This is dedicated to all the hackers and the crackers
I see in binary, I speak source code
Step on my toes, I'll post a million game pegs of you in a fag pose
In your digital stance, getting firewalled ho
Cause I'm riding the net in my six-fold
I was a dick with my 56
Now with my cable, I'm able to get that stable
On the out, my name is Ace and I'm a Leo
On the digital highway, my name is Neo and I'm a hero
In a flash, I'll school you on burning dream packs
You need some ISO? Let me do my hard drive rifle
Our exchange you could never stifle
In a digital hug, you just caught the love bug
I bootlegged your CD, I caused a fight between Un and Jay-Z
Your CG, it's all gonna be free
Whether we take it by force or we take it nicely
You feel that rattle in your bones?
When I tell you we just hacked out Jones
And NASDAQ leaves your fight on your back
Cause I am he who loves to hack and crack
This is dedicated to the hackers and the critics
Cereal phones, source codes, ISOs, RANs, SIFs, SIFs
This is dedicated to the hackers and the crack
Welcome everyone to Binary Revolution Radio episode 46
I am StankDog with you again this week
And we have a returning host from a few weeks ago
Had a lot of fun doing the show with him before
So we thought we'd bring him back for tonight's main topic
ZeroDB back on the show
Welcome to you my friend
What's up?
And our main topic we'll get to in a moment
Kind of something that the two of us have been working on together
Or looking, looking, I shouldn't say working on
Playing with I guess, looking into
But before we get to that
Take care of a little bit of housekeeping here
A couple things
First of all
We mentioned on the last episode
A little
There was some
Well okay
We'll just say
Okay
Kevin Rose
Went on his tech TV show
Or whatever
And basically
Presented a stun glove
For lack of a better word
A project that X-Logic had been working on
And had presented at his 2600 meeting
And had talked about on RFA quite a while back
And even though the whole idea of the camera
Being using the old disposable camera battery etc
May have been around
It was the first time I'd seen one put together
Cleanly and professionally
And with the glove
And all together
And amazingly that showed up on tech TV
Well
Some people contacted him
Kevin Rose that is
Contacted tech TV
And he put up on their website
On their website
A little note saying
Or acknowledging
That this project
Was something that they had seen
On the web before
And gave a link
To X-Logic
His
Their DEFCON group site
Or 2600 site
Whatever they want to call it
So over to their site
Giving credit
So
That is a very cool thing
I'm glad to hear that
Giving credit
Where credit is due
I don't think that's really so much to ask
So that happened since last week
So actually I think
I should thank the people
That sent in the emails
To them
And made this happen
Because
Like I said
I don't think it's too much
To ask to give credit to people
Could have been accidental
But regardless
It's done
And I think that's
An amicable agreement
I think they worked it out
And I think that's fair
I was hoping
He wouldn't think
He would be able
To get away with
You know
There's too many people
Around for that
Yeah
You've got to give credit
Right
Exactly
And then you know
Well
A lot of ideas
Are going to come from the net
And after a while
You can't claim
Everything as your own
Eventually
You're going to step
On somebody's toes
Or you're going to overlap
With somebody
And
Right
Well that's why
Yeah
It's only fair
Even a minute
Reference to the actual author
Or you know
Anything relating back
To any source
That you might have
Got this from
Or that from
You know
Exactly
I mean
And you know
They teach you that in college
That you have to quote your sources
And give credit to your sources
Where you get information from
So
Right
So anyway
That's probably all
That needs to be said about that
And now let's jump into
Some emails
Actually one
Good long email here
From our good friend
Pixel Fiend
Really
You know
When he sends in email
And when he posts to the forums
Really
Really a bright guy
And very much
On the ball
So I really like
Getting stuff from him
And he says in this email
Let's see
I'll skip ahead
Let's see
Been a while since I've written
I thought I'd drop you
A quick email
To say thanks again
For your great shows
Anyway
I just wanted to say
That I was able
To use info
From your last show
And put it to good use
Now the last show
Was episode 45
Where we talked about
Microsoft Office
Versus OpenOffice.org
And open source software
In general
But those two particularly
We kind of did a little
Comparison
Compare and contrast
Of those two products
He goes on
Personally
I run like hell
From Microsoft products
Whenever I can
But last week
I was approached
By one of my company's
Vendors
Who was looking
For an alternative
To MS Office
For his personal machines
Due to cost
In parentheses
He mentions
These were Macs
I knew about
OpenOffice previously
But was unable
And was able
To turn him on
To it
But the last show
Was very timely
And gave me
Some helpful
Background info
To pass along
Since I don't use
Any kind of
Office suite programs
Personally
Quark Express
And Adobe
And design
Do fine
For any word
Like activity
For my purpose
And the one or two
Times I've needed
A spreadsheet
I've just used
The free
Apple works app
This guy was happy
Enough that I was
Able to set him up
With a free alternative
That he gave me
A gift certificate
For dinner
For me and my wife
Very nice to get out
After having a new baby
Congratulations
Pixelphine by the way
And yeah
Anytime you can get out
With a wife
That's always
That's always good
So I'm glad that worked
Something that
Okay now here's
Here's a
I'll
Enunciate properly
On this
Because this is a little bit
Needs to be spoken
Clearly here
To understand
Something that the listeners
May be interested in
Is that to run
OpenOffice on the Mac
You have to run it
From within the
X11 emulator
This is a little
Unfortunate because
You have to jump
Through all the hoops
Of getting X11
Installed and set up
Then download and
Install OpenOffice
And get it set up
Now not that it's
All that difficult
It's just extra steps
This may be widely
Loan for Mac enthusiasts
But this guy
I was talking to
About above
Was lost at first
X11 isn't
Installed in OSX
By default
And if you have
Pre-OSX.3 version
You have to do
A bit of digging
To find the version
That it is compatible
With your system
Of OSX
If you decide
To read this on the air
Which we are
Obviously
I have the image
For X11 for Jaguar
If anyone needs it
And they can PM
Or email me
And I'd be happy
To send it their way
Thanks again for your work
Thank you Pixelfiend
For the email
And for the offer
You know when people
Send us email
Is so cool
That they're always
Offering help
And they're always
Doing cool things
They're not just saying
Oh yeah well I can do this
And I can make this
Run on the Mac
And I can do
You know
They actually offer
And tell people
That you know
They will help them
And they will give them
What they
You know
What information they have
So that's very cool
I appreciate the offer
And you know
The thing about it is
I like getting email
Like this too
That's follow up
On last week's show
A it shows people
Are listening
Which is always good
But it kind of lets us know
Because last week particularly
I really wanted that
To be a serious show
A serious topic
And something that
You could present
To convince people
Or try to convince people
Something that you could
Possibly even take
To your office
And you know
Get them convinced
Or to a manager
Or something like that
And show them
That there are
Alternative open source
Software out there
That can be used
Now office
I just think this is
The biggest one
To really get people
To open their eyes
The office
Now there are lots
Of others
And we can't sit
And list them
And I also know
That when we're
Talking on the show
Here a lot of our listeners
You know
We're just preaching
To the choir
I know a lot of our listeners
Use open source software
I know it for a fact
You know
So people turn me
On to a lot of it
A lot of our listeners
A lot of people
In the forums
So you know
I'm learning as much
About this from
From listeners
As anybody else
So
So the listeners know that
They know that
You know
It's a good value
Free software
Open source software
You can modify it
It's dependable
Blah blah blah
But I wanted this one
To be for the laymen
And for the people
Out there
Who haven't tried it
And there are still
People that have
That mindset
Of you know what
It's freeware
It's garbage
It's just something
Somebody whipped up
It's a hack
It's a whatever
No
I mean
Zero db
Have you used
I don't want to put you
On the spot
Have you used
Openoffice.org
Yes
I have it installed
On my box now
Yeah
And it's a good app
Is it not
Yeah
It works just like
Like the real deal
Yeah
I mean
It works exactly how
You know
Microsoft side works
Prints
Post scripts
Everything
It works just great
Yeah
It's very very easy
To transition over
From one to the other
And I don't think people
It's one of those things
You've got to see
To believe it
And I really hope
Last week's episode
Will convince people
So that was really
The goal
And the point
And I hope
You know
That happens
Now
Actually
I don't know
If I should
Well I guess
I'll tangent here
A little bit
A friend of mine
I was talking to
This weekend
About it
Mentioned
Well actually
He mentioned
Two things
I don't have here
In the notes
But I'm just
Going to wing this here
He mentioned
Two things to me
One
That he
He actually
Had a knock
Against openoffice.org
That frankly
I'm not sure
If it's valid or not
Because I have not
Tried this
But he said
He had problems
With openoffice.org
Using true type fonts
Now I can't
Confirm or deny
That myself
I will look into it
Out of curiosity
But if anybody
Knows that
Feel free to
Write in to us
At radio
At binrev.com
And let me know
If you've ever
Had problems like that
And he may have
Been using an older version
So of course
I informed him
That the 1.1
1.1.x
Whatever
1.1.1
Is out now
I believe
Make sure he's
Using the latest one
And of course
2.0 is in development
You can get
The in progress
Stuff
That's the other
Cool thing about
Open source
You get a lot of
In between ones
That are probably
As stable
If not more so
Than Microsoft
But we won't go there
But he also
Mentioned to me
That he thought
It was kind of
Interesting that we
Brought the topic up
On the show
Last week
And the reason
And I said this
On the show
The reason it
Spawned me
Was from an article
In one of my
Trade magazines
Did a little
Comparison
Not a comparison
What kind of a
Comparison
But they basically
Convinced an office
To try both of them
And think about
Using one as an
Alternative
Well he mentioned
To me that the
Current maximum
PC that he just
Got in last week
Also had an article
Comparing Microsoft
Office to
OpenOffice.org
So you know
I think the time
Is now
I think we're
Right in it
And I think a lot
Of people are
Doing it
So obviously
That just came out
Last week
I'm sure we had
No effect on that
But I think
The whole world
Is opening their
Eyes to
Alternative
Open source
Software
I'm trying to say
So I think it's
Really really the time
Right now
And I think this
May just be
A turning point
In the open source
Movement
I really do
So
And it's not just that
All kinds of
Open source
Very dependable
Great open source
Stuff is out there
Like Firefox
Is wonderful
You know
Not OpenOffice.org
Thunderbird
You know
Is a good email client
There's just
Tons of stuff out there
That's perfectly stable
Works perfectly fine
Right
I personally
Have turned on
In the past week
Three people
To Firefox
And I
Really told them
Do not use IE
Yeah
Firefox
Yeah and
You know
It's much cleaner
It loads faster
And it doesn't
Really execute
Those
That code
You know
Just in the background
With you
As you
Know anything
And you know
You get viruses
And drogens
And everything
God knows what else
But
Firefox is really
A better
All around
Browser
To me
Yeah
I agree
And tabbed
Browsing
Just
Man
Such a simple
Thing
Goes so far
Right
So
So anyway
Back to the email
I knew we were
Going to go off
On that tangent
But back to the email
Thank you Pixel Fiend
Again for offering
That X11 package
For Jaguar
If anybody does
Want to take him
Up on that
Contact him
Through the forums
I think is the best
Way
I don't want to
I'm not sure
Which email he wants
To contact him
With or share
So I'll just say
Get in touch
With him
Through the forums
Forums.binrev.com
And he's pretty easy
To find there
So
You can send him
A private message
Or email him
Through that interface
And sounds like
He'd be glad
To help you
So
You know
Don't
Don't thank me
Pixel Fiend
For the show
I thank you
For input
And for helping
The community
So I thank you
For the email
I also got another
Email this week
And I get these
Every once in a while
Every couple months
I get an email
Like this
And I'm not
Going to mention
The name
It's from an
Anonymous person
And I'm not
Going to quote
The whole email
But basically
What he's saying
Is that he found
Out my real name
Where I work
You know
Owned me
Whatever you want
To call it
I get this
Every few months
It's in my fact
It's in the
Frequently asked
Questions to the site
It's in the
Frequently asked
Questions on
Snagdog.com
You know
I'm not
Hiding from anything
My information
Is out there
So congratulations
I mean I'm glad
That you were motivated
And you decided
To go out
And see if you
Could find
My docs
That's cool
That's something
That a lot of
People do
And that's
Something that
Hackers have
A skill at
Finding information
And you know
I'm glad that
You have that
And have the
Desire or the
Interest to see
If you could
Find it
I'm definitely
Not a tough
Case
Very easy
So I'm not
I'm not going to
Come out and
Give it out
On the air
I'm not going
To give it
Away
But I absolutely
Don't mind
That people
Know
I go by my
Real name
At the 2600
Meetings
You know
It's
There's a lot
Of easy ways
To find out
Who I am
So if you do
Congratulations
Kudos to you
I'll even give you
A few hints
Order the magazine
You'll get a lot
Of information
When you order
The magazine
You know
That's real
Information
You can look
Up my IP
Address
See where the
IP address
Resolves
Of all the
Different things
I do
You can
Find it
Via IRC
You can
Find it
Via forum
Post
If you can
Find out
Where it is
You can
Find out
Just lots
Of ways
And you
Can
Who is
My site
Again
That's
Real information
I'm not
Denying that
That's
Perfectly
Real information
Because I
Don't have
Anything to
Hide from
And I
Don't mind
That people
Know
I like
Talking to
People
Just don't
Call me
At 3am
That's
Call 0DB
At 1
No never mind
We won't
Go there
Alright so
Anyway just
Throwing that
Out there
Yeah I know
The potential
Exists for
Somebody to
Really be a
Complete jerk
I know that
But it
Hasn't
Happened
So far
People have
Been cool
And you
Know I'm
Cool with
People
I know
There's
Some people
That probably
Don't
Particularly
Care for
Me
I know
That for
A fact
But you
Know
Hey what
Are you
Going to
Do
So
Anyway
That is
Going to
Take care of
The housekeeping
We can
Let's see
How should we
Do this
You know
What let's
As we go
Into the show
And tell
Here we do
Our little
Personal hacking
What have we
Been working
On
I've been
Pretty much
Concentrating on
One thing
While you on
The other hand
Have done
Quite a few
Projects and
Done a lot of
Research since
The last time
You were on
So why don't
You go
First
And talk
About
I know
One thing
That I know
I'll come
Right out
And say
I know
Nothing
About
Is that
Plan
Nine
Okay
So why don't
You start
With that
I think
Would be
Great
Well
I started
Off
I came
Across
This
In an
IRC
Chat
With another
Gentleman
That
Actually
Doesn't live
Far from
Me
And he
Turned me
On to
Plan
Nine
And I
Was like
Plan
Nine
What is
That
I've
Heard
Of
It
But I
Never
Really
Followed
Up
On
To see
What
It
Was
About
So
One
Day
He
Told
Me
The
Site
The
Web
Address
And
Plan
Nine
Briefly
Here
Is
An
Operating
System
It
Was
Designed
In the
Eighties
By
The
Gentleman
At
Bell
Labs
Namely
Rob
Pike
And
Brian
Carringham
Now
Plan
Nine
Was
Developed
Because
There
Were
Some
Shortcomings
And
Some
Issues
With
Unix
That
They
Couldn't
Really
Easily
Undo
So
That's
When
They
Came
Out
With
Plan
Nine
And
Plan
Nine
Is
An
OS
Plan
Nine
Is
Not
Unix
Plan
Nine
Is
Not
Linux
However
Plan
Nine
Does
Resemble
Unix
In
Many
Ways
But
It
Really
Operates
Differently
So
It
Is
Not
It
Is
Actually
Not
A
Form
Of
Unix
Is
That
Right
In
A
Round
About
Way
Yes
But
It
Is
Not
Unix
Okay
Again
If
You
Go
To
Bell
Labs
Website
Or
Do
A
Search
On
Plan
Nine
Or
Google
Plan
Nine
Or
However
Search
Engine
You
Might
Use
It
Goes
Into
Detail
And
There
Are
A
Lot
Of
Links
On
Exactly
What
Plan
Nine
Is
Of
Course
They
Have
Wiki
Pages
And
FAQs
And
Things
Like
That
To
Help
You
Along
The
Way
The
Installation
Is
Really
Easy
You
Just
Go
To
Their
Website
You
Answer
To
The
Terms
And
Policies
You
Can
Actually
Create
An
Image
On
A
Disc
Based
On
Your
Hardware
And
Download
The
CD
Or
The
Image
To
CD
The
Actual
Operating
System
Which
Is
Nothing
More
Than
I
Think
It's
Only
Maybe
300
Meg
I
Don't
Think
It's
Even
More
Than
500
Meg
It
Can't
Be
Wait
A
I
Want
To
Understand
What
You
Just
Said
Did
You
Just
Say
That
You
Can
Go
Through
The
Web
And
They
Have
Some
Kind
Of
Interface
And
You
Can
Dictate
What
Hardware
You
Have
If
You
Know
What
Hardware
You
Have
And
It
Will
Customize
The
Package
For
You
And
Deliver
The
Drivers
That
You
Need
Only
For
Your
Hardware
Absolutely
I
Think
That
That's
The
Coolest
Thing
I've
Heard
In
Probably
Six
Months
These
Guys
I
Mean
These
Researchers
They're
Pretty
Good
And
Think
About
Things
To
Try
To
Do
It
The
Easy
Way
And
This
Is
How
Really
Plan
Nine
Came
About
Is
Trying
To
Have
An
Operating
System
That
Was
Fairly
Easy
To
Install
Easy
To
Access
And
Easy
To
Overall
Just
Work
On
Granted
It's
Not
Your
Normal
OS
Like
Windows
Where
You
Have
A
Whole
Bunch
Of
Windows
And
Different
Icons
And
Different
Motion
Cons
And
Mouse
Pointers
And
All
That
I
Mean
Plan
Nine
Gets
To
The
Point
I
Assume
That
It's
A
Command
Line
It's
From
The
80s
It
Started
Right
So
I
Assume
This
Is
A
Command
Line
Correct
Like
You
Unix
So
To
Speak
But
It's
Not
Unix
There
Is
A
Command
Nine
There
Is
A
Terminal
To
Kind
Of
Expand
On
That
You
Can
Actually
Mount
Almost
Anything
As
A
File
And
What
I
Mean
By
That
You
Can
Look
At
Memory
You
Can
Look
At
The
Memory
On
The
Video
Card
You
Can
Of
Course
Open
Up
Ports
Listen
You
Know
Open
Up
Ports
Where
You
Can
Be
Able
To
Authenticate
On
To
You
Can
Actually
Mount
Say
Like
An
F
For
Example
You
Have
An
F
P
Site
Out
There
Somewhere
And
You
Want
To
Browse
That
Site
You
Can
Actually
Mount
That
Site
On
To
Your
Hard
Drive
And
Browse
That
Direction
On
Your
Hard
Drive
As
A
File
As
Well
As
Email
Like
When
I
Check
My
Email
I
Check
My
Email
Using
Plan
Nine
And
They
Have
This
Neat
Little
Utility
Well
It's
Built
Into
The
OS
It's
Called
Faces
And
If
You
Actually
Create
A
Face
Like
An
Image
Of
Yourself
Or
Whatever
You
Want
To
Portray
As
You
And
Put
It
In
A
Database
When
One
Receives
Email
Your
Pictorial
Is
There
Or
Your
Image
Or
Whatever
You
Have
As
An
Image
Will
Show
Up
And
You
Click
On
That
And
You
Can
Read
That
Person's
Email
There
Is
A
Lot
Of
Nice
Things
About
It
Is
Still
By
Any
Means
To
Our
Standards
Crude
But
The
Concept
Is
Far
Superior
In
My
Opinion
Things
Happen
Much
More
Easier
And
Effortlessly
With
Panline
It's
A
Bit
Mousy
Though
Everything
You
Do
You
Do
With
The
Mouse
Keyboards
Like
The
Arrows
Up
And
Down
And
All
That
Doesn't
Come
To
Play
In
Plan
Nine
Anytime
You
Want
To
Actually
Execute
Something
Of
Course
There's
The
Character
Return
However
You
Know
Your
Highlighting
Is
Done
With
The
Mouse
If
You
Want
To
Copy
And
Paste
They
Call
It
Something
Else
They
Call
Snarf
Send
Which
Means
For
Instance
If
I
Highlight
Like
In
The
Unix
Environment
LS
I
Can
Highlight
It
In
Plan
Nine
And
Send
And
It
Actually
Execute
The
LS
Command
LS
Is
Just
One
Of
The
Unix
Like
Commands
In
Plan
Nine
But
There
Are
Other
Different
Things
And
Commands
That
Actually
Do
Different
Things
Differently
In
Plan
Nine
As
Supposed
To
Unix
Or
Linux
What
Else
Can
I
Say
About
It
Well
Let
Me
What
About
How
Would
You
Use
Flags
On
The
LS
Command
If
You
Want
To
Use
Flags
Or
Different
Options
If
You
Click
On
It
To
Execute
It
You
Don't
Really
Have
The
Keyboard
Control
To
Say
Slash
You
Know
L
S
A
Whatever
Well
Yes
You
Can
Do
That
From
Command
Line
That
Is
Not
A
Problem
The
Mouse
Is
Just
A
Short
Cut
Let
Me
Explain
A
Little
Bit
More
About
The
Mouse
On
A
Regular
Terminal
That
Wouldn't
Be
The
Way
To
Go
But
They
Have
In
The
Windows
System
Instead
Of
It
Calling
X
Window
Or
Windows
It
Is
Called
Rio
And
That
Is
The
Window
System
For
Plan
Nine
In
Rio
You
Have
An
Equivalent
To
Emacs
Or
VI
Or
Vi
Or
Ed
Or
Sam
Acme
And
Basically
What
That
Is
That
Is
A
Hybrid
Windows
System
Editor
And
Shell
And
I
Can
It
Is
Kind
Of
Hard
To
Explain
Until
You
Can
Actually
Get
It
On
A
Box
I
Might
Actually
Go
A
And
Try
To
Do
A
Present
Facitation
Parley
At
One
Of
FL
26
Hour
Meetings
As
To
How
That
Actually
Works
But
When
You
Like
Use
Acme
For
It
Brings
Up
Your
Little
Editor
And
It
Has
Different
Things
On
It
And
You
Can
Actually
Type
Say
A
Directory
Starting
Say
For
Slash
Bin
As
An
Example
Now
When
You
Use
The
Mouse
And
Right
Click
On
That
For
Slash
Bin
It
Actually
Drops
Down
And
So
For
And
So
On
As
A
Tree
And
If
You
Want
To
Execute
Something
You
Just
Send
It
And
It
Executes
There
Is
No
You
Don't
Necessarily
Have
To
Type
The
Whole
Command
Like
You
Do
In
The
Unix
Environment
But
In
Plan
Nine
There
Are
No
Icons
There
Are
No
Fancy
Dancy
This
And
Fancy
Dancy
That
It
Pretty
It
It's
A
Little
Different
But
Once
You
Settle
Down
It
It's
Actually
Quite
Neat
And
Quite
Solid
Really
To
Be
Honest
With
You
What
Else
Can
I
Say
Well
It
Sounds
Surprisingly
Intuitive
Well
I
Have
I
Still
Have
Two
Questions
If
You
Don't
Mind
I
Don't
Want
To
Put
You
On
The
Spot
But
One
And
I
Guess
I
This
Is
Probably
I
Should
Assume
This
Instead
Of
Asking
But
I
Assume
Then
That
General
Unix
Or
Linux
Packages
Or
Source
Out
There
Will
Not
Compile
Directly
At
Easily
It
Would
Probably
Have
To
Be
Tweaked
Or
Modified
Recompiled
Well
No
If
You
Have
It
Is
Basically
C
NCC
Built
In
C
And
NCC
So
If
You
Have
Any
C
Program
It
Will
Compile
And
It
Will
Run
It
Not
A
Problem
But
Yes
There
Are
Some
Things
Like
If
You
Have
Some
Graphical
Things
That
Implemented
Into
It
Right
Certain
System
Calls
I
Would
Assume
Would
Not
Work
It
Won't
It
Won't
Run
It
Won't
Run
It
Won't
But
Basic
Code
It
Will
Run
NC
Standard
Yeah
That's
Great
That's
Very
Good
And
The
Other
Question
That
Jumps
To
Mind
Is
You
Mentioned
Earlier
About
The
Hardware
Does
It
Have
Updated
Drivers
For
New
Hardware
Is
It
Still
Being
In
General
Is
It
Still
Being
Maintained
Overall
And
Updated
And
Or
Only
Hardware
And
Drivers
Being
Updated
If
That
Well
It
Been
Updated
Every
Day
To
Day
I
Joined
The
Nine
Fans
News
Group
They
Update
And
Code
And
Provide
Information
And
Everything
Day
To
Day
I
Mean
We're
Talking
About
Globally
Not
Just
U.S.
Or
Europe
We're
Talking
About
From
All
Over
The
World
And
They
Made
It
Open
Source
So
That's
Why
You
Can
Go
Ahead
And
Download
It
Wow
That
Is
Really
Cool
Yeah
And
It's
Still
Maintained
And
This
Is
Not
An
Archaic
Operating
System
This
Is
Still
Maintained
Today
Right
It's
Just
Obscure
It's
Fairly
Obscure
Right
By
People
Like
You
And
Me
You
Know
Being
Built
From
The
Ground
Up
To
Try
To
Clean
Up
Some
Of
The
Shortcomings
From
The
Unix
Days
You
Know
And
All
The
Problem
They
Have
With
That
You
Know
The
Little
Things
Right
Let's
Try
To
Make
It
A
Little
Bit
More
Simpler
And
Make
Sense
You
Know
Wow
They
Have
A
Different
Foul
System
That
I
Know
Of
That
We
Work
With
There
Two
Actually
Three
I'm
Sorry
Kin
Foul
System
KFS
Venti
And
Fossil
And
I
Haven't
I
Have
To
KFS
And
It
Seems
To
Be
Clean
I
Wish
I
Can
Well
Actually
On
The
Site
I'm
Going
To
Be
Updating
On
FL
2600
Site
And
I
Probably
Even
On
The
Bin
Rev
Site
Put
Up
A
Couple
Screenshots
Yeah
I
Was
Getting
Ready
To
Ask
I
Don't
Know
If
It
Is
Possible
To
Take
Screenshots
Through
There
But
Yeah
That
Would
Be
Very
Cool
To
See
Because
Remember
I
Said
You
Can
Mount
Anything
As
A
File
So
You
Can
Even
Mount
The
Screen
As
File
Everything
Is
A
File
In
Plan
9
Yeah
That
Sounds
Familiar
Now
You
Know
What
We
Can
Try
To
Do
If
You
Have
Time
Is
We'll
Put
These
Up
In
The
Gallery
We'll
Try
To
Put
Some
Screenshots
Up
In
The
Gallery
As
Well
As
Zero
DB
Net
FL
2600
We'll
Put
Some
Of
That
Information
Around
And
I
For
One
I
Can't
Wait
I
Would
Love
To
We
Can
Cut
The
Show
Off
Right
Now
I
Think
That
Was
Great
I
Learned
A
Lot
I
Enjoyed
Being
On
This
Show
That
Was
Good
Stuff
Yeah
I
Think
I'm
Going
To
Do
That
I'm
Still
Doing
Research
I've
Been
Playing
With
It
Off
And
On
For
A
Year
But
I
Last
Month
I
Said
You
Know
What
I'm
Going
To
Really
Settle
Down
And
Learn
This
Plan
Nine
And
Understand
It
Only
Because
You
Know
I
Have
A
Mind
That
Just
Won't
Quit
And
I
Just
Want
To
Have
Something
To
Do
And
I
Think
Playing
That
Will
Keep
You
Tied
Up
For
Quite
A
While
Yeah
Sounds
Like
You
Are
Right
Well
You
Know
We're
Going
To
Go
From
One
Extreme
To
Another
We're
Going
To
Go
On
The
Opposite
End
Of
The
Spectrum
In
A
Few
Min
But
Before
We
Do
Actually
Didn't
You
Also
Tell
Me
You
Were
Doing
A
Little
Exploration
For
Lack
Of
A
Better
Word
Just
Quickly
Touch
On
That
And
Then
We'll
Jump
Into
The
Other
Okay
Well
Yeah
Today
I
Kind
Of
I
Was
At
Work
And
I
Said
Okay
I
Guess
I'll
Take
Lunch
Now
And
I
Pull
Up
The
Burger
King
And
I
Decided
I
Probably
Just
Go
Into
Barnes
And
Noble
The
Food
Port
There
And
I
Take
My
Laptop
And
I
Go
And
I
Noticed
I
Got
A
Link
To
A
Wireless
Connection
Here
So
I
Like
Okay
Well
What's
Going
On
You
Know
Let
Me
Just
Check
It
Out
So
I
Go
In
And
I
Come
To
The
Splash
Page
And
It
Says
Comida
It
It's
A
I
Guess
A
Wi-Fi
Um
Uh
Hot
Spot
Type
Uh
Company
That
I
Guess
They
Just
Provide
Hot
Spots
Around
The
Country
Right
It
Wasn't
A
T-Mobile
But
It
Was
A
Similar
To
The
T-Mobile
Hop
Spots
And
Stuff
Like
That
Comita
I
Have
It
On
The
FL2600
I
Also
Put
It
In
The
Better
Red
Forums
It
Should
Be
Under
Barnes
And
Noble
Wi-Fi
And
Also
To
My
Link
To
My
Site
Zero
DB
Dot
Net
Um
Like
Again
I
Come
To
The
Splash
Page
And
It
Just
Asks
Me
Um
To
View
Further
Or
To
Use
The
Wi-Fi
Connection
Accept
The
Terms
And
Policy
And
It
Agree
So
I
Did
That
And
It
Brought
Me
To
Another
A
Welcome
Page
Where
It
Tell
Me
Welcome
To
Comita
Hotspot
Um
Blah
You
This
And
That
Okay
Fine
So
It
Had
A
Time
Limit
Well
That's
What
I
Thought
I
Go
In
I
Go
Up
And
I
Type
Google
Wham
I'm
At
The
Google
Website
I'm
Like
Okay
Do
I
Do I
Not
Have
A
Free
Connection
Here
So
I
Pop
A
Few
Other
Sites
And
Flawlessly
They
Come
Up
I
Didn't
Have
To
Authenticate
I
Didn't
Have
To
Do
Anything
Yeah
Where's
The
Where's
The
Username
And
The
Password
And
Where's
The
Credit
Card
Number
Come
Into
Play
I
Have
No
Idea
But
I
Will
Tell
You
This
After
I
Decided
To
Do
A
Little
The
Network
At
The
Time
Other
Than
The
Router
I
Did
Some
Trace
Routes
I
Did
Some
DNS
Lookups
To
See
What
DNS
It
Was
Using
The
Barnes
And
Nobles
That
I
Was
At
They
Were
Using
AT&T
World
Net
With
A
Cable
And
Wireless
DNS
Server
They
Were
Using
I
Guess
They
Have
Something
To
Do
With
AT&T
I
Not
Sure
But
I
Was
Just
Screwing
Around
And
I
Was
Just
Playing
With
The
URLs
And
There
Was
A
Secure
Login
Site
Now
If
You
Go
To
I
Have
A
Link
To
It
On
My
Side
In
The
Gallery
And
There
Is
Goes
To
A
Comita
Network
Security
Check
If
You
Go
To
Actually
The
After
The
Splash
Page
So
To
Speak
And
You
To
A
Security
Check
Static
Page
And
There
You
Actually
It
Has
Like
A
Little
Keypad
Where
You
Can
Type
In
Some
Sort
Of
Combination
Key
And
It
Takes
You
Into
I
Don't
Even
Know
What
I
Didn't
Spend
Too
Much
Time
On
It
Because
I
Didn't
Want
To
Do
Anything
To
Make
Myself
Obvious
So
I
Just
Left
It
Alone
At
That
But
Maybe
Somebody
Else
Will
Get
The
To
The
Experience
That
Was
Kind
Of
Interesting
For
The
Noble
To
Have
An
Open
Network
Like
That
Yeah
That
That's
A
Good
Lunch
There
Yeah
I
Just
Right
Off
The
Bad
And
I
Spend
An
Hour
There
Actually
An
Hour
15
Hour
30
Minutes
And
I
Was
Still
Surfing
Not
A
Problem
So
I
Don't
Know
Very
Interesting
I
Wonder
If
That
Was
Had
A
Time
Limit
Between
Certain
Hours
Of
Today
I
Have
No
Idea
Right
Or
If
That
Was
Maybe
A
Free
Trial
And
They
Are
Going
To
Open
It
Up
Next
Month
For
Charging
And
It
Was
A
Free
Sample
Or
A
Misconfiguration
It
Could
Have
Been
Anything
Really
Right
It
Must
Have
Definitely
New
Because
It
Wasn't
There
Last
Week
Well
Somebody
Had
Posted
In
The
Bin
Rev
Forums
Fairly
Recently
That
These
New
Free
Hotspots
These
Free
Wi-Fi
Access
Were
Starting
To
Pop
Up
And
They
Were
Questioning
Is
It
A
Dangerous
Thing
To
Do
This
And
Obviously
It
Is
Growing
And
It
Is
Happening
Everywhere
I
Think
Maybe
This
Is
A
New
Trend
I
Mean
You
Know
These
Like
I
Mentioned
Earlier
T
Mobile
And
Their
Hotspots
And
There
Other
Ones
Where
You
Can
Pay
By
The
Minute
By
The
Hour
By
The
Whatever
And
I
Wonder
It
Would
Be
Interesting
Research
To
Find
Out
It
Probably
Would
Be
Difficult
Research
To
Find
Out
If
Maybe
These
Just
Frankly
Weren't
Very
Successful
I
Mean
Majority
Of
People
Have
All
The
Internet
Access
They
Want
And
They
Are
Very
Unlikely
To
Leave
Their
Office
To
Lunch
Just
To
Pay
For
Internet
Access
During
Lunch
And
Go
Back
To
Their
Office
And
Get
Their
Internet
Access
For
Free
I
Think
Maybe
It
Wasn't
Successful
And
Maybe
That's
Why
These
New
Ones
Are
Starting
To
Come
Out
That
Are
Free
They
Might
Be
On
Some
Kind
Of
Advertising
Based
Model
Or
Any
Number
Of
Reasons
I
Could
Go
On
Guessing
Right
You
Got
A
Point
There
But
I
Did
Go
To
The
Comedas
Actual
Hot
Spot
Web
Page
Right
And
They
Do
Charge
Hmm
So
This
Must
Be
A
Trial
Run
In
Barnes
And
Nobles
Um
It
Probably
Won't
Last
Long
And
Even
By
The
Time
This
Airs
Uh
Every
Barnes
And
Nobles
Probably
Be
Getting
Hit
Well
Yeah
I
Was
Going
To
Say
That
So
Probably
A
Good
Shout
Out
To
The
Listeners
Go
Check
Out
Your
Barnes
And
Nobles
Today
Yeah
You
Finding
Free
Access
To
See
If
It's
Provided
By
Comida
Or
Someone
Else
And
Just
See
If
This
Is
A
Worldwide
Thing
A
Global
Thing
A
Once
In
A
Lifetime
Accidental
Thing
So
Yeah
Check
It
Out
And
Yeah
Email
Us
Radio
Bin
Red
Dotcom
Let
Us
Know
What
You
Find
Out
Now
We're
Kind
Of
Running
A
Little
Short
On
Time
But
We're
Okay
So
I'm
Going
To
Make
My
Short
That
Was
Great
By
The
Way
I
Can't
Wait
To
Hear
More
About
Plan
Nine
And
See
Some
Of
That
I
Really
Can't
That
Was
Very
Well
Done
Me
I
Wish
I
Had
Something
That
Good
But
Basically
What
I've
Been
Doing
This
Week
Is
Well
I
Was
Motivated
To
Try
To
Write
Up
An
Official
Privacy
Policy
Privacy
Policy
I'm
Trying
To
Say
For
Bin
Rev.com
I
Mean
We
Kind
Of
Tell
Everybody
It's
Pretty
Open
About
What
We
Do
And
What
We
Don't
Do
We
Don't
Collect
Any
Information
And
You
Know
It's
Not
Like
We're
Selling
It
Or
Anything
We
Don't
Even
Have
Advertising
Blah
It's
Pretty
Obvious
And
It's
Well
Known
But
I
Wanted
To
Make
An
Official
One
And
I
Wanted
To
Do
It
According
To
There's
Something
Called
The
P3P
Which
Is
The
Platform
For
Privacy
Preferences
Project
So
The
Privacy
Preferences
Project
Is
Basically
An
XML
Standard
Of
Privacy
Fields
Where
You
Define
Things
Like
Some
Of
It
As
Simple
As
Contact
Information
Name
Address
Phone
Numbers
That
Type
Of
Stuff
As
Well
As
Official
Titles
Of
What
Do
You
Do
With
Emails
And
You
Put
In
Your
Description
Of
What
Do
You
Do
With
The
Emails
That
You
Do
Or
Do
Not
Collect
Or
If
You
Don't
Collect
Them
At
All
Obviously
It's
Not
Applicable
And
Any
Other
Information
What
Cookies
And
Things
Like
That
So
I
Was
Looking
On
Following
That
Standard
And
Writing
Some
Code
To
Match
That
So
That
People
Would
Actually
Have
An
Official
Standard
That
Integrates
With
The
Browser
And
That
Leads
Us
To
Our
Main
Topic
On
This
By
My
Other
Project
Of
The
Week
Which
Also
Zero
DB
Kind
Of
Turned
Me
On
And
Got
My
Head
Into
This
Decide
To
Finally
Break
Down
And
Do
It
And
That
Is
The
Longhorn
Microsoft
Longhorn
Alpha
So
Where
I
Work
Which
I
Mentioned
Earlier
People
Can
Find
That
Out
We
Have
Access
To
That
Kind
Of
Stuff
So
We
Were
Actually
Spent
Some
Time
Looking
At
That
At
Build
4053
Now
I
Subsequently
After
I
Spent
Most
Of
This
Most
Of
This
Review
And
Most
Of
The
Time
I
Spent
Looking
At
Was
On
That
One
But
I
Did
Spend
A
Few
Hours
On
4074
Which
Is
The
Latest
One
Available
To
Us
At
Work
Which
Again
We
Get
Access
To
That
Kind
Of
Stuff
We
Are
Part
Of
These
Programs
Where
We
Are
Part
Of
The
Review
Generally
Everything
We're
Talking
About
Is
On
Build
4053
Alpha
Of
Microsoft
Longhorn
Now
I'm
Not
Sure
If
You
I
Know
You
Installed
It
And
Uninstalled
It
And
I
Don't
Know
If
You
Reinstalled
It
Again
But
Me
I
Installed
It
On
An
Old
P3
866
With
512
Of
RAM
So
Not
A
Top
Of
The
Line
System
Or
Anything
But
Not
A
Bottom
Of
The
Line
System
You
It's
Kind
Of
On
The
Low
End
Of
Things
Nowadays
I
Guess
But
It
Should
Be
More
Than
Enough
To
Get
The
Job
Done
Running
A
Fresh
Install
Base
Operating
System
With
No
Extra
Bells
And
Whistles
Add
Ons
And
Stuff
Like
That
This
Is
The
Same
Box
Actually
From
An
Earlier
Episode
I
Did
A
Little
Windows
2003
Server
Review
Off
Of
It
I
Did
The
Same
Thing
I
Just
Do
A
Fresh
Install
Played
With
It
See
How
It
Work
And
Did
A
Little
Review
Of
That
So
What
Kind
Of
Did
You
Do
You
Still
Have
This
On
A
Box
Somewhere
And
What
Are
The
Specs
Of
That
Box
Well
I
Did
Have
It
On
A
Box
I
Actually
No
Longer
Have
It
On
That
Box
Because
It's
Now
A
Plan
Nine
Box
But
I
Had
It
On
A
Actually
An
AMD
Box
A
1200
With
Only
256
Mega
Ram
And
It
Was
Okay
To
Get
The
Job
Done
It
Did
Install
But
It
Did
Have
Its
Short
Comings
As
Far
As
Performance
Right
And
That's
Basically
The
Summary
Now
I
Gotta
Preface
This
I
Mean
I
Think
You
And
I
Can
Both
Say
This
Fairly
I
Mean
We'll
Be
Objective
With
This
We'll
Say
Fairly
That
This
Is
An
Alpha
We're
Going
To
Expect
It
To
Be
Clunky
Right
Your
Machine
Was
More
Powerful
Than
Mine
But
You
Had
Less
Memory
I
Had
More
Memory
But
It's
A
Less
Powerful
Machine
So
You
Know
We
Want
Running
It
With
Top
Of
The
Line
So
It
Would
Really
Be
Unfair
To
Us
To
Judge
How
Clunky
And
How
Slow
It
Was
On
A
Old
Machines
And
B
Alpha
Code
Very
Early
Alpha
Code
So
I
Really
Don't
Think
It
Would
Be
Too
Fair
To
Bash
The
Speed
And
The
Response
Time
Of
It
So
I
You
Know
I
Think
That
Goes
Without
Saying
And
You
Know
It's
Supposed
To
Be
Two
They
Don't
Really
Have
A
Release
Definite
Release
But
They
Are
Filtering
It
Out
You
Know
To
Universities
To
You
Know
Internet
News
And
Right
Organizations
That
Might
Want
Take
A
Look
At
The
Pre-Releases
Right
So
That
Being
Said
We'll
Keep
That
In
Mind
And
We
Won't
Bash
For
That
Because
It's
A
Little
Unfair
Now
I
Will
Say
This
Though
On
The
40
74
It
Was
Noticeably
Faster
Was
Noticeably
Different
I
Have
To
Say
That
It
Was
It
Was
Not
Still
Not
A
You
Know
Still
Not
Quite
What
I
Would
Hope
Or
What
I
Like
But
It
Was
Noticeably
Different
So
I'll
Go ahead
And
Throw
That
Out
There
That
Means
Obviously
It's
Going
To
Improve
As
They
Work
On
It
More
And
That
Goes
To
Reason
That
Stands
To
Reason
Hopefully
Now
The
Thing
That
You
And
I
Really
Both
Agreed
On
And
Laughed
About
Even
In
This
Was
The
Interface
Itself
Now
One
Of
The
Most
Glaring
And
One
Of
The
First
Things
That
You
Find
And
First
Thing
People
Are
Going
To
Play
With
Is
The
Addition
Of
Something
A
New
Thing
They
Call
The
Side
Bar
Yeah
It's
You
Know
And
Actually
I
Have
To
Say
This
Has
Potential
To
Be
Really
Cool
It
Can
Be
A
Lot
Of
Things
And
Well
I
Tell
You
What
Let's
Just
Let's
Talk
About
Just
The
Interface
In
General
To
Me
Was
Very
Clunky
It
Was
Very
Much
Overloaded
With
A
Lot
Of
Stuff
Too
Much
I
Think
For
A
Base
Install
With
All
The
Defaults
And
Stuff
The
Way
They
Are
Now
You
I
Did
Find
That
For
The
Most
Part
I
Could
Turn
A
Sidebar
When
You
Have
Your
Start
Menu
At
The
Bottom
That
Most
People
Using
Xperia
Used
To
But
You
Also
Have
Something
Called
A
Sidebar
That
You
Can
Activate
And
The
Sidebar
Obviously
Sits
Along
The
Side
By
Default
You
Can
Control
Some
Of
That
Too
But
It
Sits
Along
The
Right
Hand
Side
By
Default
And
The
Way
They
Are
Going
With
This
Is
They
Trying
To
Do
They
Trying
To
Allow
They
Trying
To
Modulize
Modularize
I'm
Not
Sure
What
The
Exact
Term
There
Is
The
Sidebar
To
Allow
You
To
Install
Apps
Onto
The
Sidebar
By
Default
For
Example
They
Moved
The
Clock
To
The
Sidebar
So
You
Got
A
Big
Old
Fashioned
Clock
There
That
Tells
You
The
Date
And
Time
And
It
Is
In
The
Sidebar
And
It
Constantly
Running
And
This
Is
Something
That
Linux
Users
Have
Seen
For
A
While
In
X
Windows
And
KDE
And
That
Type
Of
Stuff
You
Can
Have
TSR
Programs
That
Are
Sitting
In
Your
Tray
Or
In
A
Lot
Of
Different
Places
That
For
Example
Monitor
Your
CPU
Usage
Or
Your
Temperature
System
Temperature
Gosh
Any
Number
Of
Things
Memory
Just
Any
Number
Of
System
Things
And
Those
Are
Very
Handy
Particularly
On
Kind
Of
Taken
That
Idea
I
Not
Sure
If
They
Are
Going
To
Give
You
The
Same
Functionality
But
That
Is
What
It
Reminds
Me
Of
Anyway
It
Does
Not
Come
With
Those
Things
I
Just
Mentioned
Check
Watching
Memory
And
Stuff
Like
That
It
Comes
With
Some
Pretty
Corny
Stuff
In
The
Very
First
Release
Here
For
Example
The
Clock
I
Mentioned
It
Comes
With
A
Slideshow
For
Example
And
It
Puts
A
Little
Window
I
Don't
Know
Three
Inches
By
Two
Inches
Part
Of
The
Sidebar
There
And
It
Will
Go
Through
Your
My
Pictures
And
It
Basically
Has
A
Moving
Slideshow
On
The
Screen
All
The
Time
Obviously
You
Can
Disable
It
These
Are
Modules
That
You
Can
Include
Or
Exclude
So
You
Can
Take
Off
This
Stuff
If
You
Want
To
Waste
Your
Memory
You
Want
To
Run
An
Efficient
Box
But
That
Is
Just
Some
Examples
So
What
I
Forsee
This
Is
A
On
The
Server
Environment
Watching
Your
System
Watching
System
Variables
Notifying
You
Of
Errors
Things
Like
That
But
Even
More
So
I
Can
Picture
It
Being
Used
For
Web
Getting
Information
From
The
Web
Putting
A
Search
Bar
In
There
Which
Is
On
Build
40
74
The
Search
Bar
Can
Be
Added
In
There
Along
With
Some
Other
Things
Like
There
Were
Several
Other
Things
By
The
Way
In
40
74
That
You
Could
Add
In
There
Little
Clips
Little
Modules
Whatever
Their
Terminology
Is
But
I
Forsee
That
For
Example
You
Could
Put
In
News
Headlines
Or
Stop
Quotes
Or
Things
Like
That
Plugins
That
You
Can
Put
On
This
Thing
That
Will
Check
And
Have
That
Information
On
Sidebar
All
The
Time
That
You
Can
Have
Up
And
Be
Persistent
And
Be
Constantly
Updating
Data
Constantly
Showing
You
What
You
Need
And
Have
A
Lot
Of
Stuff
Right
There
Handy
Ready
To
Click
On
That
Could
Be
Really
Cool
To
Me
But
It
Could
Also
Be
Really
Messy
And
Really
CPU
Intensive
Well
Yes
But
I
Have
A
Little
Bias
Against
A
Lot
That
Microsoft
This
Is
Really
Nothing
New
Like
You
Mentioned
We
Have
This
In
The
Unix
Even
In
The
Spark
World
Where
You
Have
The
Clock
And
You
Have
The
Different
Modules
For
CPU
Usage
This
Usage
Internet
Ethernet
Usage
Memory
And
Even
Down
To
A
Directory
Usage
Microsoft
Is
Coming
Out
With
This
And
It
Is
Really
Nothing
New
Maybe
It
Might
Be
New
To
The
Grandmas
And
The
Grandpas
Of
The
PC
World
But
Again
It
I
Think
It's a
Little
Bit
Over
Engineered
It's
Really
Bulky
It's
Clunky
It's
Not
All
That
Necessary
And
Thank
God
You
Can
Really
Disable
It
If
You
Need
To
And
Let's
Just
Hope
That
They
Don't
Make
It
A
Permanent
Thing
Where
You
Can't
It's
Because
You
Going
To
Need
About
2
Gig
Of
Memory
To
Even
Run
This
Thing
Apparently
It
Seems
To
Me
Yeah
And
I'm
Not
It
Remains
To
Be
Seen
Of
Course
On
The
Final
Release
How
Much
Control
You
Can
Have
In
Turning
This
On
And
Off
What
You
Can
Do
Now
Is
I
Don't
Want
To
Say
Turn
It
Off
Because
I'm
Not
Sure
I'm
Not
Convinced
That
It's
Turned
Off
I
Think
It's
Just
Minimized
For
Lack
Of
The
Way
So
It's
Not
Intrusive
But
It
May
Still
Be
Eating
Up
CPU
Those
Processes
May
Still
Be
Active
I
Don't
Know
That
And
Again
It's
An
Alpha
So
That
May
Be
Something
That
Changes
Later
But
The
Potential
Exists
For
This
To
Be
Really
Good
If
You
Have
A
Big
Powerful
Machine
Lots
Of
Memory
And
You
Want
That
Information
Overkill
And
Stuff
Like
That
You
Want
Your
Prawn
Of
The
Day
On
The
Screen
And
You
Want
Whatever
Then
The
Potential
Exists
To
Have
It
I
Think
That
Is
Kind
Of
Do
Not
Give
You
That
Kind
Of
Control
Then
This
Is
A
Big
Thumbs
Down
But
Like
You
Know
What
I
Think
Of
Is
Like
Our
Website
At
FL2600.com
For
Example
Where
You
Can
Add
In
Different
Plugin
Different
Modules
Of
Stuff
You
Can
Add
It
This
Would
Be
Wonderful
If
It
Will
Support
In
The
Final
Release
XML
News
Feeds
RSS
News
Feeds
And
I
Can
Put
In
All
About
Giving
The
User
Control
Not
Taking
Away
Control
Microsoft
Never
Got
That
If
They
Give
You
Control
For
Example
What
If
You
Could
Set
It
To
Only
Update
Overnight
At
Two
In
The
Morning
So
That
When
You
Come
In
The
First
Thing
You
Got
New
Headlines
Or
New
Whatever
Waiting
For
You
Can
Have
It
Do
Stuff
Overnight
That
Kind
Of
Stuff
I
Think
That
Could
Be
Cool
They
Can
Have
It
Right
In
Their
Desktop
The
Whole
Time
And
If
I
May
They
Also
Coming
Out
Well
I
Think
It
Even
In
That
Release
What
Is
It
4074
They
Have
The
Desktop
Window
Manager
Aero
Or
They
Call
It
The
Avalon
Desktop
Window
Manager
And
That
Is
The
Name
Of
It
Right
Okay
What
This
Does
Is
It
Incorporates
3D
And
Transparency
Into
The
Window
Manager
Now
That
Is
Something
That
Formerly
Was
Done
By
The
Video
Drivers
Well
I
Think
It
Reminds
Me
Really
Of
What
The
Macs
Use
I
Don't
Really
Yeah
You
Even
Have
Transparencies
In
The
Unix
Environment
Using
The
Window
Manager
Enlightenment
So
I'm
Not
Sure
I
Think
Microsoft
Really
Hasn't
Really
Innovated
Anything
Right
It
Sounds
Like
They're
Borrowing
A
Little
Bit
From
Everybody
Yes
And
I
Can
Recall
Even
Reading
Something
A
While
Ago
About
There
Was
A
Guy
That
Used
To
Work
For
Red
Hat
And
He
Now
Works
For
Microsoft
I
Don't
Know
He
Might
Even
Have
Something
To
Do
With
What's
Going
On
I
Don't
Know
But
There
Is
A
Separate
Command
I
Understand
To
Enable
This
Avalon
Desktop
Window
Manager
It
Is
Two
Dimensional
By
Default
And
To
Actually
Enable
The
Three
Dimensional
Side
You
Have
To
Issue
A
Separate
Command
And
I
Understand
That
Command
Is
Like
An
S
B
C
T
L
Start
Now
I
Not
Sure
And
I
Really
Didn't
Have
The
Time
Throughout
The
Day
To
Find
Out
What
S
B
C
T
L
Stood
For
But
I
Pretty
Sure
Somebody
Out
There
Knows
And
Again
I
Not
Really
A
Windows
Guy
I
Pretty
Much
Choose
Mac
And
Unix
But
I
Pretty
Sure
Somebody
Out
There
Knows
And
Also
Understand
That
They
Are
Using
XAML
The
Extensible
Markup
Language
Really
Heavily
Into
Longhorn
So
That
Is
Another
Thing
That
They
Are
Really
Trying
To
Get
Under
Their
Belt
Yeah
And
That
Would
Be
Beneficial
Of
What
I
Suggested
Earlier
With
The
News
Fe
Support
For
That
And
If
That
Is
Native
To
The
OS
That
Would
Be
Pretty
And
You
Know
What
That
Keeps
In
Pattern
With
Them
Because
You
Know
The
Latest
Office
Microsoft
Office
Went
Heavy
Towards
XML
As
Well
So
Yeah
We
Shouldn't
Be
Surprised
At
Microsoft
Borrowing
Idea
That
Is
Nothing
Surprising
Or
New
Now
Is
It
Right
And
Even
From
A
Network
Point
Of
View
They
Have
Something
That
They
Call
Castle
Which
Is
Like
A
Mini
Domain
And
But
It
Doesn't
Really
Require
A
Full
Domain
Server
I'm
Not
Sure
Exactly
How
That
Castle
Comes
Into
Play
As
Far
As
Network
And
I
Guess
It
Has
A
Lot
To
Do
With
Some
Sort
Of
Different
Type
Of
Protocol
Maybe
So
To
Speak
To
Actually
Network
From
One
Longhorn
To
An
XP
Box
Or
An
SQL
Server
Or
Something
Like
That
But
I'm
Still
Doing
A
Little
Bit
More
Research
On
It
To
Figure
Out
How
This
Thing
Is
All
Coming
Together
Yeah
It's
Interesting
Definitely
Interesting
Now
We're
Kind
Of
Running
Towards
The
End
Here
But
I
Want
To
Hit
A
Few
More
Of
These
Top
Now
The
One
Main
Thing
That
We
Can
Agree
On
It
Earlier
When
I
Mentioned
The
Sidebar
But
In
General
The
Interface
Whether
It
Be
Through
Explorer
File
Browsing
Whatever
Was
Very
Over
Engineered
Is
The
Term
We
Both
Use
Very
Clunky
Very
It
Reminded
Me
Of
Watching
Bloomberg
Television
You've
Got
So
Much
Information
Thrown
At
You
So
Much
Crap
I
Don't
Like
Calling
It
Information
Just
So
Much
Junk
On
The
Screen
At
Any
Given
Time
When
Intense
Of
That
Folder
Previews
Of
Those
Images
Or
Thumbnails
Or
All
This
You
Know
As
Well
As
All
The
Properties
And
Then
On
The
Left
Hand
Side
And
Then
Broken
Down
By
Stats
Of
The
Individual
Let's
Use
Graphics
For
Example
JPEG
With
The
Size
Of
It
The
Color
Depth
All
This
Kind
Of
Stuff
On
The
Screen
Over
On
In
The
Operating
System
And
Movies
And
Stuff
Where
It
Would
Have
Length
You
Had
All
These
New
Attributes
That
You
Could
Put
In
There
All
This
Stuff
Is
Thrown
On
The
Screen
As
Well
By
Default
In
Build
4053
Now
4074
Took
A
Lot
Of
That
Out
I
Have
To
Say
And
That
Is
The
One
Thing
I
Hated
About
This
Build
More
Than
Anything
You
And
I
Talked
About
Was
All
The
Crap
They
Throw
On
The
Screen
Because
Besides
All
That
File
Information
That
They
Throw
At
You
Above
That
You
Have
General
Browser
Options
Which
Are
Search
Map
Network
Drive
Edit
Things
Like
That
All
That
Menu
But
Then
They
Also
Try
They're
Trying
So
Hard
To
Be
Intuitive
But
They're
Just
Squashing
They're
Just
Doing
So
Much
The
Burn
To
See
Burn
This
To
CD
Button
Is
Always
On
There
Even
When
It's
Inappropriate
Why
Am I
Going
To
Burn
Something
From
The
Control
Panel
To
A
CD
That
Doesn't
Make
Sense
It's
Always
On
The
Screen
And
Then
Across
The
Top
Of
The
Whole
Thing
They're
Really
Trying
To
Blur
The
Line
And
They
Tried
To
Do
This
Before
By
Integrating
Internet
Explorer
Into
The
Operating
System
And
We
All
Know
How
That
Turned
Out
We're
Not
Going
To
Rehash
That
But
You
Have
Like
A
Navigation
Bar
At
The
Top
Of
The
Whole
Thing
As
Though
We're
Surfing
The
Web
Somewhat
Even
Though
You're
Browsing
Locally
They're
Trying
To
Really
Blur
Those
Lines
Again
And
You
Have
Back
Buttons
When
You're
Navigating
Through
Just
Your
Local
File
Explorer
You
Have
An
Add
To
Favorites
You
Have
Search
Buttons
You
Have
It
Really
Makes
It
Kind
Of
Confusing
And
So
Much
Overkill
Of
So
Much
Information
On
The
Screen
That
You
Just
Want
To
Put
Your
Foot
In
The
Damn
Thing
If
I
Wanted
Properties
I'd
Right
Click
And
Say
Give
Me
The
Freaking
Properties
I
Don't
Need
Every
Potential
Option
Of
This
JPEG
I
Don't
Need
To
See
Them
All
On
The
Screen
At
The
Same
Time
I
Really
Don't
Need
All
That
Man
It
Just
Well
This
Is
More
You
Gotta
Understand
The
Grandmas
And
The
Grandpas
Need
That
Why
Would
They
Have
To
Right
Click
To
See
It
I
Really
Don't
Think
They
Do
I
Don't
You
Know
What
At
Least
Well
I
Can't
Say
Not
By
Default
If
They
Do
Need
It
Should
Be
On
By
Default
But
Doggone
It
Got
On
My
Nerve
Because
I
Figured
I
Had
To
Turn
A
Few
Of
The
Things
Off
But
It
Was
Still
Too
Much
To
My
Liking
I
Just
Want
The
Plain
Old
Explorer
EXE
That's
All
I
Want
Well
You
Know
The
One
Good
Thing
That
Came
Out
Of
This
Whole
OS
I
Think
In
My
Opinion
Is
That
They
Incorporated
The
No
Pop
Up
Or
The
Pop
Block
Into
IE
Right
And
Actually
That's
A
Good
Transition
Because
IE6
Is
What
This
Is
I
Don't
Know
If
They're
Going
To
Change
It
Will
Be
IE7
When
It
Comes
Out
Or
If
This
Is
Just
An
Upgraded
IE6
Maybe
They're
Going
To
Add
These
You
Can
Download
From
The
Web
But
A
Couple
Things
I
Noticed
In
IE6
And
This
Is
When
I
Mentioned
Earlier
What
Turned
Me
On
About
The
Privacy
Is
I
Noticed
That
IE6
In
Here
When
You
Surf
To
A
Website
This
Is
In
The
Old
IE
You
Have
To
Dig
A
Little
Bit
For
I
Can't
Tell
You
Exactly
Where
It
Is
Under
The
Options
I
Believe
A
Site
That
You
Visiting
You
Can
Go
In
And
Look
At
The
Privacy
Policy
For
That
Site
Via
The
Browser
If
That
Page
Has
That
P3
P
I
Mentioned
Earlier
I
Trying
To
Set
That
Up
For
Bin
Rav
Well
In
The
New
Interface
That
Is
Much
More
Prominent
You
See
That
Link
Across
The
Top
Right
Next
To
Your
Search
Your
History
Your
Favorites
Your
Print
This
Page
Right
Where
All
Those
I
Cons
There
Also
A
Little
I
Kind
It
Can
Have
Different
Policies
You
May
If
You
Go
To
www.
I
Don't
Know
CNET
Dot
Com
Will
Make
Up
It
May
Have
One
Privacy
Policy
That
They
Are
Going
To
Show
Ads
To
You
They
Are
Going
To
Have
A
Cookie
Blah
But
If
You
Go
To
Shop
Dot
C
Net
Dot
Com
It
May
Have
An
Entire
Entirely
Different
Privacy
Policy
So
This
Lets
You
On
Any
Individual
Page
Look
Up
The
Privacy
Policy
That
Is
Associated
With
That
Page
Again
It
Has
To
Be
Programmed
On
The
Server
Side
Or
On
The
HTML
And
The
XML
Of
That
Page
To
Support
That
But
A
Lot
Of
Companies
Are
Starting
To
Do
That
With
Privacy
Becoming
So
Important
It
Is
Really
More
Prominent
In
IE6
That
I
Noticed
In
Longhorn
More
Than
Anything
Else
That
I
Have
Seen
So
I
Trying
To
Write
One
Up
What
It
Does
Is
You
Could
Surf
Directly
To
Someone
Privacy
Policy
And
Read
The
HTML
Or
The
XML
Or
Whatever
You
Want
But
This
Does
Is
It
Pops
Up
A
Sub
Window
With
That
Information
You
Don't
Have
To
Leave
The
Navigate
You
Don't
Have
To
Open
A
Window
Control
In
You
Don't
Have
To
Any
Of
more strongly with the security zone settings that Microsoft uses you have
security zones of like low security medium and high and you can customize
those zones where for example on low security you allow all cookies to come
in you allow all JavaScript execute etc etc well by using the privacy policy
and it integrating with those security zones you can for example override the
default you may turn off all JavaScript but on this particular page you read
the privacy policy you think you agree with it you trust this site so Java you
can add them to the safe list much more easily because it's so more so much more
prominent on the page you can browse the privacy policy say yes I agree to
override my default you can still be at high security but you're giving
permission to that site and it's more tightly integrated and it's just a
couple clicks to do it so I think that's a good thing to make make it a little bit
safer browsing on the web and that is something we've been asking Microsoft
for a long time to make it safer make it harder to get viruses harder for things
to automatically pop up you can set for that what happens with a lot of people
they set high security but then they're so annoyed because nothing works it's
hard to download things get blocked that you don't want to be blocked and
vice versa so anybody people end up putting it on low or medium security
because they just get annoyed with having to babysit it right this will let
people put it on high and kind of start tweaking and customizing and it will
learn and get to know those sites as you add them so I think that's kind of a
cool thing and another thing is and I noticed this purely by accident I downloaded a
couple things to see what kind of plugins like the MSN toolbar I downloaded and put
onto the Internet Explorer just because I wanted to see you know if it worked just
it didn't say long or you said it would work with XP and I wanted to see if it
worked and it did but what I noticed is when I downloaded it it actually came up
with a download manager I didn't call it anything it didn't say download manager but it's if
people who do use Firefox know what I'm talking about it has a little pop-up and
it kind of keeps track of your downloads and the status of them so you can download it in
the background stuff like that so that's something that's kind of they've copied
from Firefox or borrowed from Firefox so that's kind of a cool addition as well so you know I think that is
there anything else that you know and again 4074 took away a lot of the bloat but it's still messy and
it's still going to take some getting used to and overall I still don't like it oh I know one other
minor annoyance I had I don't know if you notice this but when I'm surfing the web when I'm browsing
you know obviously by default there's a color scheme you know your start menus blue and Windows XP by
default or green or whatever the hell it is you have default fonts and default icons and colors and
it's the same with this and it's kind of a blackish grayish by default right well all of your toolbars
and stuff are that color and they're real thick and they take up a lot of real estate at the top
for example where you type in your address where your back button is stuff like that the background
of that is a standard color well it always has been but it was smaller now it's so much bigger and so
much more prominent and there's so much crap on it well yeah and then they have this back button
that's like what is it it's a big circle almost the size of a marble yeah it's like an inch tall
this thing of screens hey it's like it's telling you you have to go back or something I mean why is
the back button so big yeah and yeah it's silly stuff like that and and I could not find a way to
make it smaller I always even on IE and stuff I always change it to small icons right you know save up
my screen real estate just put everything small I couldn't find out where to do that in this one
um again I admit I haven't spent a whole lot of time you know I've spent a couple days playing with
it um but the the annoyance that I was getting at is that color right now anyway you can't you can
change the overall color theme like you could in xp but it doesn't matter because no matter what scheme
you choose every web page is different right so I've got this big gray and bluish bar but when I
navigate to binrev.com my nice green and black color scheme oh man it's like it's like I want
to call in queer eye for the straight guy and redesign this damn thing because it's clashing so badly
I got my nice sight and all the colors all nice and laid out and then they surround it with this big
ugly blue and gray and black thing that you can't get rid of and can't you know at least with the old
you know old browsers you can make it small you couldn't get rid of it it's small enough that it was
less noticeable with this thing it's just like it ruins the whole color scheme and feel of the damn
thing maybe they only have uh 21 inch monitors uh up at microsoft yeah yeah maybe that's their next
push is they're going to push us all the 21 inch flat screens and a higher so um is there any what
else is there anything else um uh relating to longhorn yeah uh well for what it's worth I did I was
reading an article by um a Steve Van Van Horn Nichols um well we'll put a link up to it to the to the
article but what's it what is it okay well bottom line is um he wrote an article saying uh that um longhorn
is to be made as uh open source unfriendly as possible um I'm not too sure what he meant by that
I'm not sure if Microsoft is incorporating some sort of different uh protocols or as far as a net
from a networking point point of view is what I'm talking about um like for instance Samba or or uh even
the uh what do they call the remote uh remote desktop right that I'm not sure if that's what if they're
trying to Microsoft is trying to do something so it would only talk to Microsoft equipment I don't know
but uh he did read um write an article in reference to that and uh there was something about uh the uh
GNOME um window uh window manager for Linux right a couple of the founders um they were uh onto that
and they were trying to suggest that uh some of the vendors and people that write code um for the
GNOME environment look into a clone for like an xaml for the xaml language that Microsoft is
more so using into longhorn he feels that there's going to be a need for it I'm not sure exactly why
again I you know I haven't worked with longhorn for more than maybe an hour or two but um I think
something's going down with some sort of rivalry between Linux and Microsoft there's no big uh secret
that you know Microsoft is um anti open source but uh I think they're kind of taking it to
an extreme here maybe well that may be something that we'll discuss further in depth on a future
episode um when we find out more information because that is you know it doesn't surprise
anyone and it'd be interesting to see how they're going about it because guess what people are going
to figure out ways around it you know it's going to happen oh yeah you know they may be some kind
of code registration where only code that's authorized by Microsoft or maybe they only support their own
ASP or or their own architecture or something and it has to be approved I don't know what they
that could you know I'm just speculating so I probably shouldn't even do that but we'll we'll
look into that when the time comes but I guess for now we're going to have to close it up we are well
over our time so um yeah I guess we probably should just jump on um was there anything else you wanted
to add though or summary or anything uh well you know we can talk for the next three hours about
uh different things that go on but I guess we can uh try to wrap it up I got yeah yeah I think we
should go ahead and do that so why don't you uh why don't you throw some shouts out uh well
shout out to uh a local FL2600 uh group uh shouts to BinRev them the BinRev forums everyone in
there uh what else uh just shouts out to all yeah yeah and specifically again I want to shout out to
um to lucky 225 not theory rigel 5 uh and doug all for for doing default radio it's still a great
show if you're not listening to default radio you really should go over there and check it out
still on every friday default fridays on ddphack radio so shouts out to those guys I've been
talking to some of them a lot more lately so uh that's cool my shouts go to them and of course
I second all of yours you know fl 2600 guys you know can't wait to see that presentation if you can
put something together don't no rush or anything but you know I'd like to see some plan 9 stuff sounds
really interesting um kind of a not really an announcement but I'll just go ahead and throw
out people probably already realize that this is episode 46 once again so episode 50 is going to be
coming up I haven't quite decided what we're going to do if we're going to do something special we'll
probably do something for episode 50 I'm leaning towards doing a telephonic craptacular part two if I
have time um believe it or not that takes a lot more time than you think um so I don't know if I'm
going to be able to get that done but we're going to probably do something special for that one but
also not only 50 but actually episode 52 is going to be a milestone because 52 of course 52 weeks in
a year would be our one year anniversary we've had perfect attendance from episode one we have not
missed a week a new show every week and knock on wood I don't want to jinx us here but we make it
to episode 52 that will be a one year anniversary so we might do well we probably will do some type of
fun episode a special episode for that so actually 50 and 52 almost back to back we'll have two
episodes that are kind of uh different than the usual episodes we do so look for that 52 is probably
going to be more of a clip show some fun stuff some outtakes things like that so um look out for both
of those coming up in the future and again anything we've mentioned before you want to email us back
you send it to radio at binrev.com um and article submissions you're going to send those to articles
at binrev.com I really would love to see a plan 9 article if you want to put that on your things to
do list as well I know you're a busy man but um that would be pretty cool so if you got articles to
send go ahead and send them into that and our closing music this week is from tom chi and casey from
www.ok-cancel.com this is kind of a neat little song a little nerdcore I guess you call it
just a little fun song they made up themselves and it's called we got it so we're going to close
with that little programming song you might want to listen to the lyrics of that it's kind of kind
of good stuff so I think that is it zero db thank you very much my friend for being on the show I
thought this was a great show for me because I got to sit back and listen to a lot of good stuff man
that was that's what you call being prepared for a show you had man you could have done this show
yourself you don't need me oh no no no you know what when I need a week off I'm putting you in
charge oh you can take over the show when I need a week off you can no sincerely thank you for being
on the show I do appreciate it and it's because you and I both kind of were talking and playing with
this longhorn so it was very appropriate so um yeah we're gonna wrap it up here we're we're a little
over time but it was pretty good long episode um and everybody listening again let us know because
I know other people have used longhorn as well um we may have made some mistakes on here I was
pretty thorough looking through longhorn I'm sure I missed some things but if you've got something
else you want to point out bring to our attention um by all means let us know if you got a newer
alpha than 4074 then I need to get on the stick and tell Microsoft that they need to hook that up
so um get in touch with us and that's going to do it so to everyone listening oh you know what I'm
going to add a last minute shout out everybody listening in the IRC channel what up that's for
you I know there's guys that go in there and listen every week religiously extra special shout outs to
you guys because that's dedication that's people listening to the show live very cool so shout out
to each and every one of you in there um so for you guys and everyone else we're going to see them
next week same hack time same hack channel peace later yo this is an okay cancel exclusive
for the first time in history hti and hip-hop together for your educational pleasure
now check this while I'll write this with some buttons and levels
uh give me 10 seconds and I'll start this endeavor hti yeah we got it ucd yeah we got it focus on
usability yeah we're on it champion the user to keep the work on it that's the task that's upon us
yeah the task that's upon us so you say you got an application to build marketing it you're gonna
build with the product that's a killer you got funding in the millions in the team that is
willing to follow any schedule that you set before them but wait a second here I don't see an hti
man you're headed for more drama the names of our lives you're gonna end up with something you
just despise unless you get the feedback throughout the project timeline so sit down and listen to me
no one wants to see the product become ancient history before you start rushing to build those
interfaces your best bet is to make a set of simple use cases
they should describe what users actually do
and that's unknown running contextual inquiry too because your interface will never be easy to follow
unless you build it to match up with the cognitive models after that generate a lot of designs
run the minds of users even just two at a time
iterate and iterate and soon you'll obliterate any interfaces which your wife will inconsiderate
that will help you mitigate support costs to generate website hit rates and orders
so check it you'll be taking profits instead of mounting losses because you brought us in at the
front of the process hti yeah we got it ucd yeah we got it focus on usability yeah we're on it champion
the user to keep the work honest that's the task that's upon us yeah the task that's upon us so you're
just starting out and you want to know more design of everyday things will help you get through the door and
it takes less than seven seconds if you're logged on to scope an alert box over at users.com
and cruise on over to schneiderman and cooper along with steve crew to stop interface bloopers and when
you've got to check where your user's head is at let's pick up a copy of fire and hold squat perhaps
you're a coder needing hci back we got pizza speaker language at slow ski and winograd and lastly if you're
asking to see the bigger picture read rosenfeld and morva and i've talked to each other later hci yeah we got it
ucd yeah we got it focus on usability yeah we're on it champion the user to keep the work honest
that's the task that's upon us
Alright, I'll get y'all started, shout out to Snoop, Tauki Tau, EZZ, LL, Spool J, and other heads that didn't get to mention here, user rats I unite, to keep the interactions clear, nice, yo my pass is over to KC now, check this out.
Yo, this is KC from the UK, bringing usability from London to VanCity, if your project goes pear-shaped, you come get me, or perhaps that geezer, the brilliant Tom Chee, all lightweight to clear out, right? Okay, cancel is here now.