WEBVTT 00:00.000 --> 00:02.980 Get ready to rock the planet. 00:06.420 --> 00:08.000 Get ready. 00:20.000 --> 00:24.300 Digital Dogpong presents Binary Revolution Radio. 00:24.300 --> 00:26.000 Now launch the base. 00:30.000 --> 00:40.300 Get ready to rock the planet. 00:48.300 --> 00:49.720 Yeah, go planet. 00:51.000 --> 00:52.300 Captain system. 00:53.300 --> 00:55.000 Magnus Unity Time. 01:00.000 --> 01:06.640 Get ready to rock the planet. 01:09.300 --> 01:10.880 Hack the planet. 01:12.620 --> 01:13.640 Hack the system. 01:14.460 --> 01:15.400 Hack us unite. 01:17.140 --> 01:17.980 Get ready. 01:17.980 --> 01:22.300 Get ready to rock the planet. 01:22.300 --> 01:22.840 Let's go. 01:31.600 --> 01:35.100 We play track the system. 01:45.600 --> 01:48.600 Magnus Unity Time. 01:48.600 --> 01:48.900 Get ready to rock the planet. 01:57.900 --> 02:00.120 Get ready to rock the planet. 02:00.120 --> 02:02.160 Hack us unite. 02:05.900 --> 02:08.200 Hack us unite. 02:10.900 --> 02:13.080 Hack the planet. 02:14.300 --> 02:16.540 Hack the system. 02:17.280 --> 02:18.000 Hack us unite. 02:18.000 --> 02:18.680 Get ready to rock the planet. 02:24.680 --> 02:26.780 Get ready to rock the system. 02:28.020 --> 02:30.440 Get ready to rock the planet. 02:43.300 --> 02:44.760 Hack the planet. 02:44.760 --> 02:46.160 Get ready to rock the planet. 02:46.160 --> 02:49.000 Get ready to rock the planet. 02:51.440 --> 02:54.000 Get ready to rock the planet. 02:58.440 --> 03:02.640 Get ready to rock the planet. 03:06.440 --> 03:06.960 Get ready to rock the planet. 03:07.040 --> 03:07.540 Rock the planet. 03:07.540 --> 03:08.140 Go plane to rock the planet. 03:08.140 --> 03:08.720 Get ready to rock the planet. 03:08.720 --> 03:09.280 Get ready to rock the planet. 03:09.280 --> 03:09.960 Get ready to rock the planet. 03:09.960 --> 03:39.940 We'll be right back. 03:39.960 --> 04:09.940 We'll be right back. 04:09.960 --> 04:11.480 I was a dick with my 56. 04:12.000 --> 04:14.480 Now with my cable, I'm able to get that stable. 04:14.800 --> 04:16.740 On the out, my name is Ace and I'm a Leo. 04:17.100 --> 04:20.480 On the digital highway, my name is Neo and I'm a Nero. 04:20.700 --> 04:23.180 In a flash, I'll screw you on burning dream cats. 04:23.520 --> 04:24.320 You need some ISO? 04:24.800 --> 04:26.380 Let me through my hard drive rifle. 04:26.720 --> 04:28.400 Our exchange you could never stifle. 04:28.640 --> 04:29.880 And a digital hug. 04:30.080 --> 04:31.540 You just caught the love bug. 04:31.540 --> 04:32.980 I bootlegged your CD. 04:33.420 --> 04:35.580 I caused the fight between Un and Jay-Z. 04:35.920 --> 04:37.800 Your CG, it's all gonna be free. 04:37.900 --> 04:40.120 Whether we take it by force or we take it nicely. 04:40.520 --> 04:42.140 You feel that rattle in your bones? 04:42.380 --> 04:44.300 When I tell you we just hacked out Jones. 04:44.600 --> 04:46.460 And NASDAQ leaves you flat on your back. 04:46.460 --> 04:48.760 Cause I am he who loves to hack and crack. 04:49.020 --> 04:51.520 Cause I am he who loves to hack and crack. 04:51.980 --> 04:54.620 This is dedicated to the hackers and the criminals. 04:55.120 --> 04:59.640 Serial codes, source codes, ISOs, RAMs, SIFs, SIFs. 04:59.880 --> 05:02.240 This is dedicated to the hackers and the crack. 05:02.240 --> 05:08.060 I am not going to start the show by saying all right today. 05:08.960 --> 05:12.800 I think that might be the first show I've ever started off without saying all right. 05:13.480 --> 05:14.740 But I didn't do it this time. 05:14.740 --> 05:21.220 But, I will say welcome to Binary Revolution Radio episode number 14. 05:22.020 --> 05:24.360 We have a returning guest this week. 05:25.560 --> 05:30.940 And he goes by the name of Not Theory, In Theory. 05:32.240 --> 05:32.940 What's up? 05:33.200 --> 05:34.820 Or whatever else you want to call him. 05:34.980 --> 05:36.080 Not Theory, In The Heezy. 05:36.240 --> 05:37.200 In The Heezy. 05:37.340 --> 05:37.780 It's easy. 05:39.620 --> 05:44.160 We have already been on the phone for an hour and a half before we started recording the show. 05:44.740 --> 05:47.340 So, I don't know what material we have left in us. 05:48.060 --> 05:48.360 Nothing. 05:48.460 --> 05:50.900 It's going to feel like we're going over the same conversation again. 05:50.900 --> 05:51.040 Right. 05:51.440 --> 05:51.880 Exactly. 05:53.000 --> 05:59.920 Actually, I'll probably start off the show with kind of a housekeeping section, emails, things like that. 05:59.920 --> 06:04.160 And, first thing I'm sure everybody noticed, we had a different intro. 06:04.280 --> 06:05.240 We still have the same theme. 06:05.300 --> 06:06.680 I'm not going to get rid of the theme song. 06:06.780 --> 06:08.300 I'm still going to have the same opening theme. 06:08.680 --> 06:15.680 But, in front of that, we had a new theme that was sent to me by none other than Epiphany himself. 06:15.940 --> 06:19.740 Our good friend over there producing Radical Future. 06:21.080 --> 06:22.000 Longtime friend. 06:22.640 --> 06:25.560 Sent us that mix, which is very, very cool. 06:25.560 --> 06:27.900 So, we open the show with that. 06:28.020 --> 06:29.100 Give us some lead-in music. 06:30.080 --> 06:32.040 And, try to use that. 06:32.600 --> 06:33.800 I might start using that. 06:34.500 --> 06:36.020 And then, I don't know. 06:36.100 --> 06:36.820 Should I... 06:36.820 --> 06:38.180 See, we're not really a freaking show. 06:38.300 --> 06:40.680 Should I start putting in some phone calls or something at the beginning? 06:40.800 --> 06:41.800 Should I start recording some? 06:41.920 --> 06:43.140 But, I don't know. 06:43.140 --> 06:44.260 That's more a duels thing. 06:45.060 --> 06:48.420 I think every once in a while it would be fun to go out and do something like that. 06:48.420 --> 06:49.700 Eh, I guess maybe once in a while. 06:49.740 --> 06:50.620 I do have... 06:50.620 --> 06:56.060 I still have a telephonic craptacular coming up whenever I get my lazy ass together to edit it. 06:58.420 --> 06:59.120 So, anyway. 06:59.300 --> 07:00.280 Thank you, Epiphany, for that. 07:00.340 --> 07:00.820 Very cool. 07:01.360 --> 07:06.360 We also got a lot of feedback, generally, on the virus episode last week. 07:08.320 --> 07:09.640 Which surprised me, actually. 07:09.760 --> 07:12.340 I really didn't know what people were going to think about that. 07:12.460 --> 07:12.840 But, hey. 07:13.800 --> 07:17.280 Apparently, it was interesting and very timely, from what I understand from the forums. 07:17.280 --> 07:19.000 I thought that was kind of interesting, kind of funny. 07:21.180 --> 07:24.780 And, this past week, also, were 2,600 meetings. 07:25.540 --> 07:28.280 So, for those of us who were conveniently located... 07:29.120 --> 07:29.680 Well, not that I'm... 07:29.680 --> 07:31.820 I'm really not all that conveniently located, actually. 07:31.880 --> 07:35.980 It's a good 45-minute drive for me to go to my local 2,600 meeting. 07:36.080 --> 07:36.900 But, I did go. 07:37.280 --> 07:38.380 We had a very good turnout. 07:38.540 --> 07:39.280 There was probably... 07:40.400 --> 07:42.760 Might have even been over a dozen people this time. 07:42.840 --> 07:45.500 Somewhere around a dozen at our meeting this time. 07:45.500 --> 07:48.120 Some people we'd met before from previous meetings here and there. 07:48.220 --> 07:50.180 You know how people come and go every month or two. 07:50.720 --> 07:53.220 So, we had some repeat customers come back this time. 07:53.280 --> 07:55.200 We also had some totally new people. 07:56.140 --> 07:59.020 So, pretty good meeting, all in all, I'd have to say. 07:59.020 --> 08:03.800 And, we didn't get hassled by security for a change. 08:04.640 --> 08:06.260 Actually, we haven't had too much. 08:06.320 --> 08:08.420 Last month, we did have problems with security. 08:08.580 --> 08:10.920 And, I know Duel, they've had problems. 08:11.000 --> 08:15.020 Duel and Rax, they had some problems with security that they're meeting, especially the last time. 08:15.080 --> 08:16.500 And, they've actually switched locations. 08:17.000 --> 08:19.700 But, they seem to be okay with us. 08:19.740 --> 08:21.660 The only problem they have with us is using their electricity. 08:21.740 --> 08:24.680 They don't like us plugging our laptops into their power outlets on the floor. 08:24.680 --> 08:27.720 I mean, that's the worst they got. 08:28.260 --> 08:32.780 I didn't notice a couple people, like, sitting unusually close to our meeting area. 08:32.880 --> 08:34.540 Usually, people avoid us like the plague. 08:36.620 --> 08:42.940 But, I couldn't help but notice a couple people that just kind of, like, sinned to be leaning back in their chair with their ear cocked towards our conversation. 08:43.080 --> 08:44.340 That was kind of surprising. 08:44.500 --> 08:45.140 It was kind of interesting. 08:46.280 --> 08:48.100 Of course, we didn't really change anything because of it. 08:48.120 --> 08:49.460 I figure if they want to listen, let them listen. 08:49.460 --> 08:51.460 You never know, man. 08:51.480 --> 08:52.080 They could be fed. 08:52.400 --> 08:53.060 Got to look out. 08:53.300 --> 08:54.960 Yeah, I guess be careful what you say. 08:55.380 --> 08:55.620 Yeah. 08:56.020 --> 08:57.420 You know, actually, I... 08:57.420 --> 08:59.860 Hmm, speaking of that, should I bring this up on the show? 08:59.980 --> 09:02.520 Am I going to get myself in trouble for this? 09:02.580 --> 09:03.360 No, I don't think so. 09:04.940 --> 09:10.460 At our meeting, my activity this time, we didn't really... 09:11.020 --> 09:13.080 We were thinking it was going to be a very small meeting. 09:13.080 --> 09:18.440 So, we didn't actually plan any topics of discussion or any particular meeting specifics. 09:19.660 --> 09:21.660 So, we were just kind of winging it, playing. 09:22.380 --> 09:29.120 And, I fired up my wireless sniffing program. 09:29.620 --> 09:32.940 And, there is a wireless access point, a couple of them in the mall. 09:34.460 --> 09:38.800 They're not encrypted, but they do authenticate somewhere. 09:39.160 --> 09:42.660 And, this is actually a good tie-in to one of our big topics later on. 09:43.080 --> 09:45.440 You do have to authenticate to get on the system. 09:47.080 --> 09:50.140 However, well, let me rephrase. 09:50.220 --> 09:54.040 You have to authenticate to get out of the system, to get onto the internet. 09:54.180 --> 09:55.140 You'd have to authenticate. 09:55.980 --> 10:00.140 And, it turns out that that access is being provided by a kiosk. 10:00.600 --> 10:06.600 Some company has put a kiosk in there that will allow you to connect to the internet for so much per minute. 10:07.780 --> 10:08.980 Or, so much per hour. 10:09.060 --> 10:09.340 I don't know. 10:09.380 --> 10:11.020 I know where the kiosk is, and I've seen it. 10:11.020 --> 10:14.300 But, well, it's definitely what I was picking up. 10:14.660 --> 10:19.060 But, you have to put money in and get a password or something to authenticate onto that system. 10:19.820 --> 10:20.960 I did not go that far. 10:21.060 --> 10:22.920 Probably next month, that's going to be, I'm going to try that. 10:22.940 --> 10:23.780 I'm going to go over there. 10:23.880 --> 10:25.280 I'm going to see exactly how it works. 10:25.380 --> 10:27.260 Pay for a minute or two just to see how it works. 10:27.820 --> 10:28.380 Log in. 10:28.460 --> 10:29.960 See what kind of name and password it gives me. 10:29.960 --> 10:33.460 And, while I'm in there, unfortunately, it's a shell. 10:33.940 --> 10:35.360 I can't really root out of it. 10:36.020 --> 10:36.700 I tried. 10:37.340 --> 10:43.160 I can't really root out of it to see what kind of network settings they give me and what bridge and what gateways and et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. 10:44.120 --> 10:46.220 If so, I could get that and take it back to the laptop. 10:46.220 --> 10:57.880 But, what I could do is I could access anything within their intranet, anything within their allowed network areas, which is basically the service provider itself. 10:57.880 --> 11:10.320 Well, by poking around their system, and really not that hard, poking around their system, I actually found the software that you install on the kiosk. 11:11.380 --> 11:15.600 Yeah, so I downloaded the software through their free net access. 11:15.840 --> 11:19.960 Again, it was inside of their allowable area, so I never had to authenticate. 11:19.960 --> 11:28.140 If they want to resolve it, all it does is it looks like it came from a locally, internally assigned DHCP address, a 10 dot, you know, whatever. 11:29.000 --> 11:35.960 So, I downloaded it and installed it, and basically, sitting there in the food court, I turned my laptop into a kiosk. 11:36.860 --> 11:37.400 That's awesome. 11:37.500 --> 11:38.760 Yeah, it was really pretty fun. 11:38.940 --> 11:42.720 I couldn't do anything with it again because I still could not authenticate with it. 11:43.860 --> 11:47.560 So, and by that time, it had taken me a little while to get that far. 11:47.560 --> 11:51.000 But also, part of the package is I have all the documentation. 11:52.260 --> 11:55.340 So, that's the first thing I tried. 11:55.420 --> 12:03.860 I'm reading through the documentation, saw how to get, saw in controls, ran over to the other side of the mall where the kiosk was, and tried the default name and password. 12:04.520 --> 12:06.460 They were smart enough to change that. 12:07.420 --> 12:07.900 Damn it. 12:08.100 --> 12:09.000 I almost had it. 12:09.680 --> 12:13.980 They were smart enough to change the default user login and username and password. 12:13.980 --> 12:18.980 So, if I could have got into that, I could have rooted the system and gotten that information, but alas. 12:19.520 --> 12:22.160 But it's unencrypted, you said, so you can just sniff somebody else's. 12:22.660 --> 12:24.360 Yeah, but nobody ever uses it. 12:24.400 --> 12:24.980 That's the other thing. 12:25.040 --> 12:26.220 I've never seen anybody use it. 12:26.400 --> 12:26.860 That's true. 12:27.040 --> 12:28.500 What's the name of the company that does it? 12:28.540 --> 12:28.780 Do you know? 12:29.440 --> 12:33.180 I have it in the laptop, of course, and it's not handy with me. 12:33.240 --> 12:35.300 So, no, I do not know it off the top of my head. 12:35.480 --> 12:36.300 Yeah, I'd be really curious. 12:36.400 --> 12:40.140 The only ones I've seen ever are, like, T-Mobile hotspots, and that's about it. 12:40.140 --> 12:42.920 No, this was definitely a local company. 12:44.360 --> 12:50.140 I'm sure they, like, worked out some kind of contract deal with the mall to give them some kickback or something. 12:50.180 --> 12:51.800 It's definitely not a big-name company. 12:51.920 --> 12:52.700 It's a local thing. 12:52.980 --> 12:55.240 And I think they were piggybacking on DSL. 12:55.620 --> 12:55.840 Oh. 12:56.040 --> 13:03.300 Yeah, when I was doing Traceroute to see how far back I could go and see where it was stopping along the way so I could scan each one of them. 13:03.500 --> 13:03.840 Right. 13:03.840 --> 13:10.920 Of course, it hopped along some DSL lines at the closest hops. 13:11.260 --> 13:13.300 So, that was kind of unusual. 13:13.760 --> 13:14.780 Yeah, that's pretty interesting stuff. 13:14.980 --> 13:15.120 Yep. 13:17.100 --> 13:18.560 So, that, you know, I had fun. 13:18.760 --> 13:21.980 I probably zoned out doing my own thing there for a little while. 13:22.120 --> 13:24.520 So, anybody that's listening, I apologize for that. 13:24.600 --> 13:25.580 We did have a lot of people there. 13:25.640 --> 13:27.060 I probably should have been a little bit more polite. 13:27.060 --> 13:31.000 And, actually, that's another thing I wanted to mention. 13:31.160 --> 13:34.520 It's something that Rax actually brought up on RFA last week. 13:35.300 --> 13:37.620 And that is the topic of professionalism. 13:37.900 --> 13:39.160 Not necessarily politeness. 13:39.260 --> 13:41.120 I guess I can be a jerk as long as I'm professional. 13:41.300 --> 13:43.040 I guess it doesn't quite work out that way. 13:43.780 --> 13:49.440 But, actually, people that have listened, even from episode one, even, I've tried. 13:49.440 --> 13:55.280 Especially, especially more recently, people know that I'm trying my best to control my language. 13:56.700 --> 13:59.240 And, Rax is absolutely 100% right. 13:59.320 --> 14:02.900 He mentioned it on RFA last week about being professional and trying to control the language. 14:03.340 --> 14:10.320 And, you know, somebody said that they want to be able to play this for their mother or play this for their parents or teachers or something like that. 14:11.140 --> 14:13.040 You know, ideally, that would be great. 14:13.040 --> 14:19.660 But, you know, another thing I said in episode one is this is a show by hackers for hackers. 14:19.980 --> 14:21.500 It's not really for parents. 14:21.600 --> 14:22.800 It's not really for teachers. 14:22.940 --> 14:30.220 I mean, they're welcome to listen to it if they're open-minded enough to understand what we're talking about and hear an occasional four-letter word. 14:31.620 --> 14:36.720 But, that being said, I am, just for my own reasons, going to try to cut back. 14:36.720 --> 14:41.860 Because, when you start overusing them, it becomes, I don't know, obscene. 14:41.860 --> 14:43.580 And, it just becomes very unnecessary. 14:44.660 --> 14:53.160 So, I'm going to try, as usual, to cut back and use them at an absolute minimum, if at all. 14:53.580 --> 14:56.760 I mean, sometimes I go off on the RAAA. 14:56.840 --> 14:59.380 I go off on some of these just asinine topics. 14:59.880 --> 15:07.100 And, I can't help, but I want to get the point across so bad that I just can't help but throw in an F-bomb on occasion. 15:07.300 --> 15:10.480 So, I'm going to make a conscious effort, as I have been. 15:10.480 --> 15:12.120 And, I think I've been getting a little better. 15:13.040 --> 15:19.860 It would be interesting to compare from the first episode back to this most recent episode if I've gone down in my number of vulgarities. 15:20.020 --> 15:21.980 But, anyway, I'm going to try to keep them at a minimum. 15:22.760 --> 15:25.520 And, Rax, and other people have kind of mentioned it before, too. 15:26.520 --> 15:27.700 They're absolutely right. 15:27.700 --> 15:32.340 And, it's not a radio, you know, I'm not limited by the seven words you can't say. 15:32.660 --> 15:36.300 This is not something that the FCC is going to tell me what I can and can't do. 15:36.840 --> 15:41.100 Rant Radio is very free, for the most part, in letting us, allowing us to speak our minds. 15:41.180 --> 15:42.620 I mean, that is kind of what they're about. 15:42.620 --> 15:47.220 But, I'm going to take it upon myself to try to step the show up a little bit. 15:48.180 --> 15:49.200 And, what do you think? 15:49.280 --> 15:53.120 Am I, is that, should I just go all out? 15:53.240 --> 15:56.440 Or, I mean, do I really, should I really rein myself in? 15:57.020 --> 15:59.420 You know, I think some restraint is not such a bad thing. 15:59.480 --> 16:02.500 I think the person who mentioned it originally was Gluco. 16:02.680 --> 16:04.420 That sounds right to me. 16:04.440 --> 16:05.980 And, he said that he wanted to play it for people. 16:06.480 --> 16:11.820 And, you know, maybe not expand the audience, but at least show people what the whole hacker thing is about. 16:12.760 --> 16:15.720 And, you know, maybe the foul language is a barrier to that. 16:15.720 --> 16:19.740 But, if you want to do it every once in a while and make it sound nice and professional, that's great. 16:19.820 --> 16:22.060 But, if you're going to hold yourself back from what you really want to say, 16:22.140 --> 16:25.960 then it's probably counter to the whole point of doing a radio show, 16:25.960 --> 16:29.340 especially on radio, because they don't really hold back anything on any of their shows. 16:29.600 --> 16:29.960 Amen. 16:31.080 --> 16:34.220 Well, we're going to try to make it through this show without it, if I can help it. 16:34.720 --> 16:39.620 I don't have anything about the RIAA this time, so that'll help, or the MPAA. 16:40.420 --> 16:40.940 Thank God. 16:41.600 --> 16:44.480 Well, we have a lot of other, we have a lot of good topics this show. 16:44.480 --> 16:47.260 I hope, you know, we probably just jump in. 16:47.980 --> 16:53.000 I mentioned this week that I had my 2600 meeting, but also, this past weekend, 16:53.000 --> 16:56.100 I took another trip to my favorite place, one of my favorite places, 16:56.320 --> 16:59.460 at Islands of Adventure and Universal Studios up in Orlando, Florida. 17:00.260 --> 17:03.060 They have something called Halloween Horror Nights. 17:03.240 --> 17:07.480 I don't know how familiar the listeners may be, but it's really a cool concept, 17:07.740 --> 17:11.340 and I'm sure other theme parks around the world do it as well. 17:11.900 --> 17:13.020 At least, I assume they do. 17:13.020 --> 17:19.000 So, they basically shut down the park, and they redecorate the whole thing with a Halloween theme to it. 17:19.620 --> 17:20.740 But it's not simple. 17:20.860 --> 17:25.920 It's not just a corny, you know, hang a couple ghosts like people do for Halloween in their yards. 17:26.120 --> 17:27.280 They go all out. 17:27.360 --> 17:31.060 They send people out in costume to scare the bejesus out of you, 17:31.720 --> 17:36.040 and they have them, like, themed every different area. 17:36.040 --> 17:40.040 Like, for example, last year, they have something called Superhero Island, 17:40.720 --> 17:43.620 and the theme of it was that when the Halloween Horror Nights, 17:43.680 --> 17:46.280 which starts at 7 p.m., by the way, and goes till 2 a.m., 17:46.280 --> 17:47.940 so it's all night when it's dark and everything. 17:49.100 --> 17:51.580 Majority of the lights in the park are turned off, so it's dark. 17:51.960 --> 17:53.460 They have fog machines everywhere. 17:54.240 --> 17:58.620 And, for example, the Superhero Island in the daytime turns into Supervillain Island at night. 17:59.140 --> 18:00.960 So, it's really kind of a cool environment. 18:00.960 --> 18:08.320 You're walking through, and they have these costumed supervillains running around with chainsaws and masks on 18:08.320 --> 18:12.660 and a couple different, you know, actual real supervillains from the comics and stuff that was really cool. 18:13.020 --> 18:16.560 So, you really felt like, you know, they put on a theme and everything to it. 18:17.100 --> 18:18.860 Well, all the lights are off. 18:19.100 --> 18:20.220 Fog machine's going. 18:20.420 --> 18:24.860 It's pretty, not chaotic, I guess, controlled chaos. 18:25.100 --> 18:26.880 They all have their jobs. 18:26.940 --> 18:27.980 They know what they're supposed to do. 18:27.980 --> 18:34.040 But, they're a little bit lax in security, I guess you'd say, because I was able to find my way. 18:35.140 --> 18:36.580 Actually, I should back up. 18:36.820 --> 18:38.800 When we first went in, I shouldn't say they're lax on security. 18:38.920 --> 18:42.560 When we first went in the park, when you scan your ticket in at the front, 18:42.900 --> 18:45.800 they, A, search anything you might be carrying. 18:45.920 --> 18:48.660 You're allowed to take in video camera or something, but they'll check the bag. 18:49.380 --> 18:51.080 But, this time, also, they checked. 18:52.220 --> 18:57.800 You have to empty your pockets from change and take off your watch and anything like that. 18:57.800 --> 19:02.300 And, walk through a metal detector to get into the park this time, which I thought was really strange. 19:02.360 --> 19:03.420 They didn't do that last year. 19:04.480 --> 19:06.720 You know, it's not like a September 11th change. 19:06.800 --> 19:09.380 I don't know, I don't know why they started that this year. 19:09.440 --> 19:13.000 But, anyway, you know, it wasn't that big a deal to me, I guess. 19:13.040 --> 19:14.180 I don't have anything to worry about. 19:14.180 --> 19:17.980 All I had to do was take the stuff out of my pocket and put it back. 19:20.900 --> 19:27.080 Somebody behind me, they actually said that the magnetic strip on their pass set off the metal detector. 19:27.160 --> 19:30.380 I don't know if that's possible or if that was just a line. 19:30.500 --> 19:30.860 But, anyway. 19:31.660 --> 19:34.080 So, they did actually have security going into the park. 19:34.680 --> 19:39.600 So, that was a misstatement earlier. 19:40.100 --> 19:42.980 However, once you're in the park, it's dark everywhere. 19:43.120 --> 19:43.920 There's fog everywhere. 19:44.140 --> 19:45.080 There's so many people. 19:45.680 --> 19:47.340 Their job is to scare you. 19:47.420 --> 19:49.860 They have people hidden in the bushes and all the lights are off. 19:49.860 --> 19:56.780 And, they'll come up and jump up and scare you and come up behind you or blow fog horns or chainsaws, etc. 19:56.780 --> 20:01.620 Well, we were all kind of hanging out to the side deciding which direction we were going. 20:01.740 --> 20:02.760 I went with a group of friends. 20:03.460 --> 20:08.340 And, I turned around and noticed that the gate behind me was kind of cracked open. 20:10.200 --> 20:15.140 So, being the nosy person that I am, I kind of weaseled in there. 20:15.220 --> 20:18.700 Me and, actually, Mr. Vitek and I kind of inched our way back there. 20:18.780 --> 20:20.020 He noticed it and pointed at it. 20:20.040 --> 20:21.700 So, we inched our way back and walked in. 20:22.560 --> 20:24.720 Sure enough, there was not a soul in sight. 20:24.720 --> 20:27.440 Wait, I had to use the restroom anyway. 20:27.800 --> 20:29.240 That's my story and I'm sticking to it. 20:29.860 --> 20:33.300 So, I walked back there on my quest for the restroom. 20:33.980 --> 20:36.100 Great excuse if you're ever in some place like that. 20:36.240 --> 20:37.320 Always looking for a restroom. 20:37.440 --> 20:38.620 Very easy or you're lost. 20:38.860 --> 20:39.740 Two very easy things. 20:40.760 --> 20:45.320 And, actually, to be truthful with you, I did use the restroom. 20:45.480 --> 20:47.260 I found the employee's restroom back there. 20:48.080 --> 20:49.200 But, it was kind of funny. 20:49.200 --> 20:49.800 We went back. 20:49.920 --> 20:54.700 It got you to pretty much the center of the park where you can get to any of the, 20:54.720 --> 20:55.520 internal levels. 20:55.720 --> 20:57.900 It's where all the costume people travel. 20:58.100 --> 21:02.000 It's where the concessions area, the ice machines, stuff like that were. 21:02.160 --> 21:08.440 So, had a little urban exploration of my own to go along with Duel having some urban exploration 21:08.440 --> 21:09.660 down in Texas. 21:10.500 --> 21:13.000 Had a little urban exploration of my own in Florida. 21:13.000 --> 21:17.320 Wow, there's no card swipes or anything on doors once you get down there? 21:17.380 --> 21:17.880 No cameras? 21:18.100 --> 21:19.960 No, it was a good old-fashioned latch. 21:20.260 --> 21:22.320 Big wooden fence and just slides open. 21:22.920 --> 21:24.360 And, it was already cracked open. 21:24.460 --> 21:28.740 So, I didn't actually open or change anything. 21:28.860 --> 21:33.560 I just walked into a gate that was already kind of cracked. 21:33.960 --> 21:34.180 Right. 21:34.180 --> 21:38.300 But, once you get all the way back to these other areas you're talking about, there's 21:38.300 --> 21:39.160 no security there either? 21:39.380 --> 21:44.200 Well, I got back to, I just wanted to really, I was just being nosy. 21:44.240 --> 21:46.500 I just wanted to see what it looked like back there, to be honest with you. 21:46.520 --> 21:48.020 I just wanted to see what was back there. 21:48.620 --> 21:50.920 You know, I had no intentions other than being nosy. 21:51.380 --> 21:52.000 Flat out. 21:52.400 --> 21:54.560 So, I didn't really check much. 21:54.700 --> 21:55.640 I saw the bathroom. 21:55.640 --> 21:59.060 They allowed me in that. 21:59.140 --> 22:00.060 I didn't need a key for that. 22:00.160 --> 22:02.620 There was no special card swipe or anything to get in the restrooms. 22:03.040 --> 22:07.400 Right next to the restrooms was a big walk-in freezer to the back of, I think it was the 22:07.400 --> 22:12.580 back of like a restaurant, one of the restaurant themed things. 22:13.420 --> 22:19.900 And, it had a, what looked like a lockable handle. 22:20.200 --> 22:22.620 If you've ever seen a walk-in freezer, it's a big heavy handle. 22:22.620 --> 22:25.260 It looks like it could have been locked, but I didn't test it to see. 22:26.180 --> 22:34.000 But, also right there was a whole wall of about a hundred of those little square lockers, 22:34.060 --> 22:36.500 which I assume were employee lockers for them to put their stuff in. 22:37.100 --> 22:38.360 Some of them had locks on them. 22:38.440 --> 22:39.060 Some of them didn't. 22:39.360 --> 22:39.640 Wow. 22:39.860 --> 22:41.160 I didn't touch any of them. 22:41.500 --> 22:42.360 I wasn't there for that. 22:42.420 --> 22:43.120 I was just checking it out. 22:43.180 --> 22:47.220 But, yeah, I did peek my head back and go, wow, look at all these lockers just wide open 22:47.220 --> 22:47.580 unlocked. 22:47.660 --> 22:48.420 They're probably unlocked. 22:49.280 --> 22:52.480 So, yeah, and there was also several doors to several different buildings and stuff, 22:52.540 --> 22:53.700 but I didn't do that. 22:53.780 --> 22:55.180 I went in and just kind of looked around. 22:55.180 --> 22:57.620 And, we laughed a little bit and then headed back out. 22:57.720 --> 22:59.580 Laughed at how we got back there so easy. 22:59.700 --> 23:02.380 And, as I was coming back out, busted. 23:03.180 --> 23:03.760 Oh, really? 23:03.800 --> 23:04.120 Yeah. 23:04.240 --> 23:05.980 Some chick was coming the other way. 23:05.980 --> 23:11.360 In costume, in some witch outfit or something. 23:11.440 --> 23:15.280 I don't know if she was on a break or taking a potty break or what was going on. 23:15.360 --> 23:19.000 But, she came by and she just, you know, act natural. 23:19.100 --> 23:22.880 Just act like, again, you're looking for the bathroom or act like you belong. 23:23.540 --> 23:26.360 Just kind of walked by and kind of nodded and smiled at her. 23:26.360 --> 23:27.860 She gave me the funny look. 23:28.680 --> 23:30.840 And, she had a shirt on. 23:30.900 --> 23:31.540 Oh, gosh. 23:33.240 --> 23:35.700 See, can I say the bad word if it was written on the shirt? 23:36.500 --> 23:38.400 She had a shirt with a bad word on it. 23:38.740 --> 23:39.640 A funny shirt. 23:39.680 --> 23:41.140 A funny shirt with a little slogan on it. 23:41.300 --> 23:42.400 And, I said, nice shirt. 23:43.400 --> 23:45.100 And, she just kind of gave me a look. 23:45.500 --> 23:49.140 And, then she sped her walk up a little bit faster. 23:49.600 --> 23:53.020 So, I realized she might be going back after security or going back to call somebody. 23:53.120 --> 23:55.420 So, we just double-timed it out of there. 23:56.200 --> 23:57.380 And, went back in the park. 23:57.440 --> 24:02.400 And, once you get back out there mixed in with all the dry ice and fog machines and darkness, 24:02.520 --> 24:03.500 they'll never find you again. 24:03.500 --> 24:07.720 So, my little urban exploration adventure, if you want to call it that. 24:08.200 --> 24:09.400 I don't know how urban that is. 24:09.780 --> 24:10.600 Oh, that's cool. 24:10.600 --> 24:14.120 I've heard a lot about those amusement parks and all the infrastructure that they have 24:14.120 --> 24:16.540 that you can't see and tunnels all over the place. 24:16.740 --> 24:19.920 And, that's definitely a cool place to do some UE. 24:20.360 --> 24:20.580 Yeah. 24:21.020 --> 24:21.600 That's awesome. 24:21.880 --> 24:22.040 Yeah. 24:22.120 --> 24:26.020 And, we did the good old-fashioned juvenile line hopping. 24:27.820 --> 24:29.260 And, you know, this is kind of stupid. 24:29.440 --> 24:32.880 This is, gosh, this is a non-hacking rant, but I'll make it short. 24:33.680 --> 24:35.020 This is a theme park. 24:35.560 --> 24:38.240 It's a big, loud place. 24:38.240 --> 24:46.260 When you buy a house and live next to a theme park, I don't really think you have a whole lot of right to complain about the noise. 24:47.000 --> 24:47.840 It's stupid. 24:48.560 --> 24:55.820 Even though the park is open until 2 o'clock in the morning for this, they had to close the two big roller coasters down at 11 o'clock at night 24:55.820 --> 24:58.940 because it's too loud and the neighbors complain about the noise. 24:59.780 --> 25:00.460 That's ridiculous. 25:00.460 --> 25:03.620 They passed a noise ordinance, so they had to close them down at 11 o'clock. 25:04.740 --> 25:06.720 Now, why do you buy property next to a theme park? 25:07.240 --> 25:08.320 I have no idea. 25:08.340 --> 25:09.320 And, the theme park has been there. 25:09.360 --> 25:11.540 It's not like it built up around the houses. 25:11.640 --> 25:12.920 The house is built up around it. 25:13.420 --> 25:13.780 Right. 25:14.080 --> 25:16.340 So, that's just, oh, good grief. 25:16.340 --> 25:22.700 But, anyway, right around 11 o'clock, we went and hopped back over into the line a few times 25:22.700 --> 25:26.420 and snuck in behind the security guards back a few times to get a few extra rides in. 25:27.380 --> 25:28.720 That was good stuff. 25:29.340 --> 25:30.620 But, nobody wants to hear about that. 25:30.680 --> 25:32.060 Let's go back to some hacking. 25:32.200 --> 25:37.160 Let's talk about some, I tell you what, you're a perfect person to have on to talk about this 25:37.160 --> 25:41.140 because I have this idea that I've been kicking around for a while. 25:41.580 --> 25:42.020 All right. 25:43.260 --> 25:46.260 You know, they make video accelerator cards. 25:47.040 --> 25:49.240 You know, for the games and stuff like that, 25:49.280 --> 25:51.580 that'll handle a lot of the function calls and stuff like that. 25:52.780 --> 25:56.680 They'll come with DirectX support or back of the old ones they had, 25:56.680 --> 25:58.680 even back to, what was it, MMX, 25:59.620 --> 26:02.280 that they would build those instruction sets onto the chip. 26:02.280 --> 26:08.800 Well, I've always kind of thought about the possibility of making a piece of hardware, 26:08.960 --> 26:11.140 a card that you could slide into your computer, 26:11.740 --> 26:17.700 to handle things like, along the same logic, anyway, as those video cards, 26:17.780 --> 26:19.120 and even sound cards, you know, 26:19.680 --> 26:24.160 something that does encoding and decoding of MP3s, 26:24.160 --> 26:28.640 but the instruction code is written on the chip set, on the card itself. 26:28.640 --> 26:34.580 Or not just MP3s, but even video encoding and decoding, 26:34.720 --> 26:38.380 like MPEG-2 compression or DivX, even, 26:38.460 --> 26:40.600 if they would quit changing it all the time, 26:40.640 --> 26:42.640 if they release a stable version of DivX, 26:42.820 --> 26:46.860 and put that onto a chip set that you could put into your computer 26:46.860 --> 26:50.380 and take the load off of your CPU itself. 26:50.660 --> 26:50.920 Right. 26:51.880 --> 26:53.280 Does that sound feasible? 26:53.440 --> 26:54.500 Has that been done before? 26:55.140 --> 26:56.300 Similar things have been done. 26:56.300 --> 27:01.140 Actually, Creative Labs used to advertise that they had the Sound Blaster MP3. 27:01.820 --> 27:03.320 And for people who don't know, 27:03.380 --> 27:07.280 the Sound Blaster Live has a processor on it called the EMU-10K1, 27:07.400 --> 27:10.640 which is a programmable DSP, which stands for Digital Signal Processor. 27:11.360 --> 27:14.960 And they always bragged that they could download code onto this processor 27:14.960 --> 27:16.840 and feed it MP3 data. 27:16.960 --> 27:21.680 MP3 data, it would decode the MP3s outside of what your processor was doing. 27:21.720 --> 27:23.600 So it would take all the load off, just like you're talking about. 27:23.600 --> 27:25.420 So people have done things like that. 27:25.520 --> 27:28.340 But as far as boards that accelerate video encoding, 27:28.480 --> 27:32.080 the only ones I've seen do maybe MPEG-1 or MPEG-2 video, 27:32.180 --> 27:33.940 but nothing like DivX. 27:34.040 --> 27:36.120 And like you said, because it keeps changing all the time, 27:36.220 --> 27:41.700 you can't really design a chip and then deploy it millions of times over, 27:41.780 --> 27:43.960 because by the time you get it out there, it's going to be changed. 27:44.680 --> 27:49.860 Yeah, unless you work out a way to somehow flash the ROM or flash the... 27:49.860 --> 27:50.820 Well, see, that's the thing. 27:50.820 --> 27:52.340 It's too big. It's way too much. 27:52.780 --> 27:56.600 Well, there are companies that sell boards that are populated with these chips 27:56.600 --> 27:59.520 called FPGAs, which stands for Field Programmable Gate Array. 27:59.640 --> 28:01.960 Basically, you can write a piece of software, 28:02.960 --> 28:06.720 and it translates it into this chip. 28:06.840 --> 28:10.700 And this chip essentially reorganizes its internal logic, kind of, 28:10.780 --> 28:13.480 and it's almost like you're making a hardware accelerator 28:13.480 --> 28:14.820 by programming this software. 28:14.820 --> 28:16.960 So you can do some really fancy stuff. 28:17.120 --> 28:20.540 You write a little bit of code in some weird programming language called Verilog, 28:20.920 --> 28:24.440 and you can create really optimized hardware to do whatever you want. 28:24.600 --> 28:30.400 And they make development kits where you can take whatever algorithm you want and see, 28:30.600 --> 28:32.720 it converts it to Verilog or whatever format it needs, 28:32.780 --> 28:34.040 and you can download it to this code, 28:34.080 --> 28:37.640 and then you can offload all this processing to this board with multiple FPGAs. 28:37.640 --> 28:41.240 And the boards are really expensive, but it does exactly what you're talking about. 28:41.340 --> 28:43.320 So people are thinking along these lines, 28:43.460 --> 28:46.600 but it's not really the consumer-type application just yet. 28:47.320 --> 28:51.980 Well, I think there's demand for it in the consumer market, 28:52.080 --> 28:56.040 so I hope they do figure out a way to reach the masses, 28:56.040 --> 28:58.500 have a price drop, make it available to people. 28:58.500 --> 29:04.420 Well, I know, obviously, you know, we have an interest in it here for Hack TV, of course, 29:04.880 --> 29:07.180 but not only that, I mean, it's a very, 29:07.600 --> 29:11.340 it's an interesting phenomenon going on right now online 29:11.340 --> 29:17.180 where people are becoming, well, I'm not saying they're becoming creative. 29:17.280 --> 29:18.660 They've always been creative, of course, 29:18.660 --> 29:23.960 but there's a big surge in online movies and clips and videos and stuff like that 29:23.960 --> 29:24.920 that people are making 29:24.920 --> 29:29.260 that I think could benefit. 29:29.460 --> 29:33.620 Like, I mean, there's plenty of people that do anime music videos. 29:33.680 --> 29:35.980 That's very popular and has been for a couple years now, 29:36.040 --> 29:38.300 and I think they could benefit from something like that 29:38.300 --> 29:41.060 because right now I know people who get into that 29:41.060 --> 29:43.980 and they end up going out and having to buy 29:43.980 --> 29:45.360 or choosing to buy 29:45.360 --> 29:48.560 dual processing, you know, 29:48.960 --> 29:52.260 specialized AMD, 29:52.260 --> 29:54.300 I forgot what they were called, 29:54.440 --> 29:57.720 MP, it was like an XPM or something like that, 29:57.760 --> 29:58.780 a specialized chips. 29:59.000 --> 29:59.520 Right, right, right. 29:59.640 --> 30:02.680 And, or just buying, you know, super high processors 30:02.680 --> 30:04.620 because it takes so much power 30:04.620 --> 30:06.340 to do what they want. 30:06.460 --> 30:09.260 So, seems like there's a market for it out there. 30:09.600 --> 30:09.840 Yeah. 30:09.920 --> 30:11.460 People making their own music videos. 30:11.460 --> 30:13.440 For a little external coprocessor or something like that, 30:13.480 --> 30:15.420 I think people would do it, 30:15.480 --> 30:16.220 but, I mean, these chips, 30:16.720 --> 30:17.780 these chips even in bulk, 30:17.860 --> 30:18.700 some of them cost, you know, 30:18.700 --> 30:19.600 a hundred bucks a piece 30:19.600 --> 30:21.180 so that the actual end user cost 30:21.180 --> 30:22.700 is going to be pretty high for something like that. 30:23.060 --> 30:23.560 But, you know what, 30:23.680 --> 30:24.460 like everything else, 30:24.620 --> 30:25.940 eventually the price is going to come down 30:25.940 --> 30:27.600 and they're going to do it. 30:28.560 --> 30:30.460 Well, hopefully sooner than not later. 30:34.460 --> 30:36.300 One other thing I wanted to mention, too, 30:36.560 --> 30:39.880 is go to, 30:40.560 --> 30:42.740 we've talked about this before. 30:42.920 --> 30:43.700 I don't know that I've ever, 30:43.860 --> 30:45.140 I know we've talked about it in the forums 30:45.140 --> 30:47.060 and maybe in passing on the radio, 30:47.160 --> 30:49.300 but I'm actually going to give some air time 30:49.300 --> 30:50.000 to this site 30:50.000 --> 30:52.620 because they've got a lot of good stuff 30:52.620 --> 30:53.520 and the site is 30:53.520 --> 30:55.660 networked.net. 30:56.520 --> 31:02.060 N-E-T-T-W-E-R-K-E-D dot net. 31:02.780 --> 31:03.880 And if it sounds familiar, 31:04.020 --> 31:05.140 it's because they're the people 31:05.140 --> 31:07.140 that put out K-Line Zine. 31:07.640 --> 31:09.140 And they just released issue 41 31:09.660 --> 31:12.260 and it's really good. 31:12.600 --> 31:14.240 It's a really good online zine. 31:14.240 --> 31:15.440 Go check it out. 31:16.580 --> 31:18.140 Again, you can listen back to the URL, 31:18.300 --> 31:19.800 but we'll put it up in the show notes also. 31:20.460 --> 31:22.420 But this is a really good zine. 31:22.520 --> 31:24.280 It had a lot of material this episode. 31:24.400 --> 31:25.580 They've gone quarterly now. 31:26.860 --> 31:28.640 They realize that it's kind of tough, 31:28.780 --> 31:29.660 as everybody does. 31:29.720 --> 31:30.580 They start putting out a zine 31:30.580 --> 31:31.860 and they realize how hard it is 31:31.860 --> 31:34.160 to do it on a regular basis. 31:34.240 --> 31:35.440 So they've switched it to quarterly. 31:35.640 --> 31:38.140 And this one was just loaded, 31:38.400 --> 31:40.240 packed with all kinds of good stuff. 31:40.700 --> 31:42.020 So go check that out. 31:42.020 --> 31:44.280 Definitely want to give them a shout-out and a pimp. 31:46.540 --> 31:47.460 Check them out. 31:48.080 --> 31:50.460 Radical Future, I know also, is coming out soon. 31:50.580 --> 31:53.380 I was kind of hoping to hear something to announce that, 31:53.440 --> 31:55.140 but when we do, we'll also announce them. 31:56.740 --> 31:59.500 And really, I think that's about it for me this week. 31:59.540 --> 32:00.120 That was enough. 32:00.200 --> 32:01.880 I've been on the go all week. 32:02.600 --> 32:03.780 This is actually the first day 32:03.780 --> 32:05.400 I've gotten to sit down and relax. 32:06.000 --> 32:07.560 Doing the show again is my release. 32:07.620 --> 32:08.420 It's kind of my relax. 32:08.420 --> 32:09.180 So why don't you, 32:09.580 --> 32:11.600 I know you had brought up an interesting topic 32:11.600 --> 32:12.720 in the forums. 32:13.180 --> 32:13.940 Are you in mute? 32:14.480 --> 32:16.160 Actually, we're emailing this back and forth, 32:16.240 --> 32:16.540 I believe. 32:16.600 --> 32:17.620 I don't think you mentioned it in the forums, 32:17.760 --> 32:20.680 but about the new, that software radio. 32:21.240 --> 32:22.820 Yeah, you mentioned to me 32:22.820 --> 32:26.240 this piece of hardware called Flex Radio. 32:26.420 --> 32:31.560 And the website is just www.flexradio.com. 32:31.560 --> 32:34.560 Let me just double check that. 32:34.640 --> 32:38.360 Yeah, it's actually www.flex-radio.com. 32:38.820 --> 32:40.200 And for people who aren't familiar 32:40.200 --> 32:42.380 with software-defined radio, 32:43.440 --> 32:45.940 you can just do a Google search for GNU radio. 32:46.600 --> 32:48.560 Their project gives you the rundown of it. 32:48.640 --> 32:52.120 But the really, really basic way to explain it is, 32:52.640 --> 32:55.500 let's say you buy a ham radio or something like that, 32:55.560 --> 32:57.140 and it can transmit, you know, 32:57.700 --> 32:58.780 you've got a microphone you plug in, 32:58.780 --> 33:00.120 and it can transmit FM or AM. 33:01.020 --> 33:02.720 And the FM and AM transmission 33:02.720 --> 33:04.820 is controlled by these analog pieces of hardware. 33:06.220 --> 33:08.360 So if you want to add an extra, you know, 33:08.380 --> 33:10.280 type of modulation or extra fancy features, 33:10.400 --> 33:12.420 you either need more hardware or a new radio. 33:12.900 --> 33:15.160 Well, what this piece of hardware does 33:15.160 --> 33:18.020 is it hooks your radio, you know, 33:18.040 --> 33:19.860 it hooks a radio receiver transmitter 33:19.860 --> 33:21.580 up to your sound card, 33:21.680 --> 33:22.900 and then your computer from there 33:22.900 --> 33:23.780 can do all the modulation. 33:24.020 --> 33:26.300 So if you want to transmit an FM signal, 33:26.300 --> 33:27.480 you get a piece of software 33:27.480 --> 33:28.740 that creates an FM signal, 33:28.900 --> 33:29.980 sends it out through this box. 33:30.320 --> 33:31.940 You want to do AM, same thing. 33:32.180 --> 33:36.080 So now this box will do up to, you know, 33:36.140 --> 33:37.720 between 0 and 65 megahertz. 33:38.220 --> 33:40.120 You know, you can transmit and receive 33:40.120 --> 33:40.900 anything you want. 33:41.040 --> 33:42.520 You know, you want to decode 33:42.520 --> 33:44.660 some cordless phone information 33:44.660 --> 33:45.540 or something like that, 33:45.580 --> 33:46.500 or descramble something. 33:46.960 --> 33:47.700 You know, you can just write 33:47.700 --> 33:48.720 a piece of software to do it. 33:48.720 --> 33:52.420 So I think with a tool like this, 33:52.520 --> 33:54.340 a lot more hackers are going to get 33:54.340 --> 33:58.160 into the whole aspect of hacking radio. 33:58.160 --> 33:59.220 Because until now, 33:59.300 --> 33:59.960 it had been a really, 34:00.580 --> 34:01.360 you know, you really had to be 34:01.360 --> 34:03.640 into electronics to be able 34:03.640 --> 34:04.540 to make a dent in it. 34:04.700 --> 34:06.320 But this is really going to lower 34:06.320 --> 34:07.340 the barrier, because you don't need 34:07.340 --> 34:08.300 to know electronics anymore. 34:08.300 --> 34:09.640 All you have to do is be able 34:09.640 --> 34:10.780 to program a little bit of software, 34:10.920 --> 34:11.760 and you can do some really, 34:11.900 --> 34:12.640 really cool stuff. 34:13.560 --> 34:14.300 So, uh... 34:14.300 --> 34:15.380 Of course, it would help 34:15.380 --> 34:16.400 to know some electronics, 34:16.500 --> 34:16.880 I'm sure. 34:17.120 --> 34:17.880 Oh, yeah, of course. 34:17.960 --> 34:19.960 If you wanted to make some modifications 34:19.960 --> 34:20.780 or something like that, 34:20.800 --> 34:21.760 or add on amplifiers, 34:21.900 --> 34:22.980 maybe design your own antenna 34:22.980 --> 34:23.820 or something like that. 34:24.180 --> 34:26.160 This box itself only puts out 34:26.160 --> 34:29.200 two watts of RF energy. 34:29.700 --> 34:30.980 So you'd probably want to put it 34:30.980 --> 34:32.560 into some type of amplifier, 34:32.680 --> 34:33.900 which you could build yourself or buy. 34:34.820 --> 34:36.320 And then you'd want to, you know, 34:36.340 --> 34:37.640 put it into an antenna, obviously. 34:37.800 --> 34:38.660 Otherwise, you're going to blow out 34:38.660 --> 34:39.300 the whole system. 34:40.640 --> 34:41.880 But, yeah, you could, you know, 34:41.900 --> 34:42.780 design your own antenna. 34:43.320 --> 34:45.340 And you could really get into that 34:45.340 --> 34:46.380 in both the electronics 34:46.380 --> 34:47.520 and the software aspect. 34:47.660 --> 34:48.760 But if you just want to do software, 34:49.000 --> 34:49.600 if you're like me, 34:49.720 --> 34:51.480 I personally, I can't deal 34:51.480 --> 34:52.140 with electronics. 34:52.380 --> 34:53.520 Something always goes wrong. 34:53.680 --> 34:55.120 Something's always, you know, 34:55.140 --> 34:56.600 something's always just not quite right. 34:57.200 --> 34:58.240 I like to deal with software. 34:58.240 --> 34:59.440 So I could buy this box. 34:59.540 --> 35:00.660 I could buy a little amplifier 35:00.660 --> 35:01.400 and antenna. 35:01.580 --> 35:02.480 And I could just, you know, 35:02.500 --> 35:03.120 I could go to town. 35:03.220 --> 35:04.320 I could just start writing software 35:04.320 --> 35:06.240 to transmit any type of data 35:06.240 --> 35:07.840 that I want on any of these frequencies. 35:08.160 --> 35:10.240 Now, there's FCC limitations. 35:10.540 --> 35:11.640 You're not supposed to transmit 35:11.640 --> 35:12.940 on certain bands. 35:13.000 --> 35:14.240 You have to be licensed for... 35:14.240 --> 35:15.980 I was actually just getting ready 35:15.980 --> 35:16.800 to ask that. 35:17.020 --> 35:17.200 Right. 35:17.220 --> 35:19.260 You know, all the electronic engineers 35:19.260 --> 35:20.340 out there are probably saying 35:20.340 --> 35:21.440 the same thing about us. 35:21.860 --> 35:23.480 No, the hardware always works fine. 35:23.560 --> 35:24.820 It's the software that never works. 35:25.180 --> 35:25.380 Right. 35:25.380 --> 35:26.520 Well, here's the thing, you know, 35:26.520 --> 35:28.020 and if I'm designing, 35:28.220 --> 35:28.940 and not really designing, 35:29.040 --> 35:30.080 but let's say I'm just putting together 35:30.080 --> 35:30.960 a simple piece of hardware 35:30.960 --> 35:31.900 and I make a mistake, 35:32.280 --> 35:34.020 I can't hit Control-Z and fix it. 35:34.340 --> 35:34.640 True. 35:34.820 --> 35:36.260 So that's, you know, 35:36.280 --> 35:37.700 as a career programmer, 35:37.800 --> 35:38.860 that's what I've gotten used to. 35:38.940 --> 35:39.980 Like, if something goes wrong, 35:40.320 --> 35:41.760 you know, I can go into the source tree 35:41.760 --> 35:42.700 and I can just, you know, 35:42.720 --> 35:44.760 I can back up to where I was previously. 35:44.900 --> 35:45.680 Whereas if something goes wrong 35:45.680 --> 35:46.120 with hardware, 35:46.780 --> 35:48.000 it's not quite the same. 35:48.060 --> 35:49.120 Maybe if you're doing a simulation 35:49.120 --> 35:49.960 or something like that, 35:50.180 --> 35:50.980 you can back it up. 35:50.980 --> 35:52.700 But once you start actually building it, 35:53.380 --> 35:53.580 you know, 35:53.640 --> 35:55.100 you're stuck if you make a mistake 35:55.100 --> 35:56.100 and you can, you know, 35:56.140 --> 35:57.200 you break a component 35:57.200 --> 35:57.960 or something like that 35:57.960 --> 35:59.620 and it's a physical, you know, 35:59.660 --> 36:00.980 it's something you have to go back 36:00.980 --> 36:02.340 and buy if you destroy it. 36:02.500 --> 36:03.360 Whereas my computer, 36:03.480 --> 36:04.120 something messes up, 36:04.320 --> 36:04.480 you know, 36:04.500 --> 36:05.220 I just reboot it 36:05.220 --> 36:06.380 and hopefully it comes back up 36:06.380 --> 36:06.780 and I'm done. 36:06.780 --> 36:08.980 Well, and that's actually 36:08.980 --> 36:09.860 the second thing 36:09.860 --> 36:10.780 I was going to bring up too 36:10.780 --> 36:12.200 is I would imagine 36:12.200 --> 36:14.680 that the hardware required 36:14.680 --> 36:15.800 to transmit 36:15.800 --> 36:17.800 is probably very pricey. 36:19.000 --> 36:20.280 Which would be another reason 36:20.280 --> 36:22.320 why the most hackers, 36:22.460 --> 36:22.880 like you said, 36:23.080 --> 36:23.860 probably couldn't have, 36:23.940 --> 36:24.800 wouldn't have been into it 36:24.800 --> 36:25.600 because it would cost 36:25.600 --> 36:26.360 a lot of money. 36:27.100 --> 36:27.900 Basically, you're buying 36:27.900 --> 36:28.840 the same equipment 36:28.840 --> 36:30.160 that a radio station would buy 36:30.160 --> 36:31.320 to do that kind of stuff 36:31.320 --> 36:32.520 or at least on a smaller scale. 36:32.740 --> 36:34.480 Yeah, definitely on a smaller scale. 36:34.600 --> 36:35.620 Actually, the funny thing is 36:35.620 --> 36:36.400 I heard about 36:36.400 --> 36:38.740 GNU Radio at H2K2, 36:38.820 --> 36:39.580 the guy who runs 36:39.580 --> 36:40.460 the whole show 36:40.460 --> 36:42.580 for GNU Software Radio Project. 36:42.700 --> 36:43.620 His name is Eric Blossom. 36:44.320 --> 36:45.060 And I talked to him 36:45.060 --> 36:45.860 about it a little bit 36:45.860 --> 36:46.760 and he said, 36:46.820 --> 36:47.500 yeah, if you want to get 36:47.500 --> 36:49.820 into this type of software 36:49.820 --> 36:50.480 to find radio, 36:50.600 --> 36:51.480 you should get this card. 36:51.860 --> 36:55.360 It's called the PCI-4020-12 36:55.360 --> 36:56.320 and it's basically 36:56.320 --> 36:58.180 this really super high quality 36:58.180 --> 36:59.560 analog digital converter 36:59.560 --> 37:01.640 and it does everything. 37:01.800 --> 37:02.280 It's amazing. 37:02.760 --> 37:04.880 And that's all great and dandy. 37:05.020 --> 37:05.800 It's very programmable 37:05.800 --> 37:06.320 and all that. 37:06.400 --> 37:07.360 But the problem is 37:07.360 --> 37:08.300 that it's $1,500. 37:09.920 --> 37:11.360 The problem on top of that 37:11.360 --> 37:12.460 is that you need 37:12.460 --> 37:13.620 even more support hardware 37:13.620 --> 37:14.400 to get it up and running. 37:14.580 --> 37:15.860 So unless you have $2,000 37:15.860 --> 37:17.020 to throw out the window 37:17.020 --> 37:18.500 on a whim, 37:18.780 --> 37:19.640 it's not the type of thing 37:19.640 --> 37:20.160 you're going to do. 37:20.660 --> 37:21.600 But is that still 37:21.600 --> 37:22.440 a piece of hardware 37:22.440 --> 37:24.340 that's part of the software radio? 37:25.000 --> 37:25.280 Yeah. 37:25.420 --> 37:25.820 How much? 37:26.100 --> 37:27.060 What I was saying 37:27.060 --> 37:27.860 was the cost 37:27.860 --> 37:29.840 of all analog hardware 37:29.840 --> 37:32.920 in the old-fashioned way. 37:33.420 --> 37:34.440 Analog hardware itself 37:34.440 --> 37:35.180 is not cheap either. 37:35.180 --> 37:36.240 That's what I was getting at. 37:36.300 --> 37:36.880 That's probably 37:36.880 --> 37:37.760 majorly expensive. 37:38.200 --> 37:38.880 So, yeah, 37:38.960 --> 37:39.780 what you're saying, 37:39.980 --> 37:41.300 that's not that $2,000 37:41.300 --> 37:41.760 is cheap. 37:41.840 --> 37:42.940 That's still pretty expensive, 37:42.940 --> 37:43.700 but I still think 37:43.700 --> 37:44.560 that's a drop in the bucket 37:44.560 --> 37:45.360 compared to the 37:45.360 --> 37:47.320 old analog equipment prices. 37:47.640 --> 37:48.420 Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. 37:48.420 --> 37:49.220 I mean, if you just want 37:49.220 --> 37:49.780 a simple radio, 37:49.880 --> 37:50.280 like I said, 37:50.340 --> 37:51.480 a ham radio that does FM, 37:51.580 --> 37:51.840 AM, 37:52.260 --> 37:53.160 maybe even some of these 37:53.160 --> 37:54.220 other modulation schemes 37:54.220 --> 37:55.100 like single sideband, 37:55.200 --> 37:55.700 something like that, 37:55.700 --> 37:56.440 you can get something 37:56.440 --> 37:57.840 for a couple hundred bucks, 37:57.900 --> 37:58.500 maybe $1,000. 37:59.620 --> 38:00.660 But if you get 38:00.660 --> 38:02.800 this flex radio thing 38:02.800 --> 38:04.040 that Mute told me about, 38:05.060 --> 38:06.820 it's going to cost you $500. 38:06.820 --> 38:08.580 But, you know, 38:08.620 --> 38:11.220 $500 in comparison 38:11.220 --> 38:12.100 to spending $600 38:12.100 --> 38:12.840 on a radio 38:12.840 --> 38:13.840 that you can't upgrade 38:13.840 --> 38:14.460 in software, 38:15.000 --> 38:15.860 it's not so bad. 38:16.060 --> 38:16.200 You know, 38:16.240 --> 38:17.220 once you have this box, 38:17.320 --> 38:18.180 any type of modulation 38:18.180 --> 38:19.140 that somebody comes up with, 38:19.420 --> 38:20.240 you just implement it 38:20.240 --> 38:20.660 in software, 38:20.800 --> 38:21.100 and bam, 38:21.200 --> 38:21.500 you have, 38:21.660 --> 38:21.860 you know, 38:21.880 --> 38:22.940 your hardware's like brand new. 38:23.360 --> 38:23.920 Very cool. 38:23.980 --> 38:24.780 I wouldn't say, 38:24.880 --> 38:25.120 you know, 38:25.140 --> 38:26.300 I wouldn't say it's, 38:26.300 --> 38:26.520 you know, 38:26.600 --> 38:27.740 obsolescence proof, 38:28.000 --> 38:29.400 but definitely, 38:29.580 --> 38:31.020 it raises the bar significantly. 38:32.740 --> 38:33.480 Yeah, well, 38:34.160 --> 38:34.520 you know, 38:34.860 --> 38:36.420 it seems long overdue. 38:36.520 --> 38:36.700 I mean, 38:36.700 --> 38:37.480 it doesn't seem like 38:37.480 --> 38:38.560 it's that much of a 38:38.560 --> 38:40.480 new breakthrough. 38:40.660 --> 38:41.820 I'm actually kind of surprised 38:41.820 --> 38:42.720 they didn't come up with it, 38:42.920 --> 38:43.180 you know, 38:43.220 --> 38:43.580 five, 38:43.680 --> 38:44.320 ten years ago. 38:44.600 --> 38:44.760 Yeah, 38:44.780 --> 38:46.740 I think people had the idea for it, 38:46.840 --> 38:48.740 but it wasn't until recently 38:48.740 --> 38:49.880 that there was enough 38:49.880 --> 38:51.060 free software for people 38:51.060 --> 38:52.080 to, you know, 38:52.120 --> 38:53.000 get together and do it. 38:53.000 --> 38:54.700 And the other problem was, 38:54.780 --> 38:55.060 you know, 38:55.120 --> 38:56.200 maybe ten or fifteen years ago, 38:56.260 --> 38:57.120 the processing power 38:57.120 --> 38:58.420 to do it was just not there. 38:58.540 --> 38:58.600 Like, 38:58.660 --> 38:59.080 some of these, 38:59.160 --> 39:00.200 some of these audio 39:00.200 --> 39:01.300 processing algorithms, 39:01.600 --> 39:02.600 they're not really 39:02.600 --> 39:04.280 that expensive, 39:04.420 --> 39:05.840 but to do them in real time, 39:06.100 --> 39:06.440 you know, 39:06.920 --> 39:08.040 and not real time 39:08.040 --> 39:08.840 for like two seconds 39:08.840 --> 39:09.360 and then, 39:10.400 --> 39:10.640 you know, 39:10.660 --> 39:11.440 have two or three seconds 39:11.440 --> 39:11.960 to recover 39:11.960 --> 39:12.480 so you could, 39:12.900 --> 39:13.240 you know, 39:13.540 --> 39:14.280 kind of buffer it 39:14.280 --> 39:14.840 back and forth, 39:14.960 --> 39:15.300 but I mean, 39:15.340 --> 39:16.760 to do full-on real time 39:16.760 --> 39:17.860 a hundred percent of the time 39:17.860 --> 39:19.280 takes a decent amount 39:19.280 --> 39:19.960 of processing power, 39:20.060 --> 39:20.920 but now computers, 39:21.140 --> 39:21.340 you know, 39:21.420 --> 39:21.780 if you, 39:21.780 --> 39:23.700 if you get a one gigahertz 39:23.700 --> 39:24.100 machine, 39:24.320 --> 39:25.200 there's a lot of processing 39:25.200 --> 39:26.000 you can do with that. 39:26.240 --> 39:26.880 Very true, 39:26.960 --> 39:27.400 very true. 39:27.460 --> 39:28.680 When people got this first idea 39:28.680 --> 39:29.820 and they had 25 megahertz 39:29.820 --> 39:30.540 386s, 39:30.600 --> 39:31.240 they weren't really, 39:31.340 --> 39:32.500 they weren't really thinking, 39:32.640 --> 39:32.960 oh yeah, 39:33.060 --> 39:33.220 you know, 39:33.280 --> 39:35.520 I can do FM audio processing 39:35.520 --> 39:36.180 in real time. 39:36.480 --> 39:37.900 It's just not possible then, 39:37.960 --> 39:38.620 but now it's, 39:38.620 --> 39:39.340 it's just a joke. 39:39.480 --> 39:40.640 That's why I think 39:40.640 --> 39:41.460 in the next year or two 39:41.460 --> 39:42.400 this stuff is going to come down 39:42.400 --> 39:43.260 in price a lot 39:43.260 --> 39:43.780 and you're going to see 39:43.780 --> 39:45.260 the whole aspect of, 39:45.260 --> 39:46.200 of software radio 39:46.200 --> 39:46.840 just explode. 39:46.840 --> 39:47.600 Now, 39:47.700 --> 39:48.460 is this something 39:48.460 --> 39:49.220 that is, 39:49.880 --> 39:51.260 it's probably not targeted 39:51.260 --> 39:52.000 per se at all, 39:52.080 --> 39:52.760 but is this something 39:52.760 --> 39:54.260 that obviously 39:54.260 --> 39:55.660 people like us 39:55.660 --> 39:56.500 are interested in it, 39:57.040 --> 39:57.940 but do you think 39:57.940 --> 39:59.340 radio stations 39:59.340 --> 40:00.520 that are currently using 40:00.520 --> 40:01.260 big, 40:01.560 --> 40:01.860 bulky, 40:02.220 --> 40:03.400 and expensive 40:03.400 --> 40:04.320 analog equipment 40:04.320 --> 40:05.980 will be using this 40:05.980 --> 40:07.040 or will they stay 40:07.040 --> 40:07.940 with what they've always 40:07.940 --> 40:08.780 had and been using? 40:08.780 --> 40:11.460 I think honestly 40:11.460 --> 40:13.940 that the radio stations 40:13.940 --> 40:14.600 are going to stick 40:14.600 --> 40:15.720 with specialized hardware 40:15.720 --> 40:17.020 for the simple fact 40:17.020 --> 40:18.020 that most of these 40:18.020 --> 40:18.640 companies that do 40:18.640 --> 40:19.620 any type of broadcasting, 40:20.540 --> 40:21.140 they want to keep 40:21.140 --> 40:21.920 their setup as simple 40:21.920 --> 40:22.420 as possible. 40:22.900 --> 40:23.720 They don't want to have, 40:23.860 --> 40:24.080 you know, 40:24.120 --> 40:25.000 it's nice to have a box 40:25.000 --> 40:25.780 that does all these 40:25.780 --> 40:26.460 things in one, 40:26.900 --> 40:27.660 but they don't want to have 40:27.660 --> 40:28.580 a single point of failure 40:28.580 --> 40:29.940 and if something 40:29.940 --> 40:30.800 actually does break, 40:30.900 --> 40:31.760 they want a simple fix. 40:31.860 --> 40:32.340 They don't want to say, 40:32.440 --> 40:32.580 oh, 40:32.640 --> 40:33.840 maybe I should reboot it, 40:33.900 --> 40:34.760 maybe I should upgrade this, 40:34.840 --> 40:35.680 maybe I should upgrade that. 40:36.100 --> 40:37.260 They like rack mount hardware 40:37.260 --> 40:38.140 that you slide in, 40:38.140 --> 40:38.800 and you plug it in 40:38.800 --> 40:39.800 and it just works forever. 40:40.580 --> 40:42.420 So I think it'll probably 40:42.420 --> 40:43.240 be a long time 40:43.240 --> 40:44.360 until it gets adopted 40:44.360 --> 40:46.320 by the broadcast industry, 40:46.500 --> 40:47.920 but like anything else, 40:48.040 --> 40:48.560 people will say 40:48.560 --> 40:49.680 it's never going to happen. 40:50.360 --> 40:51.380 Eventually it's going to happen. 40:51.480 --> 40:52.000 They're going to have 40:52.000 --> 40:52.600 stuff like this 40:52.600 --> 40:53.620 because I think people 40:53.620 --> 40:54.720 are going to stop making 40:54.720 --> 40:56.380 just basic analog radios. 40:56.560 --> 40:57.380 I think, you know, 40:58.140 --> 40:59.580 maybe in 30 years from now, 40:59.780 --> 41:01.100 the only radio you can get 41:01.100 --> 41:01.940 will be a software radio 41:01.940 --> 41:02.960 because there'd be no point 41:02.960 --> 41:04.220 in them designing 41:04.220 --> 41:05.920 these analog circuits 41:05.920 --> 41:06.860 in the way they do anymore. 41:08.140 --> 41:09.280 Well, you know, 41:09.340 --> 41:10.340 there's something 41:10.340 --> 41:11.900 very valid to be said 41:11.900 --> 41:13.580 about the old adage, 41:13.680 --> 41:14.280 if it ain't broke, 41:14.360 --> 41:14.960 don't fix it. 41:15.760 --> 41:16.040 You know, 41:16.120 --> 41:16.900 and I guess if I owned 41:16.900 --> 41:17.680 a radio station, 41:17.940 --> 41:18.120 yeah, 41:18.180 --> 41:18.660 I probably, 41:19.620 --> 41:21.640 I might use it 41:21.640 --> 41:23.360 for certain things 41:23.360 --> 41:24.220 or for some things 41:24.220 --> 41:25.460 but probably not rely 41:25.460 --> 41:26.100 on it completely, 41:26.220 --> 41:26.500 you know. 41:26.500 --> 41:28.840 they really have to see, 41:28.920 --> 41:29.240 you know, 41:29.320 --> 41:30.680 a reason to upgrade. 41:30.820 --> 41:31.520 Somebody's got to say, 41:31.920 --> 41:32.120 you know, 41:32.160 --> 41:33.520 maybe it'll save you money 41:33.520 --> 41:34.240 or it'll let you 41:34.240 --> 41:35.400 deliver more services 41:35.400 --> 41:36.140 to your customers 41:36.140 --> 41:37.200 or increase, 41:37.360 --> 41:37.500 like, 41:37.520 --> 41:38.240 your customer base 41:38.240 --> 41:39.080 or something like that. 41:39.180 --> 41:39.440 Right. 41:39.480 --> 41:40.140 Until you prove that 41:40.140 --> 41:40.500 to somebody, 41:40.580 --> 41:40.960 like you said, 41:40.960 --> 41:41.680 it's not broke, 41:41.740 --> 41:42.220 don't fix it, 41:42.860 --> 41:43.460 they're not going to 41:43.460 --> 41:44.140 want to make the change. 41:44.240 --> 41:44.700 They're not going to want 41:44.700 --> 41:45.320 to invest money 41:45.320 --> 41:46.360 for no return. 41:46.620 --> 41:46.740 You know, 41:46.820 --> 41:47.920 it all comes down 41:47.920 --> 41:48.580 to dollars and cents 41:48.580 --> 41:50.020 for the broadcast industry. 41:50.440 --> 41:50.640 Right. 41:51.540 --> 41:51.980 Also, 41:52.120 --> 41:53.420 you mentioned briefly earlier, 41:53.500 --> 41:54.880 let's go back to the FCC 41:54.880 --> 41:57.020 and their role in this 41:57.020 --> 41:58.320 because technically 41:58.320 --> 41:59.220 what you are doing 41:59.220 --> 41:59.680 is sure, 41:59.860 --> 42:00.740 you're doing it 42:00.740 --> 42:01.400 via software 42:01.400 --> 42:02.720 but you are still 42:02.720 --> 42:03.860 broadcasting a signal. 42:04.660 --> 42:04.920 Right. 42:05.300 --> 42:05.680 So, 42:06.400 --> 42:07.560 what are the limitations 42:07.560 --> 42:08.900 or what are the, 42:11.080 --> 42:11.940 and I don't expect you 42:11.940 --> 42:12.320 to know these 42:12.320 --> 42:13.060 off the top of your head 42:13.060 --> 42:14.360 but just to throw it out 42:14.360 --> 42:15.000 and think it over, 42:15.440 --> 42:16.520 you are still broadcasting 42:16.520 --> 42:17.280 a radio station 42:17.280 --> 42:19.040 which there are FCC rules 42:19.040 --> 42:20.220 and limitations against. 42:20.640 --> 42:20.960 Right, 42:21.040 --> 42:21.240 right, 42:21.280 --> 42:21.580 of course. 42:22.520 --> 42:22.940 Like I said, 42:23.000 --> 42:23.820 this box only does 42:23.820 --> 42:25.100 65 megahertz and below 42:25.100 --> 42:25.880 so there are a couple 42:25.880 --> 42:26.880 of bands 42:26.880 --> 42:27.420 where you're allowed 42:27.420 --> 42:28.880 to do some 42:28.880 --> 42:30.020 unlicensed operation 42:30.020 --> 42:31.320 like the 49 megahertz 42:31.320 --> 42:32.520 cordless phone band 42:32.520 --> 42:34.620 and the 27 megahertz 42:34.620 --> 42:35.220 CB band. 42:35.380 --> 42:36.420 You can do, 42:36.840 --> 42:37.720 I wouldn't say 42:37.720 --> 42:38.440 whatever you want 42:38.440 --> 42:38.760 in there 42:38.760 --> 42:40.140 but for the most part 42:40.140 --> 42:40.740 people don't really 42:40.740 --> 42:41.420 make use of those 42:41.420 --> 42:42.200 frequencies for anything 42:42.200 --> 42:42.660 important 42:42.660 --> 42:43.420 so if you want 42:43.420 --> 42:44.200 to play around there 42:44.200 --> 42:45.040 you're not really 42:45.040 --> 42:45.600 going to get busted 42:45.600 --> 42:46.460 but there are definitely 42:46.460 --> 42:47.640 a lot of frequencies 42:47.640 --> 42:49.040 underneath 65 megahertz 42:49.040 --> 42:49.520 that they're not 42:49.520 --> 42:50.200 going to want you touching. 42:50.200 --> 42:50.740 There's a lot of 42:50.740 --> 42:51.320 ham bands 42:51.320 --> 42:53.100 and stuff like that 42:53.100 --> 42:53.700 so if you really 42:53.700 --> 42:54.500 want to get into it 42:54.500 --> 42:55.400 you're going to end up 42:55.400 --> 42:56.380 if you want to do it 42:56.380 --> 42:57.240 legitimately of course 42:57.240 --> 42:57.940 you're going to end up 42:57.940 --> 42:59.300 having to get a ham license 42:59.300 --> 43:00.600 and learning all these 43:00.600 --> 43:01.000 regulations. 43:01.320 --> 43:01.740 I mean if you just 43:01.740 --> 43:02.360 want to mess around 43:02.360 --> 43:03.020 and you don't care 43:03.020 --> 43:04.400 you know that's one thing 43:04.400 --> 43:05.420 but there are regulations 43:05.420 --> 43:06.580 and there's a lot 43:06.580 --> 43:07.260 to look into 43:07.260 --> 43:08.860 because some places 43:08.860 --> 43:09.620 you know the fire 43:09.620 --> 43:10.600 departments still use 43:10.600 --> 43:11.980 frequencies that this 43:11.980 --> 43:12.880 box will transmit on 43:12.880 --> 43:13.800 and that's not the type 43:13.800 --> 43:14.280 of thing you want to 43:14.280 --> 43:14.960 start around with. 43:14.960 --> 43:15.580 That's definitely 43:15.580 --> 43:16.180 not cool 43:16.180 --> 43:18.060 but shouldn't the 43:18.060 --> 43:19.680 hardware manufacturer 43:19.680 --> 43:21.760 also have to limit 43:21.760 --> 43:22.400 that somewhere 43:22.400 --> 43:23.260 that this is an 43:23.260 --> 43:24.180 external box 43:24.180 --> 43:25.260 that yeah it's 43:25.260 --> 43:26.040 software driven 43:26.040 --> 43:27.080 but it is an 43:27.080 --> 43:28.000 external box 43:28.000 --> 43:29.060 shouldn't that 43:29.060 --> 43:30.120 or is there a way 43:30.120 --> 43:31.800 for that to not 43:31.800 --> 43:32.620 allow you to go 43:32.620 --> 43:33.240 in those reserve 43:33.240 --> 43:33.600 bands? 43:33.800 --> 43:34.400 Don't they have to 43:34.400 --> 43:35.520 meet FCC regulations 43:35.520 --> 43:36.600 on what they create 43:36.600 --> 43:37.100 and build? 43:37.660 --> 43:38.500 Not necessarily 43:38.500 --> 43:39.200 because they can 43:39.200 --> 43:39.980 always say that 43:39.980 --> 43:41.280 there's legitimate 43:41.280 --> 43:42.140 use like let's say 43:42.140 --> 43:43.520 a fire department 43:43.520 --> 43:44.380 in the middle of 43:44.380 --> 43:45.120 nowhere some rural 43:45.120 --> 43:46.420 town decides they 43:46.420 --> 43:47.200 want to use this 43:47.200 --> 43:48.840 you know for their 43:48.840 --> 43:49.920 base station they 43:49.920 --> 43:50.600 have every right to 43:50.600 --> 43:51.520 do that so basically 43:51.520 --> 43:52.440 when you buy a box 43:52.440 --> 43:53.040 like this they'll 43:53.040 --> 43:54.040 tell you you know 43:54.040 --> 43:55.040 you have to follow 43:55.040 --> 43:55.580 all the rules and 43:55.580 --> 43:56.320 regulations for your 43:56.320 --> 43:58.300 area but since the 43:58.300 --> 43:59.000 ban plans aren't 43:59.000 --> 43:59.860 really you know 43:59.860 --> 44:00.640 perfectly defined 44:00.640 --> 44:01.740 some places may use 44:01.740 --> 44:02.380 certain frequencies 44:02.380 --> 44:03.300 for fire some may 44:03.300 --> 44:03.960 use them for police 44:03.960 --> 44:04.920 some they just may 44:04.920 --> 44:05.760 not be used at all 44:05.760 --> 44:07.440 so they can't 44:07.440 --> 44:08.960 really they can't 44:08.960 --> 44:09.640 really go in there 44:09.640 --> 44:12.380 and block out all 44:12.380 --> 44:12.920 these frequencies 44:12.920 --> 44:13.540 and say you can't 44:13.540 --> 44:14.100 use this because 44:14.100 --> 44:15.520 these people use it 44:15.520 --> 44:17.520 there's not really 44:17.520 --> 44:18.260 an easy way for them 44:18.260 --> 44:19.600 to do that so 44:19.600 --> 44:20.640 basically they tell 44:20.640 --> 44:21.600 you you know use 44:21.600 --> 44:23.660 common sense follow 44:23.660 --> 44:24.460 all the rules if 44:24.460 --> 44:25.080 you're not sure about 44:25.080 --> 44:25.700 whatever frequency 44:25.700 --> 44:26.280 you're transmitting 44:26.280 --> 44:27.460 on you know look 44:27.460 --> 44:28.260 it up you can always 44:28.260 --> 44:29.320 get in contact with 44:29.320 --> 44:30.340 the FCC and find out 44:30.340 --> 44:30.880 who owns what 44:30.880 --> 44:31.700 frequency or you can 44:31.700 --> 44:32.880 buy from Radio Shack 44:32.880 --> 44:33.600 a book called 44:33.600 --> 44:34.900 Police Call that you 44:34.900 --> 44:35.460 can look up your 44:35.460 --> 44:36.160 town in it and 44:36.160 --> 44:36.860 it'll show you 44:36.860 --> 44:38.500 whoever has paid 44:38.500 --> 44:40.180 for band allocations 44:40.180 --> 44:41.340 in your town and 44:41.340 --> 44:41.900 from there you can 44:41.900 --> 44:42.300 look through and 44:42.300 --> 44:43.020 say okay nobody's 44:43.020 --> 44:43.720 using this nobody's 44:43.720 --> 44:46.120 using that and then 44:46.120 --> 44:46.780 play around a little 44:46.780 --> 44:48.140 bit but I would 44:48.140 --> 44:49.760 still recommend only 44:49.760 --> 44:50.500 playing around like 44:50.500 --> 44:51.260 I said maybe in the 44:51.260 --> 44:52.400 CV band and maybe 44:52.400 --> 44:53.360 in the maybe in the 44:53.360 --> 44:54.120 cordless phone band 44:54.120 --> 44:56.400 and at first you 44:56.400 --> 44:56.900 know play around 44:56.900 --> 44:57.820 with receiving signals 44:57.820 --> 44:58.360 and seeing what you 44:58.360 --> 44:59.040 can decode out of 44:59.040 --> 44:59.660 them before you start 44:59.660 --> 45:00.040 moving into 45:00.040 --> 45:00.760 transmitting because 45:00.760 --> 45:01.320 as soon as you get 45:01.320 --> 45:02.020 into transmitting 45:02.020 --> 45:02.880 it's a whole different 45:02.880 --> 45:03.540 ball game you've 45:03.540 --> 45:03.960 got to be really 45:03.960 --> 45:04.540 careful you're not 45:04.540 --> 45:05.180 messing with something 45:05.180 --> 45:05.560 that's really 45:05.560 --> 45:06.000 important 45:06.000 --> 45:08.360 right well and 45:08.360 --> 45:10.280 can do you have any 45:10.280 --> 45:12.860 idea how far out of 45:12.860 --> 45:14.220 the box how far that 45:14.220 --> 45:15.680 will transmit as far 45:15.680 --> 45:17.500 as physical distance a 45:17.500 --> 45:18.320 radius around 45:18.320 --> 45:20.020 are you talking like 45:20.020 --> 45:20.920 within the house 45:20.920 --> 45:21.880 within the block 45:21.880 --> 45:23.100 within a you know 45:23.100 --> 45:25.380 well here's here's the 45:25.380 --> 45:28.020 thing you're it's going 45:28.020 --> 45:28.820 to depend largely on 45:28.820 --> 45:29.440 the antenna that you 45:29.440 --> 45:30.240 get like I said it'll 45:30.240 --> 45:31.060 do two watts that they 45:31.060 --> 45:31.800 claim that those two 45:31.800 --> 45:33.040 watts output on any 45:33.040 --> 45:34.160 frequency below 65 45:34.160 --> 45:36.100 megahertz okay now ham 45:36.100 --> 45:37.020 radio operators have 45:37.020 --> 45:38.060 contests where they 45:38.060 --> 45:39.540 broadcast or I won't 45:39.540 --> 45:40.180 say broadcast they 45:40.180 --> 45:41.820 transmit um in order 45:41.820 --> 45:42.660 to make a two-way 45:42.660 --> 45:44.420 connection with somebody 45:44.420 --> 45:45.200 around the world they 45:45.200 --> 45:46.120 can transmit with less 45:46.120 --> 45:46.920 than one watt and get 45:46.920 --> 45:48.560 around the world um the 45:48.560 --> 45:49.340 conditions aren't always 45:49.340 --> 45:50.360 there to do it but if 45:50.360 --> 45:51.060 you have a really good 45:51.060 --> 45:52.700 antenna and uh and 45:52.700 --> 45:53.280 you're on the right 45:53.280 --> 45:54.160 frequency or something 45:54.160 --> 45:54.980 like that something very 45:54.980 --> 45:56.320 low something like you 45:56.320 --> 45:57.620 know below 27 megahertz 45:57.620 --> 45:59.000 something like that you 45:59.000 --> 45:59.880 can get really far on 45:59.880 --> 46:00.980 two watts so if you 46:00.980 --> 46:02.960 think you're gonna set 46:02.960 --> 46:03.720 up an antenna and 46:03.720 --> 46:04.860 transmit two watts on 46:04.860 --> 46:06.160 on 15 megahertz or 46:06.160 --> 46:07.220 16 megahertz or something 46:07.220 --> 46:07.940 like that and nobody's 46:07.940 --> 46:08.960 going to hear it you 46:08.960 --> 46:09.660 might be surprised 46:09.660 --> 46:10.740 because people around 46:10.740 --> 46:11.440 the world can hear 46:11.440 --> 46:12.260 those those types of 46:12.260 --> 46:13.060 low frequencies on 46:13.060 --> 46:15.060 extremely low power so 46:15.060 --> 46:16.440 two watts two watts 46:16.440 --> 46:17.780 will do a lot wow 46:17.780 --> 46:21.340 well very very interesting 46:21.340 --> 46:23.860 stuff I I learned more 46:23.860 --> 46:24.860 while doing this show 46:24.860 --> 46:26.760 than uh than I ever 46:26.760 --> 46:27.160 thought 46:27.160 --> 46:30.800 oh you know we are 46:30.800 --> 46:32.980 well into the show 46:32.980 --> 46:35.040 and we haven't really 46:35.040 --> 46:36.460 hit on any news topics 46:36.460 --> 46:37.080 I mentioned at the 46:37.080 --> 46:38.920 beginning and this is 46:38.920 --> 46:39.840 not necessarily a news 46:39.840 --> 46:40.780 topic this is just kind 46:40.780 --> 46:41.600 of a subject I wanted 46:41.600 --> 46:43.380 to address um we were 46:43.380 --> 46:43.780 talking about 46:43.780 --> 46:44.800 authentication earlier 46:44.800 --> 46:47.040 um I thought I'd kind 46:47.040 --> 46:47.860 of talk a little bit 46:47.860 --> 46:49.200 about single sign-on 46:49.200 --> 46:50.640 and about what single 46:50.640 --> 46:52.140 sign-on is and how it's 46:52.140 --> 46:53.060 used and what it's used 46:53.060 --> 46:56.460 for um well like for 46:56.460 --> 46:57.580 example the big the 46:57.580 --> 46:58.460 biggest and most 46:58.460 --> 46:59.580 commonly used example 46:59.580 --> 47:00.880 for single sign-on is 47:00.880 --> 47:01.720 from our good friends 47:01.720 --> 47:03.560 at Microsoft and that 47:03.560 --> 47:04.780 would be MS Passport 47:04.780 --> 47:05.880 Passport yay 47:05.880 --> 47:07.540 now anybody that goes 47:07.540 --> 47:09.520 to um anybody that goes 47:09.520 --> 47:12.840 to um Hotmail will 47:12.840 --> 47:14.100 notice the passport log 47:14.100 --> 47:15.000 logo you're actually 47:15.000 --> 47:15.840 logging in and 47:15.840 --> 47:17.480 authenticating not to 47:17.480 --> 47:19.300 Hotmail per se but 47:19.300 --> 47:20.140 you're authenticating 47:20.140 --> 47:20.960 through Microsoft's 47:20.960 --> 47:21.740 Passport I think it's 47:21.740 --> 47:22.940 required through 47:22.940 --> 47:26.440 Hotmail now so what 47:26.440 --> 47:27.880 that means if you're 47:27.880 --> 47:28.900 only using Hotmail 47:28.900 --> 47:29.660 what that means is 47:29.660 --> 47:31.540 really it's you don't 47:31.540 --> 47:32.200 notice a difference 47:32.200 --> 47:32.760 there's really no 47:32.760 --> 47:33.600 change you're logging 47:33.600 --> 47:34.740 into your email account 47:34.740 --> 47:36.400 checking your email and 47:36.400 --> 47:37.140 then you're done you're 47:37.140 --> 47:37.820 logging out of your 47:37.820 --> 47:39.680 email account well it's 47:39.680 --> 47:42.180 not really what it's for 47:42.180 --> 47:44.360 um single sign-on is 47:44.360 --> 47:45.680 exactly as the name 47:45.680 --> 47:48.380 implies it's signing on 47:48.380 --> 47:50.520 one time a single 47:50.520 --> 47:51.600 username and password 47:51.600 --> 47:53.580 to authenticate to 47:53.580 --> 47:56.120 everything that that 47:56.120 --> 47:58.840 sign-on has access to 47:58.840 --> 48:01.340 so as you also know 48:01.340 --> 48:02.880 Microsoft not only does 48:02.880 --> 48:03.980 Hotmail but they do a 48:03.980 --> 48:05.880 lot of other things the 48:05.880 --> 48:07.480 Microsoft Passport can 48:07.480 --> 48:09.820 tie into a lot of 48:09.820 --> 48:11.120 different Microsoft sites 48:11.120 --> 48:13.720 um any of the groups 48:13.720 --> 48:17.960 pages um the uh what do 48:17.960 --> 48:19.700 they call it the user 48:19.700 --> 48:20.940 information where you 48:20.940 --> 48:22.280 look up people's uh user 48:22.280 --> 48:23.580 information and screen 48:23.580 --> 48:24.440 names and stuff like 48:24.440 --> 48:27.240 that uh the my MSN the 48:27.240 --> 48:28.260 customizable like my 48:28.260 --> 48:29.400 yahoo.com they have a 48:29.400 --> 48:30.900 my MSN.com where you can 48:30.900 --> 48:31.960 customize headlines and 48:31.960 --> 48:33.340 stuff you go and you 48:33.340 --> 48:34.340 create this passport 48:34.340 --> 48:37.060 account and fill out as 48:37.060 --> 48:38.280 much information as you 48:38.280 --> 48:41.260 want to or have to or as 48:41.260 --> 48:42.640 much as you feel like and 48:42.640 --> 48:43.560 I'm sure they might add a 48:43.560 --> 48:44.240 little bit of their own to 48:44.240 --> 48:44.940 it but that's a whole 48:44.940 --> 48:47.940 other story and that's 48:47.940 --> 48:49.360 that when you sign on 48:49.360 --> 48:50.300 you're actually logging 48:50.300 --> 48:52.180 into authenticating I 48:52.180 --> 48:53.240 should say onto that 48:53.240 --> 48:55.580 one authentication source 48:55.580 --> 48:56.680 that gives you access to 48:56.680 --> 48:57.680 all of the other things 48:57.680 --> 48:59.760 combined yahoo has one I 48:59.760 --> 49:02.060 think I don't know if 49:02.060 --> 49:02.940 they have a name for it 49:02.940 --> 49:04.220 they used to call the one 49:04.220 --> 49:05.180 of the very early ones was 49:05.180 --> 49:07.500 yahoo wallet which if you 49:07.500 --> 49:08.340 went to any one of the 49:08.340 --> 49:09.360 yahoo sites it 49:09.360 --> 49:10.320 authenticated through 49:10.320 --> 49:12.800 yahoo store sites it would 49:12.800 --> 49:14.020 authenticate through yahoo 49:14.020 --> 49:15.800 wallet instead of you you 49:15.800 --> 49:16.840 could go to one store and 49:16.840 --> 49:18.700 yahoo store that is and 49:18.700 --> 49:19.620 order something and then 49:19.620 --> 49:20.620 go to another one and 49:20.620 --> 49:21.860 still be authenticated and 49:21.860 --> 49:22.780 still have that information 49:22.780 --> 49:25.040 in there instead of having 49:25.040 --> 49:26.160 to retype it in over and 49:26.160 --> 49:28.040 over again so obviously you 49:28.040 --> 49:29.460 can see the usefulness of 49:29.460 --> 49:30.520 it it actually can be very 49:30.520 --> 49:33.200 convenient but at the same 49:33.200 --> 49:35.360 time it can be very 49:35.360 --> 49:37.040 dangerous it's a single 49:37.040 --> 49:38.480 point of failure and that's 49:38.480 --> 49:39.480 that's exactly why I'm 49:39.480 --> 49:41.040 scared of it it's and it's 49:41.040 --> 49:45.060 it's it's one of those 49:45.060 --> 49:46.860 catch-22s where yes 49:46.860 --> 49:49.380 admittedly it has there's 49:49.380 --> 49:50.820 nothing wrong with 49:50.820 --> 49:53.260 convenience to a certain 49:53.260 --> 49:54.580 extent anyway there's 49:54.580 --> 49:55.140 nothing wrong with 49:55.140 --> 49:56.200 convenience especially in 49:56.200 --> 49:58.740 technology we strive to be 49:58.740 --> 50:00.420 more efficient we strive to 50:00.420 --> 50:01.920 use technology to make our 50:01.920 --> 50:04.900 lives easier and I have to 50:04.900 --> 50:07.520 admit that single sign on 50:07.520 --> 50:08.880 one single point of 50:08.880 --> 50:10.260 authentication can do that 50:10.260 --> 50:11.520 it's all about the 50:11.520 --> 50:13.220 delivery now the big 50:13.220 --> 50:15.240 example like I just said 50:15.240 --> 50:17.300 is Microsoft Passport you 50:17.300 --> 50:18.340 can get into your MSN 50:18.340 --> 50:19.480 messenger you authenticate 50:19.480 --> 50:21.580 through it MSDN Hotmail 50:21.580 --> 50:24.140 my MSN yada yada yada all 50:24.140 --> 50:25.960 with one authentication but 50:25.960 --> 50:29.320 do you really trust the big 50:29.320 --> 50:30.540 M do you really trust 50:30.540 --> 50:33.040 Microsoft I mean security is 50:33.040 --> 50:34.280 not their middle name these 50:34.280 --> 50:37.260 days I remember a story about 50:37.260 --> 50:39.360 them claiming you know 50:39.360 --> 50:40.360 somebody broke into their 50:40.360 --> 50:41.400 machine and had their 50:41.400 --> 50:42.360 machines and had access to 50:42.360 --> 50:43.700 the Windows source code but 50:43.700 --> 50:44.640 all of a sudden they said oh 50:44.640 --> 50:45.900 but we knew about it and oh 50:45.900 --> 50:47.660 we were watching them yeah 50:47.660 --> 50:48.980 yeah you know something 50:48.980 --> 50:50.640 that's all great and dandy if 50:50.640 --> 50:51.520 they're if they're looking at 50:51.520 --> 50:52.600 source code but if these guys 50:52.600 --> 50:53.900 have my personal information 50:53.900 --> 50:55.680 they say oh yeah we knew he 50:55.680 --> 50:56.400 accessed your personal 50:56.400 --> 50:58.200 information we were just you 50:58.200 --> 50:59.000 know we were just watching him 50:59.000 --> 51:00.120 to see what he did well after 51:00.120 --> 51:01.480 he got my personal information 51:01.480 --> 51:02.880 what did he do with it you 51:02.880 --> 51:05.340 know yep so and if they're 51:05.340 --> 51:06.320 just going to say well you 51:06.320 --> 51:07.200 know we were looking out for 51:07.200 --> 51:08.500 you that that doesn't cut it 51:08.500 --> 51:09.540 that's the type of stuff that 51:09.540 --> 51:11.340 you need to react right away 51:11.340 --> 51:12.820 and not give any excuses and 51:12.820 --> 51:14.120 say oh you know we were doing 51:14.120 --> 51:16.300 what we could not quite and 51:16.300 --> 51:17.880 with all of the exploits they 51:17.880 --> 51:19.780 have for for Windows coming out 51:19.780 --> 51:22.500 all the time I you know I don't 51:22.500 --> 51:24.080 really have all that much faith in 51:24.080 --> 51:25.500 Microsoft security yeah 51:25.500 --> 51:29.500 absolutely and technically they 51:29.500 --> 51:32.600 they had security issues with 51:32.600 --> 51:35.880 hotmail a while back and I'm 51:35.880 --> 51:36.840 sure they've also had some 51:36.840 --> 51:38.420 security I can't think of any 51:38.420 --> 51:39.960 specifics offhand but I know 51:39.960 --> 51:41.360 they've had some issues with 51:41.360 --> 51:43.020 passport I don't think they've 51:43.020 --> 51:45.540 had any serious ones yet I could 51:45.540 --> 51:46.580 be wrong but I don't think 51:46.580 --> 51:48.160 they've had any serious ones yet I 51:48.160 --> 51:49.380 think that they had early 51:49.380 --> 51:50.920 troubles with hotmail and hotmail 51:50.920 --> 51:52.700 security before passport came 51:52.700 --> 51:56.380 along where people did get in and 51:56.380 --> 51:58.940 they learned from that and 51:58.940 --> 52:00.820 incorporated those changes into 52:00.820 --> 52:02.320 passport when they went that way 52:02.320 --> 52:05.580 I'm I'm not certain I'm hoping 52:05.580 --> 52:08.240 that when you authenticate 52:08.240 --> 52:11.360 first of all there's some 52:11.360 --> 52:14.400 encryption involved second of all 52:14.400 --> 52:16.580 the server with it actually stores 52:16.580 --> 52:19.580 your information is separate from 52:19.580 --> 52:22.780 the net there's a proxy on their 52:22.780 --> 52:24.900 end hopefully that interfaces to 52:24.900 --> 52:28.200 look up the information itself 52:28.200 --> 52:31.900 translates it to some machine code of 52:31.900 --> 52:33.680 some sort or even just some flags or 52:33.680 --> 52:35.820 fields that it sends back in the 52:35.820 --> 52:37.460 form of a session variable or a 52:37.460 --> 52:39.920 cookie temporarily encrypted to give 52:39.920 --> 52:41.840 you that information on a technical 52:41.840 --> 52:44.020 level I think that's the very 52:44.020 --> 52:46.060 fundamental basics of how it works 52:46.060 --> 52:49.780 hopefully but again what kind how 52:49.780 --> 52:52.200 strong of encryption is it the 52:52.880 --> 52:54.820 possibility of spoofing or forging 52:54.820 --> 53:01.100 and is it really is that server or 53:01.100 --> 53:03.160 server farm I'm sure do you know how 53:03.160 --> 53:05.740 many users how many users that 53:05.740 --> 53:08.200 Microsoft passport has I have 53:08.200 --> 53:12.860 absolutely no idea Microsoft passport 53:12.860 --> 53:14.580 meaning hotmail and all of them have 53:14.580 --> 53:19.240 200 million users now I don't think 53:19.240 --> 53:23.220 that's just somebody's p2 500 I'm sure 53:23.220 --> 53:25.100 that's a lot of hardware to keep track 53:25.100 --> 53:27.220 of all that and to do the enormous 53:27.940 --> 53:30.560 amount of reads and writes for every 53:30.560 --> 53:33.540 session open live session going on 53:33.540 --> 53:36.400 that's a lot of people that's a lot of 53:36.400 --> 53:40.180 accounts if that were to be hacked if 53:40.180 --> 53:43.160 somebody were to get into that I mean 53:43.160 --> 53:45.220 that the damage is is just insurmountable 53:46.280 --> 53:51.660 it's just incalculable that's insane I 53:51.660 --> 53:53.100 didn't realize they had anywhere near 53:53.100 --> 53:56.200 200 million accounts on that that that 53:56.200 --> 53:58.000 and that was this is actually I got 53:58.000 --> 53:59.620 that statistic maybe a month or two 53:59.620 --> 54:01.940 ago so of course it's constantly going 54:01.940 --> 54:06.520 up right so I don't know the in that 54:06.520 --> 54:08.340 particular example in Microsoft example 54:08.340 --> 54:10.060 yes there's a lot of cost and for 54:10.060 --> 54:12.100 concern and it's a an issue of 54:12.100 --> 54:14.540 balancing the good versus the bad is it 54:14.540 --> 54:16.400 worth that convenience is it worth having 54:16.400 --> 54:19.080 that centralized versus the danger and in 54:19.080 --> 54:21.200 Microsoft's case it may not be but I'm 54:21.200 --> 54:25.320 I'm going to I guess play play the foil to 54:25.320 --> 54:27.020 my own argument here play the other side 54:27.020 --> 54:28.920 of my own argument there are good things 54:28.920 --> 54:30.600 about single sign-on in the right 54:30.600 --> 54:35.540 environment in enterprise environments in 54:35.540 --> 54:39.060 companies and universities and more 54:39.060 --> 54:43.040 private smaller not small mom-and-pop but 54:43.040 --> 54:45.020 in smaller businesses or normal sized 54:45.020 --> 54:47.980 average businesses where it's an internal 54:47.980 --> 54:49.640 feature something internal to your 54:49.640 --> 54:51.480 network that doesn't go out to the 54:51.480 --> 54:54.400 internet that doesn't go have access to 54:54.400 --> 54:56.160 people coming and probing at it and 54:56.160 --> 54:58.060 playing with it if you're on an internal 54:58.060 --> 55:01.160 network with single sign-on oh it's it's 55:01.160 --> 55:05.820 just such such a wonderful thing does it 55:05.820 --> 55:07.760 still have security concerns absolutely of 55:07.760 --> 55:10.600 course everything and anything does but 55:10.600 --> 55:13.460 for example using something like Microsoft 55:13.460 --> 55:18.640 active directory or any type of directory 55:18.640 --> 55:21.780 service Microsoft's just the most like 55:21.780 --> 55:23.100 everything else they're the most popular 55:23.100 --> 55:24.780 the most well-known for because they're 55:24.780 --> 55:27.700 Microsoft but just having one single 55:27.700 --> 55:30.180 point of authentication where you can log in 55:30.180 --> 55:33.840 imagine you come in and actually some of 55:33.840 --> 55:35.160 you might not have to imagine some of you 55:35.160 --> 55:37.600 may go into work or going to school and a 55:37.600 --> 55:39.480 you have to log on to the computer first of 55:39.480 --> 55:42.980 all and your permissions of what you can 55:42.980 --> 55:45.300 and cannot do and are allowed and are not 55:45.300 --> 55:48.240 allowed to access on that computer are set by 55:48.240 --> 55:52.440 permissions on the local computer also you 55:52.440 --> 55:54.600 have permissions of what you can and cannot 55:54.600 --> 55:58.860 map to or access on the network then you 55:58.860 --> 56:00.900 have to fire up your email client and 56:00.900 --> 56:02.420 you'll have to authenticate on an email 56:02.420 --> 56:04.080 server with your email account and email 56:04.080 --> 56:07.740 password and any client server application 56:07.740 --> 56:09.520 that you may use you're going to have to 56:09.520 --> 56:11.440 log into the client of that and probably 56:11.440 --> 56:13.960 sign on with another you can easily start 56:13.960 --> 56:16.140 adding up to dozens and dozens and 56:16.140 --> 56:18.300 dozens of name and password combinations 56:18.300 --> 56:21.460 and you've got to understand we make a joke 56:21.460 --> 56:22.840 of it sometimes about don't write your 56:22.840 --> 56:24.860 password on a post-it or don't read it on 56:24.860 --> 56:26.480 the side of your screen but at the same 56:26.480 --> 56:28.520 time you can understand why some secretary 56:28.520 --> 56:30.660 that has 14 different usernames and 56:30.660 --> 56:34.220 password you know you can understand why 56:34.220 --> 56:35.880 they do it well single sign-on is a 56:35.880 --> 56:38.380 solution to that in an enterprise in an 56:38.380 --> 56:41.820 enclosed self-contained environment it's 56:41.820 --> 56:44.920 wonderful you can log in to your local 56:44.920 --> 56:50.060 system log into a domain and authenticate 56:50.060 --> 56:52.880 in one single point of presence one single 56:52.880 --> 56:55.460 spot and then when you go to check your 56:55.460 --> 56:58.080 email instead of authenticating on the 56:58.080 --> 56:59.880 email server you're already pre-authenticated 57:00.600 --> 57:02.960 because you've been set up on that directory 57:02.960 --> 57:04.760 service you've been set up on that single 57:04.760 --> 57:08.000 sign-on that says yes you can access his 57:08.000 --> 57:09.680 email and you don't have to ask for the 57:09.680 --> 57:11.900 password because I already trust him he is 57:11.900 --> 57:14.060 already designated as a trusted person to 57:14.060 --> 57:16.040 this email account you can tie it together 57:16.040 --> 57:18.560 oh he wants to map to the end drive he 57:18.560 --> 57:21.260 wants to map an end drive to this folder no 57:21.260 --> 57:23.240 problem he's already pre-approved you can 57:23.240 --> 57:24.440 think of it as being pre-approved he's 57:24.440 --> 57:27.620 already pre-approved to access a b c d e f and g you 57:27.620 --> 57:29.060 don't have to log in all those different 57:29.060 --> 57:32.360 times it's already done for you so in an 57:32.360 --> 57:34.960 environment like that where you don't 57:34.960 --> 57:36.980 you're not necessarily open to the network 57:36.980 --> 57:39.980 it's wonderful it's absolutely wonderful 57:39.980 --> 57:43.040 soon as you add the internet in factor in 57:43.040 --> 57:49.020 it becomes that much more open that much 57:49.020 --> 57:53.840 more dangerous and possible to to get in 57:53.840 --> 57:57.840 to get hacked to get information found out 57:57.840 --> 58:00.600 you know just you're opening yourself to 58:00.600 --> 58:01.820 the world I mean that's what the internet 58:01.820 --> 58:05.600 is so it's even worse when you have 200 58:05.600 --> 58:09.100 million users obviously the the size you 58:09.100 --> 58:10.500 know if you have a company of 50 to 100 58:10.500 --> 58:12.600 people and you open yourself up to the 58:12.600 --> 58:14.780 internet you know your losses are limited 58:14.780 --> 58:18.520 but if you have 200 million obviously that's a 58:18.520 --> 58:20.480 much greater factor and then when you have 58:20.480 --> 58:24.120 you know if if somebody like oh I don't 58:24.120 --> 58:28.500 know a security consulting firm opens 58:28.500 --> 58:29.840 themselves up to the internet they're a 58:29.840 --> 58:31.380 little bit more trustworthy you hope they 58:31.380 --> 58:32.620 know what they're doing and they cannot 58:32.620 --> 58:34.500 sure they may have opened it up to the 58:34.500 --> 58:35.840 net but hopefully they have everything 58:35.840 --> 58:37.720 locked down pretty well encrypted and 58:37.720 --> 58:40.660 protected as opposed to Microsoft who's 58:40.660 --> 58:44.040 quite frankly famous for poor security 58:44.040 --> 58:47.140 yeah have they even made any mention of the 58:47.140 --> 58:49.100 data and how it's stored on these servers I 58:49.100 --> 58:50.980 know you said that you know hopefully 58:50.980 --> 58:52.580 hopefully it's done like this but there 58:52.580 --> 58:54.540 has to be an article or some white paper 58:54.540 --> 58:56.360 somewhere saying like this is how your 58:56.360 --> 58:58.060 data is stored and this is how we ensure 58:58.060 --> 59:00.220 it's safe by by this type of encryption or 59:00.220 --> 59:03.000 something yeah I can't say a hundred 59:03.000 --> 59:05.860 percent but I'm I'm 90 to 95 percent sure 59:05.860 --> 59:07.900 that I've read that they keep that 59:07.900 --> 59:10.460 information separate and it is kind of how 59:10.460 --> 59:13.480 I described where you access one server 59:13.480 --> 59:15.760 and it communicates with its internal server 59:15.760 --> 59:17.520 farm to find the information out and then 59:17.520 --> 59:20.280 pass it back out in the form of encrypted 59:20.280 --> 59:22.520 data in a session variable that's why you 59:22.520 --> 59:25.960 know it's an it's an HTTPS connection you 59:25.960 --> 59:29.440 know it's there's it's supposed to be now 59:29.440 --> 59:31.660 whether it's actually true and and and the 59:31.660 --> 59:33.920 other thing is who's to say and who's to 59:33.920 --> 59:36.000 trust the white papers they put out frankly I 59:36.000 --> 59:37.960 mean I may be getting way too conspiratable 59:37.960 --> 59:46.200 conspiracy theory now but who knows 59:46.200 --> 59:48.540 yeah that's that's true and who really 59:48.540 --> 59:55.400 knows anyway again I think it can have 59:55.400 --> 59:57.220 wonderful wonderful uses that I guess 59:57.220 --> 59:59.160 that's the that's the summary it can be 59:59.160 --> 01:00:01.760 really really good when done right and I 01:00:01.760 --> 01:00:03.340 guess that's true for everything though 01:00:03.340 --> 01:00:06.020 isn't it yeah I think one thing that that 01:00:06.020 --> 01:00:09.020 I'd like to throw into the single sign on 01:00:09.020 --> 01:00:11.020 thing is that you know single sign on I 01:00:11.820 --> 01:00:13.460 don't know it may may be good or bad but 01:00:13.460 --> 01:00:14.820 there's another thing that that a lot of 01:00:14.820 --> 01:00:17.120 places need to need to include with this 01:00:17.120 --> 01:00:20.860 and and and nobody I know does this with 01:00:20.860 --> 01:00:22.940 the exception of the place that I work which 01:00:22.940 --> 01:00:24.640 is require you to change your password 01:00:24.640 --> 01:00:28.240 sometime maybe not every every couple of 01:00:28.240 --> 01:00:29.940 days or something like that but once a 01:00:29.940 --> 01:00:31.280 month once every two months or something 01:00:31.280 --> 01:00:33.420 like that I think if something like that 01:00:33.420 --> 01:00:34.860 was implemented everywhere if it was the 01:00:34.860 --> 01:00:37.860 default for single sign on I think I 01:00:37.860 --> 01:00:39.560 might have a little a little more faith 01:00:39.560 --> 01:00:41.580 in it but I don't I don't know that 01:00:41.580 --> 01:00:42.920 that that's that that's necessarily the 01:00:42.920 --> 01:00:44.560 case with with the way that it's 01:00:44.560 --> 01:00:48.600 configured by default yeah and I think 01:00:48.600 --> 01:00:50.600 the the reason I'm not that I'm 01:00:50.600 --> 01:00:52.020 justifying it but I think the reason 01:00:52.020 --> 01:00:54.120 that they don't is because of what I 01:00:54.120 --> 01:00:56.340 mentioned earlier the whole point is to 01:00:56.340 --> 01:00:58.640 kind of give the users the poor secretary 01:00:58.640 --> 01:01:00.720 who has 10 passwords you're trying to 01:01:00.720 --> 01:01:03.100 make it easier on her and easier on your 01:01:03.100 --> 01:01:04.880 users by not having them remember all 01:01:04.880 --> 01:01:07.040 that stuff and by having them go back 01:01:07.040 --> 01:01:08.520 and start changing it every few months 01:01:08.520 --> 01:01:10.040 you're making it difficult on them again 01:01:10.040 --> 01:01:12.880 and kind of defeating your purpose now I 01:01:12.880 --> 01:01:14.360 think that's the logic behind the 01:01:14.360 --> 01:01:15.600 argument I'm not saying that that's 01:01:15.600 --> 01:01:18.400 right I agree with you actually but the 01:01:18.400 --> 01:01:20.440 real the reality the logistics of 01:01:20.440 --> 01:01:22.840 actually doing that it's a lot more 01:01:22.840 --> 01:01:24.860 difficult yeah I could I could see that 01:01:24.860 --> 01:01:27.160 that you know remembering 10 passwords 01:01:27.160 --> 01:01:28.920 for 10 different machines like you said 01:01:28.920 --> 01:01:32.020 is a real hassle but you know forcing 01:01:32.020 --> 01:01:33.840 the change of password you know if they 01:01:33.840 --> 01:01:35.040 still only have to remember one 01:01:35.040 --> 01:01:37.240 password not so bad but then again you 01:01:37.240 --> 01:01:38.660 know the average you know the average 01:01:38.660 --> 01:01:40.740 person is not a computer user like like 01:01:40.740 --> 01:01:42.080 people who listen to the show or like 01:01:42.080 --> 01:01:44.480 you and I that not to that not to that 01:01:44.480 --> 01:01:46.360 level or extent they're they're not 01:01:46.360 --> 01:01:47.600 going to want to they're not going to 01:01:47.600 --> 01:01:48.860 want to keep remembering new passwords 01:01:48.860 --> 01:01:50.320 exactly and they're going to get 01:01:50.320 --> 01:01:52.540 confused and lost and this is where the 01:01:52.540 --> 01:01:55.260 x-factor comes in that we all know 01:01:55.260 --> 01:01:57.960 about but you got us you got to apply 01:01:57.960 --> 01:01:59.700 it and here here's an example of where 01:01:59.700 --> 01:02:02.080 you apply it it comes back to money and 01:02:02.080 --> 01:02:03.720 let me explain what I mean by that 01:02:03.720 --> 01:02:06.420 these people if you make them change it 01:02:06.420 --> 01:02:08.560 every month and let's say they only 01:02:08.560 --> 01:02:10.360 access it once a month or some people 01:02:10.360 --> 01:02:11.820 only access it once every three or four 01:02:11.820 --> 01:02:15.220 months they're just plain and simply not 01:02:15.220 --> 01:02:17.860 going to remember it they're going to 01:02:17.860 --> 01:02:20.240 forget it they're not going to remember 01:02:20.240 --> 01:02:21.680 it they're not going to write it down if 01:02:21.680 --> 01:02:23.340 they do that's bad if they don't they 01:02:23.340 --> 01:02:25.340 forget it and what that means is it 01:02:25.340 --> 01:02:27.080 ends up as an increased number of calls 01:02:27.080 --> 01:02:30.700 to your help desk it costs money to run 01:02:30.700 --> 01:02:33.380 and maintain a help desk it costs money 01:02:33.380 --> 01:02:36.820 to run and maintain services for users 01:02:36.820 --> 01:02:41.300 and if it can save money they will cut 01:02:41.300 --> 01:02:43.820 the service out if it means if you if 01:02:43.820 --> 01:02:45.560 they see the bottom line when management 01:02:45.560 --> 01:02:48.800 sees this and I've seen I can tell you 01:02:48.800 --> 01:02:50.440 as a matter of fact I witnessed it in a 01:02:50.440 --> 01:02:52.880 couple places if it will save them money 01:02:52.880 --> 01:02:55.560 on the bottom line they will sacrifice 01:02:55.560 --> 01:02:59.100 that bit of security to save that money 01:02:59.100 --> 01:03:01.280 right and I've seen it a million times 01:03:01.280 --> 01:03:05.140 money is the x-factor in everything you 01:03:05.140 --> 01:03:07.680 can relate money into every conversation 01:03:07.680 --> 01:03:09.420 and every decision that's made in the 01:03:09.420 --> 01:03:12.920 world it's all hinges around money and 01:03:12.920 --> 01:03:14.840 anybody that says otherwise is naive 01:03:14.840 --> 01:03:19.640 anybody that says I just I won't even 01:03:19.640 --> 01:03:21.320 go into that I could go into a rant but 01:03:21.320 --> 01:03:23.200 I'm not going to I'm I'm enjoying this 01:03:23.200 --> 01:03:24.480 show I'm just having a nice light 01:03:24.480 --> 01:03:27.080 informational show this time yep I haven't 01:03:27.080 --> 01:03:28.620 even cursed yet I don't think I don't 01:03:28.620 --> 01:03:30.800 think I'm sure somebody will tell me if 01:03:30.800 --> 01:03:32.960 I did but I think I'm doing good so far 01:03:32.960 --> 01:03:34.680 and actually we're starting I think 01:03:34.680 --> 01:03:37.220 we're let's see how far away into I 01:03:37.220 --> 01:03:40.820 forgot to start my timer well we'll hit 01:03:40.820 --> 01:03:46.060 one more topic here anything particular 01:03:46.060 --> 01:03:49.260 strike your eye here not that I can 01:03:49.260 --> 01:03:52.120 really I tell you what since we're 01:03:52.120 --> 01:03:55.340 talking about data and scattered data and 01:03:55.340 --> 01:03:56.740 different you know authenticating on 01:03:56.740 --> 01:03:59.660 different places again you haven't you 01:03:59.660 --> 01:04:01.960 might have an authentication for email 01:04:01.960 --> 01:04:03.600 you might have an authentication for some 01:04:03.600 --> 01:04:06.620 client server customized application you 01:04:06.620 --> 01:04:08.440 might have to access a certain database 01:04:08.440 --> 01:04:12.100 well can you imagine how many databases 01:04:12.100 --> 01:04:15.940 that the government has it's probably an 01:04:15.940 --> 01:04:17.920 unbelievable amount multiple terabytes 01:04:17.920 --> 01:04:20.640 scattered everywhere and and and that's 01:04:20.640 --> 01:04:23.840 the problem that is the problem it's 01:04:23.840 --> 01:04:26.680 kind of a catch-22 actually you don't 01:04:26.680 --> 01:04:28.460 really want it's kind of a scary thought 01:04:28.460 --> 01:04:30.180 of the government having one big 01:04:30.180 --> 01:04:33.260 centralized database of everybody and the 01:04:33.260 --> 01:04:35.280 FBI is trying to do that they started 01:04:35.280 --> 01:04:36.640 you know it's September 11th they 01:04:36.640 --> 01:04:37.920 really started trying to have this 01:04:37.920 --> 01:04:40.540 registry of potential you know it's 01:04:40.540 --> 01:04:41.880 been it's been talked to death that 01:04:41.880 --> 01:04:48.240 topic um but that's just one of many 01:04:48.240 --> 01:04:51.900 many databases that that the government 01:04:51.900 --> 01:04:55.320 has and well think about see this is 01:04:55.320 --> 01:04:56.800 something that's always escaped me I 01:04:56.800 --> 01:04:58.860 don't even understand why they have a 01:04:58.860 --> 01:05:01.140 census I don't understand why that 01:05:01.140 --> 01:05:03.320 exists I really don't we have to fill 01:05:03.320 --> 01:05:07.220 out taxes every year what information 01:05:07.220 --> 01:05:09.000 don't you get from the taxes that you 01:05:09.000 --> 01:05:11.060 need to put on the census report yeah 01:05:11.060 --> 01:05:12.340 that's a good point I hadn't really 01:05:12.340 --> 01:05:14.500 thought about it every single year I 01:05:14.500 --> 01:05:16.180 mean unless somebody doesn't obviously 01:05:16.180 --> 01:05:20.020 they don't fill out taxes but you know 01:05:20.020 --> 01:05:21.040 there's three things that you're 01:05:21.040 --> 01:05:23.060 assured of in life you're born you die 01:05:23.060 --> 01:05:25.760 and you pay taxes I mean it's going to 01:05:25.760 --> 01:05:28.540 be as close to complete as the census 01:05:28.540 --> 01:05:30.920 takers I hang up on them I got better 01:05:30.920 --> 01:05:33.440 things to do yeah I think it's a census 01:05:33.440 --> 01:05:36.600 sounds sounded like an okay idea um you 01:05:36.600 --> 01:05:37.820 know to kind of get an idea of how the 01:05:37.820 --> 01:05:40.060 population expanding and you know do 01:05:40.060 --> 01:05:41.380 future planning for the government but 01:05:41.380 --> 01:05:43.140 like you said you get even more 01:05:43.140 --> 01:05:46.240 detailed information from from uh from 01:05:46.240 --> 01:05:49.040 taxes so every bit and then some yeah 01:05:49.040 --> 01:05:51.160 you know all about you know everybody 01:05:51.160 --> 01:05:52.720 who's working well everybody who's 01:05:52.720 --> 01:05:54.140 actually paying taxes all of you know 01:05:54.140 --> 01:05:56.060 their kids uh how much money they're 01:05:56.060 --> 01:05:57.620 making where they live all of that 01:05:57.620 --> 01:06:01.180 stuff you know all of their assets um so 01:06:01.180 --> 01:06:02.140 I don't know what they what they're 01:06:02.140 --> 01:06:03.800 really trying to achieve with it but 01:06:03.800 --> 01:06:08.020 there was I the reason this is kind of 01:06:08.020 --> 01:06:09.340 popped into my head or why I've been 01:06:09.340 --> 01:06:10.680 wanting to talk about this is because 01:06:10.680 --> 01:06:13.020 there was a there was something I saw 01:06:13.020 --> 01:06:17.980 on CNBC and um on the website that is 01:06:17.980 --> 01:06:25.240 um there are it doesn't give a number but 01:06:25.240 --> 01:06:28.600 there are lots and lots of big databases 01:06:28.600 --> 01:06:30.860 kept by the federal government obviously 01:06:30.860 --> 01:06:35.120 we mentioned to the census and the IRS of 01:06:35.120 --> 01:06:37.080 course FBI we just mentioned they since 01:06:37.080 --> 01:06:38.780 September 11th they've started to try to 01:06:38.780 --> 01:06:42.400 gather a database um obviously the like 01:06:42.400 --> 01:06:44.080 the FCC is going to have a database of 01:06:44.080 --> 01:06:47.380 anybody related to that um anybody that 01:06:47.380 --> 01:06:51.340 um gosh putting it put me on the spot 01:06:51.340 --> 01:06:53.780 I can't think there's the CIA has 01:06:53.780 --> 01:06:55.740 databases of people you know foreign 01:06:55.740 --> 01:06:58.020 and domestic any any type of branch of 01:06:58.020 --> 01:06:59.100 the government's going to have huge 01:06:59.100 --> 01:07:01.500 databases okay here's and automobiles 01:07:01.500 --> 01:07:04.980 there you go driver's licenses um any 01:07:04.980 --> 01:07:07.760 social security I mean there's a huge 01:07:07.760 --> 01:07:10.520 one there are all these huge databases 01:07:10.520 --> 01:07:14.900 out there with every bit of information 01:07:14.900 --> 01:07:17.500 on people and we've it's been seen time 01:07:17.500 --> 01:07:19.200 and time again it's only a matter of 01:07:19.200 --> 01:07:20.360 social engineering to get that 01:07:20.360 --> 01:07:23.800 information it's all you got to do is 01:07:23.800 --> 01:07:25.740 call up certain knowing who to call and 01:07:25.740 --> 01:07:27.500 how to call and how to act with them on 01:07:27.500 --> 01:07:29.080 the phone you can find out anything about 01:07:29.080 --> 01:07:32.360 anybody it may take some time and it'll 01:07:32.360 --> 01:07:34.080 work some trial and error but you can 01:07:34.080 --> 01:07:35.580 find out just about anything you want 01:07:35.580 --> 01:07:40.200 well this article I'm going to read a 01:07:40.200 --> 01:07:41.580 little bit of this because it's kind of 01:07:41.580 --> 01:07:43.740 I want you to think about this as I read 01:07:43.740 --> 01:07:46.400 it um if you'll indulge me for just a 01:07:46.400 --> 01:07:48.180 minute here I'm gonna I'll try to skip 01:07:48.180 --> 01:07:51.980 through some of it um it said poll 01:07:51.980 --> 01:07:54.300 Americans on the issue of privacy and 01:07:54.300 --> 01:07:56.920 most will recite a litany of aggravations 01:07:56.920 --> 01:07:59.580 that include digital spam persistent 01:07:59.580 --> 01:08:01.480 telemarketers and plain old-fashioned 01:08:01.480 --> 01:08:05.160 junk mail only a few will mention risk 01:08:05.160 --> 01:08:07.300 from their own government which collects 01:08:07.300 --> 01:08:09.860 data on millions of citizens and then 01:08:09.860 --> 01:08:12.860 fails to protect it adequately so 01:08:13.520 --> 01:08:14.980 they've got this information but they 01:08:14.980 --> 01:08:18.060 don't protect it but only a few people 01:08:18.060 --> 01:08:21.320 are concerned and scared about that I 01:08:21.320 --> 01:08:23.860 mean I don't quite understand people's 01:08:24.480 --> 01:08:27.120 priorities there that doesn't maybe a 01:08:27.120 --> 01:08:28.240 lot of people just don't even really 01:08:28.240 --> 01:08:30.600 realize or know at all is it that they 01:08:30.600 --> 01:08:31.940 don't know or is it that they don't 01:08:31.940 --> 01:08:34.900 care well I'm sure plenty of people 01:08:34.900 --> 01:08:36.240 don't care but I have a feeling that a 01:08:36.240 --> 01:08:37.740 lot of people who aren't computer savvy 01:08:37.740 --> 01:08:39.620 and who are into technology aren't 01:08:39.620 --> 01:08:41.520 going to know that not only is this 01:08:41.520 --> 01:08:43.280 information there but it's easy to 01:08:43.280 --> 01:08:46.100 gather as much information as you want 01:08:46.100 --> 01:08:48.440 you can store it forever and it's easy 01:08:48.440 --> 01:08:50.340 to aggregate no problem 01:08:50.340 --> 01:08:54.740 well the first line of this article says 01:08:55.300 --> 01:08:58.060 the feds are collecting more and more 01:08:58.060 --> 01:09:00.780 personal information about you and its 01:09:00.780 --> 01:09:03.060 mammoth piecemeal databases are poorly 01:09:03.060 --> 01:09:05.740 guarded and wide open to hackers that 01:09:05.740 --> 01:09:08.580 that would be us it's not wide open to 01:09:08.580 --> 01:09:10.100 anybody else it's only wide open to 01:09:10.100 --> 01:09:12.900 hackers of course instead of big 01:09:12.900 --> 01:09:14.720 brother Americans find their privacy 01:09:14.720 --> 01:09:17.600 threatened threatened by bumbling uncle 01:09:17.600 --> 01:09:19.840 actually it's not just one uncle but 01:09:19.840 --> 01:09:22.180 many there seem to be almost as many 01:09:22.180 --> 01:09:24.500 information-gathering efforts as there 01:09:24.500 --> 01:09:27.040 are agencies and sub agencies in the 01:09:27.040 --> 01:09:28.560 executive branch of the government that's 01:09:28.560 --> 01:09:31.180 what we just said there are tons and 01:09:31.180 --> 01:09:33.860 tons of databases out there and it is 01:09:33.860 --> 01:09:35.300 just a matter of social engineering 01:09:35.300 --> 01:09:36.460 whether you want to label it as 01:09:36.460 --> 01:09:38.500 hackers you know whether you want to 01:09:38.500 --> 01:09:40.420 get whether it's terrorists whether 01:09:40.420 --> 01:09:42.220 it's somebody who's just legitimately 01:09:42.220 --> 01:09:45.000 trying to find information out they do 01:09:45.000 --> 01:09:50.320 not protect the data properly and you can 01:09:50.320 --> 01:09:52.940 aim it at hackers you can aim it and 01:09:52.940 --> 01:09:54.520 blame it on the bad guys all you want but 01:09:54.520 --> 01:09:56.640 that's just diversion tactics diversionary 01:09:56.640 --> 01:09:58.940 tactics oh yeah it's hackers that are 01:09:58.940 --> 01:10:00.400 causing the problem it's hackers that are 01:10:00.400 --> 01:10:04.980 breaking in no you are not protecting the 01:10:04.980 --> 01:10:07.400 data properly you're not doing your job 01:10:07.400 --> 01:10:12.660 you're not you're not providing the 01:10:12.660 --> 01:10:15.160 security that data of such a sensitive 01:10:15.160 --> 01:10:19.560 nature deserves and it even says what 01:10:19.560 --> 01:10:21.740 unites these fragmented efforts is the 01:10:21.740 --> 01:10:24.920 generally low level of protection afforded 01:10:24.920 --> 01:10:27.020 the information that's collected with a 01:10:27.020 --> 01:10:29.100 few exceptions agencies now listen to 01:10:29.100 --> 01:10:32.520 this agencies fail even the most basic 01:10:32.520 --> 01:10:36.180 tests of security and cannot meet 01:10:36.180 --> 01:10:38.820 standards to which they hold the private 01:10:38.820 --> 01:10:39.400 sector 01:10:39.400 --> 01:10:42.420 yep they make rules and they don't 01:10:42.420 --> 01:10:42.720 follow 01:10:42.720 --> 01:10:45.020 does everyone listening hear what i just 01:10:45.020 --> 01:10:46.940 said they don't it's called practice 01:10:46.940 --> 01:10:47.820 what you preach 01:10:47.820 --> 01:10:52.640 they can't even meet their own required 01:10:52.640 --> 01:10:56.020 standards of security that's that's 01:10:56.020 --> 01:11:00.440 that's beyond scary that's beyond scary 01:11:00.440 --> 01:11:04.560 that's ridiculous do as i say don't do 01:11:04.560 --> 01:11:07.540 as i do oh yeah we're going to hold you 01:11:07.540 --> 01:11:09.380 guys if you guys have any information or 01:11:09.380 --> 01:11:10.840 any day we're going to make you do this 01:11:10.840 --> 01:11:13.140 and encrypt that and protect that and 01:11:13.140 --> 01:11:14.460 you have to buy these servers and you 01:11:14.460 --> 01:11:16.620 have to do oh but don't worry about us 01:11:16.620 --> 01:11:18.080 no we'll just we're just going to put it 01:11:18.080 --> 01:11:19.680 into an excel spreadsheet and upload it to 01:11:19.680 --> 01:11:21.880 the web don't worry about us we're fine 01:11:21.880 --> 01:11:26.920 oh man it that that i'm that is like 01:11:26.920 --> 01:11:30.060 the most scary thing i mean junk mail 01:11:30.060 --> 01:11:32.260 sure it's annoying telemarketing calls 01:11:32.260 --> 01:11:34.320 yeah that's kind of annoying too but i 01:11:34.320 --> 01:11:36.240 will take an extra couple telemarketing 01:11:36.240 --> 01:11:39.180 calls to assure my privacy of my data 01:11:39.180 --> 01:11:41.360 maybe if they had privacy of my data i 01:11:41.360 --> 01:11:43.320 wouldn't get the telemarketing calls 01:11:43.320 --> 01:11:47.080 yep oh but there's nobody that can 01:11:47.080 --> 01:11:48.840 stop them nobody can say well yeah you 01:11:48.840 --> 01:11:51.140 should fix this because there's nothing 01:11:51.140 --> 01:11:53.660 you can do you know here's here's an 01:11:53.660 --> 01:11:56.800 let's see here's a quote it says most 01:11:56.800 --> 01:11:58.700 people think of social security we got 01:11:58.700 --> 01:12:01.100 that one the irs we got that one and 01:12:01.100 --> 01:12:02.660 medicare i hadn't thought of that one 01:12:02.660 --> 01:12:04.940 yeah medicare when they think of 01:12:04.940 --> 01:12:07.620 personal databases but they're all over 01:12:07.620 --> 01:12:09.420 the place now we yeah we just said we 01:12:09.420 --> 01:12:13.860 listed several other ones as well um it's 01:12:13.860 --> 01:12:17.700 just all this data out there there's no 01:12:17.700 --> 01:12:19.620 standards that they're being forced to 01:12:19.620 --> 01:12:23.640 keep up with but everyone else is and 01:12:23.640 --> 01:12:30.800 it's it's just it's just like a theme for 01:12:30.800 --> 01:12:33.280 every episode that i do there's always 01:12:33.280 --> 01:12:35.260 something in there about incompetence and 01:12:35.260 --> 01:12:38.140 this is i guess this episode's incompetence 01:12:38.140 --> 01:12:41.400 story there's no standards in the 01:12:41.400 --> 01:12:43.140 government there never has been on 01:12:43.140 --> 01:12:45.660 anything not just this particular story 01:12:45.660 --> 01:12:48.220 but anything because they have no 01:12:48.220 --> 01:12:50.160 accountability and no motivation to do 01:12:50.160 --> 01:12:51.820 anything the way that they're supposed 01:12:51.820 --> 01:12:56.900 to yeah that in here's a quote here 01:12:56.900 --> 01:13:00.100 that says there is no uniform idea of 01:13:00.100 --> 01:13:01.520 what should be reported and what 01:13:01.520 --> 01:13:03.720 shouldn't be the situation is very 01:13:03.720 --> 01:13:06.740 confused right now if the volume of 01:13:06.740 --> 01:13:08.600 information is striking so are the 01:13:08.600 --> 01:13:10.640 disparities in the way it is classified 01:13:10.640 --> 01:13:12.760 and safeguarded by the various agencies 01:13:12.760 --> 01:13:14.900 that collect it now here's here's the 01:13:14.900 --> 01:13:18.260 quote this is not my quote this is from 01:13:18.260 --> 01:13:20.580 the article saying this i just said it a 01:13:20.580 --> 01:13:22.420 second ago but this is the article from 01:13:22.420 --> 01:13:25.840 cnbc it says much of the poor security 01:13:25.840 --> 01:13:28.760 however is attributable to sheer 01:13:28.760 --> 01:13:29.640 ineptitude 01:13:29.640 --> 01:13:35.140 sheer ineptitude they just don't know what 01:13:35.140 --> 01:13:35.760 they're doing 01:13:35.760 --> 01:13:42.740 they do everything halfway and who loses 01:13:42.740 --> 01:13:43.140 out 01:13:43.140 --> 01:13:47.680 we do we the american citizens who 01:13:47.680 --> 01:13:51.600 deserve and are entitled to privacy we 01:13:51.600 --> 01:13:54.800 have a right privacy is a right in this 01:13:54.800 --> 01:13:57.660 country and people have forgotten that it 01:13:57.660 --> 01:14:00.700 is a right it is not a privilege we have 01:14:00.700 --> 01:14:02.820 a right to privacy 01:14:02.820 --> 01:14:12.520 and whether it's taken away by heavy 01:14:12.520 --> 01:14:16.220 handed laws which again is a topic we've 01:14:16.220 --> 01:14:18.380 beaten to death patriot act patriot act 01:14:18.380 --> 01:14:24.180 2 etc etc even if it's not taken away by 01:14:24.180 --> 01:14:26.680 the heavy fist of the government it's 01:14:26.680 --> 01:14:33.380 being given away by the open palm the 01:14:33.380 --> 01:14:35.220 other open palm of the government one 01:14:35.220 --> 01:14:37.360 hand is crushing us the other one is 01:14:37.360 --> 01:14:38.740 holding our information out and giving 01:14:38.740 --> 01:14:39.200 it away 01:14:39.200 --> 01:14:41.780 i mean actually it's scary visual that 01:14:41.780 --> 01:14:45.180 would make a great anti uncle sam poster 01:14:45.180 --> 01:14:47.720 that would make a good poster a good 01:14:47.720 --> 01:14:48.940 visual maybe we should use that for the 01:14:48.940 --> 01:14:49.860 cover of bin rev 01:14:49.860 --> 01:14:56.400 that's that's just that disgusts me 01:14:56.400 --> 01:14:59.060 incompetence ineptitude whatever word 01:14:59.060 --> 01:15:01.400 you want to use is one of my biggest 01:15:01.400 --> 01:15:03.680 pet peeves if you're going to do 01:15:03.680 --> 01:15:05.540 something do it right and if you're 01:15:05.540 --> 01:15:07.200 going to make someone else follow rules 01:15:07.200 --> 01:15:08.700 you should follow them yourselves you 01:15:08.700 --> 01:15:10.660 can't tell someone else don't do 01:15:10.660 --> 01:15:12.280 something you can't do yourself or 01:15:12.280 --> 01:15:14.500 wouldn't do yourself that's something 01:15:14.500 --> 01:15:16.200 that i've always done through management 01:15:16.200 --> 01:15:18.120 through people that i've worked with i 01:15:18.120 --> 01:15:19.700 would never ask someone else to do 01:15:19.700 --> 01:15:21.760 something that i couldn't or wouldn't 01:15:21.760 --> 01:15:22.480 do myself 01:15:22.480 --> 01:15:24.660 unfortunately 01:15:24.660 --> 01:15:26.340 here's my big problem now now that 01:15:26.340 --> 01:15:27.860 we've you know normally you can say 01:15:27.860 --> 01:15:30.060 okay this person is inept and they 01:15:30.060 --> 01:15:31.460 can't do this and they can't do that 01:15:31.460 --> 01:15:33.740 like the ria they you know we're just 01:15:33.740 --> 01:15:34.900 going to boycott them because they 01:15:34.900 --> 01:15:35.920 have no idea what they're doing 01:15:35.920 --> 01:15:36.800 whatever 01:15:36.800 --> 01:15:37.960 but when it comes to the government 01:15:37.960 --> 01:15:39.600 like the especially the u.s. 01:15:39.660 --> 01:15:40.720 government the world's largest 01:15:40.720 --> 01:15:41.160 monopoly 01:15:41.160 --> 01:15:42.760 what can you do 01:15:42.760 --> 01:15:46.880 well there's one thing that you can 01:15:46.880 --> 01:15:47.240 do 01:15:47.240 --> 01:15:50.160 and everybody thinks that it doesn't 01:15:50.160 --> 01:15:51.400 matter and it doesn't count 01:15:51.400 --> 01:15:54.080 and because of that thought it 01:15:54.080 --> 01:15:55.560 doesn't kind of count sometimes and 01:15:55.560 --> 01:15:56.080 that's vote 01:15:56.080 --> 01:15:57.120 that's true 01:15:57.120 --> 01:15:59.040 and that's only limited control 01:15:59.040 --> 01:16:00.040 right 01:16:00.040 --> 01:16:03.380 you know i'll i don't want to go into 01:16:03.380 --> 01:16:05.400 a political thing but i'm just going 01:16:05.400 --> 01:16:07.020 to say that voting does count 01:16:07.020 --> 01:16:12.080 if everybody exercises that right 01:16:12.080 --> 01:16:12.800 and if you're not going to 01:16:12.800 --> 01:16:14.400 exercise that right your right to 01:16:14.400 --> 01:16:16.260 vote and to make change then you 01:16:16.260 --> 01:16:17.520 can't really whine too much about 01:16:17.520 --> 01:16:19.120 your other rights being taken away 01:16:19.120 --> 01:16:20.040 you didn't do anything 01:16:20.040 --> 01:16:20.880 you deserve what you get if you're 01:16:20.880 --> 01:16:21.380 not going to vote 01:16:21.380 --> 01:16:21.740 exactly 01:16:21.740 --> 01:16:24.340 so that's all i have to say about 01:16:24.340 --> 01:16:24.800 that 01:16:24.800 --> 01:16:27.560 and i think that's really all we 01:16:27.560 --> 01:16:28.760 have to say about the show today i 01:16:28.760 --> 01:16:30.060 think we're out of time 01:16:30.060 --> 01:16:34.140 um i thank you again for coming on 01:16:34.140 --> 01:16:35.320 during the show it's always good to 01:16:35.320 --> 01:16:35.920 have you on 01:16:35.920 --> 01:16:36.980 yeah no problem anytime 01:16:36.980 --> 01:16:38.300 um do you have anybody you want 01:16:38.300 --> 01:16:38.820 to shout out to 01:16:38.820 --> 01:16:41.460 um the only person i can think of 01:16:41.460 --> 01:16:41.920 is decoder 01:16:41.920 --> 01:16:43.960 yep got a shout out to decoder 01:16:43.960 --> 01:16:46.380 he's i'm sure as we speak and as 01:16:46.380 --> 01:16:47.100 this is streaming 01:16:47.100 --> 01:16:48.740 he's on the socal bridge 01:16:48.740 --> 01:16:49.260 no doubt 01:16:49.260 --> 01:16:50.160 he's on the bridge 01:16:50.160 --> 01:16:51.440 i should call that right after the 01:16:51.440 --> 01:16:51.600 show 01:16:51.600 --> 01:16:52.340 absolutely 01:16:52.340 --> 01:16:54.800 um i'm gonna shout out to uh 01:16:54.800 --> 01:16:56.560 mr v tech my friend went to 01:16:56.560 --> 01:16:57.820 halloween horror nights among some 01:16:57.820 --> 01:16:58.160 others 01:16:58.160 --> 01:16:58.760 sito 01:16:58.760 --> 01:17:01.080 um shout out epiphany for that 01:17:01.080 --> 01:17:02.500 opening theme song very cool 01:17:02.500 --> 01:17:02.980 again 01:17:02.980 --> 01:17:04.600 i'm gonna start using that more 01:17:04.600 --> 01:17:04.980 often 01:17:04.980 --> 01:17:05.700 and 01:17:05.700 --> 01:17:06.820 despite 01:17:06.820 --> 01:17:10.120 what zapper link has to say 01:17:10.120 --> 01:17:12.400 i'm gonna give a big 01:17:12.400 --> 01:17:13.820 fat shout out 01:17:13.820 --> 01:17:15.840 to my chicago cubs 01:17:15.840 --> 01:17:18.280 into the championship series 01:17:18.280 --> 01:17:19.200 thank you very much 01:17:19.200 --> 01:17:21.100 nlcs against the florida marlins 01:17:21.100 --> 01:17:22.080 too small 01:17:22.080 --> 01:17:23.400 well i guess chicago's not really a 01:17:23.400 --> 01:17:24.540 small market team but 01:17:24.540 --> 01:17:26.740 feels like a small market team 01:17:26.740 --> 01:17:27.880 it's better than the braves 01:17:27.880 --> 01:17:30.840 so shout out to my chicago cubs 01:17:30.840 --> 01:17:32.840 hey last week i did it and they 01:17:32.840 --> 01:17:33.920 made it through the first round of 01:17:33.920 --> 01:17:34.880 the playoffs i'm gonna give it to 01:17:34.880 --> 01:17:35.440 them again 01:17:35.440 --> 01:17:37.540 baseball is a very superstitious 01:17:37.540 --> 01:17:39.180 sport so i'm gonna go with it and 01:17:39.180 --> 01:17:40.440 hopefully next week 01:17:40.440 --> 01:17:42.780 i can do it again and we can go on 01:17:42.780 --> 01:17:43.900 to the world series so 01:17:43.900 --> 01:17:46.100 uh silly corny whatever you want 01:17:46.100 --> 01:17:47.780 to call it that's my shout some 01:17:47.780 --> 01:17:50.200 email us letters at binrev.com 01:17:50.200 --> 01:17:51.720 everybody knows that and 01:17:51.720 --> 01:17:54.160 our closing music tonight is another 01:17:54.160 --> 01:17:56.180 track from auditory 01:17:56.180 --> 01:17:59.240 it is called the way we ride 01:17:59.240 --> 01:18:01.480 i think we're gonna wrap it up 01:18:01.480 --> 01:18:03.420 so we will see you next week 01:18:03.420 --> 01:18:04.360 same hack time 01:18:04.360 --> 01:18:05.560 same hack channel 01:18:05.560 --> 01:18:14.220 bye 01:18:14.220 --> 01:18:23.260 bye 01:18:23.260 --> 01:18:31.480 bye 01:18:31.480 --> 01:18:31.920 bye 01:18:31.920 --> 01:18:32.260 bye 01:18:32.260 --> 01:18:32.640 bye 01:18:32.640 --> 01:18:32.820 bye 01:18:32.820 --> 01:18:33.400 bye 01:18:33.400 --> 01:19:03.380 Thank you. 01:19:03.400 --> 01:19:33.380 Thank you. 01:19:33.400 --> 01:20:03.380 Thank you. 01:20:03.400 --> 01:20:33.380 Thank you. 01:20:33.400 --> 01:21:03.380 Thank you. 01:21:03.400 --> 01:21:33.380 Thank you. 01:21:33.400 --> 01:21:35.400 Thank you.