe it or not. 38:27.000 --> 38:28.000 I know that's scary. 38:28.000 --> 38:29.000 Absolutely. 38:29.000 --> 38:30.000 I agree with that. 38:30.000 --> 38:31.000 Always the answer. 38:31.000 --> 38:37.000 And I think laws, laws are going to be necessary. 38:37.000 --> 38:42.000 I mean, because these people, I don't want to say it's malicious, but it's malicious. 38:42.000 --> 38:43.000 It really is. 38:43.000 --> 38:46.000 I mean, there's just no reason for it. 38:46.000 --> 38:51.000 If you hate, like I do, and I know you do as well, Spank, if you hate telemarketing calls, 38:51.000 --> 38:56.000 then spam is just, you know, it's just the internet's version. 38:56.000 --> 38:57.000 That's all it is. 38:57.000 --> 38:59.000 I kind of like telemarketing calls, actually. 38:59.000 --> 39:00.000 Because you get to fuck with them, huh? 39:00.000 --> 39:01.000 Yeah. 39:01.000 --> 39:02.000 I kind of like messing with them. 39:02.000 --> 39:03.000 Well, unfortunately, you can't. 39:03.000 --> 39:04.000 Actually, you can do that with spam. 39:04.000 --> 39:07.000 Or you can with those, do you see that on Slash. 39:07.000 --> 39:12.000 Some guy just wrote out one of these Nigerian oil scams, you know, where they say, oh, 39:12.000 --> 39:17.000 we've got all this money, and we must have put it in an account, and you would get this 39:17.000 --> 39:18.000 much of it, you know? 39:18.000 --> 39:19.000 Right. 39:19.000 --> 39:23.000 Actually, a company I used to work for years and years ago, they would get hard copy letters, 39:23.000 --> 39:24.000 actually. 39:24.000 --> 39:26.000 I think some were handwritten, of these scams. 39:26.000 --> 39:31.000 But now, of course, they've gotten emails a lot cheaper, and somebody played it out 39:31.000 --> 39:36.000 and just kept going and going all the way to, you know, like, you know, this guy's name 39:36.000 --> 39:39.000 was William Shatner, and you know, it was just unbelievable. 39:39.000 --> 39:40.000 It was a great read. 39:40.000 --> 39:43.000 Yeah, I think I did read, I don't know if I read all the detail, but I did read about 39:43.000 --> 39:47.000 somebody doing that, and I think they ended up getting the FBI involved at the end and 39:47.000 --> 39:51.000 catching the people who were sending it, at least in one case I was reading about. 39:51.000 --> 39:52.000 I hope so. 39:52.000 --> 39:53.000 I hope so. 39:53.000 --> 39:54.000 So, yeah, you're right. 39:54.000 --> 39:55.000 You have to have both. 39:55.000 --> 39:56.000 Did the article say that as well? 39:56.000 --> 39:57.000 I hope so. 39:57.000 --> 39:59.000 No, the article, but I mean, it really wasn't an article. 39:59.000 --> 40:00.000 It was a debate. 40:00.000 --> 40:03.000 So, yes, one person debated this, one person debated that. 40:03.000 --> 40:05.000 They really weren't supposed to kind of compromise, you know? 40:05.000 --> 40:07.000 It was just, alright, it was like pros and cons. 40:07.000 --> 40:08.000 Yeah. 40:08.000 --> 40:12.000 It was exactly, really, they were just defending each other's ideas, so. 40:12.000 --> 40:13.000 Right. 40:13.000 --> 40:17.000 But, you know, there was one claim in there that I thought just sounded too low or too 40:17.000 --> 40:18.000 off to me. 40:18.000 --> 40:24.000 According to the article it said, or to this debate, it said that spam has grown, excuse 40:24.000 --> 40:29.000 me, grown from less than 10% to about 40% of email. 40:29.000 --> 40:30.000 Yeah, that's wrong. 40:30.000 --> 40:31.000 I know. 40:31.000 --> 40:32.000 Come on now. 40:32.000 --> 40:36.000 I easily, it's gotta be over 50, at least over half. 40:36.000 --> 40:39.000 There's no way that it's 10 or 40%. 40:39.000 --> 40:40.000 I mean, 40%. 40:40.000 --> 40:45.000 I have to say I get more bug track, I get, which I like. 40:45.000 --> 40:46.000 I'm glad I get more. 40:46.000 --> 40:48.000 But that's an opt-in list. 40:48.000 --> 40:49.000 Yeah. 40:49.000 --> 40:50.000 That's a mailing list. 40:50.000 --> 40:51.000 Well, that's what I'm saying. 40:51.000 --> 40:54.000 I mean, as long as it's more than my bug track, I think it's, it's, I can't say that 40:54.000 --> 40:56.000 it's 50%. 40:56.000 --> 40:59.000 I'm trying to, I'm trying to think of in my office. 40:59.000 --> 41:00.000 Right. 41:00.000 --> 41:02.000 And we send a lot of emails back and forth, you know. 41:02.000 --> 41:03.000 Right. 41:03.000 --> 41:06.000 And I still say, well again, I have the filters. 41:06.000 --> 41:11.000 So if I, if I were to take the filters off, there's an, it would definitely be 75, 80%. 41:11.000 --> 41:12.000 It shouldn't be. 41:12.000 --> 41:13.000 Absolutely. 41:13.000 --> 41:14.000 No joke. 41:14.000 --> 41:15.000 No joke. 41:15.000 --> 41:18.000 I'll come in and I, I, I, what it does is it automatically moves, you can configure 41:18.000 --> 41:19.000 it how you want. 41:19.000 --> 41:21.000 I have it automatically move it to the deleted items. 41:21.000 --> 41:26.000 And I'll come in after a weekend and I'll have three, 400 things in the deleted items 41:26.000 --> 41:29.000 folder and I'll have maybe 20 or 30 legitimate emails. 41:29.000 --> 41:31.000 Of course, over the weekend, nobody sends a lot of legitimate emails. 41:31.000 --> 41:32.000 Right. 41:32.000 --> 41:34.000 But, you know, yeah, it's, it's gotta be. 41:35.000 --> 41:36.000 Crazy. 41:36.000 --> 41:38.000 During the week even, it's probably above 60, 70%. 41:39.000 --> 41:41.000 Can I tell you about one of my pet peeves? 41:41.000 --> 41:44.000 Um, besides the, uh, goat sex emails being blocked? 41:44.000 --> 41:45.000 No, that's not a peeve. 41:45.000 --> 41:46.000 I like that. 41:46.000 --> 41:47.000 No, seriously. 41:47.000 --> 41:51.000 Legitimate emails that are essentially spam. 41:51.000 --> 41:52.000 Right? 41:52.000 --> 41:58.000 People at my work that send me shit, you know, uh, there's like a free pizza crust, you know, 41:58.000 --> 42:00.000 six buildings over or something like that. 42:00.000 --> 42:02.000 You know, I could give a fuck. 42:02.000 --> 42:05.000 I'm giving away a free envelope if you'd like it. 42:05.000 --> 42:06.000 Fuck the fuck off. 42:06.000 --> 42:07.000 I don't want to read this shit. 42:07.000 --> 42:10.000 You know, or the minutes from the chess club meeting. 42:10.000 --> 42:11.000 Right? 42:11.000 --> 42:12.000 Fuck off. 42:12.000 --> 42:13.000 Fuck off. 42:13.000 --> 42:14.000 I don't want to read this shit. 42:14.000 --> 42:15.000 Dad, Denise, spam. 42:15.000 --> 42:16.000 That's like the worst spam. 42:16.000 --> 42:18.000 Cause it's not gonna get filtered or stopped by law. 42:18.000 --> 42:19.000 And I could give a rat's ass. 42:19.000 --> 42:20.000 Okay, thanks. 42:20.000 --> 42:22.000 Oh man, you're killing me. 42:22.000 --> 42:25.000 Did you just say, fuck the fuck off? 42:25.000 --> 42:27.000 What did I say? 42:27.000 --> 42:29.000 Fuck the fuck off. 42:29.000 --> 42:30.000 Fuck the fuck off. 42:30.000 --> 42:35.000 You, you managed to make 50% of the words in that sentence the F word. 42:35.000 --> 42:37.000 That low? 42:37.000 --> 42:38.000 That low? 42:38.000 --> 42:39.000 You, you are my hero. 42:39.000 --> 42:42.000 Fuck the fucking fuggers. 42:42.000 --> 42:43.000 Huh? 42:43.000 --> 42:44.000 This is bullshit. 42:44.000 --> 42:45.000 Oh man. 42:45.000 --> 42:46.000 It really makes me mad. 42:46.000 --> 42:47.000 It really makes me mad. 42:47.000 --> 42:50.000 Well, you know who the greatest spam fighter of, of our decade right, and you know who 42:50.000 --> 42:52.000 the biggest spam fighter right now is? 42:52.000 --> 42:53.000 Who? 42:53.000 --> 42:54.000 Our good friend Bill Gates. 42:54.000 --> 42:55.000 Oh, what? 42:55.000 --> 42:56.000 Pukes! 42:56.000 --> 42:57.000 What are you doing? 42:58.000 --> 42:59.000 I just wanted to say puke. 42:59.000 --> 43:00.000 I knew you'd love that. 43:00.000 --> 43:01.000 I didn't call me a puke. 43:01.000 --> 43:02.000 Are you kidding me? 43:02.000 --> 43:07.000 Bill Gates issued a letter to customers about the quote, unquote, spreading plague that 43:07.000 --> 43:08.000 is spam. 43:08.000 --> 43:09.000 Uh huh, uh huh. 43:09.000 --> 43:12.000 And he says, and this, and this actually, this is kind of funny actually. 43:12.000 --> 43:16.000 He says, like almost everyone, I receive a lot of spam every day. 43:16.000 --> 43:17.000 Bullshit. 43:17.000 --> 43:21.000 Much of it, well listen, much of it offering to help me get out of debt or get rich quick. 43:21.000 --> 43:22.000 Bullshit. 43:23.000 --> 43:24.000 Come on. 43:24.000 --> 43:27.000 How disgustingly rich is Bill Gates? 43:27.000 --> 43:28.000 Is that a quote from him? 43:28.000 --> 43:29.000 That is a quote from him. 43:29.000 --> 43:32.000 He never sees a spam in his life. 43:32.000 --> 43:36.000 He has people to go through his email, I guarantee it. 43:36.000 --> 43:39.000 I'm sure he uses a Hotmail account like everyone else. 43:39.000 --> 43:40.000 He's just a regular guy. 43:40.000 --> 43:42.000 Aw, he doesn't need Hotmail. 43:42.000 --> 43:47.000 He has somebody give him all of his email on glossy photo paper, dude. 43:47.000 --> 43:48.000 I'm serious. 43:48.000 --> 43:49.000 He doesn't, he never ever... 43:49.000 --> 43:50.000 Color. 43:50.000 --> 43:54.000 ...touch ears up, smells, or knows what a piece of spam looks like, I guarantee it. 43:54.000 --> 43:58.000 He's got, he's got scratch and sniff email printed in high color. 43:58.000 --> 43:59.000 Look at that, he does. 43:59.000 --> 44:01.000 I know, that is, what a crock of shit. 44:01.000 --> 44:03.000 Like Obi-Wan Kenobi hologram. 44:03.000 --> 44:04.000 Joe like you. 44:05.000 --> 44:06.000 Bullshit. 44:06.000 --> 44:07.000 Oh. 44:07.000 --> 44:10.000 Well, somebody, somebody, whoever reads his mail is gonna probably get spam. 44:11.000 --> 44:12.000 So... 44:12.000 --> 44:13.000 I guess so. 44:13.000 --> 44:15.000 Even, even Bill Gates can't stop spam? 44:15.000 --> 44:16.000 Is that the message here? 44:16.000 --> 44:18.000 Or you're just not buying it? 44:18.000 --> 44:19.000 You're not buying it at all? 44:19.000 --> 44:23.000 He's, he wants, there, he's selling something, isn't he? 44:23.000 --> 44:24.000 I don't know. 44:24.000 --> 44:26.000 He's always selling something. 44:26.000 --> 44:27.000 Where'd you get an issue? 44:27.000 --> 44:28.000 In a letter? 44:28.000 --> 44:32.000 This was an open, yeah, this was an open letter that he put, I don't remember what site I dug 44:32.000 --> 44:35.000 this up on, but this was an open letter that he made available. 44:35.000 --> 44:39.000 And, basically, the letter went on to say that Microsoft was gonna dedicate themselves 44:39.000 --> 44:43.000 and a joint, this was, you know where it was, if you, I think we mentioned it briefly 44:43.000 --> 44:49.000 before, but they combined with, with AOL Time Warner and Yahoo Mail and they come, they 44:49.000 --> 44:53.000 decided to make this consortium to get together and work together and try to stop, do better 44:53.000 --> 44:54.000 job to stop email. 44:54.000 --> 44:55.000 Uh huh. 44:55.000 --> 44:56.000 Okay. 44:56.000 --> 44:58.000 So that, this was, this was just his open letter announcing that. 44:58.000 --> 45:02.000 Okay, I thought he was gonna be pimping, you know, a new feature in the next XP or something 45:02.000 --> 45:03.000 like that. 45:03.000 --> 45:04.000 Yeah. 45:04.000 --> 45:05.000 Um. 45:05.000 --> 45:06.000 I didn't like originally. 45:06.000 --> 45:09.000 Yeah, you know, actually, I mentioned earlier we were gonna talk about Walmart, so let's 45:09.000 --> 45:14.000 segue back into Walmart, the RFID that we've talked about on a few different episodes. 45:14.000 --> 45:16.000 Yeah, the meme brought some stuff up too, good stuff. 45:16.000 --> 45:18.000 Yeah, it's, you know, they just can't make up their mind. 45:18.000 --> 45:20.000 It's on again, off again, on again, off again. 45:20.000 --> 45:21.000 They don't know what they're gonna do. 45:21.000 --> 45:26.000 So the last thing I heard now, unless you've heard differently again, is that the testing 45:26.000 --> 45:31.000 of RFID in retail customer stores is being halted again. 45:31.000 --> 45:36.000 They are going to still test it and use it, um, for their distribution. 45:36.000 --> 45:39.000 They're gonna put it on pallets and cases and boxes and stuff like that. 45:39.000 --> 45:40.000 Right. 45:40.000 --> 45:44.000 To track it through the warehouse and see how long it sits in like the individual stores 45:44.000 --> 45:46.000 and track their inventory remotely and stuff like that. 45:46.000 --> 45:48.000 Yeah, it has effective uses in manufacturing. 45:48.000 --> 45:49.000 It's great for a plan. 45:49.000 --> 45:50.000 It's great for a plan. 45:50.000 --> 45:53.000 You know where that part is, you know, as it's going through the manufacturing process. 45:53.000 --> 45:54.000 You know how many are where. 45:54.000 --> 45:55.000 Exactly. 45:55.000 --> 45:56.000 It's good for inventory. 45:56.000 --> 45:57.000 That's good. 45:57.000 --> 46:01.000 It's not good for tracking what you eat and where you go and who you're fucking. 46:01.000 --> 46:02.000 Right, exactly. 46:02.000 --> 46:07.000 And you know who the big partner, um, that they were doing, one of the big, um, manufacturers 46:07.000 --> 46:12.000 who was doing this, a weird, you would never guess this, so I'll just tell you, it was Gillette. 46:12.000 --> 46:13.000 Gillette. 46:13.000 --> 46:14.000 These are people, really. 46:14.000 --> 46:16.000 Who make the razors and shaving cream and stuff like that. 46:16.000 --> 46:19.000 They were one of the ones that are getting on this ahead of time. 46:19.000 --> 46:23.000 I don't know why they want to track where your razor goes or whatever, but. 46:23.000 --> 46:25.000 Are they gonna know it's shaving my balls from the RFID chip? 46:25.000 --> 46:26.000 Yeah. 46:26.000 --> 46:27.000 I mean, come on. 46:27.000 --> 46:28.000 Come on now. 46:28.000 --> 46:29.000 You use an electric razor for that. 46:29.000 --> 46:30.000 Ouch. 46:30.000 --> 46:31.000 Ouch. 46:31.000 --> 46:32.000 Ouch. 46:32.000 --> 46:33.000 Hey, man. 46:33.000 --> 46:34.000 You wax. 46:36.000 --> 46:37.000 I have nared. 46:37.000 --> 46:42.000 I'm just saying I spend the better part of my day keeping sharp objects away from my scrotum. 46:42.000 --> 46:44.000 I don't want to go down there with the razor. 46:44.000 --> 46:45.000 I'm crying out loud. 46:45.000 --> 46:46.000 Haven't you? 46:46.000 --> 46:49.000 You gotta freak, if you want to be in the porno business. 46:50.000 --> 46:51.000 Like you. 46:51.000 --> 46:52.000 You do. 46:52.000 --> 46:53.000 Yeah. 46:53.000 --> 46:54.000 Shit. 46:54.000 --> 46:55.000 You know, you gotta, you gotta be nice and clean. 46:55.000 --> 46:56.000 I'm telling you. 46:56.000 --> 46:57.000 Six tickets. 46:57.000 --> 46:58.000 Gotcha. 46:58.000 --> 46:59.000 Okay. 46:59.000 --> 47:03.000 So, Gillette, I guess, you know, and this is, that is the concern. 47:03.000 --> 47:05.000 It's privacy concern of tracking those items. 47:05.000 --> 47:08.000 You know, let's say Gillette, for example. 47:08.000 --> 47:11.000 They're gonna track that you bought their razor, I guess. 47:11.000 --> 47:12.000 I don't know. 47:12.000 --> 47:17.000 And because it has a little antenna on it, basically, and can be read pretty much wherever 47:17.000 --> 47:22.000 it goes, theoretically, if the right equipment and everything is in place, the potential is 47:22.000 --> 47:26.000 there, which is why we, you know, really need to nip it in the bud as far as tracking consumers 47:26.000 --> 47:27.000 and stuff like that. 47:27.000 --> 47:28.000 That's, you know. 47:28.000 --> 47:33.000 But they can, I guess, maybe track and see how long you reuse and how many times you reuse 47:33.000 --> 47:35.000 that disposable razor. 47:35.000 --> 47:40.000 And maybe if you're reusing it too many times, they make it, develop it more disposable, 47:40.000 --> 47:42.000 make it rust faster so you can't reuse it. 47:42.000 --> 47:46.000 Find out if you're shaving your ball sack with it and develop a special bulk curve. 47:46.000 --> 47:50.000 They're gonna make a razor with two curves so that it'll hug the ball sack. 47:50.000 --> 47:52.000 Dude, why are you degrading my show? 47:52.000 --> 47:53.000 It's not my fault, dude. 47:53.000 --> 47:55.000 The sophomore humor has just gone too far. 47:55.000 --> 47:56.000 I'm so sorry. 47:56.000 --> 47:58.000 I know, but it's hilarious. 47:58.000 --> 48:00.000 It's a show, and I'm sorry. 48:00.000 --> 48:01.000 This will be the... 48:02.000 --> 48:04.000 Yeah, like you haven't done the same thing. 48:04.000 --> 48:06.000 This will be the highest rated episode ever. 48:06.000 --> 48:07.000 I think people like... 48:07.000 --> 48:08.000 Or Lois. 48:09.000 --> 48:11.000 People like it when we make fools of ourselves. 48:11.000 --> 48:12.000 Let's just go ahead. 48:12.000 --> 48:13.000 I thought it was way more disposable. 48:13.000 --> 48:14.000 That's funny. 48:14.000 --> 48:15.000 No. 48:15.000 --> 48:17.000 Yeah, I don't see the point. 48:17.000 --> 48:20.000 Well, first of all, I thought it was... 48:20.000 --> 48:26.000 Last time I heard, of course the testing was going to occur, and then they canceled it. 48:26.000 --> 48:27.000 And that was the last I heard. 48:27.000 --> 48:29.000 I didn't know it was back on again, and now it's off again. 48:29.000 --> 48:31.000 I wonder why it was so wishy-washy. 48:31.000 --> 48:33.000 Yeah, I had heard two or three different times. 48:33.000 --> 48:36.000 Now, this is in regards to Walmart. 48:36.000 --> 48:39.000 Now, Gillette is still going forward with this technology. 48:39.000 --> 48:51.000 And in other countries, I don't know what outlets or what stores, but Gillette is still going through with working together with outlets in, I think it was Germany, and where else? 48:51.000 --> 48:52.000 I don't remember. 48:52.000 --> 48:55.000 There's a couple of European countries that they are still going through with something like this. 48:55.000 --> 49:03.000 So, you know, again, we're borderless, and yeah, it got stopped here in the United States for now, but be careful when you shave your ball sack. 49:03.000 --> 49:04.000 That's all I'm saying. 49:04.000 --> 49:05.000 Right. 49:05.000 --> 49:07.000 That's good advice besides RFID. 49:07.000 --> 49:08.000 Yeah, you always got to be careful. 49:08.000 --> 49:10.000 Lather up really well. 49:10.000 --> 49:17.000 Now, honestly, I think this is more benevolent, maybe, than it sounds, because I don't think they're going to be really, like, tracking anything. 49:17.000 --> 49:19.000 I mean, like, injecting it into your skin. 49:19.000 --> 49:24.000 I think this is more for the manufacturing and for the quick checkout, right? 49:24.000 --> 49:26.000 You know, the humanless checkout, essentially. 49:26.000 --> 49:27.000 Absolutely. 49:27.000 --> 49:28.000 That's what I think this is for. 49:28.000 --> 49:34.000 Yeah, but I mean, again, if you go home and you got this antenna on your can of green beans... 49:34.000 --> 49:35.000 Yeah, exactly. 49:35.000 --> 49:39.000 You know, you open it, throw it away, and you know, it's gone. 49:39.000 --> 49:44.000 But, you know, what if they put this on your favorite goat sex porn movie? 49:44.000 --> 49:45.000 Right. 49:45.000 --> 49:47.000 Do you really want that tracked back to your house? 49:47.000 --> 49:48.000 Right, yeah. 49:48.000 --> 49:49.000 You know? 49:49.000 --> 49:52.000 I mean, we're being silly now, and that's a silly... 49:52.000 --> 49:55.000 But the potential for abuse is just too high. 49:55.000 --> 49:57.000 It's just too scary of a thought. 49:57.000 --> 50:00.000 They're going to, you know, what if they put one in every magazine subscription you have? 50:00.000 --> 50:09.000 What if they put one in your medicine, and they know where your medicine goes, and how often, you know, if you're giving it to someone else, or if you're leaving it somewhere, and how can they make it? 50:09.000 --> 50:11.000 You know, there's just... 50:11.000 --> 50:12.000 Right. 50:12.000 --> 50:15.000 Something private like that doesn't need to be out there for everyone to find out about. 50:15.000 --> 50:16.000 I agree. 50:16.000 --> 50:17.000 You know, you've got to think of it, though. 50:17.000 --> 50:22.000 You know, to get a pattern, you're going to need to track one RFID at separate spots, basically. 50:22.000 --> 50:24.000 The one RFID chip. 50:24.000 --> 50:27.000 So, that's how they can track a dog, you know, a person. 50:27.000 --> 50:29.000 You've got the one chip, and you're scanning in numerous places. 50:29.000 --> 50:31.000 That's how you get the pattern. 50:31.000 --> 50:35.000 So, honestly, if you've got a bunch of chips, and you're only scanning in one place, that's where it comes in. 50:35.000 --> 50:38.000 Yeah, you know what this is good for? 50:38.000 --> 50:40.000 This is the best application for this. 50:40.000 --> 50:42.000 I have a cat. 50:42.000 --> 50:51.000 And my cat, when I got the cat from the Humane Society, somebody didn't want it anymore, so I picked the cat up, and they tattooed the cat with this little code on the bottom of it. 50:51.000 --> 50:52.000 Sure. 50:52.000 --> 50:57.000 And in case the cat gets lost, they call an 800 number, they give it a tattoo, and they find out who it's registered to. 50:57.000 --> 51:08.000 Well, a friend of mine bought his cat about a year ago, and his cat came with an RFID tag thing surgically embedded under the thing's skin. 51:08.000 --> 51:09.000 Wow. 51:09.000 --> 51:14.000 They can track the cat if it ever gets away, if they ever want to find your pet, find your animal, you can track it. 51:14.000 --> 51:18.000 Whether you put it under your skin, that seems a little, they say it's safe or whatever, I don't know. 51:18.000 --> 51:21.000 Not going to debate about that, but that's a good concept, a good idea. 51:21.000 --> 51:25.000 Put that on the collar, you know, if nothing else, that you can track your animals. 51:25.000 --> 51:29.000 But human beings are not animals to be tracked like that. 51:29.000 --> 51:30.000 I agree. 51:30.000 --> 51:31.000 You know? 51:31.000 --> 51:33.000 Subcutaneous layers, though. 51:33.000 --> 51:34.000 Yeah, I agree. 51:34.000 --> 51:35.000 I agree. 51:35.000 --> 51:48.000 And we'll, you know, honestly, you're going to get dumb parents who have been brainwashed and, you know, who have had fear instilled upon them doing their kids. 51:48.000 --> 51:49.000 That's what's going to happen. 51:49.000 --> 51:56.000 And then you're going to have a bunch of teenagers, you know, or a bunch of adults, I should say, get them removed. 51:56.000 --> 51:57.000 We'll see what happens. 51:57.000 --> 51:59.000 Only the future will tell, you know. 51:59.000 --> 52:04.000 And honestly, we're going to see, we're going to see all this crazy shit, you know, before we pass on. 52:04.000 --> 52:05.000 Well, yeah. 52:05.000 --> 52:06.000 We will see. 52:06.000 --> 52:07.000 We will see. 52:07.000 --> 52:08.000 I don't know. 52:08.000 --> 52:10.000 Okay, let's, let's, let's predict something. 52:10.000 --> 52:13.000 Let's go to, you know, take Minority Report. 52:13.000 --> 52:17.000 Will we see Minority Report in our lifetime? 52:17.000 --> 52:20.000 Well, I haven't seen Minority Report, so I wouldn't know. 52:20.000 --> 52:21.000 Oh, well, yeah. 52:21.000 --> 52:25.000 I, you know, in a, in a, in a scary way, it's a good movie. 52:25.000 --> 52:27.000 There's product placement in there just like anything else. 52:27.000 --> 52:38.000 But, I do think that we will see, we will see very similar technology and very similar tactics before we pass on. 52:38.000 --> 52:41.000 It's, it's a worthwhile movie just for that look. 52:41.000 --> 52:42.000 Just for that look. 52:42.000 --> 52:45.000 Yeah, I'll have to check that one out. 52:45.000 --> 52:46.000 Yeah. 52:46.000 --> 52:47.000 I've been, I've been meaning to. 52:47.000 --> 52:48.000 I've heard good things about it. 52:48.000 --> 52:55.000 You know, there was also, I think somebody put an article in the forums about putting tags in like some video game. 52:55.000 --> 52:58.000 You give your kid the video game and, you know, they play those all the time. 52:58.000 --> 52:59.000 They have it with them in their pocket. 52:59.000 --> 53:02.000 And, secretly, it has a little tracking device so you know where your kids are at. 53:02.000 --> 53:03.000 Oh, yeah. 53:03.000 --> 53:06.000 Yeah, you know, that's, that's kind of, you know, I don't know. 53:06.000 --> 53:07.000 DPS Game Boy. 53:07.000 --> 53:08.000 Yeah, I remember that. 53:08.000 --> 53:09.000 Yeah. 53:10.000 --> 53:12.000 Um, you know what, we're, we're running short here, but. 53:12.000 --> 53:13.000 Big time. 53:13.000 --> 53:16.000 In honor of you, I think we should do a little quick freak note. 53:16.000 --> 53:18.000 Wait, where's my, oh no, I'm going to pull a duel. 53:18.000 --> 53:19.000 I'm going to pull a duel. 53:19.000 --> 53:20.000 I don't have my tones. 53:20.000 --> 53:21.000 Oh, hold on. 53:21.000 --> 53:22.000 Let me look. 53:22.000 --> 53:23.000 Uh-huh. 53:23.000 --> 53:24.000 See, when you're on my show, you have them. 53:24.000 --> 53:28.000 Don't have them on mine, but I got them on yours. 53:28.000 --> 53:29.000 Here we go. 53:33.000 --> 53:36.000 The first ever BinRev Freak News. 53:36.000 --> 53:37.000 Nice, dude. 53:37.000 --> 53:40.000 Actually, yeah, let me, I'll throw this quick one on you and see what you think about this. 53:40.000 --> 53:41.000 Okay. 53:41.000 --> 53:43.000 My, because I know how much you like Quest. 53:43.000 --> 53:44.000 Love it. 53:44.000 --> 53:47.000 You know, you like Quest as much as I like Bell South. 53:47.000 --> 53:52.000 Bell South, which is who I get my DSL service from, 50 bucks a month. 53:52.000 --> 53:56.000 Which is actually 45 for the DSL and then five bucks for the account. 53:56.000 --> 53:59.000 I don't know if yours breaks down or how other people's break down. 53:59.000 --> 54:04.000 But for that, I get 1.5 megabit per second download, theoretically. 54:04.000 --> 54:08.000 And 256 upstream, which you'd think would be enough to stream the show, but I don't know 54:08.000 --> 54:10.000 what's going on with that, but I digress. 54:10.000 --> 54:15.000 And I actually, honestly, I do get, I don't always get 1.5. 54:15.000 --> 54:20.000 I can get upwards of 1.4 on certain nights, you know, depending on what's going on and 54:20.000 --> 54:21.000 weather and stuff like that. 54:21.000 --> 54:25.000 But I'm consistently between 1 and 1.4, so I'm fairly happy, I have to admit. 54:25.000 --> 54:27.000 Wish it was cheaper. 54:27.000 --> 54:31.000 They're the, they're the highest, they have the highest saturation of DSL. 54:31.000 --> 54:34.000 They have the highest percentage of customer use of DSL. 54:34.000 --> 54:38.000 Yet, ironically, they're the highest priced DSL of all the telcos. 54:38.000 --> 54:45.000 Everyone else has 35, 40, 45 dollar total DSL bill and theirs is 50. 54:45.000 --> 54:48.000 So, but they ironically have the highest percentage of users. 54:48.000 --> 54:50.000 They rolled it out pretty quick down here. 54:50.000 --> 54:54.000 They got it in a lot of places, so I guess they jumped on it soon enough that made that happen. 54:54.000 --> 54:59.000 Well, now they're offering what they're calling DSL Lite. 54:59.000 --> 55:04.000 To me, it seems, for a user like me, I should say, it's pretty silly. 55:04.000 --> 55:09.000 Basically, for $35 a month, 15 bucks less than full-blown DSL. 55:09.000 --> 55:15.000 For 35 bucks a month, you can get a 256k download and a 128k upload. 55:15.000 --> 55:17.000 For 35 bucks? 55:17.000 --> 55:20.000 35 bucks, 256 down, 128 up. 55:20.000 --> 55:21.000 Yeah. 55:21.000 --> 55:23.000 Well, you know, and that's what I thought of. 55:23.000 --> 55:24.000 I'm like, what the hell? 55:24.000 --> 55:25.000 That's stupid. 55:25.000 --> 55:26.000 Who would buy, you know? 55:26.000 --> 55:28.000 It is faster, obviously, than a 56k modem. 55:28.000 --> 55:30.000 You know, what, five times faster? 55:30.000 --> 55:31.000 Yeah. 55:31.000 --> 55:33.000 So, it's a lot faster than a modem. 55:33.000 --> 55:40.000 The reason I think this might actually be successful is because, like, a friend of mine, he has a cable modem. 55:40.000 --> 55:42.000 They didn't have DSL in his neighborhood yet. 55:42.000 --> 55:48.000 Well, he has a cable modem and what he has to do is the cable modem still needs a phone line for upload. 55:48.000 --> 55:51.000 It's download only, at least the way his is. 55:51.000 --> 55:52.000 Ugh. 55:52.000 --> 55:57.000 So, he has to pay 20-something dollars a month for an extra phone line so it doesn't tie up his regular phone. 55:57.000 --> 56:03.000 So, when you're already paying 25 a month for that, plus he's paying whatever the bandwidth he pays for the cable modem, 56:03.000 --> 56:05.000 which he is not happy with the performance of it. 56:05.000 --> 56:07.000 I forgot what company he has. 56:07.000 --> 56:11.000 So, for someone like him, 35 bucks a month is actually going to save him a lot. 56:11.000 --> 56:15.000 He's going to cancel that second phone line because DSL piggybacks on your current phone line. 56:15.000 --> 56:20.000 So, he's going to save that 20-25 a month plus fees, taxes, and other assorted butt fucks they give you. 56:20.000 --> 56:26.000 And, he's going to get rid of the cable modem service and he's going to have this for 35 a month. 56:26.000 --> 56:31.000 Or, hell, even if he goes full-blown 50 bucks a month, he's still better off now, I think. 56:31.000 --> 56:35.000 So, I think people who have a second phone line in the house, which I did. 56:35.000 --> 56:38.000 I didn't want to tie up my normal phone line. 56:38.000 --> 56:44.000 So, I had a second phone line in my 56K modem back in the day before I got the DSL going. 56:44.000 --> 56:48.000 And, that was how I justified going to 50 bucks a month. 56:48.000 --> 56:53.000 You know, I'm not a rich guy, but I was paying 25, basically 30 bucks after fees and everything for the phone line. 56:53.000 --> 56:55.000 And, then you pay, you know, 20 bucks or whatever. 56:55.000 --> 56:59.000 You can get, of course, cheaper ISPs, but you pay an average of 20 bucks. 56:59.000 --> 57:01.000 That's 50 bucks right there. 57:01.000 --> 57:03.000 So, for the same price, you're upgraded to big-time bandwidth. 57:03.000 --> 57:08.000 So, I think people who have that second phone line, it could possibly be a good deal for them 57:08.000 --> 57:11.000 if they don't want to go to the full-blown DSL or don't need it. 57:11.000 --> 57:15.000 Sure, it's a good deal if you've got those screwy deals that your buddy has. 57:15.000 --> 57:17.000 A phone line for your upload? Your cable? 57:17.000 --> 57:19.000 That's the whole point of cable. 57:19.000 --> 57:23.000 I know. I never got that either, but he's not the only one of the first one I've heard about. 57:23.000 --> 57:26.000 If everybody's getting screwed like that, I could see where that'd be a good deal. 57:26.000 --> 57:30.000 Otherwise, I would pay 25, 30 bucks for that. 57:30.000 --> 57:32.000 Tops. 30 bucks tops for that service. 57:32.000 --> 57:33.000 Yeah. 57:33.000 --> 57:34.000 For what we have. 57:34.000 --> 57:35.000 Yeah. 57:35.000 --> 57:37.000 I'd say 25 would be fair. 57:37.000 --> 57:38.000 It's going to be a market. 57:38.000 --> 57:39.000 Yeah, I'd say 25 would be fair. 57:39.000 --> 57:40.000 Yeah. 57:40.000 --> 57:43.000 But, honestly, if people were getting screwed like that, I could see where they're just, 57:43.000 --> 57:45.000 they're dying to roll this out. 57:45.000 --> 57:46.000 Right. 57:46.000 --> 57:47.000 It's like, oh, it's like heaven for them. 57:47.000 --> 57:48.000 I mean, that's a bunch of crap. 57:48.000 --> 57:49.000 Yeah. 57:49.000 --> 57:51.000 And we've talked about before, I mean, I have DSL. 57:51.000 --> 57:54.000 I've never used cable, so I probably shouldn't pass judgment. 57:54.000 --> 57:58.000 But from what I've read, it just doesn't seem to be, it seems to be an inferior product. 57:58.000 --> 58:00.000 It doesn't seem to have the same thing. 58:00.000 --> 58:05.000 You can get as high as two gigabytes, or excuse me, yeah, two megabytes per second download 58:05.000 --> 58:07.000 as opposed to 1.5. 58:07.000 --> 58:08.000 Well, they cap it. 58:08.000 --> 58:10.000 But I've heard that's very rare. 58:10.000 --> 58:11.000 Whoa, whoa, whoa. 58:11.000 --> 58:12.000 You're talking about cable, right? 58:12.000 --> 58:14.000 I'm saying cable versus DSL. 58:14.000 --> 58:15.000 Well, they cap it. 58:15.000 --> 58:19.000 The classic argument that people have had for years is cable or DSL, which one's better? 58:19.000 --> 58:22.000 Well, all I know is cable kicks ass. 58:22.000 --> 58:23.000 It kicks ass. 58:23.000 --> 58:24.000 Your cable is good? 58:24.000 --> 58:25.000 Oh, yeah. 58:25.000 --> 58:26.000 And you get a good, consistent download? 58:26.000 --> 58:27.000 Always. 58:27.000 --> 58:30.000 And you don't have to use a separate phone line for your upload? 58:30.000 --> 58:31.000 No. 58:31.000 --> 58:34.000 So it sounds like you've got a good cable provider that did it right. 58:34.000 --> 58:35.000 Yeah, at a good price, too. 58:35.000 --> 58:36.000 So, yeah. 58:36.000 --> 58:37.000 Yeah, it rocks. 58:37.000 --> 58:41.000 So, I'm sure DSL's a good deal as well. 58:41.000 --> 58:42.000 Well, I don't have a choice. 58:42.000 --> 58:44.000 My cable company sucks dog ass. 58:44.000 --> 58:45.000 That's just it. 58:45.000 --> 58:46.000 I do. 58:46.000 --> 58:47.000 Maybe that's why. 58:47.000 --> 58:48.000 Yeah, so, you know, I don't have an option. 58:48.000 --> 58:51.000 If I had an option to try it and check it out, I would definitely give it a shot. 58:51.000 --> 58:57.000 Because, again, the only reason I have DSL, the only reason I have the phone line is for my DSL. 58:57.000 --> 58:59.000 I would cut it off and just use my cell phone. 58:59.000 --> 59:00.000 Right. 59:00.000 --> 59:02.000 But if you don't have a phone line to your house, you can't get DSL. 59:02.000 --> 59:08.000 If I had the option of a cable modem, I would be so quick to jump on it if it gave me the good download. 59:08.000 --> 59:11.000 Because I could get rid of the phone line. 59:11.000 --> 59:12.000 I could get rid of the DSL. 59:12.000 --> 59:15.000 That would save me, you know, 80 bucks a month. 59:15.000 --> 59:16.000 That'd be nice. 59:16.000 --> 59:18.000 You know, and go to the $40 or $50 a month cable. 59:18.000 --> 59:20.000 That would be phenomenal. 59:20.000 --> 59:21.000 Yeah, it adds up. 59:21.000 --> 59:22.000 It definitely adds up. 59:22.000 --> 59:23.000 Yeah, it sure does. 59:23.000 --> 59:25.000 The only reason I have the landline? 59:25.000 --> 59:27.000 Radio Freak Mayor. 59:27.000 --> 59:28.000 That's right. 59:28.000 --> 59:30.000 It's all for you. 59:30.000 --> 59:31.000 All right. 59:31.000 --> 59:35.000 Did you have anything for the first ever Binary Revolution Freak News? 59:35.000 --> 59:36.000 Or are we kidding? 59:36.000 --> 59:37.000 Yeah, briefly. 59:37.000 --> 59:40.000 And this is actually time sensitive, so this is perfect timing. 59:40.000 --> 59:45.000 MCI faces federal fraud inquiry on fees for long distance calls. 59:45.000 --> 59:52.000 That's right, an inquiry into MCI's dealings, even more so, right? 59:52.000 --> 59:55.000 You know about their accounting fraud, the biggest scandal ever. 59:55.000 --> 01:00:00.000 What is that, $750 million or something like that they were fined? 01:00:00.000 --> 01:00:01.000 I don't know, man. 01:00:01.000 --> 01:00:03.000 MCI is good people. 01:00:03.000 --> 01:00:04.000 Yeah. 01:00:04.000 --> 01:00:06.000 That's a joke, right? 01:00:06.000 --> 01:00:07.000 Yeah. 01:00:07.000 --> 01:00:08.000 Okay, good. 01:00:08.000 --> 01:00:09.000 That was a good delay, huh? 01:00:09.000 --> 01:00:10.000 That was nice. 01:00:10.000 --> 01:00:12.000 Yeah, I was like, uh, yes. 01:00:12.000 --> 01:00:17.000 Apparently, they've been routing calls, making long distance calls look like local calls 01:00:17.000 --> 01:00:19.000 so they don't have to pay the access fees naturally. 01:00:19.000 --> 01:00:23.000 Did you know that Quest provides a long distance for Bell South on their pay funds? 01:00:24.000 --> 01:00:25.000 I did not know that. 01:00:25.000 --> 01:00:26.000 Well, now you do. 01:00:26.000 --> 01:00:29.000 Well, they've been, uh, apparently they've been doing this for a long time, like since 01:00:29.000 --> 01:00:31.000 the early to mid-90s. 01:00:31.000 --> 01:00:35.000 And, uh, I don't know why this, uh, inquiry is just occurring now. 01:00:35.000 --> 01:00:42.000 Apparently, I think, uh, their, uh, competitors have been bringing shit up, uh, Verizon, SBC, 01:00:42.000 --> 01:00:43.000 and AT&T. 01:00:44.000 --> 01:00:50.000 Um, apparently, some customers had been, uh, some, uh, I think it was AT&T customers would 01:00:50.000 --> 01:00:53.000 complain that they would, uh, they'd be getting calls, but they would show up as local calls 01:00:53.000 --> 01:00:55.000 and not long distance calls, and they'd be pissed. 01:00:55.000 --> 01:01:00.000 So that, uh, that brought it to the, uh, the Fed's attention. 01:01:00.000 --> 01:01:02.000 Uh, I can't wait to see what comes out of this. 01:01:02.000 --> 01:01:05.000 I'm sure it's going to take a while, but, uh, this is just great stuff. 01:01:05.000 --> 01:01:06.000 A long while. 01:01:06.000 --> 01:01:09.000 I mean, illegally routing calls, so they don't have to pay the access fees. 01:01:09.000 --> 01:01:13.000 I think they pay, they pay billions of dollars every year in access fees, right? 01:01:13.000 --> 01:01:19.000 Fees to the local exchange carriers to, uh, let that long distance calls go through. 01:01:19.000 --> 01:01:25.000 And they, this is for hundreds of millions, I think. 01:01:25.000 --> 01:01:26.000 So, actually, not that much. 01:01:26.000 --> 01:01:28.000 Well, that's still a lot of money. 01:01:28.000 --> 01:01:29.000 That's a lot of money. 01:01:29.000 --> 01:01:31.000 Compared to, you know, tens of billions of dollars. 01:01:31.000 --> 01:01:33.000 Um, yeah, yeah, it is. 01:01:33.000 --> 01:01:34.000 It's still a lot of money. 01:01:34.000 --> 01:01:36.000 Otherwise, they wouldn't be doing all this stuff. 01:01:36.000 --> 01:01:39.000 Yeah, and this is a long, actually, I got the article from the New York Times. 01:01:39.000 --> 01:01:40.000 I think I saw it on Slash.com. 01:01:40.000 --> 01:01:41.000 I got the one from the New York Times. 01:01:41.000 --> 01:01:45.000 There's actually, uh, a multicolor fish wrap today, I believe. 01:01:45.000 --> 01:01:48.000 That's the USA Today, it's you and me. 01:01:48.000 --> 01:01:51.000 Uh, they had a short blurb about it, of course. 01:01:51.000 --> 01:01:52.000 But, uh, very good news. 01:01:52.000 --> 01:01:55.000 And this just came out, did it come out Sunday? 01:01:55.000 --> 01:01:57.000 What is today? 01:01:57.000 --> 01:01:58.000 Today's Monday. 01:01:58.000 --> 01:01:59.000 Yeah, yesterday. 01:01:59.000 --> 01:02:00.000 It came out yesterday. 01:02:00.000 --> 01:02:01.000 Sunday, so. 01:02:01.000 --> 01:02:02.000 Good read, definitely. 01:02:02.000 --> 01:02:03.000 Good stuff. 01:02:03.000 --> 01:02:04.000 Thought you'd love it. 01:02:04.000 --> 01:02:05.000 Thought you'd love it. 01:02:05.000 --> 01:02:09.000 You know, how long is it going to take up before we see any action from that and... 01:02:09.000 --> 01:02:10.000 Yeah, no, I don't know. 01:02:10.000 --> 01:02:13.000 I mean, how can they even exist anymore after all this shit? 01:02:13.000 --> 01:02:14.000 You know? 01:02:14.000 --> 01:02:15.000 I mean... 01:02:15.000 --> 01:02:16.000 Government subsidies. 01:02:16.000 --> 01:02:19.000 All they're going to do is increase our taxes to help pay for it. 01:02:19.000 --> 01:02:21.000 Yeah, you're just, you're so fucked all the way around. 01:02:21.000 --> 01:02:22.000 Goodbye. 01:02:22.000 --> 01:02:23.000 Yeah. 01:02:23.000 --> 01:02:24.000 Liquidation, baby. 01:02:24.000 --> 01:02:25.000 It's just so messed up. 01:02:25.000 --> 01:02:26.000 But it's, you know, it's too big. 01:02:26.000 --> 01:02:27.000 It's too huge. 01:02:27.000 --> 01:02:30.000 And another one will just take their place just as bad. 01:02:30.000 --> 01:02:31.000 Yeah, probably. 01:02:31.000 --> 01:02:32.000 Probably. 01:02:32.000 --> 01:02:33.000 Ooh, what is this? 01:02:33.000 --> 01:02:34.000 It caught my eye. 01:02:34.000 --> 01:02:39.000 The main scheme of avoiding access charges was referred to in company documents variously 01:02:39.000 --> 01:02:45.000 as Project Invader and Project Scorpion, according to former technicians at the company. 01:02:45.000 --> 01:02:49.000 In statements provided to investigators, they described the enormous pressure they faced 01:02:49.000 --> 01:02:50.000 to reduce access fees. 01:02:50.000 --> 01:02:51.000 Oh, this is great. 01:02:51.000 --> 01:02:52.000 Oh, I've got to read this whole thing. 01:02:52.000 --> 01:02:55.000 I haven't read it all, so I'm guilty as charged. 01:02:55.000 --> 01:02:59.000 But this is going to be good, good stuff, good reading, and good drama. 01:02:59.000 --> 01:03:00.000 Unbelievable. 01:03:00.000 --> 01:03:01.000 Unbelievable. 01:03:01.000 --> 01:03:04.000 Wow, I tell you what, man, they better get the shredders fired up and ready. 01:03:04.000 --> 01:03:05.000 Ooh, boy. 01:03:05.000 --> 01:03:06.000 Start cleaning out some emails. 01:03:06.000 --> 01:03:11.000 I think, yeah, apparently some old employees gave some information. 01:03:11.000 --> 01:03:12.000 They had to have. 01:03:12.000 --> 01:03:14.000 I mean, you have to have some information like that. 01:03:14.000 --> 01:03:15.000 Good shit. 01:03:15.000 --> 01:03:16.000 Dude, that's cool. 01:03:16.000 --> 01:03:17.000 All right, man. 01:03:17.000 --> 01:03:18.000 Close out the freak news. 01:03:18.000 --> 01:03:19.000 Freak news. 01:03:19.000 --> 01:03:21.000 All right. 01:03:21.000 --> 01:03:24.000 Did that come through okay? 01:03:24.000 --> 01:03:25.000 Yeah, it came through good. 01:03:25.000 --> 01:03:28.000 I've got to apologize for bringing your show down to my level. 01:03:28.000 --> 01:03:29.000 Ah, please. 01:03:29.000 --> 01:03:30.000 It was the funnest show. 01:03:30.000 --> 01:03:31.000 Yeah. 01:03:31.000 --> 01:03:34.000 If you've got to have fun every once in a while, it'll probably be... 01:03:34.000 --> 01:03:38.000 We covered a lot of good topics and had some actually pretty deep stuff. 01:03:38.000 --> 01:03:41.000 I mean, we make fun and joke while we do it, but I think that's what... 01:03:41.000 --> 01:03:43.000 I don't know if that's what the people like. 01:03:43.000 --> 01:03:44.000 That's what I like doing, you know? 01:03:44.000 --> 01:03:45.000 It makes it fun. 01:03:45.000 --> 01:03:46.000 It makes it fun. 01:03:46.000 --> 01:03:48.000 I like to laugh and have fun while we're doing it and make fun of people. 01:03:48.000 --> 01:03:50.000 And it helps get the point across. 01:03:50.000 --> 01:03:55.000 You can either rant and get on the soapbox and pound the Bible and try to throw it, 01:03:55.000 --> 01:04:01.000 or you can make fun of them and show how ridiculous these things are that these people are doing. 01:04:01.000 --> 01:04:02.000 And that's what they are. 01:04:02.000 --> 01:04:03.000 They are fucking ridiculous. 01:04:03.000 --> 01:04:08.000 And there's nothing wrong with saying that they are fucking, fucking, fucking, fucking ridiculous sometimes. 01:04:08.000 --> 01:04:09.000 How many was that? 01:04:09.000 --> 01:04:10.000 I don't know. 01:04:10.000 --> 01:04:12.000 If you want to hear effing ridiculous, thank you. 01:04:12.000 --> 01:04:14.000 You should listen to the next RFA. 01:04:14.000 --> 01:04:15.000 You know what? 01:04:15.000 --> 01:04:16.000 I'm kind of looking forward. 01:04:16.000 --> 01:04:18.000 I'm already getting geared up. 01:04:18.000 --> 01:04:23.000 I'm getting red in the face and hot now because I know... 01:04:23.000 --> 01:04:24.000 You know what? 01:04:24.000 --> 01:04:25.000 Let's give... 01:04:25.000 --> 01:04:26.000 I'm going to give the listeners a warning. 01:04:26.000 --> 01:04:33.000 RFA this week, if you have earmuffs, earphones, ear protectors, put some wax, don't clean your ears, 01:04:33.000 --> 01:04:36.000 because it could get really loud and really messy. 01:04:36.000 --> 01:04:37.000 Oh, it's going to be awesome. 01:04:37.000 --> 01:04:38.000 It's going to be me... 01:04:38.000 --> 01:04:39.000 I will tell them. 01:04:39.000 --> 01:04:40.000 It's going to be me, you, and Bland. 01:04:40.000 --> 01:04:42.000 We've got some good shit to talk about. 01:04:42.000 --> 01:04:43.000 Oh. 01:04:43.000 --> 01:04:44.000 Very good shit. 01:04:44.000 --> 01:04:45.000 Yeah, well, let's... 01:04:45.000 --> 01:04:46.000 It was a great show. 01:04:46.000 --> 01:04:50.000 Can I tell you that you made me think on this show. 01:04:50.000 --> 01:04:51.000 I mean... 01:04:51.000 --> 01:04:53.000 And you know, and I'm not good at thinking. 01:04:54.000 --> 01:04:55.000 You made me think. 01:04:55.000 --> 01:04:56.000 I mean... 01:04:56.000 --> 01:04:57.000 Oh, shut up. 01:04:57.000 --> 01:04:58.000 Think deep, long, and hard. 01:04:58.000 --> 01:05:01.000 Oh, you know I'm going to use deep, long, and hard. 01:05:01.000 --> 01:05:02.000 Okay. 01:05:02.000 --> 01:05:04.000 All right, that's enough. 01:05:04.000 --> 01:05:06.000 Oh, no, we did. 01:05:06.000 --> 01:05:10.000 Like I said, we had fun, we covered some serious topics, and you know... 01:05:10.000 --> 01:05:11.000 Yes. 01:05:11.000 --> 01:05:12.000 Good show. 01:05:12.000 --> 01:05:16.000 I guess we've got to close up, close the bag up there, close the freak nose up, and you 01:05:16.000 --> 01:05:19.000 know, I say it at the end of every show, if you've got feedback, you've got something 01:05:19.000 --> 01:05:23.000 like, didn't like you, we say fuck too much, you know, send a letter to fuck you... 01:05:23.000 --> 01:05:27.000 I'm sorry, send a letter to letters at binrev.com, and tell us... 01:05:27.000 --> 01:05:28.000 Oh, send a letter to... 01:05:28.000 --> 01:05:29.000 How about a nice... 01:05:29.000 --> 01:05:30.000 We really... 01:05:30.000 --> 01:05:32.000 You know, honestly, joking aside, I mean, we really should... 01:05:32.000 --> 01:05:33.000 We should... 01:05:33.000 --> 01:05:34.000 Let's have a contest or something. 01:05:34.000 --> 01:05:36.000 Maybe that's what we need to motivate us. 01:05:36.000 --> 01:05:39.000 Let's try to see who's going to stop using it. 01:05:39.000 --> 01:05:42.000 We need one of those jars where we put a dollar into it every time we say the F word. 01:05:42.000 --> 01:05:43.000 Whatever. 01:05:43.000 --> 01:05:44.000 Whatever. 01:05:44.000 --> 01:05:45.000 Because I tried it last... 01:05:45.000 --> 01:05:46.000 Did you listen to the last episode? 01:05:46.000 --> 01:05:47.000 I tried. 01:05:47.000 --> 01:05:48.000 Did you really? 01:05:48.000 --> 01:05:49.000 I tried. 01:05:49.000 --> 01:05:50.000 I made it... 01:05:50.000 --> 01:05:51.000 I said it a couple times at the beginning, and then I said I'm going to try to make it 01:05:51.000 --> 01:05:52.000 through the episode. 01:05:52.000 --> 01:05:53.000 I don't remember if I did or not. 01:05:53.000 --> 01:05:55.000 I don't think I made it without saying it. 01:05:55.000 --> 01:05:56.000 I don't remember. 01:05:56.000 --> 01:05:58.000 Honestly, naturally, I usually... 01:05:58.000 --> 01:06:00.000 I think I usually don't. 01:06:00.000 --> 01:06:01.000 Honestly, I don't... 01:06:01.000 --> 01:06:03.000 I usually don't think about it, and if it happens, it happens. 01:06:03.000 --> 01:06:05.000 If I'm pissed off, sometimes it does, you know. 01:06:05.000 --> 01:06:06.000 Well, yeah. 01:06:06.000 --> 01:06:07.000 These things, they piss you off. 01:06:07.000 --> 01:06:08.000 They really do. 01:06:08.000 --> 01:06:12.000 And, you know, I guess we should also warn them for this Wednesday's RFA, because you're 01:06:12.000 --> 01:06:13.000 going to hear it from me. 01:06:13.000 --> 01:06:15.000 I guarantee you. 01:06:15.000 --> 01:06:17.000 And that's just fine. 01:06:17.000 --> 01:06:20.000 Before we end, I want to end on this. 01:06:20.000 --> 01:06:22.000 I want to thank you for making another show. 01:06:22.000 --> 01:06:23.000 Oh, please. 01:06:23.000 --> 01:06:24.000 I wouldn't be here without you. 01:06:24.000 --> 01:06:25.000 You know that. 01:06:25.000 --> 01:06:27.000 Let's quit blowing smoke up each other's ass. 01:06:27.000 --> 01:06:28.000 It was great having you on. 01:06:28.000 --> 01:06:29.000 I like having you on. 01:06:29.000 --> 01:06:30.000 We have fun. 01:06:30.000 --> 01:06:33.000 My C++ homework, I had something good to listen to, and I appreciate it. 01:06:33.000 --> 01:06:38.000 Well, I have fun doing it, and I wouldn't be here without your help and streaming and 01:06:38.000 --> 01:06:39.000 everything. 01:06:39.000 --> 01:06:44.000 And speaking of something to listen to, we're going to end today's show with Ill Skills, 01:06:44.000 --> 01:06:47.000 a track named Platinum, from mp3.com. 01:06:47.000 --> 01:06:48.000 Check him out. 01:06:48.000 --> 01:06:49.000 Right on. 01:06:49.000 --> 01:06:50.000 Anyway, you know how we end it. 01:06:50.000 --> 01:06:54.000 We'll see everybody next time, Same Hack Time. 01:06:56.000 --> 01:06:57.000 That's your cue. 01:06:58.000 --> 01:06:59.000 Same Hack Channel. 01:06:59.000 --> 01:07:01.000 You almost tried to screw me out late. 01:07:01.000 --> 01:07:03.000 Oh, score later. 01:07:03.000 --> 01:07:14.060 You have to kitchen table 01:07:16.000 --> 01:07:21.000 And someone in the middle of my ear, about rattling and filling and cutting them out. 01:07:21.000 --> 01:07:23.000 See my little couts that you haven't done. 01:07:23.000 --> 01:07:24.000 Take care, take care. 01:07:24.000 --> 01:07:25.000 That's a good thing. 01:07:25.000 --> 01:07:54.980 Thank you. 01:07:55.000 --> 01:08:24.980 Thank you. 01:08:25.000 --> 01:08:54.980 Thank you. 01:08:55.000 --> 01:09:24.980 Thank you. 01:09:25.000 --> 01:09:54.980 Thank you. 01:09:55.000 --> 01:10:24.980 Thank you. 01:10:25.000 --> 01:10:54.980 Thank you. 01:10:55.000 --> 01:10:57.000 Thank you.